Does anyone actually like the pass roll or outright die that OSR seemed to spam throughout modules? it seems awfully boring. What's the point of character death if you're just going to roll up a new character immediately afterwards anyway, seems like futility.
its odd isnt it? if it's assumed that you just roll up guy number 2 then what do YOU actually suffer by losing a guy? it kind of reduces a character to the level of a kill streak
>>98144532I'm genuinely surprised people swear by OSR when it has this huge flaw at the center of its design.
Have you tried not playing D&D?
>>98144592That has nothing to do with the topic, spammer.
>>98144613>Be (you)>Be total retard>"I don't like the taste of dogshit.">Get told stop eating dogshit>"Nooooo! That has nothing to do with this!"Fucking retard. Never post here again.
>>98144522>>98144532>>98144538You are supposed to have mutliple characters at once and run them at the same time numbskulls.
>>98144625Get out of this thread you waste of life.
>>98144630What purpose does hirings used as meat points even serve?
>>98144613Imagine complaining about your own stupid choices and then thinking being told to stop making that choice is entirely unrelated.
>>98144613It literally has everything to do with this topic. The answer to D&D problems is always to play a better game. This has been true for the last 20 years, if not longer. Stop being a brain-rotted DnDrone.
>>98144637You should consult with a medical health professional about these projected feelings. You seriously need held beyond what anyone here can provide. I'd recommend having some suicide-prevention line phone numbers written down as well.
>>98144522ITT: anon discovers different games are supposed to be played differently.
>>98144645>>98144652>>98144705/tg/ D&D vendetta strikes againgo elsewhere, faggots
>>98144724ITT anons cannot discuss the topic at hand
>>98144592>>98144625>>98144645you know dnd isn’t the only osr game, right? have YOU tried playing something other than dnd?
>>98144522TTRPGS are not tv-shows retard.
>>98144522>>98144532>>98144538>>98144613The point is that some people like a high lethality game where they build a character from scratch through actual gameplay and not multi-page dramatic anime backstories and theater-kid angst. And no, your character level is not a "kill streak", you get XP for solving encounters whether you kill things or not, something you would know if you actually played the game at all instead of just shitposting about imaginary problems or your own lack of basic reading comprehension.Please just stick to videogames from now on. Anything more complex than Skyrim is probably a cognito-hazard to your severely-stunted mental capacity.
>>98144746Then why design the game to be like this TV show where a bunch of characters are meat grinded every episode?
>>98144747I have to side with the other anon, what you're saying is people roll up a character with no backstory or anything because they are expected to be killed off in the first module. "Kill streak" might be a bit pointed, but it seems roughly on point here.Also lol @ thinking this is some complicated exercise rather than being entirely in the realm of mundanity.
>>98144729>Be OP>Be repeatedly called a retard in your own topic for being retarded>Complain that it's not fair that everyone else is as retarded and shit-taste'd as (you)I think you're the one who should be going elsewhere. This is an 18+ website where people will call you out for being a stupid underage moron, not a safe-space cuddle box like you're probably used to everywhere else.
>>98144752You're not fooling anyone by saying "other anon", OP. We know it's you.
>>98144592D&D isn't OSR by definition. Old d&d is "Classic" style, middles d&d is "traditional" style, and new d&d is "Neo-Trad" style (which is pretty dogshit).OSR is a simulacra of Classic style. The big differnece is that is classic style, you STRICTLY follow the rules, random tables, etc. In OSR, the rules are only consulted before play. At the table, they only come up when absolutely necessary (by default, the DM just says yes to everything "within reason"), and if they are forgotten during play, the DM makes something up.
OSR is just dogshit people pretend to like because vgh trad and hard games make for hard menYou're just as fat and retarded as the rest of us
>>98144912OSR tards are nogames, they're nothing like me.
>>98144747>and not multi-page dramatic anime backstories and theater-kid angst.Genuinely, how many people do you think actually do this? Because the majority of faggots playing 5e may as well be illiterate and they definitely aren't showing up and putting in any real effort to the game.
>>98144760get lost loser
>>98144912>>98144920It's also strange how those into OSR keep buying all those incestuously self similar systems that don't differentiate themselves much from one another. I see no reason to bother with Knave or Shadowdark when you could just stick to good ole reliable.
>>98144971At this point who knows what they actually believe, they communicate in truisms and meme buzzwords and see anyone outside their player group as being beneath them.
>>98144729>vendettafag trying to force his meme again Now I'm sure it's you posting HYTNPDNDs in the first place.
>>98144522Post examples of what you have encountered. You're being too vague at this point about easy flamebait.
>>98145110If you fail the dice roll you fall through the bridge of castle ravenloft to your death. roll new character
>>98144993Most people who actually play OSR also deplore the profusion of clones and don't see the point.
>>98145350>people who actually play OSRso no one?
>>98145308Go back and read it again.
>>98145364It's the third-biggest cluster of TTRPG players after 5e and Pathfinder.
>>98145400no it isn't lol
>>98144737All OSR games are d&d.
>>98144522You're not supposed to roll saves. If you are rolling a save, you fucked up prior to that point in some way. Don't think of it as "this game gives you a 50% chance to live" think of it as "this game gives you a 50% chance to not die when you do something that should kill you."
>>98144997All the talk about storyshitters and theater kids and players showing up with 500 page backstories makes it pretty clear these fuckers only listen to culture war discourse from faggots who are just as gameless and inexperienced as them. These things are not problems in the real world.
>>98145568except this only works in your nogame fantasies
>>98145350That's not true, nobody hardly ever plays actual D&D in the OSR community.
>>98145568The thread is about that 50% chance you die on a roll, rather than say lose HP.
>>98144522GURPS also has "pass roll or die" built into it, so I can speak on that specific case, rather than the mechanic as a whole. Its fine, mostly because its mitigated by the kind of injury that makes you take death checks usually also rendering your character unconcious or otherwise out of the fight. Sure it sucks to die, but its important that the check exists to add stakes to combat, and there are plenty of ways (hard to kill, luck, extra life, higher end stuff like Unkillable) to get around it if its something that worrys you. In my experience, it doesn't lead to people being detached about their character dying, instead it leads to people being cautious in combat where appropriate.
>>98145634I wonder if it's because their only experience with these supposed bad players are from those "D&D Horror Stories" that are posted for views.
>>98145687So then you just roll up a character with the same level to replace it?
>>98145703depends on the campaign. I've played some where you just build a new guy (GURPS does not have a rolling system for characters), some where you are just out of the campaign on death. Generally the former, build a new guy and try to integrate into the party as the new hire.
>>98145684Have you read the only example OP could think of instead of memes?
>>98144522>the pass roll or outright die that OSR seemed to spam throughout modules?The what?
>>98144630>run them at the same timeWrong
>>98144752>people roll up a character with no backstory or anything because they are expected to be killed offWrong
>>98144993>I see no reason to bother with Knave or ShadowdarkNeither is OSR
>>98145308>castle ravenloftNot OSR
>>98144630That doesn't counter his point. In fact, it supports it. You have multiple character, and they're all expendable. They're not characters, they're just extra lives like it's a fucking video game.
>>98144746Funny you say that, even TSR D&D had a tie-in TV show.>>98144747This is pure cope. You aren't "Building a character from scratch" because whether you like it or not, if you want there to be a character there has to be a world for them to have lived in, so unless your character is a literal newborn they will have past experiences. Family, friends, maybe a pet. That's what makes a character, where they come from alongside where they'll go through the game. The latter influences the former, just like for a real person. You call it "anime backstories" and "Theatre-kid angst" when you're just degrading the human experience by flanderizing it. You don't make characters, you don't play characters, you make and play statblocks with no character. You admit as much; all you care about is number go up.It's fucking hilarious you tell him to go play skyrim when Skyrim is more like TSR/OSR than you want to admit. The bulk of the game's content is just your guy going through dungeons, getting XP and loot, and repeating the process, maybe stopping to upgrade their equipment or procure a hireling along the way. Skyrim seems right up your alley since you don't want to engage with the game world or any sort of narrative.
>>98145694Sounds about right. It's all culture war gigafaggots who can only think in extremes, either you have no backstory or you have 500 pages of backstory. Either your "character" has no personality or they're an overly-emotional emo kid. Either the player characters are GRITTY REALISTIC HUMANS WHO CAN DIE AT ANY TIME or they're isekai protagonists with cheat powers.These sorts of faggots don't know what the word nuance means, and as such are incapable of running or playing TTRPGs, which require nuance and adaptability, which is incompatible with their rigid, black and white worldview.
>>98146402>These sorts of faggots don't know what the word nuance means, and as such are incapable of running or playing TTRPGs, which require nuance and adaptability, which is incompatible with their rigid, black and white worldview.ironic
>>98145634ok storyshitter
>>98144522The problem is you're applying post 3e adventure design thinking to osr. It isn't "pass thing or die." If you get to the point that you've triggered a trap or in fight with a monster, it's because you were rushing though the dungeon, you weren't being careful, and you fucked something up. There are several steps you're supposed to get to before you get to the "save of die" part of it.
>>98145684Why should petrification cost HP? Or dragon breath? That shit kills you man.
>>98146377>It's fucking hilarious you tell him to go play skyrim when Skyrim is more like TSR/OSR than you want to admit. The bulk of the game's content is just your guy going through dungeons, getting XP and loot, and repeating the process, maybe stopping to upgrade their equipment or procure a hireling along the way. Skyrim seems right up your alley since you don't want to engage with the game world or any sort of narrative.and when their character dies they just roll up another extra life
>>98146402It does make me wonder now, are any of the supposed OSR enjoyers who replied to this thread even involved in any games
>>98147692Castle Ravenloft is just raw numbers though, you cross a bridge and you need to roll a 10 or higher, or else you simply fall to death.
>>98147844This is fun? that's the thread
>>98144522Save vs Death is usually your best saveThe effect is not always deathIt's basically OSR games' version of Luck, which is not a particularly controversial mechanic.
>>98145793It's for AD&D, and came out in 1983
>>98148350You niggers can't read even a little bit.
>>98148359>Save vs Death is usually your best save>The effect is not always death
>>98148696Just leave, go away.
>>98148905Not until you learn how to fucking read the module you're complaining about and do some basic arithmetic.
>>98148901There are a lot of things in TSR D&D that started out as ad hoc and morphed over time. Save vs Death (or Death Ray) started out as exactly that, but as TSR D&D evolved into late 1e and 2e, Save vs Death turned into more of a catchall luck save if nothing else was more applicable.
>>98148350Post the page, let's see.
>>98147844No, if the rules say they cost HP, then they do. And we actually can choose to write good rules instead of bad ones.
>>98148901Yes. That's what I said.
>>98149248good kek. Well played anon.
>>98148901TSR's saves were kind of goofy>Save vs Death Ray or Poison>Save vs All Wands including Paralysis or Polymorph>Vs Stone (as in turned to stone, not getting pegged with rocks)>Vs Dragon Breath>Vs Staves and SpellsIt's a far cry from 3e and 4e's>Fortitude, Reflex, WillOr 5e copypasting the attribute list
If being an adventurer were so deadly, nobody would do it. They’d look for more stable employment and the ones that didn’t would be dead. Yes, a nice steady job working as a man at arms for the local lord would be much better than getting pin-cushioned by an arrow trap or whatever.
>>98149624It was a priority thing and you messed up the order and types of saves.>Paralyzation, Poison, or Death Magic (PPoD)This was the highest priority and it let Priests and Warriors no sell most death effects. Started at a 35% (Warriors and Wizards), 40% (Rouges) or 55% (Priests) chance of saving but grew to a 65% (Rogues and Wizards), 90% (Warriors) or 95% (Priests)>Rod, Staff,or Wand (RSoW)Better than the Spell save making using items less reliable than direct casting.>Petrification or Polymorph (PoP)Lower chance of saving than Death for everyone but Wizards but at the same time they were less punishing to recover from. >Breath Weapon (BW)Worse save for everyone one but high level Warriors. Covered stuff that wasn't already covered by PPoD and PoP.>Spell (S)For all spell effects not covered by the previous save types. Everyone but the WIzard's worse save and it was the Wizard's best save. >It's a far cry from 3e>Fortitude, Reflex, WillThe change in saves is part of what made casters overpowered. Instead of a character's saves being within 30% or less of each other the gap in saves tended to grow to the the point that Casters targeting a weak save could nearly guarantee success while having no chance against strong saves.
>>98145789wrong
>>98149946>t. RPGnet plebbitor
>>98148612Doesn't make it OSR.
>>98145402Yes it is, actually. Sucks for you WoDfag, but in the year of our Lord Current Year, D&D rules everything around you.
>>98145703In old D&D you're meant to roll up a new level 1 character.
>>98149114
>>98149633Most adventurers are dead though
>>98150263ummm well uhh
>>98150082wrong again
>>98150263So, the dungeon master describes the bridge as looking rickety and unsafe. The players have plenty of opportunity to do literally anything to increase their chances going across, such as tying off to one another, or tying off to the bridge itself. On top of that, it isn't "save or die" every single time they cross the bridge, there is only a 5 percent chance a plank breaks, on top of the chance to save.So, assuming the players do absolutely nothing to protect themselves, they have a less than 5 percent chance of dying while crossing the obviously dangerous bridge that will be fully signposted as being some kind of dangerous encounter. I agree with the other anon, you should learn to read.
>>98150780They have less than a 5% chance of having to make a further save that is roll equal to or under their stat. Its very different from how the illiterate nogames was painting it.
>>98148356Yeah, I have fun like that. >>98149242Nah. Sometimes stuff should just kill you. There's no point saying "dragon breath does eleventy billion D6 damage" when you could save time and say it kills you.
>>98151139No, they have a 5% chance of having to make the save, assuming they do nothing at all to improve their odds. That's why I said "less than five percent of dying;" the GM has to roll a natural 1, and then they have to fail their save. I know I'm kind of pedantically quibbling, here, but it's important to be as accurate as possible with one's statements.As I said in the first place, this is applying post 3e thinking to an /old/ scenario. The assumption of a post 3e module would be "oh I have to make some kind of skill roll or save or something, I need to pull a level on my sheet in order to get past this." Whereas the assumption of the module as actually written is "your players will attempt to use some kind of creative workaround that makes sense within the game state in order to get around or mitigate the danger of this situation."
>>98150278Here's more highlights from low level adventures
>>98151813Sometimes things kill you instantly. What's your point? They should deal arbitrary damage instead? They should deal notional (sword-hit-like) damage with the understanding that the character dodged?You seem to forget that while they're stated very bluntly many of those situations had obvious exit routes, very low probability of occurring, or could be avoided by using items (antitoxin, climbing gear, what have you) if the players were alert to the possibility.
>>98153537>What's your point?Does anyone actually like the pass roll or outright die that OSR seemed to spam throughout modules? it seems awfully boring. What's the point of character death if you're just going to roll up a new character immediately afterwards anyway, seems like futility.
>>98144630>>98144747Not beating the They're not characters, they're just extra lives like it's a fucking video game allegations.
>>98153948I mean, the whole point is to try not to get killed. Taking cautious approaches, doing things like tying off ropes to prevent falls, etc. There's no fear of failure if you can't fail. Maybe you're missing that in old school games the in-game trumps the dice. If the module says "save Vs poison or die due to poison needles" a clever Rogue might have used apple to trigger the trap or pulled the chest with a rope or such like to trigger the trap without getting hit. The save is only a hail mary for when you play badly. Character death hurts when you lose your levels and the achievements you've built up.
>>98153948So, you're just going to ignore the point made in >>98150780 and continue to be a salty cunt?
>>98154097Would you show me in the module how>tying off to one another>tying off the bridgemechanically reduces the risk of falling?
>>98153984Show me where it says that in the rules.
>>98154104What are you talking about? You hit the thing with a pole to set off any traps, and if one goes off you weren't stood in the hot zone. What rules would you need for that?
>>98154111Show me in the rules where it says>using an apple to trigger the trap>pulling a chest with a rope or such to trigger the trapis allowable.
>>98154111Or just in general that "the in-game trumps the dice."also also>weren't stoodshoo shoo ESL
>>98154116Why wouldn't it be allowable? Or are you saying only actions with a strict mechanical basis are allowed? Because that's not how old D&D (or indeed most games) work. DMs were expected to rule on actions rather than following an enormous rulebook for literally everything. >>98154120My country has been speaking English a lot longer than yours, because we invented it.
>>98154123[x] doubtAlso, if your game is that permissive, you might as well be playing a theater game, because who cares? I'll open every trap while wearing a metal gauntlet. I'll spend time doing a rube goldberg contraption to suck off the noble, etc. ur an idjit
>>98145568>you're not supposed to roll saves since that mechanic is a fail state>combat is also a fail state so you're not supposed to use the fucking combat system they wrote rules for>even if your character does die just replace them with another flavorless pawn so don't bother getting attached to the guy you're RP'ing asOSRfags love posturing about muh theater kids while they push this garbage as the only alternative.
>>98154135Ironically, you've almost got it. Yes, you should take precautions against danger. Those specific ideas sound stupid and as a DM I'd probably disallow picking locks while wearing giant metal mittens but you're thinking at least. >>98154149Strawman much?
>>98144652To be fair the thread isn't actually about playing D&D it's about the people who play games the /OSR/ way.
>>98145678Learn to write English better. Your sentence has defined exactly one point. It says nothing about the play habits of the rest of the people and doesn't address the point the other anon made.
>>98150780>>98151256Also I6 is for character levels 5-7. At that level there's a bunch of magic gear or spells characters might use to save themselves even if they do fall into the chasm.(But above all the anon who said it's not an OSR adventure is correct, the OSR hates Hickman.)
>>98154101>>98154116>I am too autistic to understand how gameplay in an embodied theatre of the mind works>each possibility has to be mechanically specified in detail in the module or it doesn't existYeah, that's a you problem.
>>98144522>Does anyone actually likeYes, unironically.Even a whiff a self-seriousness is cringe in a hobby where you hunt for mathamatical advantages in game of make believe. If the game session doesnt resemble picrel, then I got no time for you, son.
>>98154101>>98154116>>98154135>>98154149I want to think that you're trolling, but I know in my heart that some posters are, in fact, this fucking stupid.Just play Gloomhaven or Descent, it's more your speed. You aren't cut out for ttrpg.
