A thread for discussing the Star Wars franchise and its various media and tabletop games.Pellaeon-class Edition>Adepticon roadmaps:https://www.atomicmassgames.com/transmission/adepticon-2026-roadmap-star-wars-legion/https://www.atomicmassgames.com/transmission/adepticon-2026-roadmap-star-wars-shatterpoint/Previous: >>98208679Fantasy Flight Games’ X-Wing, Armada, and Legion>https://pastebin.com/9puqx1zeStar Wars Roleplaying Games (d6/d20/FFG)>https://pastebin.com/iUriRfaAOther FFG Star Wars tabletop (Imperial Assault, Destiny and the LCG)>http://pastebin.com/ZE4gn0yNOld links>https://pastebin.com/yUVx32wBX-Wing/Armada/Legion/Shatterpoint:>https://www.atomicmassgames.com/transmission/update-on-star-wars-x-wing-and-star-wars-armada/>https://www.atomicmassgames.com/star-wars-legion-documents>https://www.atomicmassgames.com/star-wars-legion-transmissions>https://www.atomicmassgames.com/swp-transmissions/>https://www.atomicmassgames.com/swp-rules/Latest Edge news:>https://edge-studio.net/a-new-hope/>https://edge-studio.net/star-wars-edge/Unlimited links:>https://starwarsunlimited.com/articles/>https://swudb.com/>https://karabast.netTQ: New images have dropped of the Pellaeon-class, are you more willing to use it now?
All ship designs from that era are utter dogshit
I dont think this is an issue in the OT, because the jedi have force ghost as a uniquely jedi ability and palps has the unique dark side power of force lightning, but in video games and stuff it often feels like lightsiders dont really have a unique thing. I know its kind of petting, but often it feels like sith are just a straight functional upgrade to jedi. It would be kino if force ghost was a more intigrated part of Jedi power sets in extra OT material. I always loved the thematic idea that the ultimate sith power was force light, something blunt and rawly offensive, while the ultimate jedi power was force ghost, something discrete and indirect, good for council and wisdom.But games in specific really dont know or care to use force ghosts, so Siths often feel like a pure power boost with the normal telekenetics and sensory abilities plus lighting.
>>98289989Becoming a ghost isn't a power it's a state of being. What are you even talking about? Do you think there's a video game where you die and become a ghost as an ability you tech into??
Why yes I do make AI photos of me in the star wars universe
>>98290463>gross nuThrawn foreheadI didn't need to see this.
>>98290710could you remove the jedi and add more Twi'leks
What is the consensus on Groult? Hate the AR-based blasters but the rest of his art is pretty great.
>>98290811We are not Jedi, but humble merchantsHere, I'm actually surprised this got by chat gpt
Would you allow a droid to wear clothes?
>>98291813Did those appear in the mando film?Did the original remnant trooper concept art designs make it too?
>>98290710Not your blog.
I will once again shill sublight drive because I like it >Libs (Restorationist Republic) (under Anakin being dragged there by his wife) buying Securotors>Loyalists under Palpy buying Imp 1s>The Confederates having fucking TIE Vultures becuase Raith is in Confederate Space>Grevius doing his own thing up north>Scout being the general of Grant's Breakoff sector in Tapani>Empress Teta just not giving a fuck anymore>The Jedi Order breaking up into 3 parts, the guys who followed the tradition into the Core, the guys who supported the liberal restorationists, and the ones who fucked off to the rim to be a jedi church in seppie landsit's an interesting setting
I need to take some pictures of the terrain I've painted up recently.
>>98292808Nice bus, anon :)
>>98289008>Pellaeonfag returns
>>98292925It really is a hover-schoolbus, isn't it.
>>98292720Can you explain which colors are which? I don't understand jack shit.
>>98291813droids wear made to be naked, bare-footed, pregnant, and docile.They dont deserve cloths. They would just get them oily anyways.
>>98290463launching lighting from your fingers is also a state, why are you quibbling over termonology like that? I have the power to become a ghost is a power I have the power to talk to ghosts is a power.I was just saying it would be neat if force ghost was implemented in gameplay more often. Like you can get bullet time because your old dead master is reaching out to you and giving you guidance from beyond.
>>98292808Please do, that look really nice.
>>98294197Oh, ESL, sorry I didn't realize.
>>98291813I think droids should wear some clothing attire if they are sentient; it helps them stand out and not be some mindless toaster droid
>>98292925Very neat board, anon.
>>98293295Dark blue - Palpy loyalistsLight blue - Lib Restorationists Red - CissiesOrange - Grant's breakaway Tapani sectorPink - Empress TetaLight Green - Mandalore Yellow - some corporate sector thing where Grevious is probably hanging outCsilla and Hutt space should be obvious
>>98295390Luv me FLGS
It's so over. Star wars has fallen
>>98300703
Splinter of the mind rape.
>>98293803>t.decraniated owner
What are some cool security or general combat droids floating around that aren't cis?
>>98302082Lando's racist killbots from NJO.
>>98301041KinoMan, I love the 2008-2014 star wars
>>98302082iirc the Empire had some off-the-books assassin droids that weren't sourced from CIS stock.
>>98301041Hot Wheels (Anakin's Sex Mobile)
>>98302762>panties>in spaceMy immersion is ruined
>>98302785Technically, it's a thong. Thongs aren't panties.
>>98302762Would it even be comfortable having Ahsoka on your lap? She seems really boney and hard
>>98302872You'll barely notice if you're harder.
>>98302087>make droids that deliberately look like your enemy>make them charge into battle shouting "we are machines and therefore greater than the Vong" in the Vong's own language>Vong despise all forms of machine intelligence and go into a seething spitting shrieking rage any time they see oneLando was a genius just for how much he was shitting on Vong with that idea, let alone how effective they were.
>>98302937
>>98302752This is from the old WEG Imperial Sourcebook so it predates the CIS, though i guess one could trace its lineage back to the B2 Super Battle Droid in canon due to the overall shape.
>>98302087>>98302937Do you think he ever bothered programming the racial slurs out of all the ones he produced after the Yuuzhan Vong War?Also, Legacy kind of dropped the ball not having one show up as an antique somewhere.
>>98303821Nah, he kept them around and programmed in an Uncle Ruckus mode where they'd pretend to be Vong right up until the moment they started going on about how they're all no good tricksters and so on.Gotta keep them in line somehow.
>>98302762
>>98304200>Ahsoka is a mini-chosen one due to being filled with so much jedi cum it infused her entire being>that's why Ahsoka survived Order 66 and the jedi purges
>>98304200>>98304215Luke probably got to tap that MILF ass as as well since she's such a "good friend".
>>98304200>But Master, my father already hit that>Luke, you kissed your sister, don't be so fussy
>>98302785are you saying she goes nopan then?
>>98304775We already know there's no underwear in space, due to based George.
>>98304215I mean it was probably washed out by hundreds of gallons of clone cum. There's got to be enough Jango genetic material in the lining of her rectum alone to make a whole new army.
Enjoy my AI sloppa!!!!
>>98306164
>>98306169a comfy dinner after a long day!
>>98306164>a twi'lek>with that rank insigniaWas she personally sucking Palpatine's dick?
>>98306178dinner date with the wife!
>>98306186she is actually a lesdom
>>98306186Why not? Daala was doing the same (she was human so she could suck off one level lower)>>98306193Yurifags in bodybags desu
>>98306164Did your lora do that well with the Star Destroyers in the background on its own, or did you have to inpaint that?
>>98306256>Did your lora do that well with the Star Destroyers in the background on its own, or did you have to inpaint that?I just used CHATgpt and imputed my prompt in and that's what came up, I had to try a few times to get her ears right but the whole image is from one prompt
>>98289008Can someone tell me how are the jedi regarded as a myth in the OT? The clone wars were barely 20 years prior and many people who fought right beside them are within living memory
The opressive regime said so and put the weight of its propaganda and opression apparatur behind it. You dont want to commit a wrongthink, do you? The friendly local ISB officer is more than willing to correct you on your errors.It worked in real life, no reason it cant work in a galaxy far, far away
>>98306491was meant for >>98306375plus, keep in mind that beside people are heavily encourage to just shut the fuck up, vast amounts of regular people never encountered a single jedi even at the hight of their power. So those two factors perfectly play into each other.
>>98306375When are they regarded as a myth? Pray tell. Han Solo and Motti doubt that they're as powerful as they are, no one ever doubts that the Jedi existed and were a major force.
>>98306375People knew that the Jedi existed, but as an ancient religious monastic cult/police agency of the Republic purged by the Empire. The Jedi usually kept themselves apart from the public eye, and very,very few people knew the reality about their powers. That even a well travelled and street wise guy like Han dismissed the stories about them as nonsense says it all. By Rogue One/ANH is clear that there was a bit of a new age religious revival about the Jedi among rebels and their sympathizers. But except for those that were around and personally saw Jedi Generals do their thing (like Bail Organa), they were clueless.
The current topic is one of the flaws of star wars. Palpatine only ruled for like 12 years and the clone wars were only like 20 years ago. Jedi were in republic propaganda across the galaxy, and all of the planets the clone wars took place on, anyone in the republic military or administration, and anyone who followed the war would know them by sight, if not name. This makes some of the lines in rebels and the sequels not make sense.I think the timeline would be better if the Sith ruled for much longer and things were darker, and people actually did have time to forget. It would make more sense. At the very least, one generation of people. But Luke is born in episode 3 and kills Palapatine when he's like 20 so it's barely one single generation.
>>98306793>But except for those that were around and personally saw Jedi Generals do their thing (like Bail Organa), they were clueless.During the Clone Wars the actions of the Jedi would have been highly publicized. They were the generals leading the GAR, so they'd have been all over the news and propaganda. It is mentioned that as the war went on Palpatine did start having the propaganda focus more on the clone troopers and downplay the Jedi in preparation for the coming purge, but especially early on the war the Jedi were the face of the GAR. The RotS novelization makes it clear that Obi-Wan and Anakin in particular are famous as heroes of the Republic, and are household names across the galaxy for their victories against the CIS.
>>98306808>I think the timeline would be better if the Sith ruled for much longer and things were darker, and people actually did have time to forget. It would make more sense. At the very least, one generation of people. But Luke is born in episode 3 and kills Palapatine when he's like 20 so it's barely one single generation.That kind of ends up being baked in since even if we ignore episodes 5 and 6, the original movie already established that Luke's father was a Jedi knight. So the Jedi must have still been around 20 years ago.In the pre-prequel EU the impression was that the rise of the Empire and the fall of the Jedi was more gradual, instead of Palpatine reorganizing the Republic and having all the Jedi killed overnight. The Jedi were mentioned to still exist while Palpatine was emperor, though they were increasingly marginalized and eventually eradicated. Palpatine was implied to have built up his powerbase more gradually, increasing the powers of the chancellor and extending his term in office until eventually he was able to just declare himself emperor. And the Empire didn't immediately kill all Jedi and sending stormtroopers to oppress the population, but gradually tightened its grip, increasing taxation and conscription to build up its military, while sidelining and discrediting the Jedi, until Palpatine was in the position to destroy the Jedi and use the military to enforce his will on the galaxy.
>>98306808>>98306810The Jedi being part of the Republic's propaganda during the war doesn't mean they featured their powers. And even if sometimes that happened, it would be easily dismissed as propaganda.> household names across the galaxy for their victories against the CIS.Maybe in the core worlds, but probably not so much everywhere else. Which is why most SW fiction is set in far away places even for the GFFA.An 20 years is a long time for the 24/7 news cycle and civilian life. Do you remember all what was going on and all the big names of 2006? The Iraq war? I was already an adult and I can barely remember.those days.
>>98306841The Iraq war only directly affected a relatively small number of people outside Iraq. A better comparison to the Clone Wars would be the World Wars, since the CW was the setting equivalent of a global conflict. WW2 ended about 80 years ago, yet there's still new material related to it being produced (at this point I'm pretty sure that if you watched every WW2 film and played every videogame taking place during the war, it would take more time than the entire actual war did), and even people who aren't history nerds will know the names of at least some of the major government leaders and generals.
>>98306870What? The Iraq war dominated the news for half a decade and lots of countries were involved on it. It also spawned big political changes and terrorist attacks all over Europe and many other countries.All that within living memory.The only reason WW2 is still part of mainstream culture (and not just nerds) is the 90s Spielberg movies that revived interest in the era, or countries like the UK, Poland or Russia that framed their national identity about the war.Meanwhile in the GFFA, the Empire erased the Republic and reframed all about their rise and the new order.
>>98289008Remember when Cade smoked death sticks to keep his ghost grandpa away? I remember
>>98306895Even with all the 00s cringe edgelord bs, these EU sequel era comics still had better plot, characters, and ships than the Disney sequels
>>98306920looking back at it, god i miss the old early 2000s edge. How do we go back?
>>98302937I admit prior to reading the novels I rolled my eyes at the whole Store Brand Terminators thing, but yeah when you actually experience it they're fantastic.
>>98306895He also banged a super-hot Zeltron and a crazy hot Twi'lek.
>>98304247Oh jesus don't give Wolfboy ideas. Next thing you know we'll find out they've given Assoka Mara's part of Disney Heir to the Empire and instead of Ben we'll get some orange-eyebrowed La Creatura de Abominacion to "carry on Luke's legacy" or some shite.
>>98306870Okay you want to use WW2 as an example, let's do that: ask a fucking Russian to relate their understanding of the Great Patriotic War as they call it according to what they were taught. If you know anything at all about it from a Western perspective, maybe after hearing their version - a version established almost immediately in the aftermath of the war and fully accepted within a few years - you'll understand how the combination of government propaganda with most people being disinterested unintelligent droogs only concerned with their next meal and/or dopamine hit can very quickly make pretty much any story you want to tell into unvarnished truth in the eyes of most.
>>98306920>>98307024There's more than just the edge. Legacy 'gets' what Star Wars is about - pulp. Look at any of Lucas' Star Wars. You have Aayla Secura who is essentially Jedi Darth Talon before Darth Talon, she dresses and fights in a tank-top. Padme and Leia both show skin several times and are intentionally attractive. Luke is a big damn hero who blows up a space station, no fucks given. There's stuffy British guys preserving Space Britannia, there's a dark wizard behind it all. Star Wars at its core and heart, is pulp and cheesecake.It's completely incompatible with the modern world of where every woman has to be an obnoxious girlboss, every man has to be hurting and in pain and having a dour face on all the time like he's constipated (See: Jon Snow, the modern hero archetype).And there's one thing Legacy has that nu-Wars lacks that original Star Wars also had - hope. For all talk of Cade being an edgelord, these are his last words to Krayt, rejecting apathy, and rejecting the Dark Side. You won't see anything like that out of Jake.The ship designs are still dogshit though, yeah.
>>98307259Legacy is lazy dogshit. Another Empire is dogshit. Empire being "benevolent" and ruling the galaxy is dogshit and fundamentally anti-Star Wars and contradicts Lucas' entire worldview. More Sith is dogshit. The main Sith dude being authors Glup Shitto OC from his prequel comics is dogshit. Designs are all atrocious, not just the ships. It looks ugly and disgusting. Everyone looks like a stinky junkie faggot with unwashed hair, piercings and eyeliners.
>>98307437Andor is a pathetic, shit show that's not Star Wars and is actively worse than even the Sequel Trilogy. Sorry, dude.
>>98307957Yawn.0/8, shit tier b8.
>>98307965Not bait at all. If you like Andor, you need to get the fuck out.
>>98307957>>98307969weak bait, it's too unbelievable
>>98307957No one has mentioned Andor or the sequels, you deranged subhuman. Legacy is still dogshit, and will always be dogshit.
>>98308001Similar to the works of Dave Filoni?
>>98307437>>98308001Legacy was forgettable and mediocre while trying to appeal to the edgy zeitgeist of the mid 00s. It was still better than the Sequel trilogy in everything that counts as SW.
>>98306375Even at their peak, there were still almost no Jedi in the galaxy. The EU put their pre-Clone Wars numbers at around 10,000, while the Republic controlled 1.3 million planets: That's less than 1 Jedi for every 100 planets. Unless you were living on Coruscant or one of planets that saw ground combat during the Clone Wars, you would almost certainly never interact with a Jedi. You wouldn't even know anyone who ever saw a Jedi. The closest the average person would come to a Jedi would be like "my neighbor's grandfather once met a guy in a bar who heard a rumor that a person a few planets over once saw a guy from afar who might have been a Jedi."
>>98307957You're right but the tourists who don't even like star wars and the cattle who will parrot that it's good because those tourists like it are really upset at you
>>98308428its a typical le own the chuds show, the main character is your 2010s archetype gormless guy who has no agency and is always constipated
>>98308428>>98308470here's your participation hoodie, nigger
>>98306192afternoon friends!
>>98309098preparing for a smuggler mission
>>98308842>it's bait because I don't like it!enjoy your normieslop badly painted over with star wars zoomzoom
>>98306164Ew, no. Keep it in your containment thread.
>>98310848AI > furry porn "artists"
>>98306164I, for one, don't mind your slop. Keep posting, anon.
>>98307259I would argue that Knights of the Old Republic (comic) is better than Legacy by leaps, bounds, and more than 12 parsecs. Simply because both come from a time when the writing was good, even if products could be shit and you cut yourself on Legacy edge.
Trying to create consistency between the Witches of Dathomir and other Force users without the Witches outshining them is some real bullshit.The amount of superspecial things they can do that others can't is fucking rancid.
>>98311552Just make most of their 'stupidly powerful' tier bullshit reliant on doing a ritual on DathomirBeyond that they're basically hot goth girls in spaaaace.
>>98311522And Tales of the Jedi was better than both. But either point is irrelevant to the reality that Legacy takes a massive reeking Taco Bell shit on the Sequels and wipes its arse with High Republic.
>>98312335>And Tales of the Jedi was better than bothHardly a fair comparison, Tales of the Jedi is basically the single most important piece of worldbuilding since the OT itself.Also, does anyone actually consoom yidsney fanfiction comics/books? I kind of just assumed they were there to justify getting rid of the real stuff.
>>98312664The disney comics have some okay stuff, I liked the Beilert Valance's comics and the short story with the Crimson Corsair finding a clone was fun
>>98312664Look, as someone who agree's that Disney's stuff has been shitshow after shitshow after shitshow, with very little redeeming material.., i really hate the rose tinted glasses of the people who pretend Pre-Disney Star Wars was any different.Star Wars has always had a 1-9 ratio of "Masterpiece vs Dogshit" I mean, the only people i have ever met who legitimately say they like the Vong novels are the people who also admit they never had to suffer through them.The only REAL difference between Disney's run and Lucas' run is that Lucas always made the big play where it counted, the 10% of old Star Wars that is golden is the stuff that had the most advertising and publicity put into it and 90% of the dogshit was relagated to places people could easily ignore (Low budget vidya, comics, novels, etc) Whereas Disney is slapping great big fucking neon signs atop their failures. whereas the actually good stuff is mostly being hidden away in novels and comics. And the only Novels and Comics they pushed hard (High Republic) Also happen to be dogshit.Disney has put out some damn good stuff. The Thrawn books are a lot of fun, Vader's comics have been (For the most part) way better than anything Lucas did with him (Lucas' era focused too hard on trying to make people see Anakin becoming Vader with comic after comic of Anakin doing dark and evil shit. Disney's era has mostly been about "What parts of Anakin ACTUALLY survived into Vader and How much does that piss him off?") The Resistance cartoon was actually pretty good. Not brilliant, but good enough (If you can get past the dogshit first 4 episodes)Call me a shill if you want. Way i see it, there are so many shitty things that Disney has done with the franchise, i don't need to pretend that the few good things they have made are shit in order to desperately validate a "DiDnEy NeVeR dOnE nUfFiN rIgHt!" mentality.
>>98313294Either a botpost, or the most NPC, soulless, deranged, retarded motherfucker ever to live. It doesn't even rise to the level of shilling, because shilling is supposed to get people to agree that the thing is good and all this makes me want to do is weep at the state of humanity when creatures like you aren't left outside in the cold to die as infants.
>>98313569And here we have an EUtranny jumping to the defense of Luuke because he feels trapped in a binary, similarly to how he decided to chemically castrate himself just because he likes to wear lacy underthings.
>>98313569
>>98313675You need to die. As in, you literally should be shot. Not in Minecraft, either.
>>98313833>>>/pol/is that way man. Enjoy.
>>98313294You misunderstand where I'm coming from. I have no interest in the quality of these works, to me they simply do not exist. The Crystal Star is more real than yidsney wars. The Callista trilogy is more real than yidsney wars. Every SW children's book series is more real than yidsney wars. The Tales comics are more real than yidsney wars. The original Marvel comics are more real than yidsney wars. Straight-up Infinities is more real than yidsney wars. Why would I quibble about the writing of something that does not exist?Anyway, I guess the answer to my question was "yes". Thank you for the timely response.
>>98313842Nothing about what I said is political. I legit think you need to be shot because your opinions are that abhorrent. In fact, you need to go back to /co/ because TCW is dogshit. Complete, utter, irredeemable, dogshit. I don't give a flying fuck if Lucas had anything to do with it.
I finally watched this because I was on an international flight and had time to kill. I like the cast. I enjoy the lightsaber duels. It's probably the most aesthetically triumphant Star Wars story when it comes to set dressing and costumes. I like the premise. I like that Sol's vision was wrong for a subtle yet obvious reason.But it has one totally irredeemable flaw and that is the fact that the Jedi are all obstinate, petulant, and weirdly intolerant. It's not that they should be flawless paragons, but their flaws should be confronted and redeem, Jedi should be aspirationally heroic. All the characters are stupid and just die ingloriously. Carrie Fisher was standoffish with the witches when all she needed to say was "my padawan thinks there are children in danger here, I disagree with him, how shall we prove him wrong?" Most of the other niggling critiques are correct but I don't think anyone would've cared about them as much if the characters weren't all obliged to be foolish and incompetent in service of the plot.
>>98313947Carrie Ann Moss* not Carrie Fisher huuurrrr
>>98313947I'm pretty sure part of the show's premise was portraying the decline of the Jedi Order. I would've been fine with them being arrogant cunts if it wasn't for the>All the characters are stupidpart. They built a mystery box and couldn't figure out how to fill it, and they didn't even have the excuse of changing directors partway through.
>>98311425I don't know why you felt the need to bring up furry artists, but you're wrong either way.
>>98314434I believe he means that the sort of artists who do commissions for RPG characters (which is the sort of specific art /tg/ otherwise has a thread for) generally do furshit as their main hustle.
>>98313947>>98314246the tl;dr as usual is 'they are shit at writing characters and stories'The rest, the whole DEI debacle, LGBTQ+whatever main character, etc. as a pretext for insulting anybody who dared critique the first (i.e. bad writing) as hating the second (being a racist and homophobe) was just PR suicide on top of the badly written show.
>>98314434There's a specific subset of slopfags that churn out slop because they hate human-made art in general and human artists in particular, and when called out on their sloppa they resort to accusing everyone of being furries. I assume they got that strategy from their AI overlords because any human with an IQ above room temperature would realize why it doesn't work as an argument.
>>98314710>hate... human artists in particularHey, who doesn't? Hardly an excuse, though.
>>98307437>Empire being "benevolent" and ruling the galaxy is dogshit and fundamentally anti-Star Wars and contradicts Lucas' entire worldview.George opinion is irrelevant ever since he sold Star Wars to Disney.Emp[ire undergoing heavy rebranding from beurocratic theocracy to military republic, formed around esprit de corps makes sense. Besides, Imperial designs are too damn popular, so you cannot be more Lucas-like with keeping them around.
>>98315166You can't argue agaisnt the butthurt everything-EU-is-the-devil faggots, they are just as insane as the fedora tipping 'andor is le anti star wars' faggots.
>>98315184Yeah but I can annoy them.
>>98315267I kinda understand.But man, all I wanted was waifus and cool starfighter fights in space and maybe some laser swords here and there.Maybe some hero's journey.
>>98315184>andor is le anti star warsBut that’s correct, thoughbeitever.
Fresh OC from my current game, made by the player of this genius Nautolan who decided to fistfight B2s.
>>98315166In the first draft of Star Wars, there was only the Empire, that grew corrupt overtime. A liberal monarchy is essentially George's idealized government, you can see it on Naboo, Alderaan, etc.And with the aesthetics, the Prequels showed us them being the aesthetics of the good guys, who were slowly corrupted overtime. Makes sense from a SW perspective to have them later be 'redeemed' and serve the good guys, hence Fel Empire and Imperial Knights.
>>98315995Plus, y'know, Imperial Knights are legitimately just cool as shit.
>>98315995Desu, Imperial knights are the only redeemable thing from Legacy
>>98307437>>98315166>>98315995Errybody likes to talk about how a good Empire is silly but nobody wants to talk about how the "good" New Republic was such a rudderless mess that they spent a year letting a quarter of the galaxy get overrun by intergalactic genocidal invaders because doing something about it would have been bad PR. Just under a decade after they let a different group of genocidal aliens ethnically cleanse an entire star cluster because stopping them would have been bad PR.
>>98316357It was a rudderless mess at least partially because the New Republic was being run by Bothans at the time, coupled with that old adage about hard times creating strong men who create good times and what good times then create is weak men who create hard times.
>>98316357a bad head of state in the New Republic will eventually be voted out of the office. A bad emperor, you´re stuck with till the end.
>>98315166>George opinion is irrelevantIt will always be relevant since he created Star Wars, you fucking moron. A bunch of retarded fanfiction - especially one as bad as Legacy - is, in fact, irrelevant.>Emp[ire undergoing heavy rebranding from beurocratic theocracy to military republic, formed around esprit de corps makes sense.No, it doesn't. Empire was already a military Republic. Perhaps you forgot, but the Republic had never had a standing military, and once it got one - that's when it started degrading into the Empire.>Besides, Imperial designs are too damn popular, so you cannot be more Lucas-like with keeping them around.What are you even saying? Complete non-sequitur. Like everything in the EU, it's a shitty knock-off and looks shittier than the original.>>98315995>In the first draftDesperately grasping at straws here, man. This shit was already gone by the second draft - for obvious reasons. And never reappeared again. Never appeared in the finished product.>A liberal monarchy is essentially George's idealized government, you can see it on Naboo, Alderaan, etc.Except George's monarchs were ELECTED in a democratic process, they were not hereditary kings and Emperors, you fucking retard. George's idealized government is liberal democracy. That's why Rebellion was an Alliance to Restore the Republic. That's why in his sequels the Republic was restored. That's what the heroes fought and sacrificed for. Not for fucking Empire with fucking Stormtroopers and ugly star destroyers, with hereditary fucking Emperors, Council of Moffs and centralized government. This is slap in the face to everything the actual, real Star Wars stands for. It's retarded fanfiction for stupid fanboys who can't own the fact that they like evil faction, so they need it whitewashed.>And with the aesthetics, the Prequels showed us them being the aesthetics of the good guys, who were slowly corrupted overtime.What? What the fuck are you talking about?EU trannies are retarded
>>98315184For all its faults and very divergent style and tone, Andor understands the themes of Star Wars: resistance against authoritarianism, tyranny, corporatism and fundamental, violent rejection of the Empire and everything it represents. Much of the EU is retarded and doesn't understand Star Wars, hence rampant Imperial whitewashing, rendering the entire narrative comically pointless.
>>98316561You need to get killed. That's a pretty simple statement. Dictatorships are and will always be superior to democracies. All democracies need to be smashed with nuclear warheads. At least 10 times.
>>98316581Andor sucks ass and is pretty much unwatchable.
>>98316561How does it feel to know literally everyone except a couple of Andortrannies thinks you're a retard? People like you always interest me because a reasonable person would take a step back and ask whether they're missing something, but your sort instead seem to view being a tiny, tiny, minority that everyone else laughs at as somehow being validation.
>>98307437>Empire being "benevolent" and ruling the galaxy is dogshit and fundamentally anti-Star Wars and contradicts Lucas' entire worldview.I think (You) and Lucas are dead wrong here, especially within the context of his own Campbell/Jungian influences for SW, and if I ever met him in person I'd probably hand him copies of Moore & Gillette. The archetype of the king, and even a shadow king is not inherently and metaphysically evil but his commie/leftoid upbringing won't let him admit it. He even has to walk back his royalty being 'elected' because he thinks democracy is superior to aristocracy even though the central plot of the PT is a failure of democracy and there is zero real critique beyond the bad guy wants autocracy and the nice person wants democracy.
>>98316610A democracy invented the Nuclear Warhead
>>98317285That was Germany. Democracies don't invent anything bar decadence.
>>98316561>It will always be relevant since he created Star WarsIt cannot be relevant, because George was constantly changing his opinion to better rotate around the market's demand.>Empire was already a military Republic.It's been anything BUT military Republic. Top-3 Imperial characters who were calling the shots durring OT weren't part of the Imperial military.Palp and Ani - sith (religious theocracy)Tarkin - Grand Moff (autocratic beurocracy)>What are you even saying?I am refering to Lucas editing ANH and cutting off the moment when Han shot first.
>>98317285>A democracyOpen Constitution
>>98317408>George was constantly changing his opinion to better rotate around the market's demand.He did it quite intelligently, too.
>>98317408Palp and Ani may have been Sith but they did not rule as a religious theocracy
>>98317528Yeah that's why I said beurocratic theocracy. Secret religious cult ruling through beurocratic machine.
ITT:
>>98313947It has an interesting premise; I mean, any story set way, way before the prequels gives you a lot of breathing room, yet they still fumble it up; the whole story feels like a big mess and comes off as odd at timesThe cast actors I don't mind; they all seem good, but they're forced to play really bad characters who are meant to be idiots or come off as idiots when they're meant to be portrayed as competent. It doesn't help that they have bad hairstyles; looking at you, Yord, and the only character I like was just Bazil, and he's a bloody otter-beaver alien thing
>>98317367The scientists working on the nuclear bomb left Germany when it became a dictatorship, because Hitler thought nuclear physics was a "Jewish science". They literally pissed away their chance to develop the weapon that could have won them the war because dictatorships care more about appeasing whatever delusions the Great Leader is having this week instead of doing the smart thing.
>>98317675You mean the military autocracy? The Empire of New Hope is one that has shed all institutions other than the military. Nobody was obeying the Empire out of fear of beauracracy. Nor were they even aware or even cared about the dark powers of the sith.
>>98317200>>98317408I think you should dilate and fuck off to Warhammer. Star Wars isn't for you and you clearly fucking hate it. You're only into it for superficial aesthetic reasons.
>>98316561>Except George's monarchs were ELECTED in a democratic processwas that lore in TPM?I thought it was a change in Attack of the Clones to basically make it easy for Padme to still be doing things and not be tied to Naboo
>>98318344Most fun interpretation of the situation (and the one I use whenever I do games) is that it's another example of the Republic infecting everything with democracy as if it's a virtue in and of itself.Similar to the Ruusan Reformations.The idea that there are ancient cultures with their own ideals and histories that've been basically Globohomo'd into submission by an uncaring Bureaucratic paste-making machine ran by retards and career politicians (but I repeat myself) who couldn't and wouldn't tolerate the differences between various worlds fits with the whole 'The Republic has gone astray somewhere along the line' theme that led to the empire.After all, what is more Imperialistic than the quiet use of back room politics by a pack of unprincipled, self-interested oligarchic anywheres to engage in the forced cultural cleansing of the somewheres that they're meant to be looking out for?
>>98318311Star Wars is about redemption of the irredeemable and confronting evil inside and out. You do know George held TWO banquets in Joseph Campbell's honor, yeah?>I disagree here's why>FUCK YOU FUCK YOU KJGHAKDAre you okay? Is this guy a regular schizo, is he always like this?
>>98320528Some nice looking clones anon
One for the nostalgia gang:gofile.io/d/JJ6VbU
To the Janny who deleted my posts: Alright, fine, thanks for not deleting the first post I made talking about the Russan Reformation since that's one of the most interesting aspects of Star Wars
>>98306920>>98307259>>98307437I liked the eu comics. They were fun and I have some somewhere. Wonder how much the paper comics are worth now.I always thought the Disney canon was good ideas and bad execution. The mud trooper designs are nice to me.I think the EU was mostly good ideas with better execution than Disney canon.But that’s just me. I didn’t mean to say EU was perfection. I know there were some really rotten stories in there but I don’t know the specifics.
>>98318311yet this post didn't get removed, very strange.
>>98317167Anon, this guy is Filonifag. Literally his ENTIRE existence is shitting on the EU and other media to cope with TCW slowly losing support as people realize how shit it really is. That's it. He has a Twitter account where he reposts shit from Archives and acts all clever about it, then spends 24/7 hunting down anything even slightly related to the EU to seethe about how Filoni is Lucas' perfect successor and how the EU "didn't get it"He's been shamed and mocked numerous times but he just doesn't give up, he's too autistic to do so.Also note that he ONLY pushes the part of lore which fits in his own tiny conception bred by TCW, so anytime anyone shows him Lucas coming up with a different take he can't take it. One time an anon showed him some shit about Lucas saying Palpatine was actually thinking about the good of the galaxy in RotS and that he loved Anakin and he seethed to no end, saying that "he didn't mean thaaat!". Another time people used the RotS novel as proof that Lucas had some consideration of the EU and he pulled out a quote from a random Del Rey editor about how Lucas apparently didn't line read it (same Del Rey editor has been in multiple subreddits retracting that very statement and confirming Lucas did line read it lmao)
>>98307107>implying Fagloni would ever give Ahsoka to anybody else instead of retconning it so that his self insert bangs her and becomes her husbandkek
>>98319353Elective monarchies are a real thing, though they ended up either turning into hereditary monarchies or into democracies over time. I think there might still be one or two tiny countries that still technically are elective monarchies (the Vatican is one if we consider the Pope the equivalent of a monarch).They're not really democracies, as instead of the people voting for a new king, you have a council of nobles that elects one among themselves to be the next king.
>>98321797Do you think there's only one person that doesn't like the EU, especially Legacy? What's next? Are you gonna tell me Dark Nest, Legacy of the Force and Fate of the Jedi were misunderstood masterpieces? Lmao, fuck off. Most of the EU sucked and anyone who was actually there reading it as it came out knows it. Sounds like you're off your pills, you larping manchild schizo.>people used the RotS novel as proof that Lucas had some consideration of the EU and he pulled out a quote from a random Del Rey editor about how Lucas apparently didn't line read itLucas told Stover to write whatever he wanted as long as it's good and doesn't violate the story of the film. Stover said himself he had never seen Lucas personally edit the novel. It was sent to him with some edits from the updated screenplay. That doesn't suggest that Lucas read the entirety of it and edited it line-by-line. It suggests that Lucas (we don't even know if it was actually Lucas personally or some middle-man from the Licensing department) remotely gave feedback on specific parts. The novel still differed drastically from the film and heavily contradicted it. Inserting EU into it was entirely Stover's doing, not Lucas'. Lucas did meet and talk to Stover before he was hired to write the novelization, and he may have provided some feedback. That is known. However there is nothing to suggest that every single word, every single sentence in that novel was read and approved by Lucas, thus making it sound like "Lucas had some consideration of the EU!" That's a baseless leap in logic and just your headcanon, because you've got nothing but this flimsy excuse. Lucas has never considered any novels or the EU to be canon. He never read them. He said it personally more times than your inbred brain can count, he's been saying the same thing for over 20 years. Deal with it.>same Del Rey editor has been in multiple subreddits retracting that very statement and confirming Lucas did line read it lmaoSource?
>>98322372nigger i don't like legacy either and yet i don't go around whining like a retardjust pick and choose what you like and stfu
>>98322389Maybe that one obsessed faggot with shit taste should stop spamming ugly Legacy slop in every thread for years on end.
>>98322454retard this is the sw tg thread. shit is obviously gonna be eu like d6 or d20why do you come to a thread for shit surrounding the eu then get mad at it? go to tv and make a thread on the films and how everything else got it wrong but don't spam a thread that's inherently for eu media
>>98322372Masterpieces? No. But I'll state with certainty they're more overhated than the Prequels ever were. If those sloppy turds can be "reappraised" then some middling licensed fanfics certainly can be.Your problem is that you reveal yourself every time because you can't keep a lid on yourself. Plenty of people have issues with the EU, only *you* go into frothing, screeching, limb-flailing autistic toddler-tier meltdowns at the merest suggestion that it isn't 100% shit from the ass of a turd.
>>98322760prequels were always great
>>98322834Great? No.But they were at least solid.Most of the critiscism aimed at the prequels boils down to 'this could have been so much better'The sequels however, are just irredeemably shit for a multitude of reasons.There may be the odd piece of cool stuff hidden in the dungheap, but it is buried deep.
>>98322834Nope! They had a few good bits and a good building block for actual good stories to be told, they're a complete mess
>>98315184NOTHING disneywars is 'star wars'. At all.
>>98316581OK COMMIE.
>>98317408MOFF literally means Military OFFicial.
>>98322372Look at this zoom zoom faggot pretending he was even alive then.Nice strawmen, zoomie
>>98324439idk man, I like the B-wing Mk 2
>>98324453never stated anywhere, not from george or any slop disney or EU writers
>>98321797>it's poopdickschizoblow your brains out discord userstop trying to give personalities and names to your thread boogiemen
>>98304200>that picI love these kinds of posts. Made a few a while back to see if I could be funny. Maybe I wasn’t but I tried. I have a few variant ideas.>>98304264That made me chuckle.
>>98307105Darth talon is up there with one of the most remembered twileks from the eu from sex appeal alone. Her character was probably not that great. I’m not sure.
>>98324982Much as I love Legacy, most of the Sith characters except Krayt and Wyrrlok III were a bit hollow. Like I'd say personality-wise Talon rates below Maladi (actual best girl btw) and Nihl.
>>98325272>Maladi (actual best girl btw)Hard mode: Hit on Maladi and Talon at the same time and survive
>>98290710You look like Dobson.
>>98324653Wrong. Loser.
>>98326540Cite your source :)
How fast is Hyperspace? Like when Luke flew from Hoth to Dagobah how long was he just sitting in his X wing?
>>98317920>You mean the military autocracy?Nope. Beuracratic autocracy.In ANH Tarkin says that Moffs and Governors will replace Senate as ruling body of the Empire, not generals and admirals.
>>98327281The Moffs are military governors (the position was created by Palpatine near the end of the Clone Wars as the Military Governor Act, placing systems near the front lines under military command), so they are still part of the military. In the film we see Tarkin wearing a military uniform, which indicates he's part of the military rather than just a bureaucrat.
Why are the rules written like such ass in Legion.I haven't played in years and didn't remember it being this bad.
>>98328165After the great Magic the Gathering refugee crisis every single popular tabletop game must write its rules to be as defensible against autistic troon misinterpretation as possible.
>>98289989force lightning feels kind of weak compared to force ghost
I'm gonna say itI wish lightsaber duels were like fights in the Kenshin movies.
>>98328419Ruruoni Kenshin?
>>98328223>Shield tokens are double-sided, with an active side and an inactive side, and always enter play with their active side faceup. When a unit flips an active Shield token, that Shield token is flipped to its inactive side and is now inactive. When a unit flips an inactive Shield token, that Shield token is flipped to its active side and is now active. why
>>98328165never actually played against it but the youtube mans have talked about the new han han being really high damage and im just wondering why han is dealing damage at all, hes a smuggler not some quickdraw gunslinger known for being dangerous he isnt even a *good* smuggler in the OT. that to me gives a worse review of the rules writers than lawyer autism detail on how tokens work.
>>98328525Yeahttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8p0z-v5kBfc
>>98289989Was electric judgment a good idea or just grey jedi cope? I've always wanted Jedi to just have a different element from lightning. If Sith get lightning, maybe Jedi get ice or something. It's a shame the SWd6 rules state all cool elemental blasts are inherently dark side. Even wind, which does no damage, is just as evil as frying someone to death with lightning. If I could go back in time, I'd tell them to not make any techniques inherently dark side. Just say a power causes extreme pain and fall back on the existing rules foe determining if it's light or dark.
>>98328674What do you want him to do? Stealth sneak attacks maybe? He quickdrawed and killed Greedo, so it fits as well as anything else.
>>98330091Nigga, using the force to attack is inherently corruptive. That's the point. The jedi are only meant to kill with their lightsabers. Force pushing someone to their death is already terrible, a "nice" force lightning is just pure cope.
>>98330091>Was electric judgment a good idea or just grey jedi cope?The latter, but I'll allow it because Luke makes any Force technique cool with his big dick Grandmaster energy.
>>98330104>using the force to attack is inherently corruptiveTake it up with the writers. That is just fundamentally not true. Killing with the force is 100% a-ok. Killing innocent civilians is bad no matter what, Force or no, Luke uses his powers to kill lots and lots and lots of people.
>>98328674To be honest that Han mostly deals high damage for 2 reasons:He is on a Tauntaun and the Tauntaun does most of the damage when charging, Han's own damage is kind of unimpressive otherwise, no better than other pistol-using heroes like Leia or Lando and actually worse than some like Moff Gideon or Episode 4-5 Luke.He also gets to attack twice per round which is kind of his thing in Legion, being a fast shot and making more attacks than other heroes.I don't think it's really a flavor fail in this case, unless you think named characters shouldn't be any more lethal than basic troopers and unable to kill anything which would be a bit dumb imo, iirc Han kills his fair share of Stormtroopers in ANH and RotJ.
>>98330091Can't speak for everyone but I like the idea there's new possibilities and techniques to be discovered, rather than everyone doing the same Force Grip, Force Choke, Force prostate exam shit for 200,000 years and that being the extent of things.
Just killed a PC with an ancient, eldritch sith lord that looked like this and was the size of a rancor
Damn I'm not a fan of con exclusives outside of Pilot Luke but that Boba Fett looks really neat.I always loved his concept art design.
>>98332516Sovl
>>98328709I don't think that's anything to be ashamed of. That's sick.
>>98325647There's way less mean things to say about someone. You could have just called him a fag.
>>98301379thats hot.
>>98330248Yoda says otherwise in ESB. Maybe he's bullshitting Luke or he's just wrong in a all-Jedi-are-wrong-about-this way, but it's been part of SW lore since 1980. Seems like using the force to propel a weapon is an edge case; if you couldn't use the force (without going dark side) if there are any possible higher-order offensive consequences, then you couldn't use the force at all. Eg, using the force to save baby Hitler from drowning, or using a force jump across a gap so you can chop up some dudes with your lightsaber. Force-levitated homing grenades are probably into the danger zone; less so if you're mostly just throwing them extra hard. IIRC it's been established a few times that force-shoving someone to their death is well into darkside territory even if using the exact same power and impact to knock them off their feet harmlessly is frowned upon but no biggie and same power to knock them away from certain death is 100% fine.
>>98333803Well it's a question of intent, not result. Let's say you're duelling some darksider or other, he's got his back to a cliff's edge, you Force shove him as hard as you can, and he falls and snaps his damn neck, among other things. If you did so because you intended for him to fall off and die, that would be a Dark Side use of it. If you expected him to defend against the shove, distracting him long enough for you to disarm him, and him flubbing it and dying as a result was accidental, then it's all kosher and you can keep huffing your own farts.
>>98333803Nah, it's not the action that matters, it's the motive, the mental state, the feeling behind the action that matters.Yoda isn't 100% right all the time, as see in the OT when he was wrong about the Dark Side being forever when we see Anakin redeem himself.But still, the Jedi had their doctrine of not using the Force for direct attacks because the Force is so strongly tied to their emotional state that to use it for direct offense risks using their anger, fear, and aggression; which ARE Dark Side traits. But the Jedi still kill. The point is they kill when it is necessary to end a thread but have no anger or personal vendetta behind the action. That's why Luke almost falls to the Dark Side in Return of the Jedi. That's why Palpatine says that if Luke strikes him down, his journey to the Dark Side will be complete. Because Palps knows (as does Luke) that if Luke were to kill him, it would be with hatred in his heart. Luke does give in, especially when Vader starts goading him about turning his sister to the Dark Side. But Luke pulls himself back from the brink and he becomes a true Jedi once he stops himself and calms his emotions.
>>98333842>>98333848I think that's mostly right, but also that the force is at least a little bit deontological. If a Jedi finds themselves in a situation where the only intervention they can think of to save many innocent lives is to force choke a baddie, just directly kill him by crushing his windpipe with the force, I think that's a serious dark side act even if they maintain saintlike calm and detachment and are motivated only by a pure instrumental desire to protect. The Force itself just doesn't like being used directly for destruction and suffering, it's alien and disinterested in human foibles but it cares about life.
>>98328419I thought the old republic cinematic CNN trailer lightsaber duels were the best.Especially the lightsaber force throw and turning a lightsaber off and back on to surprise kill a guy.Maybe it is that they were cgi that made the moves more “acceptable” because the cgi hammers in that everything is fictional even harder and so a viewer can more easily roll with what is going on screen.
>>98334122>cnn trailerHow did I type that? Autocorrect got me.I was referring to the old republic cinematic trailers.
>>98333803Yoda is saying it in the sense that a Jedi doesn't go aggressively and let his emotions dictate the fight just because his blood is up and adrenaline is pumping. They let the Force guide them. Yes, they will kill if they need to, but it won't be heir first (or second, or third) choice.
>>98311552Didn't Sheev eventually beat their boss on Dathomir?
>>98330248>>98333803>>98333842>>98333848>>98334084Jesus, do you have any idea how incredibly gay and lame all of that is? No wonder Jedi are the lamest and least interesting part of Star Wars. People should be driven by their goals, belives and desires, not supernatural force daddy fucking or your or some bullshit
>>98334425Luv me EU separatists like Sev'rance'tann and Sora Bulq
>>98289989>but in video games and stuff it often feels like lightsiders dont really have a unique thingKOTOR had "Healing the whole party" for Jedi and "Health Drain enemies for yourself" which I think was neat.And (so far) this trend has resurfaced, both Grogu and Rey/Kylo can heal when we've yet to see the ability used by a SithTechnically, tho, every Force User can use any ability, the real Force isn't a limited skill tree
>>98334425>People should be driven by their goals, belives and desires, not supernatural force daddy fucking or your or some bullshitTo the Dark Side, such thoughts always lead.
>>98334434Funny because using midichlorians to create life was supposed to be deepest Sith lore.
>>98334437>Anything apart from huffing granola and sitting in a big circle jerking each other off to Kumbyah is a path to the dark side.>You do not have free will, your two options are gay eunuch or eating babies, because the Force makes it that way.Fuck it, Darth Traya take the wheel.
>>98334444Nice quads. Although that's a lie, isn't it? Legends Plagueis didn't create life, iirc?"...he could even keep the ones he cared about... from dying" fits more nicely into Sith lore, since staying alive at all costs is their entire ideology.
>>98334463>Anon cannot fathom non-violent solutionsHow's the weather on Korriban this time of year?
>>98334425>>98334463>I want the magic powers but not the philiosphy behind themI'll never understand that.Why not just make a normalfag character at that point? Ace pilots, stalwart troopers/officers or canny rogues of all stripes are right there for people who don't like being tied to a specific system of beliefs.
Is Yoda's species especially connected to the light side? Or is there a Daolon Wong-esque nasty geezer lurking somewhere?
>>98334482>You should be an egoless puppet through which the Force acts on the galaxy.Here's an idea, would it be moral for the Jedi to create lobotomized clones of themselves who are brain dead from the moment they leave the tank, if these clones could then somehow be filled with the will of The Force?What about if they could do the same to natural born children, would that still be moral?>>98334486>The PhilosophyNah, we're memeing on someone who has interpreted the philosophy in the most paint huffing way possible as gospel.Remember: Yoda was wrong, Vader was redeemed through his emotional connection to another contrary to everything the Jedi believed, it was Luke's attachments to others that led him both towards and away from the Dark Side when Big-E started whispering in his ear and, as always and most importantly, Han Shot First.Seriously, the number of people that think emotional balance is the same as being emotionally constipated is wild. Get some emotional fibre in your diet, raise a pet with a short life span or something, it'll help.
>>98334512>would it be moral for the Jedi to create lobotomized clones of themselves who are brain dead from the moment they leave the tank, if these clones could then somehow be filled with the will of The Force?Assuming such clones even could be force sensitive, the traditionalist Jedi argument against that would be the same as mainstream Christian arguments against the likes of Valesians and Skoptsy: celibacy is ideal but it doesn't count if you castrate yourself and do not have to struggle for it.
>>98334523>No, you have to suffer otherwise it doesn't co-Suffering leads to the dark side, Yody-Wody himself said it so it must be Facts (Certified by true Jedi Patriots, ect)And putting that aside, I'm not talking about the effect on the Jedi of having an infinite clone army. I'm talking about "Would it be moral to lobotomize people/force ego death on them if the resulting husk was a pure servant of the will of the Force without any wants or desires of its own"I'm using clones to cut away the bullshit dodge of "Oh we could never do that to innocent people"If yes the end game of the Jedi Philosophy is a war against sentience, free will and the Living Force itself and it must be rejected as firmly as the Sith Philosophy is for its war with the Cosmic Force.If no then why? Because surely absolute submission of the self to the Force is the highest good possible in the philosophy of retards who mistake the stagnant, decadent last-years-of-the-republic Jedi for being some kind of perfected ideal, rather than the result of ideological drift caused by not having anyone challenge them for a thousand years.
Anon take your meds, this is sounding rather schizo.
>>98334566>Discussing the worldbuilding of a setting, in a thread about that setting is schizo because engaging the hypothetical scares me :(At least pretend to have some self-respect or dignity for once in your worthless existence. It's fine to say "That's an interesting point, but I disagree because X, Y, Z", hell, call me an asshole then tell me why I'm wrong and my shits retarded.But if you're not interested enough in the Star Wars setting to discuss it, why are you even here?
>>98334555An orthojedi answer to that is that suffering isn't the same thing as struggling. Approved trad jedi techniques to fight desires leading to the Dark Side include meditation, not self-flagellation. Consider the life of Qui-Gon, he strayed from the Jedi path by having a sexual relationship on Felucia when he was young but rejected it and lived the rest of his life according to the jedi code, even realizing the ultimate goal of becoming a force ghost (the Jedi boddhisattva).
>>98334555>struggling=sufferingMaybe the real problem is that you just want everything handed to you on a silver plate.
>>98334486>hey, wanna see some cool characters with space magic?>too bad>you choices are....>lawful stupid boy scout monk>retarded evil backstab autistso you cannot fathom that a bit more narrative variety and wiggle-room beyond these very narrow concept are interesting?a character being defined by his goals, instead of dark force space aids that corrupted his soul into being a evil retard?
>>98334598See, now this is what an actual counterpoint looks like. Good job anon, you have my never ending respect.I don't think it addresses the point, since what I'm asking is "Do you have to entirely surrender yourself to the Force? If so then why would the logical end state of that, creating a being that doesn't even have a will outside of the Force, not be a good thing?" but I can see where you're coming from at least, to choose the right thing is better than to have no choice at all.That's more of a Christian view on things though and I don't think it applies in the Star Wars Universe since yielding yourself directly to the Force and its will is an aspect of the Jedi philosophy.Also I still stand on 'The original movies directly states that Yoda is full of shit' given the ending. Vader is absolutely and without any argument against it, saved by his love for another and his fear of seeing them suffer. It is beyond a shadow of a doubt proof that 'No attachments'' is more of the Jedi going 'Oh, I'm so scared of getting hurt, what if I suffer from my attachments :(' than coming from the Force itself.>>98334606This meanwhile is what being a passive aggressive little bitch looks like.Here's your (you), don't spend it all in one place.
>>98334486Because the NJO exists. It allows you to be Jedi without being a boring boy scout monk. All of Luke's Jedi had different personalities, different goals, but shared the same ideals as Jedi. They also didn't dress in fucking bath-robes up until Denning decided to Prequelize everything by copy-pasting them as "Jedi uniforms" even though the whole point of Luke's Order was the informality of it all.>>98334574He's not here to have a proper discussion, though. He's here to shitpost and rile people up. Just ignore him. Never respond to retarded bait.
>>98334640NJO was ultimately against Jedi philosophy of the OT (unlike the aspirational life of Qui-Gon). "Luke doesn't get married" is straight from the mouth of Lucas.
Lads, I just realized.There's actually a canonical group that proves the whole Jedi 'No, you must toss the Force Salad all day every day or else you are going to start twisting the heads off younglings' argument is an incorrect and entirely in-setting read of the will of the Force.Because the non-Nightsister Dathomirian Witches are a canon non-darkside group who spend their spare time crushing slave-himbo pelvises like beer cans and have an entire stable civilization. Their existence proves that the Jedi are full of shit.
>>98334648Doesn't seem that I give a shit, does it? Star Wars is what I decide it is. Lucas is a faggot, and so are you.
>>98334648>Jedi philosophy of the OTYou still haven't addressed that Yoda was proven in the OT to be full of shit. Keep running from that one as long as you like but at the end of the day Vader only stopped throttling his officers and slam-dunked Palps into a reactor core because Luke called out to him as his father while being given the old car battery supreme.
>>98334628Well yeah but it's just that simple>morally good/neutral goals and good/neutral means to achieve them -> Jedi>morally wrong goals or means -> DarksiderI understand that having anything between might seem cooler to some, but I think having the magic powers be restricted by rigid system of morals is more interesting than just handing the magic powers for free to anyone who thinks telekinesis makes their character cooler.I think if you want to explore the stuff inbetween there is plenty of room with other archetypes besides the space wizards who are all plenty cool in their own rights, but people always want to make the most special snowflakes.>>98334633>>98334640Part of the problem is that this discussion gets rehashed every 3 threads and the fact of the matter is that no one will change their mind on it even if we argue about it until the cows come home.>Vader is absolutely and without any argument against it, saved by his love for another and his fear of seeing them suffer. It is beyond a shadow of a doubt proof that 'No attachments'' is more of the Jedi going 'Oh, I'm so scared of getting hurt, what if I suffer from my attachments :(' than coming from the Force itself.I personally think it's partly a matter of intent that is covered by the difference between connection and attachement.Vader sacrificing himself to save Luke is good because he is doing so out of selflessness while Anakin scrambling to find ways to save Padme is bad because he mistly care about having Padme for himself and no one else forever, as is somewhat represented by his beliefs in governance being entirely at odds with what she values.>This meanwhile is what being a passive aggressive little bitch looks like.Maybe consider growing a thicker skin if you can't handle being told not to conflate 2 different things.
>>98334649If those witches are slavers they surely also do horrible things to younglings. Witchcraft is thus a method of the Dark Side.
>>98334662Nah, they only enslave men so it's all kosher.I'm not even joking, that's how it's treated.
>>98334661>I understand that having anything between might seem cooler to some, but I think having the magic powers be restricted by rigid system of morals is more interesting than just handing the magic powers for free to anyone who thinks telekinesis makes their character cooler.>I think if you want to explore the stuff inbetween there is plenty of room with other archetypes besides the space wizards who are all plenty cool in their own rights, but people always want to make the most special snowflakes.Or, you know, i just ignore that stuff and stick with the old legends way and handling this.>b...but lucas saiddont care
People who reject adherence to the Jedi code become backstabby even if they are not Sith and try to rise above such practises. This is evident in Shin Hati being used as a speedbump by her master. Such is the way of the Dark Side.
>>98334661>Vader sacrificing himself to save Luke is good because he is doing so out of selflessnessBullshit, he did it because he was his son. Vader has the blood of millions on his hands, fucker could swim through it like Scrooge McDuck before Luke was old enough to walk. If Luke hadn't been his son he would've killed him four or five times over before we even got to the 3rd movie.He spared him, saved him and was saved by him purely because of their attachment to each other and no amount of faggy wordplay going 'Hmfphm, well aschually a connection isn't the schame as an attachment ' is going to dodge that, you weaselly little fuck.It was love, not ideology, that brought the Empire to its knees, the Jedi didn't win the day, Luke Skywalker did.And know what, I'll even go further; Anakin trying to save Padme wasn't wrong. Neither was him trying to save Shmi.The Jedi got it wrong. If either of them had been complete randos who Anakin had no attachment to but was having whacky dreams over, the Jedi Council would be gooning their gourds off about him having force visions telling him to save them, clearly it's the Will o' The Force™ telling him to go do something about it.But because he slightly more of a shit than average about if they live or die suddenly it's an attachment and therefore a no-no.The Jedi in your mental version of Star Wars are cowards, the type who would condemn fire out of the fear of being burned if the concept was introduced to them fresh rather than being something they already knew about.
>>98334694If Anakin had followed the Jedi Code and did not stick it in Padme, he could have beaten Sheev with Mace Windu, saving billions of younglings and preventing the Empire's very existence. His last-minute redemption does not change this fundamental fact.
>>98334706Mace Windu was acting directly outside the Jedi Code in trying to heem Sheev. By your own logic Anakin did nothing wrong in stopping Mace from curbstoping an unarmed man.After all, that's not the Jedi way is it lil' Timmy?>B-buh-buht Sheev was armed with his force powers!Flexing the code I see, that's another dark side point on your report card.
>>98334713Actually Sheev struck first so Mace was acting in self-defense, even if he dropped the old treason reason beforehand.
>>98334713nta but no you're completely wrong.Mace was correct to kill Sheev. Sheev had already manipulated public opinion and the courts, so there was not going to be proper due process for his crimes, he was going to lie and the people who he manipulated into supporting him were going to make it happen. Mace was privy to information that the rest of these people didn't have, so he knew that he needed to end the threat. Mace was accepting some dark side corruption unto himself to destroy the threat, which it testament to his character. He was already used to purging himself of corruption since his lightsaber style was aggressive, so he's even done this before.Anakin's attachment to Padme caused him to save a sith lord and murder a jedi master. Anakin's actions vindicate the OJO's stance on attachments. Everything that goes wrong, went wrong because someone with power had an attachment that caused him to act against the well-being of the galaxy. A jedi wields great power, and with power comes responsibility, and with responsibility you need to be wise and impartial. Anakin failed this test, and as a result the galaxy is ruined for the next 15 years and literally billions of people die.Being smarmy also does you no favors. A sith is, factually, still armed as along as he is conscious, and we know that Mace's reasoning for killing him is sound, since Sheev controlled the courts and the senate through manipulation.The prequels are about the OJO making various mistakes, but at the center of it all is Anakin being an easily manipulated stooge, and Palpatine pulling his strings and making everything worse on purpose as part of a millennia long plan to ruin the jedi and the republic. People love to omit those last two parts and just say "OJO dumb", which is only half or even a third of the story.
>>98334713Mace and friends went to lawfully arrest Sidious, only for him to immediately strike down 3 tenured and skilled Jedi Masters, and Mace immediately had to fight for his life. He didn't have the time to call it in or make an "Officers down!" distress call, and Sidious certainly wouldn't have given him the time. Mace's skill with the blade, Vaapad, and Shatterpoint are the only reasons he was able to defeat Sidious. He had every right to kill him there, but was stopped by Anakin who was tunnel visioning some assumed Sith Force technique to save Padme (that didn't even actually exist). Personally, if I was Mace Windu, I would've killed him before the whole "You have lost" thing with the lightning that they did, just for killing my boy Kit Fisto alone. I'm sure Mace would agree with me (off the record, of course).
>>98334694>It was love, not ideology, that brought the Empire to its kneesIt was Vader choosing love over power that saved Luke, yes. While his attempts to save Padme was stepped in power/ego tripping rather than trying to fully understand what's going on before acting.More faggy wordplay but I still think the Rebel ideology did as much to take down the Empire than the Skywalker family bonding.>If either of them had been complete randos who Anakin had no attachment to but was having whacky dreams over, the Jedi Council would be gooning their gourds off about him having force visions telling him to save them, clearly it's the Will o' The Force™ telling him to go do something about it.I disagree on that. Yoda and the Jedi Order are shown to be wary of visions: "always in motion the future is".In fact whenever some jedi maverick tries to prevent a vision because they know better than the stuck-up faggots on the council it turns out to be their downfall.>because he slightly more of a shit than average about if they live or die suddenly it's an attachment and therefore a no-no.There is a world of difference between giving a shit about someone and being willing to kill all your coworkers to save them, and I don't think that's just faggy wordplay.>The Jedi in your mental version of Star Wars are cowardsAgain I just think rules, limits and a framework are important even and especially for supermen. I think dynastic jedi lords above the laws of mere men are interesting from a worldbuilding perspective, but they lead to a lot more problems for the galaxy than self-denying monks jedi.
I think there's a pretty big difference between Anakin's attachment to Padme and to Luke. The former was possessive: he wanted to keep Padme to himself and was willing to betray the Jedi and work with a Sith lord to do it. He's more attached to the ideal of having Padme as his wife than he is to her as an actual person, hence him choking her when she disagrees with him turning to the Dark Side. Meanwhile his attachment to Luke is more selfless: he's willing to sacrifice his own life to save someone he cares about.The Jedi forbid attachment specifically because they feared it lead to exactly the kind of selfish possessive behavior Anakin displayed with Padme, which is incompatible with the Jedi being supposed to serve the greater good and the will of the Force over personal desires. They probably went too far in the other direction by banning all attachment, but the logic behind the decision is there.
>>98334796Established dynasties of force users would have taken over the story completely and then we'd have Game of Thrones in space.
>>98334649>Witches are canon.>Therefore it's canon that the Jedi really are just fucking freak incels who could be crushing puss 24/5/35/10 without consequencesLel
>>98334803>His attachment to Padme was bad, he was willing to betray the Jedi and work with the Sith to do it>His attachment to Luke was good, he was willing to betray the Sith and work with the Jedi to do itMaclunkey
>>98334796>There is a world of difference between giving a shit about someone and being willing to kill all your coworkers to save them, and I don't think that's just faggy wordplay.Bro, he killed not just his coworker but his boss to save Luke.Anakin did the exact same thing twice, betraying everything he claimed he believed in for a person.You can say one is good and one is bad until you rupture something, but you're basing it entirely in the consequences and context, not the action or motive.
>>98334803Correct.>>98334887Wrong. He killed the person harming the galaxy and harming the force. It was justified and correct. Killing Mace was his personal failing because he wanted to selfishly save Padme. So he ended up harming the galaxy and harming the force in the process. The first case factually is bad, and the second case factually is good. This is the second time you have committed the same sort of fallacy. People will say killing Mace was bad and people will say killing Papatine was good because those are simple statements of true facts. They should say these things, and I'm glad most people do. You are just a stupid contrarian committing a false equivalency fallacy by saying betraying your coworker is the same, and ignoring that one was entirely correct and the other is literally the stand-in for the devil for the franchise according to the author's own words lmao. You are really dumb, sorry to be blunt.
>>98334512Cloning Jedi never seems to go well in Star Wars. Legends or Disney. The Force doesn't seem to like it, so the clones always come out a bit weird or fucked up somehow.
>>98334909>He killed the person harming the galaxy and harming the forceGreat argument.Except he didn't do it because that person was doing that did he? He did it for the exact same reason he tried to save Padme.You're reduced to arguing "Well it was good because the consequences were good." rather than from first principles.Cope harder, louder and longer about it faggot.
I think trying to reconcile Vader being redeemed by his love for his son in the OT and the PT treating attachment as a bad thing and something Jedi shouldn't do is going to inevitably fail because the conflicting ideals come down to Doylist reasons.When doing the OR Lucas clearly didn't think the Jedi should be celibate and attachment as evil. Even before Vader was retconned into being Luke's father, Obi-Wan tells him his father was a Jedi knight, and at no point was that treated as something that was unusual or forbidden by the Jedi. As mentioned, Vader's turn back to the light is motivated by his love for his son. And at no point did Lucas veto any EU stories where Jedi had children (yes, Lucas was generally hands-off with the EU, but he did veto concepts if they contradicted his own ideas. For example, Timothy Zahn originally intended the Noghri, the aliens who were fooled into believing the Empire saved their homeworld and worshiped Vader as a cultural hero, to be called the Sith in order to explain the line in the script of the original film where Vader is called a Sith Lord during the DS boardroom scene, but since Lucas already had the idea of the Sith being evil Force-users who were the enemies of the Jedi, he told Zahn to change the name).Then between the OT and the PT Lucas gets divorced, and suddenly the Jedi are explicitly stated to ban attachment and marriage, and when asked about it in an interview he described marriage as owning or possessing a person and that being against the Jedi ideals, which isn't how most people think of marriage. It sounds to me that getting divorces left him bitter and disillusioned about love and marriage, and he projected that into his writing by making attachment evil and describing marriage as something akin to slavery.
>>98334977Agreed.Going purely by the OT though, the only people we have saying that attachments are wrong are proven to be incorrect.Yoda and Obi-Wan outright say>If you go after them you're doing the wrong thing, let them die, it's for the greater good and if you care about them that'll be used to turn you into an edgyboiAt which point Luke went 'No, fuck that fag shit, I can be a good person and still care about people' then proceeded to have his cake, look them square in the eye, eat it and go back for a second slice.Also come to think of it, the Lucas sequels would've taken place after his remarriage.Do you think we'd have gotten chocolate Mara Jade if he'd made them?
>>98334985>Ghost of Mace Windu absolutely losing his shit as Luke saves his "niece" from the Dark Side then proceeds to rawdog the hell out of her>Anakin talking mad shit in the background about 'What, I thought we weren't meant to have attachments, why would this bother you Master Windu?"
>>98334977>>98334985Two retarded bitches telling each other "agreed, so much this sister"Nah, you're just a bunch of fucking retards. The absolute state of this thread, manchildren struggling to understand movies for 12-year-olds. That's what happens when you pollute your brain with loads of contradictory fanfiction written by retards who didn't understand it either.>Also come to think of it, the Lucas sequels would've taken place after his remarriage. Do you think we'd have gotten chocolate Mara Jade if he'd made them?No. Lucas told his sequel plans in the 2018 interview, and before that to James Cameron, and Luke never married. Luke was also looking for toddlers to train, just like the prequel Jedi. Lucas never changed his mind on the prequel Jedi rules, and it carried over to Luke and his order that he would have successfully rebuilt in its image.Y'all are a bunch of retards who can't comprehend the difference between selfish attachment/possession and selfless love/compassion. Lucas based the Jedi philosophy largely on the Buddhist monks. Lucas himself said that he's a self-proclaimed Buddhist-Methodist. Read up on that, you clueless fucking bozos. Star Wars fans are so fucking stupid.
>>98335052>People agreeing with each other and not with me, this makes me the big angryhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jqHViajqnwcMaybe if you keep failing to convince people you're right using babbies basic bitch insults programme that's a (you) problem, saslty-retard-kun.
>>98334977Nobody should care about Lucas "vision" bs after he jumped the shark with the Ewok movies in the 80s, and later turned into a coward when TPM failed and he didn't follow through with Darth Jar Jar/The mule.The prequels had some good ideas, but plenty of stupid ones too. Making the Jedi innefectual assholes was one of them.
>>98335066Nigga I just came in this thread scrolled down and saw your two retarded posts. There's no reason with retards and no convincing them. They've made up their minds, retardation and biases are settled way too deep, and nothing will change it. I'm poking fun at your stupid ass.
>>98335075>he didn't follow through with Darth Jar Jar/The mule.There was nothing to follow through. This is stupid fan theory born out of people incapable of earnestly accepting Buster Keaton type character for children who looks like a cartoon alien rabbit.
>>98335089Go read Asimov's "Foundation" trilogy, and then come back.It's impossible that the idea wasn't at some point part of the prequels, even if it was discarded later.There's too many coincidences.
The Ewoks should've been the Wookies as originally planned.Jar Jar should've been a double agent, if not at first then later after Palpatine saw the possibilities in himAnyone who uses the 'Movies about Space Wizards for Children' argument should be boiled alive in their own effluence as a warning to others.Simple as.
>>98334628Nobody likes Greyjedifags and nobody ever will. Seethe eternally but the reality is everything who's ever met you thinks you're a fag.
>>98335214>Noooo, you can't critique my wholesomechungus goodboi Jedis, only->Uh, well, the films, I guess...>Can do that!Shaak Ti is never going to sleep with you bro, just give it up.
>>98334985Yoda and Obi-Wan tell him not to go because it's a trap, and that while he might (key word: might) be able to help them, the future is always in motion.Well shit, they were right. It was a trap, Luke didn't help them at all. In fact, Luke's friends had to rescue him after he fucked around and found out with Vader, and got his hand chopped off. They'd even already escaped at that point, and Luke was left hanging from a weather vane crying out for Leia to come get his dumb ass. Then he was so emotionally traumatized from finding out Vader was his father he never returned to Dagobah to keep training like he was supposed to be doing, leading him to be drastically less prepared when the time came for him to confront the Emperor and Vader.Did he succeed? Yes. But it takes nothing away from Luke's choice in ESB being wrong. Yoda was right, he should not have gone. He was not ready for that burden of knowledge in ESB.
>>98335226>Shaak Ti is never going to sleep with youreee
>>98334425Sev'rance spotted.
>>98334486You wanna know how people fall to the Dark Side? You're seeing it.
Maybe we should just take the darkside pill and join the sexo sith bitches.
>>98335226I can live with that. My one true SW waifu is a different Togruta.
>>98334692Dave Filoni is an idiot, if you're following him as a template for writing, you're doing it wrong.
>>983350521. I don't care.2. the Nameless fag that goes on about Kreia on Youtube is an absolute retard, like dumbest motherfucker on the planet, and also a pedophile.
Some of you believe this unironically. Fucking grim.
>>98336661>If you want to actually discuss if the Jedi maybe aren't 100% reliable that means you're doing it wrong.Bemused reminder that the Witches of Dathomir are Lucas Cano and all you can do about them being non-evil and still having not just families but a slave society is cope, seethe, dilate and mumble about how you're only an incel because it's the Jedi way.
>>98334660>Yoda wrong everThe dark side really did dominate the destiny of Anakin Skywalker from the moment he stepped onto that path.>>98334694>I think having the magic powers be restricted by rigid system of morals is more interesting than just handing the magic powers for freeHard agree.
>>98336688>Yoda>Right>EverDidn't see Palps coming. Got involved in the Clone Wars.Turned the Jedi into a political entity that stagnated in its quest for understanding.Missed the Rule of 2 for 1,000 straight years. Was handed the order at the height of its victory and managed to end his life in a swamp hut surviving on Dianoga gruel with everyone he ever trained bar one dead because he fumbled the ball.And again, was entirely, completely, full throatedly wrong about setting Luke up to be an assassin on Vader. If Luke had killed his own father he would've been full of Sheev Cream for the rest of eternity.>M-muh rigid system of morals-"My system of morals only lets me use the wrong hand to do everything, therefore I'm more interesting."No, you're still boring, but in a notably retarded fashion, there's a difference.
>>98335075Filtered by the peak that is The Battle for Endor
What if Ewoks hold the true secrets of the Force?
>>98335214the franchises most popular characters are often non-traditional Jedi or "Sith but kinda resonable instead of hyper autists", anon.
Cheerful reminder that the "Jedi can have no bitches" thing is canonically a part of the Ruusan Reformations.aka: The single most retarded thing the Jedi did in the entire canon and cause of literally every problem from that point onwards.It could be revealed revealed that Fae Coven was actually a Sith who survived the war, took the place of a dead Jedi and used her position to torpedo them with "My democracy, you have to be under the yoke of the Senate, religious orders should totes involve themselves in politics :3" and I wouldn't even blink.
>>98336992Cheerful reminder that if it didn't happen on screen it didn't happen at all.
Disney is canon.Seethe.
>>98336910Right, but I don't recall "canon" Revan using lightning ever. I know he redirected a Dark Council member's lightning back at her, and he tried to do the same to Vitiate, but he never used lightning on his own after the memory wipe. >well MY Revan Not what I'm talking about.
>>98336661No? No one in Luke's NJO tosses lightning around. Luke and Jaina do it like once and immediately say no thanks.
>>98334692Filoni aside this is correct
>>98334463>Darth Traya take the wheelNo.
>>98334692This is why nightsisters need regular spanking and handholding.
>>98338056The prewuels also lacked a tardwrangler for George, so we ended up with an hour of BS cogging up the first movie, bad dialogue and stupid set pieces wastign time in the 2nd and a 3rd that had to make up that lost time.
My depiction of a Mandalorian painting from a young Sheev Palaptine’s collection
>>98335111NTA but I did read the foundation trilogy this summer and I don't think you have it. There are certainly a few parallels, but Jar-Jar is a pretty clear evolution of the Ewoks rather than the impossible variable.
>>98338172That said, if you want to lay out the evidence I'd be interested to see it. I have not rewatched EP 1 in at least a decade so there could be clues I'm missing.
>>98336910The franchise's most popular characters are - objectively - the OT trio plus Anakin. The fact that Revanfags and Kreiafags are obnoxious loudmouths doesn't change reality.>>98335226Seethe and cope harder, poofter, you will always be despised by all right-thinking folk. Imaging seeing a setting filled with evil sorcerors and space samurai-wizards and thinking to yourself>I wanna be an edgelordy Centrist Dad!
>>98337642It constantly perplexes me how people can play that game and come away thinking Kreia is somehow meant to be taken as correct. She's literally just a Sith Lord with ambition to dominate the Force on a level even most Sith Lords think is overreaching. Everything she says to the PC is self-serving lies and obfuscation.
>>98338056>Um acktually I made this political allegory for the War on Terror filled with references to Dante's Inferno and other works of classical and biblical literature for 12 year olds and that's why adults didn't like it, it had nothing to do with my weird ass creative choices and wonky executionSheer cope.
>>98334741>and we know that Mace's reasoning for killing him is sound, since Sheev controlled the courts and the senate through manipulation.I always found it funny that before the fight starts Mace is all like, "You ain't the Senate yet, bitch," but then after he's like, "Um, actually sweety, he has control of the Senate and the courts and we need to make this an extrajudicial killing."Now, is that Mace making an objective re-assessment, or is that him acting out of fear/anger/grief? I can't say either way, but it makes me feel like a Force user needs to think very deeply about their reasons for doing things. Maybe that old lady from Kotor II had a point.
>>98337458people dont care about canon Revan. If anything, people dislike canon Revan. What people do like is their OC Revan who follows their own agency
