The Fool Edition>Previous>>98539003>Pastebinhttps://pastebin.com/WiCHizn0>Mediafirehttps://mediafire.com/folder/s9esc6u7ke8k5/CofD>Mega Ihttps://mega.nz/folder/ePQ1BKhJ#RCosRCh59Ki2Mpb1M9H3Uw>Mega II (also containing fanmade games)https://mega.nz/folder/ZbQ2zLJA#DOT-3df6rS2lLet4_RmqJQ>5e Megahttps://mega.nz/folder/7rQQ1LbQ#16_AiXVGo0P3_rVOJuoZyA>VtM to VtR fan translation guidehttps://mega.nz/folder/LhYTUD7b#cRDFTcMXSB_2TjD7eJoE5Q>STV content foldershttps://pastebin.com/9i9zhydQ>General Creation Kithttps://mega.nz/#F!FWJgBTbb!f7d5rARWHYzuI8-8aI-Bxw>Ideas: BJ Zanzibar's WoDhttp://167.99.155.149/>Anders Mage Pagehttp://mage.gearsonline.net/anders/>White Wolf Wiki:https://whitewolf.fandom.com/wiki/Main_Page>Thread QuestionWhat was the dumbest thing done by someone in your games or in the lore.
>>98547241>What was the dumbest thing done by someone in your games or in the lore.There was this one time werewolves decided all the other fera needed to go extinct.
>>98547247>>98547241Eh. I know the actual dumbest one.God had created.
>>98547247There was one time Werewolves decided some Fera are Wyrmspawn. Mostly because Fera were idiots and realized too late that Warriors of Gaia will warrior all over them.Ananasi actually served the Wyrm when they were targets of the War of Rage. (And they caused the rest of the War of Rage and further used Garou to attack Malfeas to rescue their Queen)Nagah literally assassinated other Fera, including Garou, for "greater good" and when one of them fell to the Wyrm and assassinated the wrong Garou, at a wrong time, it spiraled out of control.Gurahl were so stuck in their ways that they haven't realized a single action of their could have prevented the War of Rage, if they had actually balanced the scales against the Wyrm's actions.Grondr were so stupid and stubborn, charing blindly into a situation that they literally caused their extinction by poking a very delicate Garou Nation, who just lost one of the leading figures for peace, to another Fera.
>>Thread Question>What was the dumbest thing done by someone in your games or in the lore.Dumbest thing in the lore? Garou killing the other fera.In my games? A guy in my Hunter the Vigil game made a toilet bomb. Like, he turned the toilet itself into a bomb and put a pressure detector on the seat so when the guy they wanted to kill sat on it to take a shit the toilet would blow up and he would die.The toilet bomb itself wasn't exactly stupid, but the fact they were hunting a vampire certainly made it stupid.
>Be Caine>Have a path towards redemption>Don't take it10 dots in Wits my ass that fucker's on 1 dot at most.
>>98547269Gaia really wasn't the brightest spirit around, huh?
>>98547269>no emotions except prideI don't know what Gaia and the Weaver were expecting from the Anansi.
>>98547269Unreliable narrators, this is just Garou doing historical revision and trying to make their retardation look less retarded.
>>98547333?You mean Ananasi books Ananasi pov and Nagah books Nagah pov, literally their own history? Even Mokole blame Nagah like Nagah blames themselves. (Not many know about Ananasi side of things)
>>98547269Why the hell did the Gurahl refuse to resurrect Petros?
>>98547241>TQI like how all splats have a mechanism in place, that prevents them from trying to change and / or work with others for the common good. It's funnyonce you look at how many things could have been solved if they just went "maybe the enemy of my enemy is...le friend?"
>>98547338Retarded Garou apologists, unreliable narrators shouldn't be taken seriously.
Yeren Supremacy
>>98547269>we actively caused the war of rage because we got caught working for the WyrmThey should have kept killing the spiders instead of getting distracted with the pigs and aurochs.
>>98547340>retarded werewolf drags the carcass of another retarded werewolf to you and threatens to murder you and your entire species if you don't do what they tell you to doYeah, the right thing was totally to become the bitchslaves of the Garou.
>>98547354How'd that pride work out for them?
>>98547359Well now the whole world knows how retarded the werewolves really are, including themselves.
>>98547340Because they are supernaturally stubborn and once decide they are right, they don't change their mind.Otherwise, nothing is stoping it and Gurahl rewarded resurrection people less deserving than Petros>>98547354I mean...they are nearly extinct and they already resurrect their own who does stuff like "sacrifice themselves for another" or "finds food for kinfolk"
>>98547361With an asterisk because some only dug their head deeper in the sand and started shouting lalala
>>98547206This part of canon is a bit of mess(like other parts aren't) but doesn't he return like a month before Gehenna in those scenarios? You could write that off part as being on purposeThough I'm not defending WoD writing here, I agree it's extremely bad at a lot of places
>>985473671 werebear is worth 1000 retarded woofs
>>98547372Instruction unclear, now my Werebears are mostly extinct while Garou 1vs5'ed all other Fera
>>98547369Yeah but it was an explicit thing that Gehenna got held up by centuries thanks to his fuckup.
>>98547352Amen
>>98547374Which happened because Garou are retarded.
>>98547381And now we are circling back to >>98547269Because it wasn't only Garou being retarded.
>>98547391And then we circle back to unreliable narrators and Garou apologists.
>>98547394>if a narrator says something that implies anything isn't entirely the garou's fault they're unreliable>if a narrator blames them then they're beyond suspicionI must be bored if I'm still biting this.
>>98547394You are literally calling four different sources, all of them aren't Garou and in fact, three are victims of Garou and one being prideful Ananasi, Garou apologists. At this point, Black Spiral Dancers are less biased than you.
> text text text garou are retardedHang on, I've seen this somewhere before...
>>98547401When you have to go desperately scavenging for breadcrumbs when the majority of available lore agrees that the War of Rage is the result of Garou retardation, yes, those breadcrumbs are unreliable.
>>98547381All parties involved are retarded>We should work for the Wyrm, say the Nagah>Well that backfired, a Garou is dead for no good reason>We're the reviving guys who aren't gonna revive someone, say the Gurahl, fuck you>Oh shit the Guys Who Get Mad Really Easily got mad at that who could have seen this coming>We're gonna tell the other Fera to attack the Guys Who Get Mad Really Easily they're getting Pretty Mad at our entire race and no we're not gonna make accords or perform a rite of contrition or anything fuck you time to retaliate >Garou escalate >Win, win so hard they should have lost>The Wyrm sees another victory>Gaia doesn't give enough of a shit to remake the dead Fera races even though both humans and their respective animals exist Truly it is the defining theme of War Games that war is bad and you shouldn't do it.
>>98547406Non-Garou can still be brainwashed into being Garou apologists.>>98547415Unreliable narration and Garou apologia, you really shouldn't be working so hard to defend Garou retardation.
>>98547415>Gaia doesn't give enough of a shit to remake the dead Fera races even though both humans and their respective animals existIt's hilarious how skewed the priorities of Gaia and the spirits get sometimes. Like Owl finally getting off it's ass because a garou dared to go mummy.
Looks like the Woofs are being thin-skinned again...
>>98547241How bad is v6? only tangentially aware of what it's up to.
>>98547415Gaia (if we believe that she really created everything) is the setting's biggest retard.>Make the Triat and give one of it's members sentience, allowing it to break the cycle to pursue it's own vision.>Make the fera, all have massive flaws that lead to them all acting like retards when shit really hits the fan>Refuse to elaborate and die off
>>98547420>Dozens of Fera species going extinct?>I sleep, who cares, things are born to die>IS THAT AN ATTEMPT AT IMMORTALITY TO PRESERVE KNOWLEDGE I SEENo wonder so many choose to serve the Wyrm, sure, the Garou and kinfolk are promised immortality in the afterlife as an ancestor spirit...but damn bro..
>>98547431>How bad is v6?For some reason they folded Protean into Animalism while merging Koldunism and Chimerstry.>>98547435Don't forget that BSDs get three more ranks than the garou.
>>98547414Those breadcrumbs are 4 different Breedbooks about Changing Breeds aka Fera aka Garou's targets in War of Rage. They aren't from random "Rage Across..." books or side material.You are calling the Nagah narrator, Mokole narrator and Ananasi narrator unreliable.Hell, Nagah literally made stone tablets out of event and put it into their nests.
>>98547441BSD ranks don't correspond to better gifts though, it just turns them into a purely spiritual servant of the Wyrm
>>98547420>>98547435The obligatory picGaia and totems really didn't care for War of Rage
>>98547441> they folded Protean into Animalism while merging Koldunism and Chimerstry.Is Dementation & Vicissitude STILL gone on top of that?
>>98547431Second Inquisition is rendered ineffective by AI disinfo.Giovanni take over the Hecata and rebrand it.Beckoning is over but elders come back changed.Anarchs "win" in a Pyrrhic sense.Sabbat develop new tactics.Health level are gone, hunger dice are gone. Blood points now also function as hit points and are called Vitae.Humanity is a now a scale between Beast and Human where both things are bad.STs no longer roll any dice whatsoever, only the players are allowed to.NPCs don't have statblocks, just three once-per-scene abilities and a difficulty level that reduces the dice pool of the player.New Discipline called Corruption for Lasombra and Setites that is just Daimonion, Vicissitude is back for Tzimisce, Protean has been folded into Animalism, new Discipline called Tellurgy for Tzimisce and Ravnos.Half of every Discipline is locked behind clan traits, with each clan specialising in a specific Discipline and that Discipline being way worse for every other clan.Quickening is introduced as a snowball mechanic. For every 10 a player rolls, they gain a Quickening which they can spend on adding a die to a dice pool in the future.STs have a currency called Drama that they have to spend on any complication unrelated to the central challenges of the session.Lifepaths and what sort of sire you had are now important aspects of character generation that help determine ability distribution and what Disciplines you have.General feedback is that V6 feels like a combination of D&D 5e and PbtA which incentivises players to treat clans like classes and never deviate from their stereotypes, and makes it almost impossible for the players to fail at whatever they want to build their characters around.
>>98547452Vicissitude is it's own thing again. Dementation is still gone.
>>98547442>Hell, Nagah literally made stone tablets out of event and put it into their nests.Only the retarded Garou apologist nests.
>>98547219>i think it should be mentioned that the watcher caste was a last minute retcon they didn't exist before dav20What a grand and intoxicating innocence
>>98547455>Anarchs "win" in a Pyrrhic sense.Wasn't it less a Pyrrhic victory and more that they'll need to go back to that 1st edition stuff about actually working out what winning means for the Anarch movement and try to build something besides Camarilla 2.0?
>>98547449The Fianna literally have hundreds of elders sleeping beneath the Earth of Ireland and Britain, prime material for Gaia to use in making her own Werewolf Mummies.
>>98547461Time for "let's throw every idea imaginable at the wall to try and figure out how the Anarchs can be made into an interesting faction," Attempt #61.
i dont get why werecats can just...ignore gaia's balance if it is so important? some literally possess and take over people like demons/arcadia sidhe or literally granted 9 lives
Okay so how strong is a Rank 6 Garou really? Like, how are they compared to say, a Methuselah? I'm aware that a Rank 6 Garou is more or less the direct herald (or so I understood) of a certain Spirit or Incarna
>>98547485Bastet are one of the writer's pet fera.
Also MC's mandated cheat ability is to impose Legacy Meta physics on W5's realty and this ability will grow as he gathers more followers. This Premise will Totally hilarious or awesome there's no in-between.
>>98547505Most of Rank 6 Gifts are shit so as a matter of fact, not really worth the jump from 5 to 6.What it boils down to is this: Elders and methuselahs have access to all sorts of powers across numerous Disciplines that allow them to completely bypass the strengths of Rank 5 and 6 Garou and either enslave them, escape them, or send them into orbit with zero effort. Once a vampire can start putting more than five dots into Disciplines, werewolves stop being a problem no matter the Rank, provided that the vampire isn't built like a retard.
>>98547505Theoretically? A match for an average MethuselahBut most aren't. Unless you are talking about a compat focused Garou Legend who lives for combat like Golgol. In which case, he is a match for most Methuselahs. Dude is legitimately the strongest Garou, forget Zhyzhak.But like, there is only a single Golgol and he is too busy in Amazons.
>>98547505Honestly, not that powerful. Gifts are rather strange in that high-rank gifts are not that powerful for the effort you need to get themA Garou at rank 6 could solo a 7th gen. A pack of elders might be able to take out a 6th gen with the right gift and fetish spread.Anything stronger than that and the Garou are toast, no matter the rank. Presence is busted against creatures of emotion.
>>98547520>>98547522>>98547526So mechanically the average Rank 6 would get bent into a pretzel by even a 6th or 7th gen vampire, but fluffwise Rank 6 are equivalent or close to Methuselah?
>>98547535Yep. Werewolves suck so bad at scaling that it's honestly hilarious.
>>98547441from what i can tell they want every clan to have a signature discipline for clan merits, they couldn't decide on animalism or protean for gangrel so they folded it into one discipline.no idea why the fuck chimistry and coldunism got folded.
>>98547506The price is paid by also being wizard goonbait.
Do mages with Entropy sphere ping as Wyrm alligned to Garou ?
>>98547547IIRC the ones with Jhor problems do but not anyone with entropy.
>>98547547No, but mages have a mechanic called Resonance. Depending on what a mage does and the sort of Quintessence that they absorb, mages gain different types of Resonance.There's a particular type of Resonance called Jhor, which is basically Death Resonance, gained by dealing with magic and Quintessence focused on death and undeath. Mages with Jhor ping as Wyrm-tainted according to Sense Wyrm. This includes necromancers, mediums who speak with ghosts a lot, mages who absorb a lot of Quintessence gained from unpleasant sources, and Euthanatoi assassins.
>>98547535They had to buff unstoppable warrior in W20 because of how bad it was by removing the need to spend Rage to heal, rank 6 gifts can be that bad.
>>98547513>this ability will grow as he gathers more followersReplace "followers" with "harem babes, at least one from each tribe" and I'm in.
>>98547513>W20 Get on W5's factory goatseBold move
>>98547555Not mage related but what's the deal with taints? Does it have any effects on you outside of making you ping as corrupted? Does it have any impact on you physically or mentally?
>>98547513A story or a quest? Either way, color me intrigued
>>98547589Jhor (Wyrm taint) in particular makes you look like a corpse and gives you an obsession with murder and trying to bring down the Shroud (bad idea).Clarity (Weaver taint) turns you into a Drone, a servant of the Weaver, and there's no coming back after some time becoming obsessed with achieving some goal of yoursMadness (Wyld taint) turns you into a semi-marauder and if you're unlucky you can get caught in this unreality-loop until you're stuck
>>98547589Regarding Triatic taint in WtA, it has no impact on someone's mind or body. It is just a marker that clings to someone that makes them as being tainted by one of the Triat. The stronger the taint, the easier it is to detect, but the taint on its own has no actual impact, even if it can draw spirits who think that the taint is a sign that a character is going to be easier for them to possess or influence.A spirit of bloodshed, a guy who lives next to a polluted river, a low-Humanity vampire, a guy who works in an animal processing plant, a necromancer, a woman who has suffered a lifetime of domestic abuse, a serial killer who seems like a affable and upstanding guy, and a guy who drives a car designed by Pentex to emit tainted fumes all ping as Wyrm-tainted according to Sense Wyrm, just with varying difficulties of detection. It's up to the werewolf to figure out which of these tainted entities deserve to die and which are just unfortunate bystanders stained by their circumstances. The most retarded Garou kill all of them and let Gaia sort them out, which can often cause more harm than good.
>>98547593Oh I won't dare write any thing about the premise since my mediocre would do the premise a disservice. I'd like to this that premise as literary sword in the stone. Whoever is welling write a good story around would be granted ultimate fame for at least a few days, maybe even a few year if the story is really Fire.
>>98547611That's wrong. (Not your pic, your taint stuff) Taint has a direct impact but it depends on its potency.
>>98547630That seems to be describing its effect on the Garou sensing it, not the person effected?
>>98547630That's the impact that it has on the werewolves who are exposed to that taint and can sense it. The taint itself doesn't influence the behaviour of the tainted, though particular behaviour can lead to the accumulation of taint.
>>98547520>or send them into orbit with zero effortI know it's not what you meant, but this is really the best way to defeat an Antediluvian. As has been proven with video evidence.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i1YcJkYBAxQ
>>98547643It can easily be achieved with Movement of the Mind, desu, since there's no specified limit on its range or the velocity at which it can move whatever is being moved using it. Tremere, stay winning.
>>98547639>>98547642"Every type of taint can manifest on the physical and Umbral planes.""Werewolves aren't the only creatures that notice the effects of taint"Come on guys, read the text. I am not talking about casual taint here, like drinking Pentex bear or working in a office building or being a farmer.
>>98547464>Time for "let's throw every idea imaginable at the wall to try and figure out how the Anarchs can be made into an interesting faction," Attempt #61.This. People writing for VtM need to understand that the Anarchs fundamentally don't work as a faction. They're defined pretty much entirely by what they oppose, and have very few positive positions. Moreover, they're way too tied to late 20th century western counterculture movements which pretty universally aged like shit to feel like anything worth taking seriously. There's also the fact that "Anarch" is kind of a nothing term given to any breakaway faction (like whatever the fuck the Brujah got up to after the October Revolution), but this is increasingly redundant what with the existence of Independents as well as the ethnic meme sects (much as I don't care for them either). No matter the angle you take, they just don't quite work. Either it's a meaningless term that colors the perception of every separatist movement... or it's giving a bunch of C*lifornian LARPers the same prestige as 500 year old organizations. The Anarchs are an atavism from very early VtM that should've been left in the dust bin, or at the very least parochialized to allow for other interesting local sub-sects and breakaway factions.
>>98547646That is retarded>>98547643I'm reminded of the fact the Eldest statblock I made for my ExWoD game could fly in space like Cthulhu. The party never made it to him but he could have got around this. Still a great scene though.
>>98547654Your statement is that taint has a direct impact depending on its potency, and your citations to support that are that creatures other than Garou can notice the effects of taint, and that every type of taint can manifest on physical and Umbral planes alike?Connect the dots for me here, I'm not seeing it.
>>98547513Instructions unclear, running W5 game about 'correcting the record' on the Get.
>>98547661To rebuke >>98547611>Regarding Triatic taint in WtA, it has no impact on someone's mind or body. It is just a marker that clings to someone that makes them as being tainted by one of the Triat. The stronger the taint, the easier it is to detect, but the taint on its own has no actual impactTaint has an impact, from Wyld taint to Wyrm taint. The lowest amount of taint might not effect you that much but at higher levels even the environment and umbral landscape will be impacted and changed as a result. Glens, Hellholes, Blights, Calcifications etc.
>>98547676Let's have a look at the question of >>98547589>Does it have any effects on YOU outside of making YOU ping as corrupted? Does it have any impact on YOU physically or mentally?It seems to me like you're having a pedantic reaction to one particular line in the middle of a sentence without regard for the context.
>>98547535>So mechanically the average Rank 6 would get bent into a pretzel by even a 6th or 7th gen vampire,If they ONLY had rank 6 gifts? Hell yes.The issues is that gift balance is retarded and most "Rank 6" gifts are actually really weak. On the other side of that spectrum, Rank 5 gifts are often way too overpowered for their rank. The titular example from this thread is the Get of Fenris elder with 80 dice in every physical and a bunch of claw gifts that make all their melee attacks undodgable, unblockable, ignore soak, roll at difficulty 2, and hit with 2 damage per success.
>>98547687>>98547589The effect of Wyrmtaint on human beings is subtle. It amplifies your worst characteristics, but only to an extent consistent with your general character. The worst, most Wyrmtainted person on Earth is probably an awful person but they're so Wyrmtainted because they're awful not vice versa. A saint could suddenly becomes irradiated in taint isn't going to stop being a saint. What they will become is far more vulnerable to fomorification regardless of their moral character.
>>98547698Remind me how that goes again? You need a really specific setup for that
How do you guys play mage nowadays? I never played any of its versions before so I got the pdf for 20th anniversary ed. of Ascension to check it out; 600 pages later I'm thinking:1) The rules are very abstract so all players must also read and master everything or the game becomes too burdensome for the ST.2) Despite the rulebook being 600 pages long, somehow explanations on how thing work are too short. It seems like there's 570 pages of anecdotes and 20 pages where all rules, factions, subfactions, sphere explanations and working examples are crammed into.3) Some sections, notoriously the Hermetic Order pages, seem to be written as if the reader is already familiar with the topic of the section. Some sections are literally a bunch of anecdotes. I still don't get paradigms, despite them being apparently really important. The first time they come up is in a section about focus and it is offhandedly mentioned with "Oh yeah, focus must draw from your paradigm btw." or something to this effect. Depending on the paradigm It seems to be either a justification for magic and treated as a coat of paint for your effects or a major personality trait. How much are we supposed to lean into it when giving personality to our character?4) Way too many pop culture references. Pic related. Many important concepts are explained with "It's just like this character on that show. No further explanation".5) Related to point 3 but deserves its own mention because it targets a central point of the system: The book throws a bunch of theories on coincidental magic while explaining jack-shit about it. Cue in more anecdotes about cabs and whiskey bottles while going into very little detail about it (inside joke maybe?) Then on one page write mage20 assumes process-based determinism and on the next page write it assumes result-based determinism (RBD). By the way, doesn't HAB with RBD make everything coincidental?
>>98547723With a lot of house rules that basically run Awakening 2E's magic system in Ascension's lore.
>>98547709Ubermesch + strength of the ancestors for 80's in stats(or just "Bigger than you").The claw gift shit is literally just having multiple gifts with "claw" in the name.All of this is the get of fenris ahroun gift list.
>>9854772320th is THE WORST version of mage to start with. Go with revised for your first and move to 2e when you're experienced enough to handle wild shannigans.
>>98547723My biggest recommendation would be that;Have Session 0. Flesh out the characters, go over the generalities of what they can do and how they can do, teach/read stuff to the players if they aren't familiar with it. Create some basic rotes they would have in their character's position.But above all else, don't take the rules and written word as a bible. We are here to have fun, not debate endlessly.TLDR: Don't be so serious about it or I will cast "You are gay" rote on you.
>>98547755That Gift isn't even in 20th. Is it this? https://www.wyrmfoe.com/992/strength-of-the-ancestors/Because how is this supposed to get you high Attributes at all unless you say repeat castings stack instead of supersede on same stat which no reasonable ST would do?
>>98547723>1The rules are too abstract in the core and too inflexible in the HDYDT sourcebook. M20 only works if you play it fast and loose and if you only challenge the ST's rulings if you think they are wrong on a fundamental level. Too many Mage games end over the players and ST arguing over every little spell.>2M20 is infamously poorly written by an infamously pretentious writer. For details on the subjects that interest you, you will have to research previous editions.>3See 2, combined with the fact that the 20th Anniversary editions are supposed to be celebratory products for old-timers, not intended to introduce new players to the game. This can lead to the assumption that everyone who reads it is familiar with the basics of the game. As for paradigms, they're explored way too late in the book considering how fundamental they are to Mage. I'll go into detail on them in another post.>4See 2. A lot of M20's flaws boil down to Phil Brucato being a pretentious, obnoxious know-it-all with very strong opinions about the game that he is writing and the people who play it.>5See 2. Half of Brucato's rants are directed at players of previous editions of Mage who accuses as playing the game incorrectly and not handling magic right. The game ultimately works best when the game lays down how he's handling coincidental and vulgar magic and tells the book to get fucked.>tl;drRunning M20 "as written" is a good way to end off pissed off at your ST or players, pissed off at Phil Brucato and pissed off with Mage the Ascension as a game. M20 only functions if you use it as guidelines and ignore all of the shit that you consider retarded, and if the entire group has faith in their ST and their vision for MtA.
>>98547801Seconding all of this. Save yourself the heartache, pick up second edition if you want high fantasy and revised if you want low and walk on.
>>98547723Ignore the rules they are DUMB and complicated>Hey ST I wanna do this>How>By doing [This]>Ok roll Arete This is like 60% of the game. The other 40% is Avatar Stuff and Mage Politics.Paradigm often gets conflated with Practice because the guys who wrote M20 are pretentious as hell. Put very simply1: Paradigm: How You See The World2: Practice: How You Understand The World3: Spheres: How Well You Understand The World4: Arete: How Well You Understand Yourself 5: Effect: The World Changes5: Paradox: How The World Sees You (poorly)Early-game mages should rely on practices and foci to do any actual magic, but they are people first, not wizards first. A guy can do drugs without any magic involves but he also should need those drugs to implement magic until he understands more about his own magical potential. We're talking Arete 1-3 here. At rarer Arete's of 4+ practices start providing extra bonuses but can be dropped for no loss in power. >What is the difference between Paradigm and PracticeParadigm: There is one absolute God who created the universePractice: God composed the world with song, and through the divine voice I can manifest the power of God; through his words and teachings I can become one with the Word.>Coincidental magicIt's up to the ST, but if something can be construed as "plausible to the average WoDizen" then you're fine. Stargates? Hoverboards? Fireballs? Very impossible and magical in nature, vulglar magic. A gas pipe blowing up? Regular, normal, understandable.
>>98547352based
>>98547788>That Gift isn't even in 20th. Is it this?Anon, the werewolf 20th edition book tells you that it can't list every gift and that you should use previous edition books for the rest. WtA20 is the cliffs notes version of werewolf.
>>98547810
>>98547807Or keep on playing M20 with an ST who you trust and who goes with the flow. All editions require this, trying to go full RAW in any edition of Mage leads to a dysfunctional group arguing over every spell after a couple of sessions.
>>98547810The good thing about being a Yeren is that you can have sex with another Yeren without fear of producing a retarded and deformed baby.
>>98547812Sure but is the Gift I linked the Gift he's talking about? Because it won't do what he's saying. Charisma+Rituals extra Attribute dots at variable difficulty still only gets you like +7-8 dots in one attribute and has a clause for the ST to bitchslap you, specifically, if you try to game it. Its good but its not 80s in your stats good. You could get a little crazy if you stack on Might of Thor and some other stuff (I know I did it some of the Garou in my game) but it wouldn't get you to 80.
>>98547788>Because how is this supposed to get you high Attributes at all unless you say repeat castings stack instead of supersede on same stat which no reasonable ST would do?Anon, the difficulty is 10 - [Amcestors background] and the dicepool is charisma + rituals.The charisma boosting gifts, totems and backgrounds are to most numerous in the game. This is one of the few situations where pure breed and spirit heritage would stack. Ubermench lets you spend both rage And gnosis to increase your charisma for a scene.
>>98547839This is your reminder to bumrush Touch of the Muse I don't know how the hell that thing isn't a rank 5 gift
>>98547831>and has a clause for the ST to bitchslap you, specifically, if you try to game itAnon, if your storyteller rules that Fighting A Methusela is not an appropriate time for calling upon the full might of every garou going back to the first wolf, then your ST is a retard.>>98547849>Touch of the MuseBlack fury gift unfortunately. That would give the ST ground to kick you in the dick, since it's out of tribe.
>>98547839Getting the Wyld Touched background would be better than purebreed or spirit heritage, since it'll add full successes instead of just Dice. Having all 3 would be amazing though.
I wonder how many Get end up crippled after going Nova on strength of the ancesters/einharjar one too many times.
>>98547860>Having all 3 would be amazing though.I'm pretty sure the process of breeding that garou would qualify as a war crime.
>>98547705>The effect of Wyrmtaint on human beings is subtle. It amplifies your worst characteristics, but only to an extent consistent with your general characterSo weaver taint would make you more emotionless and orderly and wyld taint would make you more shizo?
>>98547860Backgrounds are a freebie point a dot and you get 15 of them, that's possible even if you spent the 5 base points on something else like Resources.
>>98547839>>98547849Hmm, let me math.Beyond Human (formerly Ubermensch) could get you up to +10 on Charisma assuming your ST doesn't enforce an attribute cap of 8 or 15, and up to +20 if your ST assumes multiple castings stack (since you can't spend rage and gnosis in one move). That's a dice pool of 25+Rituals. Persuasion would let you reduce difficulty by 1, Touch of the Muse by like 3-4 maybe. Pure Breed does nothing in this situation, it just adds a die to social interactions with other Garou which Gift activations are not. If you define 'social rolls' as 'any roll involving Charisma' then Spirit Heritage would apply but I wouldn't define it that way. So if we stack all of that>IF your ST doesn't assume a Trait maximum and>IF your ST allows you to stack castings on Strength of the Ancestors and>IF your ST allows you to use Pure Breed and Spirit Heritage to boost your activation rollYou'd roll Charisma base 5+20 Beyond Human +Rituals 5 +Pure Breed 5 + Spirit Heritage 5 for a total pool of 40 rolled at difficulty 5. So you'd end up with a Strength around 32 [9+23ish] which you could then double to 64 with Might of Thor. I'd imagine with more buffs you could get the pool high enough to get you up to 80 though personally as an ST I don't even think half this shit should be applicable (and frankly at my table I use trait maximums so you would have got hard cockblocked at Strength 15 anyway). Still if your ST allows it I suppose it could be done. I concede the point.
>>98547856I'd disagree with both those things. Fighting a Meth is a big boss fight, not the apocalypse; and you can definitely learn out of tribe Gifts. The Silver Fang elder in my game was a walking tour of the Garou nation. Convincing the spirits to teach you shit is a logistical problem.
>>98547890Anon, you fucked up your math. You need ancestors 1 minimum to use the gift and the difficulty is 10 - Ancestors. At minimum, your example would be difficulty 4, but would likely be closer to difgiculty 1-2 from ancestors 5 if the player went this hard to build their character for strength of the ancestors. That averages to 12 more successes in your pool of 40 dice the amount of successes. Wyld Touched 5 would add 5 more.
>>98547927As I said you could add more stuff to get an even dumber result. I mean if we dip into shit like cybernetics from book of the Weaver you could get another 5-10 dice in there on top of all of this. And I didn't even bother looking for a good Totem but I know there's some that give you more Charisma or Rituals dots there has to be.
>>98547902>Fighting a Meth is a big boss fight, not the apocalypse;Anon, the Ravnos Ante situation revealed that every vampire ante is canoniically an avatar of the eater of souls.Fighting Methusela and Antes is fighting the apocalypse directly.
>>98547939I'm not arguing thr original point, I'm just being autistic about math.
>>98547940You do you but I know two Methusaleh interactions in my immediate groups and neither of us treated it like that. In my game the Silver Fang Elder's pack got wiped out by a Nossie meth who got on the PENTEX board and it was a big part of his backstory, and in a friend's game Sobek was the final boss of the campaign (which ran at like Rank 2 with plans to go till like 4? Idk never asked, they never got to Sobek and would have had plot help). Either way I treat a pack of high-Rank Garou fighting a Methusaleh as very different than fighting an Antediluvian, not that they could fight the latter directly.
>>98547810I still blame WTA for making me a furry nearly 30 years ago...>would
>>98548015Fucking Metis, Crinos aren't supposed to have tits
>>98547723>I still don't get paradigms, despite them being apparently really important. The first time they come up is in a section about focus and it is offhandedly mentioned with "Oh yeah, focus must draw from your paradigm btw." or something to this effect. Depending on the paradigm It seems to be either a justification for magic and treated as a coat of paint for your effects or a major personality trait. How much are we supposed to lean into it when giving personality to our character?In M20, your character's Focus is a combination of your character's Paradigm, your character's Practices and your character's Instruments.>ParadigmHow does your character believe the universe works? This is important in determining what your character believes to be the source of magic in the universe, and what they believe magic to be.>PracticeHow does your character wield magic, or whatever they believe magic is? What methodology do they believe allows them to mess with the status quo of the universe, and defy reality as the Masses understand it?>InstrumentsWhat are the numerous techniques and tools of their Practice(s) that they use in order to perform it and to use magic, or whatever they believe magic is?>Depending on the paradigm It seems to be either a justification for magic and treated as a coat of paint for your effects or a major personality trait.It depends on your character. Some characters revolve around their Focus, while others just use their Focus to explain how they're able to use magic and care a lot more about things outside of magic.
>>98548015>This causes you to go insane with fearWeird
>>98547765Shit. I though anniversary ed. meant no major changes while amending contentious points of the previous books.>>98547801It's >2 all the way down huh.>>98547809Thanks for the clarification. After reading your post I realized that I understood coincidental magic the first time it was presented but as the book's explanation went on and on I understood less and less.Thanks fatties. It seems M:tAs appeals to a very specific type of player. I hope finding a group won't be hard.
>>98548026The fear or being drained of all your vril
>>98548025Here are a couple of example characters and their Foci, one who cares a lot about magic and how they wield it, and another who just uses it as a tool.>Bellamy is a Hermetic mage who combines Bring Back the Golden Age! and A Mechanistic Cosmos to create a new Paradigm. He believes that the universe as a machine that the Order of Hermes had a profound understanding of and had mastered, but the Technocracy went and ruined everything, so now he strives to bring back this lost golden age of magic and help mankind understand the hidden mechanisms of the universe. He uses the Practices of Alchemy and High Ritual Magic in order to compel the mechanistic cosmos to do his bidding, by concocting alchemical substances that defy conventional science and by performing elaborate rituals that warp reality. Bellamy's Instruments include Labs & Gear, Herbs & Plants and Brews & Concoctions which he mostly uses for Alchemy, Circles & Designs, Voices & Vocalisations and Wands & Staves mostly for High Ritual Magic, and Formulae & Math which is used for both. Bellamy's whole life revolves around improving his understanding of his magic, teaching it to others and trying to bring back the supposed golden age.>Boris is a Verbena mage who combines Everything is Chaos and Might is Right to create a new Paradigm. He believes that the universe is a chaotic, meaningless mess that only the strong are able to master and bend to their will. He uses the Practices of Maleficia and Martial Arts in order to strengthen his will and break that of others, by drawing clarity from suffering and turning his body into a living weapon. Boris's Instruments include Blood & Fluids, Bones & Remains and Offerings & Sacrifices for Maleficia, Bodywork, Meditation and Weapons for Martial Arts, and Ordeals & Exertions for both Practices. Boris doesn't care about teaching anyone about his beliefs, nor does he want to force them on the rest of the world in any shape or form. Magic is just a tool to him.
>>98548029>I though anniversary ed. meant no major changes while amending contentious points of the previous booksThat's what it was originally Supposed to mean, but 20th started as a kickstarter Before paradox bought the IP. Paradox started molesting 20th halfway through development. Mage20 and Wraith20 are hot dogshit.
>>98548029>Shit. I though anniversary ed. meant no major changes while amending contentious points of the previous books.It's mainly due to the fact that M20 was mostly left in the hands of Phil Brucato, who people foolishly considered the brains behind the original Mage and who wasn't given an editor to curtail him or make sense of his nonsense. He was given 700 pages to vomit up his personal beliefs about Mage and magic in general, without much oversight.There weren't too many significant mechanical and narrative changes, aside from ridiculous Sphere requirements for spells and the assumption that the Traditions and Technocracy are no longer at open war in order to enable combined groups straight out of the core book.
>What was the dumbest thing done by someone in your games or in the lore.One of my friends played a Gangrel whose motivation was "be the strongest, because might makes right." One session he challenges the oldest Gangrel in the city in her home turf in some attempt to become the alpha Gangrel or something. After getting his ass stomped, he ended up making a deal with a Ventrue to get a squad of elite ghoul mercenaries in full tactical gear for back up, but it was clear that they were only nominally under his command and it was a temporary gig. My Gangrel friend wanted to discuss his plans with the rest of the coterie and brought these outsider ghouls right into our communal haven. Two of our members (the combat specialists at that; becomes important in a bit) were away taking care of their own plans, so myself (playing Bleu, this was when the chronicle was 1E Requiem and she was a Setite-flavored Gorgon) and my other friend's Daeva (the vampire BDSM show character) were relaxing by the pool waiting for them to come back when our Gangrel walks in with these ghouls we don't recognize who are all armed to the teeth. Daeva friend is very upset about the ghouls now knowing were our haven is and gets into a heated argument with the Gangrel, and mentions that we might need to kill the ghouls. Of course, the ghouls aren't deaf, and now they're very upset. The argument spirals out of control and next thing I know, we are in combat against a squad of ghouls armed with automatic weapons, in our own haven, with two of our combat specialists away. Thankfully I had just picked up Amphivena 5 at the start of that session, but we were still all so badly messed up by the end of the fight that we had to put all of our plans on hold for that session.Pic only semi related because of Bleu.
>>98548037You guys can keep fearing, I am going right in.
>>98548206In a world full of predatory muscle mommies, should we really count Short as a flaw?
>>98548257As a manlet, YES.
>>98547364Say what you want about the Tzimisce, but their ability to train pets is unparalleled. Amazing what you can accomplish with a heavy application of torture, sheer terror, and headpats.
>>98547723>>98547723There's a .pdf floating around of the condensed M20's rules and I bookbound them at the print shop, for those of us who have had enough of Brucato's bullshit.https://docs.google.com/document/d/1KUaDRM2DiK185-L2u13Smdf1M3IN0M88gAOaH2GSXdg/edit?usp=drivesdk
>>98546958>sorta rightLol lmao. Coward. Bitch.
>>98548285What would happen to Bakeslave if I applied the butt scratch technique...?
>>98547241>TQ My group of Kindred players ignored every red flag to cross town and meet a very very suspicious Vampire in a building site filled with armed ghouls at 4:30AM in the morning. It ended the whole campaign unfortunately as they tried to start a fight after walking into the jaws of the trap, standing in the foundations of the building as said Ghouls opened fire and four trucks filled the whole thing with concrete.
>>98547271>spoilerLmao. RIP the poor ghoul who set it off. They were just trying to take a shit.
>>98547579>>98547613A part of me wants to write it, but then the other part remembers I'd have to research W5 for it, and I really don't wanna do that...
If you were to give a character from each splat a "cheat" what would it be and why?
>>98548416Just buy those 7 point merits, they're usually quite absurdMage with it's 16 point merit is having a laugh, however.
>>98548044Why would anyone want to play a Boris instead of a Bellamy?
>>98548206Same but with Life mages
I just want to be happy
>>98548334His ears and tail (if not actively concealed) shoot straight up momentarily before relaxing and his legs involuntarily straighten out as long as you keep scratching.
>>98548457Realistically, a decent chunk of mages would learn Life or at least get their friend with Life to make them beautiful.>>98548416Give an Imbued Hunter a Gamer system. Just for the funsies.The end result will be 100% what the Minister feared as power corrupts him.
>>98548516>Give an Imbued Hunter a Gamer systemWeirdly enough it fits, if you lean into the messengers being their own thing rather than angels.
>>98547655Aye. It should've been Cam, Sabbat, Autarks, and a localized California problem of concentrated Autarks doing gang wars for power. Maybe the TMHR as secret Antediluvian spies eliminating or manipulating key figures as the old "secret masters" plot but not "secretly controlling both factions".
>>98548581Honestly? Angels fits. Because in OG Gamer, God or Gaia gave powers like Gamer to people. Which means Imbued (and Werewolves and Fera) are perfect for it
>>98548435Fair, but the idea of a cheat ability is to sidestep the glass ceiling, so a vampire cheat would be like a variation of the ritual "From Marduk's Throat" or "Glimpse of Divinity" where they can diablerize lesser creatures like that one Trememe who ate a werewolf and gained a dot of Generation.
>>98548621While that's true, that's a lot closer Mage rather than Hunter but that's splitting hairs at that point.The neat aspect of "Gamer" is how you get upgrades through simple repetion and downtime in many cases. Hunter would benefit a lot from that.
>>98548622Hmmm...for a Werewolf...the ability to ignore chinimage entirely, I guess.Personal and Pack totems don't come with bans, spirits will always enter the fetish items you make, you could learn gifts without having to pay the price...even Silver could be overcome and dominated. Alternatively, a Garou who could spend Rage instead of Gnosis when asked to spend Gnosis
>>98548507Wrong place to look for happiness
Is Dark Thaumaturgy worth it? You get drawbacks for every path if you advance enough in it (without counting the witch’s mark and other unpleasantries that the demon places on you) and you get the baleful green fire in your aura, which unlike diablerie cannot be concealed with a merit.I’m asking because I have a concept in mind inspired from Himiko Toga from My Hero Academia. A serial killer kindred who is obsessed with people loving her. She would nurture them by feeding them her vitae and satisfying their vices, and once they have blossomed into loving her she would embrace them, and then diablerise them so they would always be inside her. Loving her forever. Though sometimes love turn to hate and slave servitude, and the blood bond can amplify those emotions instead of the loving devotion she seeks. And thus she might want to “part” with those souls attached to her. Infernal pacts might be a good way to do so.I was also considering if she could have the equivalent of the Ancestor background for werewolves. Having so many souls chained to her that she could channel them to do tasks.
>>98548642>Alternatively, a Garou who could spend Rage instead of Gnosis when asked to spend GnosisSounds like an interesting upgrade to the Star Gazer's gift.What I was thinking was something along the lines of being able to learn gifts without a mentor because of your deep conection to your past lives or a spark of the Wyld within you.
>>98548512Another weakness to take advantage of. Filed away for future use.
>>98547367Gurhal are still holding grudges from before prehistory that noone else not even their own people remember. Everyone who was involved died millennia ago. Their total lack of flexibility and insane pettiness have shown they were never fit for leadership of the Fera.
>>98548741Not really worth it but who cares about that. If you like the character, go for it.
Hey so I know it's technically off topic, but I feel like everyone who would actually know browses this thread anyways:How's Curseborne?
Weremoth forms? Weremoth forms! Similar stuff as with the Ananasi I guess
>thread questionhad a malkavian player role insanely well on an auspex roll to reveal basically all the secrets in an area, but the player got too drunk irl to continue playing so I had his character drop the truth nukes on the rest of the coterie and then spend the rest of the night in a public bathroom beating the shit out of a random mortal for being too white near him
>>98548916I've tried to get into it but presently there is a distinct lack of content. I'm not even sure what you're really meant to be doing as a PC or what kind of story you should be structuring as an ST. It feels very vague.No matter what you think about WoD/CofD it's brimming with antagonists and potential conflicts.
>>98548916Some Curseborne (aka splats) are way more punishing and weak than the others. Like Mages who need to destroy historical artifacts to cast spells
>>98548916It's basically WoD/CoD distilled to its very basics, for good and ill. All splats coexist in the same book and are meant to interact amongst each other, but a lot of what makes WoD/CoD unique has also been sanded down and replaced with little.Remember that line in some Vampire book about making sure the players are playing as vampires and not blood-powered superheroes? That's kind of what Curseborne feels like. Despite having 'curse' on its name, the Families don't really feel very cursed at all, a lot of them are totally cool with having been turned into spooky monsters and, of course, playing as a bad guy is not very encouraged nor supported. It can still blossom into something interesting if they release more content for it, but so far it's kind of bare bones and fangless
>>98548929Should probably call their warform-crinos equivalent after the moth somewhat? in cultist simulator? I would go with "Skintwister" but in some other language than english probablySkintwister is the final rank in the moth aligned cult in cultist simulator (Wildwood club)
>>98549032>"Skintwister" but in some other language than english probablyTranslated to Latin, it's Cutistorquen.If we stylize and shorten it to fit WtA terminology: Ctistor
>>98549157>CtistorThat doesnt sound bad at all
>>98548507Same, but unless I win the lottery, that's not happening and I'm killing myself at 50.
Anyone got a link to the Curseborne pdf?
>>98548899Yeah that’s what I figured. Well, it’s also written in the book that the weaknesses could be optional… or was it extra weaknesses alongside those that already exist that are optional? I just went through it today and I already forgot.I like the character though I don’t know which direction to take them except for their diablerie passion. Should I make her a Tzimisce to keep with the Toga inspiration of shapeshifting. I like the idea of Dark Thaumaturgy too so Tremere or any sorcerer clan could fit. I could also emphasize her craziness and desire to be loved. Malkavian would fit, and I would love to try a character with maliavian time. There’s also the fact that I want to charm people and manipulate them. Especially blood binding them. Tzimisce are ill equipped for that. Caitiff is an option… could have the setite addictive vitae too. Heard there was a merit that makes your blood stronger, allowing you to blood bind with only two drinks instead of three. But I only ever saw that once online, so I’m wondering if it was an online forum exclusive merit.
>>98548916I only read the old preview so I have no idea if they managed to make their splats more interesting lore wise.As far I know they had some neat dice tricks here and there but besides that... No fucking idea.
>>98549373Check the CofD mega, there should be a backer preview there, also check the share thread.
>>98548819>>98548741What would be a cheat ability in mage?
>>98549469Thank you.
These guys have the same problem as modern Marvel comics where when there’s an alternate universe that people like, they try to Frankenstein elements of it to the mainline “Universe” without realizing what made it work
Have you given your Sidhe characters noble steeds befitting their station?
>>98549408>Heard there was a merit that makes your blood stronger, allowing you to blood bind with only two drinks instead of three. But I only ever saw that once online, so I’m wondering if it was an online forum exclusive merit.Here, from Dirty Secrets of Black Hand
What do you prefer from equivalent game lines?>Vampire: Masquerade, maybe because I don’t know enough about Requiem.>Werewolf: Tie. Garou are cool, Uratha are cool, I can’t decide because they both work for different reasons >Changeling: Lost, mainly because the Dreaming never clicked with me>Mage: Ascension because I never played Awakening.>Hunter: I don’t know enough about either, but I’m leaning Vigil based on vibes>Demon: Descent because Fallen doesn’t vibe with me. I think Christian demons are boring>Wraith/Geist: Wraith but because I didn’t play Geist
>>98549514Just a heads up, that's an early preview and odds it is missing a lot of stuff.
>>98548199Did that Gangrel ever get a chance to become the strongest or at the very least lay with the strongest? I doubt that was the case how that session ended but you neer know.
>>98547520>provided that the vampire isn't built like a retard.Doesn't that exclude every vampire with a canonical character sheet?
>>98549567Why is this worth five points? Is it that you can blood bond someone who thinks it only takes three sips? I feel like these five points would be better spent on acute senses.
And oft-overlooked detail I like, from Blood & Smoke:>A vampire need not press the prospective ghoul’s lips to his wrist. There are so many other ways to skin that cat.>The Serpent bites his lip, and you barely notice the copper in the kiss.>The Haunt spits bloody phlegm in your eye, inexplicably, as you pass on the midnight road. Now you sit in your apartment feeling more afraid than you think you ought to, wondering if you should go get tested for some disease.>You reach for your expensive coffee, but it tastes weird. A Shadow smiles in front of your face, but you cannot see her.>You drank from a chalice when a Lord commanded you to. And now you…no…you don’t quite remember what happened.>The Savage cuts you and then herself, pressing the open wounds together. Something wild surges between.
>>98548516I don't know why you posted that image when anon mentioned "Life mages" because that's actually a drawing of an Ecstatic, you know? You can see the Tradition symbol on her belt buckle.
>>98547810This post is misleading because Yeren only have two forms; Homid and Crinos. They have no Glabro form. Or "Ape" form, for that matter.
>Vampire with a fear of the dark>not a Malkavian>a Lasombra
>>98550019And then you have VtM in the 90s, with a Giovanni making his niece/half-sister give him a blowjob to ghoul her during a debauched mockery of Mass. There's always been creative ways to Ghoul someone if you aren't a midwit.
>>98550240Do you expect to find a Mage called Life Mage or a group of mages called Life Mages or something in WoD?I used that image because Tradition Mages can be hot as fuck. The fact that she is Ecstatic is a bonus since their Life magic focuses on the sensations (and sex).
>>98550264>Giovanni making his niece/half-sister give him a blowjob to ghoul her during a debauched mockery of Mass. "Amateur." -t. Baali
>>98550249The source of that character is basically a series where Pentex does one-off shenanigans on First Team members."A Beast Cries In The Wilderness", or Kouya ni Kemono Doukokusu
>>98550270I mean, the "Life mages" of Ascension are the V*rbena. But now I realize nobody should ever indulge the V*rbena, those backward savages. Even a Dreamspeaker is preferable to them.
>>98550252Given what they have to deal with before the embrace... I don't blame them for getting flashbacks everywhere they could see their sire springing up from and molest them with inky tendrils of tenebrae.
>>98550284That bar is so low it's at the center of the earth fighting Nazis.
>>98550279>The Baali canonically have bussy within their Clan
>>98550295They a break from getting their guts drilled by demons and the Bruhja are useful pawns.They're also huge fags and can't help but bounce on the nearest pole to fill the void left by saulot and company.
>>98550291Np, that's the etherites. They take the bar with them because no other tradition is interested in lifting the damn thing instead of sitting on it.
>>98550284>But now I realize nobody should ever indulge the V*rbena, those backward savages.Verbena had so much potential too. They a group of female mages obsessed with cultivating magical bloodlines and turning their own bodies into arsenals of relics. They could have been a fusion of Dune Bene Gesserits and Xianxia Body Cultivators, but whitewolf decided to just make feminist wiccans a tradition and pretend wiccans were around when the church was burning witches.
>>98547589For the most part, I don't bother doing anything mechanically with taint. If I was ever in a position to actually roll for a Bane using the Possession Charm, I'd ballpark a number by which a victim's taint reduces the difficulty of the roll
>>98549932He never became "the strongest" but he did get a nice moment to shine in a later session. The Ventrue that he got the ghouls on loan from ended up getting into a feud with another major player in city politics that our group was already enemies of. The Gangrel and our combat specialist who had just acquired a fancy magical knife fought in a death match against the top enforcers of the enemy vampire's organization. After a brutal back and forth, our guys managed to kill both their targets, which allowed us and the Ventrue we were working with to gobble up our mutual enemy's territory.Of course later when we switched to 2E Requiem, our Gangrel then proceeded to farm beats by turning a failed roll into a botch at every opportunity. It culminated in an angry mob hunting for this known monster through our coterie's territory (Hunted condition or whatever it was called; our ST bought the card accessory). I managed to take control of the mob and lead it on the hunt for the monster, where we "cornered" the Gangrel at the Riverside and I "bravely charged the beast and plunged a stake into it heart while tackling it into the river." The mob bought the act, the condition was resolved, everyone was happy! Hooray!And then, the Gamgrel PROMPTLY took a botch on his very next failure, which was a feeding roll. So guess what? Hunted condition returns. That session soured me on Requiem 2E, and I've never given it a second look because it felt like I was being punished for actually trying to succeed while my friend playing the Gangrel got rewarded for constantly detailing the session by forcing us to clean up his character's messes (which I admit is unfair).
>>98550318Depends on faction. The Nergali like getting bussy broken, but are delusional idiots that think they're still in charge after they sell their soul to a demon and their ass to the nearest bvll.The Swarm are so buckbroken they don't even pretend they want anything other than to be mindless slaves.The Molochim are the odd one out, because they didn't take up infernalism to sell their souls or be fags. They just want the demon lords to stay asleep and are fine with feeding them serial killers to keep them that way. Daimonion is optimized for screwing over demons at every level except the 9th dot, so it seems like Moloch was the inceptor that actually invented it.
>>98549476Spending Paradox in place of Quint. Much like "substitute Rage for Gnosis" like >>98548642 anon suggested.Paradox immunity was my first guess, but that's a marauder thing, and mages should still have the ability to get hoisted by their own petard with it.Sure you can use Paradox, but if you accrue too much, it'll fuck you up before you can spend it.
>>98550435Wasn't that some nephandi ability? But yeah that sounds appropriate.
So let's just say W6 was revealed and it amounted to white wolf Retconing W5 to always have been a continuation of Legacy and working back word from there as a ill conceived compromise between W5 and W20 fans. How big of a shitstorm would that cause?
>>98550521I don’t even think that’s a good idea
>>98550529Yes as I said ill conceived. Question is How bad the backlash will be.
>>98548819>Sounds like an interesting upgrade to the Star Gazer's gift.You mean Chaos Mechanism(spend gnosis and rage in the same turn, without restrictions)? That's a glasswalker gift.
>>98548416Since the big 3 already got covered let's take a look at the others>WraithJust take any of the Shadow archetypes that isn't a huge asshole and things should be manageable. Either that or steal from KotE and get the 2 become 1 power where you become a whole person once again.>HunterThe monsters you kill give you an point of conviction and XP.>MummyYour character has access to a potion or artifact that sends him into a coma so profounds it allows you to visit the underworld and quickly recover your Sekem.>DemonYou possessed a competent therapist and have the tools to let go of your Angst. Given enough time you may calm even the earthbound demons into something resembling who they were before the fall.>GypsyI have no fucking idea.
>>98550555No, the one that allowed you to use rage to do some of the same stuff willpower did or at least use it in more peaceful applications.
>>98548416To be quite frank, most splat already have a number of obscure "Cheat Ability" powers.Mummies can rewrite how any power functions with nomenclature, which includes using Nomenclature to make all hekau stronger.Changelings with Naming can turn things into other things, even absract concepts. A changeling with Allies 5 can turn it into Resources 5 or a 5 point Merit(Merits are treated a backgrounds after character creation, according to the rules for buying merits with xp).Vampires have Mardukes Throat, Golconda, Anarch ritual of Ascention, etc.Fomori get Brain Eater(effectively infinite xp, which fomori, an ONLY fomori, can buy fomori powers with according to Possessed + Freaks Legion).Wraiths have the Way of Soul power that lets them turn Catharsis into a Superform without drawbacks(can use thorns with pathos and now angst from arcanoi extend your catharsis. Keep it going forever and spend your shadow xp on thorns you can benefit from.)Demons have the Mastery Background.Hell, Everyone can use infernalism. Just don't be retarded about it.
>>98550608>Vampires have Mardukes Throat, Golconda, Anarch ritual of Ascention, etc.Marduk's Throat might let you go up the ladder without being a diablerist but that's still both dangerous and requires you to either find a low gen who doesn't mind sponsoring your rise or keeping one chained up in the basement somehow while keeping it very well fed.
>>98550521>ill conceived compromise between W5 and W20 fansLupus and metis are back, but metis get put on some kind of weird pedestal instead of stigmatized.Crinos is still the killing form instead of the war form, but now there are Gifts that exist as a kind of feat tax to lessen the penalties.Glass Walkers get Roach back as their tribal totem. The metaplot explanation is it was actually Roach's brother Silverfish or something who got Wyrm'd.There's a bestiary of over twenty fomori STs can throw at players. Each stat block is just health, willpower, a difficulty, and a bunch of 1/scene powers.
>>98550283I really wish she had only one pair of tits and a normal tiger tail...
Hey guys, haven't been around since the new edition news, have you playtested it? Is it working? Is it fun? Is it better?
>>98550696>Lupus and metis are back, but metis get put on some kind of weird pedestal instead of stigmatized.That's excitably how they works in my Deltarune AU head canon. Granted they're more the result of spirt patron and Garou X Garou couplings usually produce "normal" crinos cubs.
>>98550757Long story short, a lot of the wording make this version of vampire sound like a D&Do clone with a lot of abilities and merits feeling like feats and the backgrounds being basically the same thing.The urban Gangrel have become the default breed so they are going to be bullshit.The new take on humanity is apparently a poorly transplanted mechanic from Werewolf the Forsaken.Very little of worth has been seen and most of will be used elsewhere.
>>98550811>Deltarune AUHow does that work exactly
>>98550892Well for one thing they're not called metis but something like spirit marked since they're "deformities" are uselessly just spirit altering them thus are more fantasy inspired and tend to pass along families, An example would be the Dreemers who are garou but they fur tend white and have got features. Before you ask no the Holadays are not garou. They're weredeers with Aspices based on the Seasons, with Carol as Winter, Rudy as Summer, Noel as spring and Dess would have been autumn.Something close to canon metis could happen due to a interbreed pairing (Humanoid X Lupus) while normal matching breed (Humanoid X Humanoid & Lupus X Lupus ) pairing result in a "normal" Crinos pups whose borne in a torpor so they wont harm they mother on the way out (though in recent times inter garou pairing results in infertility ). Meaning that the Relevant passages in the Lantry is altered from No sex with another garou Ever to Don't do Bestiality.
>>98550892You take most of the same pieces and downscale their story, then you a few few new characters and build a mystery with them and let the players speculate on how the old characters would handle the situation after the changes.
>>98550944What is Kris then
>>98551004A human with issues about being the only human around and autonomy.
We split this weekend into two sessions. Tomorrow I send Hina and Sephina to Argentina to look for Hitler bones, but today we began trying to save Hana from the Technocracy. Daiya's player retired her and made a new character. This time he is literally just Jack Garland. +20 strength if someone is foolish enough to admit they are Chaos.Bro nearly killed Sanae, a fucking methusela. She was already wounded but Runie (Cataphract currently pretending to be a magical girl as part of a scheme) got Mari (Sanae's childe) to back her up in claiming the unconscious Sanae was, in fact, Chaos. So this guy rips her leg off and sends her flying, only for Mari to have a change of heart and spirit away a nearly dead Sanae to hide out and recover.Meanwhile, Andrea and Seia (Jidai mage) encountered and pointed at each other like "Holy shit you're alive? The Axis is back baby!"Jack, Hibiki, Runie, and Hilady (another of Adelweiss' maids) then got surrounded by roughly 80 Technocracy goons (Investigating the 500kg explosion that Runie caused). They order everyone onto the ground and Jack Garland's live reaction is to keep aura farming and say "Are those green tips?" This somehow terrifies them so much that Andrea uses it as cover to send 1/4th of the goons into cardiac arrest. One guy finally says "M-Maybe?" while struggling not to shit his pants, which hears him about 20 rounds of 7.62NATO center mass. Then Runie bombs them and leaves.Finally, we have a slight tremor hit. Adelweiss, still in Leipzig, gets a MUCH bigger tremor and sees a column of white-hot light coming down on London over the horizon. More on that after tomorrow, but let's just say the Technocrats are getting angry about Antediluvians again.
>>98551004A kinflolk Dreemers adopted and they're really insecure about that fact.
>>98550369The campaign sounds kinda cool. Sorry you got taken out of the game due to the failures of other PCs, but really that's a hard thing to balance. On one hand I think that is the game play loop that is trying to be encouraged by Chronicles at times, but execution is important for it not to be seen as bad. That said, easier to say these things when you're not in the moment.
Ever seen s Malkavian Prince? What about a Malkavian Bishop?
>>98551242I remember a Malk prince from... Fuck, I forgot.
>>98550696You know, you'd think with getting rid of Kinfolk and all and with Garou no longer working with bloodlines and pure breed yada yada it would have been an excellent opportunity to revise the metis. It would have been quite rare, but the possibility of a Garou who was born from Garou who in turn were born from Garou is possible in W5.
>>98551342do you think if they appealed even more to furries that it'd be more popular
>>98551368>if they appealed even more to furriesOh, god, please, no
>>98550252>Afraid of the Dark>Cannot survive in sunlightSounds utterly miserable.
>>98551242There are some here:https://whitewolf.fandom.com/wiki/List_of_Princes_(VTM)
>>98551342They really need to stop with this shit
>>98547603>Jhor>Clarity>MadnessOne of these is not like the others.Could the game-makers not be bothered to think up equally unorthodox names for wyld and weaver taint?
Huh, I guess Blood Magic's writer toyed with the idea of vamps in Golconda being able to ignore the sun lethargy effect. Or at least they're immune to the artificial version.
>>98548199>I want to be the strongestCool and respectable.>I'm going to use the strength of others to prove that I am the strongestRetarded and cringeworthy.The truly powerful are perfectly sovereign.They'd have no need to outsource capabilities from others.
>>98549476Paradox immediately converts to potency on effect.
>>98550703Funny. That’s what she also wished for. It is in fact, why Monkey and Rat are so hated by the others. They can pass as human, but the other Soldiers cannot
Will the V5 mob on Discord bully the devs into making V6 even more like V5 or D&D 5.5 than it already is as a playtest?
>>98551704Is the discord butthurt really that bad?
>>98551704"It's too much like D&D" is one of the most common complaints there. They all want it to be just a minor update to V5. The most common demand are:>bring back hunger dice>bring back the second inquisition>bring back the hecata>bring back the beckoning>bring back touchstones>bring back chronicle tents and stains>get rid of drama and quickening and every other mechanic that is a change from v5The V5 mob is just screaming for Paradox to kill V6 in the cradle and make V5 last forever.>>98551760Yes.
>>98551767Considering how AIDS V6 sounds, I'm kinda supporting the V5 crowd here.
>>98551771A stagnant V5 that lasts forever is just as garbage as the changes that they're fighting against, if not more, so fuck that.
>>98551785The people who say this are still playing older editions, so - if anything don't they support MORE stagnancy? And therefore game being good is good and game being bad is bad and everything else is all so much mental justification for that?
>>98551767that's not unusual when bad changes are made. the most common response is always "reverse it"
>>98551767kekI'm almost considering going back to that shithole just to laugh at those idiots.Almost.
>>98551792I would like if they went back to mid-2010s status quo, at that point the MMO was bust, Paradox wasn't forcing their bullshit yet, there were no HtP kiddies, it was pure.
>>98551704Do you think they will eventually ban all V5 discussion like they tried to do with legacy WoD. Probably not because they wrote V5, but it would be incredibly funny for them fuck up like that again.
>>98551792"I play an older edition" doesn't equal "I want VtM to be that edition forever." I don't want VtM to be V20 forever, I want new editions of VtM and I want them to be good, I don't want more of V5 and I don't want whatever V6 currently is, though killing off the SI, the Beckoning and hunger dice are steps in the right direction.>>98551810There's just some delicious irony involved when the people who said "suck it up grog, VtM isn't for you anymore" are now crying over V5 being changed.
>>98551841The question is: "When is eventually?", but I think they will give the V5 crowd their own ghetto, accelerated by one "But in V5 we used to do it like this!" too many.
>>98551841"they wrote v5" is technically wrongnone of the writing team of v5 is actually working at white wolf and haven't been for a while. murmar is the only guy who is left but he is working at paradox it's actually insane how many writing teams v5 had chewed through they had 5 near complete team overhauls in 8 yearsthat's why early and late v5 are nearly different settings (si is a global alliance and thread to the entire kindred race, beckoning is leading elders to the middle east, pyramid is gone, tech is banned, kindred are way more limited in how they interact with people outside of their city a lot of the hits aginst the establishment are hinted to be inside jobs etc vs si might just be a trend that is already staring to blow over, the gehenna war is global, the hits against the establishment have always been real, there are global black markets and vampire and thinblood internet groups and so forth) nobody has a real "vision" for v5. They are just paid to stack more shit on the shit the previous hacks wrote and the v5 paypig eats it up
>>98551955>nobody has a real "vision" for v5Hear hear!
>>98551859Hunger Dice were fun.The Hunger/Rouse system wasn't, blood tank all the way, but more hungry = violent botches is thematically cohesive.I have quite literally never understood the problems people have with it. Even when it's explained. Maybe I'm just too autistic.
>>98552024or v6
>>98552026>>98552026>The Hunger/Rouse system wasn't, blood tank all the wayWhen I said hunger dice, I meant all of that as well, and I don't think you can have hunger dice without the rest of the wretched system.
Ananasistoryfag here.I've got Pentex elite kill teams (like, squads of five to seven with fomori, vampires, and each squad having a BSD), four packs (so around 19 Garou), Ananasi (An assassin LARPing as a vampire, the MC and the other Ananasi Elder directly helping them), the Mage (who gets a visit from the spiders), and the local Sabbat going nuts.Is this too much? Like, Pentex is cleaning house and simultaneously trying to get rid of all the Garou in and near Olympia while also doing terror strikes against their corporate competitors, spreading Wyrmshit to the populace, fuck with the vampires (both Camarilla and Sabbat) and also trying to kidnap the random Mage.It's a clusterfuck. Opinions? Ideas? The Technocracy is like one dice roll away from directly intervening.
>>98552061Sure you can. Off the top of my head:Take your v20 blood tank system. If you've got less than half your max, you get messy crits - your '10' is going to solve the problem with violence or asserting dominance.If you're under a quarter, you get bestial failures too. Your botches now involve you doing things violently, unavoidably. If you're trying to do violence anyways, your bestial botches are also messy crits.The above example is just a 'gun to my head' type suggestion, I'm sure people who know game design could take a brainstorming and testing afternoon to find something that works better.
>>98551086>Tomorrow I send Hina and Sephina to Argentina to look for Hitler bonesI would recommend the Hollow Earth. I bet the Nazis took his bones to there since they are pretty entranched in there.>sees a column of white-hot light coming down on London over the horizon. More on that after tomorrow, but let's just say the Technocrats are getting angry about Antediluvians again.Time to nuke or do worse things to another city eh?
>>98552072>Is this too much? Like, Pentex is cleaning house and simultaneously trying to get rid of all the Garou in and near Olympia while also doing terror strikes against their corporate competitors, spreading Wyrmshit to the populace, fuck with the vampires (both Camarilla and Sabbat) and also trying to kidnap the random Mage.Sounds like your average old school "X By Night" or "Rage Across X" chronicle. There is a reason classic World of Darkness chronicle books were full of mixed splat adventures with multiple sides.
>>98551859> There's just some delicious irony involvedyes, the crash-outs have been delectable
Systems that V5 added>Hunger Dice>Blood Resonance>Predator Type>Lore Sheets>Touchstones>Amalgam Disciplines>Thin-Blood Alchemy>MemoriamAnything else? Is anything staying in V6?
>>98552344Some of those weren't even invented by V5.>Lore SheetsGlorified style merits from CofD.>TouchstonesAlso from CofD, only done way worse this time.>Amalgam DisciplinesCombo disciplines have existed since VtM.
We should start calling V5 shit (and ONLY V5 shit) "Legacy" just to anger the retards.
>>98552353>Glorified style merits from CofD.not sure i would even call them glorified because most lore sheets are just shadow cult initiation with custom shadow cults mechanically
>>98552344isn't memoriam just flashbacks? those been in the books as a "storytelling technique" since forever
I Honstly think that V6 humanity is actually a suitable replacement for W5 Harano and Hauglosk bars
>>98552072It is a massive clusterfuck and I'm looking forward to it, especially vampire jewery.
>>98552415Shit on a plate would be a suitable replacement for Harano and Hauglosk. It's the worst morality system I've ever seen in a ttrpg. Considering V6 humanity is just WtF harmony, they had a solution there all along.I would like them to try a 3 way triangle like system. With each corner representing being overly influenced by one side of the triat. With a separate shared track for the entire group called doom (stolen from Soulbound). Which makes things worse and worse if they let it fill.
>>98551172Despite my frustration with some aspects of the chronicle, overall I enjoyed it very much - to the point I was initially excited when we gave it a second go while trying out V5 (I get to be a full blown Setite with Bleu? Yay!). That excitement didn't last once we started playing, admittedly. Aside from one particular scene, I didn't have any fun in the V5 version of the chronicle. That may have had more to do with the change in our playgroup than the system itself, but I'm not sure.I think I still like they idea, conceptually, of the Beat system. I just happened to experience it in the most frustrating way possible. There are even some things in V5 that I appreciate, even if overall I'm not a fan.>>98551475That's kinda the recurring theme with his characters. Solid theme/concept, poor execution. He's always enthusiastic about the game, but always plays his characters as "hotheaded, cocky shounen protagonist" or "obvious backstabber.">>98552397Kinda. Memoriam are flashbacks you have that then give a mechanical bonus to your present situation.
>>98552528>flashbacks with mechanical benefitsSo they stole that from Blades in the Dark as well? Was it always the end goal to have it be a discount of those modern narrative systems?
>>98552072Keep cooking king, this sounds like it's going to be glorious
Reminder that Hedgefag is a traitor. He plays Beast and Deviant.
>>98552397Not really the memoriam is supposed to be a rip of the Assassin's Creed Animus so you can tie dark age scenario to the modern ones more easily.>>98552368They follow the skeleton of a mystery cult but are more willing to modify stuff to fit with WoD. The biggest example being the Blood of Ravnos being something you can get for 5 dots.
>>98552762What's wrong with Deviant?
>>98552072>>98552166>>98552450>>98552585Aight, latest chapter is out and uploaded to Spacebattles.Feel free to tell me what you think of the chapter (or story).
>>98553662Elaborate.
>>98553675Damn pentex isn't fucking around. Now THIS is how you hunt werewolves, good job on demonstrating the preparations properly ficanon, that HTP episode was really retarded about it
I'm running a oneshot for 3 first-timers, how's this sound? The PCs get kidnapped and blackbagged, and when the bag comes off they are staring down into a shallow grave before being shovelheaded and sent as cannon fodder to attack a Camarilla incursion outpost by the pack priest, barely told about what they are or who's the target besides "go use your fucking vampire superpowers". The Camarilla is incursioning into Mexico City to find information about and compete for the grave of a Methuselah. Their outpost has a few mortals, a couple ghouls and 2-3 kindred. Depending on how this goes and what the players prefer they could either get recruited into the Cam by a Lieutenant of the incursion who offers them a way out by helping defend the Outpost, or make the pack priest proud and do what he asks after which they can get inducted into the Sabbat proper.I don't want to give them a DMPC so the Sabbat pack will threaten to put their heads on pikes for tomorrow's journal.After this I would hope this becomes a longer game, but Im still undecided if I eventually want to use the temple from Diablerie: Mexico, or the Prime Chantry of Goratrix in the Universidad del Tercer Círculo de La Serpiente Dorada where Shaitan/Huitzilopochtli is, as I have read neither D:M or MCbN. I know such a game might miss the more intricate power games and default Camarilla setting + Masquerade rules of VtM that might give the wrong impression to first-timers, but I really don't feel like running another round of Blood Nativity or Alien Hunger . And eventually I want to include Games of Instinct and EWW.
>>98554039That entire episode was about hyping Stig up and nothing else
>>98554039HtP Can't even get the basics done and you expect them to be faithful? In a few episodes this thing won't even be about hunters and the whole senpai will turn out to be some flavour of supernatural.
>>98554106What did they get wrong?
>>98554094Some say
>>98554085>The PCs get kidnapped and blackbagged, and when the bag comes off they are staring down into a shallow grave before being shovelheaded and sent as cannon fodder to attack a Camarilla incursion outpost by the pack priest, barely told about what they are or who's the target besides "go use your fucking vampire superpowers".Classic shovelhead tactics.>The Camarilla is incursioning into Mexico City to find information about and compete for the grave of a Methuselah. Their outpost has a few mortals, a couple ghouls and 2-3 kindred. Depending on how this goes...Sounds good. Though just in case, make sure that you are prepared in case they decide to say "fuck both of you, we are doing our own thing" Players can be like that sometimes and hey, independent chronicles are fun too.>After this I would hope this becomes a longer game...Honestly, I argue there is no "right" first impression. (At least in terms of content. There are definitely differences in actual quality)Some players love the action, some live for the RP session where the only thing that progressed is the drama levels and some just want to fuck around in World of Darkness.
Anyone here have experience with Exalted Vs WoD? I have a buddy getting ready to run a game of it. Im not new to either, but Im curious what's its like when the two settings collide. The "book" seems great so far, though.
>>98554504It is not bad but it is kinda...just there?The whole thing is a nice thought experiment but you would be honestly do better if you just straight up ported 2nd Edition Exalted into WoD instead of bothering with it. Holden just writes what he writes best, a decent amount boggled down with his weird thought processes and making mistakes, even if he is probably not bad as Achilli even if he can be as rambling as Satyros. (Proving that he really is the one who created Scale-Shedding Solution, one of the most useless charms in existence)Overall, meh.
>>98554504I enjoy it but I think it works best when the gm knows the metaplot of world of darkness as a whole to figure out where to slot the exalts. Lunars is a good example of what I mean when they show up to a werewolf chronicles where they're essentially shifters plus, but without friction involved they're just better werewolves without the drawback of rage. Solars are the best but without an exploration on where a solar might be needed or cause such a distribution it's just watch them explode the world. Abyssals can just be vampire/wraith/risen plus easily. Infernals while not as terrifying as earthbounds might as well be comparable to one. Sidereals is probably the best for trying to make it all fit together, etc.Essentially, you can feel like a badass depending on what Exalt type you play; however, if the world of darkness does not try to versus you or the gm doesn't respond to the arrival of demigods in the world in way that seems cool then it can be eh. At the same time if you want to play an exalted that keeps his head down by pretending to be a ghoul of cain I suppose it work.
>>98554039To be fair the lepodites are used to hunting vampires not garous and it's possible they bullets silver isn't pure enough (it should least above 90% according to W20 so rifle friendly alloys is out of the question) to hurt a garou and they pentex backed supplyers may have deliberately screw with the ammo. Possiblly as payback for Doors worm freak comment.
>>98554630Luckily my buddy has been running WoD games since the 90s, and most of our group are WoD vets. Mostly we're planning to limit our scope to the core 3 (with some of Wraith, but it's not going to be a major focus). The feel of the game is going to be a kind of "dudes of legend", so we expect to roll through most things, but its mostly about fucking around and having fun. Are there anything that players should pay attention to that might cause some unexpected friction or anything?
One of my friends got me a physical copy of the DtF core rules to complement my digital copies I totally got legaly, so now I feel obligated to put in the effort to learn the system and mechanics instead of just absorbing the lore of oWoD and just getting into lore discussions. Issue is, I've got no idea what a chronicle would look like, and I've only played a two sessions of V5 (run by that same friend, but there was issues w/ the group.)How do I into the ST system and what would be your recomended way ot approaching building a chronicle, or should I just use the pre-built and run from there for the first time to get my Feet of Clay on, before doing my own thing? I know that DtF is heavly dependent on Revised Lore needing the 6th great Malestrom to crack open the abyss, but what about just running it seperate from the other game lines? At most, it does give minor stat blocks for Vampires, Mages and Woofs, but very truncated.Should I even start w/ DtF as a first time ST, or and I doomed to be vesseless and stuck in the abyss?
>>98554094You hype your antagonist up a lot more when you have them defeat a genuinely competent foe, rather than a bunch of inept stormtrooper knockoffs. >>98554652>To be fair the lepodites are used to hunting vampires not garousAbout that...
>>98547485While the fact of being a mary sue breed is true. You have to remember that the Bastet are scam artists, working with other Supernatural creatures for power such as the Bubasti who are all part-ghoul. They ignore it probably because they learned a version from them and then reversed engineered it in a gift or rite format.For the rite of nine lives, you have to remember that Seline/Luna is insane, and that is my cop-out instead of giving a real answer.
>>98554630>Infernals while not as terrifying as earthboundsDon't let any exaulted fans hear you say that. The community is infected with the kind of power-wankery that even tremereanon can't hope to match.There are legitemately some exaulted fans who think Caine would be an essence 3 Abyssal.
>>98554731>For the rite of nine lives, you have to remember that Seline/Luna is insane, and that is my cop-out instead of giving a real answer.On that note does her one on one rite only cockblock the werewolf out of curbstomp wins in their favour (no vamps in torpor, they'll show up awake and well fed instead) or is the user of the gift just fucked if they misjudge what their opponent can do in a pure brawl?
>>98554715Yeah but they're Christians and therefore evil because they made me go to sunday school, you CHUD!!1!
>>98554776Well to be fair at least there's a evil Christian Wever Incarna in the from of the patriarch and everybody was under the effects of the wyrm juce...
>>98554652>To be fair the lepodites are used to hunting vampires not garous and it's possible they bullets silver isn't pure enough (it should least above 90% according to W20 so rifle friendly alloys is out of the question) to hurt a garou and they pentex backed supplyers may have deliberately screw with the ammo.The writers forgot that the SoL is supposed to be good at killing things and bad at actually understanding them. Them not bringing their own silver is bad enough, them not bothering to check what Pentex is offering is worse. They see other hunters as useful pawns they can sacrafice to avoid losing their own guys. They work with other on a need-to-know basis, no way they'd consider anyone at that meeting as trustworthy. I'm not going to bring up that people with TF can detect the supernatural because we don't know how many dots they had. IIRC those guys were supposed to be the Gladius Dei, you know, hardcore inquisitors that are hand-picked by the inquisitor general, the best of the best.
>>98554762>the user of the gift just fucked if they misjudge what their opponent can do in a pure brawl?This.If the Mage you thought was just a nerd busts out malign weaponry and close combat rotes to bust out hulk mode Luna isn't going to do anything.She just prevents stuff like teleportation and mental effects and makes sure it is a fair fight to both sides.Of course, being spirit meaning she needs to be a dick, she will not transport you back. Meaning you have a high chance of getting fucked by others, especially since you are likely to be wounded and in hostile territory.
>>98554799>those guys were supposed to be the Gladius DeiThat's the biggest issue here. The writers completely flubbed the most elite inquisitor faction for... what exactly? To make low-effort jokes about how wild the fringe beliefs of some backwards niche christian sects can get? Why the fuck would the be MORMONS and OLYPMIAN PATHEISTS in the fucking catholic super-soldier program?
>Be me, KHV chud>One day, remember my Fae nature snd under my Chrysalis>Learn Summer so now women will actually want to fuck me>Be Unseelie, so cucking people by “destroying love” gives me GlamourIt’s literally that easy. Later, virgins.
>>98554825presumably they are not. I suspect that they are just some low level cast off assigned to the boones.
>>98554825Honestly? I don't know. I think they're using the V5 Inquisition which, like all other oWoD factions, was gutted and retconned.
>>98554818>can't even troll a mage with a surprise werewolf with the steel chairDamn, only good for screwing with Tremere I guess.
Dicking Tremere women into giving up their secrets!
>>98554792It is incredibly funny to me fucking Patriarch is even in discussion. Dude is a relic from Book of the Weaver, one of the most controversial books that never got updated because of everything in it. Ranging from how it decried European and Asian culture as corrupted Weaver dogma and how African and Americans (except for Aztecs) were less weaverish thanks to the efforts of Garou and thus fell to them the west. But also how Hinduism and Buddhism are better than Abrahamic Religions. It is peak -ism of White Wolf. Way more than any Kuei-jin book. It even contradicts their own stuff like Silent Striders and even suggests making Moses a servant of the Patriarch...fucking Moses...Which if you read the Mummy books, every single thing that happened to Egypt because of that shenanigan was deemed righteous and by Ma'at.There is a reason no one touched Book of the Weaver and Patriarch since then outside of Black Furies clanbook. At least ones I know off.
>>98547485because what is true for Garou is not necessarily true for Bastet. Nevermind the actual way that immortality functions, there is some functionally immortal Garou (through reincarnation) and other Fera. Also Bastet are just kind of less obedient by nature, who the fuck is going to tell them no? They only have a personal totem, and a loose tribal structure for most of them. They teach gifts to each other and steal from spirits. Possibly even if this does violate Gaias Will, telling the Werecats to stop being secret-hoarding scam artists will not go over well.Since they practise sorcery too, we can assume they actually have far more ways to be immortal than this.
>>98554845What's your Kith?
>>98554962Sluagh, dude. All the goth bitches love me.
>>98554799>the SoL is supposed to be good at killing things and bad at actually understanding them.This is actually a good insight and very key to understanding the SoL. They're not stupid, but they only care to comprehend supernaturals insofar as it lets them kill them easier. Because they already "know" what they are: servants of the devil. This lack of true comprehension often bites them in the ass, but it makes them dangerous in the same way a crackhead with a knife is. No fear of death combined with the capacity to kill you back. Just because they're close-minded doesn't mean they're dumb. >>98554825I've been annoyed at their depiction of the SoL since they first showed up in the werewolf lore episode. Genuine dumbasses who think heavy armor and big guns are the way. The thing that really struck a chord with me was the flashback leopoldites happily working with an aggressively protestant guy and shooting at what they believed were catholic guerillas. The Leopoldites have basically become their own pygmy heresy, and so the idea they wouldn't even try to peacefully resolve the conflict with what they were pretty sure were weird folk Catholics pissed me off. but I should stop before I get into how little sense the Nails of Christ made. If they wanted disposable jack-booted thugs, they should've just gone with outright Pentex First Teams, or generic government stooges. God, I hate the werewolf limbo arc.
>>98554897You'll need to keep in mind that the stuff in that section is unreliably narrated by a Glass Walker Theurge. Anyway, the Black Fury Patriarch is potentially a completely different entity, as I'm sure that it's their name for one of the Urge Wyrms.
>>98547537Mechanically speaking, Garou are actually really scary.The average 6th gen leech will either have some sort of discipline to get out, or just die. If you look at some shit like Golgol, he goes first and he will attack you 6 times in a row with minimum 10 dice of agg, he also soaks agg at 8 dice. Taking him down once will mean he comes back a second time for like 90%, and does it again via remain active.This isn't even considering any gift use.So ask yourself, does the average gen 6 have anything to prevent this that the legend isn't immune to? The answer is that those clans with celerity tend to have a good chance, whilst those that do not will require an instant win button or just lose outright.I could totally see a legend, as statted, taking out a methuselah solo if they do not happen to have the aforementioned tools to prevent it.
Shark here today with your weekly healthy dose of VTM shenanigans!>After traversing the territory of an elder vampire, Shark and his friends from the Third Reich managed to arrive at the Black Pyramids>The land was saturated with the energy of death>Nothing living for miles and miles, and we’re stuck there for two weeks>We will have to ration our blood for as long as we stay there>Mathilda got a rare W and found campsites from previous expeditions>Among the loot was a kopesh belonging to a guardian of Anubis (Mathilda got another W finding its history), and a gold standard from the French Revolution>Catalina socialized a bit with a member of her sabbat pack>Plutarch, a Lasombra gentleman that served Napoleon himself>We confirmed that it isn’t the first time that Rasputin sent people to retrieve Anubis>He sent Plutarch along with the French army hundreds of years ago, lots of people he cared for died>He even left behind the standard, and cursed it so that it electrocutes anyone that holds it>Needless to say that the topic of losing his men was a sore subject>Shark was hungry, so he decided to have a friendly chat with Bull, the gargoyle who’s part of his own pack>Bull was a mix of a Labrador’s brain with the speech habits of a skaven>And he found some bones-flesh near the pyramids yes yes!>And lots of them there were! Along with some old uniforms Shark didn’t recognize>He liked them though, so he happily wore the clothes while feasting>Then something happened
>>98555016Your run-of-the-mill Tremere neonate with five dots in Movement of the Mind can send him flying into the moon at a tenth of the speed of light. Remind me why he is a threat.
>>98555016So in a bout between Golgol Fangs-First and Sascha Vykos, who do you think is coming out on top?>>98555029Your “run-of-mill” Tremere neonate would be pissing and shitting himself (leaking vitae in his pants). Vampire aren’t immune to delirium. Me thinks the Usurpers of this general are starting to get a little too uppity for my liking.
>>98555046The guy who keeps saying "run of the mill" or "standard issue" Tremere is a shitposter trying to make people hate them.
>>98555046>Vampire aren’t immune to delirium.Even having a bit of vampire blood in your system gives you immunity.
>>98555050Don't feed the dogfucker, please. He already takes up an absurd amount of posts shilling his shitty splat.
>>98555027
>>98555027>Then something happenedWhat? WHAT HAPPENED????
>Loli Garou are impossibleWhat a kuso splat!!
>>98555029because space isn't real and he will just step sideways back to you. Also he will go first and hit you for 10-15 agg very likely killing him.>>98555046vamps are immune to delirium. As for vykos, she has only 2 fort to soak his 10-15 agg with. So it depends on what sascha can do with Dominate. You can hit Golgol with a "STOP." or such - but that's gonna be -1 action. He's still probably gonna take the other 5 afterwards. Oh by the way, if he frenzies (very likely), he's just immune to that. I don't see anything that'll stop Sascha from being toast but idk, just glanced.
>>98555070Be the change you want to see and just do it
>>98555077>You can hit Golgol with a "STOP." or such - but that's gonna be -1 actionWhat happens to Golgol if he's hit with a "KILL YOURSELF" instead?
>>98554825>>98555009It's because the SoL is being used as HtP's version of the Inquisition in 40k (or rather, how TTS portrayed them): a bunch of power drunk, trigger happy fanatics whose beliefs actually go against what the deity they worship actually wants. The helmets even invoke a bit both space marines and inquisition tempestus scions. So the leopodites are basically a mishmash of different christian fundamentalist groups to keep that joke going>>98554897 >there is a reason no one touched Book of the Weaver and Patriarch since then outside of Black Furies clanbookNo, it actually gets brought up a few times elsewhere>revised glass walkers tribebook point there for rules on cybernetic fetishes>drones were introduced in it>shinzui industries and the machine become the main antagonists in the weaver ascendant ToJ scenarioI think the Patriarch gets ignored because he's pretty much the most lore conflicting aspect of the Weaver, since even just sticking to WtA it goes against the idea both pre and post Book of the Weaver that christian fanatics are Wyrm tainted
>>98555027>”BE NOT AFRAID!”>It was as if a thousand voices, perhaps a million, maybe more spoke directly into his mind, booming with the strength of thunder>”WE ARE PEACE. WE ARE YOUR SALVATION.”>Then Shark was struck with a sense of dread, and failed his courage check>Catalina and Mathilda were discussing the status of the mission with Plutarch, and how Rasputin stayed inside the train while leaving a body double behind>The three of them were surprised by Shark running towards the camp as if the devil was after him. Or rather…>”MOTHER ISABELLA FOUND US! SHE SENT GOD’S HEAVENLY HOST AFTER ME!”>Shark the burgeoning avatar of the Wyrm issued a challenge to Mother Isabella (a Toreador Primogen who attained Golconda) years ago in a duel for the fate of the world>Ultimate good vs ultimate evil>But Shark hasn’t ascended yet, and turns out his nemesis is sending a thousand angels on his ass already>That was clearly cheating!>Shark’s coterie and the nazis just looked at their friend thinking that he was retarded>But not Plutarch>Shark was wearing the clothes of his comrades>And he didn’t like it one bit>As a matter of fact, he frenzied on the spot>The man jumped on Shark, too enraged to unsheathe his cane sword>Shark was way too busy to even pay attention to the man, he dodged his attack and kept running>Seeing his target speeding away from him, Plutarch focused his attention on the weakest kindred close to him>Mathilda
>>98555027>>Plutarch, a Lasombra gentleman that served Napoleon himselfI knew it! I knew I wasn't crazy! There was a Lasombra in the tent that night!J/K. Glad to see more Shark chicanery!
>>98555091You can't?"The subject cannot be ordered to do something directly harmful to herself, so a command like “die” is ineffective." Example commands for dominate: run, agree, fall, yawn, jump, laugh, surrender, stop, scream, follow
>>98555117My bad, thought he had six dots of dominate.
Speaking of Golgol, I think we can all agree the Amazon War would have been lost at this point.
>>98555131I don't know how that would help. I see no 6 dot power that'd help you. At 7 dots you got still the mortal flesh, but Golgol is immune to that as anybody is with a wp above 8. In fact, I can see no dominate power all the way to 10 that'll help. Best case is chain the psyche but that's questionable as to how that works, especially considering he has a gift that lets him ignore all pain.
There's also the fact that as strong as a garou gets, their real strength is the pack. Its that youre likely going to be dealing with 3-5 if they're actively mad at you.
>>98555102>Very fortunately for Mathilda, the Lasombra gentleman immediately missed and botched his attacks, effectively disarming himself>But he was still a raging undead>Bull was very angry-furious that Plutarch tried to hit-hurt his packmate>He grabbed a stake and threw it like a baseball at Plutarch, staking him on the spot>The nazi revenants had their finger on their triggers ready to intervene, but calmed a bit after the situation was swiftly resolved>”Rasputin” called everyone that matters at his tent and shared his plan>There were multiple black pyramids around. That night they would split up their troops and begin searching two of them at once>A member of Clio’s pack assigned to us a pyramid at random and told the coterie to get going>It is then that they realized that Shark wasn’t there>Meanwhile Shark was travelling the desert Bugs Bunny style. Digging his way underground>Less than an hour passed that he heard this in his mind>”THIS IS MY TOMB. BUT YOU ARE WELCOMED TO REST HERE. FOREVER.”>Shark got a new surge of fear, but then the voices took another tone>They weren’t divine. They were ravenous. Hungry. Insatiable.>Shark could feel it in his being>THE WYRM>Shark could feel all warm and fuzzy inside, giggly at the prospect of being closer to ascend>It wasn’t a trap by mother Isabella, it was his destiny calling
What do you think the biggest vampire combat monster would look like, if experience points and access to obscure powers are not an issue?Basically I read the earlier discussion about the theoretical Get Ahroun with dozens of dice in all physical stats and wondered what the Vampire the Masquerade equivalent would be.I don't particularly care if high gen or low gen, this is just theoretical speculation for fun and both options sound interesting.
>>98555070I don't know where it says that so I made a 13 year old boy a garou
>>98555202Amazon deforestation started declining harshly in the recent years, has been for a few years.
>There's a dude with every possible minor template>Ghoul, Kindred/Wolf-Blooded, whatever >But he's not a shameless powergamer>He's always serving some major templated monster.
>>98555250>So Shark walked back to the camp with renewed enthusiasm>The voices came from Anubis>It means he’s close!>Shark informed his group about the voices and they all headed to the pyramid, fortunately it was the same one that Shark visited the entrance>Shark caught the ST by surprise because his first dot of protean wasn’t in night vision, but sonar>Shark could map out the entire inside of the pyramid, and detect traps and secret entrances easily>And he found all three secret passages and discovered hidden treasures>Among those were golden scarabs, that if you were to touch would crack open and reveal real scarabs that would borough into your flesh>Shark grabbed one for fun, but a single one couldn’t pierce his Fortitude>Then the group found something ludicrous>Inside a secured chamber was a golden box>Shark used his Auspex to see the aura emanating from the box>It was radiating a golden fiery light>Catalina became immediately weary, said “no fucking way”>Mathilda asked what was the matter>One of the locals we had hired, in a stupefied shock, uttered these words>”It’s the ark of the covenant.”>”What the fuck?!” Said Shark and Mathilda respectively>Shark got immediately curious. No way it’s the real deal? >Right?>He decided to poke the golden box with one of his claws
>>98555365One of my favorite characters was when I played a ghoul to another player's vampire. He was playing the classic rich old count. I played his most capable handyman; a former EOD specialist and driver who was dishonorably discharged for smuggling guns and cocaine. Out of all of us, I was potentially the most dangerous one.
anybify have a pic of a werewolf making a conspiracy wall?
>>98555381>It was as if an external force controlled Shark’s hands, made them stick to the handles of the Ark>And his hands were burning>They were burning so hot it was worse than being touched by a red hot poked>With a tremendous amount of will Shark managed to pull his hands off the box>And he then began cursing God, cursing heaven>Swearing that once he’s done consuming Earth, that heaven and His ass is next>Catalina having seen the power of the Lord, and now Shark provoking Him, immediately bolted out of there carrying Mathilda like a sack of potatoes>She made it halfway through when she stumbled upon something unsettling>We had left two men behind in our expedition to loot the treasure that we had previously found>They were now both lying dead, massacred>Catalina immediately reasoned that being alone (or two people) was an extremely bad idea and that it’s better to witness Shark being smitten by God then facing whatever lurked the corridors of the Black Pyramid>So she sprinted back, only to see that the hallways had shifted. The hidden passage leading to Shark and the diggers was sealed shut by a wall that previously didn’t exist>The two ladies panicked even more>Catalina made her best impression of the Kool-Aid Man and busted through the wall>Only, it was an illusion and she fell face first on the ground>The two kindred got up and examined their surroundings>And immediately regret running back to the group
>>98554387>make sure that you are prepared in case they decide to say "fuck both of you, we are doing our own thing"Fair enough, some players do like doing that, and while initially that's what the attacking Sabbat pack is for, at a later date I'll ask about what kind of game inerests the players more. Maybe they can try to nab the prize for themselves, or get caught up in the Sabbat politics around the Regent's death, or escape town and face a clan-themed gauntlet, or maybe get caught in those games of instinct, or face some bio-horrors from the Tzimisce like blood brothers, or even just RP vampire cafeterias and Elysium drama or whatever>Some players love the action, some live for the RP session where the only thing that progressed is the drama levels and some just want to fuck around in World of Darkness.Exactly, it'll depend on what kind of game of any they enjoy. Anything to play something that isn't 5e
>>98555467>They were surrounded by 20 mummies, and at their head was the wraith of a beautiful lady warrior wielding a massive two handed sword>The two girls cried for help and Shark joined the fray immediately>Our ST told us that what we were facing wasn’t an ordinary wraith. No it was worse. Way worse>It was some kind of specter, but the world itself wouldn’t do justice>He told us that in the picking order, this lady would be two ranks above any common specter>I’m not familiar with WtO, so I’m counting on you guys to decipher what it means>As the battle started everyone took their roles>Shark will face the ghost in a 1v1>Catalina will repel the mummies>Mathilda… will do her best?>And there was something funny that I haven’t told yet…>In the room we found the golden scarabs there were a lot of corpses>Well Shark has been packaging them in his backpack, and nomming on them all this time>All his physical stats were at 10>The first strike came from Shark, so strong was his claws that the ghost had to waste an action to nullify the blow>And her sword couldn’t cut through Shark’s skin>Catalina had quite an amazing success and spawned five tentacles made of shadows and mowed the ranks of the undead
>>98555445This one?
Why would Beasts hate the Ashwood Abbey in particular? They're a Hunter compact, but they seem almost to adore monsters, and sometimes host parties where they're guests of honor. Beasts feel like they have a strong desire to be the center of attention, so that should be really tempting for them
>>98555515>they seem almost to adore monstersThat is certainly one way to interpret them...
>>98555515>Why would Beasts hate the Ashwood Abbey in particular?Competition and their debauchery probably fucks with the "chambers" they make but that is mostly speculation tied to the Possesed.
>>98555515idk, maybe they're pissy that the Ashwood Abbey is really casual about raping people instead of doing absurd mental gymnastics to justify abusing people actually being for their own good.
>>98555092The half-measured attempts to continue TTS but also not even remotely have been only to the series' detriment. I know a few people who just won't watch it because re-using core cast members in an entirely different setting takes them out of it too much. Gotta cut the umbilical.
>>98555504>Mathilda tried to bone craft the mummies, but it didn’t work>Top of the round, second turn>Shark did massive damage on the ghost lady>She also heard while the coterie was strategizing that Shark also has necromantic powers tailor made to torture wraith>On the verge of being killed (heh), and/or captured, she preferred to nope out of existence>Catalina easily took care of the rest of the mummies and we went back to the Ark of the Covenant and the diggers>Only to find them all comatose>So apparently the lady ghost decided to heal her wounds by devouring the souls of the human servants>Shark was offended that someone was stealing his schtick, and that he couldn’t eat the ghost lady like he did that wraith a decade ago>Catalina was of the mind of abandoning the miners down there and let them rot>Shark argued against, because we weren’t sure everyone’s soul has been eaten>And he doesn’t want to be stuck with their job if we began running out of manpower (we’ll be grounded there two weeks after all)>One of the nazi commanders later agreed with Shark, only because it’s extra blood for the cainites and prevents them to go crazy with hunger>He also informed us that the Ark was one of the two keys vital to resurrect Anubis, and odds are that we’ll find his body inside our pyramid>We then all went to sleep afterwards, and preparing for the next night’s expeditionAnd this is the end of today’s session! What do you all think? Also Shark has now the fifth dot of the Kraina of Enoch! The Hungering Void! Shark can turn into a black hole, and anyone absorbed has to make a willpower roll difficulty 9! If they succeed they are paralyzed with distress and suffer derangement(s). If they fail their permanent willpower is consume! Mortals automatically fail!>>98555055<3>>98555066Terrible things>>98555106Glad to see more of you!
>>98555276>a 13 year old boy a garouToo old. Yuck!
>>98555504>They were surrounded by 20 mummies, and at their head was the wraith of a beautiful lady warrior wielding a massive two handed swordThe mental image of half of an entire splat showing up to jump your ass is a hilarious one.
>>98555533There is no artistry to raping someone like they do. You need a long, convoluted story to REALLY get of on raping someone.
>>98555576>Too old. Just add magic!
>>98555009Also it was a bit silly how of all SoL behavior to be mad at Kitten is hung on >B-but they're Catholic!!I used to think they got too good at their craft to be doing derivative work and the IPs they were working with actually constrained their writing and story-boarding capabilities. After this arc started I'm not so sure anymore.
>>98555515>Why would Beasts hate the Ashwood Abbey in particular?You know how the people who are most vocally, insistently against say, lolicon, almost inevitably end up exposed as having raped kids or having massive stashes of CP? Well...
>>98555602Just to be sure, do mummies respawn if their corpses are consumed?
>>98555625Yes. It slows down the respawn timer though.
>>98555630Huh… I hope those were just animated corpses and not the real deal. Though I guess consuming their soul with the hungering void could dispose of them for good
>My Herd is the local high school goth cliqueHow many dots would this be?
>>98555548I found it most enjoyable. Has Mathilda's player been improving?
>>98555092>It's because the SoL is being used as HtP's version of the Inquisition in 40kWhich is massively retarded on multiple level.WoD for all it's retarded bullshit, has a very different breed of retarded bullshit than 40k does. Anyone acting like the 40k inquisition in WoD will quickly find themselves in bodybags.
>>985556591, 2 at best.
>>98547485The "Balance of Gaia" is bullshit. Owl only disallows Silent Striders from mummifying because he's a death spirit and can't comprehend that other gaian spirits allow that flavor of bullshit regularly.
>>98555657No way those were actual 20 capital M Mummies that came for you. One of the Shemsu-Heru would have dropped you if you didn't know about it months in advance and specfically plan for it. Hell, Mummies haven't gotten together in more than 2-5 in the entirety of the post 800's since Horus shacked up in Switzerland.20 of the Amenti? Still not working through that, though more likely, though that is still a shit ton of Mummies. Like, putting 40 Methuselah all awake in one encounter. They were probably just animated corpses, not Mummies. Mages are more common than Mummies, to put it in perspective
>>98555687>20 of the Amenti? Still not working through that, though more likelyAnon, don't forget that Amenti get the passive effects of True Faith equal to their balance rating as part of the splat package.Most nightfolk get instantly bodied even before hekau are even a factor.
>>98555660Thanks a lot!Well Catalina’s player told them before the game started that Mathilda should aim for the sweet middle. Too strong for weaklings and the ambitious to target (without expanding lots of efforts, resources and risks). And weak enough so elders don’t see you as a threat. Today they got a reminder that they should appear stronger. Otherwise Plutarch wouldn’t have targeted them. Other than that they succeeded on rolls, Catalina didn’t have to babysit them too much, and they didn’t get molested. We did crack a few jokes at her expense. Like when Plutarch assaulted her with his cane. It’s because when Mathilda spent two years being pimped to an 70-80 yo man, the dude had a passion for beating her up with a cane while nutting inside her (before and after too). So when Plutarch struck her, we joked that she was used to it. Or when we were talking about rationing our blood she made the suggestion of using animalism to call animals (in a land without a single trace of life) to feed on. We teased her about the last time she used that power she called three angry owls and nearly met final death if it wasn’t for Shark’s intervention >>98555687That’s reassuring
>>98554867You fool, those are Tremere men
>>98555735Well, every Tremere woman was once a Tremere man.
Fucking Metis women raw. You won’t be breaking the Litany that way.
>>98555687There's actually a kind of demi-mummy the bane mummies love creating en-masse the in the same sense sabbat make shovelheads.Asekh-Sen. They don't get any crazy hekau, but they can resurrect after death a limited number of times.They have a corruption rating, but that acts as Anti-Faith like you sometimes find on nephandi.
>Getting head from your Redcap gf>She ends up voring youNot again. :(
>>98555735Tremere have a ritual thst lets them permanently switch genders. It's a complete switch that makes you fully functional downstairs unlike tzimisce freakshit.
>>98555770At least until a bastet pulls a prank on you and she gets pregnant anyway(Freyr's Gift, rank 3).The fact Bastet have a gift for letting their metis freely continue inbreeding like indians on meth is concerning.
>>98555774>pooka gf says she loves you
>>98555735This: >>98555778Some Tremere even make their newly embraced apprentices go through the ritual for fun.
Why cant I a potent kinfolk male have sex with a female garou in her crinos!? Its not fair!!!!
>>98555850You can’t handle it, boy.
>>98555778>>98555813Perfect retard-midwit-genius chart potential.>Human: Only biological women a women>Tzigger:ALL WOMEN ARE REAL WOMEN!>Tremere:Only biological women(made from men) are women
>>98555770>>98555789So this popular brand of shapeshifters is gonna have basically five gifts to choose from, so we really gotta make 'em count. What do we add, boss? Don't worry, I know exactly what the gamers want...
>>98555897>By spraying a given area or object with urine or musk
>>98555910I want to say it was just because cats do it that way but I know it was for kink reasons.
>>98555910I love how they had to point out it works for live creatures too. Thank you White Wolf, very based. And I mean this unironically, idgaf it's just fucking funny as fuck to me and more power to the guy who can jack off to it.
>>98555897R-Kelly was a Bastet?!
>>98555910Many mammals do that.
>>98555789>At least until a bastet pulls a prank on you and she gets pregnant anyway(Freyr's Gift, rank 3).Bastet only or can other fera pick up that trick if taught?
>>98556130generally speaking you can learn the gifts of other Fera, but those spirits may dislike Garou and so would most Fera. Ironically, the Bastet are known to swipe gifts and learn from each other so it is far likelier that a werecat learns Garou gifts than the other way around.I sometimes see "up to rank 3 gifts can be copied, Bastet/Kitsune can do up to rank 5" brought up but never saw a mechanical grounding for this. Either way, it'd be learnable at Rank 3.
>>98555009>>98555092You know I watched that stream of theirs after the episode and put it in the background, I heard SpeakerD saying something about how W5 werewolves can't just be gunned down by 5 guys with shotguns anymore and that if they had ran the Stig fight with tabletop rules everyone would be dead so I gotta ask, how do woofs in W5 compare to earlier editions?
>>98556198To start, Garou in W5 have a Rage track that goes from zero to five. To activate a variety of supernatural abilities, including transforming and healing, they have to do a "Rage check," which is basically a fifty-fifty chance to reduce Rage by one. A werewolf at zero Rage reverts to human shape and loses access to most of their powers.So if you do a drive-by of a werewolf pack, they have to either spend a Rage check to turn Glabro, or TWO for Crinos. They then have to spend additional Rage checks to heal from the damage of your initial assault. Also, just holding onto Rage can give complicated penalties to noncombat rolls, so some of them probably weren't at 5 Rage to start with. The only saving grace here is that once they're in supernatural forms, damage from guns might be considered superficial (I'd have to double check the rules), which gets divided in half, rounded up. But also they probably have five boxes total in their health tracks, and if the damage isn't considered superficial... soak isn't a thing in W5.So unless the hunters just have shit dice pools, strong disagree.
>>98556225lmao so you're saying even without silver stig really should've just gotten gunned down like a dog?
>>98556198>nobody would've been able to beat a pack of woofsThen maybe don't make them your entire second arc. Fucking dumbasses put us on Namek knowing there's no super saiyan at the end to bail us out.Anyway, W5 woofs take half damage from anything that isn't fire or silver - and if you don't destroy their body they're never fully dead (and even if you do, they might end up spirit-walking and getting a new one if they're old enough).They gain +2 to all physical stats in Glabro, +4 in Cirnos, and that directly gives them 2 and 4 more health squares respectively and the massive soak pool that comes with it. If you're lucky, it'll make you immortal, since there isn't much doing over 8 points of damage. If you're unlucky, 2 bursts of auto fire will take your dedicated tank down.You can regenerate a fair amount of health by spending rage, but you're not likely to have a lot of it after swapping to your war form and once you're in combat, almost nothing gives it to you, so that's a more limited resource than people think.Woofs are still pretty strong, but this isn't all that much more insane than W20. The physical buffs were about even, rage isn't dependent on rolling, you could still rapidly heal from lethal injuries, etc.Gifts? Merits? YMMV, of course.
>>98556246Unless Big D is Imbued and beats the shit out of Stig. Lord knows he would
>>98556231It's very cool when Stig or Hunts absorb massed gunfire like the surface of a lake, but it ain't happening in W5. Also, Stig isn't casually flipping between forms, again, it's a Rage check for Glabro or Hispo, two for Crinos. You can get lucky on those checks, or you can burn through your Rage very fast.
>>98556231Very few things in WoD are ACTUALLY immune to a firing squad. High Fort vampires is one of the only things that can take even both barrels of a shotgun, let alone a bunch of high calibre rifles.A pistol? Sure. But your average platoon would put down most anything if they decided to just try and eat the attack - hence why you as players still take cover and use your powers to dodge bullets.
>>98556246>They gain +2 to all physical stats in Glabro, +4 in Cirnos, and that directly gives them 2 and 4 more health squaresThey get bonuses to dice pools, their stats don't change and they don't get bonus health boxes
>>98556257I personally always found that stupid. Vampires and werewolves can literally rip people’s heads off and punch through solid rock. Bullets shouldn’t be this problematic for them
>>98554652>To be fair the lepodites are used to hunting vampires not garousthat's not true at all and depends on the chapterthe german bavarian chapter is mostly hunting garou because the garou in that country are more agressive than usual (they are the Get because white wolf for some reason thinks that germany is nordic) and are so good at it that the garou in the country have a policy of killing everyone who sees them in their warform because the 5% chance that someone remembers them and the inqusition hears about it is too scary for thembut we have no idea which chapter the guys in hunter the parenting are from especially because the SoL has no chapters in britian. The knights of saint georg are meant to cover that region
>>98556266No, this is for W5 Crinos They gain extra health
>>98556285They're from the far future via the same timewarp that's made the coalition exist in 2004.This is the problem with trying to use a lot of 5th Ed lore is that the stuff in it happens, canonically, at a certain point in time. The Beckoning happens, but not until V5's point in the timeline. The Apocalypse happens and kinfolk vanish, but not until W5's point in the timeline. By implementing X5's plot but not setting it when those games are supposed to be set, you end up with this bizarre worst of both worlds effect. It's like how before V20 an't do what all good STs do and remove Ravnos as a playable clan; they aren't made extinct until the Week of Nightmares.
>>98556284don't think about that much, ST system is build on surface level foundations. otherwise you would notice stuff like how humans can get as strong as bears, get crippled or killed by house cats etc.
>>98556330How do humans get as strong as bears?
>>98556330A house cat could fuck up a weak guy if it wanted toThat tracks
>A house cat could fuck up a weak guy if it wanted to
>>98556345I mean it depends
>>98556296why do claws in w5 bashing damage?
>>98556364I've seen a chicken kill a guy, shit's fucked
>>98556364in most ttrpg i seen cats can kill humans pretty easilyatleast our cats don't oneshot char gen mages like in dnd
Is this too much>Mhairi>Fianna descended lost cub with a bit of a bad case of late first change>Had to figure the whole rage thing out on her own due to not having a pack or anything>Surprisingly did pretty good at it, although she’s not as capable as a Fianna her age should be in combat due to her late start and how much she focused on the Rage thing, kinda scrappy and improvised, yet shows surprisingly solid Rage control.>Generally a sweet girl who likes to tell stories, judges people based on what they do>Kind of a dumbass but actively tries to make smarter choices even when she struggles to do that.Is this a balanced ish character?
>>98556378It can be a balanced PC. You can show us her character sheet after you finish.
Like dear god V6 isn't just a step back but a whole backwards marathon.I shudder to think what form W6 and H6 will take. Assuming 6e survives the release of mage.
>>98556392She’s Ahroun. Doesn’t have that many Gifts. She has like.. 3, maybe. Only one of which is combat capable.She learned them through being nice to spirits and stuff because she could just tell “Okay these guys are clearly on my side, I best treat them right whatever that means.”She’s not a zen master of Rage but she’s better than you would expect for a Lost Cub. Mainly because it was “Either I get a handle on this or I end up killing someone.”
>>98556369Because W5 is a product of spite for Werewolf.
>>98556398I wonder how much crossover there is between this general and r/WorldOfDankMemes. I see you anon
>>98556337You tell me.
>>98556398There is no W6 fuck youGet excited for C6 and M6 (Imagine having Willpower equal to 10 + Resolve + Composure, exceptit'sactuallya shared bar with your Quintessence)
>>98556410you should have seen that one annoying fag who kept switching between here and dankmemes, crying whenever one side bullied him too much because of his obsession to diss the technocracy. kept making propaganda disguised as "memes"
>>98556400Buy some cool merits.
Are there equivalent mechanics to this in 20th Anniversary? Or if I'm breaking inanimate objects do I just treat it as a feat of strength?
>>98556225>>98556246I wonder if they were mixing it up with Forsaken, where Gauru form regenerates all bashing and lethal every turn.
>>98554688Holden thought it was later a bad idea for exalts to be able to make magic wonders and get access to other splat powers when they otherwise should not be able to. In truth, that was wise but not as fun. There's something out there to change what magical items exalts that can make that is more balance but more boring. There are going to be essence differences between splats with solars/infernals, and abyssals being the strongest energy pool wise. The other exalts have a few ways to outshine them but those three are usually the straight forward best. The only thing worse than them is an actual full group of five competent sidereals arguably speaking. Your gm may try to nerf you in ways if they're having a hard time adjusting to the crazy things you can do casually out the gate. If you foresee the gm sweating when you can casually drop 12 to 30 dice on standard fire arms test be prepared for it. Discuss and figure out the tempo that works best for your group. The main thing i'd suggest is try to avoid player on player exalt conflict. If he can help it avoid exalted on exalted conflict because the system was not made with that in mind. Players plenty of time claim they don't take player vs player crap personal but you'd be surprise at how bad people have grudges. NPCs Exalts vs Players can work and it's up to the gm. Doing something lower tier than the players like Dragonbloods vs lunars/solars can work but still invites players to compare themselves to each other.>>98554747World of Darkness fans are snowflakes. Exalted fans are so used to being told it's okay to be a snowflake princesses that they've changed the game into being just that. Exalted vs World of Darkness intentionally nerfed the exalts anyway so they don't overshadow world of darkness fans. That said, the same person to mention that is probably the same guy who'd think the average exalt could be up an average scion 1e character
>>98556398Not really, V6 is not really any different than V5 to me. It's just a different pile of bad mechanics and likely will feature a different pile of bad lore too.You're in the wrong place if you think anyone here is in favour of the Hecata, the Second Inquisition or unplayable Sabbat.
>>98556475NTA but honestly the SI isn't a bad idea so much as it's horribly executed. It's also kind of funny how it straight up works as a technocracy upscale too because now you can argue that plasma guns and power armor don't incur paradox when sleepers can just pull this shit out of their ass
>>98556487If the Second Inquisition was executed well, it would have just given us what we always had, which is hunters.
>>98556475The Hecata kind of grew on me when they got their own book. Portraying what they did as something a lot of the components of it aren't happy about, the loss of their identities being a very real problem for some of them (and the Samedi just fucking vibing their asses off now a lot of them have skin again) does a lot to make it feel like something that happened in the world "like it or not". It had actual consequences for the cultures and perceptions of a lot of the clans who were dragged by Giovanni bullshit into the new status quo, which is the sort of thing that SHOULD have. Half the complaints about the Beckoning is that people are arbitrarily immune and it should have even more consequences for the world, right?And, be real, who the fuck was playing a Giovanni?>>98556487The SI in its most raw conceptual form is just "the government has had enough of your vampiric shit and they've got the tech to make it happen" which isn't even from V5. Like, what functional difference does it make if you're using the Jackalope Horn-Fuckers or just... the FBI? They've got guns either way and your supernatural branch can have the laser guns.Frankly I'd almost have liked to see them really lean on the Innocent thing where a lot of the SI are genuinely interested in trying to separate out the good from the bad, and often times doing more harm than good through that. Make them a bit more Men in Black in like, the 1990's sense.If the guys with the shades and the neuralyzers turn up they might be there to help you... or they might not. Or they might be there to drag you into some absurd plot. Or you might be black bagged. I think making them a source of PARANOIA instead of an invading army would've been neater.But I'm not American and I understand that the social malaise around law enforcement these days is as riot control with tanks, not the Stasi.
>>98556406can be the only explaination i am pretty sure v5 protean claws at least mention that they are non halved damage
>>98556424Yes, in M20 for example. But most STs don't bother with that much mechanical depth
>>98555269I don't have enough of world of darkness mastery to accurately answer that question. I can tell you it's kinda moot one though. Vampires typically have to collect powers like candy to match other splats in physical contests. If they have access to anything they want though? Just look at combination disciplines and realize that even a 12th generation vampire can do aggravated damage on demand, fake their own death with a perfect construct duplicate construct, and even soak damage with fortitude, protean, and whatever other discipline dot you want if you look hard enough. That's not including utility powers like become so invisible that ghosts can't see them in the shadow land or the fact they can fly with mindpowers and with the actual flight discipline. Maybe word it differently if you want people to try it, but make no mistake. Late game vampire is a bullcrap splat. Sometimes I don't even know if mage players realize how scary elder vampires can be even if they have access to spheres.
>>98555269without exp points being a issue vampires scale up indefinitly because of Daimonion 6 allowing you to take investments and arcana and even make up new ones without any actual demon involved and you can take it as often as you want with exp being the only limitthe highest you get in stats without it is probably the revised/dark age vampire version of the tzimisce dragon form that tripples your stats (only doubles in dav20 if i remember correctly) combined with celerity 7 dance of death that allows you keep your extra dice even if you do bonus attacks meaning you get 27(30 if you blood buffed before the transformation) dex+9 celerity dice 10 times per turn to add to your 27(30 if you blood buffed before the transformation) and roughly the same for strenght + potence in agg damage and that's without any other combosbut at that point another vampire with presence 9 can mind control a entire city, a lasombra can cause a sun eclipse that ruins two other splats metaplots, baali can doom the entire world and tremere can smite your entire faction with magic sunlightin general the problems vampires have is that they need more exp than most to get to the really op stuff so when you remove exp entirely then you get some absurd stuff. not earthbound mastery absurd but that's in a league of it's own
>>98556503>I think making them a source of PARANOIA instead of an invading army would've been neater.Oh you just make the monkey paw curl and H6 SI gameplay now resemble TTRPG classic Paranoia With all the Hyper lethality, Backstabbing and ACME tier equipment it entails.
>>98555774>vorePlease tell me this is a joke and not an actual in-universe mechanic
>>98556590redcaps can eat EVERYTHING that's their template boni although for some stuff they need to spend a point of glamour
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z-wSesiTcOMso there is a remake for redemption and it's a skyrim mod of all things?
>>98556590Unseelie Redcap will eat you but they don't get sexual gratification...normally. They aren't Unseelie Satyrs afterall.
>>98556503>Like, what functional difference does it make if you're using the Jackalope Horn-Fuckers or just... the FBI? They've got guns either way and your supernatural branch can have the laser guns.Given what we seen them do? The SI is supposed to have MOAR of everything they need given they need. But that's just me looking at Winter's Teeth and presuming that's normal. Like most of it is not unbelievable until they pull out the helicopters.
>>98556424There's the feat of strengths table and that's about it really.
>>98556662Hostilely I suspect H6 would have the SI hit funding as an excuse to make them playable, because they're not the "The man". Hell maybe parawolf could make wealth a health stat for them...
>>985561985 guys with shotguns will not reliably kill a W20 Garou, unless those shotguns pack silver.
>>98556723^ Funding cuts
>>98556749Really? Sometimes when I come to this general I feel like either I don't know world of darkness as well as I do or I haven't played enough combat with it. Can you explain why? Unless you're assuming they anywhere between 3 to 5 rage and burn it all to dodge each bullet shot?
>>98556723I can see that happening but odds are they are just kind of back tracking a lot of stuff because of the reaction it got almost a decade ago.
>>98556776A werewolf on average has about 6 soak, but you'd expect more, like 7 or 8. Let's go with 7 for a respectable Ahroun Stam of 4+3 Crinos with 0 other shenanigans. Somebody who's got a shotgun will be dealing 8 dice + succs-1 dice of damage. So if go with 3 succs, that's 10 dice for an average of 10-7 dice of damage dealt to the Garou. So 1.5 HL per guy. That puts you barely at 7.5, giving you what's basically a 50-50 if all of them unload on the Garou first without it getting a turn and deciding to dodge 0 hits.Now take into account: Gift usage (a few extra dots of soak and those shotguns are useless, a werewolf may also simply jam all guns in a scene, or have gifts that allow him to for example reflexively dodge attacks using rage), the fact that a werewolf is very likely to kill at least one Hunter before they unload. The fact that the Wolf may just dodge an attack or two if he wishes to, via rage. The fact that if you take a wolf down to death, it has remain active. The fact that if you do not kill it immediatly, it can simply run away and regen all of it's health back in what is essentially 20 seconds and come back with nasty buffs active.So in conclusion you'd see how I wouldn't call that "reliable".
>>98555009>This lack of true comprehension often bites them in the assThat goes for most splats if you think about it. A lot of the most pressing issues in WoD could be solved if everyone stopped trying to kill each other for 5 seconds.
>>98556198The whole '5 guys with shotguns' is a meme. It can be done but you need everything going right for your hunters. It would work well if it they set off a fucking bomb first while the garou is in breed form and ambushed it proper. Hunters have to be smarter and play dirty if they want to win, especially when fighting a splat that was designed for combat.
>>98556421>everyone who criticizes the Epsteinocratic Union is one personWhy are Cucknocrats so thin-skinned?
>>98556958>>98556421Please fuck off and continue to use the RP thread as the dumping ground for your retarded Trad-vs-Tech arguments. No one wants to see them here.
>>98556965No. Keep crying fag.
>>98556958At least try with a better bait, "x are so thin skinned" has been done to death
>>98556377Baldur's Gate's Legacy of Bhaal is kind of infamous for its extremely annoying starting area, cellar rats that can chain-knock you out while being near immune to damage
Imagine if he made wraith bait for that one anon who played it. It wouldn't get many (You)s but it'd be better than the same recycled slop
>>98556998But isn't recycled slop with zero creativity and human ingenuity (or shall we say, SOVL) the Technocratic ideal? Looks like someone's due for a visit from the MIW for some loyalty reinforcement.
What if Dawn of the Dead happened in the WOD? As in, just dying is enough to be a zombie, being bitten simply is lethal.
>>98557049everyone comes the giovanni to buy help and they have to admit that vampire necromancers can't control zombies that they haven't made well technically they figured it out during HTR's metaplot but that never got put into rules so depending on if you allow that to stay canon they either have a field day or their brand dies
>>98557049If supernaturals are affected everyone's fucked. If not they're fucked anyway because being bitten is simply lethal, everyone turns into a zombie no matter how they die.
I want to learn the lore of Werewolf. I read the corebook for 20th, and some of the revised tribebooks for the ones that interested me. What books do you recommend next?
>>98556398God at least V5 had some things I could backport like Thinblood stuff and bits of the Hectata. I don't know if anything good will come out of this shit.>>98556487I always treated SI as a lot of overambitious internal SI reports. >YES GENERAL we TOTALLY WIPED OUT ALL OF MONTREAL'S VAMPIRES we TOTALLY DONT HAVE CAMARILLA INFORMANTS MOVING TOPSIDE and the SABBAT DEFINITELY ARENT HIDING IN THE SEWERS>>98557013The problem there is the Technocracy should be actively breaking into several threads with their 'success.' One of which should absolutely be the guys trying to make Rocco's Basilisk real.
>>98557116IIRC the Glass Walker books had some neat stuff but Valkenberg(?) foundation is probably a better intro to the game in regards to introducing people to the game.
>>98555616Honestly, if they just had the balls to make the Leopoldites actual gay-bashers his huge revulsion towards them might make sense. Heck, a better internal conflict might've been >Leopoldites absolutely want to kill the hellhounds>Don't really want to risk any more lives rescuing a sodomite>This creates ideological friction in the alliance of convenienceOf course, I think we're already in a fustercluck of unforced errors. I think the plot of the arc pretty irrevocably crumbled when the Coalition didn't do the only reason to be in it, provide for the common defense. >>98556198>I heard SpeakerD saying something about how W5 werewolves can't just be gunned down by 5 guys with shotguns anymore and that if they had ran the Stig fight with tabletop rules everyone would be deadSpeakerD is the worst kind of WoDfag loretard and I'm really starting to think he is the root of all the problems here.
>>98557127>the guys trying to make rocco's basilisk realI'm pretty sure those are mostly fallen VAs
>>98556614They're having to change a lot of shit due to copyright, so it's not really a remake anymore.
>>98557231The moment the Hunter orgs went "oh sorry we can't lollmao" was when I knew it was going to shit and fast
>>98557231Tone has also been all over the place. However, the Norfolk Wizard Game is still fun, imo.
>>98556475I like the Hecata for the most part.
>>98557283Is the coalition being wyrm-infested and useless also a 5th thing or is it just ogre poppenang making it up. I read that H5 doesn't allow you to work for orga because they are "jobbers" and aren't real hunters
>>98557231Instead they honour a legal gay marriage from a country they're not in that was obviously never sanctified in the eyes of God.They used them because they're the most recognisable Hunters because Bloodlines and that was, frankly, a retarded decision.Same as making Stig a Silent Strider. He's the most Get-coded man alive and even if they want to go 'not playable in W5 gang sorry ):' the events that make them unplayable quite literally haven't happened in 2004. And there's so much 20th all over the rest of the shop so like...????At least we got the cute spider out of this whole mess. Ananasa's strongest out in force educating the population was delightful.
>>98557116the silver record
>>98557327I think the coalition being a series of supernatural front groups has been a thing for a whileYou can thank vampires for that
The more I hear about HtP the more I wish everyone involved in making it had been stillborn instead.
>>98556172>I sometimes see "up to rank 3 gifts can be copied, Bastet/Kitsune can do up to rank 5" brought up but never saw a mechanical grounding for this. Either way, it'd be learnable at Rank 3.The mechanics are from the "Past Lives" book. Garous and other Fera can only learn out of breed gifts up to rank 3.The bastet breedbook and hengayokai books put an asterisk on this limit by giving bastet and kitsune an uncapped ability to learn gifts(technically, they can swipe rank 6 gifts). Their only limit is that if another breed has the same gift at a lower rank, then bastet can't learn that version(example bastet learn to step sideways at rank 2, some breeds can learn at rank 1. Bastet cannot learn this lower gift, they Must wait until rank 2)
>>98557366Thing is the first season is genuinely good, with the first audiologs with Kevin being very good. It's just that season 2 with the werewolves trips on a rock and falls like five stories down in the third episode, audiologs included.
>>98557327The problem with discussing the SI/WoD5 hunter in general is that with the constant musical chairs that was being played in the writer's room, the SI is basically everything and nothing all at once. The idea that organized hunters are all soulless sellouts is all H5. The idea that they're partially compromised and ineffective is largely an oWoD-ism. Vigil is mixed. Some are compromised, some aren't, most are effective. Not all have the same goals. Every hunter group worth a damn being compromised by Wyrmshit is the kind of thing a Garou would say so they don't need to do introspection. Their coalition is kind of a weird mutant thing.
>>98556246>but you're not likely to have a lot of it after swapping to your war form and once you're in combat, almost nothing gives it to you, so that's a more limited resource than people think.This HEAVILY depends on how your ST is running the rage rules.Werewolf rage regen can range from regenerating 1-3 points a session max to wolfs generating one or more points for every round they're at low health in combat. The core rage rules are very open to interpretation and have a lot of optional rules sprinkled throughout the books, and that's before getting into merits, gifts, or totems.
>>98557383>Vampire stuff, going pretty well>THERE'S A GHOUL IN THE CHAPTER HOUSE AND EVERY HUNTER IS IN DANGER>ACTUALLY THERE'S A WEREWOLF IN THE CHAPTER HOUSE WE NEED TO SAVE MARCKUS>GRIMAL IS DEAD>KEVIN
>>98557440Can you imagine if we actually got a simple 5 episode whodunnit?
>>98557116Player's Guide to Garou, it is great at making you realize Garou aren't human. Like how their Ranks function (For example, Ranks aren't a social construct. They are spiritual and physical effects that are tied to the Garou.) or how Garou Nations function.W20 Book of the Wyrm, great if you want to learn about the main antagonists.W20 Kinfolk is great because it shows the supporting cast of the Garou Nation.
>>98557383First season was ass too.
>>98557440They killed Grimal so there would be no heterosexual romance options for Kitten
>>98557444>Can you imagine if we actually got a simple 5 episode whodunnit?Fuck, episode 4's build-up was genuinely good. If they didn't go the wolfshit rout for 5+, I think seaon 2 would have been great.The other thing that the wolfshit ruined is the 3-episode micro-season thing that season 1 set up. Having a clear pattern with each episode giving a satisfying beginning-middle-end is Fantastic pacing. However, they IMMEDIATELY fucked it up.
>>98556231W5 immensely depowered werewolves. To feed into the whole werewolves suck angle. Their survivability and sustainability in W5 is far less than in prior editions or CofD. In W5 2 normal people with hunting rifles is a legitimate lethal threat unless you have built your character for it and are prepared. Werewolf the Forsaken had you essentially be invincible to anything less than concentrated heavy machine-gun fire or a room full of people mag dumping you if you were in warform from character creation.
>>98556948I ST a game where 6 normal humans with shotguns killed a garou and nearly killed two others (6 agg). Though I also think it’s because the dice were in my favour that night, but still plenty doable.>>98557231I swear you guys forget that not only it’s a YouTube series, so obviously gay bashing is a no-no, but that it’s also happening in WoD. Not our world. Even more, it’s their interpretation of WoD. It’s written at the beginning of every video. Just like any ST has their own at their own table.>>98557337Most of the Leopoldites (the speaking ones) came or has roots from Belgium. It’s why they felt betrayed by the contract coming from their home country. They also explicitly stated that what they respect is the authenticity and age of any accord. The one between the Arcanum and SoL is hundreds of years old. Benedicte attested so. And the document said nothing about same sex marriage not being valid, or that only the church has a right to validate any union. Trying to weasel out of their duties would go against their own values, even if they hated it.And concerning Stig, my players made their characters pretty much against the stereotypes of their tribes or borrowing from others. So all in all I see nothing wrong with it. Prioritize fun above all else when you try to entertain others.Hell, Stig was basically running on the “rule of cool”. They said so in the stream.I understand that the current arc isn’t as good as the first. But I feel like it’s exaggerated just to be outraged at HtP
>>98557423>wolfs generating one or more points for every round they're at low health in combat...I feel sorry for the other guy in that fight. Fuck That
>>98557544>Werewolf the Forsaken had you essentially be invincible to anything less than concentrated heavy machine-gun fire or a room full of people mag dumping you if you were in warform from character creation.I think you're conflating editions, that's true of 2e but in 1e they were much weaker.
>>98552026>but more hungry = violent botches is thematically cohesive.The problem people had was less Bestial Failures and more Messy Criticals, as far as I've seen.
>>98557557Never read 1st so I will take your word for it. But in 2nd edition you felt like an invincible monster when players started going in Gauru. W5 makes it very easy to be knocked out of a fight even in Crinos. Along with being rendered useless by running out of rage.
>>98557337The whole Blacklaw family - SoL treaty thing is a bit of a hackneyed plot device. When the Arcanum was being founded, Holmscroft (the founder) sniffed out a Leopold spy and had him removed, despite being happy to include people of any religion. The Arcanists have viewed the Leopoldites as deranged zealots since day one, and in turn, the SoL views the Arcanum as fools and cowards. It's unwieldy. >>98557545>Even more, it’s their interpretation of WoD.My table's WoD is even further from the baseline than theirs, but I'm not going to pretend others have to like it. Especially if I'm fundamentally changing the character of a group, but keeping the name, and not properly introducing or justifying the changes (especially for a series that likes to fall back on explaining lore) isn't good writing. No shit it's their WoD. We also don't have to like it because it's their WoD. I don't expect you guys to love how I backported the Mekhet from Requiem, or decanonized the Kuei-Jin, or vastly shrunk Pentex's size and power to make room for more variety in the Wyrmshit roster. If you think that's neat, good for you. But I'm not entitled to approval because it's my OC.
>>98557545>And the document said nothing about same sex marriage not being validAnon, that's got nothing to do with what he said. The SoL are hardcore catholic. A realistic depiction of them would be anti-sodomite. Whether or not they honor the agreement because of respect for the chapter doc is tangential, they are going to view kitten and markus as subhuman for the entire operation.>Prioritize fun above all else when you try to entertain others.What ypu do at your table is your business anon, but your table does NOT dictate the actual lore of the setting.Tribe fucking matters in the WtA lore, and while some can go against the grain, the vast majority will embrace their tribe's culture.Having the only member of a tribe shown be as un-tribelike as they could possibly be is a very good reason to be pissed.>Stig was basically running on the “rule of cool”.In good writing, that's called a "Deus ex Machina", or an Ass-pull in modern terms.It boardered on making stig a full mary sue character.>But I feel like it’s exaggerated just to be outraged at HtPThis makes it sound like you're a hardcore HtP fan who can't handle people giving the series legitimate criticism.
>>98556503>And, be real, who the fuck was playing a Giovanni?I was sorta in the mood to try one after watching the Godfather recently.
>>98557617>Never read 1st so I will take your word for itWtF 1e was hot garbage. The gauru from was weaker than crinos on top of being time limited. Gifts were nerfed to shit. The lore was all over the place.It was doubly ironic because they made forsaken's accronym "WTF", and that's what every apocalypse fan was asking when forsaken first released. People forget, but Forsaken 1e was about as "well recieved" as W5 was. 2e did some HEAVY lifting.
>>98557624>they are going to view kitten and markus as subhuman for the entire operation.Popanhagen wouldn't have the balls to write that dynamic in todays globohomo internet.As much as thst kind of edgy shit would be a breath of fresh air in current day.
>>98557383>>98557440>>98557444>>98557525Here's my theory of what happened in the writing room.>The long production cycle was making them nervous, especially with other attempts to branch out (like the Half Life thing) flopping. >They began second-guessing their ghoul hunt plotline. Would people really stick around for a three act whodunnit against an antagonist far weaker than the Sabbat from the last arc? >The long production also makes them think more has happened than actually has. They want to "wrap up" the vampire-centric stuff soon.>SpeakerD won't shut up about the umbra splats and NWG isn't containing him the way we'd hoped.>Eventually someone raises the idea of "you know, the popular whodunnit party game is called 'Werewolf'...">They were probably already planning on introducing the main splats in release order. >Decide at some point towards the end of episode 4 to pivot straight into werewolves, which they were probably planning on doing the next arc and foreshadowing but not introducing in this one.>Having to radically pivot like that leads to expected results.>Keep doubling down in a panic.
Never played any Werewolf games so apologies if it's a stupid question, but is it true that werewolves in Crinos and whatever it's called in WtF are too "wolf" to speak coherently or even at all? Not even to shout threats, as redundant as it'd be when they popped their RIPANDTEAR form already?
>>98557704That actually sounds close to what most likely happened.
>>98557746If they're fully in Crinos they can't speak human languages coherently. They could manage single syllable words or maybe "FUCK YOU!" or "KILL YOURSELF" but they're not going to be able to communicate in any human languages.
>>98557652It's hard to believe that they have managed to fuck up werewolf that badly twice. Well, I guess we get to sit this edition out so we aren't going to get fucked a third time. Mage players need some of that personal horror in their lives. >>98557746They can speak in the Garou language (primal tounge) in Crinos easily. But using human language is extremely limited. Think single syllable words like 'Die'
>>98556345True, my source for this is Repairer of Reputations, a fully fictional story by Robert W. Chambers
>>98557782>>98557801And in Forsaken?
>>98557648The Giovanni having a monopoly on mafiosos deeply upsets me.Anons, run or play in a 1930's game where everyone's part of the mob so you can see how every clan fits it.
>>98557814oWoDfags aren't known for their reading comprehension.
>>98557830Al Capone is a literal Ventrue
>>98557830>The Giovanni having a monopoly on mafiosos deeply upsets me.They actually don't, not really. One of the Ventrue clanbooks has a real dago whop ass example character. Honestly, mobster Ventrue are pretty common. It's just that when people bother to remember the Gios exist, Mafioso is one of the three ideas that come to mind.
>>98557814In Forsaken the war form is pure unadulterated focus on the killing hunt. Doing anything other than moving to kill the next threat or victim puts you in danger of losing control entirely. The only communication they can do is to coordinate or ensure the kill.
>>98557830the mafia books points this out at being false and something the giovanni would be very upset with because they are venetian not sicilian! there is like all of the rest of italy between those twoand it also says that most of the actual mafia when it comes to vampires ventrue and lasombra influence is (was) far more common than giovanni
>>98557618>The whole Blacklaw family - SoL treaty thing is a bit of a hackneyed plot device. When the Arcanum was being founded, Holmscroft (the founder) sniffed out a Leopold spy and had him removed, despite being happy to include people of any religion. The Arcanists have viewed the Leopoldites as deranged zealots since day one, and in turn, the SoL views the Arcanum as fools and cowards. It's unwieldy.So? Historical conflicts between the Ventrue and the Brujah and each of those clans mutually disliking the other wouldn't stop a Brujah and a Ventrue from making savvy business deals and maybe even becoming friends. The local, regional story should always trump the general stereotype and ancient history.
Some Brujah thinbloods have a tense negotiation with a local Ventrue. Clan Giovanni members arrive uninvited. Things quickly get out of hand.https://youtube.com/watch?v=VYUKlT04qnc
>>98557669I really don't get the logic of "you can't depict something without endorsing it." Hell, it's not like every single catholic is going to be "burn in hell, fag" about it. Hate the sin, love the sinner is a pretty common stance. Not fully related, but I've found that the direction even BJD went with the SoL was very off base. The Vatican has been liberalizing rapidly in the 21st century due to pressure from NGOs and state actors, as well as the rapid growth of Liberation Theology in Latin America. The idea that they'd embrace and fully endorse a paramilitary witch hunting unit by canonizing their founder as a saint is absolutely not something they'd do. especially when the SoL probably killed John Paul I
>>98556398>renumberESL meme, opinion discarded
>>98557915That's a very disingenuous comparison. Vampire Clans are very fucking old, and unless you're in Russia, the last serious Ventrue - Brujah conflict was in the middle ages. The two have been in the same sect for 500 years. The Arcanum was founded in 1885. A century old agreement would've been made in 1906 at the latest. That's 21 years after the Arcanum became a thing. That's not "ancient history". Benjamin Holmscroft was still alive and in public in 1906, and the organization was still fairly small. Especially with how close Norfolk is to London, this kind of thing isn't going to be easy to hide from the boss. Not to mention, the two have philosophies that are diametrically opposed. The Arcanum seeks to study and comprehend, they only slay the supernatural out of defense, and prefer to just avoid detection in the first place. The Society of Leopold only seeks to understand the monster well enough to kill it effectively and even killed their own when they suggested that some supernaturals could find salvation and redemption in Christ. Even WoD5 made the whole hunter organizations unifying be a recent development. Both the Arcanum and Inquisition books were clear on where the two stood. The Leopoldites still spy on the Arcanum, to limited effect, because they can't trust them. The two may have individual members exchange information, but that's about where it ends, and neither side's superiors would approve. Is such a thing technically possible? Yeah, maybe if you squint hard enough. But it's a very unlikely thing that exists just to facilitate a plot beat better served by a different hunter group.
>>98557455>>98557165>>98557346>>98557116NTA but thanks, I also saw the W20 Pentex Employee handbook being recommended. I personally don't vibe with the furry tribalism and shamanism thing Werewolf is going for despite trying to get into it but absolutely adore the grotesque caricature that is Pentex and its subsidiaries and Fomori, so I'll try to learn more to use them as bad guys in my vampire and mage games.
I don't feel so good...
>>98558463Behold! Nothing of worth!
>>98558463>The writing crew is 2 men, 5 women, and a tzimisce neonate.This explains so much. TTRPG mechanics should be written by autistic men bordering on non-verbal.
>>98558463Viziepop, is that you?
>>98558463The usual suspects at it again.
>>98558463Jesus fucking Christ what happened to Outstar in the last few years?!Is there another goth chick to be the default WoD spokesperson or is there now an empty market? Is this what we're reduced to?!
>>98558773>Jesus fucking Christ what happened to Outstar in the last few years?!She turned into a middle-aged white liberal woman, while before she was just a white liberal woman.
>>98558773found a husband and had a kid
>>98558773Outstar is in that photo? Where?!
>>98557369Thank you for actually telling me where it's from. It's been bothering me a whole lot.
>>98558956Centre left, standing.
>>98556378You are on explosives duty. You can be trusted to not go berserk before planting c4 on the nuclear reactor.
NEW THREAD>>98559312>>98559312>>98559312
>>98557470>that one Grimal public use pic that had them automatically screeching about NSFW not being allowed in the HtP sub Unf. Tight little weeb.
>>98556503>And, be real, who the fuck was playing a Giovanni? Hey I intended to run the Giovanni Chronicles someday, I heard they were pretty good.
>>98558463kill, kill, marry, kill, kill, fuck, kill, fuck
>>98558463
>>98559490How can one have been on the internet for as long as them and still be shocked and offended by Rule 34?
