table of titans edition.Previous thread: >>98585569>HH 3.0 - Complete gofile - All Books:https://gofile.io/d/cnJk0N>Titanicus Compendiumshttps://gofile.io/d/1accdP>New Edition, to a great wailing and gnashing of teeth:https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/setting/warhammer-the-horus-heresy/>Official FAQ/Errata/Downloads:https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/downloads/warhammer-the-horus-heresy/>Thread FAQ (very old, remembers Age of Terra)https://pastebin.com/iUqNrrA8https://pastebin.com/8riDmnhS>30k TACTICA & TIPShttps://pastebin.com/Tm2P4QLphttps://1d6chan.miraheze.org/wiki/Age_of_Darkness-Warhammer_30k/3.0_Tactics/General_Tactics『Adeptus Titanicus and Legions Imperialis』>Official FAQ/Errata/Downloadshttps://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/downloads/legions-imperialis/>List of Titan Legions with Badges and Colourshttps://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/17Jccq0V--SwJifLVLwbisYnQeqLlS2pMSiPbGXp1Brs/htmlview>More listshttps://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/List_of_Titan_Legions>What size magnets do I need?5x1mm>Tacticshttps://1d6chan.miraheze.org/wiki/Adeptus_Titanicus/Tactics>Legions Imperialis Army Builderhttps://legionbuilder.app/TQ: What would you want on to have on an Imperator Titan's cathedral?
I have never seen a thousand sons army Not a finished one at least.
>>98594798You must be new.
>>98594798Nice guys finish last.
>TQ: What would you want on to have on an Imperator Titan's cathedral?A NandosI think the Warmonger has best bastion weapons with 4 anti aircraft mounts and launch rail/landing pad for the Lysander targeting aircraft. Abominatus is pretty good too with some daemonic Gau-8s from brass scorpions and a pair of sawblade insect arms up there.I'm kind of surprised no one online has tried to make their own Abominatus like those scratch built Imperators. the Abominatus is forgotten in a strange way.It's no longer a type of chaos Imperator titan fielded by a few traitor legio's that had an official conversion kit and rules. It's now just a spooky piece of lore about a single daemonic Imperator named Abominatus that lore YouTubers mention, on the same level as the Cacodominus.
Gonna start some custodes to add to my stuff soon. Does the gold spray work as an undercoat? I know the leadbelcher doesn't, because nothing sticks over it.
>>98594951You are using too much primer if so smooth nothing sticks.Spray in shorter bursts or just drybrush the metallic on over a black undercoat, it's way easier.
>>98594966It's only the leadbelcher, and I've heard it's a known problem. But yeah, I'm curious if I need to use work arounds like the metallic over black for gold as well.
>>98594760An Imperator's cathedral would be the tighest Zone Mortalis board that nobody would ever make.Put like a Ten-Forward club where visiting strategists and observers can have drinks while watching the carnage
>>98595323You could use the Imperators datacard as a rough guide for the mapI'd place it low down on the central spire like it was a Wardroom. It would be just back and a deck above the bridge and 2 decks almost directly above the Secutarii guardrooms. No Axiarch is going to travel half the titan just to get some schnapps.
>>98595401Nah, make it one of the towers for a nice 360-ish view.
Give it me straight, is it better to use OPR game structure (true alternating activations) or LIgmas phase based AA? Or did NetEpic get 30k stuff?
>>98595401>pictures you can smell>>98595323>>98595401>>98595421I imagine a goodly part of those towers is ammo feed/gun food crew and gun food storageproblem is if they're 1:285 in the original model than that whole top platform is only about 22 meters wide and from the platform to the top spire it's about same; a very small square cathedralyou're right of course they don't have to be like that and a ZM board with voids between the towers - adding some firing/obs slits - would be bretty gud, massively exaggerating the scale of the model like that one artwork from the book cover where the whole head is taller than an Acastus Knightbut it would also be one hell of a job to model let alone play on that board
>>98595612Just play Titanicus
>>98595651If it wasn't just titans I would
>>98594951I’ve had decent luck with army painter greedy gold spray. Significantly cheaper than retributor gold, and goes on as a deeper amber shade of gold. GW metallics otoh seem to vary wildly in color consistency.
>>98594833>Nice guys finish last.I'm apparently volatile while I try to be "nice" so why am I finishing last? Should I be first place?Is my personality basically an Iron Warrior before, during and after the Horus Heresy?
>>98595637The shells for the Hellstorm are stored in the body of the titan, we know this because Arruken had to disable it's autoloader and seal the feed from the magazine to stop the life eater virus getting inside the Dies IraeThe back mounted spires are a bastion fortress containing troops like a walking Fort Vaux (plus a church for the crew to have mass at in 40k not HH) so I assume it's like that where the normal artillery fortress guns have magazines beside/under them and the rest is for garrisoning troops and their supplies.
Anon in the last thread is right, the 40k land raider moggs the 30k one.
>>98594951Metallic primers tend to clog much faster in my experience, so just beware
>>98594951Black undercoat, brown zenithal. Trust me.
>>98595690Just buy Vallejo or any other, GW paint pots suck.
>>98594951Yes but you need to shake well and often
>>98595936Their paints suck too. Dunno what is happening, but even dark paints like nuln oil or abbadon black need ten fucking layers to get a proper covering coat.
>>98596239They must have changed the formula, you can also check out Army Painter, my go to for washes until I started making my own.
Weren't they supposed to be doing a new book series about the Scouring? There was a novel by Chris Wraight earlier in the year. What happened to that?
>>98596239I find Abaddon black a very good black. Nuln oil is a washwhich younusually do not need multiple layers. Also the GW pots are stupid, but with proper hanling youncan avoid spilling the paint.Maybe you lack some painting skills?
Help me decide between Cyclothrathe and Xana for my mech
>>98595612Limps order system sucks ass. OPR order and activation system is unironically better. Never considered using just the orders superimposed over limp. It's not a serious game to begin with so why not.
In its original rules the Abominatus couldn't carry troops but this seems an unfair trade off as all it has extra from a normal Imperator is an inferno gun that shoots blood and a close combat weapon. Who says a daemonically possessed titan can't carry troops? Sure the leg bastions might have a waterfall of blood with no source or end and the starboard guardroom has a door leading to the red room but other daemon engines have troops/crew inside..Makes more sense to me if I axe the main fortress artillery battery which doesn't feel fluffy (and isn't even WYSIWiggydiggy on the original model. the central main battery spire is replaced with an unholy stone pagoda which is a sanctified khornate temple) replace it with another khornate secondary weapon and give the titan the 20 model transport cap it should have. Also I love the idea of dorsal sally vents that let jumppack units combat drop from the fortress..12th Legion Assault Marines and Harpax swarming from it like flying monkeys
>>98596344Ashes of the Imperium released earlier this year, yes. Presumably the series is still ongoing, it’s only been a few months. On top of that, 40k just went into a new edition, so most of GW’s attention has been on their cash cow.
>>98596830And nuking the firstborn, expect more 40k refugees into the heresy
>>98594760>TQ: What would you want on to have on an Imperator Titan's cathedral?I wouldnt have a cathedral. I would have a fortress with more guns on top. Maybe a hangar for launching figher craft.
Any of you gamers tried attaching a top mounted weapon to a knight magaera? I'm planning on using a recast carapace and shoulders for a kitbashed knight crusader warlord using a knight desecrator chassis. Pic is my planned colour scheme in case anyone was curious.
>>98596503I went with Cyclothrathe, because they are such bastards, and I think Draykavac is cool.
Haven't played in a while, checking FAQs. I see flyers can still be obscured and block interceptor and still are feast or famine glorified tokens. Anyone house rule flyers to make more sense yet?
>>98597590Why would I, this is the best flyers have ever been. Actually useful AND not taking up table space when there's no reason they should
>>98597590>Complains the most realistic flyers rules ever seen in warhammer don't make senseGo and stay go.
>>98597590>. I see flyers can still be obscured and block interceptoYes? Why wouldnt they?>and still are feast or famine glorified tokens.In the same way every model is a glorified token. Because thats literally what they are, tokens/game pieces.
>>98595612Epic armageddon has alternating activation that's contained within a single phase, the other phases are stuff like>pregame troop placing>teleporting troops>arriving spacecrafts>orbital drops and landings>rallying troopsand quite fast, especially considering other than rallying troops the above examples might happen in a single turn and then it's just AA, if they are even brought into lists.
>>98597617Ok fine, low and zippy through buildings I can hand-waive. >TokensI mean in the sense you don't need the physical model like the rest of the game, just an oval base because they don't stay on the battlefield. The model isn't needed when you can determine facing from base cross sections. Why lug the model on and off the table in a single turn at all? If it's a transport with front weapons, just measure and you've done all the actual work, no need to even use a base.This changes if a player has an AA tarantula funny enough because of its special rules.>>98597616>Realism always translates perfectly in table top games>>98597600>best flyers have ever beenThis can't be a serious post. There's no automatic reserves, you can't modify the roll without a specific named character, the roll worsens after each success. You could see a plane zero(0) times in a 4 round game. Just coming in once is a waste of a Fire Raptors points. Twice and it might be worth it. First edition was the best they were because they were functional.
>NEW PLASTIC THUNDERHAWK>Ha, got you, it's just terrain.This fucking company...
>>98597470Wish they'd do more with the spider theme. It can't just be their logo randomly
>>98597710One of the most based things they've done all year
>>98597697>I mean in the sense you don't need the physical model like the rest of the gameYou do for LoS. Which is all you ever need physical models for really. >just measure and you've done all the actual work, no need to even use a baseThis is true for all models. You dont NEED a model for a land raider, just represent its spacial template by measuring and youre fine, maybe use a base!The models are, beyond any hobbying value, just game tokens to make it so you dont need to measure and keep track of those measurements every time, because you have a model there. But in theory you could play an entire game of warhammer with nothing but bases and tokens and a whole lot of remembering size characteristics. >There's no automatic reserves, you can't modify the roll without a specific named character, the roll worsens after each success>aircraft have finite petrolOkay? But also, yes, flyers have downsides. They also have upsdies, they require reactions to even engage, which combined with their absolutely unparalleled mobility means theyre nearly invincible unless your opponent runs a LOT of anti air or has a xiphon/some other interceptor. They get to play by different rules, but those rules are not inherently better than normal rules, theyre just different. This doesent change that flyers are incredibly valuable this edition.
>>98597710>It's 40k terrainAlready more than what 40kfags deserve.
>>98597840It's okay, you can't actually use it in 40k since it doesn't fit on the cardboard terrain footprints.
>>98597745>This is true for all modelsI dont know if you're deliberately being obtuse or not. It is not like other models that stay on during your opponents turn. There is not need to physically represent the model in a majority of use cases as it won't be seen by anything and LoS from it is obvious. Every other unit always has an opportunity to be seen based on your opponents choices, flyers do not. So flyers aren't the best they've ever been? Because that's what you're walking back from. Their value is based off how well you can roll a 3+ at least once out of 4 turns. They can be nasty; an eagle full of termis(or whatever melee lawnmower unit) will very likely connect and delete something... if it arrives in time to matter. Which is probably the best use case of a flyer. So we're back to feast or famine. Xiphons requires list tailoring to consider because they're awful unless they interdict and count as not moved thanks to being a reaction so their lascannons do real damage. A Fire Raptor is so many points to risk only one run into majority of bad reserve rolls. Flyers need to be able to stay on to risk damage for more output and come in automatically at least turn 4 if they haven't once yet. There should never be a risk, no matter how small, that a unit doesn't even get to be deployed.
>>98597846Some of it might fit on the bigger parts, it wouldn't really work though since youre supposed to be able to place models anywhere inside the template that isnt considered solid, which is specified. You'd be working pretty hard to try and use it.
>>98597713I thought it was a tick.
>>98597848>Being this butt mad because he can't roll a single 3+ in four turnsStick to 40k kiddo, that game is right up your alley. Reserve rolls don't even exist there.
>>98597848>as it won't be seen by anythingUnless it wants to shoot or avoid being shot. But once again, you can apply that for literally all models. If the basilisk stays behind cover all game, does it even have a model? >flyers do not.Unless they have AA, interceptors, or return fire against it or whatever. >So flyers aren't the best they've ever been?In what way? In terms of raw power I dont know, the early flyer rules based on the nonsense circus that was 6e/7e were probably stronger, even if the current crop arent exactly weak. In terms of implementation? Yes, this is the best flyers have ever been. >Their value is based off how well you can roll a 3+ at least once out of 4 turns.Dice? In my dice game? Say it aint so!Their value is also based on how well you can roll those 3+ to hit with their weapons too! That is how dice work, it is a dice game. >if it arrives in time to matterYes, thats how deep strike (which is essentially what flyers have) works. Flyers pay for their incredible mobility and ability to pick "where" they engage the enemy by being unreliable as to "when" they engage the enemy. >because they're awful unless they interdictIntercept, interdiction is the tactical/despoiler one. But no, even without their AA capacity (which is definetly the focus of the unit), xiphons just have a lot of firepower for their cost and a lot of mobility with which they can exploit that firepower. Anything with rear armor has very good reason to fear them. Theyre also, quite importatly, dirt cheap. A xiphon costs around as much as a fairly stripped down predator in terms of points.>A Fire Raptor is so many points to risk only one run into majority of bad reserve rolls.Every unit in the game is at the mercy of "bad rolls". A melta kratos is at the mercy of the rolls of its big cannon. Bad unit I guess, buff plz. >Flyers need to be able to stay on to risk damage for more output and come in automatically at least turnThey dont.
>>98597848>There should never be a risk, no matter how small, that a unit doesn't even get to be deployed.Anon thats call reserves, thats how reserves works. If you fucked your deep strike rolls all game your deep strike guys wont/wouldnt come on. Thats the inherent risk of the system (alongside "they can just mishap and die, but thats gone away outsides of ZM). You trade the power of "I can teleport my guys where I want" for the reliability of knowing when theyre coming on or that theyre even guaranteed to come on at all.
>>98597848NTA but IMO flyers are the best they have ever been.IMO there is only one thing they need to change to areal reserves. I think they should start on a 4+ but for each turn you do not bring them on, either by failing or simply holding it, the chance for them to come on decreases by 1, but each time you bring it on it goes up by one, the reaosn i say this is it fucking sucks that you have to gamble a massive point sink on a 4+ in some cases. Maybe even make this a rule just for transports
>>98597848>There should never be a risk, no matter how small, that a unit doesn't even get to be deployed.Holy fucking newfag kill yourself, reserve deployments have always been risky to use. Next thing you're going to say we need to bring back deep strike charging
>>98597713Maybe in ligma we'll get those mobile adsecularis conversion machines that are mentioned in one of the black books. If they wanted to they could have easily done legion specific equivalents for mech forge worlds with all the stuff that's in the fluff even ignoring the various organzations like the legio cybernetica, the magisterium, etc...
>>98597846>>98597879Wait so it isn't even compatible with whatever abomination the current 40k terrain rules are? That's hilarious. If GW proceeds to release a HH exclusive plastic thunderhawk and legends it in 40k they'd earn my respect.
>>98597932>ligma>getting anything interesting
>>98597926My personal tweak would be that the roll to bring them on only gets worse if they come on. If you kept them in reserves it should stay what it was.
>>98597940thats what it currently is anon.
>>98597942I might need to reread it, but iirc it gets worse if you pass. So if you roll a 3+ turn 1, but decide you want to hold off on bringing the thing on, it becomes a 4+ next turn anyways.
>>98597922>>98597930>>98597905>Dice? In my dice game? Say it aint so!I'm with that anon on the flyer issue. You can't both pay for a unit with points, then roll to see if you get to use it every turn, with the roll getting worse and worse.Out land units have to roll for reserves, that's fine. But if we had to roll for reserves EVERY turn, and said roll got worse and worse, I would revolt. I'm not Ruinstorm demons, pal!I would keep aircraft as they are, but make leaving airspace optional rather than mandatory. Then you can roll for reserves for them again.And let regular Reserve modifications work on Air Reserves, for crying out loud. Unnecessarily convoluted.
>>98597955I mean, why the fuck would you roll then decides to not bring it on even if you pass? You first decide if you are going to attempt to bring it on, then roll. You dont roll then decide if you want to bring it on.
>>98597975It also does not help there is nothing in the game, aside from a special UM character because of course, that actually modifies or helps the areal reserve role. Everyone has to just raw dog air reserves.
>>98597934It is technically usable. But in what would be considered a normal game using the full rules it would be almost impossible to use it.
>>98597936>implying ligma isn't the more likely game to get knight/titan sized stuff that's new and niche
>>98597989I thought you always rolled by default.
>>98597998DESU i love how GW just cant fucking win when it comes to terrain rules, in both 40k and HH, i dont think any one in my gaming group uses the actually terrain rules. We all just still use Trule LoS, 50% rule for getting cover or not. The whole "You can only see 3" in" rule in HH is just outright ignored in our group.
For me, it's the VIII Legion.
>>98597992Yeah whatever affects reserves should affect air reserves.This is the bad thing of this edition: they build up an improved system...then make things NOT engage with said new system.Create the Duel system, then keep all sergeants out unless you Prime them up.Make aircraft use reserves a lot, then keep air reserves separate from the ones that can affect regular Reserves Rebuild the vehicle damage system, then make Penetrating hits not interact with it.
>>98597975Thank you, the amount of people that are just ok with a model in a game risking never getting used is alarming. I understand mishaps in old editions happened but GWs sensibilities have changed and flyers are a strange outlier now on usage. There were ways to mitigate or eliminate mishaps too, so you still had agency. A flat 3+ on a reserve roll strips all the choice of weighing a bad scatter.Pay the points, use the model. If you lose it because of an opponents actions/your fuck up that is completely different from the game state saying you don't get to use it. If my opponents storm eagle full of XYZ never showed up I would feel bad. I wouldn't sneer at them and make a back handed comment about running out of petrol. That would suck, and both sides should recognize it as sucking.>All the other postsI'm not responding point for point because interceptor is so easily dodged without AA tarantulas. I say this from an opponent interaction standpoint. You might get snap fire return fire depending on mission. You'll never shoot a deredeo with a flyer for any reason.I won't argue the flyers are too abstracted physically point because I forgot what board I'm on.
>>98597975>You can't both pay for a unit with points, then roll to see if you get to use it every turn, with the roll getting worse and worse.Why not? You absolutely can do that, its actually pretty cool, makes for a very unique unit design space and lets flyers be balanced through different means than the norm. Flyers are, generally speaking, massively undercosted for what they do as a unit and super hard to kill (they literally dont exist during the opponents turn and can only be harmed via reactions). The tradeoff for that is that they naturally "self terminate" over time via their worsening reserves. >land units dont do thatBut heres the thing, you COULD do that. Imagine some sort of deep strike shooting unit that gets picked up at the end of turn. Well done, you have invented an infantry unit that operates under the flyer paradigm. Itd be a bit hard to explain for marines, probably better suited for demons, but theres no reason that unit couldnt exist or even be very good.
>>98598002OH shit you are right, fair enough, My group just ignored that because honestly, its fucking stupid. The way we do it is>Pick a model in reserve, you want to come in>Roll to make the reserve test>Passes? You come on the board, Fails? nothing happens.
>>98598032>, the amount of people that are just ok with a model in a game risking never getting used is alarmingWhy wouldnt they be? And can you present anything actually wrong with that? >appened but GWs sensibilities have changedBack in ZM baby!
>>98598003The current 40k terrain rules are fine and just use generic terrain areas with a few modifiers based on the type of terrain on the areas. The problem is that for the standard mode of play they tell you exactly what the terrain areas shapes must be, where they must be placed, and what approximate things must be placed on them, so there's very little room for a big chunk of thunderhawk, or a wrecked tank, water feature or really anything that isn't random scatter, pipes, fences of ruin corners. It wouldn't matter if this was just event play, but they decided this was just standard.
>>98598043So i atually dont hate the terrain or areas, i always called it the black box terrain where its "Are you in the box? Ok you get cover of xyz" I thin kthe board layouts though are fucking stupid.
>>98598040Some people just want to play with the expensive models they buy, assemble, and paint by at least deploying them once on the battlefield. Does that sound reasonable? Will you always roll four 1s and never deploy it. No, obviously. Should it be a possiblity? No one should be punished at the list building stage, no matter how rare. Get punished by how you deploy something, not if you can.
>>98598040>Why wouldnt they be? And can you present anything actually wrong with that?I mean when a chunk of your army is literally up in teh air of if it even interacts with the game is not a good system. Its not a case of "Oh your LR got popped, and then your cata terminators got gunned down as they waddled across the board" Shit like that happens.vsOh your areal reserves with your unit in the transport? Yeah it just never fucking showed up, so you just had upwards of a 700 point disadvantage.Like shit give us even an option to do a "Danger zone" Drop where we can come in to drop them off but they do so as an emergency disembark and need to roll to see if the model dies when they exit.
>>98598053Yeah there's nothing wrong with defined terrain areas, 90% of wargames use them. What's annoying is being Hitler about the shape they have to be, where they have to go and what has to be on the area.
>>98598055>Get punished by how you deploy something, not if you can.Damn, trvth nvke. >inb4 list building is gameplay
>>98598032>If my opponents storm eagle full of XYZ never showed up I would feel bad. I wouldn't sneer at them and make a back handed comment about running out of petrol.I diagnose you as gay. If someone takes abbadon in a terminator deathstar and then mishaps and has them all die thats funny and also an inherent risk he knew when he made that list. If someone takes a flyer deathstar and then never shows up because he cant roll 3+ in a game about rolling 3+? Thats funny and also an inherent risk of the strategy he chose to engage in (also technically the case with reserves, you can just fail to DS in even with a MOS). The risk is fine and healthy for the game, it helps prevent these strategies from being overly powerful. >interceptor is so easily dodged without AA tarantulasAnon interceptor is the thing the xiphon is, and the xiphon comes on, moves, then shoots. You are not dodging it. >AA tarantulasActually not necessary. Just use the lascannons. >>98598055What next, are you going to start crying that someone bought their fancy new land raider or superheavy and it got killed before it got to do anything? Should we add a little baby-shield around special characters in case someone really wanted to use their new glup shitto and he got killed by some gunfire before he did anything? "sorry anon, timmy spent a lot of money on that tank so it doesent get to die until it kills something">Should it be a possiblity?Yes. >No one should be punished at the list building stageWrong, but also unrelated. >Get punished by how you deploy something, not if you can.Anon, thats literally the thing. You cannot punish a flyer or DS unit for how they deploy, thats the strength of the option. The downside is that they arent guaranteed when or even if they can deploy. Its a perfectly fair trade-off.
>>98598078>AA tarantulas>Actually not necessary. Just use the lascannons.DESU you know what unit is a surprisingly reliable form of anti air? Fucking siege terminators with Auto canons.
>>98598043Lmao sure hope nobody wanted to use their nachmund fronteris terrain ever again.
>>98595612Correct answers:>>98595651>>98597624
>>98598068>with the game is not a good system.Go on, say why. >Oh your areal reserves with your unit in the transport? Yeah it just never fucking showed up, so you just had upwards of a 700 point disadvantage.Yea, thats a risk you knew about when you chose to put 700pts in aerial reserves. It was a risk you accepted for the power of having 700pts your opponent could not proactively neutralize before it did something. >Like shit give us even an option to do a "Danger zone" Drop where we can come in to drop them off but they do so as an emergency disembark and need to roll to see if the model dies when they exit.Why? Can you provide a good reason? or is it just "waaaaa I rolled badly on reserves and that feels bad". How many more points are you willing to pay for the reliability? Or should that reliability come out of the flyers mobility budget? A unit in reserves can fail to show up in the same way that a model with gets hot can kill itself, the risk is there to balance power elsewhere. You want to lose the risk? How much power are you willing to trade for it. >>98598082Autocannons are basically anti-everything really. Although they suffer from the same issue all reactive fire does vs flyers, the flyer can just deploy outside of their LoS. The tarantula and xiphon get to fire AFTER the flyer moves, so theyre more useful there.
>>98598102>flyer can just deploy outside of their LoS.Flyers always count as being in LoS.
>>98598078>Anon interceptor is the thing the xiphon is, and the xiphon comes on, moves, then shoots. You are not dodging it.No, that's a combat air patrol. The xiphon has the interceptor trait.>LascannonsFrom what? Nothing with them on the board will be eligible when the flyer deploys on the board edge behind terrain for interceptor. Maybe a return fire on 5+ off a sponsor if you're tank hunting. AA tarantulas shoot in the movement phase after the flyer has moved so they can't hide, btw.I diagnose you as nogames with terminal tastlet syndrome.
>>98598033>makes for a very unique unit design spaceYeah uniquely bad lmao>[Flyers] literally dont exist during the opponents turn and can only be harmed via reactionsGee, sounds like that's the very problem with them. Just let them exist, bro. I'm not even being mandatory here - you could keep pulling them out of the fight. Just let the rest of us have the choice of keeping them around if we want to.No. Gotta be mandatory pull out every time, lest the enemy otherwise interact with the flyer! The horror!>Imagine some sort of deep strike shooting unit that gets picked up at the end of turn.Well done, you just invented Suicide Devastators that bounce away and avoid the consequences of their overextending. I am thankful you aren't writing the rules.
>>98598106They don't, actually. That rule never made it to 3.0 surprisingly.
>>98598106wait nvm im thinking of something else disregard this.
>>98598043Other than making people buy ruin corners and whatever season pass terrain set is current I wonder what the idea is here. Doesn't this replace the L shaped ruin problem with a "literally nothing on the board" problem?
>>98598115>you just invented Suicide Devastators that bounce away and avoid the consequences of their overextendingJump shoot jump Crisis suits. Anon is saying JSJ Crisis would be a good thing!
>>98598106I think youre confusing it with "flyers never block LoS". Flyers need LoS to shoot and be shot just like any other model. >>98598110>The xiphon has the interceptor trait.So "the thing the xiphon is">From what?Tarantulas? The unit we were talking about. >return fire on a 5+You return fire and whatnot at flyers on normal BS, its only the original deployment reaction that you snapshoot unless you have AA.
>>98598129>>98598115>you just invented Suicide Devastators that bounce away and avoid the consequences of their overextendingBegins having war flash backs of warp spiders in 7th ed 40k.
>>98598115>Gee, sounds like that's the very problem with themYou have yet to articulate how thats a problem. >I'm not even being mandatory here - you could keep pulling them out of the fight. Just let the rest of us have the choice of keeping them around if we want to.You do understand that a unit cant be balanced both ways, right? Either theyre built to remain on the field turn round or they arent. Also: You do understand that the very nature of how flyers were ALWAYS balanced is that they were hard to interact with, right? Whether its the current system of "require reactions to shoot" or the old system of "only hit on 6+ by anything without skyfire". Flyers were always, by necessity, built around the fact that the enemy cant touch them unless they have very specific answers (which usually destroy flyers easily). >Well done, you just invented Suicide Devastators that bounce away and avoid the consequences of their overextending. I am thankful you aren't writing the rules.So which is it, are flyers to weak they need fixed and buffed or are flyers so OP that when their principles are applied to infantry the unit is too egreegious to consider? But hey, at least you conceded the point that "degrading mandatory DS" is clearly not a dealbreaker.
>>98598102>Go on, say why.Nta, but you've been told why. It is dumb to build up a system, then make things not engage with said system.>It was a risk you accepted for the power of having 700pts your opponent could not proactively neutralize before it did something.Demonstrably false: back in 2.0 I put 10 Seekers and outflanked them in a Land Raider. A bit shy of 500 pts."Better keep them in reserves do the enemy doesn't shoot them before they get to do anything" I thought.On arrival, the enemy intercepted the Land Raider and glanced it to death with Auto HSS. And that was good - 350 pts of HSS SHOULD be able to stop 220 pts of Land Raider.Your enemy CAN do something about the 700 pts deathstar that is airdropping right between your guns. Their transport doesn't need to teleport away every single turn. Shouldn't be mandatory, is all we're asking.https://youtu.be/DaJ06YqytYM?si=hVsHXcaujptjKjUm
>>98598141>Begins having war flash backs of warp spiders in 7th ed 40k.You see, that's actually a good thing because you haven't articulated the problem yet, bro ;^)
>>98598115>lest the enemy otherwise interact with the flyer! The horror!Yea man, that Av11 100pts vehicle was made to be interacted with. So true dude! You should make your own edition!Do you not understand WHY flyers are hard to interact with? How that lets them remain a survivable unit without having to be survivable through the normal means, preserving the unit fantasy? Would you rather they be "interactible" like other vehicles? And you balance their durability through armor values and hull points? Do you long for the days of AV 13 xiphons?
The more I've read complaints about the game throughout the editions in here, the more I've become aware that nobody here actually plays the game and/or can't fucking read. It's nothing but faggots who just enjoy being angry and whining about shit.
>>98598171>You do understand that the very nature of how flyers were ALWAYS balanced is that they were hard to interact with, right?You do understand people have hated them for that very same reason, right? Current air missions let them choose between the safety of zooming vs the utility of strafing speed.The best design is when players are given a choice. Let it be a choice.>at least you conceded the point that "degrading mandatory DS" is clearly not a dealbreaker.I have asserted that the problem isn't repeated degrading reserves - it is the very fact that they are mandatory.Learn to read before you try arguing.
>>98598201Oh yeah, the problem of having dudes pop out from behind an LOS wall, unload on your ass, then jump right back over so you cant even shoot them or follow up. That shit was the reaosn i just stayed away from ruins.
>>98598189>It is dumb to build up a system, then make things not engage with said system.It is good to preserve systems granularity and independence. >Demonstrably falseWhich part? You refusing to accept the risk? Your opponent having a way to proactively deal with your unit in reserves?>On arrival, the enemy intercepted the Land Raider and glanced it to death with Auto HSSThats REACTIVE. They responded to you deploying your land raider like a retard and shot it, they did not destroy the land raider before you had the chance to fuck up its positioning. You had the initiative there. Which is the power of reserves. There exist other systems (reactions) to help mitigate this power, but those systems are not on their own enough (certainly not unless you overtune them like 2e reaction spam) to balance that element of guaranteed initiative, which is why reserves has built in unreliability.
>>98598219>It's nothing but faggots who just enjoy being angry and whining about shit.You must be new to the hobby because thats litearlly a corner stone of this hobby.GamingModeling.Bitching about the first two. Now either sit down shut up, or start bitching about something with the rest of us.
>>98598210If it dies, it dies. And it will be the player's choice. If it's hard to hit, or if it isn't, it will be the player's choice.Bro really revamps the Snapshot System, then makes flyers not exist outside reactions lmao
>>98598226>You do understand people have hated them for that very same reason, right?People hated flyers back when they were new because they were wildly overtuned. >The best design is when players are given a choiceLmao. No. Choice is nice where appropriate, there are times when it is not. >I have asserted that the problem isn't repeated degrading reservesYou actually havent. You started this entire thing bitching and moaning about how the reserves get worse which means the unit is only likely to come on a few times and thats super weak. >it is the very fact that they are mandatory.Which is an element also present in that hypothetical unit, so it too is clearly not a dealbreaker.
>>98598241>they did not destroy the land raider before you had the chance to fuck up its positioningThey DID destroy the Land Raider before it could be positioned properly. It shows you never outflanked anything.But that is a good thing: it was a risk I took and the enemy wasn't powerless against it.So don't come with the excuse of things having to be this way because they would be unbalanced otherwise, because they aren't.
>>98598254>If it's hard to hit, or if it isn't, it will be the player's choice.If its hard to hit or it isnt is down to the flyer rules, which are written in a specific way to provide them with a specific level of durability. >Bro really revamps the Snapshot System, then makes flyers not exist outside reactions lmaoNo shit, do you think flyers were the only things to interact with the snapshot system?
>>98598267>>I have asserted that the problem isn't repeated degrading reserves>You actually haventYour education is over. Crayons down, play.
>>98598279>They DID destroy the Land Raider before it could be positioned properly.Yea, because YOU placed it where it could be seen and shot. You choose where the models come on dipshit, your opponent didnt engage the mind control beam to make you play like an ape. You had the initiative, you used the initiative poorly, your opponent reacted accordingly.
>>98598245I'm bitching about the bitching. It's bitch-ception.
>>98598293>>98597975>But if we had to roll for reserves EVERY turn, and said roll got worse and worse, I would revoltLiterally in the post responded to with that hypothetical unit. Do you think everyone else is as retarded as you, to where lies this poor would work for you?
>>98598314Well im bitching about you bitch about bitching!
If old edition sensibilities good (unit dies without use/doesn't see table somehow) then why can't old editions sensibilities good (automatic eventual reserves rolls) be true? Why can't old editions sensibilities good (interact with opponents units on your own turn) be true? Why does precedent only matter when it's to add suffering and not retain engagement?
>>98598324It's a human centipede of bitching.
>>98598396>If old edition sensibilities good (unit dies without use/doesn't see table somehow) then why can't old editions sensibilities good (automatic eventual reserves rolls) be true?Because those are both balancing factors, and if power is added through other means the eventual reliability ceases to be necessary. Any other obvious questions?>Why can't old editions sensibilities good (interact with opponents units on your own turn) be true?Because reactions are a superior system. >Why does precedent only matter when it's to add suffering and not retain engagement?Because your idea of "suffering" is asinine and childish, comparable to a timmy crying that someone used removal on his big creature, or the faggots whining about counterspell.
>>98597936Not counting Draykavac and Scoria they had the first official dark mech shit, I'd call that pretty interesting.
>>98598690Decimator? Blood Slaughterer? Brass scorpion?
>>98598700Those are dark mech like a rhino is technically a mechanicum vehicle but I see where you're coming from.
>>98598135>Flyers need LoS to shoot and be shot just like any other model.mmm, arguably blocking LoS is a Terrain effect
>>98599113Arguably. But I think thats a silly line of thouht to take. At best you could maybe argue that flyers ignore the more abstracted "terrain" rules, but I see no way to spin it into "flyers dont need tlos" at the very least.
>>98598690The dark mech constructs in LI are really cool, I'd love to have enough to make a sub-covenant that can fight alongside my Audax hounds as support troops from but I've heard they are a more pricey faction than marines or auxillia Filling the 2 knight slots would be cool too but Audax doesn't have knight allies and neither does Sarum. I also have an STL for 6mm chaos androids I'd love to proxy as something but idk what.
>>98597451It's possible but not trivial. You'll need to do a bit of scratchbuilding, but there's plenty of space and pre-marked guide points.
>>98599271I know they already remade that into the Deredeo but god damn that'd be a fun ultra-thallax design
>>98599167I think if you come in and claim building X is high enough to protect you from Interceptor, then you're prevented from firing through things the same height or tallerbut also it's a little weird when you're doing an insertion or extraction if you come down on top of a point, and you're claiming nobody can shoot you because the point where your mission happens is in coverreally it should be decided as part of each combat assignment
>>98599669What, the World Eaters dreadnought? The Deredeo wishes it had drip like that https://youtu.be/ss10Ivg4PMYIt took me an embarrassing amount of time to realise the Visions of Heresy artwork of Contemptors looks different because they are concept art for what a Contemptor would look like extrapolated from the original epic dreadnaught since Space Marine basically was the Horus Heresy back then.
>>98599986Damn that art looks a lot better than the buttplug model they actually produced
>>98600032I wonder if there's a slab-fronted STL out there.
>>98598043I keep seeing people say that you can put anything on the templates, but you clearly can't, right? It very clearly wants scatter (yellow) in specific places, and a more substantial thing (green) in others and there seems to not be a lot of wiggle room for the size and shape those things could be except in the bits with a single green piece in the center. Are they just lying it make it seem less bad?
Are nu-Scouts freakishly huge? Debating if I want to grab one and turn into a pathfinder.
man, lupercal green has god awful coverage, how's this supposed to be a base paint? anyone know a similar color that's nicer to work with? is incubi darkness any better, or does another brand have a better paint in a similar shade of dark blue-green? I'm trying to find the right scheme for my sons of horus, but this doesn't seem like a paint I wanna have to deal with for all my dudes
>>98600274yeah, they're huge
>>98600274>>98600407I'd just find a (recast) Telion and convert him.
>>98598043Wew. I read the 11ed rules right up in this months WD. They made it sound like the rules would let you run varied fluffy maps and narrative objectives instead of a generic ruined L shaped housing project. I should have remembered that we live in hell and GW platforming fun narrative missions over tournament play would never happen. I assume GW will sell every terrain piece in every map lest you do something silly like make your own thematic terrain?
>>98598055okay so sit down and listen attentively and maybe someone will explain to you the concept of opportunity cost
>>98600463The rules DO let you do that. The missions released as example missions just have defined terrain setups.
>>98594893I built half of an Abominatus.
>>98600407>>98600447Dont use mini compare, that site so so bad. NuScouts are nearly identical in height to MKII, like down to 0.1mm depending on pose. NuScouts are thick because GW marine armor on the models can't actually fit a realistically proportioned body.
Requesting scans of the last two Ligma books, assuming I haven't missed any: Liber Strategia and Ruin of the Salamanders
>>98600784>because GW marine armor on the models can't actually fit a realistically proportioned body.Marines aren't supposed to have human proportions retard
>>98600817They're just not suppose to have the average marinefag's proportions.
>>98600784I'll just leave this here and let you ladies fight over the differences.
>>98600895I wonder if you could fix these scouts by just shaving down the bottoms of the boots and maybe hollow out the neck join a little and push the head further down
>>98600447I plan to convert that necromunda marine.
>>98600447
>>98594798I don't see how you can paint dust bro....
>>98600895they are too big, they would look ok if you have tortuga sized marines tho
>>98600816hah ha wat a story Mark
>>98600944it would be cruel to reverse looksmaxx the chads into manlets
>>98601758Go back to /40kg/ retard
>>98601766It's a mogg or be mogged world kiddo, even in 30k
>wanna buy the Astartes shotgun upgrade sprue>local store doesn’t have it>next closest store is the GW store>”That’s not a shelf item, but we can web order it for you,”>go to next closest store, and they have itSome of these decisions for “shelf items” feel arbitrary.
I like the worldbuilding for the Forge World in Titanicus. Forge Worlds being factories, factories, factories and maybe the entire planet is an endless factory is a little tiring. Orestes is largely turned over to industry but most of the planet's population isn't part of the mechanicus directly (it has an an imperial governor and typical imperial hive cities). The nomadic prospecting/mining subsits and squatter cities around the hives are good details.This map will be deeply helpful for my heresy campaign set on a forge aligned world with a similar split of Imperial and mechanicum facilities and people.
>>98601817yeah, GW isnt known for its intelligences desu
>>98601817buy recon shotgun bits from chang instead
Rate my Ruinstorm Daemon army /hhg/.
>>986019835/10
>>98601983>/tttt/ bakes a cake for /tg/
That Tzeentch cohort for Solar Auxilia isn't enough for me, when are they gonna release a proper psyker unit for Auxilia armies?
>Dorn has the Aetos Dios>Pert has the Tormentor>Jaghatai has the SojutsuDo you ever think about the lost Primarchs possibly having their own personal vehicles? I've thought about the 11th piloting his own void fighter and being space Maverick.
Was it in black book one that had generic astartes legion organization layout? How many is astartes in one company? 100?
>>98602199100 per company, five companies per battalion, two battalions per chapter.
>finally GW are uploading some high quality digital pages of the black books, this might be better than the scans>open one>it's pixelated to hell to keep file size downGee thanks, GW.
>>98602223Thank you, I'm about 25 men short of a company then.
>>98602235Praise scanon.
>>98602235You expect competence? Our only hope for high res digital copies is that an anon finds all the Black Books and then uses those professional scanners to create PDFs.
I swear I remember there were scans of Book 4 - Conquest that were digital and not fucking photos with light glare and the guy's hand in them. Might've been in the old Mega folder...
>>98602387dunno about digital version and light glare, but...>guy's handfuck you now I can't unsee it
>>98602387>>98602397Mine has a few pages with glare but no hands and overall pretty good.It's currently uploading to catbox but it's fucking SLOW
>>98602439Screw catbox try this instead.https://vikingfile.com/f/gB903bYw6G#The Horus Heresy Book 4
>>98601843>Hive Autium
>>98602459Damn nigga, these are some clean scans. How'd you manage that?
>>98602502I've just had it saved for years, probably from here.
It's a shame that there's no rules for dominus or destrier chassis in 30k
>>98602530I don't mind them missing in 30k. Goofy ass nu-40k design slop.
>>98602530I don't like the Dominus; I like some of the weapons and I like the idea of putting those legs on a Questoris Heavy, but I don't like the package dealthe Destrier is weirdly neat for a modern 40k invention, and even though old Knights didn't have jump jets back in the 90s, Eldar titans did so it's not that out of the question if we think a Thunderhawk can flystill waiting for this lil guy to show up tho, that's what I rrilly rrilly warnt
>>98602530Destrier is just a discount Cerastus, the Dominus is by far the ugliest piece of shit knight they ever made
>>98601983I love it.
>>98602263Yes and no. It's not meant to be a precise size, at the smallest squads sizes possible it's 97 marines without counting anything in the asset part so it's not precisely 100.
>>9860184Omg I love it>Orestes is largely turned over to industry but most of the planet's population isn't part of the mechanicus directly (it has an an imperial governor and typical imperial hive cities)I've found world building is easier in 40k. 30k is a bit too nomadic to linger on one system - seems everyone is an expeditionary fleet reaching for Terra!
>>98601983Unironically that's a Great Crusade enemy. The Emperor's Children dunked on Petrosapiens / Crystal Gems on an ice planet next to a warp gate
>>98602130You don't need lost primarchs for vehicles. We know Jaghatai rode on top of a Land Raider, and Vulkan had a personal Rhino. Probably wore it more than embark in it.
>>98602763Oh my god it's gone! D:
>>98602805What you've replied with has been gone for 16 years. You need to let go, anon.
>>98602815Not-letting-go_gang.exe
>>98601983bad/10The idea is really cool, but theres piss poor readability.
>>98602572>>98602594I agree that the dominus looks dogshit which is why I don't have one, I still think it would be nice to have the option though, just for visual variety sake
>>98602792what book was that?
>>98594760>What would you want on to have on an Imperator Titan's cathedral?100+ Vindicare.
Rare Redloss fan art
>>98602594>Dominus is by far the ugliest piece of shit knight they ever madeThat's not a knight asterius though?
>>98603322Looks nowhere near depressed and traumatised enough to be a real Dark Angel legionnaire.
>>98603322Looks like a fag, fitting.
>>98603323Correct, it isn't.
>>98603387Fuck off furry
Why do women want to self insert as Ahriman's gf?
>>98603430First time I've heard of it. Usually women a thirsting after Kurze.
>>98594893My attempt to draw it. That is a wild titan
>>98603387KEK>>98603421SEETHE
>>98594893>It's now just a spooky piece of lore about a single daemonic Imperator named AbominatusI could have sworn that's what it always was.
>>98603065The very first one! Horus Heresy 1: Betrayal has such a great world building
>>98603557Propa orky
>>98603948Yes very orky in the face. I wonder what blanche was on when he was told to draw titans
>>98604087The good shit. RIP Blance
One more>>98604117Yeah I will miss the surreal flavor he brought into the setting
>>98604166Damn he just 360 noscoped someone with his left arm
Does anyone know the comparison size between the plastic mkIII & mkvi? i got resin squad of mkvi from a friend but they look a little bigger.
>>98604166I'm sorry, does his gun's giant claw bayonet have its own little gun turrets on it?!
>>98604549you can see that very clearly, Anon
>>98604166I choose to believe this is a Nemesis Emperor Titan. What do you reckon the left gun arm supposed to be?
>>98602572There's a Dominus to Acastus conversion kit out there that is very tempting.
>>98604667Probably titan equivalent of a shotgun, to knock on the door of a fortification. Then it pokes the claw into the hole and breachers deploy via the internal staircase?
>>98603323The Knight Warden got the biggest downgrade.
>>98604797>Auto canons under the main gunsOk this is fucking epic.
>>98604797Isn't the acastus like 4 inches taller?
>>98605081Scale creep affects us all.
>>98605229Oh god Macca's autism is spreading
>>98605229Makes me wonder what a malcador-ified arquitor would look like.
Were the Orks during the Great Crusade/Horus Heresy any different from 40K apart from clan cultures not being a thing yet?
>Playing a game>5 man tss with meltaguns run around a corner and shoot the rear of one of my Rhinos>Four shots miss, only the one guy outside melta range hits and takes off a mere 3 HP>Rhino turns around, drives through the tss, does the maximum possible wounds and kills three marines with meltaguns>Next turn my tartaros command squad suffers a mere 5 wounds from autocannons>Fail all 5 armour savesThe dice gods are nothing if not fickle.
>>98605229
>>98605288Klan culture was a thing, that shit is genetically encoded into Orks. There wasn't any meaningful difference.
>>98605081looks like the body shape is the change, not the rules>>98604797babby acastus has a certain charm but at that point you're just saying gundam kits are hard to build
>>98605288bigger
>>98605339>He doesn't know that 40k clan cultures are canonically the result of their defeats against marines during the GCI envy your ignorance, unironically. I wish i never read the Beast series
>>98605387Threadly reminder that BL isn't cannon.
>>98605394yes, BL are books, not cannons
>>98605288They had penises.
>>98605406They still got those, all the smut of Orks raping Eldar told me so
>>98605394>cannonI'm so tired of illiterates.
>>98605394but BL does have really nice Cannons, how does that even work anon!
>>98605442what can you expect from a furry
>>98605486I'm a Loyalist but I still want vengeance for Prospero
>>98605387I haven't read the beast series, so maybe I'm wrong, but isn't the war of the beast just when the imperium identified the existence of the ork clans? pretty sure the clans are implied to be a genetic thing built into the species by the old ones
>>98605491This post was fact checked by real Prosperine patriots
>>98605502I haven't read it either but everything I hear about it I can just tell it's complete slop and full of unnecessary retcons and lore rape.
>>98605394BL is mortar
>>98605491Should have put the book down, Prosperine boy. Now excuse me, I have some bones to rattle and some pig guts to read.
>>98605486typical low IQ furry, destroying books of knowledge because being smart scares you.
>>98605502IIRC, it's a mix of both. The Imperium fought orks since the start, and it had already lots of experience dealing with them by the time of the HH.We can assume that some cultures already existed, but others, or parts of them didn't seem ro appear until later. The books mention checkered patterns and bits of b&W armour being clearly inspired by the Luna Wolves (that also could have been Dan Abneet making everything about fucking Horus Rising, too)Orks have too many human-like aspects to be a coincidence. So my headcanon is that orks absorb part of their enemies' culture as part of their continuos development. I mean, look at Freeboters with pirate hats... i doubt that the Old Ones wore those.
>>98605562>So my headcanon is that orks absorb part of their enemies' cultureAll groups absorb bits of culture from each other when they have continuous contact. I'm sure humans also have bits of culture from the Orks. My headcanon for example is that Melta weapons were named by Orks and the human soldiers just ended up adopting it as slang sometime during the Age of Strife and it stuck because illiterate tech-barbarians assume that it has a common root with the word Plasma.
>>98605562>I mean, look at Freeboters with pirate hats... i doubt that the Old Ones wore those.Counterpoint, what fucking m25-35 era human is either? That was 24000 years after pirates
>>98605357>babby acastus has a certain charm but at that point you're just saying gundam kits are hard to buildEh? Building an Acastus is tricky enough. The assembly is fine, but you basically have to resculpt and polish several sections. Perks of working with resin.
>>98605652DAoT humans had theme park planets like Fenris for Vikingboos.Some of them larping as space pirates is not out of the question
>>98603430They don't, that's a biological man. It has XY genes even if it's multilated it's penis
>>98601983Old bait
>>98601843BASED TITANICUS BASEDNEVER FORGET LORD GEARHEARTS SLAUGHTER OF THREE ENEMY TITANS AT THE TITAN STEPS
>>98605562Horus Rising was pretty cool but it had nothing to do with the Orks i just recently finished listening to it then book 2 made me sad, 1000 Sons are neat desu.
>>98605652well, humans wear them in the 41st millennium, so I guess the fashion pops up now and again
>>98605251>>98605229Huh? A double earthshaker on an Arquitor's hull? Oooh because it's a backwards Sicaran just like the Minotaur is also back to front.But what's this Macca guy got to do with it?Wait...the Minotaur looks like a Dracosan, which I heard is a turretless Malcador?
>>98605442If books are cannon, municipalities can pass Ordnances :^)
>>98605601>My headcanon for example is that Melta weapons were named by Orks"Melta" is indeed an ork-sounding word (curse of the OG authors being bri'ish), but then why Orks have no meltas themselves? It's all super killy shoota this, and mega speshull dakka that.
>>98606113>but then why Orks have no meltas themselves?That is a good question, I guess because it's not as fun to kill things with Melta as with weapons that make loud booming dakka noises or explosions.
>>98606113>>98606123Orks used to have meltas in rogue trader
>>98606123>it's not as fun to kill things with MeltaIt is Very fun to kill things with melta>>98606133It is nothing short of a crime that the close quarters faction doesn't have access to the close quarters heavy weapon
>>98606221GW has a long list of crimes to answer for.
>>98605562In one of The Beast books, a Dread who fought in the GC recognizes that proto-Goffs are wearing white ceramite looted from Luna Wolves (and black ceramite presumably from Catulans and Justaerin)
The War in Heaven was about the Luna Wolvest. Dan Abnett
>>98606249That makes no fucking sense. The Luna Wolves changed their colours hundreds of years in the past, and the orks they fought that we know of got eradicated. In what fucking way could goff orks, hundreds of years later, get their hands on luna wolves ceramite, never mind even recognise its significance?!
>>98606113>but then why Orks have no meltas themselves?Why dont they havey heavy bolters or autocannons? Why dont they have lascannons?Orks are, generally, not very good with energy weapons. They dont have very many and the ones they have tend to be super unreliable even by their standards. Orks are good with basic kinetic dakka, maybe basic combustibles.
>>98606263You joke, but he actually almost made the Dark Age of Technology about Ollanius Persson's gand and the Alpha Legion.
>>98606266>Why dont they have autocannons?Uh, excuse you?
>>98606292Those are more like stubbers in form and function (iirc). But yes, orks have "kinetic ordnance guns", they do not have "autocannons" or "bolters" or whatever else. They have their own slapdash technological style which does not cleanly map to most imperial equivalents.The actual glaring omission for orks is shotguns. They should have loads of those.
>>98606303>Those are more like stubbersAutocannons ARE stubbers, anon. S7 autoguns
>>98606303>They have their own slapdash technological style which does not cleanly map to most imperial equivalents.True. It would be nice if they had maybe not literally a melta, but at least an equivalent. Even eldar and tau have theirs!>The actual glaring omission for orks is shotguns. They should have loads of those.Also yes. Only since 8E they got a "boombstick" at last
>>98606320>Even eldar and tau have theirs!>evenEldar and tau actually have quite a lot of overlapping technology with the imperium. Theirs tends to be better, but they share many weapons concepts because ultimately they all employ science in some form and therefore will find the same general concepts that work.Eldar have fucking chainswords. >but at least an equivalentI feel like they probably do/did somewhere? But sure, they could use something like that being a bit more prominent. Maybe an alt/special weapon for burnas when they get their eventual refresh.
>>98606311They aren't. Autocannons are a real classification, and refer to rapid-firing, single barrel cannons firing large, often explosive shells, with longer effective range and higher stopping power than machine guns.
>>98606331>Maybe an alt/special weapon for burnas>Orks flamelta PyroclastsBeing green sounds promising!
>>98606344No, I mean in 30/40k. They literally appear in the Autoguns section
>>98606344Oooh you mean irl autocannons. Yeah I haven't heard Orks using any special shells; their big calibers are just big dumb bullets.Though I hear their Meks are masters of esoteric energy weapons, tellyportas, energy fields and apparently plasma. Wew.
>>98606352That's an abstraction as a result of games rules mechanics. The demolisher cannon is listed under artillery, whilst it has never been described as being used like artillery. There have been in-universe mentions of autocannons firing mass-reactive ammunition too.It's all very arbitrary decisions made by British gunlets.
Non-metallic red TSons just feel right.
Don't tell me the Techpriest Auxilia's servitors (which could wield special guns) became Echidnax servoautomata. Those things only get to shoot bolters.In fact where's Scyllax's flamers and rotor guns?! D:
>>98606264One of The Beast is from Ullanor
>>98606430cute blood angels
What if I delivered 20 Thralls to an objective. Maybe with one Techpriest attached. Would that be a viable tactic?>It requires a Land Raider-class heavy transport Rephrasing: Would it be a SANE tactic?Can Thralls be used in an offensive way at all?
>>98606430They look good but it's too hard to get a red that doesn't look like blood angels.
>>9860650220 thralls will shoot a tactical squad to death 100% of the time assuming you have all game to do it and nobody shoots them back.
>>98606527>assuming you have all game to do it20 BS5 Thralls kill a single marine per turn, anon. They'd need 2.5 full games to kill a single squad
>>98606566That's quitter talk
>>98606430anyone have the other legions for this? especially DG?
>>98606566Thralls are not there to kill, silly billy
Did tzeentch have his eye(s) in any other legion besides the twinks to steal from
>>98606598If you believe boys lovers, every legion has some traitors, so there's probably a little tzeenchissies everywhere too
>>98606566>>98606569Oooh Mitra Locks (2x shots). But I am loathe to Guide them, as Feedback will simply kill 5/6 of the unit.Akin to 108 self-inflicted bolter shots!!>>98606592They should be able to do something besides tanking hits.
>>98606766>They should be able to do something besides tanking hits.They can suicide bomb too
>>98606509It's incredibly easy actually, since there are in fact more than three(classic orangey BAngles, modern bloody Blood Angels, Word Bearers) easily distinguishable shades of red.
>>98606822NTA, but most word bearers I've seen just look like blood angels. Easy for thousands too, if they let their red get too matte or too orange
>>98603322oh no, horny japanese artist have found 30k againbueno
Is there a Dreadnought that’s the most flavorful for Iron Warriors or should I just buy whatever has the word Siege on it and call it a day?
>>98607087They're all fitting, get them all.
>>98607087All patterns of dread fit the IW, except saturnine, those don't fit any legion.You should also hunt down a recast of the old forgeworld iron warriors contemptor chassis.
>>98606786>They can suicide bomb tooActually they can't: Thralls only get to be targeted with Omega Protocols (aka Self Detonate) if they are ALREADY under a Cybertheurgic status, meaning you need a second Techpriest or Magos.Also, the unit must ALREADY be in combat, meaning it has to be an ongoing combat from the previous turn, because cybertheurgy CANNOT be cast AFTER a charge, only before - this also means it will only ever happen in turn 3 (of fucking 4) at earliest, because no way your Thralls get into combat turn 1.This ALSO means you need a third Techpriest for reviving Thralls, as Omega Protocols requires the Target to be in (ongoing) combat, but casters of Cybertheurgy cannot be themselves locked in combat...and Eternal Servitude Battlesmith can only activate when attached to a unit.If you fulfill these requirements (3 Techpriests for Turn 3 at earliest), the unit will explode...inflicting ~33 S6 hits on your own Techpriest, killing him.Congrats: you just used 335 pts to kill ONE 100 pts Tactical squad at Turn 3. It fucking sucks.
>>98607436So how would you hoserule it? Remove the "already under a Cybertheurgic status" requirement? The phase sequencing is a bit tricky. Points are another matter.
>>98606766>They should be able to do something besides tanking hits.No they are bullet sponges
>>98601983I still like them
>>98607193I actually don’t mind the Saturine pattern suits and armor, though it’s hard to imagine anyone other than the Salamanders having them. Feels like a Legion specific unit that they tried to sell as a universal kit.
>>98606303>they do not have "autocannons" or "bolters" or whatever else.weeeeeellllI mean they had those things until 3E so
>>98606266>Why dont they have lascannons?zapcannons are not a thing anymore?
>>98606430GW should've really avoided giving 3 legions a red scheme
>>98607613It fits with the faux-historical aspect. History is full of weird shit like that.
>>98607613Black too; the DA, RG and IH.
>>98606266Listen here orks have zapp guns which are excellent, your bigotry and xenophobia will not be tolerated. You will not be missed.
Another day, same question.Anyone have a functioning repository for the AT books? Since the main thread link is KIA.
>>98607451Eternal Servitude is just making them more annoying; they'll be under Fortify by the time they're locked in combat (unless you really didn't see it coming) via the same guy; T6 6++ unit rebuilding itself (until your Start Phase)the problem is getting Omega Protocols off, but you just plan ahead and have the second tech priest leave; the first guy is there to buff Leadership and invoke Fortify, the second guy sets the dynamite however, so technically has to leave prior to that Movement phase since he can only Cybertheurgy in his own turn, that means either you get charged via Advanced Reaction (which actually helps you as long as the second tech-priest is out of the unit and you got Fortify off) or the second tech-priest also has to charge, so that he can invoke while doing so, as long as he does so after the thralls make contact with the enemy unitagainst your average blender elites it's probably a dumb idea but it's not the worst thing against most line units, particularly if you had two guys with battlesmith2+1 making zombies for a turn, because each zombo is 2 hits, they'll wound most models on 2+ (and they're still only 1/12 to take a wound off a sattie, which is pretty good)it does cost you the first tech-priest at least (and if it doesn't work your second guy is charging through the bloodstorm with a surprised emoji on his screen) but there's a reasonable chance of a big unit, pre-combat, taking out the enemy to the point that the second tech-priest can mop up, so to speak; technically the enemy unit isn't even locked in combat by the time the second guy reaches them, so there's that, and the only change I would suggest is making it so *friendly* models removed as casualties don't count toward combat resolution - obviously if some raging three-armed psycho scuttles toward you through a fine red mist that used to be 30 thralls and your own squad, you're going to shit somebody's pants, but as it stands they don't count
>>9860766768 74 74 70 73 3A 2F 2F 67 6F 66 69 6C 65 2E 69 6F 2F 64 2F 48 45 30 46 41 6C 43 73Should be ready in an hour my dog ass internet will be the bane of my existence
>>98607731Cheers mate,Though I’m not familiar with the numbers provided.
>>98606072You literally copied his conversion why are you pretending?
>>98607731Or it will change the link at after uploading68 74 74 70 73 3A 2F 2F 67 6F 66 69 6C 65 2E 69 6F 2F 64 2F 4F 43 74 33 6E 73 71 63
>>98607749Hex
>>98607785Ahh right, feel stupid for asking. Rough morning.
>>98607613I actually love the fact that they did this. If you look at real life sports teams and country flags etc it's apparently very common that groups of people end up choosing/wearing the same colors.So many country flags have red white and blue and the same goes for football teams. Makes a lot of sense to me that there's 3 red legions, 3 black legions, 3 blue legions. Lots of Grey/metallic/ceramic (practical). Bright colors (green, yellow and purple) reserved for oddball legions. It makes the universe feel more grounded and less like a top-down designed toy sales pitch (which you get more of in 40k where there's a space marine chapter for every color in the citadel paint range).
>>98607837What colors would you make the other legions anyway? They already covered all the acceptable colors.
>>98607882All of them should be grey. Mechanicus standard grey with legion logo on one pauldron and squad markings on the other.
>>98608018based pvrist
>>98607882There's stuff like orange, brown, pink, silver, gold and bronze. A lot of 40k chapters initially had crazy flashy stuff like tiger camo, green/purple, leopard prints, black/white etc, but that was the 80s/90s and peak toy aesthetic era.The 30l legion colors vs 40k chapter colors are I think a good way to differentiate the two brands and emphasise that 30k is geared towards the more historically minded customer.
How do you play Word Bearers? Do you try to maximize their horde trait? Is it a huge loss if you don't?
>>98608214You mix possessed marines, traitor militia, ruinstorm daemons and daemon engines into a list, and go out having a blast and spreading the Word.
>>98608296I was thinking something slightly more early heresy, might as well be playing 40k otherwise.
>>98608354Ironically enough, it has become very hard to make such a Word Bearer list in 40k, never mind making it capable of winning a game.
>>98608380That's just sad.
>>98608296Did we ever get generic possessed for the other legions in 30k?
>>98608855No. Closest we got is giving units Malefic.
>>98608214Master of Descent and Phraetusmaxxing
>>98608876I checked and we got rules for them in Malevolence back in 1st ed in the ruinstorm list.
>>98607451THIS MOTHER FUCKER IS OUT HERE STEALING MY LEGION!
>>98606509Theres a slight pinkish hue here I think, that helps.
>>98608354There is no such thing as "early heresy" word bearers, they've been corrupted for YEARS before the heresy. At istvaan V they were already mucking about with dark rituals, depraved sacrifices, corrupt monsters, and possessed marines.
>>98607606I thought those were like, really big tesla cannons or something. Not laser beams but closer to lightning cannons from the mechanicus.
>>98608380Has it? Cultists are staple objective campers, possessed and demon engines are generally quite good too. Feels like it should work fine. Just grab some possessed, a defiler, cultists to sit on an objective and then idk whatever chaos marine units are good (terminators and chosen?)
>>986083809th edition is still the most fun I've ever had playing word bearers, combining demons and possessed and cultists and overlapping their synergies
>>98607486Because of their stats (BS2 S3 T5) they look like Ork Boyz to me, rather than Grots (WS2 BS3 S2 T2) who are also meant to take hits but can't actually survive them.Thralls can.I just need to find a use for a unit that can be a bullet sponge but can't actually deal any damage. Dang I wish Feedback was an auto Toughness test rather than an auto wound.They really gave Lacrymaerta a Cybertheurgic rite, then essentially left Thralls out of it! Unless you have three Techpriests, are already engaged in melee and are willing to lose one of them, ofc.
>>98600274As other anons have said, get a Telion from somewhere.
>>98607750You think I am that guy, an idiot with an agenda. I'm just an unrelated idiot with no agenda. And I also just realized the Minotaur and the Dracosan look really similar.But the double gun Arquitor looks nice
>>98609077there was a transition period between mostly great crusade with some gal vorbak and literal chaos marines though
>>98607882ORANGE ORANGE ORANGE >>98608056>brown, pink, silver, gold and bronze.Can't, actually. Brown is orange with 0 contrast (Orange is technically Neon Brown).Pink is for girls.Silver is shiny Grey, which is already taken by many factions (Iron Warriors, Grey Legions, Knights Errant, Grey Knights, etc.).Gold is already taken by Custodes, and it's a very pretentious color. You cannot be more pretentious than Sanguinary Guard or Emperor's Children.Bronze I'd just shiny brown.
>>98609125I could believe two different people came to combine an arquitor and minotour independently. I don't believe they've make the literal same conversion complete with unrelated additions.
>>98609141No there wasn't. They were literally always like that, they just hid it until the heresy began. So if you aren't playing 50 years pre HH great crusade games, you're playing word bearers not imperial heralds.
>>98609170>they just hid it until the heresy beganWell there you go
>>98609188Keyword before retard: they dropped the mask at istvaan
>>98608855In 1e yes, you had a "vanilla" possessed unit which seemed quite good, like mini/more flexible GVB. They did not make the transition to 2e, and the closest 3e added was malefic as a prime benefit. Maybe theyll come in a journal but not holding my breath. You should just homebrew some if youre interested (or use mine, and tell me how they go so I can tweak it).
>>98609201Here's a WB from Calth. Doesn't look like a chaos marine to me.
>>98609225Heres a guy they had before even Istvaan. They didnt all get the insane chaos trim overnight, but they were all pretty much drowning in the koolaid
>>98605229Now, wheres a good place to get two earthshakers to make one for myself? That things rather nice looking. Although the dozers on the back look dumb.
>>98609225>doesn't look like a chaos marine >literally covered in demonic runes, occult text, and skulls hanging from their wargear Kill yourself
>>98609225Is this bait?
>>98609225Did you miss these ones?
>>98609286>>98609300>>98609302Skulls are kosher in the imperium.
>>98607682>they'll be under Fortify by the time they're locked in combat (unless you really didn't see it coming)Fortify is night useless on Thralls; you lessen the chance of the enemy to kill them during his turn only to guarantee their demise at the start of your next turn.So which one is it? Are Thralls there to last or are they sacrificial?If you use any Cybertheurgy on Thralls it's because you already don't see them surviving that turn, so you might as well spend them instead of letting them go to waste. That, I can understand.>Having the second Techpriest leave prior to that movement phaseWhen a unit with multiple characters disembarks, can you have one of those characters leave the unit as they do so? Maybe you could do it that way? Otherwise, having a nearby caster already in a different unit seems easier.All in all, it would be nice if Omega didn't require a prior Cybertheurgy. You'd do away with all of that jumping-through-hoops.As if S6 AP- was so scary to begin with. 200 pts of exploding Thralls kills one Tactical squad.
>>98609166Now I know how Techpriests feel when others modify the sacred blueprints. Feels heretical, even if it does make sense.
>>98609225He looks super evil MS13 bro what are you talking about
>>98609488looks like an avarge dude with access to weapons in eastern europ. Not much evil.
>>98609488The smurfs made him what he is.
>>98609107Thralls can't even work as keepaway units, now that vehicles simply go through squads and enemies can charge out of Rhinos
>>98609302God this art is so fucking good. Shame we never got WB cataphractii like that.In fact, any ideas for a WB catapractii praetor conversion? I have the 10 models from the 2.0 starter set so I might as well do something with them.I was considering the SoH justaerin one but that's a lot of eyes and runes I need to get rid of.
>>98609029Nah, his is green, white, and red. The Legio Heineken. Yours is green, black, white, and red. The Legio... Palestine?
Wait, I just noticed GW redid the audiobooks of the first 3 HH books.Why though? Toby Longworth did an excellent work narrating them.
>>98609961Huh odd
>>98602792If someone made a crystal army, and took care to make it look decent, it would be a 10 for me.
>>98606430They objectively look good but still too much like BA. If they had more white armor panels it would look more like TS.
>>98606430Metallic red TSons feels even better though.
>>98609961The originals are still on audible
>>98609225I see what you mean, it doesn't have the CSM corruption stylings. I think everyone is arguing form/function and missing each others points. WB had chaos influence for a long time prior, yes, but you could field a very not mutated just scary paint job WB list and call it crusade era or sooner. Just say they had to liberate a key planet and move on and either didn't need the spooky shit or kept it detached from the main force. There was a period where the outside looking in appeared to have transitioned from wackos to chaos.
>>98609201>they dropped the mask at istvaannta, but they also waited until Calth or Signus Prime.The point is that WB were not yet the same as in 40k, just look at their character minis.You can still say their armour pattern, and they don't have as much trim.
>>98609961Look, it's two Paragon blades :^)What's the point of giving Praetors the option of chainswords and power swords if none of those are viable? We should just get rid of those options and optimize their datasheets.It's the tried-and-true 40k Tournament way! You guys love it >:^)
>>98610217>Look, it's two Paragon blades :^)It sort of has to be, because main character chainswords do not function like chainswords.
>>98609166gee I wonder what happens if you google minotaur conversions
