As a 90s and early 2000s cartoon fanatic, what has happened to all the originality and creativity when it comes to work. Especially the idea of combining super science with the mystic arts. My three prime examples that I'm pulling from is thunder the barbarian (boomerang, Boomeraction), gargoyles from Disney(toon Disney) The real adventures of Jonny quest (cartoon network). Whatever happened of being able to use both strange science and magical mythology. Has the creatives became too cautious while the audience has become too jaded?
Nothing stopping you from using it for your own games.
>>98706862>Has the creatives became too cautious while the audience has become too jaded?The creatives were driven out of the industry 15 years ago and all that's left are company bootlickers and diversity hires. This applies to almost every industry from cartoons to Hollywood, videogames, card games, and tabletops.
>>98706862Genre conventions mean people don't like mixing stuff like that.
>>98706911A handful of setting still try, but ironically many of them have been declawed in their modern adaptations because they were too "edgy", which is a codeword faggots use for anything that was legitimately provocative.
>>98706901No wonder why I feel that everything is slowly decaying.
>>98706911That's bullshit, we are stuck in between people saying something is too weird or something ain't original enough. It's the FUCKING Hugo award all over again. I swear at this point everything is going to be lame gay females. Actually when are the lesbian feminist genes supposed to die out along with the gays genes. It's not like they're actually breeding. All the body positive and that acceptance people are killing over due to high cholesterol and heart attacks.
What is this genre called?
>>98706862The internet and it's usage grew and now it's harder and harder to make anything that's not depressingly derivative. The key is to not care.
>>98707008>That's bullshitNo it isn't. People don't like different, they like comfort. If this was not true then elves and humans would not be by far the most popular races with a heavy does of scorn for anything unusual.
>>98706862Hobbies don't have imaginations, people do. Hope this helps, retard.
>>98706862My originality and creativity are pristine. But it is limited to my group. There were people whose creativity was mass-distributed...I guess it DEIed.
>>98706862I just play RIFTS
>>98706862Why did you come to /tg/ to complain about /co/?
>>98707033I call it science fantasy, it's kind of on the spectrum between science fiction and fantasy. science fiction and fantasy.
>>98706862Everyone creative was run out of the industry for being racist or whatever.
>>98707133People don't know what they fucking want until they have it. And by the time they get old and set in their ways they think everybody should be just like them.
>>98707180You know exactly the fuck I was talking about.You can't have a hobby without people. Just how you can't have a community without somebody trying to turn it into an HOA.
>>98707306
>>98706862To be fair the creative limit of the 80s/90s was to take the same 4 guys and 1 girl (optional) formula from the ninja turtles and repeat it with a different look. >leader/everyman>nerd/genius>big/mean/tough guy>funny/fat/dumb guy>girlThis is every iconic team from the era, from the mighty ducks, A-team, gargoyles, transformers, biker mice, goonies etc.
>originality and creativity >cartoons to sell toys to little boyscome on man
>>98706862Propaganda is the death of art.
>>98706930Shit, that looks so fucking cool!
>>98707033Fantasy.Any world that contains impossible (or improbable to an effective degree) aspects automatically becomes fantasy, because the rest of the world, its functions, and progression of events have to work in consideration of those impossible things.
>>98707916The five-man-band is older than the Ninja Turtles.
>>98707916I hate to break it to you, gargoyle started with seven and sometimes went to eight or nine main cast members.
>>98707962Be honest with yourself after Reagan economics, what didn't have a Saturday morning cartoon and a toy line.
>>98707962Fuck you, tell me that dinosaurs and Cadillacs were not cool.
>>98706862>what has happened to all the originality and creativity when it comes to work. Creative inbreeding.Basically: All of the people who made old books/games/shows people like are people that had a diverse background and interests. They are being replaced by people whose background and interest is "Liking thing".
>>98707008Genes don't work that way.
>>98708402This is by design. In the 80s and 90s there was a huge push for unionization in the comics industry because the artists and writers saw themselves as working professionals and the comics they worked on as just another job and expected to be compensated accordingly. The owners responded by firing and blacklisting anyone who expressed pro-labor sentiments and replacing them with a wave of younger talent who were lifelong fans who had an emotional attachment to the brand.Incidentally, this is why railworkers are so hostile to anybody from "trainspotting" culture trying to get a job in the business. It's one of the few industries that still has a strong labor culture and nobody wants the industry to be overrun by scabs who care more about the trains than the people who keep them running.Autistic nerds are poison to organized labor. I don't really believe all the antivax and other autism conspiracy theories, I very much doubt the scientific knowledge to deliberately cause it exists. But if it were possible, it would definitely be in the interest of big corporations to do it.
>>98708488To be fair, I don't think it's JUST autism. But yes, you are correct. It's probably at it's most blatant in comic books but you can see it in all kinds of other industries. It's why I tend to be somewhat wary of "Hire the fans!" arguments and why I think a lot of franchises are stuck in creative dead loops.
>>98708488That's kind of a one-sided argument for human dignity."We don't have to care about you; but you have to care about us." That's like forum moderators doing favors for publishing consortiums. Gatekeeping creative outlets to control or suppress competition. Because god forbid the internet spawn a culture that can, and will, work for free.
>>98708035What's your point? Competition breeds innovation, in order to squeeze toy dollars out of impressionable eight-year-olds toy companies gave us a renaissance in children's entertainment that peaked in the mid-nineties and has yet to be surpassed. Some legitimately great shows directly resulted from the deregulation of childrens cartoons.What do we have, now? Zombie Spongebob and latest Calarts beanmouth genderqueer meme show?
>>98708999You don't have to care about them. You are just a useless tool and make media worse. Railworkers and other people like that are above all practically correct.
>>98709091The rennesaince died a very quick death. The current hellscape is the fault of reagan ecenomics and your precious competition
>>98706901What happened 15 years ago?
>>98706862> What has happened to the imagination and creativity of our hobbiesWestern cultural references have been essentially the same since the end of the cold war. Combing fantastical idea with new technology idea only works if you have an audience with historical and mythological references as part of their educational background, which we no longer have, and technological advancement that is relevant to those same people, which we don't have and haven't really since the smart phone. >gargoyls and sort of british things + sky scrapers and cybertech Sure, cool idea. No kid currently knows what a gargoyle is and technological integration is so totalized at such an early age having a metal arm is nothing. This has been the case for an entire generation. This combines poorly with the lack of lived and varied experiences, in general, and for whoever is making the art. Rather than having a rich life of interesting growth and development they have very structured and focused on profit creation art. Visual, written, whatever. Same format. This is streamlined to a simplified audience where most media is made to be consumed as a background feature. There's more, overall enshitification is a fairly complex multi directional attack on being to reduce everything and everyone to a standardized profit paste. Collect supplies and hardcopy now, digital access will be getting cut out in parts over the next decade as it floods with ai generated derivatives. Make the things you want to see, you won't get much of it from corporate.
Most fantasy fiction is incestuous and filled with just copying shit thoughtlessly and going through the motions of what is expected.
>>98709507>The rennesaince died a very quick deathHe-Man and the Masters of the Universe (1983)G.I. Joe: A Real American Hero (1983)Dungeons & Dragons (1983)Transformers (1984)Thundercats (1985)Jem (1985)The Real Ghostbusters (1986)DuckTales (1987)C.O.P.S. (1988)Chip 'n Dale: Rescue Rangers (1989)Talespin (1990)Tiny Toon Adventures (1990)Batman: the Animated Series (1992)X-Men (1992) SWAT Kats (1993)Animaniacs (1993)Exosquad (1993)Spider-Man (1994)Gargoyles (1994)Freakazoid! (1995)Pinky and the Brain (1995)The Tick (1996)And many, many more, over the course of more than a decade. But you're probably right, guy who only knows that Ronald Reagan is bad and everything wrong with the world is his fault, the deregulation of children's programming undertaken by the FTC from 1980 and left unchecked until the Children's Television Act of 1990 reimposed limitations on advertisements didn't have anything to do with the establishment or enduring popularity of '80s and '90s media franchises. Things just happen and the bad things are only ever the result of an historical villain.
>>98709618This, including the things people refuse to call fantasy.
>>98707962I would argue that's actually part of why the fantasy feels bit homogenized - if everyone has plays in single standard setting, with standard set of assumptions, it is easier to target them all with single product.Also, AFAIK one of reasons TSR failed was because they made _so many_ splatbooks, that they shattered their own customer base. Homogenization prevents this.
>>98709091A common criticism of the entertainment industry in general going back to the 70s or more was that you could walk into a business meeting in any major studio and not know what kind of business they were actually doing. It was all talk about "demographic trends", "buying patterns" and "market forecasts" rather than actually, you know, entertaining people. Still, they at least had to occasionally throw money at something new to keep their customers' interest if the numbers went down. It was soulless, but a passive, banal kind of soullessness. This is no longer the case. Studio executives no longer act like they're in high finance. They act like they're in big pharma. They use words like "dopamine", "reward mechanisms", "conditioning". The endgame isn't to endlessly chase the audience's desires, it's to mold them into ideal consumers until it's impossible for their brains to conceptualize anything else.
>>98706862... Nothing happened to it. It's literally more popular and more common than ever before.I'm so fucking sick of this "the West has fallen because muh 1980s cartoons are no longer the latest, hottest youth media" horse shit.It's your responsibility to manage your own cultural exposure. If you've insulated yourself within a toxic microcosm, that's YOUR fault, dude.Go touch some grass, talk to people you don't normally talk to and learn something you didn't know before. In the process, you'll be exposed to new media. And, with time, you'll become aware of how much more there is out there. Among which is literally the stuff you're lamenting.It's still here. It's BY FAR the most overwhelmingly common way of doing settings in literally every kind of media from TV shows and comic books to video games and tabletop games. Your ignorance is sickening, only matched by the likelihood of you being a particularly effective troll attempting to normalize toxic cynicism.
>>98709556>What happened 15 years ago?Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion
>>98707008Homosexuality is brought about by trauma.
>>98709787>didn't have anything to do with the establishment or enduring popularity of '80s and '90s media franchises. 80's and 90's entertainment refusal to die is one of the big problems with modern media. Cartoons like Transformers, Jem, He-Man, and TMNT were by most objective measures trash. Low quality scripts, animation, and ideas.Even during the 90's when cartoons started getting good again. A lot of the peak was based on franchises that already existed for decades.
>>98710295Are you aware that Gen Z and Alpha are actively looking back at 80's, 90's and even earlier media and saying that the old stuff is better than the new stuff? Budgets are up but quality and creativity are tanking.>>98710530The 80's and 90's were filled with a mix of returning 50s, 60's and 70's stuff along with a fair number of new IPs and foreign imports.>Cartoons like Transformers, Jem, He-Man, and TMNT were by most objective measures trash.They were objectively cheap but not trash. The true trash ended up forgotten and discarded.
>>98706862This takes me back…
>>98707685No. Communicate precisely or not at all. Do not reply to this post.
>>98710642>and even earlier mediaEarlier media was higher quality. That's a different era than the 80s and 90s wave of shit.
>>98710824A lot of 50s, 60s and 70s stuff was even shittier than the stuff from the 80s and 90s. You want to say Superfriends (73~74) is better than something like Batman the Animated Series ('92~95)? You don't really have a leg to stand on.
>>98710295Now everything is gay multiracial Globo Homo propaganda, and people like you love it
>>98710885Animation was hardly all bad then. I'll take something like Ralph Baski's lord of the ring over Transformers any day.
>>98707962Yes, retard.
>>98711166>Everything is objectively worse now>And that’s how I like itCase and point
>>98707008Lesbians and fa*gs don't have to be lame, (see Camille Paglia, J.C. Leyendecker, and ) What we have is mediocre left-wing queer people who piggyback off of each other to get jobs on account of having diversity pokemon points. I'm tired of their bullshit. It's everywhere.
>>98711152Ralph Baski's Lord of the Rings and Wizards were movie scale animation which means that it should be compared to Transformers: the Movie or 80s Japanese OVAs rather than animation for TV. I'm not arguing that the 50s through the 70s didn't have quality animation (the are a massive amount of high quality movie shorts from that period in addition to features), but I wouldn't say that the average animated TV series for those periods was at the same level as those of the 80s/90s.
>>98709556Obama won his 2nd term in office and so the democrats and leftists went all in on "diversity".
>>98710295>>98711166the mask really came off without even the slightest probing huh
>>98707655I like Space Fantasy as the term.
>>98710295the west has fallen and old things are better than new things
>>98706862>what happened to thing that's definitely still around in a number of placesUsually what you're describing is just shuffled into the broader label of urban fantasy. You still see it all over. No one is fucking jaded.
>>98711292At this point there's every reason in the world to legitimately hate the current ruling parties.
>>98712014Who exactly do you think are the “ruling parties”?
>>98712041Man, /pol/fags don't even know who's in charge right now. I'll add that to the list of things you don't know, like what capitalism, fascism, and communism are.
>>98712041Don't bother trying to reason with someone that dodges questions with condescension. You're casting pearls before swine.
>>98706862What do you guys think the footjobs would feel like?
>>98712405I don't think about that and neither should you.
>>98710530Transformers Gen 1 was a boring show. The comics are what it should have been. All Saturday morning cartoons should have been like that and none of them were. Simon Furman's work for Marvel and IDW was the glorification of an epic space war that never existed. The best of them were the kind of robot you'd expect to turn into a beer truck.
>>98712544I see what you did there.
>>98710295Supposedly how one supposedly meets these people. Especially those of us who didn't grow up with friends or loving family members. Who really didn't have internet access until roughly 2015 being at the right o age of 25. Who lived down a dirt road where you had to pass five thousand acre fields to get to the black top.
>>98712405Razor sharp claws like talons that can cut through bone like butter while strong enough to pierce into concrete and steel.
>>98712544If you ever get the chance look up ROM the space Knight comic book series. Mediocre toy, kick ass comic. Also, Rosebuds.
>>98710295You must be one of the few fans of lesbian space princess. How does it feel to be hated by the entire internet.
>>98706862Niche doesn't pay the bills, you have to cast the widest net possible
how many animation studios (western) were around in the 1980s/2000s and how many are there now?How much anime do you watch?Do you create op or can you only bitch?
>>98712107They are stupid and therefore struggle to understand why globalhomo is so appealing to many.
What the fuck do 90s cartoons have to do with 2020s rpgs?
>>98716693Mostly the lack of imaginations and a lot of work and the creativity and imaginative Renaissance of the '80s and '90s is over. Just pretty much tired of the californication of everything.
>>98716693>What the fuck do 90s cartoons have to do with 2020s rpgs?They're a good gauge of cultural shifts in entertainment media et al. Cartoons and tabletops in the 90s and 2000s were very happy to be truly provocative without being preachy, often taking shots with their social commentary in all proverbial directions. Today it's very difficult to find media that isn't preachy or profoundly biased.
>>98713499I do create but I mostly just create for myself. I have no friends to share any works with. Alongside I know no one to shore my creative hobbies with let alone have a conversation with be any form of format. I'm just an alone isolated fagit retard git wondering where all the works of inspirational creativity has gone. I'm just wondering just like all the works that has inspired me in my youth where is that for the younger generations. Are we stuck just repeating the same old rehash ideas to agnosium. Or am I just a casual enthusiast entering empty hollow halls crying out hello anyone there and a space that has been vacated for centuries.
The 80s post apocalyptic barbarian on the world that was with magic swords, a few guns, and scheming sorcerers was awesome. Vibrant and dangerous.
>>98717732>Cartoons and tabletops in the 90s and 2000s were very happy to be truly provocative without being preachy,>Without being preachyLol.
