Why is Savage Worlds the generic system many reach for compared to others on the market?
>>98707351I can't speak for anyone else and Ive only used it for a deadlands campaign and some one shots, but it has enough going on that it can do a lot, but it's pretty simple and easy to teach. Also, it's very simple to run even relatively complex fights in.
>>98707351Generic systems lack a core 'style' of play. They try to let players run a stealth game, a subterfuge game, a social game, etc. Savage Worlds is generic in the sense you can use any setting with it, however, it has a crystal clear concept of its style, high action, pulpy, combat heavy games and runs on that logic making it better overall product compared to other generic games if that is the style of play you want.
>>98707453that's a good point, I never really thought about it that way. I usually think about that as a possible negative when suggesting it, but it definitely has more of a specific vibe than say gurps or brp.
>>98707351Why did you write this like a marketer?
>>98707351It's easy to club into another shape.
>>98707351I think they managed to succeed at selling it as a rules lite vibeGM'd "beer & pretzels" game and I kinda hate it.This is a system you're supposed to run like X-Com
>>98707351I think it really boils down to the game being easy to teach, but "hard to master". It also helps that the game doesn't sing its praises for long like GURPS. The SW community is very much on top of, "play it as-is first."While Gurps-lite is similar, the Gurps community barely recommends it, and tends to give off sourcebooks that barely matter.I think it also shows off the market. While you COULD play Fate, most people don't anymore, they just play City of Mist related systems now. (Even though I hate that jank just as much as Fate, I can see why most consider it better than Fate.)But for those that want a crunchy-lite system comparable to D&D or Pathfinder, right now they're going Savage Worlds. >>98708397Kinda, yeah. You really can't run a game with solo boss monsters in it, the gameplay just falls apart. It feels great at doing skirmishes with the PCs vs a ton of little enemies. Like with the adventure path above, you have tons upon tons of goblins, like twenty of them spread out over three fights, and you have to play smart otherwise they'll gang up on you and you could die. But... it's honestly a much better 1st level module fight that sells high fantasy adventures compared to most ttrpgs. I really recommend playing at least one Adventure Path to see it as it is. Otherwise you'll try to force it down a path it isn't meant to go.I still don't play it though, but I respect it, and if my players want a high fantasy game, or a game where they beat the crap out of a ton of enemies, its one of the ones I will think of.(Others being Barbarians of Lemuria and Honor + Intrigue, which is where I fell because I didn't want pulp.)
>>98708606Did SW Pathfinder realize what system they're (re)making modules for? I remember someone complaining the runelords one had the same (just attrit the party) encounters which don't work like that in SW.
>>98709636To be fair, any module they port over from PF is going to be dog shit because Paizo has never made a good adventure path just some that only suck a dick vs sucking a million dicks. This is even more glaring in SF but I'm pretty sure my group is the only one in existence to even play SF.
Looking for a system for a Space Western game, how good are SW's sci fi rules?
>>98710278I've also been eyeballing it for the same kind of game. I don't think it would do the traveller, "y'all gotta make some cash to keep space gas in the space rv" firefly-esque game because resources just aren't as important in SW by default. But it'd be good for big damn heroes shit, for sure, and sci-fi compendium has everything you'd want, from mechs to ships to vehicles and psychic powers if you want.
>>98707351It just does what I want. I can make pretty much anything I want with it.
>>98710278They actually have a space westren betting called the Lost Colony. If you want that pulpy, action movie kinda feel, SW works great.
>>98710278Sci-fi is good. Like >>98710386 said, Lost Colony will give you a decent template but it is definitely more of Bravestarr setting than Firefly. I will always remember Bravestarr for having a "drugs are bad" episode where they didn't keep a kid from using drugs so the fucker just straight ODs and stays dead which is pretty crazy for Saturday morning cartoon.
For me, the core engine is a bit clunky but everything around it is good, which is like the opposite of GURPS. The core of GURPS is smooth, but O never wanna use anything else. GURPS Martial Arts? Fuck no. GURPS Vehicles? FUCK no.
>>98707453This is basically wrong. All genetic games have a style of play. Cortex Lite and GURPS will produce radically different games about stealth or combat or whatever. It's just that "being literate enough to understand what the style is" is a lost technology.
>>98707647He just wants to know why Savage Worlds is the best-selling RPG players reach for when they want Fast, Furious Fun. Including players who want the Savage Worlds Triple-F gameplay experience in the Pathfinder and RIFTS settings.
>>98716354Bravo.Bravo, sir.My hat's off to you.
Can Savage Worlds do real robot stuff like Patlabor and VOTOMs?
>>98724875With the science fiction companion, easily
>>98724875The sci-fi companion is basically essential as it fixes pretty much everything about vehicles.
>>98728324>>98728233Neat.
>>98714582Disagree hard.GURPS fags never shut up about how it can do stealth, social, investigation, and other styles of play great making it the king of generic systems. SW is JUST pulpy action bullshit with the setting being what you mod in. Genesys, BRP, GURPS, etc have a unifying conflict resolution system that is clearly defined and easy to adapt to what you are trying to run making them more versatile at shit like planning a heist, navigating court intrique, etc. They can do just about anything, but that means YOU have to build that shit out to make it work for what your gameplay is going to entail. You might not ever do anything more high stakes than having an argument and it still runs along fine with checks galore.SW, on the other hand is going to action heavy bullshit with different settings. You KNOW what kind of game you are getting, you KNOW the baseline stats, edges, and hinderances for adversary creation, and, most importantly, your GROUP knows what they are in for just by the nature of it being a SW game. Having the GM and players on the same page for what the overall style of game they will be playing is a fucking massive boon.
I ran a Savage Worlds session this weekend because two players flaked and I had to throw my plan out the window. Grabbed a module and started running it cold. And it worked. Perfectly fine session. Can't do that with a lot of other games. It's not my favorite system, but it's good enough. It has a lot of clunky bits from an abstract PoV that work ok at the table. Unusually in this age of VTT integration, it holds up well as a live game. And it's very easy to mod. >>98729108The other problem is that while the very core of GURPS is easy enough, they quickly get into a huge amount of other bullshit.
>>98729108Even tho its Made for pulpy Action you can tweak the system so easily to fit your Style of Play. Also there are Rules in the FUCKING book for social conflict.You seem to be retarded or have No exp. Running SW or SWADE. Im not advocating for or against SW but your Arguments make it clear you Lack exp AS a gm or in the Hobby in General. I cannot understand the Obsession with the system on this Site.
>>98729914>I cannot understand the Obsession with the system on this Site.Shotguns (legitimately bad mechanic to give the most damaging mundane weapon type a to hit bonus), make them double the armor bonus
>>98730372Well you could Just houserule that. I don't deny that shotguns are overpowered but only in Close Quarter Combat. GM has to make the Shotgun wieder Work for his Close Range "Pop.
>>98729914>You could houserule and tweakFuck off. The exact same argument could be made for ANY god damn system and if your stance is "just change the game to make it work" then it's a shit game.>SW has rules for social stuffAnd all kinds of other shit, but that doesn't change the fact that it was built with the core gameplay being action heavy bullshit and the players, GM, and designers know it and lean into it.
>>98731112Don't even engage, I have the sneaking suspicion that those posts are from our resident SW troll.
>>98731112>>98731130Both of you Lack Imagination and have not read the Rules. Fuck Off Back to dnd PLZ. "But what fyftem?"Savage worlds advertises their Systems modularity and encourages homebrewi g. IT is also piss easy to modify If your not half retarded. Its Not my Bad you didnt get enough oxygen at birth. Also why you dont engage with my range Argument? Are you too stupid to make a bigger battlemap?If you suck at GMing another system wont fix your Lack of Imagination or General incompetence. Savage worlds is alot easier to homebrew than Most systems so your Argument ist shit. Try again retards.
>>98731364You can homebrew the fuck out of savage worlds, but unless you radically overhaul how it works, it's still going to basically feel like savage worlds. You can make characters feel a bit more flimsy, and you can make enemies feel a bit less flimsy, but the game still feels pretty fuckin' pulpy. And, all that aside, why the fuck would your homebrew the game so radically as to completely destroy what makes its unique, instead of just playing another game?
>>98729914>>98731364>reddit spacing
>>98731434Don't engage with him.
>>98710047I enjoyed their Dungeon APs, but then again this was 20 years ago so I may be remembering them with rose tinted glasses.
>>98731434>>98731701>>98731706Yeah Just keeping another shitty thread alive my Bad for pointing Out you Guys don't understand the Rules or read the books. No one Said to homebrew the fuck Out SW bzw except you. You clearly Lack Reading comprehension and gming skills. Please go Back to your dnd or gurps contahion Threads you fukking retards lmao. Dishonest kvetching without Putting in any effort.
>>98731899The guy who cannot spell and cannot coherently express himself trying to talk shit about someone else's reading comprehension is deeply funny.
>>98731989english is like my 3rd language and I'm spamming on my phone from work you fking retard. Try to engage with any argument of me honestly and not kvetch like a fkn 6 year old and I will give more effort aswell. SW is obsviously not for you since you need everything spelled out like a toddler. Just stick to DND and whatever 800 page rulebook "FUPA FYFTEM" your playing buddy. It's painfully obvious you didn't engage with the presented material and lack GMing xp.
>>98732020Okay. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt that you aren't a troll, and you're just a very angry esl and the language barrier is making you wildly misunderstand.My point was that, yes Savage Worlds has a specific kind of play style that arises from it. Much moreso than other "universal" or "toolkit" systems. And this is a good thing. It gives SW much more of an identity than something like gurps, hero or brp. I've often said that you can run just about anything in Savage Worlds, but it will still feel like savage worlds. A "level one" savage worlds character is a lot more competent than a lot of other systems "level one" characters. Success is more likely. The system incentivizes certain tactics more than others. THESE ARE ALL GOOD THINGS THAT I LIKE. IT IS A GOOD THING THAT IT HAS A UNIQUE IDENTITY OTHER THAN UNIVERSAL. I AM NOT SAYING IT IS A BAD GAME, I AM SAYING IT IS A GOOD GAME THAT I ENJOY RUNNING.I hope that this maybe clears things up for you.
I feel like the setting could be more interesting, and there are different presets you can use to make the game deadlier. You can also make the Fear rules harsher, with more severe penalties, psychotic episodes, or even permanent Hindrances.In my opinion, if you tweak even 10%—or 20% at most—toward a deadlier, more CoC-esque game (for example), it stops feeling like lighthearted pulp action with Arcane Backgrounds and flavorful but sometimes nonsensical, logic-breaking Edges.I’ve run and played Savage Worlds for over a decade: Hellfrost, Sundered Skies, some apocalyptic games, and shorter fantasy and horror campaigns. In retrospect, it takes less effort to homebrew than almost any other system I’ve played or run, except perhaps Tunnel Rats, Dragonbane, and Mythic Bastionland. More simulationist systems are much harder for me to tweak without breaking either the game or my brain, despite my having even more experience with some of them, like Vampire: The Masquerade and The Dark Eye.I’ve even been homebrewing SWADE for a V5 chronicle, replacing the Wild Die with a Hunger Die, among other changes.Thanks for the honest discussion, and sorry for my outbursts. I’m honestly frustrated by the TTRPG discussions on this site.Setting aside my previous post: you clearly know the rules and have experience playing or GMing. I think you should spend a bit more time playtesting your homebrew. You might be surprised by what you can do with Savage Worlds.
>>98732060I didn't say the game is bad or good either. I don't know if I'm running it again vor Vampire. We will see how it turns out. I kinda got super pissed by the shotguns are overpowered "argument".
>>98732060If I'm running a deadlier survival horror game, the group won't worry about playing 'just another goddamn Savage Worlds game,' because I'll be on their asses trying to kill them (in a fun and cinematic way) — removing soak rolls with bennies, restricting defensive edges like Iron Jaw, etc., adding illnesses, radiation, and fear checks when confronted with violence, high stress, or the supernatural, etc. This stuff will feel a lot different than, let's say, a Tolkien-esque hero-adventure type game with magic/miracles, artifacts, supernatural healing, and constant benny rain on the PCs. But the setting and setting-specific rules matter a lot too, so it won't feel like the next one either.
>>98732239>I’ve even been homebrewing SWADE for a V5 chronicle, replacing the Wild Die with a Hunger Die, among other changes.Sounds interesting, how does it work?
Savage Worlds newbie here, want a perspective checkRan an intro session. A PC got whacked by a beastie that got a raise on its attack, then did something like 26 damage against his Toughness of 5. He got a bum soak roll, goes down, Incapacitated. Gets gets patched up, back on his feet, but still has 2 Wounds. Then, he takes a level of Fatigue. So he's got a -3 penalty to everything he does for the rest of the scenario. I started pulling punches the rest of the scenario cause I didn't want his first session to end up with him splattered half an hour in, but I felt it made the rest of the session a bit anemic. And he was a bit frustrated that he was gimped on all his rolls.Is this just how Savage Worlds rolls? Did I do something wrong?
>>98732911That an insane amount of extra damage from a single raise, did you ace multiple damage rolls too?
>>98732943Yeah iirc it was str d8+weapon d8, and then +d6 from the Raise, and then the d8 and the d6 both aced.
>>98707351FATE -> Requires far too much work from the designer to just get a rules light game engine to function. BRP -> Older and unless you’re familiar with the system it can get unwieldy. D20 -> Unsupported officially and hard to get outside of PDFs.GURPS -> Scares lots of would-be designers away with its points allocation system. Savage Worlds is simple to implement, easy to teach, has support for all kinds of settings and is available on Drivethru.
>>98732892The idea isn't to recreate V5 1:1, but to keep SWADE as the engine and bolt the important Vampire stuff onto it: clans, Disciplines, Humanity/Touchstones, Blood Potency, Coteries/Patrons, Havens/Domains and Contacts/Allies.Right now I'm mainly messing with Hunger. Hunger runs from 0-5 and using blood for healing, Disciplines etc. can push it up. I want Hunger to interfere with normal SWADE rolls instead of adding another dice pool system, probably by replacing/interfering with the Wild Die on certain rolls. A bad result on the Hunger Die would cause bestial complications rather than just simple failure, so the hungrier you get the more the Beast starts hijacking otherwise normal situations.
how's the combat in sw? i wanna run a paranormal hunter game and have been eyeing ETU for some time. i originally wanted to use HtV but i was informed that it would be a poor fit due to the nature of the game which is all about ambushing the monster or get shred to pieces.
Trademark weapon and improved trademark weapon are dogshit numbers bloat edges. +2 parry and to-hit for free just fucks with the numbers scale of the system. It's a dumb as hell edge especially considering you can dual wield and take it more than once. Trademark weapon should have been a single edge, +1 to hit with a named weapon. Done. It's a flavor edge and that's all you need. It just bloats the numbers in the game and that's such a bad idea when the range of numbers the dice system uses are so small. Also the game just kinda breaks at legendary tier. Which it doesn't have to, but again, numbers bloat. You can easily get to the point of the PCs being able to carve through hundreds of men. Which isn't necessarily bad because the system is designed to handle that, but most players aren't. And boss fights just kinda suck.
>Serious discussion>Actual answers to questions>Minimal shitflingningWeird. I thought I was on 4chan.
>>98735665>Legendary PCs do legendary shitThat's implied with the name.
>>98735918Yeah but when the system doesn't have any monsters left that can really challenge them, it just means the game ends at that point.
>>98730573>I don't deny that shotguns are overpowered but only in Close Quarter Combat. GM has to make the Shotgun wieder Work for his Close Range "Pop.GeeMoids that aren't me are don't want to use 48x60"+ maps, the cowards, the swine.>>98735628SW is all about fighting groups and Megacrits so it's good if you expect your monster to summon minions or come in packs and bad if you want to fight one big monster.>>98735665SWADE TW is bad because it makes ranged characters never have to pull out a melee weapon in combat since the +1 parry longarm (likely shotgun) is better>>98731899>No one Said to homebrew the fuck Out SW bzw except you.I'm saying it, in fact you should give me money for my set of homebrew rules attached to a setting once I start selling it on itch or drivethru... in the 10 years it'll take for me to actually edit them.
>>98736142What do you mean? There's stuff that can challenge legendary characters. Not a lot though. At that level of play, your average mook should be running away from them, but there isn't anything stopping you from just straight up dropping in power armor from RIFTS into a Deadlands game powered by ghost rock, duct tape, and prayers or other such shenanigans. At legendary though it should mainly be other legendary wild cards with disposable henchmen sporting extreme ordinance in frankly ludicrous amounts because you are well outside the realm of mundane and firmly into the excessive levels of mayhem stage of play. It's even more egregious in a Supers game where you gotta start fighting multiversal threats and personified concepts like Entropy and such.The threats are still there, anon. But any semblance of realism, no matter how absurd, has taken a flying leap out the window at the point of legendary level play. Usually best to end a campaign before going that far if you don't want to get into the more batshit elements. This is hardly unique to SW though.
>>98736509Savage Worlds legendary characters can get bodied by a lucky mook.
>>98737038A d6 strength d6 fighting guy against a PC with 12 Parry (very easy to attain and I've seen parries in the high teens) needs a 1 in 36 to hit, then for 2d6 to explode twice to max (usually takes 24 damage to threaten 4 wounds, 16 over a toughness of 8, which is actually pretty low) so that's another 1 in 1296, then that PC has to fail all 3 soak rolls with his bennies (1 in 4 if he has a d6 vigor, and by legendary his vigor is likely higher, possibly with edge bonus to soak rolls, so even less likely) so that's 1/64 chance he fails all those rolls. So on a CHARITABLE end of things, a mook has a 1 in 2985984 chance to one shot a high level PC. Better by a couple orders of magnitude if he used up all his bennies so far, but not likely. And even with that, the chance is reduced even more for a character who is above 8 toughness, or above 12 Parry.
>>98737636How does the math shake out if that mook does a Wild Attack for +2 to hit?
>>98737657A more realistic scenario would be that the mook has five buddies attacking the wild card at once, each getting +4 on the attack due to gang up bonuses.
>>98737678That too. How does the math shake out on a more realistic gang-up like that?
>>98737038
>>98736501What are you brewing anon?
>>98735665This might be a Version Problem. A plus 1 from trademark w. Wont affect your parry and you need a d10 on fighting or Shooting. Also as a GM I wont let my PCs Switch trademark weapons unless we Play longer campaigns.
What are some good scenarios to run that highlight the best of Savage Worlds?
>>98738381SW excels at fast paced Combat with alot of participants. I recommend running your own scenario and use Basic stat Blocks for some mooks/Minions (with the Same Stats and weapons) and an enemy Boss with some extra edges. There are tons of official and unofficial one shots for almost any setting.
>>98738440>There are tons of official and unofficial one shots for almost any setting.Yes but which ones are actually great?
>>98738468I have mostly played My own Shit and Plot Point campaigns. Im sorry anon.
>>98738381Deadlands Coffin Rock is "the good one" though it's more about the town and less about mook fights.One of my better results was running a map based on the Amusement Park from Rainbow Six Siege, complete with antagonists hitting you through walls.
>>98738219CthulhuPunk but this time it'll...Core Houserules are basically a midpoint between SW Deluxe and SWADE.Attack limits from previous edition, 1 attack per weaponRest Action: Skip unshake roll to get +4 on the next oneImprovised weapon rules from previous edition: -1 to hit, -1 to parry when using one, most ranged weapons count as improvised weapons.Ready weapon is an action againTrademark weapon has no parry bonus, applies to all weapons of selected typeIf you swear off arcane backgrounds you can ignore rank requirement for other edges in chargen.Raw smarts roll instead of the Common Knowledge SkillInterrupting is made using Agility AgainCan't spend bennies to recover power points.Buckshot doubles the target's armor value.
>>98738622Sounds neat! Overall I find SWADE to be the best Version, but some stuff ist better in older Versions. Gonna drop your Post into a Notepad for Future projects.Improvised weapons was Something that rarely came Up in our Sessions.
>>98738778I prefer using Deluxe as a base just because the core mechanics are less dumb while SWADE fixes a lot of stuffDeluxe also has semi-playable vehicle rules unlike SWADE's unplayable outside chases vehicle rules.
>>98707351Many generic systems are presented more as toolkits to build your own RPG. Savage Worlds doesn't do this. It is a complete game out of the box that can be learned and played as is, what you are doing is choosing the setting. So you can pick it up and start putting your game together quickly and easily.Also most RPGs have a style to them beyond the setting. The style they have chose, pulp, works fantastic for many IPs. You have generally competent and powerful, but not invincible characters. Most modern media with an action leaning is a bit pulpy. The game also gives the GM some optional rules and tools to adjust the pulp dial up or down a bit to dial it in. The supplement books are also very easy to apply to your games.The system also hits a nice balance of easy to use, but still enough crunch for people who like to fiddle with characters and optimize. If you want to dive in there are a bunch of tactical options and things that can be combined. However, you can also play a very simple character rather effectively.
>>98738913SWADE has the same core?
>>98739976SWADE axed Charisma and fuckers are still salty about it.
>>98737678>each getting +4 on the attack due to gang up bonuses.No it's caps at +3 and they probably have improved block edge by legendary dropping that to +1 >>98737657Okay then divide that probability by 2 in a very rough sense, since they need to roll a 6 and then a 4 (1 in 12) instead of a 6 and then a 6 (1 in 36). S
>>98740153ok but you still roll dice, get raises, draw cards, etc.
>>98740369You are wrong. SWADE Core Rulebook pg. 101>Ganging up allows attackers to flank, exploitopenings, and generally harass a foe. Eachadditional adjacent foe (who isn’t Stunned)adds +1 to all the attackers’ Fighting rolls, upto a maximum of +4. If three goblins attacka single hero, for example, each of the threegoblins add+2 to their Fighting rolls.
>>98743030Okay so improved block drops that to +2 overallAgain, I put those stats on the LOW end for a legendary fighter.d12 fighting, improved block, improved trademark weapon gets it to 12. weapon master and master of arms with professional and expert gets Parry to 16.Combat Acrobat gives another +1 effective parry as well.
>>98738235>A plus 1 from trademark w. Wont affect your parry and you need a d10 on fighting or Shooting.lmao it literally says it does in the edge. And yes this was less of a problem in Deluxe edition but it was still a problem that there was an Improved version at all.
>>98743059The real problem is that defense bonuses outnumber attack bonuses and if you take every defensive boon you can overpower the exploding dice.Also one of the devs said grappling applies the unarmed defender status on the grappled character but it's not stated in the books.
>>98707351It's crunchier than PbtA or Fate but not as weird as genesys
Recommend me some adventures to run that get right into the action.
>>98744406This post is a prime example of a guy who reads rules, imagines an extremely unlikely if not impossible scenario to arrive at a game state that supports their desired conclusion and assumes it is the normal state of the game.
When I run Savage Worlds, I normally do a couple changes.>Gritty damage rules from the core rulebooks' expanded campaign options. You roll on the injury chart whenever you take a wound, so even a successful fight can give you an arm injury or whatever.>Modify Shaken so that it inflicts a stats penalty on you, but doesn't prevent you from acting at all. This is essential to stop players from pissing and shitting themselves when they fail a spirit roll. With these two things in, the game turns into a kind of low-risk but high-consequence system that I think is a lot of fun, especially for one shot adventures where you're not as concerned about your characters longevity. Individual fights are still very much in the players favor, mowing down hordes of enemies, but actually getting hit can be crippling so you're always at risk even in an easy fight. It tends to make my players paranoid and cautious, and they'll go out of their way to ambush enemies and get the First Mover advantage, which is so important in this ruleset. I think RPGs need fights to carry some degree of actual risk to be interesting. There's still some problems with the system, you'll never have a satisfying fight between the PCs and a single boss monster, for example, and the rules for noncombat encounters don't carry so much interest either. But it's a very efficacious way to create combat-focused adventures and you can explain it to someone who's never played an RPG in thirty minutes.
>>98716354Kekkers
>>98707351Is it?
>>98731130Some people have too much time on their hands
Ran two one-shots over the past couple of weeks. Def a bit rusty, I don't usually run modules and that made it clunkier for me. Also, both scenarios featured guns and other modern stuff and when I played SW a while ago it was all fantasy and magic, so PCs with RoF 3 weapons really slowed me down trying to remember how various things worked with it.
