https://strawpoll.com/bVg8B9ekbyY/results

https://strawpoll.com/X3nkPNaKVgE/results

Update on this and a new one

https://strawpoll.com/X3nkPNbmBgE

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>Cain murdered Able, and that was bad
>So God curses Cain and his descendants...
>...with biological immortality, a huge variety of superpowers, rulership over humanity, and the capacity to create a master race
What did God mean by this?

>>98797394
>TQ

Most Toreador would be pretty shit at domination. Yes I know that bondage features heavily in their 2e clanbook, but hear me out.

They just strike me as if they have a disproportionate amount of lazy and selfish "just laying with me is a privilege" type lovers. They might be good at social manipulation, but the actually good ones do so by "please do this for me" or tricking you into thinking it was your idea during pillow talk. Being the dominant partner is work that I think the typical vain bitch artist toreador would suck at, and probably not want to do. Maybe if you get one of the low key autistic perfectionist Toreador they could be good at it, but the average? I don't really see it.

>>98797443
The real Mark of Cain is pretty OP too, you can't farm but you're immune to violence.

>>98797443
Lilith was the one who botched things by giving him the superpower access.

>>98797419
It's entirely possible the werewolf poll got fewer results than the vampire poll because several users' answers were "I don't care about any of these assholes."
If we held a poll on everyone's favorite legion in Stygia I'd be surprised if we got a dozen results.

still waiting for my government mandated garou boyfriend

>>98797443
I like to think that Caine spent at least a thousand years completely fucking miserable. But God was not the only powerful entity to curse Caine. The effect of being cursed by half a dozen powerful entities caused a snarl of unintended side effects that Lilith taught him to exploit. Right before she cursed him too.

Alternatively keeping in line with the Gnostic themes and some of the lore of the other gamelines God is not the ultimate creator god but a Demiurge. Honestly making the Abrahamic God a Demiurge would fix a lot of the lore incompatibility that Vampire and Demon have with he rest of the setting. Or at least hint to it.

>>98797505
>government mandated garou boyfriend
Anon that's gonna be a black spiral dancer if it's from the government

>>98797538
>God is not the ultimate creator god but a Demiurge.
Isn't that just NwoD with the God machine?

>>98797567
i can fix him

>>98797505
this is the society Verbena would implement if they won the ascension war. Join the technocracy to prevent this horrible fate.

>>98797575
The God Machine was maybe a Demiurge I guess, it was closer to what if the most powerful entity in our world is a mechanical-eldritch horror that influences everything. It was eldritch horror, but the interesting kind not the trite which just steals HP Lovecraft’s notes. The God-Machine honestly got a lot more focus than it should have. Making it the ultimate big bad changes the entire tone of the setting. Since the entire point of making nWoD was to move away from metaplot, making the most metaploty thing to ever exist in WoD or CofD was a huge mistake.

Keeping the Abrahamic God something distant and unknowable fits WoD better. Just leave hints as to it being something else entirely.

>>98797589
No, not unless you got maxed out faith
He makes you worse and rings you down to his level

>>98797589
>>98797567
That BSD has no idea what he's in for. I will outmatch his freak. First step: I WILL get that notoriously mangy Spiral coat silky smooth. This is non-negotiable.

>>98797637
Unless you're possessed by an urge wyrm of desire then you ain't matching shit

>>98797675
>>98797622
I mean the Batini have a 50/50 survival rate against the black spiral labyrinth, a single bsd can't be that hard right? You just have to treat the corruption as an exploration of yourself and jungian shadow rather than letting it distort your sense of ego and confine your thinking.

>>98797465
Wraith poll be like
>who are these losers?
Mage poll be like
>Which one lets me jerk off the best
Changeling poll be like
>AYYYYYYYYYY I'M MELTING

>>98797622
Nothing my silver chastity cage and premium dog collar can't fix. Just needs some grooming and to force him to develop a dependency on my toxic affection

>>98797465
its because the /v/ampire clan poll was literally posted on
>>>/v/749238615

>>98797702
I can smell Setite deception through the screen

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>>98797505
>government mandated garou boyfriend
Best I can do is a regular dog (forma de Pitbull). Take it or leave it.

>>98797675
>government-appointed BSD bf
>Urge Wyrm whispering in my ear
Are you trying to set me up as an otome protagonist? Next you'll be telling me about the exotic Kumo who owns a hot spring resort

>>98797795
>A pitbull
>Not even an american dog breed
You government stooges are real cheap

>>98797702
>Let's crash it, /v/.
Of course /v/ is full of sabbatards.

>>98797419
Where did the spirits touch you, dreamspeakers bros?

>>98797960
I'm honestly surprised by that. Lasombra don't even show up in Bloodlines, and it was after the /v/tards were let in when someone voted Ravnos.

>>98798099
hey now
there are like a dozen of us but we still exist :(

>>98798125
Gibe chimerstry.

>>98797419
>a third of votes are for the Sons of Ether
I thought 4chan hated refugees

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>>98798153
u mad?

>>98797443
Christians see life as a test to see if they're worthy of entering Heaven. Being immortal means you can never be with God.

>Sabbat GF (Malkavian or Lasombra)
or
>Garou BF (Shadow Lord)

>>98798318
How much do you like femdom?
What about fur and fleas?

>>98797419
>vtm poll features sabbat and independent clans
>wta poll features stargazers who left the nation
>mta poll is just traditions with no sign of conventions
Shit poll.

>>98798393
>stargazers who left the nation
Fake news

>>98798304
Assuming God even cares about you. Given that, whatever the mythology of the setting, Christianity is definitely wrong, I doubt they're going to Heaven.

>>98798339
It was more about the flavour of being an abuse victim

>>98797419
Akashics are the only right answer

>>98797443
I think that God deliberately set it up that way.
>You and those you spread this curse of immortality with will be given supernatural powers beyond any mortal man, leading to petty power struggles, sociopathy, and insanity

>>98798469
I mean they're still living lives far better than the mortals they tyrannize

>>98797443
>>98798491
Being a vampire is only a positive if you're a sociopathic misanthrope with zero empathy for other humans and if you are one, you would quickly become a wight if you were a vampire.
>But I would just take a Path instead and skip the Humanity misery porn, I'm too cool for that.
If you browse 4chan, you do not have the strength of will to live according to a Path.

>>98797419
No Hollow Ones?

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>>98798540
Except:
>You can just purge yourself of the need to feed entirely through Golconda
>Feeding feels good for the people being fed upon and you don't have to take all their blood
>You can still access True Faith powers and all that jazz and do Via Christi so you know you're good with Jesus
>You can make all your friends ghouls so they're also immortals with not-quite-as-cool but still cool powers
>You can selectively feed on bad people
There's really hardly any actual downsides to being a vampire if you're not a fuckin' retard about it.

>>98798640
I mean, really, if you care at all about your friends and family, you'll make them ghouls, and then their kids will be revenants, who are basically a master race in-setting because they get cool vampire powers and don't even have to fuckin' feed.

>>98798640
>why doesn't every vampire just achieve Golconda are they retarded or something
>if I give someone a nickel every time that I stab them it's morally justified, especially if it's non-lethal
>True Faith isn't me producing supernatural effects with my own overpowering belief, it's God rewarding me, even though there's no difference between True Faith in God and True Faith in capitalism
>you can turn all of your friends into slaves addicted to your blood who you will be eternally superior to
>I will conveniently always have a bad person at hand so I can make someone else suffer for my own benefit without being morally compromised in any shape or form
t. wassail before you get through your first year as a vampire

What is the relationship between blood points and health levels in oWoD? If I drink three blood points from a mortal, enough to him slightly weak, is that three lethal damage? Then how do I get an entire ten blood points by murdering someone who only has six or seven boxes in their health track?

>>98798664
And yet vampires have ruled the world since the beginning of time with no problems

>>98798672
if some bleeds out they still have blood in their body by the time they die anon

>Did you submit to your Toreador mommy yet?
>not using lasombra for femdom erp
not gonna make it

>>98798672
2 blood is the tresshold before you should see a doctor

7 blood is instant death

10 blood is everything in the body

>>98798787
>lasombra
eww normie

where the FUCK is charon, why does he keep fucking off when he's got a kingdom to be running

>>98798811
chillin with demon charon at the milk and cig shop

>>98798811
>>98798817
Charon deez nuts

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>>98798828

>>98798640
>Camarilla tries to rape you if they find out you're doing that
>When you become a leech you often become a pretty fucked up low discipline nigger who can't control himself early on
>If you have True Faith as a lick the Cam will probably try to rape you and you'd have to be fairly autistic for TF
>Keeping in touch with friends and family causes the camarilla to try to rape you + opens you up to unnecessary risks

Sure, you could be the good guy vampire but basically everything in setting is trying to keep you a docile power hungry scheming lick. It will be pretty far from easy, even if you aren't a retard. I'm fairly certain it'd take 1/100 4channers to even get close.

>>98798640
the problem with posts like this is that people in-universe don't have the books

at first you very likely only know what your sire tells you and in most cases he will tell you that Golconda is nonsense, has never heard of true faith and that ghouls turn crazy because that's common wisdom among vampires

>>98798811
He tried a reincarnation trick for a reason I don't recall, his reincarnation saw the bullshit he'd had to deal with and just transcended right then and there instead of going with the plan.

>>98798850
>Sure, you could be the good guy vampire but basically everything in setting is trying to keep you a docile power hungry scheming lick.
Well yeah, it's one of the five basic rules of how to manage the youngsters from war of ages. If they're all busy tearing into each other then they can't team up and come after you.

I'm surprised there isn't like a Revenant breeding program going on. Obviously the Camilla would have no interest in a race of self-propagating superhumans, but that seems like the sort of thing I'd expect the Tzimisce to get up to.

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Anon,where's your hexmap? Your minis? You aren't one of those HtP tourists, are you?

>>98799026
that's all revenants are anon every single familly started as a vampires (or vampire group) personal breeding programm and pretty much every single familly also has their pairing overseen by their masters

they are rare because they have very few uses that ghouls can't cover and are hard to make because making a new familly needs "dark rituals" that few know in addition to decades if not centuries of time that could be spend doing something more useful like tending to your petty rivalies

back in the dark ages making a new familly atleast got you prestige inside of clan tzimisce but these days even few fiends care about them so they are a nichè hobby like breeding very rare pets is for humans

>>98799055
i did run vampire with minis once but it felt rather clunky and i can't imagine running demon or mage with it at all

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Guess what tribe this werewolf is from

>>98799209
innsmouth has werewolves?

>>98799216
>the War of Rage was so terrible, so thorough, most don't even remember the weretrout

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>TQ
Always.

>>98798865
Why don't more vampires try to do it?

>>98799560
like i said they don't have the books. they don't know about it. they don't even know that they don't know about as they never even heard of the option

And in the case of golconda if they have heard of it then most sources in-universe will tell them that it's a scam or even evil and demonic

>>98799560
Because going for the morality based superpowers golconda promises means that you're putting yourself at a massive disadvantage in vampire politics. Also in old stuff it had the catch where you only get one shot at it.

And in newer stuff the Iconnu are way less prominent to provide actual advice compared to random ass golconda cults.

>>98799209
BSD?

>>98798640
>Bro, just become the 0.01% of all vampires bro

>>98799573
>Oh no haha my character has decided to research Golconda anyway haha and he has conveniently stumbled on the actual true path of Golconda haha and he is conveniently built to actually be able to realistically achieve it haha what are the chances of that haha
Now what?

>>98799573
Why would they want to prevent it when it's a net benefit?

>>98798540
This is like saying being a billionaire sucks because it means you’re a sociopath. No, being a billionaire is awesome and the vast majority of people would gladly accept a billion dollars, the fact that most billionaires are sociopaths is because of what you have to do to become a billionaire, not because the money itself is a curse.

>>98799617
Because they don't know exactly what the parts of the curse golconda lets you slip out from under. For all they know it's the power to run around at full power during the day which is a hard counter to all those older vamps with dogshit humanity/road scores. Better to stop the kids from getting an advantage you can't replicate.

>>98799617
most golconda lore in-universe is actually fake and made up by so called golconda cults to manipulate you + most vampires have only ever heard of the salubri from tremere probaganda that paints them as soul thieves something that the camarilla has accepted as true and saulot is credited as the creator of golconda (even if he himself fell out of it because he is a retard) and do you really want to listen to the guy who is mostly known as vampire satan? like the only people who even defend the saulot and the salburi's reputation right now are the tzimisce who are to the average cam and anarch vampire known themselves to be all evil as fuck

golconda is also tied to the inconnu who are heavily distrusted for good reason (they destroyed the eastern roman empire because michael called them morons close to the fall of the roman empire and their leadership are all very stupid infernalists) but even they don't have it down to a science after two millenia of trying

then there is also the fact that some know that it's true but also just don't want to put in the effort themselves and also don't want you to have a edge over them or just disagree with it on a fundamental level (children of osiris in this case)

>>98797870
>>A pitbull
>>Not even an american dog breed
>You government stooges are real cheap
But pitbulls ARE american breed

>>98799655
>golconda is also tied to the inconnu who are heavily distrusted for good reason (they destroyed the eastern roman empire because michael called them morons close to the fall of the roman empire and their leadership are all very stupid infernalists) but even they don't have it down to a science after two millenia of trying
Did they even have any guys in golconda by the time revised was done with them?

>>98799635
>the fact that most billionaires are sociopaths is because of what you have to do to become a billionaire
That's exactly the point.
>dude lmao being a vampire is a sweet deal who cares about having to harm people on a nightly basis by drinking their blood it's totally worth it for the superpowers
People would accept the benefits of being a vampire with no issue just like people would accept being a billionaire with no issue, but it becomes a problem that makes people squeamish when you add a cost to it like having to regularly drink the blood of other people. The only people who would cheerfully accept that deal are sociopaths.

>>98799683
i can think of so many groups of people i would feed on without feeling a single sting of remorse. Even more so if its not totally sucking dry, but keeping them alive.

>>98799683
It’s really not a big deal to feeds. I mean for gods sakes we have examples of sisters feeding on their little brothers so they can skip out on a math quiz the next day, it’s not some traumatizing event.

>>98799700
Easy to say that behind a screen. I doubt that you'd actually be comfortable with doing that in person and not just in theory. When is the last time that you intentionally drew the blood of another person in any shape or form?

>>98799673
not in their leadership/council of twelve but Guillaume was still around in revised but revised only said that he is rumored to be in golconda but they also didn't print any stats of him not in golconda so i personally read it as rumors of him being in golconda having started to leak

and revised also never retconed Valerianus being in golconda and a inconnu monitor probably because the reveal that he was still alive was in a german book, but it must have be somewhat awkward given the guy is personal friends with etrius and the tremere are the reason why the council of twelve are stuck in their castle

>>98799707
About seven years back when my brother tried to shank me I guess.

>>98799707
Anon, feeding is likened to sex. Hell, both sides like it, it feels good. Are you really going to argue that sex is some traumatizing thing regular people can’t commit to?

>>98799707
being able to say that behind the screen in a purely theoretical manner is enough, because people consider becoming kindred is also purely theoretical. In 9 out of 10 cases, they will conclude "sounds cool, i bet i can manage this" and not "i will first need some actual first hand experience before i make the call"

>>98799719
>Are you really going to argue that sex is some traumatizing thing regular people can’t commit to?
Yeah but the Camarilla sodomises you if you go around getting consent. Get ready to suck off the homeless.

>>98799683
This is why the only ethical predator type is Bagger

>>98799730
Who cares, you’re fucking immortal now. If you spend a few years at the bottom of the totem pole that’s no biggie because you have literally fucking infinity to work your way up the totem pole and you get stronger just by living. Given infinite time literally any loser can become rich.

>>98799737
Doesn't each blood bag fucked with add up to three people killed? It adds up to way more deaths than just drinking fuckers dry, they're just indirect.

>>98799719
In which case, rape isn't real because sex feels good for both parties, therefore there is nothing wrong with forcefully having sex with someone who doesn't want to have sex with you because you're sexually stimulating them.

It's almost like vampiric feeding has been a metaphor for sexual assault and bodily violation for centuries.

>>98799745
Just get consent nigga

>>98799749
>just break the masquerade every time that you need to top up your blood points lmao it's that easy

>>98799611
You roleplay about him becoming a better person and give the character an appropriate ending, whether he fails or succeeds.
Maybe he fails to reach Golconda but continues on the path because he thinks it the right thing to do, maybe he becomes depressed and retreats into a hermitage maybe he does get it and has to rebuild a mortal life unsure of what he can do with what remains of his powers.

Who knows buddy?

>>98799754
That's what Dominate combo powers are for.

>>98799740
Huh?

guys, how do i become a shut in nerdy Toreador who obsesses over the perfect big tiddy anime figurines (the shelves in my haven will be filled to the brim)

>>98799754
The “masquerade” is for society collectively, not individuals, you can and will frequently be breaking the masquerade with individuals otherwise every vampire and their mother wouldn’t have ghoul servants running around

>>98799761
They always do those "every time you donate you save an average of three lives" ads around here so the figure is stuck in my head.

>>98799762
get a jar

>>98799760
Then you're back to rape, it's not consent if mind control is involved.

>>98799769
>Hey dude would you like to donate blood?
>yes\no
>Feed and mind wipe / fuck off.

>>98799767
how does the jar help

>>98799763
Ghouls are an exception because they're dependent on their domitors and mystically compelled to obey them.
Getting consent from everyone you feed from, which is going to be two digits of different people no matter what unless you want one of them to die from eventual blood loss, is a Masquerade breach waiting to happen and the Camarilla are fully justified in staking you and leaving you out to dry in the rising sun if they find out about that.

>>98799764
Heh

>>98799782
Just try your family. “Hey mom and dad, I’m a vampire now, let’s celebrate and I’ll take a bit of your blood after.”

>>98799775
Altering someone's memories without their permission is still unethical.

To everyone that says “you can’t do X because the Camarilla would rape you”, why don’t you just become too strong for them and join the Sabbat while you and your bois still pretend to be cammies?

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Hello fellow Kindred, what locations and buildings come into mind that would make perfect Elysiums to use in a hypothetical game set in the US/ Europe?

>>98799795
>the US
abandoned mall
>Europe
abandoned castle or factory

>>98799794
How do you "become too strong for the Camarilla?" What's your step-by-step process for that? How do you avoid the Camarilla fucking you up before you reach the end of the process?

Okay so I'm pretty sure that the answer's in the books somewhere, but I can't be arsed to check right now, so
>do wraiths fuck?
>is there a way for a wraith to have sex with a living person?
This is important I swear

>>98799804
Step 1: Live
Step 2: Wait

It’s literally that easy.

>>98799808
Vampires aren't alive so they are incapable of living and you didn't include feeding, so your vampire goes into torpor before a month is up.

Try again.

>>98799814
Vampires are more “alive” than humans are. Humans are basically just cattle in the setting. They’re easily manipulated and controlled by fucking everyone. Mages, Werewolves, Vampires, Mummies, it doesn’t matter who, they all make humans their bitch. That’s not living. That’s being an NPC.

>>98799794
>trying to be ethical
>joining the Sabbat
Anon, they'll rape you even harder for trying to be humane. Also:
>spreading your asscheeks for the Eldest with the vaulderie

>>98799804
Serial diablerie and never attend Elysium while you have the black marks
Eat lots of people
Get help from the Sabbat because they believe that you’re the equivalent of a rockstar to them
Join the Nazi party
Take over the body of a werewolf thanks to a vampire god you just resurrected

I don’t know what to tell you man, it’s that simple

Retards on an imageboard who peaked in middle school and have never tasted success since really be like
>"oh yeah no, living outside of the system and becoming invincible is super easy if you just follow these steps"

>>98799830
What if you’ve never peaked because your entire life has been nonstop misery

>>98799817
>Serial diablerie and never attend Elysium while you have the black marks
"Sheriff, many Kindred have disappeared over the last few years and this particular subject of mine has not attended Elysium for years. Determine whether or not they have been committing diablerie and deal with them."
>Eat lots of people
"Sheriff, many of the Kine are disappearing at an alarming rate that may draw unwanted attention. Discover the culprit and deal with them."
>Get help from the Sabbat because they believe that you’re the equivalent of a rockstar to them
"Sheriff, I have received reports from my informants that one of our own is actually with the Sabbat. Deal with them."
>Join the Nazi party
"Sheriff, one of our own is a retard who believes in Kine ideology. Deal with them."
>Take over the body of a werewolf thanks to a vampire god you just resurrected
"Sheriff, one of our own is a nonsensical schizo. Deal with them."

If you’ve played crusader kings you can handle vampire society just fine.

>>98799830
It's just typical gamer solipsism.
>heh, i'm the main character, i'm the only one in the entire world who is sapient, everyone else is just an npc going through the motions, i'm the only person in the world capable of independent thought and thinking outside the box, everyone else is just a bot who exists in a permanent state of standby and is only capable of reacting to what i do, otherwise all of these sheeple just go through the rote motions of their monotonous existences, only my life has any meaning

>>98799895
I mean there’s, what, tens of thousands of vampires? Compared to billions of NPC humans I’d say they qualify as “main characters”.

>>98799830
They also forget that Princes will often treat fledglings and neonates like expendable resources, the system aggressively goes out of its way to fuck you over.

>>98799820
Humane? Why would you ever want that? Alright I’ll give another tip free of charge…
Just never be born human to begin with

Boom! Easy!

>>98799845
Alright, alright. Imma give some more details.

Step one through three is easily circumvented if you happen to be the Sheriff and the Prince’s pet project. Emphasis on the pet part.

When your Tremere sheriff daddy and granddaddy have enough of your antics, make sure to have your dad banished from the court by making a social faux pas. I recommend something nachos related involving foreign dignitaries. You get your own head saved thanks to a major boon your Giovanni friend had on the Prince.

Then you and your Sabbat friends capture Sheriff daddy, torture him for info and then you get to diablerise him as a bonus. Use said info to split granddaddy Prince’s court in two and kill all loyalists in a freak accident (the strongest among them turning into a chicken for you to swallow whole and consequently diablerise).

Step 4 is taken care of already because daddy is dead, and your sabbat friends just succeeded in a coup.

Step 5, well you and your friends took over the city while pretending (with success) to still be cammies. Turns out that you just got promoted to sheriff. Well not really, but now people behave because if they don’t they just get fed to you. Also turns out that the schizo thing is real and the sabbat high authority’s whole life has been dedicated to resurrecting that vampire god

Here! Hope that it’ll help you!

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>>98799907
And then your vampire gets Dane'd.

>>98799917
And everyone but you is just standing by and watching while you do all of this, without doing or thinking anything unless they're on stage and you're interacting with them? No one but you has any plans, ambitions, logic or proactivity?

>>98799921
Hunters are the bottomest bitches of the totem pole. Guys like Dane are literally just the pawns of vampires taking out rival vampires without even knowing it. They never manage to actually make vampire society fear them, their height is literally to just be the useful idiots for vampires.

>>98799939
Too bad, your vampire is still a bonfire because they got outsmarted by a mere NPC. Make a new character sheet.

>>98799795
Europe:
Abandoned places such as barracks, village schools, union resorts, communist memorials, cold war bunkers, hospitals... Basically anything made before 1990s. You can also hide in any random village because villages are either completely deserted or inhabited by 80+ year olds. I used to live next to an abandoned factory. When I urbexed inside the calendar was showing 1991.

>>98799944
“Your vampire” is some 12th gen neonate that probably wasn’t smart enough to keep their head down. Hunters never actually matter when it comes to hunting the important figures, the 4th gens.

Beast lost changeling can still have sapient tasks or forms in their durenze right? They just were stuck to primal instincts as a sick joke until memories flooded back?

Thinking of making a gambling addict who had to keep some lampooned sadistic abomination of a gambling game going as it tortured and rewarded them and other changelings it knew with no understanding of how, what or why
Yes as a bit they are the truefae's ssr pull

>>98799795
Museums, art galleries, theaters, mansions, best if they have one or more subterranean levels.

>>98799936
This is basically the narrative equivalent of the "I can dodge bullets by looking where the gun is pointing" argument.

The metanarrative information available to players would be of miniscule advantage to any VtM player who actually becomes a vampire because they wouldn't have the skills, the clout, or the charisma to use any of it.

>>98799965
>the skills, the clout, or the charisma
Damn, if only vampires had superpowers that allowed them to have supernatural skills, clout, and charisma…

The real personal horror of VTM is how the entirety of Vampire society is that it’s no different from our own. Predatory, selfish, and controlled by a scant few.
Perhaps that is the real horror of vampires. They are at the end of the day, human, and are thus mirrors to us all.

>>98799971
Damn, if only other vampires were actually people who probably have baseline traits better than yours and are just as capable of using those superpowers as cleverly as you...

>>98799953
>Hunters never actually matter when it comes to hunting the important figures, the 4th gens.
90% of vampires also don't matter when you're talking about plot devices.

>>98800018
Yeah but hunters are the bitches to the bitches. If a 12th gen is the disposable pawn of a higher gen, then the hunters are the disposable pawns of the 12th gens.

>>98800022
Depends on the hunter. There's absolutely nothing stopping an ST from making talented independent hunters like Dane who aren't beholden to or the pawns of any vampire.

>>98799936
You know that I’m just retelling my game as Shark, right? Of course other coterie members and NPCs have their own ambitions and act accordingly.

Like Ansel, Shark’s Giovanni friend wasn’t fond of joining the Sabbat. Even less spending a major favor the prince owes him to save his life. Though in the end he was granted a huge territory in Munich to give to his clan (Shark gave him his share of the rewards). Which made him rise up in popularity and power.

>>98800051
No, I didn't, I glaze over and skip every time you talk about your sessions.

>>98800049
>Dane who aren't beholden to or the pawns of any vampire.
LMAO

Dane just thinks he isn’t the pawn. Which is what the pawns always say.

>>98800073
Okay, which vampire is he the pawn of? Surely you can cite the specific vampire that is manipulating him, along with the book and page which says so.

>>98800059
Fair enough

>>98800078
He’s being manipulated by several at any one time. Point me to a vampire he’s killed and I’ll show you which vampires benefitted from it.

>>98800092
Which vampire was responsible for masterminding the Algerian incident in the 1980s that involved Sullivan Dane destroying several vampires and winning over his former Jesuit brothers to assist him in the hunt?

>>98800092
That's like says that cops are being manipulated by 80 IQ gangbangers because they shot some dude another kneegrower had beef with.

>>98800122
>Algerian
That would be everyone in vampire-kind with the exception of the Assamites, as the Assamites are primarily found in Muslim areas, and their primary role is killing other vampires, by killing those vampires Dane actually helped vampires proliferate much more.

>>98800157
In which case, the Camarilla-Sabbat conflict is actually the product of mortals manipulating vampires into killing each other to make their job easier, if that's the logic we're going with.

I can't believe NPC humans were able to trick so many vampires into killing each other like that. Why are vampires such suckers?

>>98797443
God is the Wyrm and was rewarding his best boy.

>>98800165
Humans aren’t manipulating shit. The vampires stay in charge no matter what happens. There’s a reason the vampires are in charge of the inquistition.

>>98800179
Yet the vampires keep on tearing each other apart, whittling down their own numbers and playing right into the hands of the humans who have fooled them into thinking they run the show. Truly, humans are the ultimate masterminds of WoD.

why does /wodg/ get a million times more toxic whenever people talk about vampire instead of mage or werewolf

>>98800183
>whittling down their numbers
There is no indication whatsoever that the vampires are being “whittled down”. They possess the capacity for functionally infinite reproduction of their own forces, they have exactly as many vampires as they desire to have an any one time.

>>98800190
Relative to humanity, they are. But if you really want to insist that vampires run the show, which vampires orchestrated the First World War?
Which vampires orchestrated the Second World War?
Which vampires orchestrated the Vietnam War?
Which vampires orchestrated the moon landing?
Which vampires were responsible for the election of which American presidents?
Vampires were surely behind all of these important events that impacted humanity worldwide, right, because vampires are in charge? Which vampires orchestrated these events then?

>>98800202
>which vampires orchestrated the First World War?
The Ventrue
>Which vampires orchestrated the Second World War?
The Tzimisce
>Which vampires orchestrated the Vietnam War?
All of them, it was a Camilla vs Anarch war
>Which vampires orchestrated the moon landing?
Toreadors
>Which vampires were responsible for the election of which American presidents?
Depends on the president in question.

>>98800212
Moon landing was Kiasyd. Also WWII was actually the Tremere they just blamed the Tzimisce as per usual.

>>98800212
>>98800238
You're both wrong.
It was me.

>Be me
>Playing that one Crusader Kings princes of darkness mod
>Using ghouls as breeder stock to pump out revenant children
>Using the revenants as my foot soldiers and lieutenants
>Meanwhile I find mortals and sire new vampires with them to lock up and use as particularly powerful herd-stock
How feasible would this actually be for a vampire to do in-game/setting?

>>98800260
Breeding a new revenant family naturally (without the Kupala special sauce the Tzimisce had) takes ages. Centuries if not millennia. Pregnant ghouls take a looooong time to come to term and miscarry like crazy.

I am right
You are wrong
Nanana~

>>98799209
That was a Red Talon from W5 if I recall. The artwork and character concepts from the tribes section of the book was terrible.

>>98800051
Yes, thank you for demonstrating your character has insanely thick plot armor and only goes up against inactive and inept enemies.

>>98800189
Mage, Werewolves, and Mummies are all about being incredibly powerful people that make regular humans look like wimps and being the true forces in the world responsible for running it. It’s awesome and the splats know it.

Hunter is about being a powerless human who can’t meaningfully affect the world, but the splat knows that and so do the people going into the game.

Fae and Wraith are about being genuinely traumatized and cursed in ways you would rather get out of typically, and any powers you get out of the situation typically don’t outweigh the horror you find yourself in. The splat and the players both understand this going in.

Vampire is unique in that the splat, ostensibly, is supposed to be more along the lines of Fae and Wraith, where you’re supposed to be cursed and dislike your situation…..but instead it ends up being more like Mage where it’s basically all upsides with very few downsides and you get to be a superpowered badass at little to no cost to you.

>>98799921
Aura farming.
Dane is so cool.

New idea - WereCuckoos, bird fera that do not have their own kinfolk and instead have to reproduce with kinfolk of other fera breeds they can detect. Special magic for turning a fera fetus into a werecuckoo.

>>98800713
Extinct

>>98800715
So does everyone think up untill one lupus kinfolk lays an egg.

>>98794596
>>98794986
>>98794986
Achilli is STILL lurking in random forums and seething at people throwing shit at him. How much of a failure of a human being you have to be lmao? Is because Paradox left him without job after V5 flopped?

>>98798099
Lasombra show up as enemies in Bloodlines, in that last hotel map the enemies that disappear when you hit them are Lasombra
Also Wesp's Plus Patch adds one in that library quest

>>98798099
Some of us have actually read the books and that's why we prefer the hardworking, crude, and competent Lasombra. Not everyone is a secondary who enjoys playing overpowered nepobabies like the Tremetards or fake opposition to the system like the nu-Brujah.

>>98800212
Source and citation for each of these please.

>>98800713
While I don't find the werecuckoo idea interesting (frankly, I find it stupid), a werebird of some kind, like say a falcon or a hawk would be pretty cool.

There's an ongoing effort on making the weremoths playable, and it's been trudging along for some time now.
I think they're reaching a spot where lore and fluff have to be written for them to make progress.

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>>98800816
Don’t have the others on hand but the Ventrue are explicitly listed as being the clan behind the Nazis rise to power

>>98800824
Speaking of weremoths, I (one of the mothfags) have a fall break next week. Expect some moths then.

>>98800829
>>98800816
Also the concentration camps were actually designed to feed vampires, they were basically built as vampire feeding camps and that’s what accounted for the death tolls

>>98800812
...Nepobabies is a surprisingly accurate description of the Tremere. Authors pets, IMO.
>Get away with all kinds of shit that would earn you a fucking Blood Hunt and execution if it was anyone else
>"Oh but they have Thaumaturgy so they get off scot-free from any consequences"

>>98800824
>a werebird of some kind, like say a falcon or a hawk would be pretty cool.
Technically speaking there are Corax.
>While I don't find the werecuckoo idea interesting (frankly, I find it stupid)
Think about it as a refreshing enemy you cannot defeat in conventional ways and makes you protect your kinfolk .

>>98800863
>Technically speaking there are Corax.
True, I didn't forget about them. I just feel some other bird, like a bird of prey, would work better. Could have some South American bird and deck it out with Aztec-Inca-Maya stuff.
>Think about it as a refreshing enemy you cannot defeat in conventional ways and makes you protect your kinfolk .
Werewolves already have a lot of enemies they can't just beat up to defeat them, though I admit the kinfolk angle is interesting.

Nothing's going to stop you from running wild with the idea of werecuckoos, and honestly speaking they would work better if they did what real cuckoos do, which is to add in their own kids, after which the cuckoo babies sabotage the host-bird's eggs.
Reducing them to a "bird that cucks other fera" in the most literal sense is boring. Use a changeling (the real world myth) as a basis mixed with how real cuckoos work.

>>98800532
>Yes, thank you for demonstrating your character has insanely thick plot armor and only goes up against inactive and inept enemies.

All in a day’s work citizen!

But seriously, Shark has faced off against fearsome enemies. Some that kicked the shit out of him, and some victories that wouldn’t have happened without the support of the other players. He’s a PC just like anyone who has a game. You do seem to focus especially on the last games and nothing before.

>>98800212
What did vampires gain from unleashing the changelings?

>>98800937
Kiasyds ?

>>98800937
Means more supernaturals for hunters to hunt, which means less of them are hunting vampires

>>98800942
Why would they even hunt changelings of all fucking things? They literally need to make children laugh to survive.

>>98800959
Technocracy would hunt them 100%.

>>98800959
It’s WoD, anon. Anything that can potentially bring joy and whimsy into the world is considered demonic influence or reality deviancy by the powers that be

>>98800824
Fera I think would be cool to have:
>Birds of Prey (eagles, buzzards, vultures etc)
>Cervines (elk, deer, moose etc)
>Caprines (Sheep and goats)
>The mothfuckers if they get it off the ground

>>98800883
And anon he was just fetish posting. Despite the memes you need more than just pure horniness to bring an idea to fruition.

>>98801140
>And anon he was just fetish posting. Despite the memes you need more than just pure horniness to bring an idea to fruition.
I really wasnt I am not into cuckoldry I just had this silly idea so I shared it. I feel like there is a design space for such a meta fera breed that can interact with all forms of kinfolk.
Admitedly it can as well just be a fookin pookah.
I will not use it anyway since I play Mage.

>>98801140
The mothposters at least have a document thats been updated somewhat

>>98801140

Are there any myths or folklore about those particular kind of shapeshifters? That's always a good place to start for ideas.

It is pretty neat how there are genuine creative projects going on in this thread

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>>98800959
The laughter of children frightens Pentex and the Technocracy deeply enough that they'll team up together to stop it.

>>98800899
Every time you describe your character's accomplishments, his enemies sound completely passive and inept. The fact you've managed to have any close calls at all with an ST as permissive and dim as yours is a testament to your ineptitude.

If you're having fun, excellent. However, stop trying to pretend it's any great accomplishment when you're playing VtM on game journalist difficulty.

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>>98801283

Probably one of the last places on /tg/ to have it too. It's wild to think the tourists have been running rampant for 10 years now. Generals have been the only thing worthwhile here for years now, and they're rotting one by one. It's interesting how anything horror themed seems to be the most resilient.

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If I might weigh in to this vampire argument, I think people are working in extremes on both ends.

The moment you are sired, you are likely the weakest vampire around. Being talented, or highly experienced from your mortal life can help. So can having a prodigious generation. But even then, age matters quite a bit. Not just in personal power, but the connections and resources that accumulate over the course of centuries. You will not have a vampire wiki on your person, and will likely know only what your sire teaches you. Granted, neonates kept entirely in the dark and used disposably are in fact not very common. Mortals and ghouls are far less of an investment, and the latter isn't even that much weaker than a rank, clueless fledgling when you consider they can go out during the day. If someone embraced you, odds are you're a more long-term investment for them. So they'll likely teach you the basics.

You're not in a great situation, and getting out of it isn't easy, but it isn't impossible. Some vampires are going to have shared interests with you, even if it's entirely practical. You can learn to play the game, but how to win depends too much on sect and city specifics to have a one size fits all statement.

>>98797443
It was to make caines children kill eachother over and over again like how Caine murdered able. The superpowers came from the breeding with the demon Lilith.

>>98801283
Like what?

>>98801324
Mothfags and Ananasifag

>>98801304
that's because in the old days webforums were the only place to post homebrew. now that things like dnd beyond and wikis have popped up, peoppe have moved there for that sweet upvote dopamine rush.

>>98799795
All the best and most secret Elysiums take place in the sewers.

>>98801333
Who?

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>>98800959
>Why would they even hunt changelings of all fucking things?
>For plenty of reasons

>>98801417
check the OP

>>98801301
I feel like you’re forgetting that I’m playing a combat monster that deals aggravated damage and that I treat any encounter like a vidya game by properly getting myself all the buffs and tactical advantages I could use before a fight. Like any real vampire would, they play to win and fight battles they can’t lose. When I don’t things go sideways fast. Also I have a coterie to count on.

And before wolfing out any bloke with average and above stats in fighting, that took Shark by surprise or overwhelming numbers (and not being a regular human) would have good odds wrecking him. If both, then he would absolutely be dusted. Even Catalina who’s a social/fighting hybrid could murder Shark (even with all the disciplines he got via diablerie) in the first round of combat. He is likely to win if, and only if, he survives that unharmed. Plus I’ve repeatedly said that the dice quite often fuck him over.

And even if he has 10 willpower, he gets mindraped quite often. So there’s really one thing out of three that he’s good at and without preparation it’s not always a walk in the park.

>>98800959
>They literally need to make children laugh to survive.
Funny how you nevert mentioned all the other, cruel shit they can do to get glamour. Hell, they fuck with peeople just because they can.

>>98800966
>would
They already do. Progenitors like to run some experiments on them.

>>98800531
>It was all photobashed real people images
Honestly, it was a real what were they thinking-tier book in more ways than one

>>98800713
Is this NTR?

>>98801283
That's because most people here hate corpos and paradox enough that they're invited to create their own thing. Other threads here are only created to shill product slop or culture war shit.

>>98801465
>other cruel shit
If a changeling causes your wife to cuck you, and then a completely different unrelated changeling causes your new gf to cuck you, to curse of being cucked is yours instead of something they put on you

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>>98801488
Yes.
Select your netoranger.

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>>98801503

>>98801503

So Nosferatu, Toreador, Tzimisce, Brujah.... uh... Giovanni?

>cuckshit
don't you have some cuck videos of your underage family members to watch faggots?

>>98798639
Hollow ones are not a tradition no matter how much Euthanatoi want to poach them.
Solificatti on the other hand...

>>98801503
Where's the sadistic shota that looks like a yakuza boss? That's my netoraranger

>>98801503
You can get cucked… by tentacles?

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henlo homids
henlllo stinky homids
go eat a burger ugly

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>>98801633

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>>98801629
Video related has personally cucked dozens of anons. At the same.
Now imagine what he could do if he were all tentacles.

Brujah tommy boy mommy who craves the touch of young men, but lashes out because she thinks she's too ugly and old!

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>>98801629
I think that's up for discussion.
If the tentacled fucker has human-like or near-human intellect, it most likely counts as cucking.
If the tentacles are mindless but controlled by someone who summoned them (such as Arms of Ahriman), it count as being cucked by the summoner.
For tentacled creatures with animal-like intelligence, it might not count depending on exact circumstance. But it also might count and there even is a precedent. A while ago there was a story of a man cucked by his own dog, because he left the girl to look after the pupper while he was at work and I guess you just know what happened. The guy, by his own admission, felt totally cucked though at the same time couldn't really be mad at the "bull" because he's still good boy that got set up by a thirsty hoe.

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>>98797419

I think we got a real vamp answering.

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All female mages who grow in strength must also increase in breast size. This is not negotiable.

>>98801713
The spirits already make sure novice dreamspeakers have big tits.

>>98801180
Fair enough. It's hard to tell in this general since the ambient horniness is fairly high.

>>98801250
As for mythology; Celtic myths have plenty of deer in them and people turning into them or having deer like forms. They were thought to have some spiritual power specially red and white deer. They could travel or lead someone to the otherworld were faeries and spirits were.
Norse mythology has lots of Gods and stuff turning into deer. Maybe they could be the keepers of the gauntlet or the Umbra. Or Gaia's guides and wayfarers.

The birds would probably be associated with Helios somehow. Maybe his gift to Gaia to go wherever they are needed. Birds of prey are often associated with wisdom, purity and power. Zeus did a lot of time as various rapey birds.

The sheep and goats are a bit more complicated as all the legends I know have them as tricksters but that role is already taken.

>>98801633
Great idea, going to grab a Gutbuster Deluxe from O'Tolley's

>>98801633
You're talking awfully big for someone in belly rubbing range.

>>98801759
But for whom?

>>98801501
Massive self-report, milkling. Another 3 billion to big pharma.

>>98801929
AYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY stop you'll doom us all

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>>98799802
>>98799950
>>98799960
>>98801375
Grazie, you continue to keep our society safe and secure, fellow kindred.

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>>98802083
>V5 slop
At least use the proper logo

>>98802089
It's a shame, I don't hate the V5 Leopold logo, but it's such a good indicator of if people are talking about SI larper slop or if they're talking about the real Leopoldites.

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>>98799795
>buildings come into mind that would make perfect Elysiums

>>98802089
If the other version looks better I will use it. El Erucifijo Genérico is fine, I just don't care for it.

>>98802089
Sorry you can't use that. You mind offending a fascist by using a cross or tumblerite who starts to piss their clitty if they see a cross, ok? Don't use crosses here. You need to use the pro-glowie, pro-goverment and overdesigned garbage they made for V5 that removes the cross symbolism okay sweetie?

>>98802159
I mean even the globohomo version has some symbolism such as ro chi, alpha and omega. Cross is more like high middle ages symbol. You can also use symbism of a lamb or a fish to represent Jesus.

>>98802115
Isnt >>98802083 the ESOG/ La Entita logo?

>>98802122
This is the commiest looking area I've ever seen. And I've been to Cuba

>>98802122
fun fact, vampires in Marvel build an entire vampiric nation right there

>>98802214
It's Pripyat, so yeah.

>>98802122
Cool. I was there 1-2 months before they finally covered the damn thing.

>>98802204
the books themselves can't decide if La Entità is something different from the society of leopold i am sorry i mean the society of saint leopold or not. some books say they are the entity is just the society of (saint) leopold with restored vatican founding while some books say it's something new that absorped the leopolds instead

Any of you guys did some cooking today?
For the first time in my life I prepared a pumpkin. I made some sweet purée for a pie and Harry Potter pumpkin juice. I also roasted the seeds and it’s a huge success with the family. It’s like eating popcorn.

>>98802244
How close did you get? Does your piss still glow in the dark?

>>98802263
Closer than the picture. No more than 100 meters away from the sarcophagus and maybe 200 away from Reactor 4. It was hard to judge with all the structure in place at the time to move the sarcophagus.
My piss doesn't glow anymore but I have a second dick and all the tziwhores love me.

>post-apocalyptic game
>but it is a "mundane" reason (economic, fatal plague, or WWIII)
How does each splat survive and thrive?

>>98802296
>wolps
if the plague results in lots of people dying, well, excluding kinfolk deaths.

economic? bad. wyrm probably uses the time to grow bigger and better, plus if they're real desperate people will be going out into the woods to steal as much shit as possible so they can eat.

WW3? also probably bad. best to stay under the radar outside of supernatural warfare.
>vampires
fine as always, probably. maybe it swings up, maybe it swings down, but it'll swing back at some point
>mages
probably all kill each other, so business as usual but more intense.
idk the other ones well enough.

>>98802320
>wolps
why are people suddenly calling garou that

>>98802296
we have post nuclear amagadon while also gehenna vtm in a shadis magazine article it's called Gothapocalypse and we have it in the second mega in short: it's probably vitel's fault and most vampires die (obviously) and the surivours become fiefdom rulers of small blood cults with only the setites and tzimisce doing somewhat well because their founder is awake and surrived the apocalypse.

garou and fae are just fucked

the technocratic unions breaks apart after the NWO and syndicate lose everything and iteration X and the progenitors can't find any common ground without them and then both become fallout villians while the VE try to fuck off into space and are never heard of again. traditions are reduced to a foot note for the most part with the only survivors being in the umbra

Wraiths are seeing never seen before population rise

and mummies are scared because setites now have a stockpile of weapons that are proven to kill them so horus actually chickens out of his rematch with set

it also has a small set of plot hooks ranging from the players finding a progenitors private utopia where everyone is mind controled to the brujah trying to dig out troile to a entire town run by the inqusition and non-supernatural bandits ala madmax or fallout raiders trying to raid your tribe/cult/fiefdom's stuff

>>98802296
if nukes dropped I'd expect at least a few mages to ham up mutation like it's something outta fallout

>>98802320
>>98802296
Woofs unironically would welcome a mad-max apocalypse so long as there's still breeding stock and hunting land

>>98802296
you only need 2 dots in either forces, matter, correspondence, life or entropy to completely mitigate the effects of nuclear fallout
like that's about average for someone straight out of character creation how do you die to a mundane apocalypse lmao

>>98802368
>"Dis nigga is a witch! Kill him!"

>>98802371
>implying that every mage is a retard hermetic that's going to take an apocalypse as an opportunity to go out in public and start dickwaving their wands around instead of just stay in their basement

>>98802368
Better hope you roll enough arete before your ST decides you should be a fallout ghoul

>>98802296
post apoc games are fucking dogshit boring. 99% of sci fi settings are just post apoc garbage. i would not run any game on that shite.

>>98802381
What if fantasy is post-post apoc? What if it's the type of post-apoc where everything sucks but it all still works (Cowboy Bebop, Cyberpunk, etc). Apocalypse just depends on the scale and what it's affecting

How many dots would you rate Ranma’s curse for an Akashic character?

>>98802250
>from the society of leopold i am sorry i mean the society of saint leopold
This has always bugged me, though it's overlooked in favor of larger issues. I don't know where they got the idea that the current Catholic establishment would canonize an Inquisitor, and legitimize an order of witch hunters, regardless of how redacted and sanitized this hypothetical legitimized and empowered SoL would be.

Since Vatican 2 they've been concerned with courting controversy, it's part of why they tried to cover up the pedophile thing (which backfired horribly). Since Pope Francis, this attempt to appear modern and liberal has greatly increased in magnitude. It strikes me as a plot point written by someone who doesn't really know much about the Catholic Church.

>>98802254
I do a lot of home cookery, though right now I'm in a funk and I feel I haven't been on my A-game recently. I made a pretty solid roast duck last week.

>>98802380
extended casting for a sphere 2 spell is going to be about 5 minutes, since i'd argue that to prevent radiation poisoning from touching you or mitigating the biological effects temporarily you'd only need like 1 or 2 successes. the rest can go into duration

>>98802396
Bro, in this general that would be a merit.

>>98802296
Whatever the case is, 90% of humans are fucking dead.

>>98802332
idk the people i was playing games with called them that and i picked up on it

>>98802401
it's even weirder because leopold is as far as normies in the setting know just a minior bavarian noble from 800 years ago everything else about him gotten censored

and the masquarade is still up

so how did the press go? why are we canonizing a random german guy? why is there a group named after him that is buying military grade equpitment and deploying along side United States' FIRSTLIGHT, Brazil's BOES, Russia’s GRU-N58, the UK’s JTRG,Poland's Bureau IX
France's La Calcédoine, Sweden's G-Kontoret, Egypt's Homeland Special Program japan's Third Intelligence Department and isreal's Unit 8211 for... police work? that includes martial law in european capital cities

actually how is the masquarade still up?

>>98802159
Buddy, the entire Christian faith in WoD is a lie and Jesus never even loved you in the first place, to say nothing of the fact that most of the organizations that use the cross are basically just pawns for the real power players in the setting who are on all some weird Pagan or Gnosticism stuff.

>>98802474
So true my fellow V5 xister! Remind to put an inverted cross in your bio too! Time to own da christian vampirites! Slay queen!

>>98802497
You do realize that this is foundational world of darkness lore right? If you don’t like it, you’re not gonna like world of darkness as a whole, it’s just that the setting for you.

>>98802534
And you could have fucked off from this thread long ago, V5 sister, but you're still here.

>>98800719
Wolves don't have nesting instincts. It'd die.

>>98802551
Who said anything about V5? This is OWoD lore.

>>98802368
Made into a Tremere Juicebox.

>>98802296
Hunters don’t even thrive in their own splat how are they gonna thrive when 90% of their resources are gone and all the other splats don’t feel the need to hide anymore

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how common are or should cursed items be in the modern times?

>>98802430
>actually how is the masquarade still up?
Isn't the implication of the setting generally that the population KNOWS there's monsters in the dark, but they just don't know the details, and because humans are largely powerless to resist them they don't try to look into it too much?

>>98800049
Like that one guy who is successful enough that the Camarilla's response is just killing any vampire that goes anywhere near him because they've decided that the only reasonable way to deal with him is waiting for old age to do the job.

>>98802792
no the common populace is not meant to know about the supernatural at all and we are told that vampires especially would (allegedly) be screwed if they would ever find out

what you are talking about is true in curseborne and certain parts of cofd, but again not at all in owod

>>98802820
>and we are told that vampires especially would (allegedly) be screwed if they would ever find out
If anything, it's the opposite. There's a reason hunters have to hide and keep things a secret, if they ever exposed the masquerade humanity as a whole would be fucked. The only thing protecting humanity is that the monsters prefer to manipulate us from the shadows, but if it comes to open warfare humanity is fucked.

I've got this character concept. So some Ordo Dracul is trying to create a super-vampire by means of Diablerie. So he picks out a promising young vampire and trains them up. They have a duel and whoever wins eats the other. The mentor usually wins, but the apprentice wins often enough to shake things up. How many times can this happen before the winner goes completely bugfuck?

>>98802583
>implying I would read any lore
Ishiggy

>>98802792
No. It's not uncommon for like, a police officer to know something is 'wrong', but anything beyond that is not common knowledge.

>>98802583
god is real and biblical angels had philisophical interpetative dance rap battles with each other

>>98802401
WOD doesn't do full on historicals very well, mostly because they don't try super hard, but their portrayal of the catholic church is often, as you said, pretty strange.

>>98803131
well now I'm stuck imagining angels having standoffs resembling the testimony of the buffed-up pirate from ace attorney

how did would the hermetics react to the rising number of adult orphans who have a harry potter paradigm

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>>98803108
I mean it can't be that unknown considering how often Vampires are able to 'break' the masquerade with no issues. I think it's basically an 'open secret', it's like living under a totalitarian dictatorship, you might think "Great Leader" is a tyrant but you'd never say that because people who say that tend to disappear.

>>98803134
they couldn't kill each other before caine did his thing so it was pretty much ace attorney mixed with a creation wide game of cops and robbers

>>98803144
they do look down on hollow ones and orphans in general not just the harry potter ones

>>98803165
wtf is this incest

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>>98803174
just sibling skinship

>>98802820
>certain parts of cofd
what exactly are you talking about here?

>>98803174
>>98803178
>He's surprised vampires are fucked up exploitative creatures who can't be trusted around anyone, family included

>>98803296
It was consensual

>>98803316
Consent doesn't mean it was exploitative
>Basically gives him the bloodbag treatment which is better than drugs
>takes his allowance
>leaves him and says hey sorry we won't do this again (clear lie)
Come on now. Leeches can't be trusted

>>98803381
Might as well say all siblings are exploitive then because they lean on each other when they need it.

>>98803165
>how often Vampires are able to 'break' the masquerade with no issues.
You can thank The Ventrue for that. You'd be shocked how difficult it would be to keep The Masquerade under wraps without Dominate.