Should elfs be top or bottom heavy?
What games are you playing where this is a relevant question?Tell us about your campaign.
They should be lithe.
>>98824922Oh sorry, you're thinking about /tg/ ten years ago when people made and played games. Those people were all banned or harassed off of the board, or mass repoted as questfags. Now you get this.Enjoy it.
>>98824924I know this is a retarded pornrot no-games thread, but it's absolutely astonishing how elves being lithe and slender has been memory-holed out of /tg/ anons, thanks to porn, shitty fanart and dumb isekai.Pick up any rulebook, go to the section of elves, read their physical description. They almost always say something like "slender", "lithe", "slim". They can be tall, small, athletic or not. And they are always a variation of slender. Not heavy, light. Neither bottom nor top heavy, light builds. This is the agile nimble race. If you want "heavy" characters, pick a dwarf.
(You) should be kill yourself
>>98824917Depends on what other humanoids you have in the setting.If it's just elves and humans it doesn't really matter.If you have humans, elves and a Homey/Fecund/Plains/Foodie race then elves should be lithe, humans a mix and your third race an hourglass.
>>98824938>If you want "heavy" characters, pick a dwarfIf we are talking about making a single character I'd be fine with nearly whatever. There are outliers in every group. But then the character would also sometimes be treated as a curiosity by others in-game.But if we are talking about a race in general then yes it's pretty stupid to turn a race of generic elves into fridge sized muscle monsters or all dwarves into stringy thin small humans.>>98824922>can't discuss any theoretical topics and people's opinion about it unless it's connected to a specific campaignkys noldorfag
>>98824917Slim and stacked. Firm and shapely asses.
>>98824960>There are outliers in every groupThe problem with this thinking is that once the focus is on the outliers, they will be perceived as the norm.>kys noldorfagAmazing plot twist ahead.
>>98824938>Gary Gygax once characterized elves as "slim" and "lithe" thus it was determined all elves should forever be so in all settings and across all systems
>>98824986Your implication that it was an appeal to authority is just slimey, badfaith way of arguing.Elves in traditional games have established themselves as agile, quick and nimble + being magically gifted. I'd argue that the former is even more important than their magical nature, although it really depends on the systems. And giving them massive tits and arses isn't how you visually communicate that they are agile but can't take a hit.Also, it's important to give fantasy races unique silhouettes, and in my opinions, elves should be recognizable not just by their pointy ears. Have them always be slimmer on average is another way to quickly tell if someone is an elf. You aren't making your line-up of fantasy races more interesting and visually varied by having elves with the same exact proportions as humans, or the bodyweight of two dwarves and half an orc.Sure, do whatever the fuck you want in your game. At some point, whatever you do making them less elfy will result in being just worse elves.
>>98824917they are ear heavy
>>98824917The correct coomer answer is "both".
>>98825022>have established themselvesYou are retarded, genuinely retardedIt all boils down to you aping OD&D because consciously or not you treat it as some sort of authoritative depiction of "the ur-elf", the platonic Form of Elf and you seem to have particularly fixated on this whole slim thing, I guess it because it tickles your aesthetic fancyTolkien's elves were taller than humans and powerfully built, not some Orlando Bloom twinks or ottermode Tyler Durden typesAlso, I don't give a fuck about "the silhouettes", I'm not talking about video games here
>>98825022NTA but he's got a good point.Insisting that the elves in your setting have to conform to certain specific appearances because 'they look like that in other settings' is ridiculous.>B-But them being lithe and skinny is integral to their identity!No it is not. You call a creature an 'Elf', and that sets certain precedents in the player's mind about appearance and nature, true. But you are at no point obliged to meet those expectations.In fact, the reality not matching, subverting, or being different from those expectations is a fantastic way to foster intrigue and engagement.In the Witcher books, Elves don't have canine teeth. In 40k, (space) Elves go crystal with age, and are biologically coded to need stimulation.Torquemada has Elves with three-toed feet.DnD has Dusk Elves, Sea Elves, Drow, Sun Elves, Fae Elves. So many different iterations and alternative physical presentations of Elf.Because if you fail to add interesting differences and present a bog-standard elf. Your players, already knowing the general idea of an elf, will not engage with them.You prove that what is called an Elf is NOT that, and they sit forward and ask for more.
>>98825078I actually really like elves as warior-mages and that doesn't require them to be weak little twinks. Personal preference for sure. The agile aspect is an important part of it.If you don't make elves the agile race, what's so elf-like about your elves? I guess you can make them only about magic. What else? Is that all? Don't come to me with muscle elves or some other gooner shit. I like night elves but I would never say elves in all settings should be giant huge buff dudes and tall amazons, that only works for Warcraft.>Tolkien's elves were taller than humans and powerfully builtThey were powerful and strong, hardy and had almost endless stamina, but that was the result of their strong fea. And Tolkien stressed multiple times that they were light. Legolas jumping over snow is not a Jackson invention, he did that in the books. In that scene, it really showed the difference between the more ethereal elves and the physical, bodily humans, as Boromir and Aragorn plowed through the snow and made way for the hobbits. Túrin famously wore the Dragon-helm of Dor-lómin, which he got from the elves. They couldn't wear it, it was too heavy for them.
>>98825090>because 'they look like that in other settings' is ridiculousThat is not my argument.>So many different iterations and alternative physical presentations of ElfAnd they are all slender.None of these physical elements stop them from being slender. Yes, you can add all manners of weird shit to your elves, but if you make them short and stocky, then they stop being elves. Being slender is just a baseline. Sorry, but you are mistakingly thinking that if someone stresses how elves should be slender, that is then their entire and only physical aspect. It's not. It's some kind of logical fallacy if you think elves being slender forbids them from having weird teethe, wings, fins, and antennas. Or some inherent weird magical shit going on like changing their appearance based on their environment, the seasons.>Your players, already knowing the general idea of an elf, will not engage with them.Counter-argument: if you present them a new game and inform your players that there are elves as playable choice, many of them will immediately flock to them because they want to play an agile, quick dex-race. If they aren't, then they won't engage with them.
>>98825138>That is not my argument.>>98825022>Elves in traditional games have established themselves as agile, quick and nimble.>...it's important to give fantasy races unique silhouettes.>>98824938>They almost always say something like "slender", "lithe", "slim".You are made of stupid.And as for the rest of that; no you can make them not-slender, most elves in historic folklore were short and varied in body sizes, you're just a retard who thinks Tolkein invented the elf, you seem to be the one thinking elven slenderness is their sole physical aspect, fat tits is not a reasonable deviation from slimness anyway, and you are so chronically poisoned by DnD brainrot it's evident you don't play other games, and can't give a good argument anyway.Counter-counter-'argument'. I actually run games, and know that; there are better dex options in most common fantasy ttrpg systems than elves (which have to be milquetost for 'balance'), that players when presented with a species dichotomy will pick the more novel one, that elves need not be a playable creature, and that players showed more interest in the obese cannibal degenerate Elves in one of my settings, than the bog-standard DnD Elves in another.
>>98824922What kinda content do you want to see on this board, honestly? Because it's super dead and despite that I get that>lust provoking imagethreads are not the height of content, the alternative is schizo threads, anons occasionally electing to shitpost separately from their slow ass generals or... nothing. I don't get why this of all boards has an entire array of anons at the ready to question a thread's purpose, when there is nothing else meaningful that is getting replaced. Like where are YOUR threads with discussions relevant to games and campaigns YOU play? They don't exist, do they? Be the change you)want to see in the board.
>>98825228>>Elves in traditional games have established themselves as agile, quick and nimble.That's an observation. My argument for why elves should be slender is not because other systems describe them as slender, but because other systems give elves certain abilities and attributes, and being slim accurately communicates them. And if you give elves the same or similar attributes (and you likely will), then there is no reason to drop this description.Making elves have the same exact proportion as the numan next to them doesn't help them. Especially if they are still described as agile and dexterous, and their attributes reflect that.>most elves in historic folklore were short and varied in body sizesWe are not talking about these elves. We are talking about elves in the context of high fantasy. OP is not posting these types of elves, he's not talking about thesen types of elves.>you seem to be the one thinking elven slenderness is their sole physical aspectRead my posts again. Another badfaith argument.This topic really gets people angry.Elves are routinely described as slender in traditional games and there are good reasons for that.
>>98825251Be the change you want to see is a good resolution, but it doesn't make the bad threads go away.This is a bad thread. I have no problem with somewhat lewd threads, as long as they are in some way related to actual games. OP is just posting twitter memeshit. I'd rather take a slow board over this.
>>98824938Elves being "slender" does kind fit neatly into the array with humans and dwarves.>Small and broad>Medium and medium>Tall and slenderCompared to dwarves, who retained their dwarveness, elves kinda just become taller humans with pointy ears in build.
>>98825251>Like where are YOUR threads with discussions relevant to games and campaigns YOU play?Backseat jannies will never ever post their own games or add anything to a game discussion. You can present them with a full description of your latest game and you'll never get anything back. All they do is demand everyone else give them what they want. It's painfully obvious they're nogames that pretend to be the unpaid moderation on a Taiwanese sock puppet forum
>>98824928/tg/ 10 years ago was way lewder than today.
>>98824928The sheer levels of tourist in this post is actually overwhelming
>>98824917I dunno man, go ask /elf general/ - Don't Call it a General
>>98825656>/elf general/No such thing.
>>98824917More bottom- than top-heavy. Elves are tall and slender and I feel they should have relatively modest breasts. But female elves still need wide enough hips to give birth so they should have hips that are wider than their (very narrow) waist, so even though they wouldn't have particularly fat asses they would be comparatively more bottom- than top-heavy.
>>98824924Agreed.Save the ass and titties for the humans (and dwarves)
>>98824922He saw the pic and wanted to post it, that's all. This place is analog /v/. We don't even get >"How do I run [recently released videogame] as a TTRPG?threads anymore.
>>98824960I remember when this place used to calculate the number of spiders you could fit in a drow's uterus and vagina. That was a theortical topic>This is trash and you are trashI would tell you to kill yourself, but you're already dead inside.
>>98825932>>"How do I run [recently released videogame] as a TTRPG?>threads anymore.Blame your tranny jannies. >you deserve a better /tg/ anon. They are out there, in the warp. Waiting to be found, Bunkers of Superlative Delight. What are you waiting for, The Tranny Emperor to approve? Zer Trannystodes to take you into their 'care'.
>>98825961would beheaded heads really fly with the CCA?
>>98825932That's because, like every other thread, they just get shitposted into oblivion by retards.
>>98826017Last time I checked they weren't even ok with bullet exit wounds, but last time I checked was like 20 years ago
>>98824922Scoundrel, I add downtime mechanics to interact with random npcs, and bed the female ones.>>98824917Every female should be bottom heavy, especially the top heavy ones, great tits without an equally great ass can create a structurally unsound look.>>98824938IDK, I'd expect a race of extremely agile and mobile forest dwellers to have great asses, from all the uneven terrain traversal. I agree that, asthetically, huge tits are kinda weird for agile archers, but even that can be explained by women not going to war as much (which would make for nice characterization for younger, flatter, female elves becoming adventurers). Ass is necessary though, not flaccid and celulitis-afflicted, but toned and ready to spring.
>>98824928quest threads sucked man.>>98824938i don't care about that the elf part that matters is>long lived>most live separately from humans in hard to get to places>pointy ears>humanoid but really fucking hot to a point where its uncanny.i my game the high elves look like white marble masterwork statues, wood elves look like perfect wood carvings, cave elves look like they're carved from obsidian etc.
>>98826134example
>>98826138example 2
>>98826126I think it's very reasonable for elves to be built like track and field athletes
>>98826165And to get bonuses to acrobatics and athletics if they do a little dance.
>>98826165>>98826181
>>98826165>I think it's very reasonable for elves to be built like track and field athletesTaller and more slender though.
>>98824917The women? Bottom. The men? Top.
>>98825932>This place is analog /v/Is see anons posting shit like this on /v/, get their thread deleted and then immediately head over to /tg/, where the mods don't lift a finger.It's repulsive.
>>98824917Muscular with fat girlcocks.
>>98824922>>98824928Elf Slave Wat Do was literally one of the seed threads m00t made when first creating the board. OP style posts have been on topic for longer than you've been alive, kiddo.
>>98826567That would be funny if true, because Moot was a newfag and didn't play.But it's also not true.The difference between the silly olden style of /tg/ that yes, it was sillier and potentially lewder, but also most anons posting in these threads actually played or run games.This OP is straight from /v/. It's some twitter-memeshit posted by some tourist.
>>98824917I've always imagined elf women to be very androgynous looking due to their typical longevity and extremely low birth rates. You don't need to be have exaggerated sexually dimporphic traits when you have centuries of fertility. Ass and Tits are a human woman's thing.
>>98826614Holy newfag, fagman
>>98826409high jumpers are probably the most elf-like then, but I think other disciplines count as well
>>98824986If by "Gary Gygax" you mean "JRR Tolkien", sure.
>>98827294Divers are a good fit as well.I've always been of the opinion if you need pointed ears to tell humans and elves apart, your world-building is liquid shit at best.
>>98827423the vast majority of all elves look like hot humans with pointy ears though. You can distinguish elves and humans in the fiction through physical features and dress and so but that's ultimately an arbitrary separation of different human physical features and styles of clothes
>>98824981>they will be perceived as the norm.If you are retarded and only able to think in absolutes, sure. In either case, that shouldn't have much effect on (Your) games.>spoilerYou think I don't recognize your images and your style of bitching about porn after more than 5 years of seeing them?>>98825954Why don't you go ahead and facilitate threads with shit like> calculate the number of spiders you could fit in a drow's uterus and vagina.then?It's easier to just bitch and moan, huh?
>>98827704Every time a hand tries to make them more distinct (3e, Elder Scrolls, Dragon Age 2), there's either backlash or people just ignore.
>>98827704You can easily subvert it by making them taller. Unless you are one of those DA:O faggots who can't get over their Legolas/Grimli slashfic not being canon. DA:II getting shut down was a mistake for aesthetics. >>98827867Facts. TES, Divinity, and to an extent WoW stand out because their elves are more than just humies with pointed ears.
>>98827867TES elves have entrenched themselves pretty well.
>>98824938It's not possible to be slim anymore, because everyone is well-fed in modern fantasy. Remember all those pictures with the giant sticks of meat? Yeah. If you didn't want this, you shouldn't have fed them.
>>98824938Warcraft 3 and later World of Warcraft were the most popular videogames on the planet for a good while in the 2000s which have night elves be eight feet tall Amazons with hourglass figures and the dudes are eight and a half feet tall jacked and bearded gigachads that turn into bears. D&D elves are like five feet tall on average lorewise, even the Drow, but the enormous success and popularity of Warcraft and its role in the zeitgeist has made many people ignore that and mentally substitute elves as eight feet tall gigachads and gigastacies
>>98827867The Divinity Original Sin 2 elves are tall skinny gangly fuckers who are carnivorous and able to gain memories by consuming the dead, and even can get surface readings from living people by licking them
I actually prefer elves being tall, slender, and lighter than the average human. Being taller gives them presence, and everyone prefers being tall over short. Being slender and light makes the idea of otherworldly grace and poise understandable feasible; if you weighed half as much, but were just as strong you could easily have immense control over your body's movements. I like to think of elves as the titanium to man's steel and dwarves stone.And while I like big tits, they just look off on elves; big tits belong on human women, and ubiquitously on dwarven women.
Top obviously.
>>98828506Yeah, Warcraft sucking ass is definitely a factor in elves being generally ruined, good point. Man Blizzard has really had nothing but a negative impact on society.
>>98828506>>98828935Between these and pauldrons, Warcraft's damage to fantasy aesthetics is unmeasurable.
>>98825422Yes, and people also played games, unlike now. Everything authentic on /tg/ was eliminated around 2019-2022. It was already in decline but that was when it actually died.The proof is all around you. This is all that's left.
>>98824917Neither. Elves are a higher race. They are tall and dolichocephalic, with fine features and subtle expressions and mannerisms. They detest noise, are prone to solitary diversion and thought, the sexes of the elves are more androgynous in both mannerism and thought.They are prone neither to quick emotions nor impulsive action, but frequently to whims and fancies which they put forth in the moment only to entertain themselves briefly. Only over long periods--months, years--can an elf truly be worked into a state of rage or sorrow, and once there they cool very slowly, as a stove heated in the morning might still be warm at dusk--and once set to course they move inexorably onwards until reaching their destination or until stopped.They are centered, in all things, upon the crushing, measureless burden of history, both within and without themselves, and have neither vulgar animalistic breasts nor bestial, cellulite marred asses. It is the heart of the elf which is heavy.
>>98828935>a factor in elves being generally ruined, good point.how? Night elves are just wood elves but purple
>>98824938Tolkien Elves were huge Aryan gigachads. Tolkien was irritated that they kept depicting Legolas as a twink when he was a tall strong prince.
>>98824938>If you want "heavy" characters, pick a dwarf.no! canonical buff elf exist! look at Uthegental Del'Armgo from the Drizzt series
>>98829311>*does the stereotypical nerd snort, pushes up glasses* UMM ACKTUALLY they're more like WILD elves but purple, which were the 3rd edition D&D elf subrace that were described as more savage and barbaric than other elves and dressed in skimpy tribal outfits and animal skins exactly like warcraft night elves are famous for. They even have silver hair called out as a common hair color exactly like Night Elves.WC3 Night Elves are so savage and bloodthirsty that even the orcs that first encounter them are impressed. Metzen and the other lead blizzard devs of the era were unapologetic about their love of 3rd edition D&D and they even made a bunch of official OGL warcraft roleplaying game books using 3e rules. culturally they're also basically elven anprims with a religious fatwah against all arcane magic because they blew up the planet ten thousand years ago so they hunt down and kill any elves caught using it
>>98829346>dressed in skimpy tribal outfits and animal skins exactly like warcraft night elves are famous fortruly their greatest contribution to society
>>98824917Bottom heavy.But I also made mine an evolved form of tree, so of course þeir "roots" are wider þan þe trunk.Tree > Leshy/Ent > Sprigan/Nymph > Elf
>>98829390Did you add the thorn to your keyboard or are you copy pasting it
>>98829390"The" is written with an eth, not a thorn. The others are correct, though.
>>98829406I use þe ALT codes on PC and just toggle on þe extended symbol option when I'm on my phone.>>98829406False. In English þey're 100% interchangeable, & eð is an Irish character anyway.
>>98824917Both? Both. Both is good
>>98824917Depends on your setting and what exactly your elves are and are meant to represent. I prefer them tall, slim, athletic, and universally flexible with C-cups being seen as large anything bigger than than that regarded as non-aesthetic and probably a sign of bloodline impurity by other elves if it occurs naturally.Certain elves are fully aware of how beautiful they are in the eyes of many lesser races and may use transmutation magic to further enhance their features, of course.
Elves in FR are tall when in Greyhawk they are short.Elves in FR have hands 50% longer than a human. Neither of these get brought up in WotC’s FR.
>>98829311They are wood elves with a moon gimmick.>>98829346>which were the 3rd edition D&D elf subrace that were described as more savage and barbaricWasn't that also the elf subrace that infamously had + 2 Strength?
>>98829336Sure they can be buff even in FR, but they probably can't achieve that large-belly strongman physique.
>>98829843+2 Str and -1 Int. So they're extremely strong but kind of dumb. For reference, half-orcs had the same modifiers for those stats.
>>98829843yes, they were jacked. they also couldn't be wizards/magic users but could be druids which likely inspired Night Elves banning arcane magic as well.
>>98829900Didn't wild elves still have the + 2 Dexterity as well and a malus for Constitution?>>98829904>which likely inspired Night Elves banning arcane magic as wellThat's a fascinating thought.
>>98828506The problem with early warcraft is that everyone is turbojacked gigachad. The bear part and the skin color is the only thing that makes them different from other races.I was enchanted on Lineage 2 aesthetics where elves are either sticks (white elves) or bimbos (dark elves)
