So we all agree that this expansion isn't as good as we thought, right?
No, it is as good as I thought. (not very)
>>739600642It's good but not with a playerbase that played it for almost 2 decades on private servers and minmaxxed the shit out of it.
it was exactly as bad as it was the first time which is also when i quit. came back for official vanilla and the cycle repeated.RIP turtle the true wow successor
Raid log expansion.
I think it's very good, but its meta has sadly aged poorly. I would love to see a pirate server try to give it a little spice and balance like they always do for WOTLK servers.
>>739600642this, but Wrath of the Lich King
>>739600642It's the best WoW expansion (not that great, but still recognizably the same game as Vanilla and yet to take the fucking swan dive into abysmal dogshit that the game was about to take and never emerge from)
>>739602391that's every expansion. even vanilla eventually just becomes raid logging. you can't escape it.
>>739603686Vanilla was the king of raid logging, especially if you weren't in some minmaxxing raid group that went with every single buff and consumable.
>>739602391>>739603686The natural consequence of treating raiding like its the only real content endgame content. Which is an attitude Blizzard started to have in Vanilla and doubled down on ever since.
>>739603720>>739603765B-BUT MUS PARSES
>>739600907exactly thisif was comfykino with a bunch of bros and dadgamers that were average-above average at the game
>>739603765It worked better in vanilla until wrathBecause while I was done raidlogging on my main for the week I could spend the rest of my time leveling an alt(s) back when those took time and commitment to have so they were great to chip away at
>>739600642• Flying mounts ruined the game• 40 man raids being reduced to 20 made no sense• Arena ruined PvP• Giving no reason to go back to Azeroth made the base game sterile and dead
>>739604107PvP in wow was always pointless unbalanced unfun shit.
>>739600642Nobody fucking cares about the like 4th "official" release. You can only re-release the same fucking 3 expansions so many times. The only people who truly care are retards who are desperate to relive their teenage years or garbage WoW content creators that will never stop chasing the numbers the OG fresh vanilla release had.I fucking love WoW, it was my game. But there are things that just have to be let go.
>>739604175>Kaplan is jewish. Pardo is a jewish name.>It's literally always them
>>739604206The world pvp was fun and organic in vanilla. Battleground were ok, but mostly lame. Im not talking about balance, just how gay it was to turn it competitive
>>739600642rolling classic black pilled a lot of wow players I feelthe most humiliated being BC trannies, wrath babies and pandatards
>>739600642It took 3 fucking releases of this shit for you to figure that out?
>>739600642I liked the dungeons and heroics. TBC heroics were WoW dungeons at their peak. Controversial opinion, but I also liked the Draenei and not even as goonbait. I thought the idea of playing as a race of ancient holy warriors from beyond the stars was cool.But, yeah, I think we can all agree that TBC was kind of a downgrade from Vanilla.
>>739603639But the chuds still played through all of Wotlk and didn't quit until Cataclysm, though.
>>739604360in vanilla people just played a game, not running through obligatory checklist created by streamers/ecelebs
>>739604370>the most humiliated being BC trannies, wrath babies and pandatardsCatachads stay winning.
>>739604418Wrath of the Lich King was coasting off of Vanilla and TBC's success.
The only real flaw of BC was the PVP balance. A lot of classes were fucked in arena and you pretty much needed endgame PVE loot to compete at the highest level.
>>739604447unironically it didn't do as much damage to the game's systems as the other 3 did, it was just very uninspired
>>739604418the flip side of that people don't mention is that player growth completely stalled in Wrath. it plateaued after having steady growth all throughout vanilla and TBC. that's when the game's momentum died, it just managed to cling on for a bit cause it was still riding the wave of vanilla/TBC. you'll notice that when most people talk about how Cata ruined the game, it comes down to its revamp of the old world, aka the vanilla world, NOT with anything to do with how it changed from Wrath content. because Cata was actually very similar to Wrath. it's just that they finally stripped away the last remaining vestiges of vanilla and people realized the game they thought they loved was already long-dead.
>TBC in 2007>play whatever you want (i raided as a rogue), enough fresh people for 5ppl/heroics, wiping in raid only means another try, faction balance is somewhat still okay>TBC classic>your class is predetermined by your guild raidcomp, if you miss initial gearing/levelingh phase (1st week) you're fucked, every server is one-sided, wiping in raid usually ends in guild disband
>>739604418WotLK was the culmination of WC3 stories. Illidan, Arthas, everything. The dailies in it were a chore and a lot of symptoms had become casualized. I quit at some point during Cata, myself, and had been playing since release of Vanilla. I remember Cata had just been too casual, and gay. the Disney-fied art style shift is so disgusting, now. I went back for the 20th anniversary with dragonflight, played for a couple of weeks, and, I just couldn't believe how bad the writing had become.
the expansions killed world of warcraft
>>739603720i understand not gathering consumes for BWL or MC, but not getting world buffs for the 40 man's is just asking for a longer, miserable time.I wouldn't even think of doing AQ40 or Naxx without consumes, yeah, gathering them up for a few hours sucks, but I'd take that over sitting in a raid for hours on end.I did both and I'll take farmin for a few hours to clear naxx in 90 mins instead of slogging through it for hours on end because people are too cheap or lazy to get world buffs
>>739604175anyone got the updated one that's focused more on the lore part?
It was the best expansion for its time, but it didn't age well.
At this point WoW is the ultimate "hybrid class" of MMOs.Mediocre at everything, except maybe raiding.
>>739600642TBC is amazinf until you are done with heroics and fully attuned. As every other iteration of WoW, it falls apart once the raid logging starts.
>>739604963>until you are done with heroicsheroic dungeons are miserable because no one understands threat mechanics and just starts going ham thinking its like retail
>>739603765blizzard had that mentality from the very beginning because the game was designed by everquest poopsockers
>>739600642TBC was the first modern mmorpg expansion. Shifted from being a living world to endgame only. Vanilla WoW was a casual Everquest with level focus on quests instead of grinding without quests. TBC was the first modern MMORPG.
>>739604762The power creep is what killed WoW for me.>Get epic gear from raids>Next expansion has quest greens that are better than your epics>Boars you kill have more hp than the previous expansion's raid boss
>>739605034>Shifted from being a living world to endgame only.Vanilla was like that already, world felt alive only because stable influx of new players kept low-level locations populated.
>>739605076Nah, most people still played it like a virtual world and chat room. There were so many people who played from 1.0 - 1.12 and never reached 60 because they just were online to have fun. More than raiding tigole jews.
>>739605151mostly cause leveling after 50 was absolute ass
>>739600642TBC is in a weird spot of raiding where you need to be certain class typically shaman/warlock in order to get invited, other spots are for friends or actual degenerates.Wotlk and Vanilla had it much better.
>>739605225Nah. Because most people were chatting in IF or OG and had fun with their bros. Same goes for all the other older MMORPGs. No one was even interested in doing 'end game'.
>>739605039bro, aint that the truth. Everyone was so salty about that at release. It made no sense and could have been planned way better.
>>739605261Good thing now we have sever discords and can chat wherever we are))))))0)
>>739600642
>>739605284You know that discord is total different to have a persona in a virtual world. just kys already tigole.
>>739604259>But there are things that just have to be let go.Why? If a game is fun, play it.
>>739605371>MMO in 2026>fun
classic needs to die in order for it to thrivewhat I mean with this is that terminally online niggers need to disappear from playing this game over and over again so that new, fun people can join instead of metafaggots speedrunning through levelling dungeons and ruining everyone's vibe because they've seen the dungeon for the 1000th timeMMORPGs used to be about exploration. Go find the original vanilla box and take a look on the back, they were showcasing areas and cool places to explore, enemies to kill, instead of focusing it on raids.
>>739605039For how WoW is designed power creep is inevitable, even vanilla suffered from this problem
>>739605241And to add on it, things change drastically with p3 once good gear becoming much more attainable, even better at last phase, but overall yeah no easy loot pinata of Onyxia and MC where 10-20 ppl carry entire raid with ease, everything is min-maxed and all raids want full clear and ask unreasonable high item level, perfect comp. Even for heroic they typically demand raid gear because of mix/max efficiency.Expect player count to double if not triple by end of TBC.tl;dr TBC is nigger expansion but things get better as phases envelope.
>>739605492This. It's just playing excel at this point. The most fun I've had in this game was with 3 other irl friends, levelling and exploring and doing dungeons completely blind. We had so many funnt stories, vendettas against allies, etcTerminally online losers have ruined this game
TBC as its original concept is amazing, not in the same vision as classic but it's a great experience nonethelessthe way blizzard released in original classic and now in anniversary is complete ass however, they completely butchered the whole thing and it just doesn't work
>>739605320The most fun I ever had in WoW was the server wide event of opening the gates of Ahn'Quiraj. That took place over a month or two on my server. I see faggots speed running it now in 2020 classic in 5-6 days. what is the point
>>739605563>Terminally online losers have ruined this gameTerminally online losers ruined gaming in general.Hell, there are people who 'professionally' playing fucking rimworld.
>>739605618The gayest change blizzard invented is mega-server as consequence of hardcore layering, and it was done just for the sake of that 1 streamer server being overpopulated, there is no sense of community and scarcity anymore.
>>739605618>I see faggots speed running it now in 2020 classic in 5-6 days. what is the pointbecause of the scepter questblizzard knew but did nothingeveryone should've been able to do the questthere was so much third trading with gold going on, at one point, guilds on the opposite factions collided together to kill anyone not part of their "list"
>>739605792Kill all streamers. Modern devs and publishers don't make games for normal people anymore; they make games that look good on stream or are tailored for streamers.
>>739605618And her I play like it's being 2004. Level 21 and already 36 hours.
>>739605492>>739605563The best way to play the game is with a group of people who are competent, but not hyper-sweaty. Classic has convinced me that ultra casual dad gamers can be just as toxic as the terminally online minmaxers. Like, I don't care about doing speedruns or parsing 99s, but good man, it is not that hard to look up a guide on how to play your class and a boss strategy. The mystery and exploration of 2005 was fun, but it's a solved game now. I don't have patience anymore to spend hours wiping in Karazhan, and then listen to you bitching about gatekeeping when nobody wants to carry you. You really have to find a chill group who can get shit done but isn't going to take it uber-seriously either. They're pretty hard to find though, most of the community is made up of either turbo-sweats or turbo-casuals, not much in between these days.
>>739606020>it is not that hard to look up a guide on how to play your class and a boss strategyyou don't need guides. just use your brain. Guide users are on the same retarded level as 'dad gamers', but still less annoying than comp faggots.
>>739605492
>>739606161based and truepilled.
>>739600642If you were actually there you'd remember everyone hated tbc by the end
>>739606312TBC was only liked by raiders and comp arena guys with their fucking forced esport stuff.
>>739606059I'm not asking you to spend 2 hours watching guides. Just know your rotation and have even a vague idea of what the bosses are going to do. That's literally it. >just use your brainSure, unfortunately many classic players seem unable to do this. So just take 5 minutes to glance at wowhead before jumping into a raid, please. I mean whatever, I'm not playing that shit anymore. But God I got so sick of casuals. (I'm not talking about the type of casual who just likes to chill and level, that's cool in my book. just specifically the kind you meet in endgame)
>>739606161lmao I made this, I think 4 years ago, nice that people saved it and shared it.Another one I made
>>739605241>TBC is in a weird spot of raiding where you need to be certain class typically shaman/warlock in order to get invited, other spots are for friends or actual degenerates.A Shaman and Shadow Priest for each group, never gets old. Or you just stack shamans and switch a shaman into the parsing warriors group every time he needs heroism.God, it really is amazing how fucking retarded the playbase is, repeating the same mistakes over and over again. Wanting unnerfed content, everyone cries saying it was overtuned and buggy(which it was) then they nerf everything. Then TBC comes out again, and instead of learning from that mistake, the playerbase swears it will be different this time and wants the unnerfed versions of the raids, only for them to realize it was shit and cry for nerfs once again. I swear to god how the fuck do they never learn?
>>739604470separating pvp/pve loot is fucking gay. you should be rewarded for getting the rare drop weapon from the last boss, beating out every other player for the roll and one shotting green machines with it. resilience is fucking gay. vanilla had it right with pve gear and pvp gear being pretty similar and being able to mix/match them.
>>739606391thank you for your servicealso that pic is so true it hurts especially the gurubashi troll and ogre, i wanted those fuckers since before the game even came outhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iqIVxEpQEms
>>739606472amani not gurubashii'm retarded
>>739606472>>739606502Thanks, I let go of the game recently, tried to play Alliance instead, but it wasn't the same.You should check out this game, it gives me that comfy, campy feeling. Also the voice acting is quite good, with renowned voice actors like optimus prime, and Thrall is voiced my Mr Krabs.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AibRNEu449c
>>739606161kek
>>739600907that's the truth we need to accept about every single "RETVRN" game.Even if it's not one that's been pservered into total efficiency, a public re-release will do that to it because that's what the modern MMO audience does. Datamining, scraping, wikis, fight logs, all automated and running within a week of the unofficial discord server going live.Yes, we metafagged back in the days, but not like this. Allakhazam and thottbot were useful but not always accurate, statistics were player reported, boss kill strats were trade secrets.it's a silent, terrible efficiency we have built.
Warcraft is the best example on how money corrupts your ambitions and your soul. It was just a bunch of metalheads in to DnD, the early productions of using the Warcraft 3 engine for the beta of World of Warcraft was pure soulMetzen really had it all, alongside his friend Samwise. They threw it all away for short term profit because none of them were able to handle their profits well. I mean Activision literally THREW money at Blizzard and told them to make cool shit, at the cost of adding microtransactions.
The expansion is great.Everyone being jammed on one megaserver full of bots and meta slaves with some fascinating combination of horrible decisions and outright neglect by the developers for months at a time is not great.Classic WoW has been one giant string of bad choices and self sabotage by the devs since it came out in 2019.It feels intentionally raped.
>>739604595Wasn't Cata the expansion that ruined the talent trees as well? Fuck Cata.
I still can't understand how Nostalrius and Turtle WoW were comfy withouth crying meta faggots while Classic is a shit show (especially on player side)
>>739606890Cata trimmed them down to an anemic efficiency and required you to fill out the capstone talent in one spec before they'd let you put points into another spec, keeping creative combinations completely off the table by not letting you go more than like 2 rows down.
>>739606890not really, I think Cata casualized them a little bit but it still had talent trees. it was MoP that removed the trees.
>>739606890If you mean replacing talent trees with an ability once every 15 levels, that happened in MoPBut Cataclysm forced you to finish your talent tree completely, before using points in other specs. Which killed off the hybrid specs
>>739606890Cata Start was all about CC and stuff because meta fags were crying about WotLK bombing through dungeons and muh difficulty.I will never understand this. I like difficult game when they are fun. Like Demons Souls, Gothic 2 or many Roguelikes. But people want some spastic retarded shit which they break with optimized meta builds anyway.
>>739606630this game was so BASED because the story was very redpilling at that time, I often wonder if they didn't kill it because it highlighted the problem of (((them)))
>>739607004elaborate
>>739606630>and Thrall is voiced my Mr Krabs.which is funny because the voice actor is clancy brown and i was watching shawshank redemption yesterday
>>739606894a lot of the meta people only want to play legit because there's more people and you can brag officially instead of adding the caveat that it's on a private server and therefore fake
>>739600642It -was- good, it isn't now. There's no point. 90% of old MMOs were discovery and exploration. That's over now.There are miles of spreadsheets telling you how to win BC with mathematical perfection. This is the class you pick, this is the trinket you get, this is the "right" way to kill the boss. Everyone's just going through the motions, it's like a historical re-enactment but for a video game from 20 years ago.Oddly enough, from what I hear progression guild leaders are still mentally unhinged narcissists too. So even that's the same.
>>739606894>Nostalrius >withouth crying meta faggotsnost started all this shit with "LESS THAN 10K DED SERVER" and wbuff faggotry
>>739607001early Cata heroics when they were hard before people cried and they nerfed them back to Wrath levels was legit some of the most fun I ever had in the game and one of the vew few redeeming factors of that expansion. good shit. classic players can never seem to decide if the later expansions were too hard or too casual. they seem to accuse it of being both. idk, Cata sucked for a lot of reasons, but I liked this. the real problem of heroic dungeons is that dungeon design was just gutted after vanilla and dungeons were turned from these big sprawling experiences into little hallways you had to grind endlessly. going into Blackrock Depths for 4 hours, doing all the quests, it was an amazing experience. closest the game ever got to feeling like an actual D&D session. they never approached anything like that again after TBC turned dungeons into hallway simulators.
>>739600642Never liked it. In fact it was the beginning of the end.
>>739607027It's just a silly click and point game, but it OOZED soul and it was made by the same russians that created those meme link of zelda/mario cutscenes from youtube poop, but atleast they vastly improved their shit a bit.Anyway, the story is basically how the Orcs got tricked by demons in to doing their bidding with the demon blood, nothing new with that.But they were divided and seperated, while a group of orcs were selling out their race to the alterac humans by feeding them alcohol, slowly taking away their barbarian spirit and turning them in to obedient slaves. There's a fun scene with the Bladefist clan selling their own weapons for a bucket of booze.Surprisingly it had a good amount of lore characters. The only disservice was turning Zul'jin in to a zesty trade merchant.You even had Deathwing smoking a hookah pipe, back before K'naak turned them in to cosplaying humans
>>739604418People showed up for Arthas and the majority left before he released.
>>739605151>Nah, most people still played it like a virtual world and chat room. There were so many people who played from 1.0 - 1.12 and never reached 60 because they just were online to have fun.That's me, I literally leveled up enough to look somewhat adventurous and just went on and explored the map, questing and dungeons were not interesting to me.
>>739606894The average private server player is there because of genuine love for the game or IP.The average metafag on Blizzard servers is there because their surrogate streamer friend told them that this is a game for metafags, taught them how to metafag, so now all they know is metafagging.It's not an organic love of the IP. It's battered housewives trying to overwrite being a mediocre teenager by being a sad adult.If you've ever unironically used the word "speedrunning" and the name of a classic WoW raid in the same sentence, you're actually fucked in the head.
I remember when I first started playing wow, I had a blast running through all these zones, doing quests, going in to dungeons, seeing all the cool gear I would get from themthen I turned max level and I instantly had a moment of realisation when my friends told me that the game was basically just chores and the same content over and over and over for the following weeksI joined in Cataclysm so woe me
>>739606391They never should have added new races to begin with.
>>739607207>big sprawling experiencesI know the Z axis is a nightmare for aggro problems, but remember when dungeons had floors? You could look down from above and drop into a lower floor of the dungeon. That was great. Just looking over the edge of Blackrock Spire and seeing lava below you felt very dungeon-y.Now it's weird that we still use the word dungeon. Half of them are outdoor instances. They're just Diablo rifts that you run endlessly to pull a slot machine lever for Loot X.
>>739607421They should have added 'no ass pull' races.
>>739606020>uses a guide for a boss in classicCringe, try figuring smth out for yourself for once retard
>>739607467anon, we spent 5 hours and 2k gold for all buffs and consumeswe cannot afford wipe
>>739607448it also gave rogue's fall protection, mage slow fall and priest levitate a use instead of just being a noveltyalso it was so cool grinding lockpicking and then sneaking around high levels dungeons looting chestsfelt really special
>>739607410The worst part in my opinion is when they started adding chore islands.Literal islands in the ocean that you fly or port to and do the exact same dailies or loot treasure every single day for fucking months until the expansion ends.It started with Isle of Quel'danas, which wasn't a big deal at the time. The Sunwell had heavy and established lore, the servers worked together to breach Sunwell Plateau, and the dailies were fairly reigned in.But then it just kept fucking going. Firelands, Isle of Thunder, Timeless Isle, Broken Shore, Mechagon, etc etc etc.It's the laziest content they can possibly make yet it's their highest reviewed and fonest remembered. Literally running in circles or standing still waiting for Scrump Dingo to spawn in a two hour window that will die in 10 seconds for a 1% chance at his mount.It's fucking nauseating.
>>739607467The problem are the room temperature IQ retards who play classic still standing in the same fire on the ground after months of doing a boss. It gets tiring man. If the average classic WoW player was capable of understanding more than a single mechanic without somebody shouting it in their ear, I would say sure, fuck the guides. But unfortunately these people barely know how to tie their shoes. >>739607606See, you're also misinterpreting what I'm saying. I don't care about a wipe. I just don't like to.be wiping for hours. There is a middle ground. Both extremes suck ass to play with.
I almost never play Alliance and when I do, its usually a night elf. So i started up a dwarf paly on TBC anniversary. Never rolled a dwarf or a pally before, its ok so far.Dun Morogh was pretty comfy, i can see why people like it, but nothing beats Durotar for me.Lvling thru westfall rn, its ok.
>>739603720>raiding in vanilla>grab all world buffs>log out so you don't die and lose your buffs and so the buff timer doesn't run out>log in 20 mins before raid time, meet up with 40 players so you can run to the raid together without getting ganked and losing world buffs>repeat each week for each character bretty fun
>>739607641>The problem are the room temperature IQ retards who play classic still standing in the same fire on the ground after months of doing a boss.This. The kind of unsalvageable moron who still moves during flame wreath 20 years later and says "heals?"
>>739602284>troontle Post adam's apple
So what are your expectations for classic+?I'm gonna take everything they say with a grain of salt, and it will probably be like this>the same shitty instances from SoD>retail abilities added to classic>microtransactions>difficulty modes>dailiesand they will have learned nothing, nothing, or perhaps they don't care and just want to cash in from the retards playing classic+
>>739600642It's amazing, but Classic WoW has a sickness.>want to do the content cleanlyyou have to raid with sweats that want to do speedrun strats, autists, wankers and gold buyers that ruin the fun of the game. the biggest fucking egos over the most unimpressive "accomplishments" ever. guild is a ghost town outside of raid nights, nobody ever wants to just hang out and talk shit. They have to go raid on their 11th alt to get loot that they will probably never use. constantly whinging about GDKPs being banned.>play more casuallythe worst fucking most annoying players you'll ever fucking encounter. the same 3 in jokes on repeat, the most spineless fucking losers you'll ever fucking encounter because they're so fucking desperately afraid of upsetting anyone. everyone is constantly late, raids will NEVER start on time. nobody is ever held accountable for anything they do or how they inconvenience others. also the flakiest bunch by a long shot.>try to start your own guild as a middle groundforget it. you lose 2 people for every 1 you recruit. absolutely sisyphean. at best you'll be the guild for some idiots 11th alt to soak gear before he eventually pulls it out to raid in his main guild. you will only get the absolute dregs of the server.
>revisionist thread #4552145I don't care about your modern lens or deep analysis of game design and mechanics, vanilla+tbc+wotlk was an unparalleled experience in gaming and will never be matched again. This isn't rose tinted glasses, it's history, it's FACT.It will never be captured again.
>>739607937This. Finally somebody else who understands my plight.
>>739604107>tfw still remember playing BC back in the day and everywhere was basically barren>tfw remember playing [REDACTED] and the world was fucking full of people, even saw some ERPniggers in Ratchet
>>739607937It's not just classic. I remember having those same issues back in vanilla and TBC. Less so in vanilla since most people were clueless at the time but still. I have no idea how to fix it. If you screen the retards odds are you get the tryhards. If you don't then you get people who wear grey gear with a broken weapon and spam wing clip as a hunter for 60 levels. Starting a guild you pretty much have to know a bunch of IRL people or you're doomed to spam invite or slowly wither like you said.It feels mostly like luck to be honest.
>>739607751>>log in 20 mins before raid time, meet up with 40 players so you can run to the raid together without getting ganked and losing world buffsjust pay for warlock summoning lol
>>739607937surprisingly my guild had both and everyone ended up hating eachother
>>739607870Just shit from retail spun in a way by shills to make it seem fresh.>"heroic" version dungeons named something different>daily quest hubs>severely overtune gear completely obsoleting giant chunks of content at a time>vehicle quests>world rares that drop toys and mounts that will be camped 24/7>currency tab with a huge currency bloat>vendors for everything from gear to bags full of materials, raping the economy and removing a reason to even gather>"sanctuary" zones slapped over every new hub, preventing any and all conflict that might hurt peoples feelings>scheduled pvp like Ashenvale requiring you to log in during 3 hour intervals to avoid missing giant chunks of rep and currency>bag slot creep like SoD where you need four 30 slot bags to hold of of the useless shit they give you as currency and materials>complete class imbalance in the other direction where hybrid specs do everything the best all at once>new items clearly have retail art stlye and graphical fidelity like was already seen in SoD, clashing like hell with the aesthetic>raping of Warcraft 3 lore under the guise of "evolving it">forced ties to retail like how Xal'atath was in SoD that shills will call clever storytelling>more gay shit like the homo orcs and homo night elves in the Incubus quest they already added to era>dev self inserts like Grendag Buttfuck who sells dual spec>raping and homogenization of classic dungeons like was done in Wrath and Cata. Think Archaedes in Uldaman. They'll want you to be able to do everything possible in a dungeon in a single run and never return.>collection tabs, turning classic into another dollhouse collectathon>pvp becoming seasons like TBC and beyond>level cap ranges to buy them time for more development and to artificially throttle you in future "fresh" servers>no GM support for bugs that will cripple your character for 3+ months at a time>devs retreating to social media to only interact with flavor of the month streamers
>>739608003there was good parts of it, but it was clearly the blueprint for modern WoW right from the start, they should have made an expansion that was as big as vanilla
>>739604813i think whatk illed it especially is making each expansion focus on late game shit rather than add to early and mid-game
What boggles my mind is how warcraft 3 was launched in 2002 and WoW in 2004, in those 2 years alone they managed to create a giant game that's still fondly remembered to this day, and TBC launched 3 years after classic was made, and that expansion only contained 11 zones and a handful of dungeons (counting in the blood elf and draenei starting zones)and every fucking expansion they added contained less and less, I mean look at Warlords of Draenor and see how much content was cutlike how did they lose the ability to churn out content?
>>739608482IIRC WoW was already in development when WC3 released.
>>739604958>tfw went back to WoW because of some friendsWoW basically wants you to do dungeons to level cap, then raid, everything else is just optional and bullshit.Doing dungeons are ass.Doing quests are ass.Why use my ground mount when I can fly from orgrimmar to shadowglen in two minutes? and at level 10?There is no sense of adventure it's dead.
>>739608482they began in 99 iirc
>>739608482TBC had 15 dungeons and 5 raids at launch.That's pretty damn good considering players were much worse back then and would burn through it orders of magnitudes slower than today.
>>739608571>TBC had 15 dungeons and 5 raids at launch.and a battlegroundshame it turned into arenafest
>>739600642Nah TBC is good i just think people are sick of it. Also the raid logging shit is getting tiring, people want something else.
>>739608571The dungeons are pitiful though, TBC started the hallway dungeon design trend. Compare any dungeon in TBC to vanilla dungeons like Wailing Caverns, Sunken Temple, or any of the Blackrock ones. Theyre pathetic. We went from big sprawling dungeons with 15 bosses that took hours to clear, to hallways with 4 bosses that you clear in 20 minutes or less. The raids were not very substantial either, the only reason they took awhile to clear is because they were super overtuned. Karazhan is the only good launch raid for TBC and I'm pretty sure it was mostly developed for vanilla originally.
>>739608694TBC dungeon-centric gamedesign is an absolute cancer for any player who start mid-expansion.Good fucking luck finding party for Pre-raid/attunes when server is in SSC/TK phase.
>>739607448I hated how the TBC team decided every fucking dungeon needs to be a linear hallway.
>>739607870>>739608303they will 100% reference gay ass retail lore instead of keeping it old school, like they did in SoD
>>739608736>>739607448how did turtle handle new dungeons?
>>739607870Im expecting more Project Epoch than Turtle WoW.Turtle WoW started to get ambitious with all it's new lore that ignored TBC and custom content that i don't think Blizzard will do since it's a lot of effort.Similar to Project Epoch they will just reuse assets from other expansions/remaster some vanilla assets to create new-ish content and keep it pretty tame lore wise. Probably no custom zones (at launch anyway) but new quest hubs. No new races most likely but just new race/class combinations. Im 100% expecting Undead Paladin/Dwarf Shaman. It takes zero effort and Blizzard will be praised for it.
>>739605241I always receive random whispers for dungeon groupst. shammychad
>>739608939actually anon, they went after turtle wow, not project epoch, which gives me some false hope that they will make it like turtle, they didn't add shamans/paladins on the opposite factions with SoD either
>>739608932Dragonmaw was a proper dungeon like Blackrock Spire with multiple floors. Stormwrought didn't really have multiple floors but had the castle section and a swampy/demonic section with a hidden boss. Timbermaw was similar to ZG, even had a summonable boss.
>>739609006They C&D Epoch too.
>>739608967>aRe YoU ReStO?
>>739600642My issue is that sweats won't invite my character to HC unless I equip my pvp trinklet which has higher gear score than my good gear.
>>739600642TBC is great for what it is, but knowing Wrath is inevitable makes it feel like a waiting room.
>>739609180>Spend 6 gorrillion hours raiding>decked in purples>next expac drops >get a green that BTFOs your raid gearSame as it ever was.
>>739609235People cleared Naxx 25 wearing T6 during original wrath. There were several trinkets that survived all the way to Ulduar.
>>739605492Yeah
>>739609235I did gruul and mag in half my naxx gear including weapons
>>739602284Shenna shouldn't you be dodging the Ukrainian drone bombs instead of shilling?
Vanilla has a better feel at 60, especially when gathering rich thorium and fighting people for nodes. TBC is just druid bots flying around and auto picking with 0 contesting. Only upside to TBC is the talent trees fixes a lot of issues
>>739607421THat's right. They should've just made nelfs and undead unplayable npc races with loads of actual content instead
>>739609434>fighting people for nodes>implying most servers are not one-sided at this point
I will say it again.Horde is for misfits.Alliance is for 'civilized' races.Blood Elves don't belong in the Horde.There shouldn't be 4 different types of human to pick.Shaman/Pally shit makes no sense, at least make that shit make sense, with Undead Pally and maybe NE Shaman or some shit.This game isn't a fun world anymore, it's just bullshit, Raiding Tryhards ruined it, and RPers ruined what little RP scene there is or was.
>>739600642it already got exposed the first time it ran. people dipped out quickly.
>>739609919>Alliance is for 'civilized' races.>Blood Elves don't belong in the Horde.That was the point. They put an alli race in the horde and a horde race in the alliance.
It's my first time actually raiding during it and I'm enjoying it, but I do realize now that only vanilla is truly "classic" and every other expansion is "retail". Like people say that wotlk is retail-lite but in reality it started in tbc.
>>739610065Trust me, Anon I know.I wish the broken is what we fucking got, they looked so much cooler.God, I remember blood elves, I remember playing them as a kid to be "cool" I hate myself instead of just accepting my true orc nature.
>>739610065>a horde race in the alliance.
>>739602284I hope we get another private server with the community of turtle one day.
>>739610127the draenei were intended to be the alliances version of bulky beast men. they've talked about it. it was almost pandaren
>>739610127The Alliance is about retaking the old, the Horde is about settling the new. Except forsaken, they kinda do both at the same time in a way. But yeah you see these themes in all the newbie zones.
>>739600642>completely butchered the lore of Frozen Throne characters>instead of Bloodelves living as tragic exiles in Outland, they get retconned back to Quel'thalas, which was a massive waste of story potential>Dreanei are turned beautiful>Quests are quirky "let's test my gnomish fuck-machine", which have nothing to do with the lore, instead of cool shit like "How did Maiev's Nightelf base survive and fare in Outland? What did they have to do to survive? How did they adapt? What are they doing?">>739606161this
>>739610153>learn about turtle years ago>don't join because it seemed like it would fail>years pass>don't join because it will probably be taken down>years pass>decide to check it out>pretty cool>decide to play on it since it'll probably be around for a long time >weeks later they announce the shutdowni missed out on nostalrius because i was busy with college too
>>739600642Yeah. I got forced into RLing Kara and I'm already so burnt out I don't even want to play until Wrath.
>>739610301I got lucky not getting invested into Nost. I played early on, leveled to around 25, came back a year later and leveled when I met an anon from another game. I hit 60 a day or two before they announced the shutdown which was a bummer so I stopped playing.Then I spent 4 and a half years off-and-on playing Turtle aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
>>739610153I just want a server or some shit that would approach the expansions with a classic mindset.Examples:>BC the Portal Never Reopens, so some more zones open/reimagined up like Hyjal and Gilneas emphasizing exploring our World of Warcraft this would just be more Kalimdor and EK, Dalaran is just floating now above Hillsbrad>WotLK Northrend is just a frozen wasteland with barely anybody there except scourge, 2 or 3 neutral settlements in the continent at most>Cata is more about the looming threat of Deathwing reawakening or some shit, I don't fucking know, rather than redo the zones, just expand via islands and smaller continents around Azeroth>Levels remain 1-60 and each expac is less endgame and moreso alternate ways to journey to 60
>>739609180The rat race must go on
>>739600642My favorite expansion is Dragonflight. Not for the story or the world or any of that worthless shit but just for the PvP.
>>739608003That experience was not crafted by the game, but the world and time you lived in.
>>739610456Turtle's idea was adding new zones and new areas within pre-existing zones, throughout the two continents, which was nice. We had Hyjal and Gilneas, among others.
>>739605039>get rare loot from dungeons>next zone has quest greens that are better than your rares>Boars you kill have more hp than the previous zone dungeon boss
>>739609527Grobbulus was balanced all the way to TBC
>>739610780God, I remember playing there, it was so fucking neat.I loved how Gilneas was basically 'Duskwood if he Westfall', was fun hated how RPers were just ERPers or boring as fuck.
>>739600642Pretty much yeah. I had nostalgia for it because I started the game with it in 2007, but revisiting it years later with classic made me realize I mostly liked the 1-60 parts of it, which is just vanilla. And with retrospective I also realized most of what the expansion introduced was dogshit and started the downwards spiral of the game
>>739600642It was fine for its time.
>>739600642HC version when?
>>739606161hate that fucking shnooz dindu nuffin oy vey im being opressed kaplan. the recent pr stunt interviews he did to shill his doa bootleg rdr2 mmo only showed how much of a disgusting kike he truly is lmao
>plays for 3 years>Never hit cap>would always reroll when I hit 30>only time I ever got past that was with an orc rogue>deleted him because a bitch I knew wouldn't leave me the fuck alone and she was 100% the type to make new characters just to bug me ig i /ignored
The only correct way to play wow is to level to cap and avoid dungeoning and raiding.
better>dungeons>leveling>questing>crafting>gearing>pve class balanceworse>pvp class balance>world pvp (fuck flying)>player retention (largely due to the dead overworld)
>>739604175Isn't there a comic that shows his entire infamous rant where he bitched about EQ raid design?
blood elves killed the game
>>739610782That's actually fairly rare in classic. Most of the good dungeon items are stated well enough that they last for 20-30 levels. Flask for Warrior Tanks is something you will use all the way into Naxx and you get that while leveling.TBC was when Blizzard had the itemization wizard and the first pieces of gear you get in Hellfire are better than a lot of the shit you get in BWL.
>>739610905There were lots of regular events but you had to check the discord for posting. Lion's Pride guys were doing weekly stuff for years. There were a fun jousting tournament during the final week.
>>739610780Turtle's made it impossible for me to go back to normal vanilla. I tried to join some friends in a re-launch and dropped out at 30. Gilneas and all the new quests and small changes just made the world feel larger and more interesting. Same with 50-60 with all the new quests that got added.
>>739602391>omg the game isn't coercing me to log in and do my chores every single day forever>bad game design!Retailcucks are an interesting breed.
>>739600642Questing/leveling experience is fun but endgame is boring
>>739611821Yeah same. I can't do stock boring default vanilla ever again. I made a casual character on Chromie but even there I'm going to RDF spam.We didn't even get the latest patch for a full month before shutdown announcement.
>>739611821Yeah this is why Turtle devs added more content in that 30-40 range cause the data showed that's where a lot of people dropped off.Northwind, Balor and Grim Reaches are great additions. Especially Northwind.
>>739608939I fully expect a SoD 2.0. with maybe a shocking addition to draw players back, probably high elves and ogres/goblins with their questing zones folded into pre-existing starter zones and like a small quarter added into Org and SW.You have to remember that the classic WoW team is actually a third of the size that Turtle-WoW's team was supposedly at. Yea they are paid professionals, but they're also corporate and beholden to people that expect minimum effort-maximum pay checks from the consumers.
>>739611778I made a mistake joining an "RP" guild but our fucking GM was an autist who was too busy getting Best In Slot Gear.It was a cool idea too, but man, fucking man did it flop hard because this nigga was too busy doing dungeons and raids.He did a handful of fun events, but his second in command dipped, and so did like one other dude I got along with.
>Expansion>Makes the game smallerAll these retards talking about raidlogging and sweats and meta as if that fucking matters. TBC is shit, just like every expansion and just like Naxx patch. Fuck raising level caps, fuck making new hubs, fuck making a new island of higher level enemies that drop new higher level materials. Fuck everything about WoW expansions.
>>739611713Cool cherrypicking. I can also cherrypick. The best TBC bear idol drops from Strat and lasts until BT. The next best idol comes from a random quest. Some random leather legs with expertise from a lvl 67 quest are bis for most melee classes until ZA.
>>739611949I ended up in the water rodent server. End of the road or not, I was still liking Turtle WoW.
>>739605039exactly>>739605517sure but it was slower, meaning your existing progress was still useful for the new harder content. wow expansions were basically a progress wipe, later even patches kind of were.
>>739612215I felt like RP guilds and groups were easy enough to find but I am a huge chicken and never got directly involved with anything. Something I'd like to change in the future.>>739612329The radio group made an addon so going to try it out next time I launch Chromie. The radio was a great idea.
>>739612329Capybara is pretty good desu. The translator add on is magic and there is a decent number of english players.A good chunk of turtle refugees went to Epoch and even OctoWoW (lol) so it's a bit split atm.
>>739611938>autoattacking mobs to death is fundo you have autism or brain damage
>>739613090weekly gacha pull (raiding) is a downgrade to that pseud
>>739612992Of them, Epoch I was staying from. The C&D already has me jumpy if TWoW was willing to fold. I'm only really on Capy since it's just the Chinese server on the last update, so no growing pains like they have with Octo.I'm still shocked that Blizzard hasn't gone after Bronzebeard and Ascension in general yet.
>>739613153>>739602391Trvke NUKE
>>739609372>"shilling" a dead serverwhat brand of /v/tism is this
>>739613090your brain is just fried. Leveling and questing was and is always the best part of a mmorpg.
>Breh you never played TBC you just can't believe how much better the storyline and setting were in calssic breh god retail WoW storyline is so bad>Ok sounds promising.>Start>It is I, cool person from game prior to WoW! I am now...>CONTEXTLESSLY RETARDED DURRRRRR>This repeats 10x>Well okay then. That's par de course Blizzard I suppose. Surely the world quests will be better.>HELLO YES THERE ARE DEMONS WE HAVE BEEN BATTLING THEM CEASELESSLY BUT THEY HAVE NOT WIPED US YET>But now they totally will unless (you)! solo this camp of...>Checks notes>Ogres and nagas, again. Have fun with that.>Well these are just the starting areas, maybe further ahead.>Hi, it is us! Ethereals! Did you read the novel?>Huh?>Well fuck you then, go steal shit from us from the locals and we won't explain any of this until Netherstorm.Turns out the writing was always fucking stupid, shocking nobody, and it doesn't matter whether I am getting 10 bear asses for a gay centaur wedding or because I need to feed yet another hungry ogre/peasant/down syndrome dranei. It's still not good.
>>739604107>Flying mounts ruined the gameIt didnt, WPvP still happens constantly in Outland in farming spots or Skettis, what ruined that aspect of the game was when they made flying more and more accessible everywhere as the game got older>40 man raids being reduced to 20 made no senseNobody wants to wrangle 40 retards that struggled to run the game with that many people on screen back in the day. 25 mans and 10 mans make more sense because you don't have to look for 20 people that play the same class, its much easier to be coordinate, and form groups/raid comps>Arena ruined PvPHow? Arena isnt my cup of tea either but theres nothing wrong with it and how it affected PvP at that point in time>Giving no reason to go back to Azeroth made the base game sterile and deadYou literally go back to Azeroth to be able to do the first raid dude. Keepers of Time dungeons/raid are also in Tanaris
>>739600642No i hated it, it killed battleground and world pvp somewhat cause everyone wanted arena gear.the grind was ok but back then it was hard to find a group that could do heroics and it sucked for me
>>739609235This only applies from Wrath to Cata onward thougheverbeit
Never understood why anyone cared (or cares) about open world PvP specially in WoW where it's effectively impossible to ever actually engage in it unless you are max level and max geared, while essentially being a nuisance all through the rest of the game.Not even a "tense" nuisance, just a instant deletion ganking sort of thing where either you camp them or them camp them, and nothing meaningful ever happens through the exchange save for griefing one another.
>>739614003Nobody, and I do literally mean NOBODY ever said the story in TBC is good. In fact, since its release almost 20 years ago it was derided for its stupid fucking storytelling and assassination of multiple beloved and interesting characters. You are arguing with fucking nothing.
>>739605389>you don't have fun>therefore others can't possibly be having funAh, the good ole /v/ logic.
>>739614085>Arena ruined PvP>How?isn't bis pvp gear locked behind arena points?
>>739604394>TBC heroics were WoW dungeons at their peak.this, never had so much fun fighting trash mobs
>>739614218nigger what I blasted inflames and soilwork and did nonstop battlegrounds and world pvp on my shittily geared undead rogue in 2007
Objectively the worst thing that happened to wow
>>739614989Now, now, let's not be hasty. Shadowlands still exists.
>>739615101even though everything was shit at least the concept of an underworld is better than Gay Dragon Trannies
>>739600642It is not. 25 years ago I could not get into any raid group because raiding was too difficult. Now that I got better I can say that the bosses weren't hard, it's just raiders who are bad at the game. >>739604394>I liked the dungeons and heroicsYes they were engaging, however if your party members have at least 2 functioning braincells, they become significantly easier.
>>739600642It's the only good expansion but it is from a time when people hadn't already solved the game and there weren't 10000000 videos on how to do every single thing in the game and twice as many guides.Zoomers will never understand what peak WoW was truly like, it hasn't been worth playing for almost 20 years now
>>739614572>we have to stop the naga! they're pooling all the water together!>why>what?>why are they doing that and why is it a big deal>look just shut up and kill them
>>739615794You forget Shadowlands already had the "uh I wasa man but I chose I wanted to be a beautiful grill in the afterlife because that is my real selfu. Ignoring that the afterlife has turned me into a completely different race and is trying to brainwash my memories away from me, of course, what matters is my vagina(male)"
>>739615881What you are saying is that it was never good, you just didn't know it, though?
>new rep grind opens>...>...>thank fuck that's done, I never want to do this area again>oh look a new rep grind
>>739602391ur not doing your ogrila dailies bruv?
>>739600642it was okay but i already played it
>>739600642ive said that since 2007, its pound for pound the worst wow expansion
>we really fucked up with sylvanas people hate her>better make every new female character sylvanas
>>739616074>play simon says every day for a month anon!fuck off
>>739614572Blood Elf starting zone and how they handled the race was GOAT. I remember all the people complaining that they were too evil on launch and that Horde shouldn't have two 'objectively' evil races.Outside of that, writing is pretty dogshit. Demonic infiltration of the Blood Elves makes sense and even Kael playing too close to the sun, but none of it made a lot of character sense considering how seasoned and experienced both Kael and Illidan were.For the longest time the lore-reason explanation for Illidan being a villain and raid boss was that his jobbing to Arthas at Icecrown literally mind-broke him. Kael was also wasted and the only good plot thread to really come out of the expansion was Garrosh.
>>739616023There is not a single game that would be good after 20 years of people making guides, mods, videos etc. on how to beat every single aspect of the game. You are judging it through the eyes of somebody who genuinely believes modern wow is good, which is laughable
>>739616285You are still not explaining what makes it good simply because you don't know what you are doing. You are making totalitarian statements with no real argumentation.
>>739613090you never leveled from 58 to 60 in hellfire peninsula
>>739616398The story, the lore, the atmosphere, the raids, the crafting and trading economy, the added classes, the itemization.
>>739609434>chad viskang vs forced pity daggerman
>>739616398nta, but there's a huge difference in play experience for an unsolved ('fresh') game vs a solved game. fumbling through WoW as everyone everywhere learns how to play the game, then how to git gud at the game, was something that could've only happened the first time around.once the magic of discovery and exploration and optimization is all gone, all that remains is perfecting the execution. we've had years, fucking decades, to optimize execution; it's stale.
I gotta raid tomorrow fellas, wish me luck.
>>739616487>The storyNo, it was shit.>The loreSure. Has nothing to do with guides?>The atmosphere.Again, nothing to do with guides?>Raidslol>The crafting and trading economyI am not sure what part of that gave you a massive boner, my experience was "ask guild what to do, do that", but sure.>The added classesYou mean none until WoTLK or what are you trying to say? That they added them to the other races as they went? Because everyone loudly hated that 3 out of 5 times shitflinging about "muh lore", speaking of.>the itemizationWas as shit as now. Unironically vague stat increases that did not matter in the slightest because at the end of the day everyone knew to just outlevel shit if you had an issue from common sense.What I -will- give is that finding unique gear through quests instead of just receiving generic stat sticks was by all means a more engaging approach.
>>739616721While perfectly correct in regards to the social aspect of games as a whole, which is indeed a done deal and seems to not be coming back, it feels like falling for the optimization meme is something that is entirely up to you outside of that. Not disagreeing with the take otherwise.
>>739600642BC is ass, I never thought it was good
>>739616805>No, it was shit.How so?>lolDidn't explain how?>I am not sure what part of that gave you a massive boner, my experience was "ask guild what to do, do that", but sure.So you are so Z brained that you can't even read a guide on your own and asked somebody else to read it out for you?>You mean none until WoTLK or what are you trying to say? No I obviously meant races nigga, try to keep up>Was as shit as now. Unironically vague stat increases that did not matter in the slightest because at the end of the day everyone knew to just outlevel shit if you had an issue from common sense.Did you even play BC? You're describing item progression in general in every single MMO. I am clearly talking about the set bonuses and synergy between classes and their totems/idols/etc. trinkets, offhands, etc. Healing was the best in BC, Tanking was the best in BC, DPS was braindead but that is literally the role for people who are braindead. Questing was no longer tedious hour long treks every other quest. You have no idea what you're talking about because you lack context of what the norm was at the time.
Sometimes I miss vanilla, but now that I've done everything I wanted to do I don't know if I can play it again. I don't like Blizzard. None of my friends want to play on private servers anymore. I had fun. So much fun, but playing on the Era servers feels wrong. At least my mage and my shaman will stay there, so I could go back any time. But why bother? It's all GDKP, man.
>>739617035>Can't even write a proper coherent post to express thoughts>Obviously I meant <???>>Accusses other people of being "Z brained"Gotcha. You know what, I think I am going to sit this one out. You can take my concession.
>>739603606Nobody who started playing in 2004-2006 thought WOTLK was good. The forums were awful, people crying and quitting. Leveling was boring and slow with many empty looking (and feeling) zones. Especially the starter zones. So many people quit in first months of wrath. The content drought after ICC into Ruby Sanctum was BAD. The bots farming saronite and titanium ore from under the ground and the bots outside that one dungeon it was just awful. The problems in wotlk were never fixed during the entire expansion. The only good thing everyone LOVED was wintergrasp. It brought the whole server together and was where all the old player of the server would be for those that didn't quit at the end of TBC and start of wrath. My server was unrecognizable by ruby sanctum and made me depressed for months. WoW had been my life from age 13 till then. Wrath was when my friends list was mostly perma-offline people and dead guilds were everywhere with only 1 active player that used to be the top of the server. Getting rid of battlegroups was awful too. I was in cyclone battlegroup and recognizing people and having rivalries was much more common back then. Bots in battlegrounds that just sat in the graveyard are insta-released to walk out to die over and over got really bad in wrath.
>>739617217Concession accepted
>>739617035>t. projecting zoomie larping as an oldfaglmao who do you think you're fooling
>>739617332I would post my amani warbear if I felt like installing that slop again but I won't
I really like TBC. I played a holy/shadow priest and enjoyed the story content in outland as you explore beyond hellfire peninsula for the first time and see the full scope of the world of the orcs. The raids also feel like a good end to the different stories in the expansion. The only downside is they dont make other content besides raids so you eventually get bottle-necked into raid content regardless of your efforts to try different stuff.
WoW without playable goblins is of no use to anyone but the garbage bin.
>>739617042>It's all GDKP, man.PvP servers are inherently more cancerous. GDKPs are rightfully shunned on PvE servers, and banned on all Anniversary servers.
>>739616152I can't believe I did that 20 years ago.
>>739617434>I could prove I'm not larping any second now it's just I don't feel like it that's alllmao
The modern mmo player is a blight among the gaming space that needs to be studied
>>739618212This. Our main tank was still keyboard turning when we cleared Black Temple for the first time. New-gens have no concept of what it was actually like back then
>>739600642The first time TBC Classic came around 5 years ago or whenever it was I spent 4 hours in a Karazhan run and I wanted to blow my fucking brains out due to boredom. TBC was the ultimate you think you do but you don't for me.
>no aoe>mediocre damage>melee downsides>sap is a joke>flying mounts completely invalidate world pvpWho would ever play a rogue?Insane that every lfg is 90% rogues
Wow classic players ruin the game for themselves.
>>739618425Karazhan killed a lot of guilds
>>739618545It's fun. Most other classes aren't.
>play warlock through all of vanilla anniversary>class is a bit jank in vanilla but simple to play, rotation basically amounts to pressing a couple dots and spamming shadowbolt with succubus banished>used to being one of the only locks in raid >dps isn't going to really top the charts, but performs decently well once you're hit capped and get a few good crits, certainly not going to outperform those mages >TBC anniversary comes out>every mage switches to warlock>they start telling me how to play, showing me parse data, discussing builds >they start getting competitive in virtual damage meters (who gives a shit, fuck you)>snobby mage faggot in my guild vying for my prestigious role of ranged magic dps lead (the only reason i'm in this position is to do loot and answer questions on gearing if someone needs help)>all the while these faggots don't know what the fuck they're doing and can't even attempt vashj without a 20 minute long explanation on what to doi fucking hate magician niggers like you wouldn't believe
>>739618545Rogues can 1v2 most classes in the game if played at a high level and also quest without worrying about getting ganked
>>739618785>dot clicker know it all fuming at chadicianscan't make this shit up *blinks behind you**shoves a conjured croissaint in your back pocket**teleports to shatt*
>>739610247I can't imagine any horde player thinking wow male draenei are cool and tough I'm gonna play alliance nowThey look like basedfags>muh lightmeanwhile blood elves are literally raping a godbeing chained in their basement for holy magic
Im a high rated arena player across many expansions and some private servers, and the fact of the matter is 95% of wpvp interactions are griefs or ganks and I say this as someone who mains a feral.Most players actively avoid a 1v1 between a competent player that is a class counter.
>>739600642YOU KNOW, There is a reason of why people took a year long break to play oblivion when naxx and tbc tier 1 retarded grind overdrive happened.Because players saw the writing on the wall that the pvp arena system would suck ass that warlocks would be stuck with 1 set of crafted tier gear all times because of tigole, the retarded grinding to force people to be subbed and ignore other vidya and touch grass, and ofc the retarded raid experiments.People came back to wrath because blizzard aka team 1 listened to the crowd for once, and never more when activision took full control by the time of ulduar pre patch, because they needed reasons to keep retards occupied and druing their wallets ingame.
>>739620412>year long break to play oblivion when naxx and tbc tier 1nah I went to city of villains
>>739605039>Next expansion has quest greens that are better than your epicsfalse>Boars you kill have more hp than the previous expansion's raid bossfalsewhy lie?
>>739620412Wrath killed WoW bro... Adding multiple difficulties to raids, adding LFD, killed downrankingThey made it a babby game and it has lead us where we are now
>>739620561Also a good choice at that time, crysis mp at release was good shit too.2006 trully was the last year for good vidya.
>>739620587>my factually incorrect statement backed up by none of the player feedback on top of that killed the game bro, it's overWhy are you people like this
>>739620693>none of the player feedback??? I'm a player and that's my feedback. Having multiple raid difficulties and LFD killed the game and its community. No we're stuck with the gay soulless husk we have now
I like retail, systems wise. If I could delete the main campaign altogether and keep the high definition artwork but without going full Disney Chink Discount Production, I'd have no complaints about it. Then again I don't care about raids/PvP and never did, so those waves never hit me.
>>739620885Nobody agrees with you, anon. So maybe it's just a you thing?
>>739620924retail has better gameplay but besides that everything else is dogshit, the world is shit, the systems are trash m+ is horrible, delves suck dick, the vault is garbage shit tier weekly system, can't say much about the raids they are fine I guess.
>>739620972Tell me how raiding is better off with 3-4 difficulty levels. Tell me how LFD didn't kill the community. Tell me how downranking didnt kill healing
>>739620587That didnt killed wow unless you are a pve sweatshit from europe like preachgaming and the other raidloging fatsos who necame friends with the devs.What killed wow was cattering to these retards, including sweatlord pvpfags, because god forbid leaving wow to have a life or play other games, come back and get kicked out of the server itself for not raidlogging or grinding like a faggot all times to not fullfil the inflated gayscore quota even in the guild.
>>739621031I like delves. They comfy and easy to wear.But jokes aside, I overall enjoy the world design more for what it is intended to be. Most of Classic WoW is honestly empty, unusuable, boring as fuck zones where you will do nothing but slog through the same three skeletons or iron dwarves or birds/wolves, to find nothing.The atmosphere? Much better, but once you actually are playing you notice you aren't really... doing anything. Which worked back when the populations of players were massive and you would set out to socialize and shit.But MMOs are not that anymore and I don't want to talk to retarded kids online. So I appreciate I can set out on fields and have a shit fucking ton of random nonsense to find and do, should I feel like going around doing random nonsense.
>>739621145All the things you mentioned stem from changes made in wotlk lol. Even shit like gearscore originated in wotlk
>>739620972I agree with him. Now what, pseud? Fracturing a community like that in an MMO of all games is always a net negative
>>739621373Now you two can go kiss in the contrarian corner.
>>739621260>But MMOs are not that anymore and I don't want to talk to retarded kids onlineYea that's the point nu-Blizzard cultivated people like you. When I played 2019 classic I met so many people again, because the game forces you to be social. Meanwhile, Retail is just a shit tier, queue simulator.
>>739621272Gearscore Began in tbc, Late BT progression to be exact because SWP progression was such a shitshow that led to blizzard to listen the players for once.It didnt matter in the end because the top guilds lost tbeir shit that jimmy was gearing up outside their circlejerk.
>>739621408>moving the goalpostyeah because not liking a fractured community in an MMO is a contrarian opinion lmao brainlet
>>739621610>Gearscore Began in tbc, Late BT progression to be exact because SWP progression was such a shitshow that led to blizzard to listen the players for once.Never happened. It started as a mod and became popular around late ulduar and early totc
>>739621797>USING AII rest my case, this anon is a retard.
>>739621797>AI overviewhahahaha
>>739621879>>739621948>no argumentconcession accepted
>>739621879>>739621948He's right though WOTLK didn't add gearscore.
>>739606161>>739606391pic related however i'll be a board contrarian and say blood elves on horde side was a good decision, you would've simply had absurd faction imbalance without it which even at 60/40 ruins the entire game
>TBC fag using ai slop to defend TBCMy sides are in orbit.
>>739621797this. I never installed that shit
I’m having fun with friends. On launch we got together at my house and broke the night cracking jokes, doing dungeons, questing. Now we’re raiding together and it’s amazing. >but anything is fun with friendsYeah no shit and wow is like the one game my normalfag friends still like because we played it together as children.
you dont have to samefag that hard just because your claim was corrected
>>739621797gearscore was used in late tbc by guilds as a high pass filtering mechanism, if you had above even basic dungeon gear then i'd look at you more seriously for a spoti remember because i was there little zoom, sorry your ai summary is wrong
Never played Wrath, is it fun? I haven't been playing on the current anniversary servers but am interested in coming back assuming they do Wrath next.
Quit within 2 weeks of launch. Took no time to hit 70 and see all of its problems. The tank issue is just a small one. Ques are atrocious, the nerfed raiding is extremely boring, the 3 button raiding is extremely boring, the dungeons are extremely boring. The community is amongst some of the worst in all of gaming. It's metaslave sweat niggers that are sweating on a 30 year old game designed for 200ms dialup speeds and computer hardware that barely was a hundreth of what we have today. Everything about this game is shit. Everything. That isn't even getting into the devs themselves which are walking garbage with no understanding of game development.
>>739621439No, the internet simply became popular. Good for you if people back then had so little to choose from in their online communication they had to settle with you. It's not the case anymore. Pretending it somehow relates to the game design is as retarded as taking raids seriously.
>>739622614Its fun the first patch up to ulduar, then it becomes raidlog simulator
>>739622832>Good for you if people back then had so little to choose from in their online communication they had to settle with you.You do know humans are social creatures that's why we write together right now? Nu-Blizzard just made the game unsocial as fuck, because they hate their own player base and then they added the most addicting skinnerbox mechanics to it.
>>739622536Inspecting people was not gearscore, people always inspected people to see if they could handle content. The problem was attaching a number to each piece of gear and then setting an arbitrary allowable number for specific content.The gearscore addon did not release until 2009, Wotlk was released in 2008. There was no gearscore in BC, it is one of many things that started in wotlk and ended up killing the game.https://stormstrike.wordpress.com/2009/11/04/more-than-just-gearscore-an-interview-with-gear-scores-developer/Objective proof
>>739622832>making it so people could do content that previously required communication didn't kill communication!>Oh and them merging all servers into one mega server? Didn't kill previously existing communities.>Literally deleting the forums for each individual server? Nope, didn't kill the communityGen Z has no concept of how good gaming was before their time. They have never played a true MMO in their entire lives. Being able to walk through a city and recognize a large amount of people was the norm back then, now it's an impossibility
I would rather take a 12 hour burger flipping shift in detroit than quest in outland and participate in the tigole's retard dance raidlogging.The zones, the retcons, the quests, the characters, the raids, the travel, what a God awful expansion it truly was, completely going against vanilla's philosophy. It's saving grace was the old web culture that nerds could connect to each other. Now the shittiness was coiled and even elevated by "classic" which made everything even worse by web2.0 spergs, trannies and sweats who want to win the marathon which has been already over many years ago.
>>739622536nobody did SWP or such with randos late TBC, and if they tried they'd most likely give up very soon. in case they were out for new blood they'd have a proper interview by someone in a guild or by posting a guild recruitment application on their forums. PUGs were a thing, sure, but they indeed took their time to see who's who by whispering them your average gear level e.g "mostly kara, couple of SSC" and maybe taking a quick glance to see if they actually did sport the gear the claimed
how the fuck do you people manage to log in every week with 24 other people, you're not gonna like them all right?
>>739624001Nowadays? It's hard to find one WoW player I enjoy interacting with. The only people left are the most insufferable people imaginable
>>739600642>So we all agree that this expansion isn't as good as we thought, right?No that's WotLK
>>739624308It's the same people anon, just twenty years later.
>>739624308i'm in a guild where the officers had a irl meetup and just told the rest of the guild to fly over if they wanted to
>>739624001I'm glad if just one person lol at my jokes
>>739609919Blood elves on the horde make sense.Lorelets forget they were treated like shit by the Alliance because of Garrithos hating any race that wasn't human and the blood elves decided they were better off with literally anyone else but them. Not to mention when Kael considered allying with the Naga, he basically wanted the entire army Kael brought with him put to death in Dalaran.The only conflicting lore is that they would be willing to work with the forsaken knowing they were the ones that caused all of their suffering to begin with.
>>739625791>Lorelets forget they were treated like shit by the Alliance because of Garrithos hating any race that wasn't human and the blood elves decided they were better off with literally anyone else but them. Not to mention when Kael considered allying with the Naga, he basically wanted the entire army Kael brought with him put to death in Dalaran.nigga the orcs and trolls tried to sack their kingdom lmfao
>>739612861>The radio group made an addon so going to try it out next time I launch Chromie. The radio was a great ideaWhat is the radio thing you mention?I'm trying to explore new private servers, I'm burnt out on ascension, and I can't decide between v+ or chromie.
>>739625791who's the lorelet now, dylan
>>739625973>nigga the orcs and trolls tried to sack their kingdom lmfaoThe second war wasn't their war. They just participated it on the alliances side. And what did they get out of it? Fucking nothing, and the alliance tried to have them put to death, and the night elves kept trying to sabotage them in the WoW era after they got rocked by the scourge already and are completely fucked up.The Amani trolls did fuck with them, but they are aware that the Amini aren't allied with the horde and the darkspear trolls half way across the world on Kalimdoor, aren't the ones that were constantly trying to kill them.It's more unlikely that they were willing to work with the forsaken, but if they somehow manage to get over their prejudice about that, why can't they about a troll tribe that had ZERO doing with the Amani.It was clear that it was horde or nothing, while they alliance would continually fuck with them for no good or valid reason.
It's time to face the fact that Warlords of Draenor was a great expansion.
>>739626941Bullshit, by that time the RPG books were canon, No one trusted the blood elves.Blizzard made all a "non canon" bullshit to justify tbc.
>>739626941you sound like an incel. the blood elves are white skinned and are a human-adjacent race. They should have rejected the zug zug and joined with the humans. This is especially true considering the alliance in WoW is not the same human group that Garithos belonged to.
looking back as a stoner 15 year old tanking heroics and karazhan it was fun flying was actually tedious despite how new jt was and 5000g was a lot for epic speed I had more fun exploring the zones on foot
>>739627381it was and I even liked legion but I was into dopamine simulators like garrison I made fuckin millions
>>739627538Blood elves became demon worshipping junkies thanks to kael'thas.Both Sides hated their asses, and they hated in double.Orcs mainly for they see the stench of corruption in them from the first war, and most alliance races, including high elves for being in cahoots with the legion.
What % of the classic wow playerbase is brown skinned?
>>739600907It was never good.>just run the same dungeon 50+ times to max your rep so you can raid bro>just run the same heroic 40 times to get your preraid bis bro>world pvp bro?Nah, here's a flying mount so you can ignore everything>item use in pvp? Nah, arenas disable everything, sorry bro your grenades, engineering and alchemy don't matter anymore lmao and all the cool items like tidal charm or reflectors now only work when you're 60, sorry bro, you can't upset that mage with a reflected pyroblast anymore, that's unbalanced!>pvp outside of arenas? Are you a fucking scrub bro, REAL pros only play arenas higher rating means you have a bigger penis!>Economy and trading? Nah bro, just do your dailies to get your badges and your gold bro>Dungeon layout? A straight path that loops back on itself, fast and convenient! And there's a set of three dungeons in every place so you don't actually have to go anywhere and do anything (Auchidoun, Hellfire, Tempest Keep)Anyone that unironically shills for TBC is brain damaged.
>>739630530Blizzard at least tried to unfuck this in wrath, but nope sweaties gonna sperg.
>>739630530World PvP was already shit anyway.
>>739630914Wrath definitely was a step in the right direction, but it still retained all of the TBC faults. It just had more stuff to offer than what TBC had, so they were not as apparent, which is why WOTLK is so well-regarded and remembered. It was also when WoW became truly mainstream.>>739631147>We didn't need it anywayLess content is less content, whether you like it or not.
>739630530>just run the same dungeon 50+ times to max your rep so you can raid brofalse, dungeons only needed like 20 runs to get from neutral to exalted with no quests or turn-ins. lower city revered only needs 8-9 runs of shadow labs if you do the feathers and quests>just run the same heroic 40 times to get your preraid bis brou dont need preraid for kara/gruul/mag anyone saying otherwise is a retail troon>Economy and trading? Nah bro, just do your dailies to get your badges and your gold broa bunch of preraid bis items are boe or bop from profs. have you even played tbc nigga?>world pvp bro?Nah, here's a flying mount so you can ignore everything>item use in pvp? Nah, arenas disable everything, sorry bro your grenades, engineering and alchemy don't matter anymore lmao and all the cool items like tidal charm or reflectors now only work when you're 60, sorry bro, you can't upset that mage with a reflected pyroblast anymore, that's unbalanced!>pvp outside of arenas? Are you a fucking scrub bro, REAL pros only play arenas higher rating means you have a bigger penis!>Dungeon layout? A straight path that loops back on itself, fast and convenient! And there's a set of three dungeons in every place so you don't actually have to go anywhere and do anything (Auchidoun, Hellfire, Tempest Keep)these you can have though!
>>739626218A few patches ago, Turtle WoW launched an in-game radio where they had a goblin DJ and played Warcraft-related music (official soundtracks and fan songs) while featuring thematic 'advertisements' such as dwarves selling the best smithing services, elves doing enchanting, and random commentary on zones like how hot Silithus must be.This eventually expanded to include many other people doing things like readings of specific lore events (i.e., Medivh during WC2), weekly 'market'/server updates that would discuss consume prices, notable events over that past week, etc., and other musical DJs hosting sets where they'd play real-world music while meeting in-game to /dance and hang out and socialize.Anyway I haven't messed with it yet but they uploaded a radio addon to the twow discord that is supposed to have many channels, some related to WoW and some not. Listening to the radio ingame was a nice reprieve from the same OST tracks over the past 20 years.
>>739630530Wrath was still shit but I will finally cede ground and say wrath was better than TBC. I just like the gear mostly in TBC more than Wrath to be honest. If tmog was in wrath instead of Cata it would dwarf TBC forever for me. I'm over it though, fuck that game forever.
>>739631494Blizzard made the saronite plate set inspired on quake 1 death knights
>>739631329You needed heroic drops to gear your tanks for Gruul and Mags'.
>>739626218>>739631432I found the git for it.https://github.com/paokkerkir/WowRadio-Vanilla Guess it only works for vanilla RIP
>>739607207Cata heroics werent even that hard outside that 1 boss in stonecore and Grim Batol. They just required people to not be stupid.
>>739627513I mean.>white wolfThat's the foremost kneejerk, and then the following is that I really wouldn't push a TTRPG adaptation as being the utmost end all for new lore for the Warcraft IP.They tried to guide white wolf as much as they could to make content for their TTRPG but they needed to do leg work as well and took some liberties as white wolf is known to do.>>739627538>leads with a personal insult>proceeds to lead in with the most racist chud argument aliveOkay faggot. They were both functionally the alliance, the difference is, they were picking themselves up after the fall of Loderon and had zero help from the south. Functionally, they had the support the dwarves, high elves, and humans from the region just like the "le mainstream alliance" but incapable to rejoin the fold after the collapse.Also doesn't negate the espionage tactic of the night elves who already fucking hated them anyways.Just because they look human doesn't mean they belong on the alliance, then the undead also belong on the alliance as well with that dumbass take.
I am playing TBC for the first time since 2008 and this is my hot take on it. I play a holy priest so I am having a lot of fun. I didnt level professions and most of my gear came from karazhan. I mostly skipped heroic dungeons except for the daily quest every now and then and the T5 attunements. I have a shadow gear offset which is just items that I got in raids that nobody else could use/wanted. I have exclusively played through PuG raids and have had a lot of fun. I only login when I want to and I skipped the grinding for consumables and other stuff because only dps really need to worry about their "parse".
>>739631432HOLY FUCKING SVOLThat is some high grade kino if I ever heard of some. Damn I kind of regret not playing on turtle now.
>>739632408and it was better, but then retarded smug south cuntlifornian culture dictates that only their farts should smell better than the rest.
TBC is good, but life sucks.
>>739621031>retail has better gameplayCan this bullshit lie finally die? Retail doesn't have better gameplay. The gameplay is so hollow and doesn't feel weighty compared to Classic or other old MMORPGs.Flashy and fast don't mean it's good. Even the zones are better in Classic or old MMORPGs. Do you really need a map full of shit every few meters? Modern maps make no sense. They are too tiny for all the stuff that is happening in them. There is no sense of scaling whatsoever.
>>739631432I MISSED OUT!
>>739624315Gameplay wise? Nah.Atmosphere wise? The best expansion.
>>739633337I feel like you could beat a pro by just button mashing in retail. In vanilla you have to know your class and the enemies class to win.
>>739633596Not him but... I still remember the fucking T1 Tauren Druid back in STV, summer 2005. I was questing on my level 46 Dwarf Paladin when he jumped me. I had Seal of Command active, and it kept proccing like crazy. I fucking wrecked him. Sure, I had to use my bubble and Lay on Hands, but he actually fled right as I was about to deliver the killing blow. I still remember that fight... damn, I was shaking after that.
>>739634043That's what it was about, mane. I used to be a stealth cat in STV with waterbreathing pots just waiting for people to cross the river. They never expect it. I went for the orange levels on purpose.
>>739634412>I went for the orange levels on purpose.based lad.
>>739632547btw I'm trans
>>739631936I mean, I read through the lua provided in the source. I don't know if they decided to go away from the WoW themes as described, but the azeroth radio stream def isn't warcraft themed.This is all like generic internet radio unfortunately and I don't see any of the cool WoW theme shit I was hoping to find.You aren't missing much.
>>739633596>In vanilla you have to know your class and the enemies class to win.Thank you for laugh.
>>739600642test
>>73963485095% of the people in retail do less damage than a Single Button Assistant (SBA). The worst thing about most people in retail is they think they are good just because they memorized some artificial simulated rotation on a dummy.
In hindsight, it's Wrath that I think ruined the aestetic and direction, even though I loved it at the time and it's still miles better than anything after.>gear went from bright colorful class fantasy to drab browns and "realistic">fully embracing badge systems with tiers of badges, vendors for each tier, and exchange rates>Wintergrasp being outdoor ensuring most servers just had one faction near perma own it>Achievements promoting players to treat the game content as a checklist rather than simply ignoring the parts that didn't appeal>embraced gearscore rather than stomp it out>Crystalsong was an entirely wasted zone because Dalaran was a resource hog on old computers>tabard system, while convenient, made no sense. Why are dragons and the Kirin'tor happy that i'm killing metal dwarves in a factory or vikings in their castle?>easy to play and overpowered "hero class" asking players to level a character far past halfway to even switch. Also encourages fotm rerolling for a quick power boost since you come out as a DK around 58.>dungeons were even shorter thanTBC hallways now that AoE is king>gutting Naxx's legacy so they can have baby's first raid>removing Naxx from Eastern Plaguelands as legacy content>old world and Outland now sped up even more and all remaining elites downgraded to normal, cementing leveling as a hurdle instead of an experience>Fall of the Lich King not being a de facto finale to this arc. Bolvar becoming Lich King drags this scourge plot along like a beaten dog>vehicle combat in general>Argent Tournament cementing Blizzard's new patch design of the same dailies for 2 months in exchange for mounts, pets, and toysIt had a lot of ups too. Some of the most iconic boss lines come from Wrath, and of course muh Ulduar and muh Time-Lost Proto Cancer.But Wrath turned everything into a brown and gray blob of going through the motions in my personal experience.
>>739632547I've parse 80+ with more than half of my gear being healer gear as a boomkin, wow players are mouth breathers. This phase 2 is absurdly boring, I'm not even playing anymore(done both raids one time, that's all). Phase 3 is just 2 more raids for months too. Honestly, it was fun for like 5 months, but I'm kinda done
TBC killed wow in the long run
>>739600642It was never good. It made the entirety of Azeroth worthless. You'd expect an "expansion" to build on a foundation, maybe fills it up more, maybe integrates itself into the core of the game, but nope, it's a tiny little content island that makes 98% of the original content completely pointless. Also, world pvp? What world pvp?
>>739635138this ice sci-fi stuff was peak lego. Especially the first gen stuff from the early 90s.
>>739635139I like the raids. Even though I dont need any gear from it I still try to run Kara every week.
TBC is probably my least favorite expansionIt has a lot of problems but the biggest to me is that the vanilla dungeons went from being cool, in world areas to being just a bunch of shitty hallways>Deadmines>Cool bandit hideout that opens up into a secret port>Shadowfang Keep>Cool mad scientist castle >Scarlet Monastery>Cool corrupt church compound with a bunch of lore shit>BRD, Scholomance, Stratholme, Dire Maul>All feel like lived in places where bosses are placed in areas that they would organically be found in>Shattered Halls>Steamvaults>Underbog>Blood Furnace>Arcatraz>Botanica>Mechinaar>All four Auchindoun dungeons>Literally just hallway -> boss -> hallway -> bossSo boring
>>739635138>embraced gearscore rather than stomp it outsee >>739623014>tabard system, while convenient, made no sense. Why are dragons and the Kirin'tor happy that i'm killing metal dwarves in a factory or vikings in their castle?would you rather players be forced to spam consortium prisoner keys (dogshit content) instead of actually playing good shit?>easy to play and overpowered "hero class" asking players to level a character far past halfway to even switch. Also encourages fotm rerolling for a quick power boost since you come out as a DK around 58.>gutting Naxx's legacy so they can have baby's first raid>removing Naxx from Eastern Plaguelands as legacy contentthe vast majority of players had not raided naxx before, would you expect 80s to do a 60 raid? dont forget wrath naxx was overhauled and was not just a copy paste with bigger numbers>old world and Outland now sped up even more and all remaining elites downgraded to normal, cementing leveling as a hurdle instead of an experienceelite downscaling was a tbc thing and the xp reqs per level were lowered because vanilla did not have enough quests to hit 60 without mob grinding
>>739634717I do remember a mention that there were a shitload of random channels, most likely the different genre stations.Here's a link to the T-WoW OST but I don't believe it includes the DJ stuff, adverts, radio shit.https://soundcloud.com/turtlewow/albums
>>739635390What irked me was condensing it into "hubs."Hellfire, Zangarmarsh, Terrokar, and Netherstorm had designated hubs with 2-3 leveling dungeons and one "max level" dungeon. With a raid portal at 3 of them.Dungeons weren't organically out in the world except for Gruul. It felt like you flew to the designated "group content hub."Vanilla only had one place that could act as a hub. Blackrock Mountain had 2 dungeons and 2 raids, and with no flying or mounts could quickly spiral into an organic warzone.It felt much more organic in the world because there were no other areas besides Scarlet Monestary to feature instance portals so close together, and BRM was a max level naturally occuring landmass bridging two zones together.
>>739635747what a bad take. having people run to the dungeon just made it more awful.
>>739636139nta but it's not about making people run, it's about properly fitting the dungeons into the world. in tbc they did it backwards, where they wanted a dungeon hub because it's less work then making its placement kind of make sense instead of making the map then thinking of how to incorporate dungeons into it in an interesting way and it shows
>>739636327they make sense from a lore perspective thoughbeit. HFC has multiple entrances to the castle. coilfang has different entrances for different parts of the same structure. tempest keep is obvious. the only weird one is auchindoun because 4 different factions control a different part.
>>739635719Ah well, this is cool and something I can add to my playlists to vibe/enjoy.Yeah, I checked twows stream, the stream is dead. So I assumed possibly these were all on a loop and shit. I didn't realize how in depth their radio system is. So that's just lost to time. I noticed they have a YT with some archived shit as well.It's a shame cause I would love if they kept up with it and just kept doing the raido regardless of twows status. But maybe they wouldn't get as many listeners post mortem.But yeah, the raido plugin you got just has a bunch of generic internet radio stations. They aren't doing what twow did. But, BUT. They did give people the ability to add in stations themselves, so I'd personally just throw r/a/dio in my mix and try to find some based radio to throw in there.
50% of my guild quit vanilla WoW after we finally cleared MC and TBC was about to launch. And I usually blamed TBC for that but i realize we were just really burnt out. It was kind of alot for our semi-casual guild to get geared up for all that and deal with everyone's egos (tank faggots mostly), then keep up participation once everyone started wanting MC gear. Any guild leaders ITT? What was it like dealing with all that shit?
>>739635487>embraced gearscoreLinking to a post doesn't debunk the claim, retard.I stated that Blizzard embraced it rather than stomp it out. On retail today, you open your character panel and the first number highlighted in bold and color-coded is your fucking gear score.I don't care about being inspected. That's fine. I'm talking about a player-made metric for quick and easy assumption of results being embraced by the game itself rather than players having to do better screening.Inspecting means you're at least seeing if I'm gemmed, enchanted, and if my talents are batshit. Gearscore is just "Grug like big number, Grug likely win.">would you rather players be forced to spam consortium prisoner keysNo, I wouldn't. Your argument is a whataboutism of TBC, which handled it in a different way that is ALSO not great. Stop talking about pancakes because I critiqued waffles you fucking retard.>would you expect 80s to do a 60 raid?What the fuck does that have to do with removing legacy Naxx? Yes actually, I would expect an 80 to do a 60 raid. We did it all the time for gold and just neat shit to have. People were putting together 15-20 people in TBC at 70 to run level 60 Naxx just to get Corrupted Ashbringer and see the place.>elite downscaling was a tbc thingYeah, halfway through the expansion. And even then they didn't slam everything. WotLK sped it up once again and finished the job. You're pedantic as fuck.>vanilla did not have enough quests to hit 60 without mob grindingYes it did. You are a fucking midwit if you still believe this old song and dance. Vanilla had enough quests to get the job done if you actually changed zones and did what was available. You strike me as one of those RestedXP shitters who follow an arrow around and because it tells you to kill mobs for 2 hours instead of fly down and get some slime samples for a guy, then there must be no quests to doYou are such a stupid and insufferable motherfucker.
>>739600642I only used WoW to escape my life. It never needed to be a good game
>>739636545The radio group moved to www.outofbounds.live which is a 24/7 stream. There is a notification whenever one of the DJs is actively on twitch. Fair warning though: it's a huge medley of random music. You may tune in and get a warcraft-related song or something wholly different like metal or techno.>It's a shame cause I would love if they kept up with it and just kept doing the raido regardless of twows statusThey're kind of trying, more-so involving the radio itself and not the Warcraft theme. There have been a few meetups in other free games like Runescape and Warhammer Online where you just hang out and listen to music for a few hours. I think they want to offer a radio program for in-game use in other games but I believe it sounds rather ambitious.As far as the specific in-game themed adverts and other more common radio things, I'm not sure where to find those tracks for download. If you search youtube for "Zappo Zapblast", you may be able to find some stuff. That is the name of the "goblin" DJ who ran the radio.
>>739636327pretty much this and it makes tbc dungeons feel less like dungeons and more like short themepark rides.
>>739636558nigger
>>739636495>HFC has multiple entrances to the castleit's barely a wall let alone a castle. they called it a citadel but put zero effort into selling the illusion of it; just slapped the three portals and called it a day>tempest keepthey're so sterile and samey though. they could've made thematic dungeons in blade's edge and shadowmoon each but they phoned it in with copy pasted scifi ships>auchindon we agree onthe naga hub was fine imo
>>739636553Depressing.It's always catty and shitty drama, part of the reason I fell out of love with raiding is watching my guild fall apart.Women in WoW destroy everything. There are so many that are fucking sociopaths who just want their own guild of simps and circle of simps.What killed mine was my long time friend was chasing some ass. The ass was jealous of one of his ex lovers, and she was getting carried by some guild who progged better than us. She didn't like this and splintered the guild so they can find their own carry guild, and get a higher prog rate than the ex lover.Our guild was just a misfit tag of shitters, we had like 3-4 really good players, the rest were shit. So the good players fought around the concept of how to be better to clear content we were hopeless in cause we likes the people we played with.I honestly cannot raid anymore in MMOs because of shit like that. Everyone's egos are fucking massive, zero patience, and everyone just *sucks* unless you get lucky with a based group of bros or really good players who just want to FAFO for fun and have nothing to prove.I remember the sweet memories, try to raid every once in a while and hope I can capture those feelings long lost ago.
>>739636874>it makes tbc dungeons feel less like dungeons and more like short themepark ridesyeah that's a good way to put it, especially given the insistence on corridor design. sad
>>739636832Oh based, thanks for the info.I'm glad they are still alive at least and not fully. So that means I talked out of my ass partially when looking through the stream lists, cause I saw out of bounds listed, gave them a quick listen and figured it was unrelated. Similar to the "azeroth radio" station, they just had unrelated music as well.Makes more sense with context
>>739637697>So that means I talked out of my assNah, it's okay. "Out of bounds" wouldn't have made sense to you either way. That's their rebranded name. They have a few DJs and they're recruiting more, as well as welcoming people interested in other stuff (behind the scenes production, non-music things like the lore readings, etc.)Fun fact: One of the people who did/does lore readings was an older Blizz dev and he's been involved with T-WoW through their discord and now the radio one. He's pretty vocal about being anti-Blizzard and how scummy they are. Literally the guy who designed THE CULLING, of all iconic Warcraft-related media.https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/David_Fried
