Do you think there's any chance the sokoban game will be a success at this point?I can see it recouping it's cost if it was just 2, maybe 3 years in development, but not 10. Are the steam reviews really going to all be "wow, 10/10 game, the programming that went into it is really impeccable in ways that I can't identify but are surely real."?
>>739619990I don't think so, normalfags are gonna get filtered but making good games is more important.
>>739619990It only takes 1M sales at 40$ to get back his 30M spent on this game.(can't deduce salaries beyond 1 year, but this lets him get out 80% unscathed)I can see it happen.
Is Jonathan Blow actually gay? He sounds like a lisping faggot in all the clip videos I've seen.
>>739620420they don't call him jonny blowjob for nothin'
>>739619990he wasn't just making a game though, he was making a compiler and a programming language, the game is just proof his language works and can be used to make a game.I don't really think he cares too much about how much it makes, hes been bank rolling all this off his past games success, i doubt he has VC money he needs to pay off.I'm sure the game will be good and people will enjoy it, it's going to have like 7000 levels though and i doubt most people will play through most of the game, kinda like the witness
>>739619990Void Stranger was successful.
>>739620287>It only takes 1M salesThat's... a lot, dude.It was one thing when there was a market for high production value walking around puzzle games like The Witness, or The Talos Principal, but that market doesn't really exist anymore, AND because of the format and gameplay of this it doesn't come off as high production value to normies. Based on youtube views, blow himself only has a couple thousand actual die hard fans, the trailer doesn't even have 100k views.
>>739619990Yes, it looks great, and I mean both visually and in terms of puzzles.
>>739621021There is precedence for simple puzzles games selling well like Tetris or even Picross, but no one is going to pay 40$ for super-sokoban.
>>739619990No, there's zero chance it recoups the costs. He's doing it as a self-indulgent vanity product though, so I very much doubt he's expecting it to.There's a very good chance he's completely insane and thinks selling the programming language he's autistically crafted will make him money though. Which is not going to happen and no one but him and the people he's paying will ever touch it.
pic related is sokoban>>739619990this is some zoomerslop
>>739621402Again, it could make sense if it was a 2 or 3 year project with a small team. I don't think it can work as a 10 year project that needs to be 4x as successful as it can realistically be assumed to be.Jblow might have some gimmick that draws in the crowd like braid (one of the first real xbox arcade games), or witness with the meta puzzles and all that. But until further notice it's just a puzzle game nobody is going to care about.
He's the personification of why it is bad advice to tell indie devs to build their own game entirely from scratch.Seriously, 10 years and this shit still isn't out
>>739621402the zelda spinoff is a block based puzzle game.>>739621021His name carries some weight, but it is as you say. and according to slop the witness sold just above 1M, which I can't verify. so it's grimmer than I thought, since this has much less appeal to normies.
>>739621561>No, there's zero chance it recoups the costs.I also think it's unlikely. 28 million is a lot of money for a puzzle game. But this money was spent over a decade, so it's not like Thekla needs it all right away. It's one of those games that don't necessarily need to recoup the dev cost to be considered a success.>selling the programming languageIt will be open source. Not right away, it'll be released as a free binary first, but eventually the source code for JAI will be on Github.
>>739621742He even went back on his own statements and said this year that it's perfectly okay to use a pre-made engine.
>His core fanbase >a significant amount of puzzle enjoyers >a portion of indie devs who like his gamesit will do around Witness numbers +- a few %, which should be fine for him.
>>739622018Big if true, do you know where he said this?I wonder if he feels any sense of regret that he spent a decade building his own engine and the Jai language, then again he seems to enjoy programming more than finishing projects.
>>739621910For that money you can have approximately any of the original mass effect games, or a grid based puzzle game apparently.
>>739622142>do you know where he said this?Some podcast interview. I don't remember which one, but it wasn't the polish guy.>>739622149And?
I didn't realize there was actually a trailer out, so I just watched it.Really shitty trailer.
>>739620287he's not selling a million copies of his chips challenge remake
>>739622142>I wonder if he feels any sense of regret that he spent a decade building his own engine and the Jai languageProbably not. And even if he does, he'd feel worse if he stopped, even early on.>he seems to enjoy programming more than finishing projects.He said that once OotSS is out, the next games will have much shorter dev times since the language and the engine will be ready.>>739622365Which one? There is TGA trailer (the bad one) and the recent trailer (the good one).https://youtu.be/gI886DV0FJAhttps://youtu.be/q3PUtYGl3J0
>>739619990When did he become a slav
>>739622479>He said that once OotSS is out, the next games will have much shorter dev times since the language and the engine will be ready.didn't he also say he has some major game in the works since 2013 that's not puzzle-related and he intends to work on for about 20 years? His engine is a testing ground for this mystery game too, apparently.
It actually looks good, I might get it sometime. In general Blow has good intuition about puzzle games, he's just an autistic ass.
>>739621910The money is gone regardless of spending pace and Blow himself came out saying the future of the company was uncertain when no one gave a fuck about braid remastered.Wasting 28 million on a Sokoban at the cost of tanking your company is very unlikely to be a long term success unless you are using Sony's modern definition of money well spent.
>>739619990It will probably do fairly well. Not sure if it will recoup the costs but I doubt it will be the indie equivalent of a Concord or anything like that.
I physically cringed at one clip where he was talking about how he was paying $150k/year for some junior doing clerical work because his company was based in San Francisco and that's what salaries are like there. 150 thousand dollars is four or five experienced programmers working their asses off in a company like Warhorse or CDPR(while they were based in Poland). You can't maintain a team on FAANG salaries to make a Sokoban game, there's a reason why indies are usually small projects
The game is an advertisement for his programming language and compiler. Him doing that Switch 2 video confirms it.My current guess about what his plans are is he's gonna release Jai + the compiler, but keep the console SDK side of things closed. Then when devs make a game using Jai, they'll hire JBlow's people to port to console.There's already a decent market for this in the indie space.>t. work for a studio that ports godot and unity games to console
So, here's the thing.You are going to buy my game and you're going to enjoy it.
>>739620287He's not selling more than 1k copies of this.If he wanted his games to sell well they'd need quirky characters or some semblance of a story or be some sorta of new meta narrative horror thing with puzzles like fnaf or poppy playtime
>>739621402The positive impact the comparative dearth of game releases in the 80s had on the puzzle genre cannot be understated. Tetris being functionally infinitely replayable was a massive asset when a competent player could beat a year's worth of new releases in under 100 hours of playtime. The appeal of that lessens as new games become more common. We now get the equivalent of the NES's NA library every ten days on Steam alone, and most of those games are as long as or vastly longer than a NES game.
>>739623370The people most interested in Jai are other engine devs who would console port themselves.The gaming industry largely does not care about alternative languages. It's only a very small subsection of indie devs.
>>739623487Yeah if it had a narrative and actual chasacters for you to get attached to, it might have a chance, look at Void Stranger. Sokoban + gimmicks + an actual story.(Well, + an existing audience, but that audience was from a shmup, so... not the usual Sokoban demographic.)
>>739620287HOW. I've been developing a pretty fucking complex game for 2 years now and doing almost all the work outside of audio and some visual assets ive spent like.... 7 grand on it.
>>739623487Just like he would only sell 1k copies of The Witness right?
>>739623753He treats it like an actual studio and pays a small team. the company was also in San Fran for a number of years which is stupidly expensive.
>>739619990gotta say, I think it'll probably be a masterpiece.
>>739623753See >>739623095His studio had a physical office space in San Francisco and employed multiple people. Probably averaged somewhere around $1-2 mil of salary cost per year, probably another million toward the lease each year for the duration. So the project isn't actually very small and also it's being made in literally the most expensive place on earth in terms of both labor and real estate.
I think it'll sell around 30,000 copies at launch on PC, and a smaller number on consoles, and that's about it.After that, it will depend mainly on long-term sales on Steam, though those are all driven by super generous sales. And then there are regional prices. But maybe if he gets lucky with word of mouth around the game, it’s possible he'll sell around 200k-300k copies after several years.I think even he knows he won't get all the money he invested in the project back.
>>739623487>If he wanted his games to sell well they'd need quirky characters or some semblance of a storyGood thing the game has that.
I gotta be honest, I didn't invest in his company so I couldn't care less if it's a success or not.I'm going to play it and then hopefully check out any of the Jai related stuff he ends up releasing related to it.Whether it succeeds of fails I still win.
>>739623487Because that strategy sure has worked well for all the recent Concordian games that have even bigger forces behind them than he does lol
In the announcement trailer, each of the game worlds is represented by an emblem. They all describe the game rules of that world. For example, the top 3 cartouches in the shield here represent the warrior, thief, and wizard, who push an arbitrary amount of blocks, pull 1 block, and swap with a block at any distance respectively.
>>739625856The mirror one is more interesting.
>>739623978Just like he sold 40 copies of braid anniversary, yes>>739625309What does concord and it's ugly ass characters have to do with fnaf and Jonathan blow even the witness sold around 100k which is still less than those
>>739626036>What does concord and it's ugly ass characters have to do with fnaf and Jonathan blow even the witness sold around 100k which is still less than thoseWhat does this statement have to do with mine.Anon said use a strategy and I'm saying it's a bad one.
>>739626036The Braid remaster sold poorly because it wasn't advertised, like at all, and because the main new feature was extensive dev commentary.
>>739626036100k is a conservative estimate of just the first week retard, it's been out for yearsIt's fine if you hate blow but you don't need to lie about it
>>739619990Barry Shitpeas
Sokobans need waifus
>>739626246Nta, but sales drop off dramatically after the first week. it probably sold around 250k at full price, the rest was sporadically and mostly on sale I would think.But I'm not trying to dunk on The Witness. I think it had a lot more mass market appeal than this game does.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWqnz-7iQbYThis isn't selling more than 100 copies lolJohnathan blow only made it due to timed exclusivities with Xbox/Sony
>>739626408>waifus
>>739626408Porn addict opinion.
>>739626503This will never not be funny.
>>739619990it will flop and generate endless amounts of hilarious blow clips
>>739626716I know Patrick was working on a game with Jai and I think it was another sokoban tooI wonder how far along it is now
>>739626786No clue. I assume it will release after OotSS. Would be pretty mean to beat your boss in releasing a game in his own language.
I like Jon and love how much he triggers shit programmers but I'm still not going to get it for full price. I'd pay $10 for his little puzzle game at most.
It's amazing how much seethe a man can generate by just making games and talking shit online on occasion.
>>739626917>littleIt's like 500 hours for 100%.
>>739626937These days I see people pretending to be mad at anyhintg just for attention. Jealousy isn't even a prerequisite anymore.
>>739626408Sukebans?
>>739619990no
https://x.com/Jonathan_Blow/status/2059326622428500197A tiny bit of OST.
>>739619990Sokoban games are never successful. It's not about the sales.
>>739629273>Sokoban games are never successfulhttps://store.steampowered.com/app/353540/Stephens_Sausage_Roll/
>In 10 years he made one (1) Sokoban with a middling art direction, servicable OST and nothing outside the puzzles themselves>meanwhile>In 10 years System Erasure made both a best-in-genre Shmup AND then a best-in-the-genre Sokoban that combined pure puzzles, strong art direction, a story and an oustanding soundtrackIs there even anything more to say beyond this?
>>739629384>1,000 reviews in 10 yearslol
>>739629578>/v/ is so lost in AAA steam chart wank, they think 1000 reviews for an extremely niche indie puzzle game is bad
>>739629515>>In 10 years he made one (1) Sokoban with a middling art direction, servicable OST and nothing outside the puzzles themselvesIt's a pretty big Sokoban, 1400 puzzles. And don't forget the programming language that this game was made to demonstrate.>and nothing outside the puzzles themselvesWhat is this supposed to mean? It's a puzzle game. You solve puzzles to unlock more puzzles.>best-in-the-genre SokobanLmao, you mean Void Stranger? If anything, that game's story is a detriment to it.
>>739629515I hope Blow's game is nothing like Void Stranger because that one was fucking trash.
>>739622142In a recent clip he said that if he had 50-100m he would start developing an OS 'today' (lek) I'm hyped for this game because his games are that good. I don't even give a fuck about puzzles anymore, but a blow game is an instabuy.
I love a good JBlow, this is a day 1 buy for me.
>>739629515Did they create their own programming language that actually has a working, highly optimizing compiler? That's a bigger accomplishment than any of these shit games.
>>739630763No one is going to buy the game based on compile time
>>739630763what does that bring to me as a player?
>>739623753You're a retard who has never worked an actual job in your life, thoughbeit whomst'eve.
>>739631164Performance.
I really hope this obnoxious cock-sucking faggot fails again and kills himself. Reminder his "remaster" of braid was a complete failure so he basically already had a noose ready anyway.
>>739620287>1M sales at 40$ to get back his 30MYeah good thing taxes don't exist and you only need to pay Gabe and literally nobody else when you make money
>>739631246I can't even imagine the kind of turdworld toaster you'd have to have that can't run a sokoban game.
>>739631480>Puzzle games can't be graphically intensive
>>739630763Let me know when Jai is self-hosted and not coasting off C++
>>739631246hilarious
>>739631726What is this supposed to mean?
>>739631763Jai is just a front-end language that compiles to C++.
>>739631887
>>739631250This is quite a mean-spirited post.
>>739631730>Lot's of polygons>LightingYeah, this could use optimization to run on lower end machines.
>>739631946You need a C++ compiler to build it? lol
>>739632098No, JAI has its own compiler.
>>739619990Nope. Know the audience, know the market. This is the shitty part about making money with anything "art" you need do know when and where to cut corners and "cheap out" to put your product out before you reach a point of loss.
>>739631887Even if true, that's not how you would phrase that. It would be transpiled, or maybe a DSL.
>make your own compiler and programming language, focusing on efficiency and robustness>use it to make a fucking sokubanBut why? Should've just programmed it in assembly for whatever chips the main consoles use if you're that bothered by it
>>739621021The market for stuff like The Witness was always niche, he has his audience. I think he will be fine.
>>739632289He wanted to make a language. He decided to make a game to demonstrate that it's usable. He wanted it to be an intersection of 4 existing free Sokobans. Mechanic intersection caused a combinatoric explosion. 10 years to make, 1400 puzzles, 500 hours to complete.
>>739632204Transpiled is also fine, but front-end language is actually more accurate specifically because that's closer to the goal. He just wanted his own version of C++, which is why he's also indifferent to self-hosting
>>739623095thats going from one extreme to another, 150k for 5 senior devs is only possi ke because COL in poland is much lower. Nowhere in the US are you gonna get 5 senior full time devs for 150k
>>739624085He was retarded and bought into the anti remote work right winger shit while also wantinh a physical studio in san fran.
>>739630102>>739630206Void Stranger was absolutely incredible, why the fuck would you want a game nothing like it?
>>739633480Because I didn't like it. Simple as.
>>739620907fuck off Blow
>>739633723It's hard to believe just how much that 1 tiny soulja boy video one shotted Blow's brain. He's just a couple more years away from going full terry davis. The only difference is that jblow still has money, and in theory is smart enough to manage that effectively, Terry was just a wagie who was out of resources as soon as he was unemployed, vs blow who is rich.Poor people are crazy, rich people are just eccentric.
>>739632981That's the point, he's competing with FAANG for labor while making an extremely niche product without any real expectation of ROI. Either reduce the scope of the project or at least do it somewhere cheaper. There's a reason Nintendo never had a financial crater the size of Concord or Bungie, their talent and office space in Japan costs less than half as much as that of American developers
>>739630763That doesn't matter in the slightest. There is already a highly optimized language that can produce games that can run on toasters. It's called C, or even C++ if you ignore it's optional bullshit.Blow made a solution to a problem that doesn't exist. The tools are already here, it's already a solved problem. There are NO games that would benefit from a specialized language. The issue is, has, and always will be, execution. He could make Jai a shining jewel, and shit games that run horribly would STILL be made on it.Worthless.
