looking back at it, was this game really any good?
It was, but it walked so that wotr could run.
As good as every other Olwcat game.
>>739872679>wotrPls>>739872768Km was best, no other owlcuck game had soul. Neither will any game ever have it. They will likely ruin kingmaker remake, too.
this game runs at 5 fps unless I restrict it to 4 coresfunny shit
>>739872641Jaethal was the only good thing about KM
>>739872641Yes, much better than wotr.
>>739873075what the fuck are you talking about, what about this is better then what wotr offers?
>>739872641Wotr was better
>>739872641The more I look back at it the more I want to fuck octaviawhy is my dick so weak against half elves
>>739872641It was, but since Owlcat no longer has the rights, they don't give a shit about it now
Fae better than wotr or 40kids
>>739873916it's not your dick who is weak, it is (You) who is a cuck.
>>739874065>Fae*Lawful crusade intensifies*
>>739873990Rumors are a remake could happen, I doubt it.
>>739872641Between this and WotR this is my favorite, though I wish it had rideable mounts like WotR has.
>>739872641Yes. The second part is pure Reddit, while this one looks like good old-fashioned fantasy.
>>739873803EVERYTHING. Starting from the setting, the characters, the feel of the game (realistically gritty), the endings, the choices, the kingdom management. Wotr is for cucks.
>>739876706Oh and the soundtrack / music is ALSO better in Kingmaker lmao, starting with the main menu theme.
the contrarian cycle continues huh. it never fails.
Yes.
>>739872641I loved it. Pure soul and reminded me of BG1, which I prefer over BG2. Game was pretty awful on release, though. Luckily they fixed enough before they got jewed out of the rights to it.
>>739872641Depends. What is your own opinion? I'll argue for the opposite of it.
>>739875642Id rather a third game, no need for a remake.
None of the Owlcuck games are good.
It was the genuine successor to BG2 that I always wanted after Pillars and all the other pretenders shit the bed.
Kingmaker with WOTR quality of life and class updates would be best. Maybe a few unlockable mythic powers as your kingdom grows.
>>739872641Tried replaying it a couple months ago and the buff train is even worse than wotr since there you level up superfast to lvl10 and start clearing maps before they run out.Also, why the fuck is pathfinder so swingy?A single hit clears half your tank HP so you either pyjama tank + mirror image or ignore AC and fill the room with summons.
>>739877672D20 has always been garbage anon you just have to deal with it
>>739877672>A single hit clears half your tank HPSo like BG and NWN?
>>739877717Of course lvl1 combat sucks dick in any d20 but I'm talking lvl6, my AC already makes everyone but bosses only hit on 20s but it doesn't matter if a random npcs can hit for 20-30 hp since everyone is rocking power attack or insane str scores, a couple lucky hits and my tank is down.
About to start playing it myself, but I hear both Kingmaker and WotR (and to a much lesser extent, Rogue Trader which may be the only owlkek title without the problem?) have completely asinine class requirements and builds. You can't just build whatever sounds cool to you for roleplaying potential and have it work, but it has a lot of >dip a level into vivisectionist subclass to get some synergy ability that's stupidly overpowered even on your lawful good non-rogue character. Go ahead paladin, take a few levels of stigmatized witch and then clean up the battlefield etc. >varying subclasses somee of which are just plain better or worse than the base class variant and others make no sense Maybe this is just Pathfinder jank but being expected to take a level of this or that here and there but I've been making me want to put off playing the title since it feelsl ike you have to either be following a guide/tierlist from the start or risk either gimping yourself or having no competent way to follow a class fantasy.
>>739876810All the good wotr ost is in the evil mythic themes for some reasonThose are all great
>>739878035The origins of the system is early 00s D&D, before metagaming and following class builds was a thing. People at most did shit like Fighter/Wizard. Nobody did the doofus monk/vivi/paladin etc dips because it didn't make sense from a roleplaying perspective.
Considering we got the expanse lead VA fired, what else can we bully owlcat into doing?
>>739878118and they should honestly put limits on character creation like any reasonable GM
>>739878035The shitload of classes + their archetypes are for TT roleplaying purposes. You know, the thing that vidya will never be good at.
>>739878035kingmaker and wotr use pathfinder ruleset, you can make a lot of different builds but you really need to understand the ruleset to get anything more complex than 2h weapon + power attack or stacking spell dc on your casters.Like I played a oracle that added stagger to all his damage spells letting him doing "good" AoE damage while CCing at the same time.
>>739872641Yeah, it was fantastic. The first CRPG to be better than BG2. And then WotR was even better. Absolutely phenomenal experiences.
>>739878035Doing 20 levels of fighter, rogue, wizard or whatever else you like is totally fine. Dipping or other kind of minmaxing is entirely unnecessary even on core. My first run was a pure fighter with high charisma just for rp and that was pretty chill.Subcoasses are often straight upgrades that’s true, but even the base classes are totally fine. Just go with whatever you think sounds cool, read your class features and allocate your stats properly, you’ll be totally fine.
>>739878118You're incorrect, netdecking was alive at this point and players were writing and sharing guides.The original God Wizard guide was for pathfinder and is broadly applicable to both owlcat games even now.Anyway, you can beat both games on moderate difficulties with themed characters, it's only on hard and unfair that you need to compromise on theme to minmax in order to meet the inflated stat checks, with unfair existing to challenge perfectionists.
>>739872641best Owlcat game so far
>>739878035Class dips are a meme and completely unnecessary.The class options aren't super well balanced but that's inevitable with the number of options the game gives. Building whatever sounds cool will generally work well enough though, it's not like your companions are super well optimised and they make up 5/6ths of the average party.
>>739878118Right, I mean I used to play AD&D 2nd and 3rd editions. I just thought that for Pathfinder they would have found some way in its transition to vidya, to sort out the stupid metagaming and/or at least making things competently balanced. From what I've read and even selecting difficulty, if you play on anything above normal there's a >You really need to know how to metagame a build, how the Pathfinder system works etcstyle thing rigth there on the screen. Yeah, I hear that you can basically stumble through on easy settings with most things, but on normal or better you're expected to do take certain classes and now which ones lead to synergy etc? I'm glad they included all those classes for the fun and RP of it, but I just thought that they'd find some way to balance it just like the old days where it had to make some kind of sense in terms of alignment, skills/stat requirements and other things. Stuff like Eldritch Knight or Arcane Archer I think are neat concepts but for tabletop they had to work and be balanced both mechanically and RP related. >>739878209RP parts are great and I like the options, but I think they could do a little more to make it make sense in both the game mechanic and RP factors. If you're taking a level in enlightened ascended master super monk then dipping into some sort of bloodrage barbarian that needs to eat the organs from still living prey, or some pact with night hags where you need to steal them a living child to eat, corrupt or both , should not "work" together at the same time. >>739878245Yeah, I hear there are comprehensive ruleset stuff and/or builds made by people who really dive into the system and thus can get some "broken' stuff even if it shouldn't work from a RP standpoint or not very well. >>739878269Well that's good to hear. I saw others say you could gimp yourself with some classes/subclasses - kineticist was it? >>739878481Do you have to know how to build them properly too?
>>739878035If you’re playing normal mode or even up to core you should be able to get by without hyper-optimising things. I played core and for a majority of the characters I just kept putting levels in their starting class. For a few I set them up to take a prestige class. Think the most creative thing I did in kingmaker was multi-class the fighter into bard to take advantage of her fairly high charisma.My point is, it’s fairly difficult to ruin a character if you just keep levelling their primary class. You don’t need all the “dip 1 in x class to be optimal”. If you do multiclass though, you should have a plan for how the two classes will synergise beyond just “feels right roleplaying-vice”.
>>739872641Its my least favorite owlkek game, but its still decent. Falls completely apart late game and im not even talk about the house im one of the few that kinda like it, even though i got buttfucked by them taking away my skill monkey
>>739878687>Falls completely apart late gameThis is every owlcat game and will continue to be every owlcat game.
>>739878035I used cheat tool when I couldn't get past a certain point. The combat system itself looks cool when your whole party swarms the enemies, but the character building from the early D&D games is just a nightmare.
>>739875642They're probably remaking/remastering WOTR first with shiny HD graffix, full VA and vastly reduced content like only Angel/Demon/Legend Paths due to inflated budget as normies only care about graffix and VA
>>739878687To be honest most crpgs tend to fall apart late game since the scope of a lot of these games means the latter parts tend to be under developed or unfinished
>>739878957>normies only care about graffix and VAGod forbid I like the VA performances and wish there was more.
>>739878579Kineticist is really strong. You might be thinking of the kinetic knight kit which is comparatively underwhelming but even that is okay.
Low level campaigns are just better.
>>739879105Even on release months with people not knowing how to maximize, you ended at lv 18 at least
>>739878152Argenta romance.
>>739878035Up to Challenging/Core, any class/archetype up to 20 is perfectly viable.Some are stronger than other, and higher difficulty than normal requires some team synergy and sensible elve-ups.But you could win with fucking auto-level.Even on hard, the vast majority of archetypes is viable.Things that could be even considered trap options can be counted on yoru fingers.Most of the dips/minmaxxing concerns unfair, and that is usually for the early game where you have minimal class abilities and items.
>>739877583The are salty they lost their first game. I despise owlcucks so much.
>>739878035Pathfinder aka mathfinder has trap choices. Owlkeks take this to the power of power.
>>739881323So what are the trap choices of kingmaker that would not let you finish the game at challenging smoothly?
>>739872641It's pretty nice until House of the edge of time. Anyone designing that should be raped to death
>>739872641Yes. It just doesn't by default appeal to CRPG fans. If you automate the kingdom management aspect you're missing the game's draw so what's the point?
>>739876479>mfw entirety of the House at the End of Time
>>739879309>Up to Challenging/Core, any class/archetype up to 20 is perfectly viable.people making a big deal about builds and traps really overlook this. you can play with absolutely stock companions and whatever you want on that medium difficulty.
>>739878707Nah, not to this point. Side content is miserable in lategame kingmaker, its all just copy pasted maps and enemies with barely any story attached to it. WotR and RT suffer from unfinished and rushed late game acts, true, but whats there still tries to be unique.
>>739881894>they toned down colony management because retards couldnt deal with it in km and wotri hate this shit, the moment a series gets more popular its starts getting dumbed down
>>739872641Kingmaker is boring because it lacks the grand and heroic feel that WOTR gives. WOTR gives the player a powerful feeling (like he is the FUCKING god or something), whereas Kingmaker gives the player a lame feeling (muh king who gets tricked by a lame dryad). Also the early game of Kingmaker is one of the worst things if you are an autist who is obsessed with unfair difficulty. Early Kingmaker is impossible on Unfair. I hate lowering/adjusting difficulty in a session, it hurts my ego. WOTR is such a genius game that every single encounter plays like butter on bread. It is a flawless game. WOTR is the greatest CRPG I have ever played. The mythic powers and storylines made WOTR iconic. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uITaghKWMMMListen to this, it will make you fee like al Nietzschean Übermensch
Kingmaker was significantly better than their other efforts.WoTR in particular was a massive step-down in worldbuilding, writing, companions and quests.
>contrarians claim km is superior due to its low stake adventure feel>meanwhile everyone hated through the ashes so much that it buckbroke owlcat
>>739882867Music in wotr especially mythic power and mythic themes slap so fucking hard, its unironically the best ost i've heard in an rpg.The only memorable music in kingmaker is one of the tavern songs.
>>739882973>people didn't like an expansion that was an entire different shittier campaign that people didn't want to pay for>therefore they can't like a different tone to their standalone releasesRetarded.Much like most wotr fans.
>>739885123WotR is and will always be considered the better game.
>>739885657a day old turd is better then a week old turd, but at the end of the day its still just turds
>>739872641Yeah it was pretty good.
>>739882867Just say that you need your dumb power fantasy. No need to hide behind word salads
>>739872641It was pretty alright. Chargen was pretty dense with redundant options of highly variable effectiveness, but overall, I had fun. The twins are best girls.
Octavia had a very cute romance.
>>739874827>it's not your dick who is weakwho the fuck praises someone's dick like that online gaylord
>>739872641It’s a pretty serviceable 6-7/10 CRPG. Nothing amazing but it has some interesting encounters and the build variety is very nice. Anyone claiming it’s amazing/horrible hasn’t played that many similar games
>>739877303GodI wish that was me
>>739877672Buffs aren't really such a big deal when 90% of the game gets raped by brapclouds
>>739872641>Play Rogue Trader >Have fun>Play kingmaker or WotR>They suckWhy is fantasyslop so inferior to space kino?
How much kingdom roleplay does this game have? If I make a neutral evil charater, can I have her act haughty and demanding to her subjects?
>>739893131Sure.
>>739893131YesYou can overtax, put the head of protesters on spikes, and do all kind of comically tyrannical shit, including to hiring bandits to collect your taxes, putting an ancient lich as your advisor, etc etcIt's a great game to be a complete cunt, my only complaint is that there is a single companion (Linzi) who is good but is forced on you by the plot and cannot be killed because she's the narrator of your story.Everything else, you can go nuts.
>>739894065>cannot be fuckedfix'd you're complaint
>start playing the game>really like it>get to the kingdom management part>drop itthey ruined it
>>739878035Complete nonsense. You can finish the games on the highest difficulty with pure classes.
youtu.be/Hp8dSSeQutsNu-CRPGs could never
>>739896691You can disable that aspect, though.
>>739900326how? even mods couldn't disable that aspect completely
>>739872641>spam brap clouds rendering all enemies actionless>summon armies of undead>haste everyone>legion of crack minions gank the stomach churning fools to death>can be repeated in nearly every encounterThere is basically no reason to play as any class other than a wizard or wizard muli-class because of this combo.
>>739893131Surprisingly a lot. Although it's very clear Lawful with charismatic character is the way to go if you want to be optimal.
>>739899202??? Owlshit games ARE nuCRPG
>>739900414game has an option that automates it entirely
>>739872641i liked it. it fulfilled my fantasy of being a female paladin kingqueen bossbabe who does everything right and makes everyone in the kingdom happy with her fair & just rule.the companions were dogshit tho. except that little celebrity gnome who was always criticising everything, he was fun.
>>739872641>mfw capital under siegehttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DsfiIW8_3Wc
>>739882867>Kingmaker is boring because it lacks the grand and heroic feel that WOTR gives.because it didn't set out to do that. original ap was basically all about giving your players freedom and time to do what they rarely get to. keep in mind, in the published ap game is based on players have even MORE gold and power to go around.
The gameplay in these games honestly just sucks. Building characters is pretty ass, as well. You have these massively convoluted buff and skill interactions, and none of them are especially cool or interesting. Oh, you stacked a boring amount of modifiers to make your number go from +8 to +30, so now your character's auto-attacks hit every time. Wow, what an amazing feeling.I enjoy the writing and such some of the time, but just as often it's just pissing me off with how pozzed it is. I'm so sick of everyone being a gay amoral retard and/or a cuck or girlboss, and of course fucking niggers and even literal trannies everywhere.I remember reading an article a while ago about how, after LOTR came out, publishers basically demanded that authors writing fantasy slop HAD to emulate Tolkien. Having similar story structures, clear good/evil moral lines in their stories, etc. Which is why so much post-LOTR fantasyslop feels so similar.But man, if that wasn't better, because right now all the fantasyslop is gay & retarded and it is a billion times worse. Tolkien may have been slop, but even as slop it's in the top-1% of the kind of writing that people are capable of producing. So telling everyone to emulate it at least made it somewhat tolerable. Now, it's just a free-for-all, with every retard under the sun showing you what's goin on inside their heads. And it's truly horrifying to behold.
