>be Jung>ruin's you're game analysis channels
Other than the obvious ones like Persona, which games would even be subject to Jungian analysis? It's not common at all.Sure wish it was though, my man was great and Jungism happens in unexpected places.
Watch this thread get to 300 replies
>>739877132Jung is literally worthless, nothing he ever did can be replicated or tested scientifically. Behaviorism and neuroscience is the only way to study the brain without being a faggot
>>739877524>t. I've never heard about Fear and Hunger
>>739877569If he made a scientific model that could be applied to fiction we would be able to make LLMs that write stories that are better than Tolkien's. The reason he wasn't able to do it is because you can't break stories down into a pure science.
>>739877569>nothing he ever did can be replicated or tested scientificallyYou could probably end up producing something to reveal the collective unconscious/archetypes through LLMs, since the way they work is to reproduce patterns in a very large amount of data sourced from pretty much anywhere on the internet, in any language, and whatnot.That being said, I question the very basis of your argument here: scientific consensus isn't the only authority on truth, especially in a field such as analytical psychology, of all things. The problem is that you confuse it with biology or neuroscience, neither are "psychology" though they feed into each other.>>739877637Very correct, it's rare for me to get interested in RPG maker games.
>>739877132Jung is based, everything he ever wrote about can be replicated or tested scientifically. Behaviorism and neuroscience aren't the only ways to study the brain.
>>739877762>>739877748It's astrology for pseuds
>>739877793>narratives are a spook
>>739877838Go take a personality quiz and get your letters, midwit
>>739877854>he thinks actual Jung is a personality testDo we tell him?
>>739877569Cope all you like but neuroscience will never provide good answers for how and why we should live.
>>739877569collective unconcious stuff makes perfect sense thoughbeit
>>739877569>literally worthlessvery poor choice of words
>>739877132Jung is a normalfag's idea of le based schizo
>>739877982>the hero with a thousand facesmore like the queero with a thousand genders!
>>739878005what is your idea of a based schizo then
>>739877982this book is shit
>>739877132his retarded face makes me want to punch the shit out of my monitor for displaying this shitty fucking mug>>739878040plotinus
>>739878019Got 'em!
>>739877132>OP read about Jung and now keeps making threads about him on an unrelated image board for video games.What would Jung have to say about this?
>>739877854How will a personality test help me with my writing?
>>739877894To be fair neither does Jung, but at least he isn't willing to ignore things like intention/will in consciousness along with the (largely) unconscious pull towards the Self.>>739877945It's one of those things that if you think about it for a second, it would be more difficult to argue that it's NOT there.The only real questions become "where did it came from?" and "is there some sort of genetic imprint that you could study?"
>>739878019>>739878043>"waah waah, I don't like it so it's gay"
>>739878110materialist faggot
>>739878040me
>>739878073
>>739878156Don't think you have any idea what that word even means. How's something like "intention" and "will" materialistic?My point is that Jung studied these things and kept an open mind, but he didn't really tell you how to live your life.
>>739878220faggot
>guy's named young>is actually old
>>739878128ah yes, freud, a mentally ill coked out kike that projected his incestuous fantasies onto everything and everyone
>>739878263>if someone did retarded shit you shouldn't use their ideas even if they produce undeniable results
>>739878263>i'm a mentally ill chantard posting online at 4AM inbetween beating off to anime. i'm smarter than freud
>>739878346yes
>Now, you might be wondering what this has to with jumping in video games
>>739878263Freud had some good concepts and Jung himself didn't outright deny everything, but he overextended the fuck out his theories without accounting for enough individual differences. Also he was running with the "tabula rasa" assumption for the unconscious while Jung said you are already born with something(namely the archetypes in the collective unconscious).
>>739878401no, you can jump in dreams like everywhere else
>>739878582I fly in the my dreams. It's only when I wake up do I realise that it wasn't real.
>>739877793It's better than that. Jung is the kind of shit that makes astrology narratively cool in a setting instead of of being set dressing made by a faggot with mental issues.
>>739878685
>>739878892Ever since my second-last bout of schizophrenia, my dreams have been incredibly vivid.
>>739878102How to use Jung for writing is something I've thought about myself quite a lot.Most tasteful answer would be to make what's essentially a psychological narrative about individuation that shows you that without telling, as opposed to something that treats archetypes as mystical things or tropes. Pic rel is a good example in anime, though this one does make it blatant by referencing Psychological Types and explicitly saying that Tsubomi is an introvert and Erika is an extravert, and they are both one-sided.
>>739878981yeah, imagine if a game did just that
>>739877132>jungDieser Mann sieht sehr alt aus.
>>739879305Don't you love how it shows up in unexpected places? Sometimes I wonder if it's an open secret that Jap authors read Jung
>>739879363Forever young, I want to be forever youngDo you really want to live forever, forever and ever?
>be Schrödinger>every middle aged Japanese writer will now reference your most well known thought experiment in their work
>>739879548And misunderstand the point every single time. It wasn't meant to be a philosophical stance.
>>739879548Schrodinger's cat was principally meant to be an example to show the absurdity of quantum physics, and is taken seriously by midwit pretenders.
>>739879548>>739879671Sure sure, but just imagine if... Yume no Schrödinger.
>>739879548Somewhat unrelated, but that reminds me that if you want to throw in some tentative epistemology, Jung actually makes more sense than Schrödinger.e.g.
>>739878252
>>739878019I shouldn't have laughed at that.
>>739878128Tradcuck bs
>>739880403>t. abula rasa brainlet
jung is in every jap game lolespecially JRPGs, but also stuff like SH. you won't hear any jap game analysis without him, unironically
>>739880768>jung is in every jap game lolWhich makes me wonder if it's accidental or Japanese authors have some sort of open secret that everyone is at least more or less aware of Jung, and whenever psychology is part of your narrative you will turn to Jungian concepts.
>>739879671Yeah yeah, he didn't like the interpretation of his own equation, so he made that thought experiment "see? in classical physics it wouldn't make any sense!"
>>739877569>t. disgusting materialistyou are not just your brain and his ideas of how man works emotionally turn out to be true when applied every time.>>739878346>everywhere is USA>>739880881>>739880768Jung just tried to describe reality as he understood it.It will happen that "he" will be in games because we all just observe reality and do our best and there is a lot of overlap
>>739878346Very poor choice of philosopher
>>739881235We can go even higher.
>>739881309>t. nigger who thinks realism is the only valid form of storytelling
I've recently read through the red book. It was very weird but also very interesting. This man was having full blown conversations with the archetypical mind. Imagine inducing psychosis and then fixing it yourself just to flex.
>>739881309yes, that's correct>>739881380interesting
>>739881705>This man was having full blown conversations with the archetypical mind. Imagine inducing psychosis and then fixing it yourself just to flex.Sounds kino. Gotta read it eventually.>>739881727Jung letters have some unexpected kino.
>Be moon jellyfish, Aurelia Aurelita, drifting in north atlantic ocean>Have no relevance to videogames whatsoever
>>739881705Maybe his mind palace is just more vast than yours
Yo let me tell you about the archetypical mind bro. Let me tell you about the logos blueprint for incarnation expierential catalyst bro.
>>739881925let me tell you about Per Kele
>>739881309Imagine the mass psychosis you would cause if you tried to remind everyone about the concepts of Anima/Animus nowadays. Just imagine.First we will have to admit that basically everyone has a contrasexual archetype, which can be more or less integrated in consciousness.And second we will have to admit that archetype "possession" is a thing, so your life being taken over by trying to become the opposite gender is essentially a neurosis in Jungian terms. iirc one that was noted to lead into physical death too at worst.
>>739882103>trying to become the opposite gender is essentially a neurosis in Jungian terms. iirc one that was noted to lead into physical death too at worst.literally truethey all kill themselves, some of them just take longer to do so (via all the drugs they use)
>>739877524Thanatos tower in ragnarok online probably
>>739882030Feed me daddy
>>739882262That's the point. Jung predicted this.But his take is more nuanced since you can also just integrate Anima/Animus in healthier ways, especially for creative people.
Have more fun stuff, especially for people who are also into the typology aspect.Also do yourself a favor and don't use second-hand "Jungian" typologies. If you are interested in extraverts/introverts and the 4 functions, stick to his stuff starting from Psychological Types, but not limited to. You can find more in places such as the 1925 seminar, some letters/interviews, and von Franz's own book on the inferior function.
it's just a genre of analysis, jungian takes are overdone these days.
>>739878069Jung would say that you're a limp wrist faggot who is ONLY capable of such a thing.
>>739877524Even Persona is just singular: Persona 4All the others are just calling the demon summoning bullshit Persona to be distinguished from SMT.
>>739884143Do you prefer critical theory perchance?
>>739877569who gives a fuck, jung rules
>>739877132>Muh collective subconsciousness must be the reason why WE, in this social circle all think and behave so similar with the same core values. His idea completely falls apart the moment he walks down to a common pub at the bad part of town or going to the countryside, let alone be applicable to even a neighboring country.In current day you can just look at the immigrants shipped in by billionaires running a country trying to set up their equivalent of Chinese sweatshops using barbarians from the sandboxes. They can't comprehend civilized thinking, let alone 21st century 1st world culture and values.These psychologists just like the rest of the scientific world of the time period were talking entirely out of their asses and were trying to assassinate scientists with contrary theories while dodging assassination attempts. It never stops being funny how Zoomers that failed school are trying to look at philosophers and psychologists as this source of greater knowledge and wisdom while being too fucking illiterate to comprehend they are all failed theories.
>>739884807That's a lotta words for somebody who has no fucking idea what "collective unconscious" means.
>>739877132
>>739877739muddleheaded mindbroken brainrotten gibberish post
>>739878128>wahtrannies on /v/enough, this isn't tumblr
>>739886592Why wouldn't you be able to make better stories than him artificially if stories could be boiled down to scientific formulas?
>>739886654Why are you pretending not to be aware of the concept of tropes and literary analysis? Dumb animal.
>>739886735Literally analysis is just made up mumbo jumbo, there's nothing scientific about it. It's just made up labels like all the tranny genders.
What are your opinions on the idea that men playing female characters is the most widespread case of anima projection?The few times i've mentioned it on this board people have rejected it or ignored it. I'm surprised it's not a common observation.
>>739879831Schrödinger‘s Hyundai
>>739886807*literary
>>739877569anything """thought""" by western philosopher is either worthless or stolen from non-Abrahamic philosophies.
>>739886639nigger
>>739886878>western philosophy is either worthless or stolen and worthlesshuh?
>>739886818I analyzed a game once from a Jungian point of view. It had a good deal on the anima/animus shit but I cut it out later because it was almost irrelevant to the conclusion.
>>739877739Lord Raglan would disagree with you
>>739886818>What are your opinions on the idea that men playing female characters is the most widespread case of anima projection?Makes sense in a way, but only in so far you are actually projecting anything upon the female character as opposed to merely aesthetic appreciation/sexual attraction or gameplay stuff.If you go out of your way to make your playable characters girls, especially when you can customize or characterize them, then yea you are basically using vidya as a vessel for anima projection among other things.
>>739887031So? You can't boil fiction down to a science so it doesn't matter.
>>739877569Yes, but this kind of nonsense based purely on intellectual masturbation will always be cherished by humanity, because it is the religion of people who are too intelligent to believe in traditional religions.
>>739887097So you think people should just obey the scripture instead and look no further?
>>739887084You can certainly find lots of commonalities.
>>739887097That's funny in the context of somebody treating "neuroscience" and "biology" as if it were the sole arbiter of truth.Why does it have to be about either empiricism or literal magic? What level of undifferentiated thinking are we dealing with here?
>>739887493You can put labels on shit but it doesn't matter how many tropes you manage to check. That doesn't tell you shit about if the story is good or not.
>>739887097Explain why the mental masturbation mentality produces works like Silent Hill 2 and the scientifically aligned mentality produces works like Depression Quest?
>>739887629I think I see your point. You can identify the components but no one's been able to pinpoint what 'talent', the good writing that holds it all together, is.
>>739877569this anon is an NPC.
>nothing he ever did can be replicated or tested scientifically
>>739887987Yeah, that's because what matters is if the story means something. You can see that shit in action when some "modern audience" shitlib feminist strips away the message of the work because it makes them uncomfortable. Like when in the Netflix adaption of Watership Down where they couldn't say that their tribe wouldn't survive without does. So they had to have some other bullshit explanation that they needed the does to dig warrens (the characters are rabbits). One states a fact of life and the other is complete nonsense.
>>739888432>We won't survive a generation without mothersis still too edgy message for Netflix?
>>739888136Jung would agree with Rogan on that, dumb jaknigger
>>739888692It was bad enough that they replaced that line.
>>739887841>scientifically aligned mentality>Zoe QuinnFunniest post in this thread.
>>739888892yes
>>739877739not a pure science but a foundational blueprint
why are soiniggers so retarded? are they zogpsyop or just thirdworlders?
>>739888007Participation mystique enjoyer, you mean.
>The case of a man of 36 with a cardiac neurosis may serve as an example. He was an obviously extraverted type, and his wife was introverted to a pathological degree. They got a divorce. He then married an extremely extraverted woman, lost his cardiac neurosis, and became a typical introvert with the feeling that this was his true nature. >He was a successful businessman who from humble beginnings had worked his way to the top. His originally introverted disposition was kept under by his hard struggle and energetic will, but had to be married in the form of an introverted wife and paid for with a cardiac neurosis.Let me ask here too I guess.What if you are an extravert forcing yourself to live as an introvert due to circumstances and/or trauma rather than a natural disposition? Or do you believe your "original" or "true" type is the same as your current type?
oh my heckin science
>>739891224I'm a socially anxious extrovert so I live like an introvert and I do not enjoy it. Chronic anxiety has been making me age like crazy since I turned 26. I'm now 33 and feel like a 40+ wreck despite working out regularly.No amount of exposure helps unless it's done constantly. I've been in therapy since 2015 and as soon as I have a break, every single automatic thought pattern and behavior comes back before I can take action and I'm back at square 1.I believe I can't fix myself no matter how hard I try, all I can achieve in this life is harm reduction and minimize suffering, but suffer a great deal nonetheless, I will never feel a slightest bit of fulfillment or serenity. Fuck childhood and fuck irreversible neurological damage fucking my shaping my subconscious for life and being unfixable. I wish I was brave enough to end this.
>>739891224My guess is your "true" type is the one you're most comfortable with, in the example you posted the guy seemed to have a succesfull life but suffered from neurosis (whatever that means), and then was alot happier when he could live out his actual disposition. When you live like an introvert and get by but still suffer alot under it and feel lonely and like you're missing out all the time then you propably aren't that introverted, just repressed. I think this would actually apply to alot of people here because they complain about it all the time.also note that I know nothin about nothin so who knows
>>739891224An interesting anecdote.>What ifI don't know.>Or do you believe your "original" or "true" type is the same as your current type?I'm no psychologist or have read anything of Jung or others, but I have thought about this on multiple occasions as some form of self-reflection. There are so many things that affect and influence you behaviorally from childhood to adolescence that it's very hard to make the distinction between "true" or not. I couldn't do it for certain, at least.There are plenty of reasons why I am a friendless shut-in and most of them too embedded to my formative years/subtle to pick apart on my own, but I do 'think' I'm a natural introvert if only because I've never been any other way.
>>739892410Might sound weird to say, but nowadays I believe it might be harder to be an extravert. Especially for a male who isn't Chad or particularly successful.The introvert would naturally want an introverted lifestyle, so those things become secondary issues until he literally cannot live at all.>>739892741>My guess is your "true" type is the one you're most comfortable with>When you live like an introvert and get by but still suffer alot under it and feel lonely and like you're missing out all the time then you propably aren't that introverted, just repressedYes basically.It's one of these things that had always confused me because you see many "introverts" who seem to want an extraverted lifestyle, or use external standards to measure their self-worth, or other people's. That's very out-of-character for a type who wouldn't give those things any real thought, as they believe the subject and inner factors are more relevant/interesting/determining etc.
>>739888853Yes, I agree, especially when the message it's replacing is both factual and wholesome. I guess they wanted 'women should be slaves to capital' to be the message instead.
>>739884326>Even Persona is just singular: Persona 4Persona 2 as well (inb4 "Persona started at 3")
>>739877569Calm down, Werzog.
>>739891224I thought I was a failed normalfag until I realized the tendency of me constantly seeking a reason not to be among others, it was my brain going numb and not being interested in whatever was happening and mostly noise, my mental acuity improves when I am on my own and I do favor being in a space where I'm not interrupted or distracted by it.I think it's not a small issue how sensorially fucked you can be by continuous distraction and noise and you don't even realize how much it affects your ability to concentrate or think clearly, perhaps there are things you'd even enjoy doing if it wasn't for this sort of feeling of constant agitation, for me that overload can get me slightly dizzy, if you live in a 3rd world shithole like I do, or live in a place where you're constantly distracted get that sorted out immediately, I use noise cancelling earbuds and they're decent enough, and can regulate how much sound I can block, to the point I can only hear my own breathing and not much else.>But I like listening to podcats or musicI do sometimes as well, however I have no interest on listening to whatever is happening outside, I get to choose when I want to listen to something or not.
>be jung>click around on the "computer">gives it labels for patterns like "microsoft word, ms paint">this is outrageous>be neuroscientist>scan the cpu over and over again>it's all 0's and 1's, who knows what it means>get all the hardware down, clueless about all the software>we'll figure out the rest someday, but anything else isn't science
>>739896217Basically.
>>739896861You will never be an absolute object.
>>739897063But do I get to fuck the anima if I don't want to become her?
>>739877569Hylic detected.
>>739897174Sensation type*I wish I was joking but Jung himself made the association straight in one of the first chapters of Psychological Types so...
>>739877132He doesn't look that Jung.
>>739896217you missed the point of Jung.>Be Jung>Study and become a pretty amazing doctor of psychiatry and psychology>PhDs, peer reviewed papers, and shit.>Freud names you the successor and executor of the Psychological Analysis>Suddenly, with no fucking reason at all, just claim everything was wrong and create this archetype and collective unconscious framework>Freud asks you to take a vacation, and/or your meds> you refuse, claiming you have found a way to measure and observe the "soul">lose everything: positions, certifications, license to practice>continue writing your psychobabble>gain everything back and more because people think there's merit to it>you credit your success because your work is speaking to something inherent to every person - the soul link between everyone and every universe.>OneDayYou'llUnderstand.smirk>dies richnote: Psychiatry is more of a science and accredited than neuroscience.
>>739897243>so...Don't leave me hanging in suspense, anon, finish your thought. So what?
>>739897318he has Benjamin Button disease
>>739877569Sinchronicities probably happen to most people desu
>>739897370He did basically made canon that Sensation types would be hylics.But strangely enough, Pneumatikoi would be thinking types, Psychikoi matches feeling, and there is no equivalent for intuition.
>>739878934bruh
>>739877793Traditional astrology is based, modern/psychological/new age astrology is garbage but I don't know how much Jung can be blamed for this.
>>739897580>but I don't know how much Jung can be blamed for this.None at all since his concepts nowadays are only used in fiction.We have extraversion and introversion yes, but the terms aren't used in the way Jung defined them(they are not social attitudes or ways to "recharge"). And things like MBTI&Socionics are a mess that have basically fuck all to do with his actual typology.
>Jung>actually old
>>739881868Who is he?
>>739897154Go find a femboy
>>739891224I wonder if this is why trannies exist
>>739878102>To broke the rules
I don't think it's Jung's fault. It's just that basic introduction to psychololy/economics that everybody takes at their first or second university semester and really think they have everything figured out after that.Actual Jung is an esoteric and very complicated mess.And it's really funny because it feels like gamedevs from the 90s were dropouts who did the same kind of course and put it into their writing.t. psychiatrist
>>739899248the rebel borked the garmar
>>739899120No, that's the Anima
>>739897354>use psychobabble as template for characters and narrative(12 archetypes, symbolism, etc.)>itjustworkslmao!
I don't know what any of these posts mean. I like swords.t. historian
>>739899382It's more likeAt the start it feels like he's just saying something about a good side of the personality and a bad one, and also some character archetypes who are apparently shared amongst people.Then you realize it's more esoteric than that and you can't tell whether you are doing some metaphysical fuckery or this guy is high as fuck, truly giving his old master Freud a run for his money (but with fewer benis, booba and bagina analogies)Finally you realize he actually just named things that were more or less known but only eastern spiritualists and maybe some random philosophers bothered mentioning once or twice, but never really assigned a particular psychological significance to their work.Which is to say it's not really esoteric but also not exactly a system with fixed concepts or rules, in fact there isn't even a real list of archetypes. It's "empirical" in a certain way, since he's just reporting observed dynamics.
>>739899382Yeah we got it, you're the genius who looks down on everyone else, thanks for enlightening us with your wisdom
>>739899923>I like swords.Does Black Mage know you're here, Fighter?
>>739900809I like swords.
>>739901532I like sword. That's a personal weapon.
>>739877132What are his quitessential works?I want to know his ideas beyond what persona taught me.
>>739899747the fact remains people remember Jung.People don't remember whoever Freud replaced him with
>>739877524Remedy Connected Universe, explicitly so. In there even utter bullshit like Synchronicity is canon.
>>739904245>Synchronicity is canon.Just like IRL
>>739877569he’s studying the mind not the brain. obviously the data is intangible because the mind itself is intangible but it’s still replicable through direct experience
>>739894931Read nigga READ>All the others are just calling the demon summoning bullshit Persona to be distinguished from SMT.
>>739884875Evidently you can't fucking read.
>>739884807>chimpanzees exist>therefore human psychology is worthlessok
>>739904953C.U. isn't some sort of shared hivemind anon.Archetypes would be basically the first thing that exist in your mind before the p.u. layer, and then something finally arrives to p.c. through the operation of the 4 functions of consciousness (Thinking, Feeling, Sensation, Intuition).Opposite way around can also happen, Jung says that whether you set the "absolute entity" behind the objective world or the inner one is sort of arbitrary.>>739896861
>>739877982This turned out to be prescriptive, not descriptive.
>>739881235>you are not just your brainNo. Because your body is a wholistic system and having a tummy ache literally changes your cognition. This is why brains in jars will never work. The human mind is not contained in just the brain, but is reliant on impulses from toe to tip to function properly. But you are a meat sack.
>>739905508You got raised by omnosis of the same information everyone else around you, you illiterate retard. That's it. His entire drugtrip of a "theory" fell apart long ago.>It's not that but kinda that but not that still because semantics!Is this what makes you pseudo-intellectual dropouts and failures feel intelligent?
>>739905708>nah man you're just imagining those patterns schizo
>>739905776Don't tell this anon about microphysics and relative space/time. You are not ready for Mr. Jung's Wild Ride.>>739906296Are you mixing C.C. and C.U.?Whoever is around me does not matter for the latter, that comes from the subject/inner side. Though since it's still "impersonal"(as in, does not reflect personal experience), Jung speculates it's basically imprinted into you somehow.
>>739877569Stay in your lane, physicalist midwit.
>>739905776Materialists reductionists are faggots, "lol you're just a biological machine". First, you can't prove it, because that would require an external observer, second, why don't you destroy the world?
>>739877569Jung rapes your whole lineage for 10'000 years
>>739906552Would that count as archetypal rape?
>>739906498Before 1900, scientists were philosofers and viceversa, then it all went to shit, and now STEMfags are philosophical illiterates>t. Stemfag
>>739906296If that is true the "modern audience" crowd should have had zero problems reshaping human society. After all as long as the input is shared culturally people should just readily accept dogshit whatever the highest authority of society feeds them without question.
>>739906513What kind of psychology drives someone to go from, "Am I really just flesh and blood?", to, "I must exterminate all life!"?Why would me thinking that I'm a meat sack make me want to destroy the world? Describe the driving impulse.
Jung wrote the first piece of Esoteric Hitlerism and we heil him for that.
>>739906443More like coming in with a pattern and beating stuff into shape for it. The Heroe With a Thousand Faces is a good model for making YA type action stories. But it doesn't really describe many historical tales.
>>739900392What Jung discovered and the thing you can learn most about him is to take a certain perspective towards human behaviour, especially across the ages. The guy loved his history and mythology after all.
>>739906660If consciousness were completely mappable, and we were just biological machines following a predictable pattern, even if probabilistically deterministic, then I do not see the difference between breaking a computer and a crime, there are no subjects, there are only objects in the universe that suffer for no reason, because there is no intrinsic value in being human, I believe in man, not in anything mystical, but in the irreducibility of consciousness
>>739906594precisely
>>739906882Why would you want to do that? Do you like breaking computers right now?
>>739906660Personally I'm more of a capitalist. A clump of cells is only worth as much as the wealth it can produce. There is zero reason to feel bad about the suffering you cause because it doesn't matter. What matters is that you become rich and gain influence.
>>739906967Can't wait for my dreams of being dicked down by a very familiar old man with glasses and a very smug expression.
>>739906724>bro, the tropes in in TVtropes don't fit perfectly so they don't count
>>739907050Nothing about that mindset is enabled by materialism, because you can just as easily discount the spiritual experience of other people to treat them as mere means.
>>739906467What book is this?
>>739907109If you're comparing it to TVTropes, then you're just agreeing with me.
>>739907231Not exactly a book but.
>>739907207Yes it does. It absolves you from metaphysical nonsense like human rights.
>>739907272The point I'm making is that you really struggle with the concept of generalization. It's the same shit woke retards struggle with. Though most of the time it just feels like cynical sophistry.
>>739906636As if the wokeshit and the herd's bleating was the only input you took all through your life.Culture is not rewritten so easily.>>739906467I don't care about your new religion, delusionalbro.
>>739907376Generalization is useless when discussing the products of artists that are differentiated by specifics.
>>739877569>
>>739907443>bro, if you don't get everything right exactly it means you're completely wrongyou really are like a woke retard
>>739877132>be OP>sucks at grammar
>>739907310Human rights are justified entirely through materialistic philosophy. Basic utilitarian reasoning of it being better for you if society believes in shared fictions like inalienable rights creates a justified self-perpetuating system.
>>739907286Thanks. It's funny, I was just reading about Plato's Forms yesterday before going to sleep, which lead me to Jung's C.U. and... Synchronicity.And what do you now? The very next morning I see a Jung thread here. I'm convinced we are more than the sum of our parts, are there's more beyond the world we perceive. I have a lot to learn.
>>739907402>>I don't care about your new religionUnlike some neo-Jungians, I have no religious ideas on Jung, I'm just curious and don't care to conform what I'm allowed to think to modern academic consensus, especially on something like psychology since the shit we do nowadays is extremely surface-level tier bs with much shakier grounds than anything claimed by Freud - not even saying Jung here.
>>739907551No it isn't. I am in no way obligated to acknowledge your needs in any way.
>>739907517If your generalization ignores actual identifiable and definitive traits then it is useless and just becomes a type of practiced ignorance for the sake of itself. You are generalizing without any benefit to analysis.
>Mythological Roots of Cuckolding: The myth of Bata follows a eunuch whose wife leaves him for the Pharoah, the God king of Egypt. His wife has Bata killed and he is reborn as a bull or ox. His wife again has him killed, and his blood fertilizes the earth and a cedar tree is born. Again, his wife has the tree felled and she becomes pregnant when a splinter of the tree imbeds itself in her mouth. Bata is reborn as his own son through his wife, and becomes the Pharoah himself.>The psychological eunuch (the cuckold) is incapable of self-generation. He thus has his wife bed the superior, fertile man, referred to as the "bull". This is no coincidence; in extreme forms of cuckolding, the "bull" impregnates the wife. The cuckold is acting out this archetypal motif. He is attempting to recreate conditions necessary to regenerate his psyche. The final stage before the hero is born comes when his wife (the symbolic unconscious) "consumes" the nascent hero in the form of the tree and becomes pregnant with his own son and self. This is the final stage of self-generation, and the precursor to the new Pharoah. Psychologically speaking, the Pharoah is the archetypal king capable of creation/ expansion/ boundary setting for the new kingdom.>The cuckold projects the feminine archetypal roles onto the wife because he has yet to birth within himself a fully formed ego consciousness which makes the act of discrimination possible (this is part of me, these are parts of you, etc.). He also projects the role of the superior masculine onto the "bull", whose purpose is to plant the seeds within the feminine that eventually give birth to the hero (to ego consciousness itself).
>>739907604>there's more beyond the world we perceiveThat much was always far too obvious, there again>intuition type
>>739907649You're the type of retard that would say that music theory is useless because it doesn't actually tell you how to make good music.
>>739907797This guy went through his texts to find any mention of cuckoldry.
>>739907612heh, my symbolism isn't cryptic because I actually pay attention
>>739908131I still have to figure out why as a kid I dreamed multiple times shit involving falling from a balcony.
>>739907836>bro if you just ignore the corners a square is the same as a circle
>>739906513>first, you can’t prove anythingNeither can you, but his view has far more evidence than your pseudoreligion.>why don’t you destroy the worldBecause I can’t and it doesn’t benefit me, you retarded nigger. No, there’s no point in anything. That doesn’t mean that not having a point intrinsically means everything should explode. I even have self preservation instincts inbuilt.
>>739908382>look, if I just misinterpret what this text is saying then it must be wrong
>>739907624Okay, then multiple people will figure out your amateur manipulations and discard you. You don’t become a machiavellian master the second you acknowledge there is no physical universal basis to morality.
>>739908435
>>739908601No they won't. I will be the next Donald Trump. I don't even have to be smart to make it work.
>>739908656Very good, you posted a basedjack. So do you have a point or has your helplessness just resulted in lashing out?
>>739907050Isn't that just Calvinism?
>>739908709Trump was born rich and well-connected. You’re some fag on 4chan. Good luck climbing the social ladder.
>>739908721I posted your worldview and a soijak.
>>739908793So the latter. Pretty pathetic that this is all your divine spark can impose on reality.
>>739908656What's the Jungian explanation behind soijaks?
>>739908554>look, if I just misinterpret what this text is saying then it fits my theory
>>739907469>>739908656I look like this and say this
>>739908783You can be a nigger like Vaush and still have people that back your retarded ass. It doesn't matter. You just have to be able to talk bullshit in a really convincing manner.
>>739908435>. No, there’s no point in anythingOf course nothing has a predetermined meaning, but that is not what I said, I defended the irreducibility of consciousness, we are the only lens the universe has to look at itself, only we can see the universe and say "how disgusting'" I am defending the ontological difference between man and other forms of life. Nothing has meaning, and for this reason, we have the will to power
>>739908830I'm not lashing out at all. I'm merely holding a mirror to your face.
>>739908851I say again, good luck with your devious schemes. I’m sure you’ll out-grift everyone else.
>>739908836 they're post-modern archetypes
>>739908838>noo if you simplify it you're going to ruin everythinguh, no?
>>739908893That is a lot of back-to-back assumptions. There may be other conscious species, there may be other species MORE intelligent than man, and consciousness may simply be a cognitive trick.
what the hell is going on here
>>739908929you'll feel really stupid for doubting me
>>739909063New-religion lashes out at apathy.
>>739909082Sure, give me your name before you make it big
>>739884393definitely, some would bring in a Jungian reference.
>>739909026>and consciousness may simply be a cognitive trick.Are you the guy who posted about "fake fun"? Sorry, but I'm also into Yui-ism.>>739909063NPCs are threatened by funny old man talking about individuation and differentiating yourself from the collective.
>>739878346>i'm smarter than freudthis but unironically
>>739909026>you existing isn't actually true, it's just a lie invented by your brain, your current tangible experience? it's bullshitpeak materialism
>>739908836they represent the shadow of whoever is posting them
>>739909210“Consciousness” implies it is separate from basic deterministic cognition, which it may not be.
>>739909135Nah. You'll know it once a furfag makes it big.
>>739909229Stellar argumentation, but I shouldn’t be too hard on you. You were always destined to turn out like this.>>739909291Tezuka? Like half of the upper officers of the military? Probably a good chunk of the secret service?
>>739909274What if the material world is a lie?
>>739909020>noo if you complicate it you're going to ruin everythinguh, no?
>>739909456Well then they did a really good job making it cohesive. They did exceptionally well designing all the awakened non-hylics like yourself to be completely unable to evidence anything and instead universally look like schizo assholes.
>>739909410Why would I take a retard like you seriously? You wouldn't even lie to yourself for the sake of motivation. You're destined to be worthless since you already know your place.
>>739877132I prefer Karl Hungus.
>>739909585
>>739909587Well at least you’re consciously aware that you’re lying to yourself for a sliver of motivation. I didn’t really need “a purpose” to accomplish anything, but you were born weak and destined to be easily defeated, so whatever works for you.
>>739909685Yeah, like that. You really capture the hilarious self-importance, as you were designed to.
>>739909686You just accept your own weakness. It's like you don't want to succeed at all. I don't even have to convince you to give up because you'll just do that for me.
>>739909778I guess this is what the untalented are destined for, to forever be their own hype-man.
>>739909754>curiosity badfaggot niggercattle
>>739909826worked for Trump
>>739909830I was curious as a young teen myself. Once your “curiosity” morphs into “faith”, you aren’t just asking questions anymore.>>739909884Trump, again, was born rich and well-connected. Hypemen come with the toadies that licked his boots for a sliver of his wealth.
Psychology is such a midwit fieldYou are the crystalgirls of science
>>739877132The only good Jung is Kitty Jung.
>>739909970Being born rich wasn't the only factor. It's like turning down a free stat bonus because your ego is too materialistic to just roll with it.>boohoo, I can't win because other people were born with advantagesself defeating nihilist faggotYou are niggercattle, an NPC. A worthless sack of shit.
>>739909970>Once your “curiosity” morphs into “faith”, you aren’t just asking questions anymore.>"noo, my empiric analysis doesn't support these conclusions because it's unverifiable, I refuse to act on my intuition."
>>739910134I AM wealthy. I just want you to understand that Trump and you are not the same. You do not have his advantages, and this discussion leads me to believe you share his disadvantages. Good luck landing a spot on primetime television.
>>739910004I prefer magical girl, thank you very much.By the way, all Jungians ITT need to watch this stuff.
>>739910285>primetime televisionfaggot boomer retard
>>739910412Well it worked for him and selling a streaming show is less profitable. No idea how you are going to make it as a reality TV star nowadays.
>>739909026>consciousness may simply be a cognitive trick.That would be the death of humanity, thankfully it can't be proven, and this will remain an open question forever
>>739910479you are really struggling with the concept of generalizationit's not particularly surprising
>>739910280>no you don’t understand, I FEEL itWe can literally already manipulate emotions and intuition in a lab environment. Your divine spark loses to a powerful electromagnet.
>>739910542You still have yet to outline how you’re going to “become Trump” from your place of disadvantage, I’m just giving you his milestones.
>>739910524Only a dumbfuck nigger concerned with landing on the right side of the debate would give a fuck. A reasonable man like me wouldn't care if you disprove consciousness. Like what incentive do I have to care if your book verifies if you're just a flesh computer? The distinction literally doesn't matter.
>>739877524The Project Moon series
>>739910581>manipulate intuitionI'd like to see you try. Only works on sensoids probably, since their intuition is not under conscious control usually.
>>739910656It will happen because I'm lucky and opportunistic.
>>739878102Can I be all of these at once?
>>739877569>Jung is literally worthless, nothing he ever did can be replicated or tested scientificallyNo fucking shit captain obvious. The metaphysical is the human experience, so all you can do is write down the events and then see if there's a pattern, which there is.
>>739910581I can manipulate emotions and intuition by throwing a brick in your face.
>>739910768>archetype maxxingJungfags... what would happen with anon if he did that?
>>739904648>he’s studying the mind not the brainA lot of people don't think the two are separate things.
>>739910725I don’t think you even know what intuition is.
>>739910847I like to think I'm on the verge of escaping the matrix and then I am become god and create my own matrix keeping the cycle going
>>739877569how Jungian of you
>>739910883Have you considered that neither actually exists?
>>739910995>Have you considered that neither actually exists?You're retarded to think that. I mean, you had to use your mind, which is the essence flowing through your material brain to think.
>>739910915Always funny when anons keep trying to teach me how2Jung when I'm fairly sure I read more than anyone ITT..."perception by the way of the unconscious" as per definition, though paradoxically enough intuition itself can be a differentiated function in consciousness, which is to say one that's fully directed by will.If anything, it means you can do some filtering or intentionally arrest intuitive activity.
>>739910679Man has always sought a meaning, I do not believe humanity would accept discovering that it is merely a more complex computer
>>739911187It could just be a simulation.
>>739911302Why not? You can make people accept socialism.
>>739877569Wait until you find out how your emotions and states of being produces ripples in your body which leads to inflammation and can end with auto-immune diseases. Not only is it not science fiction anymore, its happening right now. Psychosomatic issues are real and all the faggots yelling about how you should ignore your body because your feefees disappear when you close your eyes are about to get a rude awakening. "Bro you control your body bro, he is your slave bro" is the biggest cope the retarded gym monkeys have served to men all over the world.
>>739911301“Intuition directed fully by conscious will” is called a “thought”, my precious pseudoreligious boy. Cool that you too can have thoughts and feelings, weird you feel the need to brag about it using two dollar words.
>>739911417>It could just be a simulation.That would still imply there being a mind in existence.
>>739911716It's only a "thought" as much as seeing something with your eyes and maintaining awareness of this object in your mind counts as "thinking".
>>739911789Why? It might be something else.
>>739912118>Why? It might be something else.We've got enough evidence that when you destroy the brain, the mind is gone. For a collection of memories and decisions to be contained (the essence/the mind), you need a container. It really is that simple.What you're trying to do to trip me up isn't working because you're just saying random stuff that sounds important, and I can see right through it.
>>739912410>we got enough evidence that when we destroy the radio that the transmission is gone
>>739912383I don't get it.But I wonder what Jvng would think about computers, AI and stuff. Bet he would try to do C.U. experiments with LLMs, it's literally no different than reading random shit from various cultures/time periods and nooticing archetypes.
>>739912763that is what a midwit would think
>>739912540Anon. Can you take your mind out of your brain right now?
>>739912826Nah, genuinely the process is about the same.
>>739912909only if you think that people are computers
this dumb ass 92iq motherfucker going "LLM this" and "Jung that" rofl
>>739911985That's a memory. They feed into both thoughts and feelings.>>739912540And what about when we modify the radio and the content of the "transmission" changes completely? Surely if it was just an incomplete receiver, much of the "transmission" would be uncorrupted. Why does the whole thing change?
>>739878019Good one Dad.
>>739913043I don't. You are forgetting that the content scraped by LLMs is written by humans, so you would be able to prove emerging patterns might be archetypes.
>>739912898idk, can I? The demiurge doesn't want me to do it.
>>739913395So that's a "No" then, and it relies on the existence of something else you have no idea of the existence of.
>>739913125>That's a memory.Actually, that's an analogy. Trying to say that intuition is similar to sensory perception and awareness, that is not something you "think" or "feel" about it until it has been already perceived. Now you might want to read above what kind of perception we are talking about here, since the sensory part is covered by its own function instead.
>>739913214So? Everyone's voice is treated as equal. So you don't get the kind of filtering that you get with fairy tales and religious texts that might make that material worth studying. People would need to go back to passing stories orally to get anything worth studying. Otherwise you're just diagnosing someone's personal issues filtered through a narrative. Like is the case with a H.C. Andersen fairy tale for example.
>>739913516Uh huh, so you consciously receive soul-signals from the universe and manipulate them with your will in order to form magic, and this magic that you have definitely felt with your mind-soul is why you put faith in this whole system to begin with. Meanwhile I can focus an electromagnet in your brain and make you feel or intuit whatever the machine is designed to make you.
>>739913510dude I don't even know if you exist, lol
>>739913715So do you have more faith in me or the demiurge existing? Because apparently one of us is stopping you from astral projection.
>>739913662You don't need a machine to make you intuit and feel things. I can make people your feel and intuit things with my fist. I can even make you feel and intuit different things. Like if I shove my fist up your ass you'll feel one sensation, but if I punch you in the face you'll have a different sensation.It's very scientific and the results are reproducible.
>>739913803How? I can't know if astral projection is a thing or not in the first place.
>>739913876Yeah, you're right. But I'm not the one claiming extrasensory perception here.
>>739877543Thanks for blessing my thread anon.
>>739913647>Everyone's voice is treated as equal.As it should, if I want to study something that's on the level of collective unconscious.>>739913662> consciously receive Of course not, just like you don't consciously *receive* sense data.>and manipulate them with your willYou do get to direct the perception to certain things over others and arrest awareness selectively, if anything. Or basically look at something else with your eyes, or look at the same thing but focus on a shape over its color, that's the kind of thing we are talking about here.
>>739914019I can feel the butthurt of people. It's definitively real.
>>739914067I am trying my very best to make you shit yourself by exerting my incalculable will on the collective unconscious. What magic words and rituals do I need to do to achieve this fucking boywiccan curse magic?
>>739914153What does this have to do with Jung?
>>739914118That's just being on /v/ you retard.
>>739914067>as it should, if I want to study something that's on the level of collective unconscious.You don't get good data that way, it's like trying to write a story by committee. We have mountains of Marvelslop to demonstrate that the approach is dogshit and doesn't work.
>>739914153>exerting my incalculable will >on the collective unconsciousWhat did anon mean by this.
>>739914214Because apparently I am a divine spark that exerts gravity on the soul of the universe, and I want to make people shit themselves over the internet.
>>739914246Anon I was talking about how Jung would have fun experimenting with his idea of the C.U., not him writing a plot.
>>739914278No you are a low IQ leftist seething about things you can't understand, you have no will
>>739914317It's amazing that my lack of desire to play along with your boywiccan universe-soul has labeled me a leftist in your mind. The horseshoe is real, you and crystal girls have a lot to talk about.
>>739877524Everhood. It gets so blatant that in the second game you meet Jung and talk with him.
Hes jewish
>>739877982Is this Nyarlathotep propaganda?
>>739914289Yeah but you don't get it. You're studying mainly conscious impulses of people to figure out the unconscious with zero means to figure out what belongs to which camp.That's why his approach in his clinical work was to get people to describe their dreams. He didn't ask them what they think it meant. He asked for as much unfiltered information as he could get.
>>739914356I'd rather talk to the crystal girls than to you for sure. Maybe I get to fuck some with enough Jungism.>>739914403lmao, and I thought literally going for "blue girl = extravert, pink girl = introvert" along with a literal shadow cure was the limit of how blatant you can get before you just write "this is Jung with magical girls".
>>739914465It's an high school level explanation to how myths work.
>>739914502I get what you are trying to say, but it's not like you are reading the entire dataset raw. You get to do the filtering on the level of your own user prompts.
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