What's the worst Smash?
>>740034721/thread
64
>>740034721Melee > Brawl > 64 > Ultimate > 4
>>740034721For wii u & 3DSIt really lacks it's own identity, there was no reason to stay attached to it once Ultimate came along
>64 is a well-rounded game>Melee expands on it, more competitive>Brawl has the most content>Smash for 3DS has exclusive content and was the first portable>Ultimate expands the roster and significantly tweaks/speeds up Sm4shIt's objectively Smash for Wii U.
No reason to play it over UltimateAt least the 3DS version has Smash Run
Brawl had trippingI didn't play the wii u entry, but Brawl had tripping. Cmon
4
>>740036587Its balloon physics were worse than the tripping
People are going to say 4, but 4 is fine actually.It's probably Brawl, in terms of the game being needlessly unfun to play. Yes, Subspace Emissary was cool, but that's not what Smash Bros is about.And then 64, simply because it's so simple and underdeveloped compared to the other ones (I still like it).
>>740034721Another vote for Sm4sh. Incredibly slow and unambitious.
64, N64 graphics are shitty
>>740034721Wii U/3DS were the worst but all smash games are all fun in their own way
>>740036984>>740034817zoom zoom
>>740034721It has to be 4 even though it was my favorite Smash game to play online. It just doesn’t really stand out now that Ultimate is a thing.
>>740034721brawl is awful>>740035048while ultimate is a better version of 4, I would still rather play 4 over brawl anyday
Honestly, I don't know. It's obviously between Brawl, 4, and Ultimate, but they each have their own strengths and weaknesses.Brawl's gameplay is so fucking bad that it effectively never formed a real competitive community, but it had Subspace Emissary, introduced final smashes, introduced third party characters, and was arguably the biggest jump the series ever experienced in terms of presentation and prestige. If you didn't watch https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PbetJKOQB7k during E3 2006, you don't understand. Also, Japan Time.4 is mediocre and had mediocre newcomers, but I think it's actually a decent game competitively (pre-Cloud and especially pre-Bayonetta) and casually. The issue is that 4 doesn't really have any actual content that justifies its existence, beyond the 3DS version being very technically impressive and having both Smash Run and the funniest glitch in Smash history, Wectoring.I think it unironcially has to be Ultimate. Yes, 4 is mediocre, but Ultimate is actively offensive once you're able to see past the production value of the game - and it doesn't have the singleplayer content that Brawl does to redeem it as a casual game. Ultimate is all style, no substance, and bringing back every single character came at the cost of content and game balance. Even though Brawl's gameplay is worse, Ultimate somehow has the worst competitive meta of any Smash game, so bad that you can't escape it as a casual player playing multiplayer online. Ultimate, more than any other Smash game, made me lose faith in Sakurai's design philosophy.
>>740037213I played 64 back then. It rides heavily on nostalgia. It does deserve praise for being the first to do it but objectively it's a lesser game than any of the others. Only reason people are saying 4 is it because Ultimate offers such a similar experience that 4 is basically irrelevant, but 4 had to lay the groundwork for Ultimate to happen. It's a great game in its own right. 64 does offer a unique experience but you're only going to appreciate it if you're nostalgic.
>>740034721>Asks a question and answers at the same time
Casually:64 Remix > Melee > PM > Brawl > 3DS > 4 > UltimateCompetitively:Melee > PM > 64 Remix >>> 4 > 64 > Ultimate (pre-FP2) > Brawl > Ultimate (post-FP2)Hype (irrelevant):Ultimate > Brawl > Melee > 4 / 3DS > 64
Somewhere they lost the plot of "playing with physics should be fun" and just never recovered.
>>740038334that was brawl, Utterly insane that 4/ultimate continued to use brawl's horrible physics/movement system, what kind of a platform fighter gets rid of momentum upon jumping? Fucking terrible
I like the way melee and brawl look and sound they both have this unique atmosphere and feel to them. I think brawl can be appreciated in that regard atleast. 4 & ultimate are both smash themed smash games if you know what I mean. The only thing I can compare it to is how the nsmb games are mario themed mario games.Now 4 and ultimate aren't nearly as obnoxious with it and its nice that it allows for absolute variety(especially in music) but I liked how melee and brawl took all these totally different things and glazed them in something to make them all feel like they were apart of the same thing.It makes things just that little bit less jarring and almost cheap looking. Fortnite has this problem aswell but way worse
>>740034721You just posted it. Modded, it's godly.
>>7400350484 is better than Ultimate.
>>740037625I can see how they would fuck up with Steve but Kazuya is insultingly broken. I think having the fighting game characters behave like fighting game characters in smash was a mistake especially when they dish out as much damage as they do and every traditional smash character in the same game struggles to create even 2 hit combos.
>>740039364Auto-turnaround alone is one of the most broken mechanics in platform fighter history
>>740039364nothing's wrong with ryu, ken, or terry. Kazuya is just overtuned. And I wouldn't say he's "insultingly" broken (he's not even top 5), the only one who gets that claim is Steve
>>740039962Shouldn't have dash danced faggotNow we all gotta suffer.
>>740041514wut
>>740041650Ruins the game. Supposed to jump around to move and take the battle into the air instead of being cringe and spamming weak moves with shorthop off the edge. Fuck wave dashing too. I fully commit by entirely charging smash moves all the time and still win. Tourneyfaggots are spiritual Californians Chinese copycat spytoid communist collectivists. #Owned.Need to make a YouTube video about this
>>740037625>so bad that you can't escape it as a casual player playing multiplayer onlineThis also isn't counting just how bad the online is to begin with. There is just no joy to be found anywhere in Ultimate.
>>740041916>game already has a ton of input delay offline>add even more online>no rollback>switch game, portable platform which means most people will be on wi-fiI have no idea how people accept all that when traditional fighting game players bullied Capcom until they reduced SFV's input delay which used to be 8 frames, and there are now talks of boycotting the DoA6 re-release due to no rollback netcode, yet Smashers are fine not demanding changes from one of the biggest franchises from one of the biggest companies. Hell, I even heard Smashers were trying to cancel people who modded Ultimate to be less unbearable online, when the guy who made a mod to reduce SFV lag was considered a hero.
The only one I like is Brawl
Smash Run should have come back. I played that shit more than the real game, making the 3DS version better than the WiiU version by a mile for me.
>>740040086He's unironically the most centralizing character in the game. In order for a character to be viable they need to have an answer to him.He atleast answered the age old question "are disjoints broken?" The answer being that even if a character with no disjoints could %100 take a stock off of nearly every attack in their moveset, almost any swordie is still better then them.
>>740034889Some things have better graphics on Wii U compared to Ultimate. Like Donkey Kong actually having hair. The lighting looks a lot better too.
>>740044148no, that's steve. Kazuya's short reach gives him a notable weakness
>>740034880Nah, 64 feels way better to play than Brawl.
>>740044472Shulk's face is a disaster in ultimate, I don't know what happened there
>>740034721Brawl is saved through having the best mods. But if you're playing vanilla Brawl, it's rough as hell.
The input delay in Ultimate is so much worse than every other game it's unreal.
I only have 500-900 hours in each except for 64 and 3DS + Wii U playtimes are combined>Melee > Ult > Brawl > 64 > 3DS > Wii UI went back to Wii U a few weeks ago for a session, and it feels so fucking weird now but I've always felt the game was lacking. The best part about Wii U's solo content was Crazy Orders, that was fun. We all liked Crazy Orders. I liked the "For Fun" and "For Glory" set-up for online. But the 3DS version had better stages, better solo stuff, a more fun classic mode (Wii U's was meh and "Master Fortress" or whatever was lame) and I actually liked the outline, cartoon visual style. It's still smash 4, though. Yeah Brawl feels weird too and had shitty online but I spent a lot of time playing that game locally to make up for it and the solo stuff was way better.
brawl, 4, and ultishit are are extremely horrifically beyond dogshit so it's really hard to say which one is shittier. they're all really fucking bad. I at least give 3ds a pass for being handheld smash at the time which was something I dreamed of as a kid so it's not bad for some little shit like that. like it's better than the mortal kombat games on game boy or something by far. but brawl/4/ultishit have no excuse like they are unplayable because they're so fucking slow and retarded and braindead with dogshit physics. legit mortal kombat on game boy tier and they were supposed to be nintendo's biggest console sellers.
Honestly when I tried to go back and play all the smash games the only ones I enjoyed were 64 and ultimate.IMHO there is just something "off" about the gamecube, wii, and wii u versions.
>>740046061>there is just something "off" about the gamecubewrong + retarded to think that
Wii UIt plays better than Brawl but has the worst Classic mode ever conceived along with fucking Smash Tour.
>>740034721Brawl > Melee > Ultimate > 64 > 4
mew2king needs help
>>740045403>>740044472Double that on Shulk, something went wrong with the facial animation.And I notice Ultimate dulls out a lot of the colors.Ruined my favorite Lucina alt by turning the red hair one into one with faded hair.
>>740046772What's he up to these days?
>>740034880this for the most partbut none of the games are truly bad
Melee > 3DS > 64 > Ultimate >= Brawl > Wii U
Brawl was probably the most ambitious but it's just a shame that the gameplay just wasn't good compared to its predecessors I'm not a compedo guy by the way, I just definitely noticed the gameplay with sluggish and stiff and brawl
>>740045403>>740046892Shulk looks like a ventriloquist puppet. Pokemon Trainer looks like this.
>>740046772I love m2k but yeah he's going through it right now it seems like. apparently his pc just broke, the thing he was using to get money from people downloading mobile games that would pay him shut down, and he's always begging and shit on stream which I get it but it makes me just not type in the chat cuz he'll ask me to download some gay ass game or some shit that I don't want on my phone... but idk what else he's supposed to do.
Smash4 had grapplers actually be decent for once, so it can't be the worse
>>740039364Kazuya really has way too much shit.>Auto-turn around>Projectile that basically goes full-stage>Superarmor on his smash attacks>Combos with a billion move choices>A stun move that is perhaps the most spammable non-projectile move in all of Smash>The 100% comeback mechanic (I really hate all of these on any character)>Reflector in a kick with the highest multiplier (x2.4) of all reflectors in Smash>Not being put in special fall after his Up Special AND has kill power on it.>Command grab throw that puts you at a disgusting angle.>Ignores Ultimate's conventions on Hit-stop
>>740042153>Hell, I even heard Smashers were trying to cancel people who modded Ultimate to be less unbearable onlineTo be fair, the Smash community was spiritually brown on this issue. In the case of the SFV netcode mod, the community at least made a performative effort to say, "You shouldn't use the netcode mod in random matchmaking, especially because it impacts console players who can't install it." In contrast, the Ultimate community's collective reaction to the delay mod was>Ayo, fuck these broke-ass niggas who won't use the mod! Not my problem, chief!tl;dr modding a Switch isn't as easy as installing a mod for a PC game, can cost money (anywhere from $50-200), voids its warranty, violates the online EULA (potentially getting your Switch banned from online), and the mod is 100% client-side, meaning that there's no way to automatically disable it if your opponent doesn't have it. For whatever reason, the mod author decided it was a good idea to release the mod so that it works against people who don't have it, which is cheating for all intents and purposes.The Smash community is so retarded and averse to collective action that they can't even remove child predators from their community. Not only that, but they're manchildren who crumble the second that daddy Nintendo dangles Mario and Pikachu in front of them. It's the MW2 boycott meme. There was never any hope of them pressuring Nintendo to do anything, lmao.
>>740034721smash 4 is the worst one. ult is second last. it goes melee>brawl>64>ult>4
Melee > Ultimate > Brawl > 64 > Nickelodeon All Star Brawl 2 > Smash Bros 4 Wii u & 3DS. Lol.
>>740045931My Switch became my shitting console, and on the rare occasion I boot up Smash instead of some bite-size game, I feel the input delay on the character select screen and instantly turn it off. It's unplayable.
>>740046772He’s my favorite of the gods. Hope he gets his computer fixed but even when he does, next time he plays a non-smash game I’m gonna fuck him up in it like I tend to do.
>>740046892>the insane rim lightingReminds me of SF6
>>740046996He lives in squalor, he refuses to get a job, and he probably couldn't get a job anyways, he is like a homeless veteran, he streams 20 hours per day to 65 people where he plays modded melee or modded ultimate against viewers and friends and he constantly begs people to donate him money so he can eat for the week.Lol.
>>740046772mew2king is living proof of why social services need to exist>actually autistic>basically harmless by himself>being thrust into the harsh, uncaring world where he needs to support himself makes him behave in selfish, amoral ways that he wouldn't resort to if he could just play Smash and eat Burger King all day
>>740034721Probably Melee then Ultimate.Whichever spawned the most degenerate fucked up fans, since the smash fanbase is the new sonic fanbase
>>740047321i wouldn't call grabs being overpowered in general grappling. i guess bowser's pivot grab and the ding dong count because they're heavies, but even light characters had broken shit off of grab.
>>740048890Melee cause they're cheating with glitches which is autistic, retarded and unnecessary. I can beat their tricks just playing normally
>>740034721Brawl is shitty enough gameplay wise to call it the worst. Even Subspace emissary, while cool in story and concept, is just garbage to play with the shitty level design and terrible physics. Smash 4 is like a slightly more refined version of Brawl's gameplay with some tech removed and plenty of its own bullshit, but custom moves are kind of a neat concept. Ultimate is more watered down Brawl without the same frustrating jank, but the meta isn't great, and there's less useful tech, but you have a huge roster and stage list to play with.
Brawl is peak. Everything else after is tranny Esports shit.
When I noticed the fast characters getting speedcapped in Subspace Emissary and having jumps slightly altered to homogenize their gameplay for what were essentially just Kirby stages, the magic died for me.
>>740048890>Whichever spawned the most degenerate fucked up fans,That would be Brawl.Infact like 90% of the diddlers and creeps started or got serious in Brawl.
>>740051675Mods that just give the characters their base game movement speed make SSE so much more bearable, its disturbing how awful some characters jump in it.
>>740045336Steve is a whole other can of worms, kazuya is too good at what he does and theres a lot of characters that share his game plan and would be hopelessly out matched by him so why play them?
>>740051757Doesn't really fix the god awful autoscrolling segments, but PM/P+ make it marginally more fun.
>>740034721Melee since it only attracts pedophiles
I can’t be the only one who hated Subspace Emissary. It felt like such a grind and a huge downgrade from the level design in Melee. Playing in the mario/zelda universe blew my mind as a kid.
>>740052375It's not something I'd go back to readily.Would be way cooler if it had more enemies and locations from Nintendo's history than just some of the Mario enemies and Halberd, instead of making up all these random OC enemy types.I'm surprised Smash Run on the 3DS actually put in more effort to make new enemies there (though it also reused a bunch of SSE assets too). Smash Run even had Pokemon enemies which I'd never expect.
>>740034721Cant be brawl because that was the last time they fully modeled Peach's bloomers.
I do not understand why so many people say 4. it is miles ahead of ultimate, which is the actual worst smash ever made.4 was actually made to be perfectly playable online, had superior character viability and yes I do mean that, didn't have parry, and you could actually see the characters without blending to the background which to me is an absolutely massive issue with ult.single player modes do not matter.
>>740046772>>740048568>>740047276>>740048668sad as fuckNEO Mang0 > PPMD > M2K > 'mada > Fat Mang0 >>> Fagbox
>>740055789Why does everyone hate Hungrybox? You SHOULD be cheesing everyone to death if you main a lower tiered character, that's literally the correct gameplan and is fun to see.
>>740055843>is fun to seelmaoI hate that bitch because he's proved multiple times that he doesn't have to play like a bitch to win. Rest setups and Bair juggles are rad as fuck to watch. He CHOOSES to ledge camp like a pussy, and he's a fucking prissy drama queen corpo bootlicker outside the game as well. I wish that crab had hit him so he'd actually gain some fuckin perspective.
>>740034721464 is nostalgia bait and the firstMelee is the comp's favBrawl has subspaceUlt has the content4 does nothing special.
>>740055843he used to be a huge cornball during the armada hbox grand finals era. every single tournament you'd watch armada's fox lose to hbox and he'd give some corny-ass speech with the transparent intention of trying to get people to like him, and it was just incredibly tiresome. when he embraced being a heel, he became infinitely more likable. i have a lot of respect for hbox these days, he actually does a lot to support the community and is the most mature top player left.
>>740048378>>Ayo, fuck these broke-ass niggas who won't use the mod! Not my problem, chief!That wasn't the reaction, in was >HOLY FUCK they are gonna use this to cheeeeat! CANCEL CANCEL CANCEL
>>740048469>I feel the input delay on the character select screen andThis may be the most retarded thing I ever read in this whole site.
>>740057186the ultimate CSS is laggy as fuck. your cursor feels like it's drunk. the actual game itself is no better.
>>7400347214 is the most boring to go back to because Ultimate exists but Brawl plays the worst64 is not the worst game, I actually enjoy going back to it sometimes and it's not yet another Brawl asset rip
>>740034721Am I the only one that preferred melee adventure mode to subspace emissary? Adventure mode was short and cut a lot of corners by having you just fight on stages half the time, but when it had platforming and original levels it actually drew inspiration from the series it was emulating.Subspace emissary is like 7 hours of boring forests and ruins with bland OC enemies. To me the perfect smash game would have the quality/length of brawls story mode but with each character in the roster getting their own single player level based on the game theyre from, with enemies and characters making appearances.
Why did it take tourneyfags three (3) games to realize that Sonic the Hedgehog, the character whose defining characteristic is running very fast, can just stall out the match when he gets the upper hand?
>>740046892How could sakurai look at this and think "yup, looks better" its so muted and washed out.
>>740057562I kinda liked adventure mode but it wasn't that notable overall for traversal stages, they were simple and very short.
>>740057562The concept is better than Subspace, but the execution is overrated as hell. I agree that the next game's adventure mode should be the best of both, not leaning into one over the other.
>>740057562Adventure is better at implementing stuff from the games but it's the same thing every time with minor differences, subspace is a shitty kirby game but at least it unlocks characters and you only have to touch it twice
>>740057562Adventure is better in theory, but in practice I think it's like 4 pieces of unique content>Mushroom Kingdom10/10>Zelda maze6/10>F-Zero GP3/10, you basically just hold forward and jump a couple times>Brinstar Escape5/10I still like it more than SSE
>>740057562I liked Adventure waaay more. Mostly because subspace was garbage with a shitty weird plot.
>>740057562Why is adventure mode so fellated here? Its just a better classic mode from 64, while classic mode was just a worse classic mode than 64. WoL and SSE kick its ass
>>740034721Replaying Brawl and Melee for the first time in over 15 years made me realize that these games are basically arcade collectathons dressed up as fighting games. The fun is entirely in collecting trophies, maximizing sandbag distances, unlocking secrets and completing the story modes. The 'fighting' gameplay is merely a vehicle towards these ends. I have never played Ultimate, and the idea doesn't really appeal to me since one of the core mechanics (trophies) was gutted from Ultimate.
>>740046892SOVL VS SOULLESSRETVRN
>>740055843he spitroasted mang0 with Armada during competitive melee's most active peak, mang0fags hated them for constantly on the """""""GOAT""""""". The hate persists
>>740060147*consistently shitting
>>740035048Less input lag
tr4.5h
>>7400347214 because it's completely irrelevant, I guess mostly because it was designed to be played online and not much elseall the others are good, Brawl is the best one
>>740063872>Brawl is the best onekys
>>740034721Smash For 3DS and Wii U>Bad roster>Bad DLC>Barely any single-player content>Bland art style>Bland gameplay>3DS version simply existing when it should have only been on Wii U
>>740035048Controllable Final Smashes.4 >>> Ultimate
>>740064360No it shouldn't have only been Wii U, that'd be a financial disaster.The roster was also good.
It's Smash 4, no debate. Wii U specifically because 3DS is a fun enough novelty to boot up Citra/your 3DS and play a few rounds off before doing something else. Smash 4 is the first game to get hit with patch culture which ultimately did nothing to stop Bayonetta & Cloud (can't understate how fucked & piss easy the latter was, even if he goes under the radar). When people discuss Smash 4, and this'll likely be the case for Ultimate, you really only hear 2 sides. The honeymoon phase and beginning of the game, with its jankiness and stupid opinions going through while we're still getting used to the game, and the end of it, where things may or may not be as interesting. For Smash 4? That's pretty much it. People either say>Haha remember wectoring that was really silly and fun I miss it. (If that's what gets you going then Brawl has x10 the amount of stupid shit intentional or not, making it fun to revisit with likeminded people)Or>Thank god it's over *webm of Lima vs Captain Zack at EVO holding NeutralB*Coming back to the game, unless you really were into the character and meta at the time, there's nothing that really stands out, and significantly less, even at its most broken, unpatched state. There's customs which are kinda fun, but playing it with someone is a hassle. It's arguably the hardest game to play vs someone online right now. 2 have rollback, 1 has active online, and then Brawl may get something eventually.Smash 4 didn't live long enough for its modding efforts to blossom either, it was all just skins & music packs, and 4XM/Ch4os. Brawl and even Ultimate beat it in that regard. In conclusion, you have a game where nothing really jumps at you unless you're THAT much of a Smash nerd, with nothing of value to discover in the modding scene, and a couple of system and ideas that, customs aside, probably exist in Ultimate in some way, but your appreciation of them in Smash 4 likely isn't enough to sway the tides.
>>740034721Ultimate would be my favourite if it wasn't for the horrifically aggressive input buffer that completely ruins the feel of the game for me. I don't know what they were thinking with that and it's doubly worse with their terrible netcode
if you can stomach anything after melee you should die and you deserve to die
>>7400347214 is the worst and most soulless
>>740034721Ultimate.I'm a casul and Smash 4 aerial spam was fun to me, Brawl kinda sucked ass but it did have the Subspace campaign which was nice. Smash N64 is kind of fun in an empty calories kind of way and Melee is Melee
>>740048668>Burger KingJesus, he really DOES need help
It's insane that despite having the biggest roster, Ultimate easily fits that spot. World of Light is booty, there's nothing to do outside of it, and Steve/Kazuya power cliffed a roster already full of Pay to Win DLC.
>>740046892Nintendo got woke and fed everyone anti soul gas
>>740034721For people who don't care about competitive it's either 64 or Smash 4
>>740035048Custom Moves was such a good idea and a step in the right direction, now Megaman is incomplete
>>740072024>subspace was niceOnly the videos, the actual camapaign was bad and those original enemies sucked ass.
>>740075916I'm sure custom moves are fun casually, but we both now the meta would get figured out in a week and every competitive player would use the exact same moveset, and it'd also be hell to balance
>>740076490>compYeah, I kinda don't think about it, I ignore online play too, got tired of the same tactics, felt like I was always playing against the same person.
>>740057987Because Adventure mode was a good but rushed foundation for what a single player mode in smash should be. A mario level where you fight goombas and koopas that leads into a zelda level where you fight redead and octoroks is what a single player smash should be. But i can admit its underdeveloped and rushed (much like the rest of melee).Subspace giving you generic af enemies and generic af levels that dont connect to any respective game was a wrong turn, even if the production quality was a huge step up. The bossfights against Petey piranha, porky and mecha ridley were cool but few and far between. World of light is a joke. Game is called "smash ultimate" and its single player mode is just running around on a flat PNG image filled with gimmick matches against the base roster.
>>740035048This
>>740048668MewTroonKing made everyone hide on the ledge like cowards another reason why melee is ruined
>>740064360Not a single smash game has a bad roster
>>740081125You have to DLC Roid thoughever
>>740081474>complaining about DLC chars in 2026Grow up>unironically posting wojaks nvm you can't
>>740081574Can't even buy DLC after (((Nintendog))) shut down the serversThis is why I don't bother buying DLC for shitch.They will just end up shutting down the servers anyway
