Why is this still impossible to explain
>>740220985Visuals were made at the time for a reason back then (limitations)Today it looks nice but it feels less authentic cuz it's a deliberate imitation? I don't know. Personally I think it looks great and ageless so I don't see why that anon thinks that
its too detailed
>>740220985Because you know it's new. Now fuck off you pretentious contrarian dumbfuck.
>>740220985Old games had bigger budgets because the tech they had was the best at the time, so they had plenty of good artists. Today this same category of games is all high fidelity and indies don't have the money to do the same. A better comparison would be 80s retro to something like Vanillaware games.
It's not impossible to explain at all unless you are retarded.Something made with limitations in mind was trying to push an art style to its limits to convey an idea or design in mind.Something made to imitate limitations ends up therefore not limited, overly detailed and made under a different mindset.It's not only possible to explain, it's common sense to everyone.
you're just trying to find a reason to hate indie games
>>740220985pixel art used to be made with crt screens in mind.nowadays' pixel art is just made with the pixel art itself in mind. yes there are crt filters, but the crt filters don't enhance the actual image.
You actually don't value JUST pixel art, but also the likes of UI, music, lighting, limitations and the craftmanship associated to overcome it, the conditions in which you're playing the game (which, to be fair, can be entirely self inflicted and your fault), or a general sense of cluelessness you had as a kid leading to mystery (among other irreplicable factors, down to a certain je ne sais quoi).Your threshold for tolerating these differences varies on how hellbent you are on playing these for the sake of feeling like the good old days, so to speak.
>>740221178>crtroon arrives to say dumb shitfuck off retard
What is not causing this >the lack of a CRT>the color palette>the art style>being too detailed>any imagined inconsistencies >the resolution being "too high">the lack of limitations What is actually causing this>the fact that modern pixel art games are conceived as pixel art first instead of first having a defined actual vision of a hypothetical ideal "full form" that they then try to translate into pixel art>this means that they're using pixel art tricks that are established as "looking good" but don't actually hint at the greater vision beyond themselves, the pixels only represent themselves instead of the greater vision behind the gameOld pixel art had tons of weird design decisions that didn't make sense visually, but did make sense when you consider the fact that the devs were trying to inform the players about what they are trying to evoke, new pixel art that is good makes all the "right" decisions that have been determined to look good, but don't evoke anything beyond themselves and pleasing pixel art principles, what feels off is the lack of those weird design decisions
>>740220985visionaries pushing up against the boundaries of what is technologically possible in the medium vs unimaginative people using old art styles out of laziness / as a cheap appeal to nostalgia so they can maybe sell 20 copies and not feel like they've wasted their life (they have)
>>740221154Just look at the grass lol. So much unnecessary detail and texture on the grass. Also the values are kinda meh. Too evenly well lit. And this game had a requirement, they simply did it in this art style because they wanted to look like something they played. Aka its a forced art style they tried to immitate instead. Basically its a mockery because it has no limitations. If they limted their color pallete and designs upon themselves with restrictions, it forces you to get creative. Its what I do with my pixel art, I set limits to 5-10-15 colors depedning on the sprite/BG etc. Without putting restrictions you end up focusing too much on details. In pixel art, if you can do it with less, its more.
>>740221049Yeah it makes my eyes swim like new games
>>740221223>"noooooo pixel art definitely wasn't made with crt screens in mind, umm what do you mean if was MADE on crt screens? noooooooo!!!!"
>>740221242I'll try to post some examples of these weird decisions >Chrono Trigger is an anime-looking JRPG made with pixel art>has all the usual JRPG sprites and tiles styles>scene depicting far away mountains has a clashing almost realistic style with soft shading>this is because if they could make the game 3D or an anime those mountains would be a painted background and look just like thatMeanwhile an indie pixel art game would never do something like this for fear of looking inconsistent, they would make the mountains gamey-like and pixelated and fail to evoke what pic related manages to evoke
>>740221462For comparison here is Sea of Stars which is self admittedly inspired by Chrono Trigger, it has no scenes that look like the mountain background from CT and instead tries to use the same style in the background as the main area foreground, which makes the distant view feel gamey and fake instead of evoking the distance and scale that Chrono Trigger does
>>740220985Different engine. Give me an SNES indie game that requires an SNES to play.
>>740221242>modern pixel art games are conceived as pixel art firstCorrect answer. Only reference is previous art without grounding in reality. Pic related.
>>740221273Pretty much. And yeah, the grass and the stone road are particularly offensive. Just calm the fuck down with the minutia of detail, you don't need every blade of grass and every shade of a pebble in a god damn minimalistic artstyle.
>>740220985I tried Adventure of Elliot and it was fucking awful. Modern bloated presentation combined with pixels that have no facial animations don't mix well. The lack of scanlines make the game feel empty despite superior graphical fidelity.
>>740221178>allow me to demonstrate the difference using your non CRT based screenRetard-kun.
Visual clutter7 bajillion colorsWhat am I supposed to be looking at?The backgrounds are overdetailedThe sprites are underdetailed and many of them are just copied designs from the older games they try to look likeAlso it's like modern pixel artists are really fucking scared of repetition. No that particular floor tile must have some cracks and some moss and some garbage. No you see, that tree over there must look completely different from the other 571 trees we put in this fucking map. Why? I like clarity not your meaningless bullshit
>>740220985because you aren't a kid anymore and your sense of wonder has died a long time ago
>>740221683>Pic related.the thesis breaks down when the most celebrated "visionaries" in japan- tezuki, miyazaki, anno- were all just manchildren immersing themselves in duck comics and gundam respectively.
>>740220985It's called SOVL.Western games imitating JRPGs with pixel art have an ugly generic feel to it mostly with tumbr character portraits and RPGmaker character/enemy sprites.
>>740221242I was gonna say the op image looks fine to me as a nearly 40 year old boomer who played in the pixel art era, but I think your response is the right one. The "idea" of making pixel art means a lot of things look the same, rather than the idea of conveying a drawing as pixels
>>740221242>>740221526Here's a bridge scene from Suikoden II>the bridge is just a regular stone bridge, it's not a whimsical JRPG bridge with plump proportions and crystal decorations >the new game is playing into the stereotype of JRPGs being whimsical and having lots of crystal references, it's trying to evoke the tone and stereotypes of the genre>the Suikoden bridge scene is trying to evoke a serious grounded tone that it would have even as an anime or 3D game, you can imagine what the scene would look like in those mediums but you can't do that for the OP scene because it's designed primarily as a gamey video game bridge scene >Suikoden is not trying to be evoke a genre, it's trying to evoke its own vision while being executed as part of a genre is just the technical reality and almost an unintended part of the design
>>740220985Because you grew up to be jaded, and lack the whimsy to find charm in new games that don't tickle your nostalgia, reminding you of a younger, better time.
>>740220985It's because you're not twelve any more
>>740221242That is not to say old artists never worked directly in pixel art, in fact here's proof that it did happen, but it was still about having a vision first and finding a way to best convey it with limited pixels, as opposed to just working with established pixel art conventions instead of having any sort of vision
>>740220985I also often note inconsistencies in the different artworks.In OPs pic it looks like the characters, floor/houses and doodads like the lanterns/ornaments were made by three different people.
>>740220985well i for one hate the hue shift
>>740220985Call me blind but the artstyle of OP looks perfectly in line with GBA games like Sword of Mana
>>740221049>too detailed>>740221273>So much unnecessary detail and texture on the grass>>740222292>hue shiftAll period accurate
I think you're all full of shit, you've already decided that "old good, new bad" and now you're trying ro rationalize it after the fact.
>>740221178>It looks the same in the thumbnail (the actual resolution the game would be play at)lol CRTrannies
>>740220985I get a perverse thrill out of putting people in deliberately unwinnable situations so my expectations are intentionally impossible to meet. Nothing you can do will ever be enough to actually satisfy me, and I will always move the goalposts on you. And I still expect you to keep playing this unwinnable game for my amusement now that you know this, because my ego is bigger than the known universe, and I feel entitled to treat other people as my playthings.
>>740220985Inconsistent art style and colouring usually does it.FFVI is one of the best looking 2D Pixel games and compare its art style and direction to this.There is definitely good looking pixel art made today but pretty far and few in between.IMO one of the best modern games was UFO 50, I think because they forced themselves to stick to a very limited palette and pixel size.
>>740221865>>740222142>>740222156>>740222416>>740222553Actual illiterate retards or bots
>>740220985I don't and never liked how they had to draw people as those weird miniature dolls. Chrono Trigger did all right though.
>>740222470>Tranigger retard doesn't understand the difference between internal resolution and display resolution and kids playing inches away from the tv screenMany such cases.
this image comes from this tweet https://x.com/ShitpostRock2/status/2062235868715229327
>>740220985Autistic spergs will disagree, but it's because it's not on a crt
>>740222634You think there are genuine humans on this board? lol
>>740220985Because you don't want new game, you want the same exact game that you've played as a child so you can nostalgia hard about it. A new game in the same stye doesn't have the same connection, nevermind you lowkey don't want it to be good because it means the game that you've originally played is inferior to the new one. You've already decided in your mind that something is wrong/fake about the new game from the start.
>>740220985It's because they are immitating existing games instead of doing their own interpretation of life
>>740222807I'm human.
>>740222681On top of lower resolution, 256 colors, chromatic aberration, curved display, horizontal blur, crt lines. The tileset also needs to align with a grid. Unless the tiles are really small some of the features in this image look implausible. Or like they're assembled in photoshop.
>>740220985It's not, you dufus2
>>740222681This tweet comes from this post https://arch.b4k.dev/v/thread/703130345/#703130345
>screencap of /v/ from twitter reposted on 4chankeepthechaingoingpost that on your official blue checkmark twitter account AGAIN
>>740222919actually it's https://arch.b4k.dev/v/thread/732037847/#732037847 but the end result is the same: bots reposting shit
>>740220985Because old games are working with hard limitations and it's satisfying to see what they come up with to accomplish their vision. Each retro dev was different and the tools to build games were not completely homogenized and each new generation of tech shuffled the deck and brought new techniques.Today all that is gone and when you play a modern indie that is a emulating a retro look you know they can do whatever they want, there is no struggle, you don't really care about the water texture or how they did it. It's boring.
>>740222807Don't get mad at me, I'm just the manifestation of all of the thoughts that /v/ doesn't want to say out loud. I wouldn't exist if everyone on /v/ wasn't so unapologetically self-absorbed and refused to admit it. Just say it: "I'm a narcissist and I'm proud of it!"
Are there any indies which legit feel like they could've released on a 90s console?
>>740220985False premise, the difference between OP and pic related are smaller pixels from a higher resolution, nothing more
>>740220985The image answers its own question.>imitatingThe old games used it because of limitation. These graphics were to best they could do to balance visual identity with cartridge/CD limitations.Nowadays these graphics are by choice. The creator is trying to imitate something else. They are holding back their capabilities instead of pushing them.It comes off as a cheap and lazy copy in an attempt to recapture a moment in time of rapidly evolving technology. A mimicry that tries to pass itself off as a childhood the creator thinks he had.
>>740223008>narcissist:^)
might as well use this as a dumping ground for twitter reposts
>>740220985>>740221526Both of these examples have the same issue. They're too clean and lacking in grunge, making them look like toy landscapes. The pixel art is technically good but not period-accurate.
>>740220985You can only drink coke so many times before you say 'hey this is shit'Without fun fame mechanics and in game depth it means nothing, and when you do pixel art you need those things.Back then crt made pixelart games look like the best thing ever. Crt was a technology way beyond the lcd goyslop we used after them for 20+ years
>>740223008>me me me fag is trying a new angle
>>740221890Not reallyDid you actually read the post?Also simply due to their age these visionaries have, in fact been outside cities and seen the real world.
pixel games dont need to be played on gameboy anymore retard. thats why they look different
>>740223008You're a disingenuous tranny. Fuck off.
>>740223085Nigger look at the gradient and shit.GBA game uses like 3-5 color shades for one object, while OP has more color shaded on any given object than my eyeball.
>>740220985back in the day devs were trying to adapt shit to make it look as good as possible in spite of the limitationsnowadays the limitations are gone, and it looks like the pixel look itself is the objective. so they suffer from clarity and visibility issues, overcrowding, lack of emphasis, mixels, etc.
Pixel art only really works on a CRT. I am not a CRT elitist, I don't even own a CRT, I'm just stating the truth.Game artists used to do all of their work on CRTs, and thus they were able to see how their art looked on the monitor as the game was being developed. If something looked weird, they would fix it before moving on.Now, indie game devs will draw the whole thing on an LCD/OLED display, and maybe they'll use a CRT filter after all of their artwork has been complete. If something looks off on the CRT filter, they'll just ignore it and move on because they're high on the smell of their own farts.
>>740223132im inclined to agree. i think modern pixel artists all seem to learn from the same tutorials and books which causes them to render everything in this smooth, shiny manner where everything is shaped perfectly and reflects so much light in a way that looks artificial and garish. if old pixel art was a diorama, modern pixel art is like a playmobil toy set.
>>740222390he is right. In a real pixel game in the old days they simply wouldn't paint that much detail. Entire strips of land would just be fairly empty except for changes in the ground texture switches
>>740223751Never had a Gameboy huh
>>740222390>>740223824I think another aspect is how older consoles has limited color pallets you had to work around.
>>740221826You can't be this stupid
>>740220985it's not impossible to explainit's a modern game, so you know the pixel art is an attempt to charm people and bank on nostalgiaInstead of old games, that used pixel art because of technological limitations.It's as simple as that. A game having pixel art these days is almost always just trying to curry favor. It's an immediate red flag from any developer.
>>740220985old games were more fun
>>740220985It insists upon itself.
it's really interesting seeing people stretch for ways to hate modern indie games simply because new bad
>>740220985Nothing to do with the graphics but one thing I miss when playing something like in the OP is the feeling of not really knowing what I'll see next. Like talking to a NPC and they say something odd or off color. You play these "retro" indie games and there is no mystery and every npc says exactly what you expect.
>>740220985Okay but is this game trying to imitate old games or is just using a modern pixel art style?
>>740222878Ohh... Sorry about that, babe!
>>740221890They got some novelty for free by growing up in a foreign culture. Proof that "cultural appropriation" is a good thing.
>>740222553try making better art
>>740222887>chromatic aberrationThat's an artifact of putting multiple colors through the same lens. CRT projectors used a separate tube and lens for each color, so it's irrelevant to games. Perhaps you are confusing it with color convergence errors, which were visible on bad CRTs. They do not look identical.
>>740220985The more detail and definition, the higher the chance for an uncanny valley fake effect to occur.I think this is reason why old games often feel more real than modern games.
>>740220985too many colors, not enough repeated textures.you can tell someone dropped hours customizing those rails to not look copy pasted, instead of just copy pasting them and spent more time refining the WHOLE look instead of just the individual bits.
>>740222390SD3 is way less overdetailed than OP's image though.What hue shift are you referring to?
>>740222470Thumbnail looks nothing like how it is actually playing on a monitor
>>740223008Why'd you abandon your ME shtick, MEposter?
>>740222116Your theory explains why I liked Arc the Lad 2 so much. I could never articulate it like you, but I've never enjoyed modern pixel art more than this game in particular
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s43WBG8mQCg
>>740220985I think it would look pretty good without the road to the right. It's a visual eyesore, too detailed, and a weird-ass shape.But the little trees and grass look pretty wrong too. They have too much detail and gradients which makes it look weird and fuzzy compared to everything else.
>>740220985Tries too hard to be art instead of a video game.
>>740221242Yeppp
>>740225692Even ps1 did it well to me
>>740220985the water is too uniform
>>740221216This is the answer. Very few indie devs get this. Most is retro slop.
Am I allowed to say that Sonic Mania has good pixel art or is /v/ still in its contrarian phase about that game
>>740224882I never abandoned it. I cannot. I am nothing more than a product of /v/'s collective egos. I embody /v/'s malignant narcissism.
>>740220985Pixel art tended to be made with a limitation to both color palette and also made in a grid so they could tile map everything.Also the characters are just ugly and even though the colors are nice and the style looks fine whats drawn just kinda looks like shit.
>>740220985the explanation is right there in front of you. it's an imitation.
>>740225770Wil Knights, my man
>>740226317You are your own malignant narcissism, but at least it's funny
xitter is just 4chan 2.0 anyway
>>740220985>"limitations breed creativity"No, you stupid art and tech illiterate shitskin children. It's because old pixel art games were made by creative Japanese artists and nerds and new pixel art games are made by mutt faggots who can make detailed sprites and nothing else. There's more to creating a good world than just making some detailed sprites.
>>740226809>japan good>america badtypical "trying to fit in" slop comment. don't you have anything original and actually interesting thing to comment about?
>>740221178Why do people always phrase it like this? The art wasn't made "with CRTs in mind". It was made on a CRT because that's what they had.
>>740221154Yeah, it's this. Back then, it was expected that you'd need to use your imagination a bit, but the newfags that make games in this style don't Get It, so it comes across feeling like you're looking at plastic or something.
>>740226975>The art wasn't made "with CRTs in mind".It was, yes, designed around the limitations and quirks of CRT displays, that's just a fact. This is just more of the continual braindead zoomer revisionism that plagues this board.
>>740220985they lack something majority of people don't have, a soul
>>740227162Exactly. Look at this Kirby's Dream Land screenshot. Despite only supporting 4 colors, the CRT on a real Gameboy blended the dithering pattern so you saw a smooth gradient.
>>740227421>the CRT on a real Gameboy
>>740227421I am guessing you are being tongue in cheek because the Gameboy was an LCD screen, not a CRT.>>740227162No, they weren't. The developer monitors these games were made on had much higher resolutions and much smaller scan lines than commercial/consumer televisions. Additionally, consumer televisions were not consistent in the size/spacing of the horizontal scan lines, even from model to model from the same manufacturer. You don't know what you are talking about, which is why I doubt you ever have even seen anything on an actual CRT.
>>740222624>UFO 50UFO 50 looks like absolute shit.
>>740227658>No, they weren't.
>>740227421>CRT on a real Gameboyah yes, the classic 240 volt gameboy with a 3 minute battery.
>>740221526this is a good example; you can tell they wanted a consistent background and ‘looking fantasy’, but the end result makes the scene look smaller, like it’s a shoebox diorama.
>>740227747Zoomers are something else
>>740227541It obviously had a CRT because dither patterns were always blurred. Imagine displaying this gradient on a a "DOT MATRIX" display. Absolutely unthinkable.
>>740221526>Sea of ShartsLOL
>>740227658>The developer monitors these games were made on had much higher resolutions and much smaller scan lines than commercial/consumer televisions.What do you think the size of crt tvs were in the 90s and 2000s?
>>740220985Looks fine to me. It’s just your own bias and mindset. I do think the crisp voice acting sounded off in Freedom Planet though. Should have bitcrushed it to sound like a Genesis game.
>>740227850No gameboy ever had a crt screen, it was always lcd.
>>740227850See how the developers cleverly simulated an extra shade of gray. That's because they knew that pixel art was always displayed on a CRT.
>>740227974The guy you're replying to is trying to facetiously dunk on people, but he's too retarded to do so.
>>740227974ONE gameboy had a CRT https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=irHI_2WdQXc
>>740228004Sharp pixels are inauthentic zoomer trash. Nobody ever saw them on the original hardware.
>>740221223>>740221826>>740222470look at these destitute niggers. shouldn't you be working?
>>740227974Explain this gradient then.
>>740220985the people making pixel art back then were creating something that was at the pinnacle of the limitations of technology at the time, modern pixel art is intentionally making something look that way, not really fair to call it intentionally handicapping yourself, but you are aiming for a specific look rather than working with what you've got and there is a difference in that
>>740221178>pixel art used to be made with crt screens in mindloving this meme since day one kek
>>740221049Basically this, but also an uncanny valley effect on multiple levels.More detail you have, more and better animations and interactions you need to make that whole feel cohesiveFor ex you can accept on some level a walk cycle of a nes Simon Belmont being 3sprites; but if you pick super castlevania Simon or alucard a walk cycle of three sprites will seem shittyThe same is true for 3d of course. Let's say we have a mod that makes us play psx re2 with all the gfx from remake 2, it would be shit
>>740228187>Explain this gradient then.You are some unsufferable nigger.
It boils down to the difference between something organic and something artificial trying to emulate something organic
>>740228238By exploiting the CRT blur, the Gameboy artist cleverly simulated an extra shade of gray.
>>740228295>Gameboy>CRTyou're not baiting me further nigga
>>740220985Lack of hardware limitations make it feel inauthentic
Despite looking blocky on your LCD, the pillars in this screenshot actually looked smooth and round on the original CRT!Anyway, I think I've made by point. The Gameboy didn't really have a CRT. >>740221178 Is obviously wrong because the exact same techniques were used on LCD portable systems.
>>740220985the monitor is the cause, get a CRT and use that instead
>>740220985You weren't 8 when the indie game came out
>>740224691>SD3 is way less overdetailed than OP's image though.It's the same level of detail>What hue shift are you referring to?The tree shadows are purple
>>740228427Am I going schizo here? Gameboy had a dot matrix screen. It literally said "dot matrix with stereo sound." Maybe it's a kind of LCD, but I think that term is way more associated with modern monitors.
>>740228927Yes, I already alluded to that in >>740227850I just showed that the same techniques were used even when you had sharp pixels, so anybody claiming that CRT blur is necessary is wrong.
>>740226909>slop You're a retarded child with nothing of worth to say and you should cancel your internet subscription. Japan makes plenty of trash and America has made and continues to make great games, but comparing old top tier Japanese talent with the average indie dev that does pixel art now is a comparison that heavily favors the old Japanese devs.
>>740221216Pearls before swine, friendo.
>>740228427>>740229008You seem to be confused by the fact crt came before lcd displays. Those techniques were also used on lcd because they were developed and became a standard for crt displays long before lcd were a thing.The dithering and other techniques still looked good on small lcd displays like the gameboy so there was no point in inventing new techniques or changing methods.
>>740220985Because it was made for modern LCD screens on modern LCD screens. Those tricks people like to jerk off weren't even intentional most of the time, just the side effect o artists drawing them on CRTs. If you put a modern pixelart game it's going to look like ass too. Unless the game was made by some madman on a CRT/With a filter and uses the filter in it's graphics pipeline.This dude made an excellent video on the subject.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bC-8y2R6IxI
>>740220985modern artists are scared of high contrast shadows and darkness
>>740220985That really strong outline on the boy's arm looks weird.
>>740220985reality is they all look like trash because the games the're emulating were made to be displayed on CRTs
These repeat threads are just disingenuous and pretentious circle jerks
Th3 solution is for indiefags to abandon modern hardware and make JRPGS for SNES like they should have been since custom development tools for it became more available.A lot of the magic of JRPGS of old came down to pixel limitations. If you're gonna do it you gotta do it right!!!
>>740226317Oh my god you're sooo smart!
>>740220985More often than not modern pixel art games don't "snap" the pixels to pixels on the screen (think walking animation smoothly going across the screen, hitting 10% of the with of a pixel), that could be why i feels artificial. because it is.
>>740221049/spbpThis is it. When I look at games with Pixel art, original back in Snes days, PS1 days, the backgrounds weren't overdetailed because they still had to abide to memory limitations something modern games in this style don't have to consider. That's why it feels so artificial.
>>740229609Most threads and comments nowadays are just AI bots having conversation with each other.It's all fake.This site is dead.
>>740220985I think it's 2 things probably.First of all, you probably looked at the old pixel art on a CRT TV and it makes a big difference over seeing it on a super high res modern display.Secondly the old art was a result of limitations, not a stylistic choice. The modern devs use it as a style and as such they may not emulate all the limitations. Color limits per sprite, color limits on the entire screen, sprite sizes supported, how smoothly things can move or animate, how many sprites can be on-screen at once and all that shit had to be taken into account on old hardware because that's all the hardware could do. A modern dev using a pixel art style may not also emulate all those old limits.
>>740220985Old games pushed limited technology available at the time to their limits to try to feel advanced.Current games use new advanced technology to try to replicate an “old” feel. It’s not the same and you’re smart enough to tell the difference.It’s like if a film studio used modern CGI and technology to make a black and white noir film. It wouldn’t feel the same as an actual noir film from the 1940’s
There's also the matter of things just becoming really standardized, in almost the same way that every game has that shitty UI because that's what they teach people in those "learn to make games" scam courses, because games aren't art
>>740220985>Why is this still impossible to explainIt's hard to explain to people that back in the day kids in 95 were playing on hand me down tellies from 85 that were composite only and a bit run down from years of heavy use, so that when a dialogue box appeared in their JRPG appeared on the screen it slightly bent and warped the entire screen around it, and when they walked around their JRPG town all the houses stretched and distorted as they came into view and moved towards the center of the screen. All those JRPGs that used quick bright flashes for spells literally made the image shrink and expand like it was breathing. All anyone wants to talk about is dithering blending not all the other quirks those old games made use of to give the screen more life. Unironically I think if you made someone sit down with the average consumer CRT people had back then and saw how much the geometry affected the screen and how basically nothing was as straight as it appears on a modern display they'd probably throw up.
>>740229918Yeah, Mina does this. What's the point in making the game look like you're using GBC quality sprites if you're not even going to follow all the rules for rendering GBC graphics?
>>740222390>posts a game that shits itself when more than 5 characters are on screen at a time
>>740230564It's part of the charm. And angela's ass is worth any amount of jank.
>>740220985Older games had heavier limitations, pixel art was them working around a constraint. Things looked like they were designed and written first in a human mind. New games do not have the same limitations. Pixel art is a stylistic choice, mostly trying to piggyback on the reputation of nostalgia that older video games carry, and computer tools are slowly taking over the creative process. Things are starting to look like they were designed in a computer.
>>740230078AI is pretty easy to spot, sadly these are mostly real people
>>740220985its easy: its just pretentious autism. thats it. no other explanation necessary. theres nothing fake about looking good. "artificial" isnt a thing. its made up pretentiousness.the worst thing these games do is have inconsistencies in the level of detail and style, like having character sprites that are way less detailed/smooth than the environment, so they clash. (and also the AWFUL looking blur/fade filter for 2.5d slop).
>>740229143I was merely pointing out the absurd consequence ("Gameboy had a CRT") you are forced to accept if you believe the CRT advocates.>>740229258See all the Gameboy screenshots ITT.
>>740230912He's not being pretentious he's just saying it's a feeling he has and he can't articulate why he has that feeling
>>740220985This is an AI generated image lol
>>740220985Art direction + limitation, usually in color, game size, ram size and rendering power.They used tiles to be able to fit everything in the ram and abuse the fuck out of the rendering pipeline for backgrounds and foreground/menusThat bridge alone is so unique and detailed it would take half of a cartridge and fill the ram 1000% over limit
>>740220985Lack of contrast, characters feel visually pasted into the world too.
>>740230976Nobody but you said the gameboy had a ctr display though.Denying that techniques were developed specifically to increase visuals on the medium they were mean to display on is simply absurd, whether it's crt or anything else.
>>740231323>medium
i wonder how the original OP feels knowing that a retarded post he made now echoes infinitely in time from bots reposting shit from the archives and niggers reposting shit from twitteri bet dead peoples posts get recycled
>>740231589I invite you to fucking kill yourself asap.
>>740220985>>740221049>>740222390people whine about things being too "flat" and clean. compare the water. massive expanse of a single "flat" color. a huge segment of smooth dirt with just a few little rocks/holes. the brick walls have extensive smoothness. now look at the other, every single thing is dithered to fuck and back (except the rabite) with only 2-5 shades. the new stuff is mostly chunks of 2 colors touching, and then the detailed grass is like 8 shades. while the new one is certainly a cleaner picture, i would not argue that the old one is "more detailed". what people are getting hung up on (unconsciously or not) is how fucking busy all of the dithering colors are in the old stuff. theres a different shade every 1-4 pixels in every direction in the old stuff. the dirt isnt detailed as much as it is just gritty. the grass isnt detailed as much as it is just messy. the new one has grass that actually looks like grass. they're both pixel art, but the newer one has a simply, brighter, more color forward style that emphasizes shape clarity rather than trying to approximate exact colors/shades per pixel location. also crt faggots deserve the rope, they have no argument, and no actual understanding of art and aesthetics.
>>740220985Old GoodNew Badeveryone else effortposting paragraphs is just copeit has always just been this
>>740222624>one of the best modern games was UFAnd just like that, your opinion and your entire existence is worth absolutely nothing.
>>740221178>pixel art used to be made with crt screens in mind.no, pixel art was made smooth, and then scanning devices formatted them into pixels and put them behind a crt screen. play at the proper size/resolution, and raw looks better and cleaner, every time. every single one of you faggots always posts the most disingenuous "example" of bullshit zoomed way too far in where both look like shit.
>>740231323It's mind-boggling how many anons fail to understand a simple rhetorical device. Obviously the Gameboy doesn't have a CRT.
>>740231887>scanning devices formatted them into pixelsPC-98 style, some arcade games, yes. Not typical home consoles. You need to design around pixels from the start to get good results at those resolutions.
>>740231913A fallacy is not a rhetorical device.
>>740232052Reductio ad absurdum. "Gameboy had a CRT" is obviously absurd.
>>740231913>I made a stupid fallacious argument, why aren't you listening to me?duhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
>>740221683that anon puts it so eloquently, and beautifully
>>740232115>Reductio ad absurdum.I don't think you understand how it's meant to be used.
>>740220985It's not impossible its quite simple, the pixel art is to detailed for the style they are trying to emulate, to many colours, to many unique tiles/spites etc
>>740232128The Gameboy literally has "DOT MATRIX" printed above the screen, as I referenced here >>740227850. But it appears there are people who think it's plausible that the Gameboy had a CRT or they wouldn't feel the need to correct it.
>>740232325You are a retard and no one cares about this autistic battle you're trying to fight
>>740222116>it doesnt look gameyyeah, the background style clashes with the unit style. this is a good thing if you just want entities to pop like scooby doo objects. compared to sea of stars, which is just consistent. >>740227784calling it a shoebox diorama is fair because the background looks actually close. the difference is that the mountains in chrono trigger are REALLY far, and they basically simply drew them as shadows. sea of stars is capturing the immediate actual distance (more realistic and consistent) while chrono trigger went for a more minimalist, impressionistic representation of mountains in way the fuck out there. >>740221462>>740221526if you stand at the top of the grand canyon, things will look like in sea of stars, which matches the angle and actual distance approximating. if you stand at the top of mt fuji, where theres fuck all in any direction, things look like chrono trigger here. the ONLY problem with sea of stars background, is that sudden horizon line and drop off.
>>740221526Sea of Stars looks and plays like complete dogshit and it's deeply embarrassing for everyone involved that it was lauded like it was
>>740221178>>740229258literally just kill yourselves already.
>>740232983see>>740222668
>>740221462>>740221526>>740232675the scope what you're trying to portray matters. they arent equivalent background SUBJECTS.
>>740233259you posted a zoomed in picture, misrepresenting the size of the pixels as well as the size of the crt screen squares. you dont have an argument. you're a disingenuous faggot, and it is no different than playing inches from the screen.
>>740233325You can't conclusively claim that without proof
I love how everyone on this shitty site is a faggoty reddit debater now, definitely not the most insufferable archetype you could possibly embody
you don't have a CRT and you're sour grapes about it
Old games had industry leading artists.
>>740233325>>740233759FUCK, i forgot the pic
>>740229258looks fine to me.
>>740233259
>get the pixel art you want>still don't like it because "i can't explain it"it's post like these that makes me sympathize with AAA devs appealing to the retarded masses, some people are just impossible to please
>>740234793Multiple people explained it perfectly
>>740221178>actually decent crt example image>entire reply base telling them to fuck offDisgusting subhuman trash.
>>740234868i know they have but it still looks decent, what does OP think devs are going to do? go back to sticks and rocks just to capture that exact "feeling"?of course you won't replicate it because we don't have those limitations anymore and most players don't fucking care about CRT monitors or whatever
>>740234974>zooming in is decent
>>740234590Crt tvs in the 90s were around 25 to 30 inches. Those portraits took around a third of the display in height so they would look 4 or 5 inches tall on a 30" crt tv. You niggers still don't understand internal vs display resolution or imagine all crt tvs were like 12".
>>740235120I see you didn't even read the relevant posts
>>740222624UFO 50 is probably the most egregious example of modern aesthetic sensibilities sticking out like a sore thumb when confronted with limitations of low fidelity pixelart. It just looks extremely inauthentic.
>>740227850What's your point? In handhelds the "smoothing" was accomplished by the small size of the display, as evidenced by your intentionally tiny screenshot. Console and many PC devs were absolutely designing graphics with CRTs in mind.
>>740228076>>740228187>dishonestly posting tiny screenshots because the effect is completely lost on a larger displaylmaoyou're destroying your own gotcha in real time
>>740228238>developers totally weren't developing for the TVs that the games would be played on, absolutely not>even when they used techniques that only work on a CRT display
>>740234974It's zoomies refusing to believe they missed out, or else it's 'end of history' progressives who can't accept that older tech made some things look better.>my overrpriced kikephone has 48 megapixels, there's no way an old TV could look better hurr
old games were trying to go beyond their limitations, it makes you imagine more than what is there.
>>740234590Your entire argument hinges on TVs being the size of a gameboy screen or something.Left is how the game actually looks on TVs.
>>740220985Because good pixel art isn't "miraculous", you've just been looking for excuses to shit on games that haven't already proven themselves.
>>740235776>>740235939Gameboy was mostly played by kids who had better eyes than you and held it close to their face.
>740235173You don't need to zoom in you disingenuous fucking nigger.
>>740234590I don't understand this shit.Do you play these games on tiny windows? Do you play on a 24'' monitor 2 meters away?This is the fundamental problem with a good number of new indie games (some of them really good games by the way). There's a reason a lot of people prefer handhelds for these.
>>740236059>It's zoomies refusing to believe they missed outBut they can still get the effect with filters, so they didn't miss out on anything.They just can't admit the way they experienced it on an emulator is wrong, and that pixel art isn't supposed to look like that.This is why most pixel art sucks now. The people making it have a fundamental misunderstanding of the medium and they refuse to be corrected. It's like a game of telephone or some shit
>>740236059CRT actually does look better, but not because it blurs the image (good CRTs have minimal blur). CRT looks better because it strobes the image extremely quickly, which eliminates sample-and-hold blur. Fast scrolling 2D platform games especially look sharper on CRTs.
>>740221178How the fuck can anyone think right is how it's supposed to look?
>>740220985Indie games feel fake because many of them are derivative whereas "real" videogames are often based on real life experiences.Example:>Legend of Zelda: Inspired by Miyamoto's childhood memories of playing in the woods.>Tunic: Inspired by the dev's childhood memories of ... playing ZeldaNo matter how good the pixel art may look in some of these games, the lack of soul or creative spark is still readily apparent.
>>740236453>But they can still get the effect with filters, so they didn't miss out on anything.You need 1000Hz OLED to simulate CRT motion quality, so no, you can't (yet).https://blurbusters.com/crt-simulation-in-a-gpu-shader-looks-better-than-bfi/
>>740236486>CRT actually does look better, but not because it blurs the image (good CRTs have minimal blur). CRT looks better because it strobes the image extremely quickly, which eliminates sample-and-hold blur. It's both. It looks better for both reasons.
>>740220985That screen has at least three different artstyles going on. Old JRPG, Rayman, RPG Maker.The chibi on the left, the bridge, and the guy on the right do not belong in the same game.
>>740236606So why did arcade machines always use big and sharp CRTs with RGB connections? Arcade machines always had distinct pixels.
>>740236559Motion is another issue. As far as the actual pixel art goes, they can get the right effect with filters.
CRT more like HRT lmfaooo
>>740235217you're seriously going to tell me that zooming in so that a single pixel or scanline box is 5x the size, is the same as displaying it at the proper resolution and sitting at an appropriate distance? you really think things dont shrink at a distance? it matches what a person actually sees with their eyes? >um, look at the color bleeding and pixel stretching!>look at how the sausage is MADEnobody gives a flying fuck how the sausage is made. the clear argument for how RETARDED you are is "just look at it". your response is "no, look at it CLOSELY" when nobody is going to be inches form their screen to look at it closely. they will be at an appropriate viewing distance so the sprite is the appropriate size. oh, your typical computer screen is closer than your typical crt gaming experience was? then fucking zoom out to match the projection of the image. holy shit, its perfect and your crt SLOP nonsense is meaningless.
>>740236697>Arcade machines always had distinct pixels.And the games were designed for those displays.Console games were designed for home displays. In these discussions it's generally understood we're talking about games for home systems.
>>740236541Yeah this is horseshit. Miyamoto wanted a fantasy adventure game and made up a story about his childhood to claim it came from somewhere "real". The idea that "real" experiences make better games relies on the idea that nobody can parse how a game made them feel like they can any other experience, which is obviously wrong.
>>740236486I used to play a lot of slow scrolling paced RPGs with drawn 2D or prerendered 2D backgrounds. The less defined edges on things absolutely contribute to the image, more small detail is implied and left to the imagination.
>>740236230maybe if your tv was the size of a garage door.
>>740220985there's fast travel and datamining instead of a world map and a strategy guide
The pixel troons try to imitate limitations instead of actually hard limiting themselves when working in their pixel troon games.I think the only faux retro game that I enjoyed was Labyrinth of the Demon King.
>>740236730>nobody gives a flying fuck how the sausage is madeThat is what is being discussed.If you have to zoom out until your window is the size of a gameboy screen you're playing it on a display it's not designed for. Developers relied on smoothing effects from CRTs, not screen size, except in the case of tiny screen handhelds which had a uniformly small display.
>>740237019All limits on art are now arbitrary and imitated rather than enforced.
You cant mentally make yourself 8 again so it's never gonna hit as hard. Same reason why a swing set isnt something adults typically do
>>740236796A shitload of arcade games run at console display resolution. The exact same art techniques were used.
>>740223085I know this is a GBA game with how fucking bright it is.
>>740237165Reductive midwit retard I hope you literally kill yourself, and if you have a kid, I hope they die too
>>740236834>The idea that "real" experiences make better games relies on the idea that nobody can parse how a game made them feel like they can any other experience, which is obviously wrong.How game made you feel isn't equal to experiencing reality. It's like inbreeding or playing telephone. Derivations of derivations of derivations slowly lose the spark of creation.
>>740236989No, left is about normal, right is only how your TV looked if it was super tiny and you sat across the room from it.
>>740237306You are talking to a soulless artless hylic human husk, there is no point in what you're trying to do
>>740237173>A shitload of arcade games run at console display resolution.Irrelevant. It's the techniques that matter, not the display resolution.>The exact same art techniques were used.Show me arcade games that look like >>740221178 on the right.
>>740237047first of all, gameboy is not crt. second, no, you adjust the zoom so that the pixel size matches the proper display size and resolution. things look different at different rendering distances. your viewing distance matters. nobody is playing 6 inches from the screen. zooming in to make a small portrait take up my entire display just to show "how pixels and crt screens work" is fucking meaningless when the the actual SIZE on screen IN GAME, and especially AT VIEWING DISTANCE is wildly different. you have no argument, just disingenuous zoom.pic related, viewing distance matters.
>>740220985tbf this does look like DS pixel art. Final Fantasy Tactics A2 is this detailed.
>>740237361I wouldn't go that far, but it's sad people like are incapable of getting it.
>>740237306>How game made you feel isn't equal to experiencing reality.The "creative spark" is born solely from having feelings you understand well enough to express through a creative endeavor. Those feelings can and do come from other media and not just "real" things. Derivations of derivations of derivations is an inevitability of every form of creative expression, you aren't going to get anyone making games that doesn't have preformed ideas on what a video game is just like you weren't going to find a renaissance painter who didn't already know a thing or two about other painters.
>>740236989Have you ever actually played on a consumer grade CRT? Answer honestly.
Because the color palette has too many colors. Also you can almost smell the Twitter troons breath who drew the image by just looking at it. /thread
I was there to play SOTN when they re-released it on 360 and it looked like SHIT on an HDTV
>>740234590CRTroons have been really quiet since this dropped.
>>740234974phoneposters can't see the difference.
>>740237678Clearly you were just sitting too close. Should've pushed your couch back 30 feet so the screen was as relatively big as a handheld.
>>740237397>gameboy is not crtNo shit.>viewing distance mattersViewing distance makes a difference, but so does squinting. It is not what developers intended or relied on, except when they made games specifically for devices with tiny screens. People were not playing on TVs the size of game boys, or viewing their TVs from a comparable distance.But they were playing on CRTs.Developers relied on CRT displays to bring out the effect they were aiming for together.
>>740237686>three responses and ongoing discussion>"really quiet"Do you actually think before you speak, or do you just react to stimuli with preprogrammed responses like a fucking ape?
>>740221049if anything that picture is not detailed enough.
>>740237828>Viewing distance makes a difference, but so does squintingTry it, it works >>740221178It's a great test to see if a game would have looked better on a CRT
>>740237592yes, it had wood paneling on the sides, a knob that was both power and volume, and only worked on channel 3 for games. why zoom in on an image to dishonestly illustrate "how it looks" when its not accurate to the portion of the screen it takes up? you have no argument.
>>740238146>it had wood paneling on the sides, a knob that was both power and volume, and only worked on channel 3 for gamesYou could not be more obviously making this shit up whole cloth, my god. How embarrassing.
>>740237828>but so does squintingim not going to play a game, squinting the whole time. >People were not playing on TVs the size of game boys, or viewing their TVs from a comparable distance.so why are you disingenuous about how far away most people sit from their screen? the images posted always take up more of my current screen than if i were to play the game itself.
>>740238146>why zoom in on an image to dishonestly illustrate "how it looks" when its not accurate to the portion of the screen it takes up?Because that's a good way to demonstrate the effect and why it looks bad. It looks bad when you take the entire image into account, too.I've played games on CRTs, LCDs TVs and LCD computer monitors, at all sorts of distances. CRT looks better for games made for CRTs at all distances. Those same games look like trash on LCDs and other such high accuracy displays because they were not made with those displays in mind.
>>740238469I don't think I'd ever play a game on a window that only takes up like a tenth of even a 1080p monitor.
>>740238146>why zoom in on an image to dishonestly illustrate "how it looks"anon the CRT i played the snes version of final fantasy 6 (3) was 40 inches. the game's resolution was 256 × 224. I'm currently sitting three feet from a 40in 4k monitor. the quick reply window is smaller than that. it was always "zoomed in."
>>740221154you're gay
>>740238536I actually get pissed when some pixelshit bullshit thinks it needs to take up my entire 40 inch monitor.
>>740238658I would actually get pissed if I opened a pixel game and the default setting was 1:1 pixel zoom.
>>740238469>the images posted always take up more of my current screen than if i were to play the game itself.You sure about that? The average pc monitor is probably smaller than the crt tv from the 90s and 2000s.
>>740238267i have no idea what brand it was, let alone what model. it was from, the 80s and looked a lot like this. next to the red digital display, there was a single small silver knob (like a thimble) that you turned to turn it on and control volume. turn the volume down all the way until it clicks to turn it off. i think it had channel up and down buttons, but i dont think it had a numpad. the sides had wood paneling, like a station wagon. the right panel got a crack from something, and the tv temperature would cause the crack to shift and massively fuck up the display (like skinemax channels you dont own). everyone would just bang it until it fixed, but i found out that you could just gently press it to realign and "seal" the crack to return the display to normal.
>>740220985I feel like this towards all fuckass low-poly PS1 looking nostalgia bait indie games on steam these days.
>>740238756>i would be mad if the default setting was native
>>740238469>im not going to play a game, squinting the whole time.But you'll play it at the size of a gameboy screen lmao>so why are you disingenuous about how far away most people sit from their screen?People sit at all sorts of distances. Nobody got far enough away that the screen was the size of a fucking gameboy screen. The controller cables wouldn't let you get that far anyway.>picrelEven that small screenshot still looks worse than on a CRT. Richter looks way too sharp and jagged, and Drac's eye glow is missing.I just grabbed this from youtube in 5 seconds. It doesn't even look that good and it's still better
>>740239079Yes, I am not going to play a game in less screen space than is taken up by the quick reply window. I don't care if I see "blown up pixels" by making the game bigger, I'm a big boy, I can handle it.
>>740220985Perhaps one problem is the pixel size; previously, pixels were all the same size due to graphical limitations, but today they change the pixel size depending on the desired effect, which ends up lacking any standard, and the eye perceives something strange.I enlarged the girl's hair, look how within each pixel there are pixels of a different size.
>>740229918Every fucking time.Like do they think the graphics were blocky for the fun of it? That was the resolution limit.Rixels get a special layer of hell all to themselves, because I know your ass isn’t imitating an fx chip.
This thread feels like nostalgiafagging, honestly.
>>740239223Kinda pointless to analyze a jpg that 100% artifacted this picture to hell and back.
>>740239191its much less of hassle to just stretch a window than it is to disable fullscreen, set a realistic resolution, and sometimes even restart for changes to take effect.
>>740222116Fuck, I forget how good Suikoden 2 looked and it was still achieved with tilesets without fancy prerendered backgrounds or anything.
>>740239223You took a JPG of pixel art and blew it up with an algorithm that doesn't try to preserve individual pixels. Of course it doesn't look right anymore.
>>740237165I never played Metal Slug in my life despite being 30yo and the art in that game is incredible.Things were, in fact, just better back then.
>>740229918yeah that's the bit.
>>740220985>>740221526Lots of wrong answers in the thread. There are two main problems here:1: Unlimited colour palette - SNES games could only display 16 colours on each sprite and also had a limit to how many different colour palettes could be in use at once, and determining which colours to use made for a tricky puzzle that tended to result in interesting colour choices and high contrast.2: Lack of pixel character design sensibilities. The characters in the Western-made examples look off because of plain incompetence at portraying expressive characters and especially faces with few pixels. Look at Sea of Stars. The blue girl has a squished head compared to the others. The blond guy's face looks like a burn victim's, with hollow, glazed eyes. It's simply poor artistic ability. Old JRPG character artists had mastered a craft that is often unintuitive in terms of where to place pixels in order to fool the human mind into seeing the face you want them to see. A lot of experience and testing was needed to accomplish this, and most of today's pixel artists just don't have that knowledge.
>>740225692>>740225770pre-rendered backgrounds really cracked open the door to perspective trickery
>>740239397What pixel art game have you played where it started in actual fullscreen and you needed to restart the whole game to turn that off? Borderless windowed has been common for years and most games with simple graphics don't have to restart the whole game to change resolution even aside from that.
>>740239530That's not pre-rendered, that's just painted.
>>740237959>non-integer nearest neighbor
>>740239604Pre-rendered just means it's not a sprite. Whether you rendered 3D assets or just scanned a drawn image, end result is the same.
>>740238536>>740238562>>740238476>>740238830i pulled up a youtube video (nvm the video resolution and clarity, this is about size). made it fullscreen. took a screenshot (you an even see my shitty "activate windows"). heres how big that image is in comparison, overlayed. you arent being genuine in your comparisons. blowing up the image is the same and changing the viewing distance. even the size of the crt screen boxes is way bigger than an actual crt screen display box. its a disingenuous comparison, and you have no defense against that. when you shrink things down to their proper size, >>740234590 >>740236730, crt does nothing or just makes it blurry. this is exactly why normal people make fun you pretentious, disingenuous autists with images like >>740232983im at LEAST 6 feet away from my 50 inch display. holding up my hand at arm's length ("talk to the hand" pose) my screen is almost exactly from the tip of my middle finger to the bottom of my palm. crts were generally way smaller than that, and nobody except retards like you seen here>>740232983 were sitting closer than 6 ft from it. even at 4ft, its still smaller. blowing it up is disingenuous and inaccurate to actual viewing distance. how the dots work together (>>740237397) and how the aperture grille works is irrelevant to the actual resulting image as viewed by real people.
>>740221094Only actual answer in this thread.
>>740239153the only "size of a gameboy screen" is the thumbnails of the thread. you're just rambling about made up garbage.
>>740239801>im at LEAST 6 feet away from my 50 inch display. holding up my hand at arm's length ("talk to the hand" pose) my screen is almost exactly from the tip of my middle finger to the bottom of my palm.You're sitting further from what I presume to be your PC screen than I sit from some flatscreen televisions.
>>740221094is that really the case, though?
>>740239801>made it fullscreen>1920x1080
>>740227850dude you got ass blasted by some guys using filters and are now posting a bunch of random shit while being salty
>>740239981Yes. People feel differently about pixel art that they think is new because they're looking for something to shit on "safely" without needing to know much about it.
>>740220985colour palette all over the place, parts dont even look like pixel art just pixellated drawing, kids on the left has limb looking like its in front of him and too harsh delineation ebwteen face and arm, looks like neither ps1, neither snes pixel art. incoherent. if its lacking patterns then its just random noise theres a sweet spot
>>740240151Straight up just projecting your own 80IQ onto everyone around you
>>740231913you're being retarded on purpose, of course people are going to be confusedironic shitposting is still shitposting
>>740239801>made it fullscreenFor you at least. I'm on a 4k monitor.The size of the monitor also matters a lot more than resolution since tvs automatically strech anything to full screen and I'm pretty sure a fullscreen image on a 17" screen will look quite different from the same fullscreen image on a 32"
the original saga frontier had this gritty and dreamlike quality due to the crt. the remaster is completely "clean." the "cleanness" is why modern pixelshit looks like shit. the pixels were never clean until LCDs started being a thing. the ghosting of the original gameboy led the eye to believe the animations were more detailed than they actually were.
>>740239801>proper sizeYou're shrinking it down to miniscule sizes it was never intended to be played at. It was intended to be played at TV size at a reasonable distance. Again, consider that the length of a controller cable would force you to sit relatively close to the TV.>were sitting closer than 6 ft from it. even at 4ft, its still smallerIt's smaller but it's not small enough to have the transformative effect that a CRT does. CRT looks better.You're getting hung up in the sizes of the images but>>740238469 and >>740239153are roughly the same. CRT looks better.>how the dots work together and how the aperture grille works is irrelevant to the actual resulting image as viewed by real people.No it isn't. The zoomed in examples are just demonstrating the effect. It still looks worse for regular gameplay. Hence the techniques being discussed, and their failure on modern displays, are very relevant.
>>740239529>The blue girl has a squished head compared to the othersopen up the image and measure things. they're actually really consistent between the 3 of them.>The blond guy's face looks like a burn victim's,lol having a tan makes one a burn victim now>hollow, glazed eyesaccurate for this image. honestly, not sure whats going on here. his character portrait has blue eyes, and i can see images on google that show the blue better on the sprite.
>>740220985I don't see anything egregiously wrong with this pixel art and reading the replies detailing what is apparently wrong with it makes me think it's a matter of liking what you grew up with and working backwards for an explanation. I don't even think it looks particularly modern. To me it evokes the kind of pixel art you'd see in the 2000s on the DS or RPG Maker or something
>>740240279NTA but he's right.
>>740240651>>740220985>I don't see anything egregiously wrong with this pixel artThere's nothing egregiously wrong, as admitted by OP who calls it "good but artificial". It's just not right in ways that are hard to pin down.I think it's just too much detail and an odd palette clash, personally. I've seen DOS games with this much detail but having the JRPG sprites makes it seem uncanny
>>740239673No, it doesn't. Pre-rendered means the image was rendered on 3D software into a 2D bitmap before being added to the game. You don't "render" a painting. Stop being retarded.
>google op image>game is godshard chronicles>find more images>wait this looks very familiar>realize its aping seiken densetsu 3
>>740221462Good observation!
>>740239529Nope, you quoted a correct post and gave an elaborate yet incorrect explanation on how it is wrong
>>740240445To be fair they also re-rendered the character sprites which is more than these remasters tend to do. I don't LIKE the way the remaster looks, but at least it's visually consistent.
>>740240651The explanation is pretty easy, people had to work harder with the limitations they had back then, they weren't self imposed challenges for the sake of style, it was what they had to work with and trying to squeeze all of it they could, on top of most pixel art being made with CRT in mind. Modern pixel art isn't consistent because you can fudge the rules for style and shading and coloring work completely differently in modern monitors. You probably barely remember what those games look like in CRT if you're using them on a modern display, and when you go back you realize that people now recreate what the pixels look like on a LED display not what people actually remember what they look like.
>>740241392>the preprendered background is upscaled with the worst ai artifice possible>the sprites look like they're supposed to be in a different game
>>740241237>realize its aping seiken densetsu 3PoorlyLooking at the other screenshots, I think it's the palette more than anything elseIn this shot everything that should be forming a cohesive whole instead jumps out individually. The colors are off and the detail levels are inconsistent.
>>740241486do games aping nes style at least stick to it more?
>>740241573"ape" means to poorly imitate.
>>740240642>open up the image and measure things. they're actually really consistent between the 3 of them.The girl's hair is much flatter and makes her look squished. The fact that you measured the faces and figured that it's fine because the guy has spiky hair and the girl has flat hair exemplifies what I was talking about regarding incompetence. You can't measure your way to correct pixel art. Look at any competently made pixel art and you'll see that even for characters with flat hairstyles, it'll have more volume than this because that's how to make it not look bad. The girl's hair needed to be several pixels taller.>lol having a tan makes one a burn victim nowI thought it would be obvious that the colour had nothing to do with it. It's the pixel placements that make the guy look like his face is scarred. There's circles of lighter pixels around his eyes that evoke a grotesque appearance. The eyes are also too small, the dark pixels above them are a mistake, the colour used for the darkes skin shade is too red. Just a lot of rookie mistakes here.I recognize these mistakes because I made them myself back when I was studying.
>>740241670mina the hollower has already come up and, no, they don't.but to be fair, on a crt you'd never see a pixel character just snap to the next pixel, as they also had ghosting, so the transition was more like oozing from one pixel to the next.
>>740222807the people who make these giant post compilations are infinitely more deranged than what they're bitching about
>>740241670That orange gradient in the background would 100% disqualify this game.
>>740241670They still overuse color and gradients. You could never have those many on screen. even games like shovel knight are very guilty of this.
>>740241573stardew really ruined the entire landscape for pixelshit didn't it
>>740221242Right pic looks like the start of a gay porno
CONTRAST.The contrast is being handled wrong. You notice how the lightest parts of this image, are the railings? Parts you can't walk on? That's not wise.Even as you cross your eyes, the railings pop out far more than anything else. You want your characters to pop out the most. Then their navigable area, then the scenic stuff.Great singular example: >>740221462Cross your eyes there and what happens?
>>740220985Good graphics doesnt mean good game.
>>740241760>mina the hollowerNot even trying to be an NES game, are you stupid?
>>740220985Older games didn't look like this but only because of pixel size. Plenty of snes games were this detailed, just with larger pixels.
>>740241297Yeah fair, the Sea of Stars post wasn't wrong about the specific thing it pointed out, I was responding to the screenshots themselves which have a lot of replies with wrong explanations.
>>740239972it is a television. also, i challenge you to actually measure the distance between your tv and your sitting/viewing distance, and then measure at somebody else's house. easy measurement without numbers: if you can kick the tv, you're too close. >>740239982yes, and? cry about it. $100 black friday sale, baby. im not a pretentious graphicsfag retard.>>740240337and if i changed it to 4k, the PROPORTIONS would still be the same. its YOUR zoomed in image compared to how full screen ACTUALLY looks in terms of size on my singular, same display. >>740240580>You're shrinking it down to miniscule sizes it was never intended to be played at.no, im comparing a full screen image of how the game fills the screen, compared to how your shitty zoomed in image (bigger than the game was ever meant to be played at) displays. >consider that the length of a controller cable would force you to sit relatively close to the TV.the controller isnt plugged in to the tv. the controller is plugged into the console, which is plugged into the tv. this often gives you even more distance to play with, allowing you to have slack. even if your console is tucked into the stand because your parents are ocd, the controller wires for genesis was 6ft and snes was 7.5ft.>You're getting hung up in the sizes of the imagesbecause at the right size, the vast majority of those effects literally do not matter, and the image looks better without the actual SCREEN blurring the image. crisp clear colors and beautiful pixel art vs blurry lines all over. literally the ONLY instance i can think of where crt "matters" to actually change things is the waterfalls in sonic. every single sprite thing you faggots try to put forward ALWAYS looks better in raw when played at actual screen size. zoomed in nonsense is worthless bullshit.
>>740241671>"ape" means to poorly imitate.I didn't realize that. Thanks anon.Now I wonder how many times I've accidentally insulted someone by using "aping" when I meant "imitating" kek
>>740241859>mina the hollower>Not even trying to be an NES gamewe're reaching levels of dishonesty that shouldn't be possible.
>>740241081>You don't "render" a paintingyes you do lmao. you fucking mongoloid. you're clearly not an artist. you can 'render' an image using a pencil.
>>740241958GBC game dumb jiggaboo
>>740234974>>actually decent crt example imageno it isn't faggot
>>740241958that's more of a gameboy aesthetic than anything you should play any nes game sometime
>>740241912>if you can kick the tv, you're too close.
>>740221526Sea of Stars looks "bad" because the background and the character sprite work are of different qualityThe background tileset is most likely an asset pack bought off of the store while the sprite work is unique so you see a really obvious clash in quality
>>740242041>its not that 8bit platform its another 8bit platform
>>740242123>Different things are different thingsWaow!!!
>>740241958But it's not. It's primarily inspired by the art of Gameboy Color games like Link's Awakening DX and DQ3. It's also not trying to be an accurate Gameboy Color game, it's just attempting to invoke the same feeling those games had.
>>740241912>if you can kick the tv, you're too close.Yeah, no shit. What kind of legs do you have that you sit far enough away for the TV to be shorter vertically than your hand is long before you hit that point? Or am I misunderstanding you?
STOP POSTING AFTER I POSTED THE RIGHT ANSWER: >>740241851PEONS
>>7402421578-bit is 8-bit and defined by the nes.
>>740242123The gbc could display over twice as much colours on a single screen than the nes though.
>>740242197it doesn't work because you're talking to people who are using $100 shitbox 1080p monitors they bought on clearance because they're shit
>>740242293
>>740220985>Good pixel art>animated beautifully>game is fun to play>sound effects are awful even someone with zero sound design could record more impactful and better sound effects with a plain microphoneI don't get it and it's even worse for the modern beat em ups like streets of rage 4 or the new ninja turtles games but almost all of the visually beautiful modern pixel rpgs suffer the same issue and then you go back and play FF6 (american) on the snes and every single sound effect is master piece tier.
>>740242123>>740242374It also had much bigger color palette available.
>>740229258Left is more accurate to the original art
do zooomers really think old game devs used "TVs" to make games do they not know computer screens are not the samelol lmao lmfao
>>740241670The bobbing items in the shops instantly disqualify this game from accuracy. It’s so jarring.
>>740242123go find a different streamer's opinion on consoles you didn't grow up with because that one is wrong
>>740242497Here's your pity (you).Enjoy it.
>>740242497do retards really think old game devs didn't test on the intended consumer hardware?lol lmao
>>740242469and that is the main factor that is lost. pixelshitters don't take an image that would be larger than the entire game if rendered 1:1 and try to fit it into a 32x32 or whatever portrait. they start at the pixel stage.
>>740241990This may blow your mind but rendering in can mean different thingsIn a broad sense a render just means a depiction of something. In drawing sense it's the step where you add shading and small details. In graphics it is the process of taking pixel data from the GPU and drawing it on a monitor. Pre-rendered specially refers to a 3D scene which is renderered, the output is copied into a 2D format, and then the copy is used for something.
STOP TALKING ABOUT TVS YOU IDIOTSALL OF THE CORE PRINCIPLES ARE STILL TRUE REGARDLESS WHAT YOU PLAY THEM ON.THEY DO LOOK DIFFERENT, BUT THE GENERATIONAL GAP IS MORE THAN THAT.I PLAYED MOST OF THE CLASSIC SNES RPGS ON EMULATOR FIRST. AND IT'S VERY OBVIOUS TO ME.I AM THIS POST: >>740241851SEA OF STARS COMES CLOSE TO DOING IT RIGHT, BUT THEY STILL HAVE FOREGROUND SCENERY DIALED UP TOO HIGH AND IT ENDS UP SWALLOWING THE CHARACTERS MORE THAN IT SHOULD.>>740221526>>740222116 & >>740221462 STYLE CONTRAST IS YOUR BEST PLAY.
>>740220985not a problem in project nortubel
>>740242932>I have consumed the games on the wrong media thus making me an expertlol
>>740241912>the controller isnt plugged in to the tv. the controller is plugged into the console, which is plugged into the tv. this often gives you even more distance to play with, allowing you to have slack.Anecdotally, I don't think it was common to have your consoles away from TV, in case they get kicked or stepped on or something.> the controller wires for genesis was 6ft and snes was 7.5ft.But you wouldn't be sitting at maximum distance, because that's uncomfortable and runs the risk of pulling the console off whatever you've got it sitting on.Again anecdotally, TVs were fairly big (not as big as now of course) and you'd be sitting reasonably close to it. Not far enough to get the viewing distance you're suggesting and not enough to significantly "smooth" or "soften" pixels.>every single sprite thing you faggots try to put forward ALWAYS looks better in raw when played at actual screen sizeAre you kidding? It looks way worse. I first played FFVI on an emulator (there wasn't a PAL version for a long time) and playing it on CRT was a big improvement.The SOTN comparison images you may or may not be avoiding show a huge difference. The CRT version has a lot more depth in soe many different ways, and Richter looks like a proper sprite instead of a conspicuous bunch of pixels. Even the text saying "RICHTER" and his health bar look too flat in the raw image. Look at the obvious zig zag on dracula's cape as opposed to the folds and shadows you get on the CRT version.I honestly think this fixation on viewing size is a deflection. I think you KNOW CRT is how it's designed to look.
>>740241734>The girl's hair is much flatter and makes her look squishedweird personal interpretation. yes, the others have spikey hair, but the actual sizes are the consistent. face size, general head volume, distance from cheek on the right side of the screen to the eye on the left (center head), etc. >The girl's hair needed to be several pixels taller.why? so every unit can be the exact same size? whats wrong with characters being different sizes? whats wrong with hair spikes extending further than the height of somebody that does not have hair spikes? it doesnt have to be shining force field sprites where every unit is the exact same amount of pixels tall. she's round like the moon, he's spiky like the sun. >It's the pixel placements that make the guy look like his face is scarredhe has shadow from his spiky hair. its called depth. and if you're talking about the nose line, the girl has it too.>circles of lighter pixels around his eyesyou mean his blond eyebrows, and sunlit skin tone before reaching the shadow of his hair and head curvature? >The eyes are also too smallas opposed to crono's, where his eyes take up 2/3 of his face width, and the only skin tone color change is 2-4 pixels for his nose?>the dark pixels above them hair shadow>the colour used for the darkes skin shade is too redlol weird hang up, but consider the rest of your absurd autistic nonsense, not really out of line with it.
>>740243120I played FF4, FF6, SMRPG on original hardware first.I played Earthbound and Chrono Trigger on emulator first.I'm a learned son of a bitch.Defy my knowledge at your own peril.Why spurn the skeleton key, given to you for fucking free. Put the tips I've just described through the most powerful scrutiny imaginable, a gauntlet of trials, and they'll survive. Unscathed, like Leopardon.
>>740243154>in case they get kicked or stepped on or something.More to not have cables in the middle of the living room. Also remotes were not as common so walking to the tv to turn it on or off or cahnging volume became a hazard with console cables all over the floor.
>>740242469Odd, that art doesn't look like it's full of jagged pixels
>>740220985The developers are woke: putting black/brownoids in the game, no fan service, gay shit, etc. I don't care about the quality of the product otherwise.
It's called "i had no intention of playing the game I claim to desire, I just like finding arbitrary things about gaming to complain about"Very common on /v/
>>740242178>Or am I misunderstanding you?you are misunderstanding me. im assuming you arent some nba super freak, so you can use your own body to measure. laying down with your head at the viewing distance, you should not be able to make physical contact with the tv/stand with your foot. that should illustrate that your viewing distance is at least 6 feet or more. if not, then you're sitting too close. even people that have a tv in their bedroom dont have it closer than the fucking mattress. holding your hand out like moana to measure, personally my screen for my current display and viewing distant is top to bottom of my hand suspended in the air. if you have some kind massive crt display and its bigger than that for your viewing distance, you're easily too close.
>>740221049This. There's too many colors.
>>740222807What's wrong with those posts?
>>740243734forgot pic
>>740241760>on a crt you'd never see a pixel character just snap to the next pixel, as they also had ghosting, so the transition was more like oozing from one pixel to the nextCompletely wrong. The main advantage of a CRT is that motion does just "snap" into position because of the inherent strobing.
>>740220985>>740221049ThisLiterally every single tile in that image is unique which literally NEVER fucking happened with retro games
>>740243734Okay, and what about my monitor, at my desk? Am I supposed to be sitting far enough back that I couldn't physically touch it? My ideal viewing distance involves a screen size bigger than my hand appears when fully extended like you describe.
>>740243960They're written by someone who thinks all of /v/'s complaints come from the exact same place and anyone showing any displeasure with any game is a narcissist.
>>740243154>But you wouldn't be sitting at maximum distance,pretty close, just a little slack. and again, it was common to have the console out a bit while in use, and then you tuck everything in (controllers and all) when you're done. >TVs were fairly big (not as big as now of course)right, so for my 50ish inch display right now, that is about 6ft away from me, crts would have been significantly smaller, and as such, the PORTION of such a character portrait/sprite would also be smaller of my visual range. for example, for the image i did of the screenshot and overlay comparison, the screenshot portrait is about tip of my index finger to the second knuckle. the zoomed in one from the "crt comparison" takes up more than my whole finger, almost down to the L corner if hold my thumb out. a fullscreen 30in crt image is going to be smaller than my finger, so showing me an image WAY BIGGER than how it would actually display is meaningless.
>lets make pixelshit!vs>i have a vision and all we got are pixels
>>740244807How about>I have a vision and I'm not going to pay an "artist" so pixels it isLike FTL?
>>740221216Oh pesky boy YOU pesky pesky pesky boy oh pesky you pesky boy you pesky pespy boy.
>>740242515I have never watched a streamer.
>>740244594see >>740222390
>>740222116Bingo. They were always trying to be realistic. The cartooniness was a necessity or something they made work on the fly trying to make things look decent. It's a far cry from an "aesthetic". If old games chose and aesthetic they chose something with art value, not other games. In short making a game that "looks like a game" is just meta nonsense, not creativity
>>740244761>pretty close, just a little slack.Absolutely not. If I ever felt tension in the controller cord my setup was wrong and I adjusted closer to the TV.>I sit far enough away from my screens that if I hold out my hand, just my thumb would completely cover a 30" screen!Your gaming experience is so far removed from mine that we might as well live in entirely different worlds.
>>740245017>They were always trying to be realistic.No, realism in video games is a recent cancerous trend.
>>740220985It is possible to explain, tho. It's usually some innocuous stuff like camera movement that gives it away.
>>740245017>In short making a game that "looks like a game" is just meta nonsense, not creativityToo bad there's literally no way to make a game that doesn't look like a game anymore. Guess everyone's making "meta nonsense" except maybe AAAA $3 billion + productions.
>>740244601>My ideal viewing distance involves a screen size bigger than my hand appears when fully extended like you describe.and standard crt viewing by normal people is less than that. not beating the >>740232983 allegations.
>>740245029i accept your concession to >>740245228
>>740245094lol noThere's always been people who wanted to push the medium towards realism. When software CD's were introduced, the market was flooded with FMV slop with "lifelike" "graphics".
>>740220985lack of hardware restraints
>>740240280It's called sarcasm you fucking buffoon.
>>740245353>there's always been retards held in check by technological limitations and superiors who knew the goal was to stand out not fit inand
>>740220985That tree is so small. And why is the railing curved while the bridge walkway is flat?
>>740245135but star citizen is trying to look like a game?
>>740245431Art is born from limitations.
>>740245228Most normalfags hold their phone maybe a foot from their face. If I hold my phone at a similar viewing distance then extend my hand and hold both vertical, my phone is bigger than my hand by like 20%. Your standards are bullshit that were probably inflicted on you by a parent convinced that TV would fundamentally damage your eyes.
>>740232052 >>740232128 >>740240280How would you feel if you didn't eat breakfast this morning?
>>740221049i cant play lost planet 2 for this reason my eyes cant focus on fucking anything
>>740245017yes anon chrono trigger was trying to look realistic. ya cracked it.
>>740245558jesus look at bro and his tiny hands
>>740244761>so showing me an image WAY BIGGER than how it would actually display is meaningless.This doesn't change how bad pixel art looks at at LCDs at most distances though. If you have to shrink it down to the point where it's not noticeable, there's clearly a problem. The only time a small display is the intended experience is when a game is a handheld game. Those tend to look like garbage when expanded, yes. But for console games, it's really:>developers designed games with an optimal viewing range in mind and expected people to keep that distance from the TV at all timesvs>developers developed for CRTs, which were basically the only TV at the timeI know which one makes more sense to me. CRTs look better at basically all distances. Even your screenshot vs mine shows that.I'm sorry you're fixated on the supposed dishonesty of the cropped images, but that doesn't change the reality of what's being shown. You have to get an absurd viewing distance to mask the warts.
>>740221049Same reason I hate modern graphics. Excessive detail for no good reason at the expense of performance.
>>740245589>picrelwow, CRTs are amazing
>>740245589What if you weren't a massive faggot posting well known troll pics?
remember in older games, where higher resolutions would shrink the UI? i miss that. No, i don't need the health number to be half the screen to see it.
>>740245754Look at bro and his mile long controller cord stretched taut because he's afraid of the screen taking up more than 5% of his field of vision.
>>740241912>the waterfalls in sonicYou mean the ones with separate stylized water drops (short vertical lines with gradients) that get destroyed if you blur them? If they really intended transparency they'd have used dithering.
>>740232983Most people sat at 1/2 or 2/3 that distance, especially as kids
>>740221242>the color paletteThats where youre wrong. The exact issue with OP is that it uses way too many fucking colors simultaneously. Every individual part of the scene looks fine but together they are just too busy. Compare to any of SNES screenshots including the one you posted where 4 or 5 base colors fill 80% of the screen.
>>740245969insecure about his tiny hands too
>>740245558>Most normalfags hold their phone maybe a foot from their faceto match the total percentage of their field of vision that a tv and such would take up.you have no defense for zooming in. if we had the entire rest of the screenshot, it wouldnt fit on the screen. you're misrepresenting the actual display. zooming in and blowing up the picture like that is meaningless. when you actually make it the size that it appears for a full screen application, THEN you have a comparison. zoomed in is nothing.
>>740220985You have to embrace the jank. Modern indie games try to polish over too many quirks that would be considered "jank" by todays standards. Also they keep using the same engines for everything instead of engines from scratch like the 90s where games had their own unique flavor and soul that set them apart from other games.
>>740220985back then jrpg devs didn't imagine their characters a sprites
>>740245773>If you have to shrink it down to the point where it's not noticeablenot shrinking it to anything special, just the normal size that it would be for a full screen game. theres no need to zoom in. is a dishonest and disingenuous comparison (and you know this), which is why its NEVER properly sized.
>>740245985>waterfalls are supposed to look like vertical scanlines
>>740221683people have a really hard time facing this reality because if you are able to even begin to grasp what it is getting at you are likely one of the very people who has lived in a sanitized digital world and to accept it is to accept a level of defeat
>>740246215define "properly sized." exactly how large should each pixel be? are/were all televisions the same size?
>>740221042>>740221049>>740221094>>740221154All wrongIt's because modern indie games are made by 1-3 guys who live on instant ramen in a cellar. They simply don't have the resources to infuse enough soul into the game. Keep in mind that the old games they mimick were made by teams that sometimes numbered in the hundreds.
>>740246279Literally yes. Matches the polygonal trees, and the checkerboard earth. Sonic 1 aesthetic is early 90s high-tech futuristic.
>>740246151all the reverse image searches think that's slayers. the west has fallen.
>>740246018SNES games can get quite colorful, the OP image is over limit but it's not as egregious as the lack of vision
>>740246057>to match the total percentage of their field of vision that a tv and such would take up.Yes. And that means a thirty inch TV being completely covered by your thumb is fucking insanity by comparison. Thanks for noticing.
>>740246215>not shrinking it to anything special, just the normal size that it would be for a full screen gameAccording to your frankly strange idea of what a normal size is, which does not match how people actually played them then and play them now.>is a dishonest and disingenuous comparison (and you know this), which is why its NEVER properly sized.But as we have seen, a properly-sized comparison yields similar results.I'm not the one posting these zoomed-in comparisons but I really think it's just to showcase the phenomenon, not push a dishonest narrative.
>>740223923No-one is giving this comment enough attention. A big part of why modern pixel art looks inauthentic is the lack of consistent colour palettes and resolution scaling.
>>740244987see, what?most tiles in the sd3 screenshot are repeating 5+ times
>>740246429and 6 people was a large team in the 16-bit era.
>>740246471Then why doesn't it look that way on CRTs, which it was designed for?
>>740220985if, today, you told an artist to give you concept art for dozens of characters and locations, and then you said "and the final result will be pixelshit," they'd shriek bloody murder.
>>740224263Exactly! Only Worlds does this right! It really feels like an old game, because there are so many angsty and edgy plotlines and dialogue options.
>>740220985old games look like shit unironically. you guys just remember it wrong.
>>740227974>>740228427Retard alert
>>740246834It does look that way on an RGB CRT, which the hardware natively supports.
>>740220985literally all it needs is the characters to have some better outlines around them
>>740247163no, it looks like a transparent waterfall, rather than a bunch of lines.
>>740246765Chrono Trigger has 103 credited (97 main + 6 special thanks).
>>740247238It only looks like that on a shitty CRT with a composite/RF connection.
>>740247468>It only looks like that onmost CRTs.
>>740247539On most American TVs, where RGB was almost unknown. Not on most Japanese/European TVs, where RGB was common, and not on the high quality computer monitors devs used back then.
niggas really hold strong opinions about design trends from before they was born
>>740247623wait. nigger. are you bringing up component video CRTs? read: HD-CRT?
>>740246347>exactly how large should each pixel be?it depends on your fucking screen resolution, idiot. if i open a game and put it full screen in 1920x1080 and a portrait takes up a small corner of the screen, and your comparison image takes up half of my screen, its not an honest comparison.
>>740247726Component was an American thing. You can convert between RGB and component with imperceptible quality loss but basically nobody was doing in in the 16-bit era. CRTs are RGB natively and Japan/Europe had TVs with RGB inputs.
I just took one look at it and noticed they were filling it with 'diversity' and lost interest.
>>740246525>But as we have seen, a properly-sized comparison yields meaningless results.right, crt shit means nothing at best, or at worst it makes it look blurry and raw display makes the colors more vibrant.>I really think it's just to showcase the phenomenon, not push a dishonest narrative.how wrong you are.
>>740247751>it depends on your fucking screen resolutionthe screen resolution the screen resolution of shining force II would be 320x244 (fuck off palfag). which would be "stretched" across my 40in CRT.
>>740247941
>>740220985Because you're retarded>>740221094This right here
>>740247897anon this isn't "RGB," its RCA.
>Activate Windows
>>740221049Pretty much this, it just doesn't feel rightDisregard the fact that Metal slug has the most detailed pixel art of all time and that shit gets its dick sucked all the time
>>740248038anon that image is literally the size of my thumb on my monitor. it would not be the size of my thumb on a 40in CRT unless I was looking at it from another house.
>>740221216Whoever made this gif knows the good shit.
>>740248079Illiterate nigger
>>740220985>visuals designed for CRTs>vs visuals designed for LEDsIt's that shrimple. I also think that we should stop comparing indie games to the old ones because there's nothing wrong with just doing pixel art the way you want. If it's good it's good.
>>740248113I wasn't the one who brought it up, that was >>740247726.Component is basically a complicated way to do RGB.Your pic is "composite" which is the shitty blurry signal that hides the water droplets in the Sonic waterfalls.
>>740247623anon developers would commonly have multiple working monitors, one closer to consumer spec, and a professional one for more detailed work. the former to see how it would look on consumer spec televisions and the other for actual work.it wasn't just dumb luck that >>740246471 transformed into a uniform transparency on a CRT.
>>740247751It looks better smaller obviously, but the dithered portrait background still shows that was made for CRT. The sprite is kind of jagged too.
>>740247392How many of these were pixel artists(dotters)?
>>740248181and for the game screen, the portrait is about 1/3 of the vertical screen, and 1/4 the horizontal. showing me something thats almost 100% tall and over 50% wide when opened is not a fair and accurate depiction of display.
>>740248392You are 100% confused about something and I'm trying to figure out what.
>>740247925>or at worst it makes it look blurry and raw display makes the colors more vibrantThe colors are far more vibrant in the CRT image I posted.>how wrong you are.You can assume bad faith if you want, but you'll probably get the same in return.
>>740248453anon. you're simply retarded. the image would be "blown up" on a crt too. the entire screen would be 320x244.
>>740248162Detail can be done well or done badly, and high detail doesn't always fit
>>740221890Miyazaki made Spirited Away's hot spring inn based on one he spent a summer back when he was a child. He did exactly what that thesis talks about.
>>740221683Anon post is wrong because (most)good artists don't draw from their memory, they use reference, photos or pictures from rocks in a lake before drawing.Just doomer shit
>>740248443Counting "Field Graphic", "Character Graphic", and "Monster Graphic" but not "Effect Graphic" which I assume is mostly procedurally generated not manually drawn, 20 credited artists. Also three credited Graphic Directors, and Akira Toriyama credited for Character Design.Also I just noticed 14 of the credits are for remake staff (no specific roles), so it's really 83 main staff + 6 thanks.
>>740249068yes anon, looking at a picture of a lake is exactly the same as being at a lake
>>740249068You can't use references effectively without real life experience. Ungrounded referencemaxxing is basically how AI slop works.
>>740249068Okay, so how do you explain that flat garbage in the bottom pic?
>>740249068Or simply having more people involved in the process. If all you have to do today is paint a fucking rock, you make sure it's the best fucking rock you have ever painted. Meanwhile the digital artmonkey has to make the whole scene fast because more efficient tools can only ever mean smaller teams instead of better quality.
>>740249232>>740249238lmao what pseuds
>>740249260greed. the clipart at the bottom took a tenth of the time the top one did
>>740248453you're arguing like the resolution of the image is the only factor that determines its size. this is some shit that would only be possible if you, yourself, have never actually looked at a screen, only ever seen the images at x resolution.
>>740249441I mean, the intended medium was also different. Old School animations were shown in theathres. The flash-art content on the bottom look like a web-feature/streaming service filler.
>MY LOBSTER IS TOO BUTTERY!
>>740221462you could tell me this was a shitty rpgmaker game from the mid 2000s and I would believe you
>>740248576a portrait that takes up 1/12th of the screen would only take up 1/12th of any screen. using an image that takes up 1/2 of the screen as a comparison image is dishonest and disingenuous.
>>740249795... because rpgmaker was quite literally designed to make 16-bit squaresoft rpgs...
>>740220985It's not impossible to explain. It's very easy to explain. Pixel art in older games was built within limitations. Even if you run the games on emulated hardware, their aesthetic style is boxed in by these technical requirements. Indie games very rarely operate under any sort of technical limitation, the art style is either imitated for aesthetic or chosen due to budget. Even if they look good, they don't resemble the traditional pixel art at all because they don't use the same techniques or materials to get their look at all.You might not be an art student but you'd probably recognize the difference in styles and schools instantly if you went to an art museum. This is just the same shit. "Indie pixel art" and "traditional pixel art" are just totally different practices.
>>740249260For the same reason you like top and not bottom.Artistic choice, though it's hard to say that artists behind it were even in charge
Sometimes they use some weird effects that detract from the pixel art that make the visuals look more hazy looking.
>>740249848the native resolution of shining force II takes up 1/106th of a 4k monitor.
>>740220985The answer would be extremely transphobic with some hints of antisemitism.
>>740249260While i'm sure artistic intent is a factor, i think it's also worth considering each cartoon's respective budget. I guarantee you the bottom cartoon had a shoestring budget in comparison to the top. It's cheaper to hack out some flat, simple shapes than it is to pay someone to do a detailed watercolor background for a scene.
>>740250037>地下鉄 written with a Chinese 铁
>>740249848anon go to your display settings and tell me what this is set at
>>740250274It's a Chinese game
>>740222116Suikoden 2 is treat for the eyes.All 19 npcs have different heights, builds, hairstyles and clothings.
>>740250114ok? and? are you trying to say that the comparison images take up a smaller percentage of your screen than they do for mine? i showed you what it looks like as a fullscreen overlay comparison, and why i always find it dishonest and disingenuous. shit is too zoomed in. thats why the thumbnails of these stupid things almost always look better than the opened image, because its more accurate.and then, even if we have different "sizes" going on, once we actually normalize and equate them to the proper screen percentage size for all viewers, raw STILL looks better because the colors and details pop properly, while shitty disgusting screen lines blur and obscure things into a dull mess.
>>740220985>a generation of people who are psychologically paralyzed by perpetual adolescence after being sequestered by virtual escapism find it impossible to accept that their infantile experiences won't be emulated perfectly and insist on imbuing them with a mystical, impossible-to-satisfy longing for a "perfect" return to what only ever existed because they were incomplete human beings, and so they remain incomplete human beings to forever chase that fantasymany such cases
>>740250659you see it a lot with n64 fags and especially ocarina of time.>parents get divorced>they try to convince anon it isnt his fault and get him an N64>theres only a handful of decent games>anon's friends come over for his birthday party and have a great time playing goldeneye and mario kart>core memory archived>later anon goes to friend's house and is blown away by how many fun games they have>start to feel defensive about mommy and daddy's present>its always there for him when mommy and daddy are fighting>and remember that awesome birthday party?>time moves on and nintendo has the gamecube>its all mom can afford on a single income, since its soo cheap>friends dont come to anon's house because it isnt as fun>anon goes over to friend's house and plays ps2 and xbox>the disparity of how far games have progressed is even greater>"hey guys, why dont we play some goldeneye?">"why would we play that crusty shit when we have halo right here?">anon is still stuck with shit at home>anon suffers from deep depression>anon's mom wonders where it all went wrong. didnt she give her son the best?>much like his parent's marriage, reality and reason divorce in anon's mind>"n64, you were always there for me. remember that birthday party? nothing will ever top that." he says to himself in his 30s as he white knights for his console waifu on a mongolian basket weaving forum. >surely the n64 with reciprocate his feelings one of these days
>>740250639>are you trying to say that the comparison images take up a smaller percentage of your screen than they do for mine?yes, i am. windows recommends i scale to 300 fucking percent on my 40in 4k monitor that I sit three feet away from.
>>740250486No, they definitely fucked up, they wrote 映画 with a Chinese 画 too and that's only Japanese word.
>>740251016I meant to imply they fucked up because they're Chinese, not that they didn't fuck up
I feel like whoever complain about modern pixel indiegame being contributed to trannies or whatever the boogeyman they have nowadays is always the same suspect. Sure it was funny and sort of legit as a criticism a few years ago but nowadays it feels like you people are grifting instead of actually enjoying what's might be inoffensive to you.
>>740250843oh ok then.then you're just blind and retarded for thinking screens dont make things blurry and ugly. raw pops much better.
>>740250795Nice blogpost retard-kun
>>740248471Probably SCART, while being ignorant about RGB SCART.
>>740220985>background is basically a pixelized detailed drawing>Characters are in-between snes and ps1 tier in terms of detail.
>>740251334>receive word from the ESLKing>have no idea what the fuck he just saidDamn...
>>740251650I know about RGB SCART. I didn't mention it for the same reason I didn't say "composite RCA". The connector isn't relevant to the discussion.
>>740251774Found the cuck. Have you post your mandatory wojak edit today?
>>740221042>Still feels kind of fake and artificial unlike the old games it's imitatingTranslation: The dev is not a based racist conservative like me and i don't like it!
>>740251470You're clearly just trolling at this point, but my pappy always said, if someone wants to look stupid, help them.also note that phones also upscale everything. an iphone 12 max should be able to tie 45 instances of shining force II.
>>740251774I feel as though whomever complains about the sensibilities of modern pixel art indie games and attributes these sensibilities to transgender individuals (or whichever other bugaboos) are always the same good for nothing, non-gaming layabouts. Perhaps there was an amusing and admittedly accurate critique to behold many moons ago, but 'tis not so in the current day. It feels as though the fusspots are more interested in politicking than enjoying gaming.
>>740250659Okay thanks for the psychobabble, but we're talking about pixel art, which looks worse without the technology it was designed for.
>>740252827it doesn't, drop the nostalgia goggles
