Are Final Fantasy fans too old?
The problem is that because each game takes 8 years to make, there's no chance in creating a fanbase that 'grew up with the series' like it happened in the SNES/PS1 era
>>740298702Square Enix is doing their best to get rid of the turn-based boomers.
>>740298702Average FF fan is in their 30s+Zoomers dont care about the IPIt has a pretty grim future just based on that
>>74029870217 WILL FIX EVERYTHINGTRUST THE PLAN
>>740298702The last good FF game was 25 years ago. If they made another good one people would play it
>>740298702Square Enix is a company run by uncool uncs making game for uncool uncs.All the cool people moved onto better IPs and better publishers. Now no one below 30 even takes a glance at Unc Fantasy
>>740298702until they bring back X or XII combat im not interested
>>740298843Who keeps telling these niggas that they must make a AAA action RPG numbered entry every time? And even then they don't always follow this since they made an MMO out of 14. They really should just give us some pixel style or early PS1 style new numbered entries. Or just make new ones but budgeted. Instead they feel that they absolutely must make one with AAA production values that take them 8 years as you said. Going back to turn based would also drastically help simplify the development of these games again.
>>740298843But there's a chance to have a gen that "grows" with the game, anonImagine being 16, Remake comes out, blows your assNow you're 22, Rebirth comes out, fucks your motherYou will be 28..let's give them a bit more time to cook, 30. You have seen more than 10 years of FFVII relived through you. Very experience of your life was always along with the games.I wish I had that. But I'm 33 and got to play ALL the series so lmao
>>7402987021.take Balls Gait 32.make it Final Fantasy3.????4. Profit
The last good ff was 10, and even that one was not amazing.All they have to do is, you know, actually make a good game for once.
>>740298843Square Enix used to have IPs that came out far more frequently while Final Fantasy dragged on with development. Kingdom Hearts is an example with a decade of consistent releases despite the multi-platform autism that IP had, it still had fans.Now modern final fantasy is not only holding itself hostage with long development times, meaning no one who's not into the IP already gives a shit, but it's also holding Squares other IPs hostage
It's impossible to get into Final Fantasy because it's not a game series. Every game is a separate thing and there's no continuation or cohesion. You play one and like it, then the next one is completely different. You can barely call it a franchise.How is someone supposed to be a fan of that schizoshit?
>>740298702they killed the series with 13 unfortunately, i think they didn't really know how to break it out of the PS2 era, a lot of talent is gone now and you have 6+ year development times for something that is mostly unremarkable gameplay wise and written poorly, so if both the action and story is bad what else is there? not much
The problem is Square Enix is not squaresoft. They havent made a good game in over 20 years.If a game is good people will play it. Simple as
>>740298843Even if they made more, kids won't buy and play that. 70 dollar single player rpg games are for uncs.
>>740299124Just bring back X combat. That is the perfect way to go about making the next entry good. Of course they will need to make a compelling story again with good characters but the combat system is already done for them. They just need to adapt that again. There is no way in hell a new entry with X style combat could fail unless they absolutely botch everything else about the game which I could not see happening.
>>740299254>How is someone supposed to be a fan of thatBy not being a close minded autist who can't digest anything but the same thing forever
>>740298702Final Fantasy hasn’t been good since X, and it hasn’t been great since IX. You now have an entire generation well into adulthood who have only known Final Fantasy in this reduced shitty form.
>>740299248The entire FF7 trilogy coming out between KH3 and KH4 is all you need to know about the state of this company.
>>740299254Yea, it's one of the more bizarre franchises. Resident Evil sticks with a formula for a few games and brings back characters for connective tissue. You can see the line from RE7 abd RE2 Make to Requiem. Who knows how the fuck FF17 will play? Could an action rpg like 16 or maybe some shit like Clair
>>740299329>Just bring back X combatNah sorry but even JRPG fans don't fully understand FFX's combat. People will just grind and complain about turn based being boring.
>>740298702Final Fantasy died when they fired Sakaguchi. It was his game after all. Everything Square has released since then has been soulless in comparison. Square keeps making these huge epic adventures with a ton of boring characters and needlessly complex mechanics and convoluted stories when Final Fantasy was always just about character-driven stories with brilliant world-building and plot twists and addictive, tight mechanics that keep the gameplay fun. They are trying to compete with AAA cinematic open world crap and it's stupid and not fun.
>>740299481It will probably be an MMO
>>740299254Yes, but there was some kind of consistency from 1 to 10.
>>740299329XII had good combat
>>740299569If they're trying to get Zoomers into Final Fantasy then it certainly won't be an MMO. Zoomers don't care for MMO's, to them it's considered a dying and uncool genre for millennials
>>740298702I like final fantasy, I just don't think the new remakes are good, they're bland and boring, and in 16 there's literally no gameplay, it's just watching videos play 80% of the runtime.
>>740298843They’d be better off putting Cloud in Fortnite if they wanted kids to care about FF
I think Final is pretty cool guy. Eh kills Shinra and doesnt afraid of anything
>>740298862>Square Enix is doing their best to get rid of the turn-based boomers.Smart move. Maybe Atlus can learn from Square Enix.
>>740299632How do you get younger people into a game that's presented as the 17th numbered entry in a series? By its very nature it will look like some old-timey thing that requires you to play the first 16 games.If Square wants the zoomer audience they have to make a new IP with the most insane nonsensical story imaginable and a super fast-paced battle system about button mashing. It will also need flashy graphics and loud noises. It wouldn't be like Final Fantasy at all
>>740298702Childish writing + old fans = stale franchise.
>>740299632Zoomers play BR’s like CoD and Valorant, which really aren’t that different from MMO’s.
JRPGs are simply dead.
>>740299737Putting Cloud in Fortnite won't make him suddenly appeal to Gen Alpha or Zoomers. Putting him in Smash certainly didn't increase either generations interest in picking up Final Fantasy.At some point millennials need to accept the likes of Cloud and Tifa are gonna go the way of He-man and Betty Boop. People can name the characters, but once the generation who grew up on them stops giving a shit, the ones who came after won't give a shit because they grew up on other more interesting stuff that appealed to them to begin with.It's how your action mans got replaced with bionicles and bionicles got replaced with ninjagos. Vidya games are like toys and unless the toys can keep getting newer generations in, the sales will eventually dry up.
I hope the next title is a new MMO. There is an insane desire for something new/fresh within the MMO space but the reality is that MMO do not do well unless it's an established IP that people know and enjoy. Final fantasy is uniquely positioned to do this as from what I hear, 14 is winding down and it's longest most dedicated fans are tired of it.It won't be, but I hope it is.
>>740298843This is a profound issue with video games in general. Look at Fatekeeper. In development for nearly 4 years already and just put out a 2 hour demo NOW, with an 18 month probably even longer turn around time, despite being an extremely basic formula that would have taken a smaller studio 1-2 years in the mod-2010s.
>>740299481I mean RE has its own issue of not being able to let go of people. We are getting the remakes because they have no fucking idea what to do with the franchise. RE9 has a god damn RE3 Remake Nemesis boss fight
>>740299980>Vidya games are like toyskek I am so glad to see you say this because I had thought the same thing for a long time now.
>>740300985Resident Evil had 2 legacy characters people liked that they could've built off of instead of relying on Chris and Leon all the time.Problem is, 1 they killed off in the same game they introduced him in, the 2nd they killed him off in his 2nd game.
>>740298702Fixing the thread with theorycrafting
>>740301092They also haven't done anything with Clare as a protag since CV and Jill since 3. Neither has been in a mainline game since before 6 at this point, only Revelations for Claire. Watch people lose their minds over nu-Claire as protag in REX
>>740298702Which RPG franchise is up there with the youngsters? because there isnt. Youngsters like fornite slop
They've attempted to do the "mature story and characters" angle, but if they don't fully detach from the weeb aspect of it, it'll just be a shitty middle ground that no one wantsTheir stories haven't been engaging for over a decade now and they struggle to find and stick to an identity. I'm sure E33 gave them a lot of food for thought, though you won't see the results of that until 3 or 4 more years (if they even decide to do another mainline game)The whole fucking thing has been going through an identity crisis. Can't decide between carefree or mature, can't decide between action or turn based, can't decide between linear and open world
>>740301248>Can't decide between carefree or mature, can't decide between action or turn based, can't decide between linear and open worldThe world isnt black or white, stop with this garbage. Arbitrary ways chosen by you to do things isnt the way to do.
>>740298702Square makes bad JRPGs with high budgets and they're too proud of themselves to correct the current trend. They've spent so much time reinventing the wheel they forgot how to make a wheel.
>>740301248The random comedy quips out of nowhere kills it
>Nier was the last Square Enix IP to make a big splash with the general public>Do nothing but a single gacha since automata, the game that's arguably their biggest success in the last 10 years>Instead pump out yearly Final Fantasies and wonder why people stopped giving a shit despite it becoming the Call of Duty of JRPG's. Aka yearly slopSquare deserves every bad thing that happens to them tbqh
>>740298702Look, i am not buying snoy's leftovers. All they need to do is not be retarded, stop living in 2000s, and release on PC. I am not buying shit if it gets to me 1 year after the release.
>>740301578Nier was lightning in a bottle, Yoko Taro himself hasn't done shit till this new Eva project.
>>740299861They should do that. Keep Final Fantasy for millennial, Iike how DQ exists for its audience and make a new franchise.
>>740301223Pokémon, I guess. The single-player RPG is really a relic of a game style. Kids prefer hopping into a game quick and socializing with friends in a game, not really into a slow developing story with character development.
>>740301223Persona, but it relies entirely on the dating aspect of the cast. Metaphor functionally is a better Persona, but you can't date people so its not as good to them.
>Have Final Fantasy, a series whose most beloved entries were turn-based, but currently suffers from extremely bloated dev times and budgets>Also have Team Asano, a dev team that regularly releases reasonably-budgeted turn-based titles that consistently turn a profit>The last time that Team Asano got to work on a official Final Fantasy game was almost twenty years ago with 4 Heroes of Light
My true final fantasy was always Aeriths soft buttcheeks on my face
>>740302698BD1 basically was a FF game in all but name
>>740302840It DID have FF as its subtitle (Flying Fairy)
>>740302698You people never learn and are completely captured by muh turn based shit. You really think FF15 and 16 would suddenly be good as turn based games, when they shat the bed hard in other areas?
>>740301370Oh they've done grey before, and it fucking sucked
>>740303079Yeah the issue is S-E is incapable of either writing a straight grounded story like with FF16 going muh Ultima partway through, or is tonally all over the place like Rebirth. OG FF7 was the same way but its even bigger shifts in Rebirth. If you slap turn based on Rebirth nothing really changes with people's other issues and really a basic OG style turn based wouldn't be very interesting.
I just wish they'd try to innovate on the "X Niggas in A Line" genre than switching to "action" gameplay.X tried to do something new; Lost Odyssey did a decent job.Even Chrono Trigger and Star Ocean 2 were moving in a better direction.
>>740303427X actually went backwards to pure turn based instead of ATB. 13 was the last time it like they tried something new, with having attacks and spells being parts of an ATB bar. So if you had 3 slots, you could do Attackx2 and Fire. Or Firex3. Just needed to refine that style of combat more IMO but it also meant losing party control.
>>740301223Pokemon and Persona, maybe the Paper Mario and Mario & Luigi games
>>740304794Pokemon doesn't really excel for its turn based combat though, Legends Arceus was a big hit and its very different. I think both Pokemon and Persona are popular for non-gameplay reasons. Fire Emblem is sorta up there, going from Path of Radiance or Radiant Dawn to Awakening isn't really a huge gameplay shift. Its how much the dating/romance stuff is played up in the Awakening onwards games.
There's 1000jrpgs...think about it...1000jrpgs and you're outraging that this one isn't popular... It's not that surprising or crazy. These threads have to be a falseflag psyop..it looks bad tbqh>be luxury item (200GB to install) (ff7 remake did look good. looking at the video. tho)>it's a luxury item...why does it have to be popular?>overrated ngl, there is other 230 rpg and no one complain 'bout them>peaked w/ FFX/FF7 when people had PS1/PS2..mixed reviews on most later ones
>>740298843nah the development time is the least of their problemsthey arent capable of writing mature and interesting stories and characters that match those they did in the past like ff6 and ff7its crazy how their older games look and present themselves with way more artistry cohesion and subtlety than they do nowits like their artistic skills regressed in tandem as tech progressedfunny how all that began once the merger in 2002 was complete and many key people left the company
>>740298702>why are ff fans so oldmaybe because they havent released a game in the series that isnt fucking dogshit for literally 25 years now
>>740298843didn't stop gta
>>740299329>unless they absolutely botch everything else about the game which I could not see happening.they can and they would. just look at 7r, shouldve been the easiest slam dunk of all time for SE. they even made a good combat system despite refusing to just use turn based. and they still fucked it up bad. its not just the shitty "modern" combat systems with every new entry, they cant write a compelling story or characters to save their life either.
>>740298702The only people who still like FF are obsessive cultists which tend to be old.
>>740299183Nah he has a point. I bought my 11 year old cousin BOTW a year after it came out. By the time TotK came out, he was nearly done with high school, and focused on what he wanted to do for college.His only exposure to "Zelda games" in his life is just BOTW.
>>740298702Japs don't adapt is the issue. I think Japs are very similar to us Germans in this way. Most of both our populations are older. The work culture is very formal and hierarchal, with senior voices most likely shutting down young upstarts with wild ideas (which they used to be). Neither of us likes to take chances, especially if it could lead to heavy financial losses. And the general attitude is "if it ain't broke, don't fix it".They need to take risks again, lean into an artstyle that compliments their game, not hyper-realism, which makes the MCs look like cosplayers, revitalize the gameplay, explore new and exciting settings. It was that jump from 2D into 3D with VII, VIII, X, w/ the crazy unique settings after all that really pushed them into cultural relevance.
>>740298702FF fans played turn based games, the devs are now making action games so the fanbase got shrunk down
>>740298702>daily "le FF is le dead!" thread by shitsona and falcom detractorslollmao
>>740306021>lean into an artstyle that compliments their game, not hyper-realismThis is so true for most modern games. I'm tired of all the realistic looking games that are cluttered with so much shit in the world you don't even know what is important for the game. Not to mention those games run like ass if you don't have a $5k PC
>>740298702no, Square is just full of employees who don't like their own games.They literally just have to make a game that plays like E33. Should be the easiest shit in the world and cost less resources than the bloated mess games they've been making.
>>740305612 GTA is its own niche, at least. Open-world w/ gangstahs.In the case of FF, you have some competition now that Dragon Quest has more visibility...Even Atlus is some big player. If you like jrpgs in general, niche or big name. You have many things to branch to and you appreciate FF as one of these. In what world would you consolewar for the 'FF brand' specifically? A shareholder thinks like that.
FF is a cool in highschool franchise that zoomers dont give a fuck about and boomers are tired of, and squeenix are obsessed with their mainline entries being overly bombastic AAA slot with a trillion dollar budgets so any new entry will never recapture their lossesi just hope that the popularity of E33 shows the retarded old men that helm squeenix that people still care about turn based games if the games are actually GOOD and not shallow as fuck character action games
>return to turn based gameplay>take extreme attention to make the artstyle look as close as is feasibly possible to Amano's illutrations>hire matsuno as lead writer/consultant there, i made the highest grossing final fantasy of all time
>>740308158>i
>>740298702>Make best game of 2024>The journos have it against Square and give it to bing-bing-wahoo-lite from SonyIt must fucking suck bringing your A-game but you live in a world of narratives and the current one is stacked against you as a company
>expecting a return to form from a company whos CEO is a literal old retard who unironically seek executive business advice from fortune tellers
things do not actually have to continue forever.
>>740308452wada hasn't been CEO in like 15 years lol
>>740299254People overstate the difference 1-10 is basically:>1: Basic Bitch RPG with a "Pick Once" Class System.>2: Basic Bitch RPG with "Your actions Determine your stats" Esoteric System>3: Basic Botch RPG where you can freely change Class mid campaign.All progressively getting more shit and reusing assetys.>4: Introduction of ATB and higher story focus.>5: Basically 4+3.>6: 4 But LOADSA CHARACTERS and a Esoteric stat-progression system.>7: 3D, ATB and "Skill Equip" System.>8: Card Game. 3D, ATB and Estoteric, "Skill Equip" System.>9: Basically FF4 but 3D.>10: Back to non-ATB turn-based, Skill Tree levelling progressing where you fill out a Grid, honestly the one true outlier.>11: 3MMO, Technically not ATB, but in practice move costs and charging kinda works like it, Class System where you can change Class mid campaign.>10-2: 3D, ATB, Class System where you can freely change classes mid-combat.>12: 3D, ATB where you can manually position,No Random battles, skill tree progression where you fill out a Grid, Programmable Auto-Battle.A bit iffier but you can still see "the same" building blocks thrown around.>13: 3D ATB, Stagger Faggotry, Change Classes Mid Combat, Auto-Battle.>13-2: Literally 13, but with a Monster Catcher. also Reused Assets.14: MMO, HORSEBIRD! B ut seriously i missed the 1.0 train so not i'll refrain my take here.>Lighting Returns: 13+Single Character Valkyrie Profile.>14 - A Realm Reborn (and Expansions): 3D, MMO (No ATB), Can change Class Mid- Campaign, I LITERALLY CANNOT STOP REUSING ASSETS!Kinda starting to lose the plot here, but still a thread.>15: Action RPG with a coping shit ATB system tacked on, and some skill tree level progressiobn.>Strangers in Paradise: ActionRPG, Class System you can change mid campaign, Reused Assets.Chaos Killing Simulator.>16: Haven't played yet.It gets thin, but between the coat of of paint if you are a fan then you can usually find a throughline unifying the games you like.
>>740298702Maybe yes. Pushing 30 myself.
>>740299183>You have seen more than 10 years of FFVII relived through you. Very experience of your life was always along with the games.So in a decade, that bloke got to experience ONE Final Fantasy remake chopped up and sold as poorly connected individual parts. As opposed to the older generations who got to experience a dozen fucking, different, Final Fantasy games in a decade.
>>740312909I think a lot of the "XIII was good actually" in recent years is from the kids who got to experience that whole trilogy, so "XIII" is their equivalent of getting VII-IX.
>>740298702How come Persona managed to get new fans but FF cant?
>>740305552>they arent capable of writing mature and interesting stories and characters that match those they did in the past like ff6 and ff7This seems to be a large problem with people in the general, no matter their age. Maybe it is because they have spent too long trying to appeal to millennials and zoomers who were over protected by helicopter parents. Maybe it is because of the overly PC and feminization of all aspects of life. Maybe it is because of the meme of how stupid everybody is and so everything has been dumbed down well below even the average. Maybe it is all of that. But whatever it is, there is a lack of maturity and willingness to treat the audience with respect and intelligence.Comparing media, whether games, books, or movies, through the decades, you can see a decline start in the '90s and rapidly accelerate in the early '00s until we get to present day.
>>740299183Dude, no ass was blow by ff7RThere is no new fanabse and no legacy as those games are nowhere near that good or memorable.FF7R is breath of fire tier, will be only rememebed by jrpg fans.
>guys nobody likes turn-based combat, it's archaic>persona 5 releases to critical acclaim, became the jrpg zeitgeist>just trust me, players dont like turn-based combat>dragon quest XI remains the best thing they've done in the last 10 years>guys, please, nobody likes turn-based combat>baldur's gate 3 wins goty and hundreds of awards>no seriously turn-based combat is dead>expedition 33 wins like 400 goty awardsare square genuinely unironically retarded or what
>>740299254>and there's no continuation or cohesion>You play one and like it, then the next one is completely different.It didn't start genre-hopping until like a dozen games in. There are differences between the games of course. But they're all within the same genre, and they do share established franchise conventions ontop of that. And yet people like you repeat these claims that every single fucking game was completely different. And that's fucking bullshit. FF1, FF5, and FF10 are all infinitely more alike, than any of them are to FF16, FF15, or FF14. But you speak of Final Fantasy as if FF17 could be a straight Slay the Spire or Terraria clone or something and you wouldn't even bat an eye. Just a new instalment as any other.
>>740298702Stranger of paradise is the only good ff game
>>740314446At this point is also clearly dragon quest fault.Close anime style, classic fantasy, epic hero journey, turn based.Can't do the same thing for ff, so we have cg "realism", GOT wannabe story and world, and is action shit.
>>740298969How would anybody in their 30s know FF? A 30 year old would have been 5 when FFX came out, and the rest of the ffs were shit. The heydey of FF is literally before your time if you aren't in your late 30s or 40s.
>>740299962What did she mean by this?
>>740314004I believe it's because of corporate control over the story. It has to appeal to a wide audience and can't offend anyone. Sex appeal is also forbidden from female characters and you have a check list of character traits that have to be in the main cast for "diversity"This affects Japan too because they want to sell their games worldwide so they have tranny advisors telling them what supposedly will sell in the rest of the world and what is forbidden
>>740314592>FF17 could be a straight Terraria cloneIt would likely be the best FF game since 10 even if it's not what FF games should be
>>740298702Yes, but also all their games after PS2 are fucking trash.
>DIE TURNBASED DIE
>>740315260Back then everyone didn't play games on launch day nearly as much as today. Also if you had older siblings they would likely have a bunch of games
>>740314002Atlus knows they make niche games for a niche audience and they mostly stick to what they do best.
>>740303079>You really think FF15 and 16 would suddenly be good as turn based games, when they shat the bed hard in other areas?I think FF15 and 16 would have been good if they were turn-based games developed by devs who are good at turn-based games, instead of action games made by people who are bad at making turn-based games
>>740314446>are square genuinely unironically retarded or whatyes, after Sakaguchi left all of the collective braincells left with him.
>>740298702These threads read like someone programmed an AI-agent to generate several anti-FFVIIR threads under the assumption that we'd get some kind of info about part 3 during the state of play a few days ago, so now it's this awkward moment where the AI-agent malfunctions and just bashes Rebirth instead in a way that makes no sense, probably because the data it scrapped is filled with info about the recent release on new platforms. The uncanny result are these threads.
>>740298702>Are Final Fantasy fans too old?I'm 39 and I only started playing FFX for the first time ever a few months ago. I played FF7-9 on PS1 back in the late 90s/early 2000s but then I didn't get a PS2 until the Slim released and then I got distracted by girls and working/partying for years so now I've finally settled down and began FFX 25 years later. I'm about 33 hours in so far and loving how soulful it is.
>>740298702I think the only one who gives a shit about Nu-VII is Maximilian Shill. He's really tried to shill whatever FFVII related shit for years to his fanbase, whom really don't care about it.
>>740298702VII is at least since Redditbirth flopped bigly
>>740298702Final Fantasy only got popular in the West with FFVII because it utilized cutting edge CGI for cutscenes earlier than most game series thus giving people a way to say "look, videogames are just like movies and not kiddy anymore!" which also meant they put up with the shitty gameplay and dogshit story. However once the industry evolved without needing prerendered cutscenes and became far more cinematic, there was nothing to make the franchise standout and its flaws just became more glaringly obvious. Also the turn based retards are delusional if they think FF going back to that system would lure in a new generation of fans and not just remnants of bitter aging uncs in their late 30's and 40's..
>>740301515>muh game filesthis is like arguing that hot coffee is canon in San Andreas
