He was right btw
No he wasn't.
What if we already live in the world of musubi and the nigga who made our pocket world was just gay and retarded
>>740375212
>>740375212One of the low-key funniest things about SMT is how much it shits on the concept of Nirvana and chalks it up to losers wanting to shed the responsibility of their existence.
>>740375212>>740379892All the Reasons are embarassing high school philosophy tier rubbish. That's why Neutral is best because you get to revive those dumb fucks so they have to remember all the stupid nonsense they came up with for the rest of their lives.>>740375487Fucking kek.
>>740379892the most generous take would be that it's something you can't impose it on others at the very least, it has to come to you on your own terms. all the Reason niggas and especially Norwoodman are absolutely in the wrong for that alone. there's no consent to any of it, its like getting raped into enlightenment
Ah yes, isolationism, the thinking man's choice.
>>740375212Real men know hikawa was right
>>740382617Sorry but teacher wife is the only choice.
I never get the thought process of Nocturne fags thinking that being force to do his godhood quest for him is okay and not just shitty story telling. They just go LOL YOU KILL HIM ANYWAYS.
>>740375212Cool mustache
>>740375212I don't give a fuck about any of the endings that deprive me of the Lucifer fight but he was the most fun character to experience throughout the story itself
>>740383974That's because he wasn't in the original game.
>>740375212What? I played nocturne when I was a jobless NEET high school drop out and I still thought his reason was fucking stupid
>>740375212I want a hat like his. Where can I get one
>>740375212>everyone should get their own little world because I can't rely on people>thirsty for validation from everyone around him>relies completely on demi to even get the magatsuhi for his reasonnah
>>740384451>Spend the whole game saving his ass from demons and try to protect him>He keeps running off and you can't help himHe's so stupid.
>>740384029Who? Lucifer? I know that, why did you begin that post with because like I was posing a fucking question?
>>740384605Calm down, esl.
>>740384652You're the ESL here, jose, go back to your favella and eat some tacos or w/e you fucking retard
>>740384508>>740384451>do this quest for me so I can be a god, you fucking faggot retard>thank retard, I will become a god>you cannot say no and you have to do itHe is an unlikable piece of shit and baffles me they consider this peak writing.
>>740384820he's a hypocrite, but so are the other reason holders. it's on purpose.
>>740384860I know he is a hypocrite. Its the fact that you're force to do his retarded shit and cannot say no to him while he hurl insult at you. This isn't good writing at all.
>>740384719Quit projecting.
>>740375212WHAT DID HE EVEN BELIEVE????i fucking HATE nocturne
>>740384962Cope harder, spicoid zombie, you will never be white
>>740383046>Just give up your free will goy, the tech CEO says soNice try, Thiel.
How do you feel now that kaneko is an AI faggot?
>>740384918he's also dealing with the guy going schizo on you, so at least for that bit demi's interests aligned even if you personally tell him to fuck off, which you can do earlier. this sounds more like a you problem.
>>740385898He's been checked out of any relevant roles in game development for over 15 years so I'm not sure if that matters
>>740386026I see you're making excuse for shitty writing now. There really no need to help that retard and all the humans in the game just right out suck on all fundamental of story telling. They need to shove in Raidou/Dante and Lucy later on to make you guys cum buckets.
>>740386254I see you're esl. guessing this is an izzat thing and you can't deal with someone not sucking up to you at all times. people being flawed isn't bad writing.
>>740375212a world where only i get to live in isolation in my own bubble forever sounds cool but then i wouldn't be able to shitpost and call you a retard
World of stillness is the best reason.
bitch bitch bitch bitch bitch bitch
is nocturne a good place to start with the smt games
>>740386731yeah it's like a soft reboot though one side character is a reference to the MC from 2 it's not a big deal.
>>740386197Did he at least leave an outline or something? He managed to take Nishitani's YA novel series and spin it into an intriguing analysis of biblical philosophy.
>>740386678Man you gotta ramp those rookie numbers up.
>>740375212the hidden eye is red
>>740386850I got better (eventually).You either kill him quick or the fight goes on into eternity.
key points to not getting my ass beat in nocturne?
>>740386887Sick. I'm replaying Nocturne on hard with the insaniax mod and I'm going to have to spend a long ass time on getting the right demons to complete all of the burial fights in a decent amount of turns.
>>740386678>Aurora >Aurora >Aurora >Aurora >Aurora
>>740375212the japanese retarded bug people were heavily impressed by Clockwork Orange.
>>740386678>>740386850A lot of those fights feel like they're intended to drag on for a while, especially on a first playthrough. Like the fucking Trumpeter where you have to impirically calculate relative health values and turn sequence or you end up fighting the bastard forever.
>Killing Chiaki before she can full healFeels FUCKING great man. Fuck that whore.Also Reuben really makes DMC2 dante sound so much more exciting.
>>740386941Depends on which boss. I feel that Nocturne is one of the few JRPGs with actual teeth and you either learn specific boss behavior or get fucked, or at least that's true for the Fiends and some end game bosses. A lot of it comes down to "did you equip the right Magatame before the fight" and "did you bring the right buffs/spells".
>>740387075If she was right then I would have lost to her.
>>740386941Buff yourselfDebuff enemiesGet fog breath ASAP and keep it on a demon. Maybe even have it on yourself if you want.Magic is great early and falls off later for DemiPhys starts off lackluster early then becomes ridiculously good later.Save often.If you have lots of money it's better to summon demons from the compendium for fusion fodder than endlessly negotiating.Once you forget a skill on demi you can't get it back so make 100% certain you don't want that skill anymore.
What was the deal with Hijiri? What did he do to get fucked by god?
>>740386731Not even fucking close. It give you the wrong idea with the overall message of SMT and the alignment system. I would honestly just play 4 or VV first.
>>740387134Oh you know haha this and that.
>>740387086Agreed. If I remember the story right, Noct's Dante was more written like DMC1 Dante since 2 wasn't out at that point in development.
>>740375487
>>740387134God get offended by the slightest shit in SMT. >>7403871922 and 3 isn't connect, retard. You fuckers would do anything trying to connect those two game.
>>740387187Nocturne's reasons are all Law based in a way.Freedom is neutral.Demon/True Demon are chaos.It's quite simple.
>>740387120fuck you. you visited tartarus once a week. if anyone was tired or non-copacetic you reloaded the day's save. everyone is ready for the gauntlet. Let's kill this boss (there's another boss in the agenda). The only way to play this game is max social links in a ps2 emulator. fuck this shitty easy game for journalists
>>740387187Eh I started with 3 and I came out of it alright. It's probably the most accessible earliest SMT game.
>>740387134he didn't return his shopping cart at the supermarket
>>740386941fog breath fog breath fog breath fog breath fog breath fog breath fog breath fog breath fog breath
>>740387134depends on your persuasion. some people think he's aleph from smt2 being punished for the neutral route. I think he's just an average guy who happened to survive a previous conception in a parallel to demifiend and this greatly disturbs yhvh in the continuity of nocturne because someone slipping outside the system is a direct threat to his control.
>>740387247Not even close since any first timer would think Reasons are the alignment themselves. They had to go out of their way to add in Lucy's route because all the choices were shit and unfulfilling
>>740387134We don't know but he does have a cool theme https://youtu.be/tUISz9mV7BY
>>7403872821 is the most accessible earliest SMT game and fuckton more fast pace than 3.
>>740387114No, you beat her since you were the strongest and the only character in the game able to get anything done. Therefore, you proved her right.
>>740387335Ok and they can either work it out mentally or they can learn about it later, what's the issue? It's not like nocturne starts off saying it's important to know the alignment distinction at all. If someone wants to play smt3 they absolutely can, and even better, playing 5 afterward would be more fun because they'd see all the little nods and references to 3 and continued themes.
>>740387247I thought True Demon was the "actually, God thinks kalpas are gay, please remove them" route. That Demifiend is named a messiah shows that his acts were the Great Will's will.
>>740387114>>740387378She is already wrong the second she has two cats fighting with her.
>>740386731All the SMT's are sort of self-contained. Though IMO 3 is weak because it's RNG rate is stupid high (the norm for the era) for the breadcrumbs of plot you get between that.If you want "pure gameplay" /v/'s trademark it's fine, but the random encounters burned me out toward the end to where I never want to touch it again.Can't say the same for other SMT's.
>>740387335I like Freedom the most of the vanilla endings. Getting kudos from Lucy for that path is pretty interesting. It's just unfortunate you have to go True Demon to see all the content.
>>740387369this. *zap zap zap zap*gg ez
>>740387396I mean Lucifer drops a bug in your mouth in the opening turning you into a half-demon.He's a literal BUG in the system.But like any good developer, as long as it's not breaking the game, it's permissible.
>>740387395I would go so far to say you shouldn't play V without Nocturne's context.
>>740375212I don't like how his character does a complete 180° out of the blue. He was really gung-ho about chasing and saving the teacher, putting his life at risk for her. And then suddenly he's being a bitch at YOU because you didn't save him in time.And then his retarded reason is about being in solitude when his entire character had been pining for the teacher and depending on you.
>>740387192>Kills Buddha, Beelzebub, Lucifer, Satan and God>Befriends demons by dancing FURIOUSLY, can out-dance demonic Michael Jackson>Makes his biological momwife akwardly dance FURIOUSLY for his and everyone else's entertainment>Fucks his biological momwife and repopulates the worldAleph was too based for this world or any other for that matter.
>>740387395>what's the issue?All the "reason" route are poorly done and shit. You have no agency or care for any of those fuckers. At least you can sympathize with CHAOSfag in 1 even though he will back stab you many times during the journey or go full White in 4. The Reason reps are just shit and so are their ending.>>740387451Freedom is just Neutral, but one of those route they won't never get due to how badly they hint of it or get it. Only 4's Neutral route is worst to work to get it.
>>740383046Based Shijima chad
>>740383046>Work with loud minorities all fucking dayA world of silence and harmony would fix me fr fr
>>740387585>All the "reason" route are poorly done and shit.No I think they were pretty well done and clearly defined. Each character has a very clear, distinct personality and expression even evident on looks alone.Each time you meet them in game, you see them further slipping down certain paths until they inevitably end up the total opposite of who they were initially.>You have no agency or care for any of those fuckersYeah that's a good thing and sort of the point. Persona 3 came out not long after and was all about bonds and connection while SMT3 leaned into individuality and atmospheric loneliness.
>>740387620That still goes against the strongest of the fittest, which ruin her standing by default. If she is so powerful, she could have solo you and your sluts.
>>740387235>>740387192>>740387134If you look at the real world timeline the Amala labrynth stuff was added in a second re release.When the first release came about, there was no connections to SMT 1 or 2. So in this context Hijri is just some random survivor guy. The problem is he wasn't at the hospital and it's is a primo plot hole. So in the re release, rather than moving him to the hospital they decided to allude to his involvement being greater. Since the amala stuff is all a bunch of references to SMT1 and 2 so you basedjack face at it they probably sneaked in the allusion to Hijiri being Aleph.However it is very deliverately vage enough so that if they need him to be directly in a squel or something, he can be. But if they need him not to be in a rerelease of SMT2 or an artbook or whatever, they can just say it's not.It's quite made to spark conversation without actually leading anywhere,.
>>740387476>as long as it's not breaking the game, it's permissible.I don't think it's that considering late in the game kagutsuchi clearly has a problem with demi being there so much as even if someone not chosen by god survives the conception the vortex world is a hostile hell hole and the problem would usually solve itself. lucifer just gives demi the power to survive.
>>740387679>No I think they were pretty well done and clearly defined. Each character has a very clear, distinct personality and expression even evident on looks alone.lol no. They just stand there, talk about MUH Reason, and fucks off. You don't interact with them or anything. Its way too many talks with no action to back it up. This of itself is not good story telling. Lucy's Route felt like the closest thing to having a proper SMT alignment route gave you all reason to do so.
>>740387785>When the first release came about, there was no connections to SMT 1 or 2.man he looks exactly like Aleph and they even gave him a purple hat.That shit wasn't an accident.
>>740387843That's just the artstyle, they arr rook the same.
>>740387785the amala labyrinth just elaborates on what's already there in the base game.
>>740387687But she wasn't stronger than you. You beat her and pick the world you want, proving her "might makes right" philosophy right in the process. In the Yosuga route shes even happy about it. She believes that the strongest belongs on top, and she just wants to be the strongest.
>>740387843They don't look the same, dipshit. Its the artist drawing the same thing. I bet you think X anime character is the same as Y anime character and thus connected because of it.>>740387785This is Chocobo/Lucy/Cid tier of using the same name in the franchise. There not connected. Its the kind of shit people think Kain in 2 is the same as Kain 4, when its fucking not.
>>740387804I got the impression from the Freedom ending Kagutsuchi just wants the kalpas to end and Demi is there forcing him to run the same rickety timeline that already imploded once in front of them. True Demon ironically (or not, given he was claiming to act under the directive of the Great Will) gives him exactly what he wanted. Across multiple universes.
>>740383046>choose Isamu or Chiaki, your friends>they die anyway>choose Hikawa, the antagonist who destroyed the world in the first place>he gets exactly what he wantedReally makes you think...
>>740388029>I got the impression from the Freedom ending Kagutsuchi just wants the kalpasWhat exactly are the kalpas? I got the impression it was a path to lucifer's domain but their name is a measurement of time.
"might makes right" is an anti-philosophy
>>740388085Whups, I'm referring to kalpa in reference to each Conception attempt, not the levels in the Amala.
>>740387843Not really, Kaneko just does rather samey human faces. And even then, Hijiri's face is longer, has more facial hair, thinner eyebrows. It's really just the hair and equating a purple hat to sci-fi visors is really pushing it.It's easy to create connections when you really want them to be, and game developers know this. This is why things are deliberately vague in the first place.
>>740387998I still wonder how much of that is their own personality and how much is being influenced by other beings. Their personalities change pretty radically in the Vortex world over time. By the time they demonize themselves, most definitely they're not the same person.
>>740387998I am quite aware of that. Just stating the battle itself when you fight her is when her Reason is wrong.
>>740387927if you consider that stuff in the amala wasn't in the base game, it's not really elaborating as much as it's expanding on it. It's no different than Strange Journey Redux expanding on Jiminez's ideology growing from a cruel survival of the fittest to a more noble one. It is indeed an element that was in the base game but the added information changes the context.
I'll never understand why this fanbase jumps through so many hoops to keep each game entirely separate with zero connections. A series that expressly and repeatedly talks about the multiverse over and over.
>>740388343If the fans are mistaken then I think it's warranted a game dev would want to provide more info to clarify the intent.
>>740387075Correct.
>>740388343>It's no different than Strange Journey Redux expandingDSJ rewrote and shat on the themes of the original, not expanded upon.
>>740388343>It's no different than Strange Journey Redux expanding on Jiminez's ideology growing from a cruel survival of the fittest to a more noble one.That only happen because Not!Yukiko came back from the future and outright tell the retarded diaperfag about the future.
>>740388364To be fair, the cosmology of the OG timeline (I, II, NINE) is pretty different from what came after it. Even though the cosmologies being different is kind of the point since we're dealing with games where literal God is running a series of morality tests on highschoolers and the occasional jarhead.>>740388475Dude, don't remind me. NuLaw ending feels like the ultimate copout of the themes of the series.
>>740388168No. Might makes right is very much real philosophy. It's just poorly used in the games because the writers probably don't understand the concept well.Might makes right is the notion that in order to have rules, laws and order you have to have the power to enforce them. As such the rules and laws that we live as a society are those we know will be enforced.A good example is piracy. Piracy in most of the world is not enforced, you can go to any romhacking site, download quickly an emulator and games, and play the entire catalogue of nintendo games and have a jolly old time. In many nations doing this is illegal to some extent due to infringements of copyrights but in most nations it's ambiguous and nothing any officer will waste their time on.In a country like japan they will very much enforce their piracy laws, people can go up to years in prison if the company decides to file for damage. As a result japanese people have grown a very serious attitude towards piracy because the fear of retaliation looms over.Power dictates which rules apply and how people behave around them.
Raidou 2 remaster when?
>>740388574>NuLaw ending feels like the ultimate copout of the themes of the series.Naw, it still fits in the theme>Russian barefoot girl tell god to fuck off>she and she alone tries to sing out humanity's aggression, the very thing that the intro of Strange Journey kept hammering the player's head about>even the dialogue point out that despite how peaceful things get, the future is completely uncertain>there might be some human that are immune to said singing like the original Law endingIts not perfect and has its flaws.
>>740388546And that's different from a SECOND lucifer coming down to a wheelchair to explain you about the past you would otherwise not see, how exactly?Just so you know, Old Lucifer wasn't in the original release and everything he does is added to the maniax release. >>740388417why? having unclear intent leaves people talking about your game years later. They don't need you to feel you have a satisfying conclusion to the story, they need you engaged with the story.
>>740388753They're all the same lucy in 3 and he exist to just fuck around with Demifiend.
>>740388753>Just so you know, Old Lucifer wasn't in the original release and everything he does is added to the maniax release.I thought that was a cool detail. Young lucifer in the vortex world. Old lucifer in the depths of the kalpas (A kalpa is a long period of time in Hindu and Buddhist cosmology, generally between the creation and recreation of a world or universe.)
>>740388746I guess when you put it as musical therapy it isn't so bad, but when I originally came upon it, felt like an admission human nature needs to be supernaturally modified to work in the long term. SMT without the human element, is just Jack Bros. on the Virtual Boy.
>>740388168>>740388603In its most simple terms it can be determined to be an anti-philosophy, or rather a blank slate without philosophy applied, because it's simply what you get when you remove human reasoning and fall back purely on Darwinism and primal animalistic logic. Obviously it can be more than that but at its most basic it's how even the most simple forms of life behave.
>>740388808In lore, yes you are correct.In our reality, the Wheelchair Lucifer is the NPC that follows the additional content added to the maniax re release. He's effectively the Marie, the Kazumi, the Alex of the game.
>>740388920>He's effectively the Marie, the Kazumi, the Alex of the game.That Dante/Raidou.
>>740388746>Naw, it still fits in the themeThe theme of the game was the extremes alignments can go to. Everything Alex related shits on the original's themes.
>>740388941not really because he doesn't follow you the entire Kalpas. He is really exactly what he is, a guest character to boost sales. Like the guys from Durarara in Devil Survivor 2 Record Breaker
>>740389008You can't be a guest character in a game you already star in.
Is it possible to read the whole series in English yet?
>>740385898I don't really care as long as it looks good, but it's not like Kaneko has had any real involvement with modern games beyond re-using older designs.
>>740389075I heard they had a major snag on the third book but Nishitani is now actively looking for a translator.
>>740389008Pulled out my copy of Lucifer's Call so I could bask on this thing in person. Just realised this game was published by fucking Ubisoft in PAL regions
>>740388898Your understanding of might makes right is very much adhering to what anime villains say in cartoons, or what comically evil demons say in the series.Allow me to give you a much more clear example of it in the real world you live in.Mexico right now is infested with organized crime. Organized crime that has superior offensive power since it has better armament and unlike mexico's law enfocements it doesn't care for human casualties, it has superior economic power since the narcotics it sells to the entire world are far more profitable than the taxes allocated to Mexico's army or police force, and it has political power embeded deep within the ruling party.Effectively mexico's goverment has become myrmidons to the cartels because they control politics from every angle and as such all the way tot he president, political decisions are made with their interests in mind, not the broader country's.Their might dictates the law of the country. And it's not dawinism, not primal animalistic logic. It's sheer functional logistics.
>>740387267Bait or mental retardation?
Isamu's strength is hidden in his hat. After you defeat him for the final time (in which his hat has been transmogrified into his form) he leaves behind only his iconic hat. Had the demifiend had the agency to rip his hat from his head in the opening act none of this Musubi bullshit would have happened.
>>740389297What you're describing is Plato's Tyranny stage of governance which is, in fact, very animalistic in it's failure to value anything beyond maintaining power for the tyrants. I don't think it's even a particularly good example of that philosophy since even in the animal kingdom challenges of power can occur instead of weak despots crushing all opposition.
>>740389297>Not X, Not Y, but Z
>>740387134The Lady in Black makes it seem as if Hijiri stood against YHVH/the Great Will in another world's Conception cycle, and he failed in his rebellion as he had not the power of the Demi-fiend. I do not believe he is meant to be Aleph, but a predecessor to the Demi-fiend as a warning to what would happen if he fails.
>>740389865What makes you think it's a "Tyranny"?Mexico by all means has democratic elections. There wasn't a coup either, it's just plain corruption. The press isn't exactly supressed either, beyond berating by the ruling officials. It's far from being a simple matter that you can armchair your way with a few words.Also, you're making the huge mistake of thinking one thing cannot be described by two or more concepts at the same time. Philosophy is just ideas, they're mutable and fluid social constructs. They don't actually exists, it's qualitative not quantitiative you don't need to be so square about it.BTW. I can keep giving you examples, for isntance United States going in and kidnapping the president of Venezuela to judge him on american grounds, place a puppet as the head of venezuelan state and hope to easier oil and absolutely no other country in the world did anything about it despite it being an absolute violation of a soverign state. Because USA has the might to enforce what they "believe is right".Although I am starting to think I should probably use video games as an example for you to better understand.
>>740391097This reply kind of killed my interest in talking to you to be honest.
>>740391097>What makes you think it's a "Tyranny"?The key point of Plato's Tyranny is that only exists to maintain power. Any effort to maintain interest in the people, pursuit of arts or science or even maintaining strong relations with neighboring states goes out the window. That is the state you're describing for Mexico, a state where the cartels exploit resources and give nothing in return. You don't see Mexico dominating the arts with soft culture or making massive strides in technological advancement because tyranny ensures that the best of society flee while the worst remain. This is happening in other parts of the world right now, not to name names or anything.>The US>"He will also provoke warfare to consolidate his position as leader."Yeah, about that...>Although I am starting to think I should probably use video games as an example for you to better understand.I don't really want to engage you on this kind of base level but you can leave out the "I'm so much smarter than you!" part of your posts, it's not impressing anyone.
>Anon left.
>>740385723Yeah but the CEO gives up free will too
>>740386678Nigga get Freikugel and build a team for this one, I minturned that faggot without Pierce
When I was younger I wondered who could possibly take SMT alignments seriously. As I grew older and learned more about the world I came to subconsciously understand, it's Latinos. Now this thread has pulled the knowledge to the fore
>>740391837They are called latinx.
>>740392540Pretty sure they aren't indiginous to latin america, that's probably an ocelot.
>>740392540Don't use that word to describe us, it's cringe.
>>740392693Tell you what, post a funny power chart and I'll consider it.
>>740392728All my good stuff is on the other PC...
>>740393912>Shion (Panda Triste)Kek. Also so many of those are long gone now, christ.
>>740394635It can't be helped. Going public has that effect.
>>740383046I need to replay the Kramer Hentai Quest flash, I don't remember that scene.
>>740389119anon... >b-b-but it's AI trained on data provided by kaneko!!!!still kaneko
>>740395404it was early AI art. Wouldn't be bad to see what they did now, and maybe give it more cycles. That's just Elsa. I could ask ChatGPT right now to make something and it would make something pretty good I'm sure. Design wise at least.
>>740388626Hopefully soon. Shinado is my favorite antagonist of the SMT Series.
>>740387192naaaah
>>740387192You didn't actually fall for this meme, right?
In the middle of a LARP (minus the L & A) playthrough of V atm where I'm only using Greek demons and I named my guy "Phoebus Apollo" (it's almost absurd he hasn't been in any games since KMT). Gonna have Artemis right next to >me in the party for the whole game in service of the LARP (minus the L & A). Finally made it past the awkward early game void where I had to use make some very contortionistlike judgements with shit like Agathion & Daemon. Can't wait for the "fuck you dad!" fight(s) against Zeus.And also while we're here: how the fuck is Aphrodite/Venus not a series staple?And also also: fuck you I'm using Cleopatra. Greek name, Greek blood -- it counts.
>>740401275Oh yeah and my other point was that I forgot how retarded Yoko was. But I've already decided to go her route since I haven't done it yet so I have no choice to indulge her. Is this what it feels like to chase pussy?
