rpgs are not supposed to be hard

>>740543938
Genuinely who cares? No one plays these games for the combat.

sounds like you can just not use it

>another limit break mechanic after P3R

I hope there's a fight that removes all this bonus damage, and suddenly makes the player have to think

>>740543938
Golden was easier than 5

>>740544151
>just ignore it
People like you are why games are piss easy

>>740544347
I play shmups so no its not people like me I can assure you.
But for RPGs you always have had to do self imposed challenges since wizardry retardation you die to rng lol went away

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>>740544248
the last time they added a fight where you have to think it filtered everyone

>>740543938
Persona has never been a difficult game

>>740544029
>rpgs are not supposed to be hard
Yes they are? That was one of the defining features of the genre at its conception. Haven't you played Wizardry? Or Rogue?

>>740544709
Dying to rng wasnt difficulty

>>740543938
Good thing I played the original and thus have no use for a demake.

>>740543938
colour slop for adhd zoomers pushing 30 years old whose brains have been destroyed by tiktok slop

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>>740544521
are you saying this fight filtered people? really?

>>740544826
Your entire 12 word vocabulary is almost all meaningless buzz words, your glass house living ass shouldn't be calling people out on brainrot.

>>740544908
and now you understand why p3r and now p4r are designed the way they are.

>>740544908
The Royal version specifically, yes. I think it was the only fight (maybe Madarame as well) where I actually got a game over

>>740544908
to this day 99.99% of people think the only way to beat this fight is to grind extra , set the difficulty lower and use dlc persona

>>740544767
So they were easy games then?
No? Then they were difficult.

>>740544521
>>740544908
this fight was literally retarded it is easier on extreme than it is on hard/medium, their difficulty system just makes 0 sense

>>740544908
Baton passing is a really hard mechanic for everyone to comprehend apparently

>>740543938
p5 IS the easiest game, and im happy about it

>>740544029
if it's easy there is no reason to play out your party/builds/etc and all of the mechanics in the game are pointless

>>740544908
I'm 32 and this was the worst designed boss fight in any game I've played.

>>740543938
>p5 was the easiest game.
Was it? (I haven't played any of em)

>>740545076
it was the only fight that objectively increased in difficulty from persona 5 vanilla, yeah. was honestly pleasantly surprised that he game over'd me. madarame is a little bit of a sidegrade even if vanilla madarame killed me a few times and royal madarame didn't.

>>740544908
I only game over'd twice in the game and this was one of them. It's a completely nonsensical fight.

>>740544521
By think you mean looking it up online to avoid getting softlocked on your first try because you didn't know the fight is going to be a dps check where you need certain elements in your party?

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>>740545629
Yes by far. You can break it very very easily.

>>740544908
I actually died on this fight exactly once, but only in the base game. Like >>740545541 said Royal's Merciless difficulty is retarded and makes Weakness/Technicals do like triple damage so the mobs in this fight just instantly die on the "hardest" difficulty. Atlus difficulty is part of what turned me off of playing on the highest in RPGs

>>740544908
This was the one fight I game overed on
Why isn't weakness scaling consistent across difficulties?

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>>740545836
I admit in these I'm just seeing how high the damage cap can go.

>>740543938
so? That shit was already in P4 Golden.

>these games are so easy god why does anyone pretend they're hard
maybe you just got good and can't see the skill floor anymore

>>740544521
No, it was just a terribly designed boss. As >>740545541 says, the difficulty scaling proves that this encounter is fundamentally broken. No encounter should ever scale like that in any RPG. Furthermore, it shows the limits of the 1-more system.

>>740544521
Kek

>>740546008
So have all the "vanilla good, Golden bad" contrarians been just pretending to have played the game all along? Because nobody would say something so retarded and factually wrong with such confidence otherwise.

>>740544248
Isn't that what the bonus content for the twins was in 5R?

>>740546008
just like theurgies were in p3p, yeah, absolutely.

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>>740546274
The twins fight was in base P5 as well. Royal added Lavenza and some challenge fights where you score for points.

>>740545773
>you need certain elements in your party?
maybe that's why i thought the fight wasn't that bad, i got lucky with the elemental weakness

>>740544908
They hate it because it's the one fight of the game that asks if you actually understand the battle system you've been using and they don't

>>740546095
>see blue enemy
>use the attack that causes fire damage
>heal if hp goes down
not much to learn in these games, you don't even need buffs/debuffs

>>740546445
I was talking about specifically the challenge fights in my post. Yeah you can beat them normally, but then you won't get the high score rewards.

>>740543938
Oh cool more "I DONT HAVE TIME" mechanics

>>740545076
Doing this fight on the highest difficulty unironically makes it a joke.

>>740545773
>joker has multiple personas to hit multiple weakness
>you can swap out party members to hit weakness
>use items to hit weakness
its not that hard

>>740545773
There's no reason not to have Joker loaded with a wide variety of Personas.
granted my last run was a Joker Solo run so I went wide at all times anyways.

>>740546897
>There's no reason not to have Joker loaded with a wide variety of Personas.
There's no reason to have wide variety of Personas when bosses have no weaknesses and all random encounters get wiped by 2 AoE phys attacks

>>740544521
>>740544908
its funny that one fight in the Persona series makes people actually Game Over and they need to think / use strategy to overcome it.
This was normal in SMT and older RPG games. You thought a hard brickwall boss like this all the time in older JRPGs.
This issue with this boss is if you don't go into it with a specific setup of weaknesses and buffs + baton passing, then you just lose. Theres no way to overcome it unless you do the exact strategy needed to win.
Is it badly designed or just overtuned? Depends who you ask.
For me personally, I got 1 Game Over but once I knew what t do, I was just handed the win.

>>740543938
No, 4 was always the easiest game because at the end of the day, 5 never took away a party member's elemental weakness when their persona evolved.

>>740547017
>when bosses have no weaknesses
Nta but they almost always give the bosses in 4 a weakness.

>>740544521
>>740544908
Why is this considered hard? I only wiped twice in hard in the whole game and extreme is so much easier than hard

>>740547236
I think the time limit just makes people panic and they try to rush through the fight and get whacked as a result. The time limit is pretty generous in that fight all things considered, even in my solo run I wasn't anywhere close to running out of time.

>>740544151
>You control the buttons you press
okay, fag. may as well just not balance your game at all, if something trivializes the game, you can just not use it

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P4 already had an ez modo button though

>>740544908
It’s not even bad but the game has not prepared you for it at all. You don’t have to use the baton system at all or are expected to, and then here comes something that requires full team baton passing.

>>740546656
That's actually ironic, because you would normally expect the opposite.

>>740548087
>That's actually ironic
Unironically

>>740544521
>Hitting weaknesses and baton passing is too hard for people
How

>>740548627
When I first did it, I didn’t have any of the items needed for a baton pass. Once I rewound the clock I didn’t it easy.
I’ve been playing metaphor and the press turn system actually encourages you to prep elemental items constantly to maximise the turn count while Persona’s once more system never requires you to use that system

I'll never understand remaking a turn based rpg and not improving on the gameplay.

>>740550351
They're improving it in the eyes of normalcattle by making it play itself.

>guy who doesn't play turn based RPGs shares his opinion on turn based RPGs

>>740543938
honestly this is the one persona you can genuinely just watch the anime and be fine skipping the game

>>740551028
Might as well skip all of them and just play SMT.

Nice! Persona 4: persona 5 edition.
I cant fucking wait bros.

>>740551096
at least it seems like they're including Golden content this time
P3 Remake had them sneakily cutting out The Answer from the paypig deluxe pre-order tier by making up a ton of other filler DLC and selling them as a separate DLC/Season Pack

>>740551503
Thats true but how would they even sell golden content as separate? There's a whole ass s.link you have to do in order to get it

>>740551872
They're probably kicking themselves for not making Golden as much of a tack-on as FES.

>>740553164
meant for >>740551503

>>740544029
This. RPGs have literally always been "the casual game genre" Only when WRPGs died and were revived by Xbox did people delude htemasxealve into thinking hatey ewre "hardcore".

>>740544151
You said this about pokemon for 10 years and then they removed any of the options turn the casual bullshit off

>>740551872
They would just make the game vanilla p4 and the dlc would add all the golden content

>>740553716
Why didn't they?

>>740553556
But WRPGs aren't difficult. They're just social simulators for normalcattle.

>>740553784
change of heart obviously

>>740553556
>htemasxealve
Anon, did you have a stroke?

>>740545629
personally i think 3R is easier. i full cleared tartarus every month including the first one

>>740554469
It's a bot.

>>740544521
>dont have morgana on your team? LOL! You instantly lose because my main weakness is wind and only you and the cat can do that element!
P5 was such a fucking train wreck past the first palace.

>>740555163
(you) alone should be enough to basically solo the game nigga. It's piss easy.

>>740543938
persona games are basically visual novels my dude

>>740544029
I think Persona and SMT specifically originally the series that everyone looked to as more difficult than the rest of the genre

>>740555163
>anon when he realizes that consumables and ability accessories exist:

Hopefully it has harder difficulties unlocked right from the start

i really wish i could at least turn these new features off. i don't want to play on ultra baby mode i want to play PERSONA 4 as it originally was, none of the easy mode golden shit (except the things that make naoto not suck) either. i can't trust modern atlus to keep the visual style consistent with the original's and i can't trust them to not babify the gameplay. fuck this i'm just gonna play my ps2 copy again why do i even fucking care

>>740544709
>t. has played neither wizardry nor rogue, much less any of their near descendants
or are we gonna pretend that dungeon crawlers are ze only TRVE RPGs?

>>740544521
This post only applies to P5 vanilla. they knew it filtered out tards, so they made P5R easier

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>>740544029
It's really funny when persoyna fags tell you its the peak of the genre when the actual gameplay is all puddle deep garbage.

>>740560105
you can still play the real persona 4

>>740543938
>new option in a jrpg
>its only purpose is making the game easier
man Id fucking hate being a genuine jrpgfag.

>>740543938
P3 was a hard game made babby tier in the remake
P4 was already much easier than 3, this game will be a moviegame for subhumans

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>>740543938
>a fucking washing machine knob

>>740543938
I've only played p5 and p4 golden, in that order. I gotta say those games felt really similar

>>740564121
>bruv never seen the queens tele

>>740560863
I look like this and play like this

ill be honest the last time i play P4G i set it to very easy and just enjoyed the story and social links

>>740564121
it's kind of amazing how we've regressed back to P3's dogshit unintuitive menu wheel.

>>740543938
i already played the "hard mode" in the original p4 and p4g several times
i honestly don't give a shit about the difficulty this time
i am not nolifing the same stupid game again
just give me the damn new graphics and i'll coast by after arriving from work for a couple of hours

>>740564534
Not specifically to this anon (not sure that's what hes implying) but I really hate the dogshit argument of "the game is meant to be easy". Why the fuck are you making me play it then. Persona already has extremely barren story density for what ostensibly is a glorified VN, the story is good but you just don't have enough of it at all, and to make it worse half of your time is wasted with the boring dungeon crawling bullshit which the devs didn't even care about

>>740543938
Persona was never hard. Go play smt instead if you want actual difficulty

>>740564729
>story density
Is this a new morkism or something

>>740550351
Well people aren't playing Persona for the turn based gameplay. People shit and cried about P3R giving you a game over if the protagonist dies like that isn't a thing in every single atlus rpg

>>740543938
It's probably less impactful than Theurgies. Consider the following scenario:

>Max out all four gauges at once
>Everyone can unload all their Theurgies one after another
>Theurgies have bloated damage calculation, meaning they do substantially more damage than normal skills.
This isn't even the most optimal way to use Theurgies, but you CAN use them this way.

According to that Prime Time description, there's nothing suggesting that it amplifies the damage of the normal skills. It just ignores enemy resistances and skill costs. Using Primal Force four times is probably gonna do less damage than unleashing four Theurgies. It all really boils down to how big the damage of that "Series Finale" is. That's gonna be the deciding factor as to whether this is busted or not.

>>740564863
>people aren't playing [game] for [thing you do for 65% of the game]
This is why games suck dick now

>>740560863
any smt game would immediately filter persona players

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Are the character models healthy now or are we still stuck under stickfag tyranny?

>>740564901
It's why its one of the most popular turn based RPGs. These games hold your hand so much and are so simplified that it genuinely becomes boring when you understand the battle system somewhat well. But people still find this too hard somehow so Atlus will never let up on it

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>>740544106
My problem is I play Persona like it's SMT.

>>740543938
If you think it's bad now, most games will be outright catering to what were ipad kids in a few years
There will be no difficulty, room for confusion or need to critical thinking.

>>740565221
The kikes are to blame.

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>>740553556
>RPGs have literally always been "the casual game genre"
Nigger what the fuck are you smoking?

>>740565286
JRPGs at least have always been normalnigger core in Japan. DQ3 sold 3 million copies, SMT1 was Atlus' first big hit, etc.

>>740565014
i dont think you can name a more iconic duo than modders and autism
the venn diagram practically overlaps for games that looks like anime

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i see a lot of opinions here on hard JRPGS but no title drops.
what would be considered the quintessential must play?
I've heard SMT3 and DDS are ones worth looking into

>>740543938
prime time operates on a shared bar limit break. it's not usable 4 times in a row. depending on how freely brotag can switch personas this is a good thing that makes you think about party comp and experimenting to maximize damage as you progress. or use it to pick up/heal/reset the buff table. I'm much more interested in this than theurgies.

>>740565980
SMTV has the best gameplay and level design Atlus has ever produced but at the cost of story and character being awful and shallow. It's so bad you start feeling like the game's unfinished.

>>740566768
Silly storyfag. SMTV is the point.

>>740566434
It sounds even more broken than theurgies.

>>740566768
I've heard mixed things about SMTV which from what you described sounds like it's the story beats that people are complaining about
but hey if its fun ill check it out, thx

>>740545836
That's P5R thoughbeit, not P5

>>740560863
if you stun every enemy you just auto-win? What the fuck is this?

Thanatos and Arsene are cooler than Izanagi.

>>740566768
I mean most SMT games have shallow story and characters. Characters especially have always been bad because almost every character in every game is defined almost exclusively by a singular ideology.

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>>740567821
Lmao okay gaywad

>>740547890
>Yoshitsune
Explain

>>740543938
Not even close. P4 on release was embarrassingly easy. I always heard Golden made it even easier but I never bothered.

Do you think marie's dungeon will be a full blown DLC?

>>740570239
It won't. Shes part of the base game.

>>740570239
They already showed them in ski clothes

>>740560863
people who like persona like it as a dating sim. no-one likes the shitty dungeon crawling. There's a reason persona games sell like 10 million copies each and every other Atlus game with the same RPG mechanics but without the dating sim elements sell on average 1/10th that amount or less

it really is the case that 90% of people are there for the dating sim shit

I wish P6 just takes metaphor's system even further. Make certain press turn icons impart certain effects, etc.

>>740570549
Persona is just a babby spin-off though. The real meat comes from the SMT main entries.

>>740544908
funny I never lost. Because I baton pass all the time when I am grinding and enjoyed playing the game being low level so I would just super effect everything I could.

>>740571086
I enjoy the baton passes and all-out attacks. Do many people really just not use those mechanics? No wonder those dumbasses struggled with Okumura lol

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>>740560105
>i don't want to play on ultra baby mode i want to play PERSONA 4

>>740544029
Why are you playing video games when what you actually want is netflix?

>>740543938
Oh man. Reload was already way too easy too. What is going on in those devs heads? Persona 3 and 4 were pretty hard back in the day, and that's why I liked them.

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Will they nerf him?

>>740571242
Same. You can still keep the baton pass and other new features but that doesn't mean the game has to be made fucking easier. Just why? Who even wanted this?

>>740544151
You fucking said that about Marie, but there she is, shoved down your throat the moment you get off that train.

>>740571307
>Will they nerf him?
Qrd?

>>740566768
>It's so bad you start feeling like the game's unfinished.
It's very clearly rushed at the end, just like 4 was.

>>740571307
He does the same job in every game somebody at Fatlus really loves him.

>>740545629
Lategame 3FES there's you can OHKO every single fight with a demon combo attack that costs all your SP, but you just carry around a demon that fully restores your SP after every battle so now you have a skip button for every fight that doesn't ambush you.
I dunno if the remake kept that.

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>easiest difficulty
>guide open on phone describing what to do every day for max efficiency
Yup, it's Persona time

>>740544029
RPGs are meant to be Dice roll hard, not skill hard. (People who never played dnd before 5e, and only played 5e, try to argue against this but they're retards.)
The 4 niggas in a row genre is not meant to he hard, but they aren't RPGs.

>>740571372
Tower is Power, dude.

>>740571478
>aieeeeee I don't get to roleplay as my special snowflake OC and have to roleplay as a predefined character in a world so it's not an RPG reeeeeeee

>>740571505
no i meant i see Yoshitsune memes in Golden threads but I don't really get it. Is he that good in it?

>>740571372
>fuse Yoshitsune with apt pupil arms master and bunch of repels/drains he has gaps in
>spam hassou tobi
>win

>>740571456
It was kind of funny that my reward for busting my balls on the reaper was accidentally powerleveling myself to 90 by going through Monad once. Made the end a total joke even without armageddon.

>>740571590
Yeah he breaks the game in half

>>740571590
you could have just spent two seconds looking it up you know

>>740543938
>Multiple turns
>All skill costs are eliminated
>Enemy resistances are ignored
>Baton Pass is freely available

Good god. It's like a journalist mechanic. I guess you don't have to use it, but it sounds so fucking broken that it takes away any difficulty the game might have posed. They might as well have just given you 100% crit chance on top of it.

>>740571789
What do you think of the new English voice acting?

>>740571854
They should've kept Adachi's voice.

>>740571937
Rise and Naoto sounds the same.

>>740571984
Nah no chance Rise's voice is the same. Shes thinks shes too good for le anime now.

>>740572041
Wow, What a huge bitch.

>>740572041
Which one?

>>740572143
SF4 Chun li one and I thought was Kanji's VA who couldn't do anime games.

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>>740544709
Rogue isn't an RPG, it's a roguelike

>>740543938
Maybe play a real Sheen Megoomi Tensay gayme

>>740571854
Yosuke's voice sounds good...obviously different...but it fits. Yukiko is a bit off and Chie sounds alright, just not as high pitched as the original VA. Naoto sounds fine to me and so does Kanji, but they didn't have a lot of dialogue in the trailer, so it's a bit early to tell. Teddie's voice is also a bit too deep, but I guess it works. It'll take a bit of getting used to, but I think they all sound fine considering it's been almost 20 years since Persona 4 first launched on the PS2.

I think Yosuke's voice is a bit too deep, but it still sounds like him. Yosuke's original VA did a higher pitch/toned voice, and same for Chie, Teddie, and Yukiko. It's strange...like all the VA's were told to speak in a deeper tone? I'm not sure what the voice direction there was supposed to be.

There's no way they'll add a "Phys Amp" or "Crit Rate Amp" to this, right? Not with Hassou Tobi in the game.

>>740572370
Hassou Tobi was in P5 and P3 (afaik) and there were no issues there, tf you saying?

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>>740572358
I played SMT 3 SJ 4 4a and 5, now what?

>>740572370
only on the DLC personas

>>740572370
go look up what hassou tobi does in smt5 and guess

>>740543938
by 2027 all critical thinking skills will have evaporated thanks to ai

>>740572970
Hassou Tobi isn't as strong in SMT5.

Does it overrule immunities as well? That sounds busted af but I guess we need the Asmongold/Emiru crowd to stream this game.

>>740570549
>no-one likes the shitty dungeon crawling.
That's literally the only reason I ever played plebsona. It's also why Metaphor is a better game than any of them and I really hope we get a complete version of it with the Magick Akademy as a mega dungeon at some point.

>>740573795
Theurgies were even stronger than this in P3R and yeah, they did.

>>740573814
You are a tiny minority of the persona playerbase, as we can see from persona selling many multiples more than other Atlus games with the same gameplay

I don't really understand why people think this is special. In P3R, by the endgame, Theurgies can pretty much one-shot every boss except Nyx and Elizabeth.

>>740573905
But who even wanted Theurgies? Why add them? It just makes shit easier for no reason. You can still keep the baton pass and other stuff.

>>740573936
Theurgies in P3R were just another way of limiting Fusion Skills without nerfing them too much. They just gave them to everyone else too.

>>740572367
>Be bored
>Looks up what the old cast are doing now.
> Chie's Golden VA is a pink hair Pansexual She/them pronouns.

>>740573936
they wanted to advertise some kind of selling point and have flashy animations to show in 30 second trailers. the impact on the game itself wasn't considered

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Theurgies were cool
>mfw the dead broad shows up in Junpei's endgame Theurgie

>>740574004
Chiebros have it rough

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>>740572367
Yosuke in Japanese has a notably deeper tone, so I think that's what they tried to go for with his new English voice. Chie also sounds considerably more bearable compared to her previous VA.

>>740574203
Idk the banshee voice felt fitting for her

>>740574203
Teddie's original voice was super cutesy and high pitched. I liked it and I felt like it fit his character. He has a deeper voice this time...

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I already miss Donatello Teddie...

>>740574323
Nah, fuck that. He was way too annoying.

>>740574358
He was the perfect amount of annoying

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>>740574187
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WAefGu7EIOk

>>740544521
how? I played royal on the hardest mode and it was a cakewalk

>>740544029
Expedition showed they dont have to be mind numbingly brain dead at least.

>>740572412
Play 1, 2 and if... ofcourse

>>740574323
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mG6dKahjXe0
The golden VA did a good job.

>>740574386
Morgana's voice was at least kinda hot, Teddie was too screechy

>>740545603
Play your second game

>>740570130
Hassou Tobi is a skill he comes with built-in that hits all enemies 8 times. Not up to 8 times, always 8 times.
The joke is that pattern in the apple slicer there is the effect the move makes on the ground

Physical has been busted in nearly every megaten from 3 maniax on, with the only real exception being SJ. It will be busted again. This is just business as usual.

>>740572412
Play Giten and NINE.

>>740574203
>>740572367
new chie seems like it's going to try to be a lot closer to japanese chie than golden chie

golden chie spends the whole game acting like a dumbass headless chicken, wheras the Japanese Chie spent almost the entire game playing the tsukkomi straight-man role pointing out how retarded everyone else is. I get the feeling people used to the golden dub are going to get whiplash from how different her characterisation will be

>>740574478
That's the OG Chie voice though.

>>740575205
I know, But it's funny.

>>740560473
Do you want to see my copy of Wizardry I+II+III the Story of Llylgamyn on the SNES?
I suppose you'd just say I hadn't actually played it. Or it doesn't count because it's not the Apple II version.

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>niggers in the thread talking about English VAs

>>740575451
Based for properly stepping up (without buzzwords), but arguing from the position of
>That was one defining features of the genre at its conception
and bringing up Rogue while you're at it is a low WIS position. Even disregarding the fact that "difficulty" was a very different beast back when Wizardry was the new hotness and is in the eye of the beholder in general, the genre has spun out into different directions of its own over 30 years ago. To the point that we still see braindead arguments about warpigs and jarpigs as if one is the true heir and the other is false pretender. If you are interested in a zero-story turn-based dungeon crawling and then only say you want to play an RPG, you are simply not getting your idea across in any useful manner. Specifically: you are citing foreign principles out of nominal relation between modern Persona games and the granddaddy of all vidya RPGs. As if being btfo'd by a new type of encounter in the endgame means the same across every kind of game.
None of that was value judgement btw. But you can either deal with the current realities, or rage against the dying of the lightlike Berlin interpretation prescriptioninsts.

>>740575667
>bro japanese is so much better!
>literally can't understand what the fuck they're saying
kys dumb weeb

>>740544908
Yes because It’s terribly designed in Royal to the point the fight is actually easier on merciless.
Fatlus couldn’t get the space port right in either version.