>>740900887
Every parryslop game is shit

From sucks at rpg systems so no wonder this and bloodborne are the best games they've made (KF4 and AC4A as well but for different reasons)

>>740900887
What's your problem with it? Maybe it just hasn't clicked yet for you.

>>740900887
Why does everyone ignore enemies and just run straight to bosses?

>>740900887
filtered baby niggerfaggot

CLANK CLANK CLANK CLANK CLANK CLANK CLANK CLANK

>>740900887
nah, it's really good actually

>>740900887
So why don't you make a thread about what you like instead, faggot?

>>740900887
Why didn't they make a sequel?

>>740900887
>when fighting human enemies, keep attacking until they parry you (notice the difference between them blocking your attacks and them parrying)
>when they parry you, parry their next attack and then go back to attacking
>mikiri on perilous thrust attacks
>jump on perilous sweep attacks
>dodge of perilous grab attacks
>stick to dodging when fighting beast-like enemies
literally all you need to know for this game

>>740901862
oh right and lightning reversal
>jump
>get hit by lightning
>attack back before you touch the ground

>>740900887
i loved it, i love parry slop. it's fun and cool.

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He hesitates

>>740901125
Zoomers gonna zoom. I hate it too.

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>>740900887
It really really truly does in literally every way. I've always been a hater but I actually forgot how bad the game is when a friend was playing it for the first time and then I decided to boot it up again myself and I was quickly reminded just how shit it truly is.

There is literally nothing appealing about this game and the only reason it was every propped up is because it was "le HARD!!!!" when the difficulty entire comes down to playing an obtuse rhythm game. It is literally wholeheartedly and unironically artificial difficulty.

>>740902428
>artificial difficulty
Its not even hard dude

I hated it too until I forced myself to engage with the mechanics and realized I was playing the game wrong.

>>740902428
Every action game is a rhythm game. Please post one that isn't.

>>740900887
Defeat sword saint isshin before posting about this game you fucking casual

>>740901125
because fromsoft makes regular enemies almost as annoying as boss fights except there's 5 coming at you at once so why bother

>>740902494
That doesn't refute the claim that it's artificially difficulty.

>>740902537
Every single one that doesn't follow in Sekiros parryslop footsteps. Even dark souls itself is less of a rhythm game because the player has real choices when it comes to defense...until the later games when they made rolls too good, even still players can create builds that get around having to spam roll on defense

>>740902782
im not really sure what felt like artificial difficulty to me, other than chained ogre grab hitbox, not knowing about puppeteer ninjutsu at snake cave, etc.

>>740902782
>less of
Oh, so you hit the defence button every time they attack but you get to choose between easy "shield" medium "rolling" and hard "Perfect spacing". Unless you're playing DeS and DS1, in which case you just hold left or right and strafe in a circle where they can't hit you. All you're bragging about is that some of your games are too shitty to ever have to interact.

>>740900887
>be OP
>make a thread about the best FROM game
>call it shit and refuse to elaborate as a way to farm engagement
Very based thread thanks /v/

>gets filtered
>goes to the corner of the cafeteria where all the rejects sit
>searches for validation with all the losers who will froth at the chance to express themselves the only way such broken people know how: destruction

Yeah, whatever, here is your "you." Construct a massive pylon and take a seat on top of your new toy.

>>740903150
The use of artificial difficulty is clear. The player does not have the means to understand and properly fight the boss without use of trial and error.

Artificial difficulty is when the enemy goes for a fast string of attacks that you have no way of intuitive reacting to, you only know he does that fast chain of attacks after trial and error. This is the crux of every single boss outside of beasts to some extent. You can not use instincts and pure reactions to win in sekiro, winning only comes from beating your head against a wall until you've seen every attack a boss has and then learning the timing to parry it properly.

To go back to the rhythm game example. On normal difficulty for a rhythm game, you're typically giving ample time to see the notes coming up and properly react and time each of the necessary buttons.
Now imagine a rhythm game that only has one button and instead of showing you a precise location of where the note is on the bar, it instead gives a long period and the player has to guess where the right timing to parry is. That is artificial difficulty.

It's worth pointing out because classic souls did not have this issue. The games all had fair telegraphs that give attentive players the ability to instinctually react to these attacks. While they're heralded as "difficult games" back then, realistically there's nothing unfair or artifical about most bosses and I mean most, there's definitely some bad design among those games but the foundation of the game isn't build on the idea of being artificially difficult.

>>740903319
Those are still choices and if we really want to argue about parrying vs rolling we can have that argument. It's very easy to point out how dodge/rolling has more depth than parryslop.

>>740903918
by the time you understand mikiri counter the only thing that should actively tell you to fuck off from a boss is terror like headless and shichimen warrior. otherwise the game is way too linear the power creep way too negligible to get walled anywhere.

i didnt read anything more than your first two sentences.

>>740904050
Never said there was a wall, never said the game was too hard. You have said nothing that refutes anything I said.

>>740903918
No, it really isn't.
>enemy swings
>hit the roll button to dodge it
>or hit the block button to parry it
Wow such depth. "Choices" between which rhythm you want to commit to doesn't suddenly make the game not a rhythm game.

>>740904221
i got it, you want every bosses strings to play out like hopscotch, well stellar blade story mode is the answer for you then

>>740903918
>the difficulty is artificial because the player is too stupid to understand that the tools the game outlined in the tutorial are the tools you use
As for the intrinsic trial and error of learning attack timings, yeah. That's every single action game, again. I don't think you like action games.

>>740900887
>>740901121
Highest lows, and lowest highs. The game doesn't let you make much of it, the few tools and techniques available don't allow you to experiment or build any kind of character. Just a general lack of variety.

It's also just insulting that Sekiro is the best blocker in the From games when you get your shit slapped for blocking with a buckler, a completely ordinary strong usable shield.

>>740904313
now see, i think shield gameplay in elden ring is so unapologetically shit i wonder why theyre in the game at all.

but why does that make sekiro bad?

>>740901148
This convinced me to reinstall

>>740904313
Yeah, I love build variety in souls games. Do I
>roll three times and attack twice with a straight sword for 540 damage
>roll three times and attack four times with dual wielded katanas for 800 damage
>roll three times and jump attack twice with a hammer for 1000 damage
>roll three times and cast a single spell for 800 damage
>roll three times and cast a single miracle for 600 damage
I fucking LOVE variety

>>740904595
basado

at least in dark souls 2 ive been sword and board faraammaxxing with path tracing, proper dungeon crawler that one

>>740904595
I’m a 3 but sometimes with a sprinkle of 5

>>740904238
Thanks for showing me how retarded you are immediately.

A dodge requires spacing, timing, and has the choice of direction. A parry is a parry, your only choice is to time it correctly.
Spacing, timing, and direction of a dodge are all choices and they're all contextual and dynamic and it gives the players ways to express themselves. You could say that the choice is always to dodge this move this way but that assumes you're always in the optimal position and it does not account for the players choice of weapon and build. For example a spellcaster might want to get away from the boss to give more time to cast a spell while a fast attack might want to dodge behind to get quick hits in etc. There is real meaningful choices to be made that are not obvious and players will do it differently depending on what type of build they have as well.
A parry removes all of this, it is always the best option and there is almost never a reason to choose something else.

>>740904282
Stellar Blade is literally just Sekiro in terms of it's parry and plenty of bosses fall into the same artificial difficulty trap.

>>740904309
Who are you quoting, not even remotely what I said.
>That's every single action game, again.
No it isn't and I literally gave you a very easy, obvious example of a game that isn't. You're either stupid or just being disingenous at this point.

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>>740904402
I'm just kinda mad they went all in on blocking in Sekiro of all things. Meanwhile the things Ninjas are actually known for, their weapon and tool preparation is shit in Sekiro. At least Ni-oh let's you throw caltrops. If From made another focused single character archtype kind of game, I want them to do a cleric instead, or a Rapier and dagger guy. Ninjas and Samurai are hella played out.

>>740904918
>spacing
No, iframes. Still, you have to space correctly for a parry.
>timing
Yes,like parrying
>and has a choice of direction
The best direction is into the boss. There are a handful of attacks across the entirety of the souls games where the move isn't just to roll into the fucking boss, and that includes in Elden Ring where a small number of attacks are best jumped (like how sekiro does it)
Also
>classic souls games did not have the trial and error
You're confusing "Slower, easier strings" with "Not having trial and error" anon.

>>740904595
If I'm feeling fancy I might even strafe too

>>740904987
Just spam R1.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EANgXgh1yPw

>>740900887
PCissy can't parry lel

>>740904918
>A dodge requires spacing, timing, and has the choice of direction. A parry is a parry, your only choice is to time it correctly.
You can still dodge in Sekiro, you just don't get a billion free iframes on it so you have to actually practice good spacing and be mindful of your positioning
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6FoUPIgrVEc

>>740900887
It's a fucking masterpiece, but all the retards who immediately agreed and started bargaining with you to fit in are the real problem, they're fucking subhuman.

>>740901125
Maybe stop watching speedruns, you numpty.
>>740901862
This strategy does not work at all with 75% of the enemies. Stop judging games from watching them on youtube, you sound mentally disabled.

>>740905123
There is literally no spacing involved with parry. Literally none. If the attack can hit you, you can parry it.
>timing Yes,like parrying
The difference is that it's very lenient but offers different rewards. In a parry game like sekiro, there is no meaningful reward in parrying soon or later, if it's within the window frame the reward is always the same while dodging an attack later can give you more time for a new opening or dodging too slow can have you dodge that attack but might make you vulnerable to a follow up. But again because it's not a binary you either do or you don't, there's expression.
>The best direction is into the boss
This is absolutely not universal at all and I don't even know how you can try to make a claim like that and it again ignores what I said. How you dodge is a matter of build, skill expression, and context i.e. needing to heal or especially in fights against multiple enemies creating space so you don't get trapped into a corner or something.
>You're confusing "Slower, easier strings" with "Not having trial and error" anon.
Nope. Intuitive telegraphs vs unintuitive trial and error attacks. I didn't mention it but another thing that is artificially difficult is purposefully, unnaturally delayed attacks that are designed to trick your brain. This isn't as much of a Sekiro problem as it is an Elden Ring problem so I didn't bother pointing it out.
Older souls games are not made to be hard and they aren't complex as far as combat goes. They were punishing but they were fair. A game like Sekiro is trying to be "hard" and the only way fromsoft knows how to make a "hard" game is to add artificial difficulty that does everything it can to trick the player and punish them for things they have no way to know about or react to. It's cheap, it's not fun, and there are better games that both give the players a lot of tools to play around with while still retaining difficult bosses without resorting to cheap tactics

Sekiro is probably the best ninja game ever made.

So many of you just suck at videogames. So many of you just suck homeless penis.

The game is up there on my list with Ninja Gaiden Black. If you hate it, you got filtered. Go back to Minecraft or Stardew like the fucking casual you are.

GOTY!GOTY!GOTY!GOTY!GOTY!

>>740907546
>Sekiro is probably the best ninja game ever made.
nah that's Tenchu: Stealth Assassins

>>740902778
Than and enemies hit you for a fuck ton of damage. From needs to stop making regular enemies kill you in 2 hits. I want a challenge but not bullshit challenging like this.

>>740907898
I actually heard it was Tenchu: Wrath of Heaven.

>>740907017
>This strategy does not work at all with 75% of the enemies
anon he's literally just describing the combat, that's not a strategy. it works on 100% of every enemy besides ghosts that require confetti, because again, that's literally just a description of the game.

>>740900887
something about the kind of focus sekiro demands made it kind of just...vaguely unpleasant for me to play. i beat it but it never became satisfying. beating a tough boss always felt like i was kind of slopping my way through it, rather than locking into a satisfying flow state ala souls games. the miniboss encounters are tedious, and feel like they expect the player to cheese them to get the opening cheeky backstab. i didn't get "filtered" or whatever but i really feel like they failed to figure out what's supposed to be fun about it

>>740908293
ive found that every criticism ive seen is something you could levy at elden ring and its actually those faggots who are going backwards and getting filtered by this game.

>>740908370
>the miniboss encounters are tedious,
The worst thing about minibosses is that if you die, then you have to spend a ton of time making sure you kill all the nearby enemies again before engaging the miniboss.

>>740908405
i dont think the previous anon was criticizing on sekiro, just offering OP advice to improve his shitter attitude

>>740908505
the anon who was talking about 'strategy' (i.e the base combat flow of sekiro) not working on 75% of enemies is completely wrong. it works on 100% of enemies. i was replying to the anon i did to suggest that this is actually a reverse conundrum of people who played elden ring and either respecced or used an omni tool to get past most encounters, and in sekiro if you cant into the flow it would seem bad that you cant just mash attack and deflect on every single enemy as an elden ring player

The tools and combat arts are OP and fun but for some reason Sekiro players don't use them. Very strange.

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Beat SS Isshin on NG+ with 7 healing gourds left, god I love this fucking game so much. High Monk and the Flame umbrella completely fucking rape him, it's awesome.

>>740910027
>High Monk and the Flame umbrella completely fucking rape him, it's awesome.
How did you use them on him? High Monk for the perilous sweep and umbrella for the jump slam?

Ongbal is crazy, bros. How does he do it?

>>740910027
Too bad umbrella takes chip damage when playing charmless. It's not like it was that strong to begin with, unnecessary nerf. It should have been the only way to block without losing HP on charmless.

>>740910706
Parrying with the umbrella negates chip damage.

>>740910816
Yeah, but parrying with anything negates chip damage.

>>740910916
Because the umbrella is too OP with Kuro's charm.

>>740910389
>bro how does he practice a million times to time parries

>>740900887
Its the only game where deflect actually feels like a core mechanic the combat and enemies are designed around. Too many souls-likes incorporate deflect without actually designing the combat for it, so it ends up encouraging the player to be play less aggressively rather than more.

>>740904313
so did you actually beat sword saint isshin or are you just babyraging cause you're having trouble parrying and blaming the game

>>740911229
play more games

>>740911721
You first

>>740904313
>don't allow you to experiment or build any kind of character
it's like the game is not about making your original character but playing as one. Ever thought about that?

>>740911946
played more than you

Game does a good job at feeling impossible to beat. Developers didn't play into this idea and instead chose the route of a protagonist with spider-man like abilities and magic.

>>740912228
Oh yeah? Name 10 books

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>>740911229
>deflect actually feels like a core mechanic the combat and enemies are designed around
and that's a bad thing, especially with sekiro being a half-baked game. mgr did parrying better

Don't spam attack or dodge. I think a lot of people struggling with this game get stuck in attack or dodge animations and wonder why they can't parry anything. This is the most important tip in the game. Trust me, I'm a Sekiro expert.

>>740901862
>when fighting human enemies, keep attacking until they parry you
More accurately, you should attack until the point where you can still react to the enemy's counter-attack, which is usually but not always when they parry you.

>>740912484
>Designing a game with mechanics in mind is a bad thing now.

>>740900887
One of the top 5 best games ever made.

>>740900887
>He hesitated.

>>740903918
>The player does not have the means to understand and properly fight the boss without use of trial and error.
Doesn't apply to Sekiro.

>>740902428
>>740903918
you can just say you suck at rhythm games and leave it at that, didn't need a whole paragraph of cope

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>>740913041
>>740913194

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>>740911302
I indeed beat him and the Demon Sculpter. They were the only real challenges in the game for me after Chained Ogre learning hurdles. Loads of bosses I beat first try. I didn't find the game hard, or even bad, just sorta basic and I've had no interest to revisit it because there's no real goals you can set or different ways to play the game. I would have played a DLC if they made one.
>>740912171
Yeah, but Sekiro as a character you play as is about as deep as a puddle and all of his options are very limited expendables and almost scripted interactions. There's no toys in the playbox. That goofy Archthrones mod steals liberally from Sekiro and it's more fun to fight the same enemies reskinned in that because your approaches and how you are threatened are completely different depending on your character.

>>740913284
Gitgud

>>740900887
It's a better game overall than the rest of the Souls/ER games. You are just a tasteless slob.

>>740913691
>Yeah, but Sekiro as a character you play as is about as deep as a puddle and all of his options are very limited expendables and almost scripted interactions. There's no toys in the playbox.
Yeah, that's why Super Mario Mario sucks so bad: there's no depth to the moveset, all you do is run and jump and shoot fireballs.

I feel like 90s kids like this game the most because of it's "bop it,twist it, pull it" gameplay.

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Most people don't make it past Genichiro

>>740913691
I feel like you have some odd expectations for the game instead of enjoying it for the experience it offers but I'm sorry you didn't enjoy some parts of it or w/e. i don't really feel like it needed more variation or a need to introduce new mechanics, it would have messed with the balance and strayed away from the core mechanics it forces you to master. but that's my interpretation, you're free to see it as a one-trick pony if that's how it feels to you

>>740913910
fromdrones are so dishonest

>>740913910
I suppose that's why I don't still play Mario. It doesn't have that ADVENTURER mindset. For a guy with a grappling hook, Sekiro sure has really boring automatically resolved platforming. They should have put more music note blocks to bounce him around and tumble into those little piranha plants that nip at you.

>>740913987
Actually love this guy. I call him Genichiro the Jobber. His consistent weakness is one of my favorite things about the game.. Actually I've spent some time explaining Sekiro's shortcomings in this thread, but the story is actually really good for Fromsoft.

>>740913987
I erased& quit the game at least 4 times because of Guardian Ape and Genichiro.
It eventually clicked and now the game is trivial.

>>740914280
The grappling hook exists specifically so they don't have to think about level design, it's really funny. Instead of having to consider how levels connect they just copy and pasta a tree next to a wall or mountain and call it a day lol.

>>740904238
Video games have a lot of abstraction in regards to their gameplay in order to feel like they are more than what they actually are (extremely simple, especially single player games). In my opinion a game that markets itself as a hardcore action title needs to feel like you're actually fighting enemies and not just playing a rhythm game. It doesn't mean that such a game is better or more complex, but it at least does a good job with feeling like you're doing more than qtes

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>I'm bad at video games and here is a novel about why it is your problem

>>740900887
filtered by the ogre

>/v/ complains about actual engaging combat with parries and dodges
>doesn't complain about incredibly awful dogshit combat in games like TW3/Skyrim
Hmmm.....

Hmmmmmmmmm.............very interesting......

>>740913284
When you see the character swing their arms back to prepare a swing, that's them telegraphing.
When you see the glowing symbols, that's them telegraphing.

There was no need for anyone to argue with you about this, the game gives you symbols to tell you what to do, and even then, you can just dodge.

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zoomers sure do have low standards, or am i just old?

guardian ape is kino
i love getting farted on and having poopoo thrown at me
>>740914562
sekiro is a combat focused game, it's not a platformer. do you also play puzzle games and question why there's no cinematic cutscenes? these are such odd complaints you people have

>>740900887
FUCK HEADLESS
FUCK SHICHIMEN WARRIOR
FUCK ISSHIN
FUCK OWL (FATHER)
FUCK DEMON OF HATRED
FUCK ISSHIN SWORD SAINT

>>740914661
look at all the zoomers praising the piece of shit game in the op

>>740914680
If sekiro was purely a combat focused game it wouldn't have the mindless stealth sections or rpg mechanics or an open world or actually the grappling hook at all because it has almost no use in combat outside of the like 3 or 4 boss fights where you use it to avoid some attacks.

>>740914463
what, the fact that he pulls out his bow while youre in his face and lets you destroy him for free?

>>740914626
Everyone knows TW3 and Skyrim have shit combat, there's no discussion to be had from pointing it out.

>>740914680
Sekiro should just be a normal Ashigariu/Samurai then and not a Ninja.

>>740914653
Telegraphing attacks is fair but most bosses in Sekiro have attacks that have a startup move which might be telegraphed but then many moves in their attack string won't have telegraphs, the only way to know how to parry them is trial and error. It is purposefully unfair and also an extremely lazy way to make a game "difficult"

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>>740914787
I'm just saying platforming is not even remotely one of the points of the game.
also are you seriously questioning if Sekiro is a combat focused game?
>If sekiro was purely a combat focused game
It is, point blank. It's allowed to have other mechanics like stealth. But platforming is nowhere in the list, nobody agrees that's the point of the game. that's just you wanting it to have that. go play a platformer then if you want that, you're literally playing the wrong game for your own preferences, I don't get why you're playing Sekiro if you don't want heavy combat-centric gameplay

>>740914910
you have the reflexes of a baby with MS

>>740914935
I'm not the original person who said it should have platforming, I was pointing out how they lazily use the grapple points to avoid real level design. Ya know, something fromsoft used to be praised for? It's just funny to see how low they've fallen

>>740914984
refer to >>740913284

>>740914804
And the relying on heretical lightning when he loses. Then running away and coming back later with a legendary sword only to kill himself with it and trying to get his grandpa to do the job. Isshin and Emma were really the only ones holding Ashina together, weren't they?

>>740914910
Fortunately you can just hold block to learn the combos, and then deflect them when you feel comfortable

>>740913284
I look really handsome in this

>>740901862
This is correct. Sekiro isn't just about the 'Ping' or parrying. Sure you could just stand there and Ping away, but you lose valuable time this way. There is a 'Pong' element in the game, that is you need to be offensive and aggresive as well, pummelling strikes on the enemy. Every enemy is unique but you could 'Pong' away at them for certain counts, so essentially you overwhelm them with barrage of strikes UNTIL they RETALIATE, that is until the PARRY YOU. So really it's just a fucking dance of back and forth Ping-Pongs.

It isn't all about you dodging and parrying, you need to sneak attacks in, and figure out how far in can you go with the offense before they retaliate and you back to parrying/dodging. This is the optimal way of running them down quickly.

Also, the more damage you do to them, the lower their HP pool gets. The lower your HP, the quicker the Posture/Poise bar builds up, and the longer it stays built up (like fatigue). This is basic, but some enemies has different ratio where they might have higher HP than posture or vice versa, where you couldn't just rely on parrying to break their posture. You have to whittle their HP down too, so they break posture quickly.

Those one-armed tall purple Shinobis are my favorite enemy to learn the ping-pong 'dance' exchange. You master this one enemy type, you get the "click".

>>740915181
No, seriously, you should stick to games that have journalist difficulty. I think you would be much happier.

>>740915360
One thing that's always baffled me is when I watch other people fight Genichiro, they always deflect his jump attack, but for me I always do a dodge attack and he always takes the hit. It's really obvious!

Sekiro has two major design problems that are inarguable:
1. No builds. Every playthrough of Sekiro is the same as every other playthrough of Sekiro. Out of all From games, it has the worst replayability by far.
2. The levels before the boss don't teach you to fight the boss. In normal Souls games you fight bosses and normal enemies exactly the same way. In Sekiro, if you're playing the levels well, you never fight the normal enemies at all, instead avoiding or stealth-killing all of them. But then you find a boss, and suddenly have no fucking idea what to do because the normal enemies don't teach you how to fight.

>>740900887
Beat Sword Saint a couple of days ago. My main problem with the game is how often it throws you into situations that the game is fundamentally not designed for. It's supposed to be a parry-centric action game, yet nearly all enemy areas end up too crowded and full of ranged enemies for a pleasant fight, nearly all miniboss encounters feature either a fuckton of mobs that demand a stealth section of killing them before each honest attempt at the miniboss OR a gimmick that supercedes deflecting, and more than half of the bosses in the game are 'gimmick bosses' that actively shit on you for relying on your deflect.
It got to a point where I was wondering if the developers simply hated the player, because never before have I seen a game so spiteful of its central mechanic. It is no wonder people's favorite bosses are Genichiro, Isshin and True Monk, because those are truly the only salvageable bosses in the game.
Owl Father kills you with shoddy camera and a bad arena more than anything, both ape fights + Demon of Hatred are either partially or fully Dark Souls bosses that you're better off dodging against. Honorable mentions to Shinobi Owl and Gyoubu I guess, although easy they at least reward usage of the game's best and most fun mechanic.

>>740915085
I actuallly agree on the level design being bland.
And I did feel the combat was a little shallow even if challenging, but that's true of all the Souls games so there's no reason to single Sekiro out.

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>>740915379
You know nothing, child. fromdrones never have the ability to argue against real criticism. They either try the "le git gud" argument or they intentionally misinterpret criticisms.

I beat Sekiro, I beat every souls game. I beat every team ninja game including all of the ninja gaidens and at least beat NG1 on master ninja, i've beaten god hand on hard mode, PP Bayo 1 on NSIC.

Sekiro is not a difficult game, it is not complex, it does not give the player many meaningful options. The entire games combat boils down to mash mash mash > enemy deflects > parry parry parry rinse and repeat. The only exception are beasts, where it's generally better to dodge and you get more use out of subweapons for raw damage. The only boss that doesn't follow this pattern off the top of my head are both versions of Owl, the only enjoyable boss in the game specifically because he breaks the design mold. The only reason people latch onto Sekiro is because they're not good enough to tackle actual action games and try to pretend that Sekiro is the hardest game ever made and they're special for beating it.

Fromsoftware has falling so far down the to rock bottom specifically because they believe people only play their games because they're difficult so that's what they focus on instead and their idea of difficulty is lazy trial-and-error design. This is at it's worse in Elden Ring but Sekiro is really what started it.

>>740913284
I didn't tell you to get good. I simply told you that trial and error isn't needed in Sekiro.

SKILL. ISSUE. FAGGOT.

>>740916004
It is though, enemies later on start demanding perfect deflects or else you get chipped through and/or inflicted with a status. There is no way on earth someone could first try Isshin Sword Saint, because no amount of observing from a distance or blocking will learn you the timing windows before you've been chipped down to an unwinnable amount of gourds.

There're other versions of this throughout the game, such as Owl's mikiri counter being a guaranteed one-shot unless you are at full health and max beads for the level of progression, the Headless Ape's terror howl being a one-shot from the front if you don't back off, the Demon of Hatred's fireball volley being a death sentence if you dash forward during it (he always aims ahead of you), etc.

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>>740915662
>2.
It's like that in Armored Core 6 as well.The three domains of combat, enemies, bosses, and AC duels are all completely incongruous with eachother, with only bosses providing any challenge until ganksfights, and the rules are different for all of them. Game is kinda disappointing when you're not fighting the epic boss.

>>740916260
A boss not being defeatable on the first try doesn't mean that the game requires trial and error. If that were the case, every game ever made would be trial and error.

>>740915360
The irony is that this creates and unhealthy loop.

When you mash against the enemy in their face, they'll do one of 2 things, they'll either do an attack and get interrupted by your attack or they'll deflect. When they deflect, they have a limited number of follow up attacks compared to their full moveset and if you keep mashing even after deflect, you can interrupt some of those follow ups depending on the boss. This creates a super simple loop that just wrecks most bosses. Not enough of them make space for themselves to get them out of this loop. Isshin and Owl are like one of the few examples I can remember where this isn't an easy loop

>>740916690
What? That is what trial and error means. There are harder games out there with bosses that can be reasonably beat on a first try, because the skill required to beat it is something you've built throughout the game (and presumably past games of its type) and not something you must learn for each boss. Sekiro is just too full of the later, which is a valid criticism. You can still find the process fun, it is fun to die to Sword Saint Isshin until you get the muscle memory to parry his attacks and it 'clicks', but that's still trial and error baked into the game. Its even the namesake of the game.

>>740900887
>parryslop

>>740904595
Based, funny buildtrannies and arpgfags ignored this post

>>740900887
I have almost 5-600 hours in every FROM game from demons souls to elden ring. I beat sekiro once with about 50 hours gameplay and have had literally 0 desire to ever replay it since it came out. Still a great game though just no replay value for me

>>740915662
>major design problems
>no builds
This is like saying Thief has a major design problem because you can't build your character like in Deus Ex.

Sekiro was true start of the bosses having way more fun and complex movesets than the player's own ability.

>>740918010
dark souls 3 released way before that

>>740917667
Every game that's not Deus Ex has a major design problem of not being Deus Ex.

>>740918254
bloodborne says hello

>>740900887
the second phase of the ape boss made me seethe

>>740900887
Sekiro is the influencial video game every made
Before sekiro every game combat were deep as puddle but sekiro changes everything

>>740918381
Bloodborne actually did flesh out your moveset more than the other games though, and its bosses are still pretty tame compared to what came later.

>>740900887
No u.

>>740904595
Why are you shitting on soulslop when sekiro literally share the same gameplay design

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>>740918381
Bloodborne was the last traditional game of Fromsoft, with bosses, enemies, and players being much closer together in ability and method.. Dark Souls 3 started the bossrush period of Fromsoft

>>740918621
Arguably it started in The Old Hunters. Some of the enemies in the DLC are pure cancer to fight, like the shark giants and the giant clocktower patients.

>>740918587
because he wants to feel super special for liking sekiro

>>740918517
>>740918621
dark souls 3 bosses kindve job besides midir and his ungodly health pool

>>740907546
That's what sucks the most about Sekiro, it's entirely themed around being a ninja until you get to the boss fights at which point your best strategy is to let a giant samurai twice your size whale on you until he gets tired. You're not a real ninja, you're a fucking punching bag

>>740913284
But did you in fact git gud?

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>>740918754
In my view, it's not the bosses at fault, but the rest of the game falling behind. Dark Souls 3 player is quite nerfed, even compared to 2 and they took away every new move and improvement 2 and Bloodborne made. They went back to Demon's Souls level of basics, but even that game had much more competent magic casting and spells.

Also there's no real tough roadblocks or surprises in the game, except maybe frosty Outrider Knights and Pus of Man. The enemies actually become more basic.

One weird quirk about Dark Souls 2 is that there is at least one enemy type that uses every weapon type in the game. There's also lot's spell casters and tricky NPC invaders. They are rare and hard to find in Dark Souls 3.

>>740919423
dark souls 3s npcs mostly suck too, until you get to lothric castle, and even then. i think the only npc enemy in dark souls 3 that made me go 'what the fuck' was the one knight at the end of ashes of ariandel, at the backdoor of the painting building or whatever. been too long since i completed that one

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>2019+7+Tariffs+Tip
>parrylets are STILL filtered by the GOTY
How does Sekiro do it?

>>740919423
>In my view, it's not the bosses at fault, but the rest of the game falling behind.
It's both. Keeping the player weak would be fine if the rest of the game stayed the same. Making the bosses more capable would be fine if they boosted the player's abilities too.

>>740919049
And it's thematically accurate, retard. Ever heard of the meme, "lore accurate Sekiro"? The OG Sekiro was the peak Shinobi. Not our Sekiro. The Sekiro we play as, is a broken failure. Mindbroken from being amnesiac, from having that giant burning pillar crushing down his temple. And broken spiritually too, from failing his code and honor, his objective as a shinobi/guardian. Failed to protect both Kuro and his Owl Father. That's why he shut himself off the world, rotting in the hole, in the fucking gutter, holllowing day in and out. When Emma threw the letter down the well to him, that kinda give him a little push, a last effort to save whatever humanity left in him. A little glint of life, glimpse of hope to keep going forward living, another purpose to life, protecting Kuro, yet again. So the beggining of the game, we're kinda given a clean slate to our Player Character. That is not peak Sekiro. That is a buckbroken Sekiro that has to relearn every fucking thing back from scratch. It's the reason why we're seeing Remnants or shadow memories / flashes of Kuro around the place. It's the reason why his Hirata night memories are muddled and fuddled, because he has amnesia. It's the reason why it's not bonfire but fucking prayer statue / idols that's scattered everywhere. Everytime you use the idol Sekiro is simply sitting down, meditating there to recollect the 'true' memory out of all the infinite 'faux' memories - that were OUR COUNTLESS ATTEMPTS OF RESETTING THE INSTANCE OVER AND OVER TRYING TO EXPLORE OR DYING TO THE ENEMIES in certain places.

>>740919802
>Making the bosses more capable would be fine if they boosted the player's abilities too.
man if only there were some arpgs that actually did that

>>740919870
very brown coded post lmao

>>740915913
mad cuz bad
not reading you left wing meme

>>740900887
I thought as much as well until I stopped playing it like it was dark souls
the manor being a rather huge difficulty spike that you can wander aimlessly in soon after start didn't help either, but it's ultimately an early skill check, same with genichiro

>>740919712
All of the issues with the game stem from it not being enough of a parry simulator, so this post really confuses me. I got through the game just fine, but the segments that were not built around the core gameplay of deflecting and striking back felt sloppy as fuck. It was like getting transported from a game that was the best in the market at something to some random indieshit unreal engine slop every time the game wanted me to do something other than parry and counter-attack.

To be clear, Sekiro does one thing well, and that is its 'dance' of parrying, mikiri'ing and jump-kicking while weaving in attacks. Every time this was not a reliable solution to a segment (i.e. gank fights, where you get stuck in your attack animation, and cannot parry behind you) the game felt like dogshit to play.

>>740919870
A """""lore-accurate""""" Sekiro. The true OG Sekiro, would've stayed loyal to Owl Father at all times. That means he's part of the betraying invasion group. That means he would side with Owl. That also means the Shura ending is canonically accurate to the true Sekiro. Since this Sekiro is so fucking PEAK, he would've melted all the enemies and bosses and thus never had the Dragon immortality shit from Kuro.

This also explains why "our cannon" Sekiro would side with Kuro, because;
1- Sekiro fucking died in Hirata estate. All his code and vows died with him that night.
2- Sekiro was left for dead as a child in a war torn country. He was in the battlefield left alone as a child, perhaps looting the bodies, perhaps mourning for his family.. It's all dead bodies and barren land, pillaged land for miles end. There is no way a child could survive that period. So when gripped the blade, Owl Father's katana, he was begging for either one of two outcomes. Kill me now as I kneel, mercy kill. Or take me in as a fucking slave for life. Owl Father being a man of cloak and daggers knows exactly what it means to have someone owing you for life, it's free fucking real estate, property, free fucking agent to do your bidding. So he adopted Sekiro right then and there. So Sekiro owed Owl Father his life. But when he lost his life, that debt is written off. Or rather, it's written over by Kuro. Because Kuro literally gave him life. Not figuratively like Owl, but literal fucking Mario 1-UP life. In that instance, his Iron Code is transferred to Kuro, there is no more Owl Father in that equation. Protecting Kuro is single-handedly his one and only purpose.

That's our Sekiro, just like every other MC in Souls game. Broken nobodies, dragged back to life from death, given a clean slate and another chance to reedeem sarr benchod.

When a game asks a lot of investment from me in both time and effort I really need to click with it, really need to be a fan, and sekiro just left me a bit cold. the only objective criticism I have is the action adventure filler between bosses swinging from stale to outright jank.

>>740920202
Double giant ape fight is honestly Bed of Chaos level awful if you aren't able to cheese the brown ape fast enough.
A real shame, because solo headless ape actually has an extremely fun moveset. In particular, parrying his overhead swing combo that sends you skidding backwards feels godlike to pull off. But then Genichiro, Owl Father and Saint Isshin are some of the best bosses not just from Fromsoft, but video games in general.

>>740900887
Nothing wrong with accepting you're bad at something.
Not every game is for everyone

>>740920972
It's not that bad by virtue of the alive ape actually giving you time to breathe but yeah it sucks with him just randomly coming in and taking swipes
I can't believe any of it other than them knowing people struggled with and were intimidated by guardian ape and having 2 of them just being a moment that would stand out, which it totally does

>>740920972
>Double giant ape fight is honestly Bed of Chaos level awful if you aren't able to cheese the brown ape fast enough.
You don't need to cheese this fight if you focus on the headless ape. Parry his combo, spear-drag the centipede, then parry the brown ape's jump slam. Do this 4 times and he's dead even on NG+7.

>>740921438
I forgot to mention you don't even need to lock on to the brown ape to parry her jump slam. Sometimes, she'll even miss entirely.

>>740901960
I love how much of a mess that shit is
>no one seems to really know how it properly works, with the tutorial telling you to block in the air before being hit but it works perfectly fine without it
>the tutorial is found ten seconds before a three phase boss fight
>said boss is only attacking with lightning in the third phase
>you won't be using that shit again for the next 10-15 hours
>and even then you might even kill the dragon dudes fast enough that they won't attack you or you just dodge their lightning so the next best thing would be the dragon boss near the end of the game
>you still find several livers across the world as if that shit was supposed to be much more prominent

>>740921597
It does also trivialize Isshin's third phase. I got through Isshin by mastering the first phase, then chunking his health bar on the second phase with phantom kunais until he eventually staggered, and then just playing third phase normally while deflecting the lightning attacks which is easy to do.

>Ichimonji Double
>High Monk
>Empowered Mortal Draw
What's the best combat art?

>>740922140
Spiral Cloud Passage is overpowered. It melts regular enemies, mini-bosses, and even a few bosses.

>>740900887
i tried to play this game 3 times and everytime i get filtered by lady butterfly, maybe my brain it's too souls coded idk or my reflexes are not good anymore. it sucks because i really like the game but that boss it's a brick wall

>>740900887
>this game sucking fucks.
fix't

>>740904313
>sekiro sucks !!!
>why sekiro sucks anon
>muh build variety !!!
Always the same with morons.

>>740901031
FPBP

>>740915913
White people still seething about this meme 10 years later

>>740914910
>game is about shinobi using techniques and trickery to fight dirty
>retard anon gets mad when scumbag shinobi enemies uses trickery
How about just stop being so gay

>>740915662
Why does every psued on this website think their "inarguable" points (just schizo rambling they convinced themselves to be mad about) matter?
>enemies before bosses dont teach you to fight the boss
Nigger what are you talking about??? Worked fine on my machine.

>>740919049
Except if youre good you can style on your enemies. Youre just revealing how much you suck at playing with your vent comments

>>740900887
Your loss. Go play somthing else

>>740922140
Ichi is great but you can pull of like 3 floating passages for every ichi because of no windup

>>740901862
I finished it like 12 times. and all the boss rush memories
What this guy is saying is 100% true.

>>740900887
SeKINO is a top 3 From game and you got filtered.

>>740902034
This should be the thing that first boss teaches you, not mentioned as a mock line by the last one.

Kill all contrarians and their families

>makes a game that actually requires skill to beat and can't be cheased with summoning, grinding or OP builds/items from guides
>"gitgud" retards keep seething about how hard they got filtered
Kek

>>740922417
You're not supposed the get to Hirata early you retard.

>>740904313
nigger, sekiro is peak game design. it's the closest any game came to perfection in the last 20 years. the only more perfect game in its design that I could remember right now is tetris. it's not about having 100 options to solve single problem like how in final fantasy game you can select hundreds of different spells, limit breaks and summons to kill a single monster or how you can use spells in dark souls if you want easy mode. sekiro is about mastery, you got a limited set of tools, and you are allowed to cheese many encounters ("a shinobi would know the difference between honor and victory"), but eventually you will have to learn the core deflect/attack/jump/mikiri counter/dodge system and apply it in many different situations. I've beat every mini-boss legit, so the final boss fell under 30 minutes but I get why some anons spent hours on isshin because they never learned the fundamentals. my only wish if they ever decide to make a sequel is that they expand the stealth system.

>>740900887
filtered

>>740904918
>A parry removes all of this, it is always the best option and there is almost never a reason to choose something else.
Wrong. First of all there are unparryable attacks, or attacks that are parryable but the reward for doing a jump/mikiri is greater. Then there's the attacks that can be dodged or parried depending on whether you are going for health damage or posture damage, which will change over the course of the fight/phase because posture regen is linked to HP. For example Genichiro has moves you can parry, but they end in a pushback, which means he will recover all the posture damage you just inflicted. So it's better to dodge and whack him in the back 2-3 times to inflict health damage and then switch to parrying once he's below 2/3rds HP and his regen is trashed. Not only does parrying NOT replace dodging, but whether parrying or dodging is the better option will change multiple times over the course of a single fight.

>>740904595
>complains about ""souls games""
>it only applies to DS3 and to a lesser extent ER
every time lmao

>>740903771
Why are you so butthurt over the butthurt of others

>>740930657
nta but he's right all the hate against sekiro boils down to >>740927626 and it's pathetic to see

>>740929295
what, really? i always thought it was the main route kek. ok i'm gonna replay it again

>>740930876
No, don't listen to him. You have to get to Hirata early so you can get the Flame Vent for Chained Ogre. You don't need to be high level to beat Lady Butterfly. Attack her until she parries then parry her counter-attack, which is usually a roundhouse kick.

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>>740922140
ashina cross is the coolest shit

>>740922140
>>740922273
High Monk is very situational, and empowered draw costs way too much emblems. Double Ichi is very good, though.

Floating Passage is hands down and by far the best zero emblem combat art in Sekiro, it's not for debate. It's fast, does good damage, does damage on block, builds up enemy posture meter, moves you foward while attacking so it has very good reach, and most importantly it synergizes with buffs such as monk candies, confetti, bestowal, and living flame

The other anon is right about Spiral Cloud Passage being overpowered if you want to spend emblems on your combat art. Basically just floating passage but better and costs emblems.

>>740924258
Ichi is more about resetting your own guard meter battles than it is about pure damage. At least on charmless/bell when your guard meter can easily be broken from fail parries

>>740919423
filtered shitter

>>740918381
Bloodborne bosses are fucking garbage dude
they are complete trash

>>740930996
>>740929295
The actual progression it wants is
>get the bell from the old lady by the ashina gates before the ogre
>go to hirata
>get the flame vent
>go back, beat the orge, clear the remaining area and beat Gyoubu
>go finish hirata estate and beat lady butterfly
>now go fight the bull and get to ashina castle
You can beat Lady Butterfly before Gyoubu, but there's really no reason to other than to challenge yourself.

>>740918381
>beast that swipes its arms
>faggot spamming guns
wow great boss design
>>740918517
Bloodborne "movesets" are also shit

>>740931912
meant for this anon>>740930876

>>740900887
>in this game I fucking suck
Ftfy

>>740901289
Game sold like shit (for a FROM Souls game)
It's universally seen as too difficult for it's own good I fucking loved it and it lived up to the hype

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>>740900887
Extremely overrated game that suffers from having a terribly simple base attack combo with poor rhythm and a needlessly pruned martial art system, while the enemy movesets are outstandingly good and varied. These two facts render the combat too dictated and one-dimensional, it gets boring fast and is the Fromsoft game I put the least time into.

>>740932478
>suffers from having a terribly simple base attack combo
It's easy to tell who never actually figured out the game. Whirlwind Slash is pretty good and that your basic combat art. There's quite a few good combat arts as well that have been mentioned in the thread. But this anon never bothered with them, only tried to parry everything, mistook it for a rhythm game because he never used the combat arts or tools, and got filtered.

>>740901031
Yeah, it is. They all look the same and play the exact same, but are never criticised like they should be.

>>740929380
>it's the closest any game came to perfection in the last 20 years
For your consideration
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=994D0KJMN1M
But yes, Sekiro is fucking exceptional.

>>740932880
That looks awful. What the hell happened to Ninja Gaiden?

>>740932662
>never used the combat arts or tools
My good man, I completed all the gauntlets with no charm and demon bell on NG++. I squeezed everything I could out of this combat system and experimented with every martial art. I brought up the martial arts system for a reason. Sure you can expand your base combo options with stuff like whirlwind slash, high monk, or prosthetics like sabimaru. But you pay the price of that being all you have. In a true Fromsoft fashion, they have a good system on their hands but hamper player expression with arbitrary limitations. In my eyes it can't be the best action combat ever made as it's carried entirely by the enemies and bosses. The character you control is just a poor man's swiss knife that can only use 3 very basic tools at a time.

>>740900887
All Souls like games are ass

>>740933157
It's actually really good, though
>what the hell happened to Ninja Gaiden?
is a fair question since it really isn't all that much like Ninja Gaiden. I bring it up here because I think it taps into what makes Sekiro interesting.

Sekiro is a good action game because everything contrives to demand that you know what the boss is doing. You have to see a wind-up and immediately identify the animation that is about to happen; if you do not recognize the boss's behavior, you are going to die. This is in contrast to games like Bayonetta where you only need to know "a hitbox is coming" and press the designated do-not-take-damage button. Games like that require fast reflexes and good situational awareness, but they don't demand understanding. Sekiro is cool because you have to learn, you have to understand everything the boss does as though it was your own move kit. Every boss is a new trial of memorization and recognition as much as it is responsiveness.

This is what makes NG4 such a cool game. Instead of "perilous attacks" where you have to jump, dodge, or mikiri, you get the charge attacks which require a bloodraven interrupt to stagger the enemy. But because a bloodraven attack is an ATTACK, you are locked into it, the same as any other offensive action. You have windup frames and cooldown frames, there's a delay between pressing the input and the hitbox happening. And you cannot do it if you are currently locked into a different action. If you try to just unga bunga a boss until you see the "watch out, danger is coming" indication, you are already dead. You have to recognize the boss's attack patterns and strings and know when the moment is coming that you should be winding up a bloodraven.

>>740933876
>>740932880
cont
You have to recognize how its attack patterns will move it so you can choose the right one; is it going to leap up before crashing down into you? Make sure you are using a bloodraven that swings upward. Is it going to step back before dashing into you? Pick one with reach or a gap closer. Is it a very short windup? Pick one that comes out quicker than most, even if it has reduced reach. Etc.

So on the surface, it feels like a typical action game. You have a zillion attacks that fling you around, and at any point you can cancel them by blocking or dodging. It feels responsive and noncommittal, you have total control over your mobility and defenses. But it forces you to use a specific type of offense AS defense against enemies you can't push around (like bosses) and so manages to force you into the Sekiro-style dance of reading their patterns and waiting for your key moment to perform the correct response, but without making you play from a defensive posture.

Sekiro does this by making your defense INTO offense with deflects and the parry system; NG4 does it by making offense into defense with the interrupt system.

NG4 is such a sick game, man. IDK.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRMYcZK7Kjk

>>740933834
>with every martial art.
They are called combat arts. You didn't play the game.

>>740933962
I haven't touched the game in years, getting hung up on terminology is not an argument

>>740934153
Correct, this isn't an argument. This is me just pointing out you don't know what you're talking about and that you appear as a shitposter making up stuff. The term combat art appeared 9 times in this thread, I even used it on our initial exchange, yet you multiple times keep calling it martial arts. If I'm being honest, you feel like a bot. Like your LLM autocorrects "combat art" to "martial art." If you aren't a bot, at least know that your opinion is as malformed and wrong as a bot's.

>>740933921
what I also admire about sekiro is how there's still leeway when fucking up a mikiri or misreading a swipe attack. you can heal and try again. but there's also a huge skill gap between learning to perfectly deflect every strike. you can beat most bosses by just standing and deflecting perfectly, which requires true mastery and zero errors, eventually your posture bar will fill and every mistake might KO you if it leads into an enemy combo while you are staggered. I tried it, and I'm just not good enough to pull it off, haha, even though I can beat the final boss with few hp recoveries. game also rewards aggression, but the window for error is also extremely small. best examples are lady butterfly and owl father. an average player like me can take his time and wait for the optimal time to strike, but good players can exchange strikes with bosses and finish them off quicker. I did beat lady butterfly with pure aggression as well as genichiro, but I wasn't good enough to pull it off with owl father. sekiro is at the same time a tight game while being very forgiving but can be extremely challenging with much higher skill ceilings if you have the skills for it.

>>740929380
lmao tetris has more complexity and intellectual design than sekiro, see https://four.lol/
sekiro is a parryslop game with 1 mechanic that truly matters, fromdrones have no shame

>>740934969
I mean in a certain sense the same is true of NG4, arguably more so (since items can be accessed from a game-pausing menu and don't have a use animation, so healing is free as long as you have them available), doing a no-damage MN clear of something is fucking absurd, nobody does that. When the game first came out people laughed about the game even TRACKING no-damage clears because it seemed so ridiculous to even attempt it until some people started doing so.

But at a high level both games do the same thing well, which is force you to make the acquaintance of your opponent. You need to understand what they can do and how they're likely to do it, and have appropriate responses ready for each action. You need knowledge and a plan of attack, not just sharp eyes and fast fingers. It's rare to see that kind of thing demanded of you in an action game, especially one as fast as NG4. Sekiro is definitely a slower paced game, and it still feels overwhelming just because of how much attention you have to be paying. I've NG7+ bell charmless'd the bosses in the Resurrection mod and to this DAY I can't correctly fight two enemies at once in Sekiro without running around like a retard (fuck you dual apes) because the game is so methodical. Achieving the same level of player laser-focus in a game with this type of shit
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n1iNmt6cI8w
is a feat

>>740934363
I just find the two terms interchangeable, and these are my honest thoughts about a game that I gave a fair shot. I don't think the game is bad, I just think that the blind praise this game gets is detrimental to the action genre because people draw wrong conclusions about what makes it good. It's not the deflect, it's From being very competent at designing bosses. I couldn't care less if you think I am a bot, that's something your meds should sort out

>>740935361
Puyo Puyo is far, far superior to Tetris.

>>740935529
and sekiro is far worse than both :)

>>740935606
Yeah I also prefer oranges over apples, as well. But as far as oranges go, Tetris is a retard's game and Puyo Puyo actually requires skills.

>>740935436
>It's not the deflect, it's From being very competent at designing bosses
This. Sekiro is a game about what the enemy can do, not what you can do. Almost every boss in the game has a broader offensive kit than the player, and the entire game revolves around recognizing and exploiting it. That's what makes Sekiro cool.

Does it "limit player expression"? Of course it fucking does. It intends to. You aren't there to style on mooks, you're there to respect the threat in front of you and learn how to read it like a book. It's a dance and you have to learn the steps and perform them as instructed. That's what the game is about. You couldn't give the player a meaningful and diverse kit of offensive options without cheapening that, because either (a) none of them would matter since they would be indistinguishable from mashing attack, or (b) it would break the game because it would allow you to dictate the pace of the fight instead of following where the boss is leading you.

>>740935717
>respond to retard comparing sekiro to tetris
>u-uhm akshually uhhh tetris is le bad! p-please forget about sekiro and argue with me about tetris instead!
fromdrones are genuinely insane

>>740935859
oh no, a tetris man babby can't handle criticism of his basic bitch game lmao

>>740935859
Bro is stutter posting in 2026, gamer rage comic tier, you are corny as fuck and old

>>740935907
>>740935936
both tetris and puyo puyo are amazing games, far superior to parryslop
everyone can see what you're trying to do fromdrone

>>740935993
No, tetris is not amazing. Had it not been packaged with the original gameboy, it would be forgotten and you'd never know about it. Puyo Puyo is an actual game series that makes tetirs 100% obsolete.

>>740936147
yeah, you can keep trying but you're not going to remove sekiro from this argument stupid kike lmao

>>740935426
>I can't correctly fight two enemies at once in Sekiro without running around like a retard (fuck you dual apes)
headless one is actually easy and predictable, and you can bait his big attack, some players can, with some luck and positioning, kill him first so the second one just disappears. but it's much easier to rush him with flame attacks, he has a smaller hp pool. I remember seething about seven ashina spears mini boss before fighting isshin where there's another guy with him lol. luckily, you can get rid of him and make it 1 on 1. is it even possible to beat those 2 together?

>>740935786
Yeah I get that the entire premise of the combat revolves around enduring an onslaught and then deftly finding a lethal opening. It's why most lethal blows to the enemy aren't just you cutting them down with a basic attack but an animated finisher, it drives the point home that you are an efficient killer. It works conceptually, it works presentation-wise. But to me it falls short in the gameplay mastery aspect because of low player expression and it simply doesn't keep me for that long.

>>740929380
>the only more perfect game in its design that I could remember right now is tetris. it's not about having 100 options to solve single problem
That's insane to say about tetris.
/v/ has stooped so low that they don't know how to play tetris.

>>740936208
This is a sekiro thread, so that's fine. But you can't convince anyone here that tetris is good in this thread lmao. Not even /vr/ cares about that game. On the other hand, /vr/ cares about Puyo Puyo.

>>740936341
nobody cares what you think, sekiro is just garbage

>>740936405
It won GOTY, while you seethe impotently that it's garbage lmao

>>740936460
and there you go, fromdrones literally just tried changing the argument to tetris just to defend parryslop because they know the gameplay is indefensible garbage LMAAAAAO

>>740936573
You changed the argument to tetris here>>740935361 not me. And you changed the argument back to Sekiro here>>740936405, not me. So youre so ass ravaged you had to escape reality (the reality where Sekiro won GOTY and you impotently seethe about it)

>>740936769
>You changed the argument to tetris
no i didn't, this guy brought it up >>740929380

>>740936905
That guy brought up Tetris, but you made it into an argument.

>>740935859
>retard comparing sekiro to tetris
anon I admire both games. the accent was on mastery. the best level design (in my eyes, based on the countless different games I played across different genres) is about player mastering the gameplay systems progressively and eventually getting to the point where you can comfortably do something that seemed insurmountable a few days ago. it is similar to how irl you spend a few thousand hours to master some skill, like playing piano well. I wasn't saying that tetris was easy or trivial or that both games work in the same way, they share the same design philosophy. most modern game design revolves around constant player gratification and zero friction.

>>740936983
sure, i made the argument about his retardation in comparing tetris to parryslop
you made the argument about puyopuyo out of nowhere to deflect and avoid arguing about sekiro which is the main thread topic

Half the bosses are gimmick bosses which suck balls

Imagine designing an entire boss around needing a consumable specifically for that boss

>>740900887
I need filthy fucking casuals to get off my board now. You don't belong here and you never will.

>>740935993
I don’t give a shit about whatever homofaggot “argument” you’re trying to have, only old ass losers have “heckin argumenterinos” you stutter posted, you’re a faggoooooot

Are people seriously still pretending that tapping L1 is hard in 2026?

>>740937115
>they share the same design philosophy
they literally don't, have you ever even played tetris in your whole life?
you literally say stupid shit like
>it's not about having 100 options to solve single problem
that's literally how to play tetris, there's only one objective and it's to clear blocks by making a full line, the game lets you do that 100 different ways
tha mastery in tetris is your block control and planning which is completely in your control
meanwhile sekiro is literally Simon says and the mastery is memorizing boss attack timing
are you legitimately braindead?

>>740935993
Parries are sick and all games should include them. Puzzle games all suck no exceptions.

>>740937392
Are people pretending that tapping L1 50 times in a row is good gameplay in 2026?

>>740900887
It's a rythm game for women, weebs and sissies, I'm embarrassed that fromsoftware made it, it's too easy, it's not replayable unless you are a speedtranny and it caters to femboylovers instead of portraying them as enemies like the rest of the souls games.

>>740937134
>sure, i made the argument
Okay glad you conceded after you blamed me and then blamed him.

I made the puyo puyo argument because I don't think most people that say tetris is good actually play it. First anon just brought it up as a tangent and didn't focus on it, so I ignored it. You brought up even more as if it's actually worth it. Honestly someone could do a case study on how over hyped Tetris is. For good reason it's fallen off of literally everyone's top video games. But if you actually cared about Tetris and puzzle games, you would care about Puyo Puyo since it's an improvement on it and actually has a real fanbase that isn't purely performative like Tetris fan's and is even has pvp so which requires actual skill. Seroiulsy, if Tetris was not bundled with the gameboy literally no would remember it.

>>740937487
Parrying looks cooler than rolling and they both just test reflexes. Team ninja games mog both to be fair.

>>740937534
>he's still trying to force the argument away from sekiro
KEEEEEEEEK i've never seen a faggot here be this confident and afraid at the same time, you won't get any more (you)s from me until you're ready to talk about sekiro bitch

>>740937724
>no argument about Tetris anymore
That's the only reason I was even giving you (You)s. Feels good winning, I guess.

>>740900887
It's always bait threads by white boys and jeets. Why won't someone just kick their asses?

>>740937553
Nioh 2 is a fucking masterpiece

>>740937835
So is SoP and Nioh 3 seems to be on the way.

even lies of P is already miles more advanced than sekiro just for punishing you for wrong timing
it's genuinely insane how fromslopware managed to fool normalfags into believing they're playing a hardcore action game when you can beat it mashing L1

I'm sick of medieval Japanese aesthetics.

>>740900887
Sekiro is the Nortubel of From Software

>>740901148
kino

>>740901148
Music to my ears.

>>740937402
>that's literally how to play tetris, there's only one objective and it's to clear blocks by making a full line, the game lets you do that 100 different ways
sure but the number of permutations is still limited, and certain strategies work better than others. especially when things get faster.
>mastery in tetris is your block control and planning which is completely in your control
meanwhile sekiro is literally Simon says and the mastery is memorizing boss attack timing
you're looking at it the wrong way. both games require time to study the problem, find the best solution, and work your muscle memory when executing your plan perfectly and readjust it in unpredictable circumstances. you can be the best planner in the world, but if you don't have the speed to pull it off, you'll never beat later stages of tetris. that requires time and mastery, it requires focus. mastering sekiro is not only about memorizing boss attack timing, it's just a part of it. first you must memorize boss patterns and learn his combos, see if he does swipes or thrusts, does he use grabs, does he have special attacks that apply statuses like burn or poison? after you get the feel of it, you must still be focused at every moment and be ready to react. sekiro is a reactive game just like tetris. you might see what the next block will be, but you can't predict the next 10. go play it already, you're missing out.

>>740908370
>i didn't get "filtered" or whatever
saying that doesn’t make it true lil bro

>>740938383
>both games require time to study the problem, find the best solution, and work your muscle memory when executing your plan perfectly and readjust it in unpredictable circumstances. you can be the best planner in the world, but if you don't have the speed to pull it off, you'll never beat later stages of tetris. that requires time and mastery, it requires focus. mastering sekiro is not only about memorizing boss attack timing, it's just a part of it. first you must memorize boss patterns and learn his combos, see if he does swipes or thrusts, does he use grabs, does he have special attacks that apply statuses like burn or poison? after you get the feel of it, you must still be focused at every moment and be ready to react.
NIGGER YOU'RE DESCRIBING VIDEOGAMES HAVE YOU EVER PLAYED VIDEOGAMES ASIDE FROM SEKIRO?????

>>740901148
add a "WHOOSH" from a mikiri counter and it's perfect

>>740938605
is this guy for real? I haven't spoken to the bigger dumbass in months. I'm drawing you a picture bro, and you're still as blind as a bat.

>>740938801
you are genuinely retarded, I hope you manage to learn some day that there are other videogames out there

>>740938943
you might have a fromsoft derangment syndrome, it's serious.

>>740915662
>no builds
fucking kek it’s always the same with you retards. you just don’t get it.
>no idea what to do with the boss
they’re not that hard and you can react pretty instinctively on most of them. also if you die it’s not a big deal. they don’t have weird or deliberately unnatural timings or delays like ER as gotchas, and they’re not doing a bunch of spin-to-win shonen shit with a million fx.

>>740900887
What the fuck

Whenever I make a Sekiro thread even with baiting statements like "this games the worst" or "this game ez you're all just bad" I get INSTA page9 within like 10 minutes, the fuck is up with that??????????? But when someone else does it the thread gets 200+ replies


Fuck you /v/ fucking Jew infested jeets

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>>740939026
nigger, sekiro is peak game design. it's the closest any game came to perfection in the last 20 years. the only more perfect game in its design that I could remember right now is tetris. it's not about having 100 options to solve single problem

>>740900887
Ye its pretty mid

>>740939192
exactly. and you're malding over it.

>>740900887
>this game fucking sucks.

I would say it doesnt, I quit at the beginning, if your pc is not 'powerful enough', you wont get very far, so it has to be played on a console. And I put 'powerful enough' in quotes because the game isnt optimized well enough because I have a powerful pc and I can play recent, with better graphics, games, maxed out at 4k and Sekiro still lags and doesnt look as good. Yes, japanese developers can be lazy and can be bought out by Nvidia or AMD, so the game only runs on certain powerful cards from the time the game came out.

>>740917237
It’s one of my favorite games, and I’ve beaten it multiple times but I don’t have any desire to replay it right now. Once you’ve mastered the game it’s fine to put it down and move on.
You can really only play a game once. Every other time after is you trying to desperately recapture that first feeling.

>>740939357
I left out that is a 'timed actions' game, which is why on pc isnt well optimized, even though it looks and feels like it is well optimized.

>>740900887
It's cool but it also has maybe the most nebulous intended "progression" for the bosses in a game I've ever played.

I remember my first playthrough I didn't even find Lady Butterfly until after Genichiro. And when you fight her the pop-up tutorials for stance breaking show up. Like what the fuck do you mean THIS is the first boss? The whole time the games screams at you to go rescue your shota at the castle.

>>740900887
fuck you

>>740939556
You're just a little slow. Lady Butterfly was the first real boss I faced.

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>>740901031

>>740939556
I always find it hilarious how the intended starting route involves time travel fifteen minutes into the game .

>QTE
>requires skill
/v/ - Videogames

>>740915662
Ignoring that choosing to stealth every single enemy is just that, a choice, you fight like 3 minibosses before the very first real boss, who you can only kill half way with stealth before you need to engage with the combat. So your point is inarguably retarded.

>>740939556
>first playthrough get to the quick draw katana guy in ashina castle
>totally miss the window on the side that leads up to genichiro
>instead end up exploring the monk mountain, the cliffs, and even the depths before ever fighting genichiro
>wonder what the fuck I'm doing wrong
>have to look up online that I missed a simple window to the side

>>740920374
>1- Sekiro fucking died in Hirata estate. All his code and vows died with him that night.

His “code” was invented 2 seconds before Owl ad libbed it to him upon adopting him. There’s no history or meaning to the iron code, it’s just something Owl told wolf to keep him in line for his own selfish means. Prime sekiro is the sekiro we become by the end. Better than Owl, better than Isshin, and clear of mind enough to decide his future for himself.

>>740941559
I watched the twitch run before, so I knew the path, but I intentionally went and beat everyone else before genichiro. I wasted hours on monk illusion because I was too autistic to use snaps, and my attack power was 3. lmao

>>740920374
>his Iron Code is transferred to Kuro
No it didn't. His iron code just didn't get tested until his father reveals to him that it was all his plotting the whole time. Until that point, the two commands still stood: Obey the father, follow the instructions of your master (e.g. Kuro) unless it goes against the father. And later nearing the climax, the option is literally to 'break the iron code" when you fight Owl, further showing that nothing "transferred" to Kuro. And then afterwards no longer bound by that code, Wolf is able freely disobey his master and choose two sacrifice himself instead of letting Kuro die (or even unbirth him into that monk priestess).