You're right about this, but people will aim to be contrarian, while ignoring the implication they're making that pretty much the entire best console generation is barely playable jank.

>>741149598
Ocarina is constantly holding itself back.
It stole the lock on system of virtual on but implemented none of the interesting costs/risks and techniques, no clever use of canceling. In oot the lock on functions as a pull back of the trigger before you press the "win" button. No thought or gaming required, just press button and win.
>b-but dark link and they take it away during ganondorf!
And do nothing with it. Dark link is effortlessly bested with dins fire, hammer, moron sword and has no interesting mechanics to engage with. Ganondorf doesn't even need it, the generous sword swing requires zero precision you will send the magic back at him with that massive window and hitbox every time. There is no challenge.
>Entire rupee system
Money is worthless in a game which showers you with the ability to store free revivals that are literally found before bosses, all over the world just by breaking respawning props.
>but what if I need magic
break a pot, there's 1000 of them for you to break for refills. The game teaches you this in the first 5 minutes, hours before you even have access to potions.
>but I need money for bombchus
You already have it because there's nothing else to spend money on. Moneys worthless and theres no interesting decisions to be made with it.
>bloated upgrades
Whats the point of more than 30 arrows? 40? 50? It's to give you some return for the mediocre and braindead minigames (which once you line up your shots will always be trivial to perfect.) You're encouraged to waste and not think about resources, don't worry, you have 40 bombs, 200 arrows, 5 pounds of nuts. You're not running out, don't bother thinking about it. Waste of potential and just gay progression for basic player addiction.
>Dungeon puzzles are rote and boring exercises in patience
Slow ass song playing and block pushing with zero thought or cleverness required to complete. This shit is just a waste of time.

Of all the 3d 5th gen games, you haven't played enough of them.

>>741149598
>Explain how ocarina of time has aged poorly.
I can't.

>>741149598
Camera controls
Z-targeting
Menu navigation and item selection
First person aiming controls
Button mapping for context sensitive actions

Video games do not age. They are the same regardless of the amount of time that's passed.

>>741149970
Based, PS1 > PS2
PS1 games might have been janky but they had soul, PS2 games were still janky but they had less soul, and by the PS3 era the jank was mostly gone but so was the soul, so gen 5 games were the sweet spot, the soul more than made up for the jank. I can't believe people that claim MK64 is unplayable nowadays exist, when the only issue it has from a gameplay standpoint is the cheating AI.

>>741149598
Oot was a groundbreaking game for its time and introduced a lot of gaming staples but that is a problem. It became the baseline in a lot of areas and got copied thousands of times. That's why oot will feel very basic. Without the direct nostalgia you will notice that you already played this hundrets of times in every variation and that what was geoundbreaking decades ago is just Standard now.

>>741150113
They age when standards change
Wind Waker's art style still holds up
Twilight Princess's does not

>>741150394
That just means you aged, not the game.

>>741150113
Video games absolutely age. In 1998, people thought Ocarina with all of its inefficiencies and clunkiness was the best we could get for that kind of gameplay system. And maybe they were right at the time, but they are fundamentally wrong now.

>>741150394
Twilight princess unironically looks better than skyward sword and BotW/TotK, both games are eyesores, only problem with TP's visuals is the shitty bloom, but BotW and TotK have the anti-soul gas.

The pc port fixes the only problems (15 fps and low resolution)

i think the game has aged poorly, in a lot of ways. the first several hours are braindead easy and patronizingly simple because it was one of the first 3d adventure games people had played, so the game has a lot of tutorialization making sure you really understand how to move around and stuff. i think it really hurts the replay value of the game. it gets more fun at the adult part, but i often can't be assed to play through the child segment again. i think that jabu jabu is alright, but everything before that is absolutely painful.

the game is also annoyingly slow, by which i mean the dialogue just moves so goddamn slowly, which just contributes to the lack of replayability.

there's some other problems too. in general the game is just very easy, the combat has no real difficulty in it, doesn't really require any finesse. combat is more about figuring out how to beat the enemies rather than difficulty in fighting them, and once you figure it out the difficulty is gone. i suppose you could say its fitting for a puzzle game but its yet another thing that destroys replay value.

>>741149598
The camera controls were shit back in the day. And today they're comparably even worse.
But OoT still holds up today. Fuck the remake. Fuck remakes broadly.

>>741150536
If you can't appreciate a game for its own merits then you're never gonna make it.

>>741149598
The 10fps framerate with drops and disgusting Vaseline-smeared textures were already horrible in 1998, let alone now, but those are both the fault of the hardware rather than the game itself.

>>741149598
>People keep claiming that's its a product of its time and it's aged like milk
only retards say that
original visuals are dated but it's stylized so it doesn't age as bad as other mediums could, the UI is imperfect and make some things like swaping around items cumbersome, the 3ds remake fix both these issues
other than that there's no issue at all the gameplay is simple and straightforward, so it isn't stuck in anything generational or age like tank controll for some games could
the only thing you could argue about is the hyrule field being rather empty due to the limitations of the N64
so it aged, but not like milk, it's still very playable and the 3ds remake make it mostly timeless

>>741150607
you have adhd

>>741149598
I don't really believe in games "aging", in reality games are designed around and with the controls and gameplay quirks in mind. What people mean when they shit on old games is they compare them to modern gameplay conventions and if there is a learning curve to learn the controls and how much friction the game throws at you (muh QoL). With that in mind graphics aside OoT is different from modern games in a few ways:

>camera controls: no free camera movement, no second analog
>save system: no autosave, restarting from Link's house or Temple of Time
>aiming: inverted y axis and no reticle
>some seriously cryptic bullshit for main story progression

>>741150687
Irrelevant and weak argument. You can appreciate a game for its merits while also acknowledging it aged pretty poorly; they're not mutually exclusive ideas.

If you guys want a good example of a timeless Nintendo game that aged very well, there's an obvious one in Super Mario Bros 3
It sure as fuck isn't Ocarina of Time lmao

>>741150375
>>741150536
>It became the baseline in a lot of areas and got copied thousands of times. That's why oot will feel very basic.
The exact opposite of this. NOTHING has managed to replicate it and the intricate design of it's world and all the ways you have to interact with it. Very little about it has been copied with much success, and hence still remains more advanced than what succeeded it. Most more modern games that try to take after it are bloated with tons of self-similar crap instead of pulling off what it could.

>>741150375
Feeling standard and uninteresting is different though from calling it junky and dated. I'm just arguing that it's core mechanics still feel fine. The problem with this game is not its jank but that it is quaint.

>>741150774
it doesn't have any sense to judge with present eyes products of the past, you can learn what to do (and not) from them, but it's like saying "John Dalton is a retard because he thought the atom is the smalles particle", no it's not, matter fact he was ahead of his time, but things just go forward most of the time so we know there are smaller particles and stuff.
That's why it's important to give a score to a game when it came out tho.

>>741151023
>intricate design of it's world and all the ways you have to interact with it
Oh I'm laffin

>>741150774
>Irrelevant and weak argument.
It's completely relevant because arguing about a game based on its age is comparing it to games released now, which is unfair as you're judging a game's merits and demerits based on the qualities of other games. You aren't letting it stand on its own. And when you do, a game stops aging and exists regardless of time.

They are absolutely mutually exclusive ideas and it's hypocritical to think otherwise.

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Its a bad sign when the succeeding games end up failing to make a straight upgrade.
And the 2 clones that exist in the same timespan both give up completely in trying to succeed the game.

And at that point, the 3rd actual 3D zelda clone is.... Oceanhorn 2?

>>741150956
ehhh i feel like you could plop a kid down in front of SMB3 and enjoy it, it's just a fun game. OoT has some crunchy-how-does-3D-work growing pains associated with it

>>741151103
No, it's not like saying that.
John Dalton is a dead physicist whose contributions have lesser relevance in the modern day. Ocarina of Time is a video game that is still accessible and still played by people. All the criticisms under modern lenses in the world are fair fucking game.

>>741151178
No one has ever heard of "Oceanhorn 2". Please do not talk about terminally irrelevant things if you're trying to make a point.

>>741150058
>don't worry, you have…5 pounds of nuts.
Thank you for noticing.

I played it for the first time recently. It was fun.

However, when I played a more modern console game after that I kept pressing L2 to move the camera. It took a while to break that reflex.

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>>741149598
>Explain how ocarina of time has aged poorly
It hasn't. It's still as enjoyable as it was nearly 30 years ago. It feels way more modern than it is, mostly because it literally coined so many modern 3D game design tropes, and did them well on the very first try.

It's a cozy, immersive adventure like no other.

>inb4 "lol nostalgia!"
Literal zoomer and GenA toddlers less than half my age have picked up, played and loved OoT. Applies to all the big Golden Age games from that era.

>>741151292
oot is a game that made a massive contribution to videogames at the time, what the fuck are you talking about, it's the same

>>741151127
>waaaah it's unfair!
I accept your concession that Ocarina of Time doesn't hold any water to its modern contemporaries, that "merits" and aging are mutually exclusive despite this because Ocarina still has some enjoyable qualities, and that you have no idea how any of this works. Didn't need to read the rest of your post.

It has my favorite camera lock in any game ever.
My only issue with it is the aimbot while you're locked on. BotW choosing to disable the aimbot on lockon + imcluding the motion for precise aiming was rad.
botw did some not rad things tho

>>741151394
/thread

>>741151178
The town has such a cool design and uses its fixed camera perspectives so well. But damn do I wish you could end up accessing more parts of it (like the upper rooms behind the balconies and the houses behind the alley) and that the characters didn't just stand around saying the same shit after the Dorf shows up.

>>741150058
would you qualify it as a "better puzzle" if it required the use of nuts of which you could only carry say 8 from town

>>741151519
>Ocarina still has some enjoyable qualities
One day we might find them. The worlds best video game archeologists are on the case.

>>741151503
At the time, yes. Today, not so much. If someone can't sit in front of the game and enjoy it to the same degree as they might have back then, it has aged objectively and that's the GENEROUS view.

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>>741150058
>boring dungeons

Your crazy anon

>>741151591
It would be very courageous of the game to require a limited resource and a level of planning to have it on hand.

>>741151654
The solution to this is basic movement timing and watching proximity when passing through the pillars, it's a waiting puzzle. It is the half way mark of the game and they're still doing tutorials.

>>741149598
I would go as far to say it was unplayable before the 3DS version because of how shit aiming the bow/slingshot was. I will never play 3D zelda without gyro aiming ever again

>>741149598
It's early 3D, therefore really clunky/janky, no matter how you look at it
And yes, it's the best example of early 3D, but it's still clunky/janky ass early 3D
The same goes for Mario 64
A remake in this case is more than justified, way more than cashgrab shit like TLOU 1 remake for example

>>741151297
Isn't that the point?
Its very hard to claim it aged like milk, when you can't find newer or contemporary games doing the same or better.

>>741151631
>you WILL play a 30 year old game and feel EXACTLY the same and you will JUDGE IT like it's a fresh brand new VIDEOGAME
>not even tetris

why are retards like this

>>741151549
>BotW choosing to disable the aimbot on lockon + imcluding the motion for precise aiming was rad.
Yes, gyro aim is perfect for Zelda and it's one of those things OoT clearly benefits from. It's why I've done things like mod keese so that you can't properly target them.

>>741151757
But how is it clunky, please describe the things that make it clunky.

>>741151762
Did I stutter?
Also, Tetris aged infinitely better than Ocarina. You're an idiot for even bringing that one up since it proves my point.

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>>741150113
Sure.

>>741151880
Still a good challenge to this day.

>>741149598
Most answers will probably focus on controls and in-game design decisions. I think where it has aged most negatively is in comparison to the games that are contemporary to its release. This isn’t a knock on it. There was a huge portion of people that thought it was the greatest game of all time, so it only had one way to go, which was down. It’s far more common now to see people say that it isn’t even the best game of 1998 let alone all-time. Half Life, MGS, and Thief are argued as goty 1998 over OoT a lot now.

>>741151875
it doesn't, that's the point, not a single zoomer enjoys or play tetris like when it came out, because we don't live in that world anymore, games are better (or different) now, there is other standars and people have more fun with other kind of games because we are not anymore on the 8 bite era. That's the whole point of trying to not judge old games with new standars. Are you retarded for real or just trying to troll or ragebaiting or

>>741150956
This desu, I don't know what the fuck people are talking about when they say OoT aged well. This fucking game is pretty much at the forefront of discussions where people talk about then-called masterpieces that did NOT age so well.

>>741149598
OoT is boring, the game feels empty. I liked Majora's Mask better when I was younger, and recently played the 3DS remake of OoT and didn't enjoy it at all. Banjo-Kazooue and DK64 will always be better

>>741151947
I generally like all those games better than ocarina, but I Ocarina is clearly more polished, more consistent in its level design and has significantly less jank than all of those other games.

>>741152046
>not a single zoomer enjoys or play tetris like when it came out
I genuinely think you might have been dropped on your head as a child.

>>741149598
I think it's mostly the camera people complain about.

>>741149598
It aged well it’s just not particularly challenging or engaging to a veteran gamer so it’s not very fun to revisit.

>>741152180
>not giving an argument because he knows only autistic kids and chinese kids play tetris
ok

>>741150956
>can't save
Aged poorly

>>741151947
So... Tekken? Soul Reaver: The game where the sequels where HARD on narration due failing to adapt the gameplay for later games? Mystery Dungeon?
Its not contemporary with Gothic or KH for instance.

>>741152276
I kind of agree with this, but people just say it's aged poorly or it's janky. When really it's just too quaint and vanilla.

>>741150956
almost all the best SNES games aged better than the best N64 games. Link to the past, super mario world, megaman X, kirby super star, Donkey Kong Country, and Yoshi's Island are all better than OOT, Mario 64, Megaman legends, kirby 64, DK64, and yoshi's story ect
I think starfox 64 and mario kart 64 are the only strict improvements over the snes counterparts

>>741149598
all the waiting
really that's about it

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>>741149598
It insists upon itself

>>741152276
Unless its because of nostalgia people only replay OOT nowadays for randomizers

Games don't age, but to flip this on the OoT manbabies – that just means the less enjoyable ones were always shit.

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>Outside of graphics
I like the graphics though...

>>741152453
I agree with your opinion. The SNES is the greatest 2D console of all-time, and the N64 isn’t close to that title for 3D. As an aside, I would rather play SM64 over the World games, but that’s just my personal preference for 3D Mario over 2D. There’s no doubt that those two games look and play better than it.

>>741149598
Hyrule field is just a completely empty area that you have to spend 5 minutes running across to get anywhere. At least half the map is completely unused as its nowhere near any zone entrances

>>741153832
so like every open world game
also you get a horse

Its just one of those instances where virtually every mechanic in the game has been refined or vastly expanded upon by games that came after it. All it has left when looked at from a modern lens is the iconic character/setting designs, the great soundtrack and the legacy it created.

>>741152102
Majora's was way too stressful with the three days limit always looming over your head though

>>741149598
Horrible controls(Heavy menu usage alongside terrible framerate making things even worse)

Horrible framerate(it wasn't good even back in 1998)

Horrible graphics(even for the time)

>>741150687
I'm not going to appreciate a game that runs at 15 frames per second.

Monster Hunter Wilds(and many other games) runs like shit and it got much deservedly shit on, why would Ocarina of Time get a special pass?

>>741150603
The 3DS remaster fixes many more including framerate and it's in fact the superior official release of Ocarina of Time.

>>741152453
>I think starfox 64 and mario kart 64 are the only strict improvements over the snes counterparts
Also F-Zero X

Racing games are 2D by nature

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>>741149598
It's a fucking disgustingly racist game and you should be ashamed of yourself if you have EVER enjoyed it. I don't care if you were a child and liked it, you were contributing to oriental stereotypes and the discrimination of some of the kindest and accepting people in the world.

>>741155779
If we’re talking about how poorly it has aged, because of framerate issues and controls, then shouldn’t part of that aging also include the general improvements that have come with the passing of time? Even if those improvements aren’t Nintendo made, they’re still how many players approach the game now. People who play it aren’t usually playing it on original hardware. They’re playing it with a modern controller, with modern camera controls, at 60fps, and modern resolutions and AA. It’s like complaining about cpu slowdown in SNES games, when that’s not really something you actually have to deal with anymore.

I saw OP of a previous OoT thread complain about how unfun Keese were to fight and it just makes me realize how many people ignore all the tools at their disposal when they play games.
How hard is it to throw a nut?

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>>741149598
>hyrule field is a dead empty field and the rest of the world is not that interesting to explore
>npcs just wait around for you and don't do anything outside of that
>camera sucks
>controls suck and there's no jump
>first person aiming is awful
>puzzles are simply not fun
>bad dungeon design especially water temple
>story is super basic and doesn't have much lore outside of "kill ganon"
BoTW improved on every single aspect of OoT and some of you niggers refuse to accept it because nostalgia and nothing else.
Picrel

>>741156857
>If we’re talking about how poorly it has aged, because of framerate issues and controls, then shouldn’t part of that aging also include the general improvements that have come with the passing of time?
There were games on the Nintendo 64 that ran at stable 60 FPS, games made by Nintendo even. Framerate issues can be tracked down to mismanagement.

Also there are games from that same year as Ocarina of Time that did in fact age well.

The limitations of the Nintendo 64 does not mean that you can't make something good in it. Same with the SNES slowdowns. Games that had slowdown on the SNES could've ran better but they were shipped with slowdown anyway and should be judged and criticized for it.

>>741150956
Super Metroid is timeless
Chrono Trigger is timeless
Ocarina of Time sure as fuck is NOT timeless. RE2 and MGS1 came out that year and were way better.

>>741150956
SMB3 has some pretty dire level design and the difficulty curves are all over the place.
Super Metroid is unparalleled peak that is so unfathomably well designed I can only assume it was made by accident.

>>741149598
So OoT is still good but has so many areas that could be improved
>side quests
most of them aren't great and are very short, which is a pro for some but they dont really add much to the experience not to mention the rewards sucks, which ties into that hyrule field is actually really boring to explore, it was really cool as a kid but you soon learn it has nothing to do in it, hell hyrule field is literally just there to justify epona, who got improved upon in TP.
Rupees doesn't matter, golden skulltulas are pointless after getting the wallet, which doesnt actually matter.
Gyro aiming also improves this game like a million times.

>>741155992
It’s ugly as fuck

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>>741149598
I'm not sure it holds up. It doesn't have analog camera, it runs at 240p resolution and average 20fps, there's hitching when you pause the game, saving quitting and resuming doesn't retain your position in the game, most puzzles involve block pushing or just shooting a switch, there's unskippable cutscenes every 30 seconds, the lock on bounces to enemies you dont intend it to, there's knee high fences you cannot vault over, there's inclines the horse refuses to move beyond, you have to play several songs and run back to the temple of time to transform between child and adult forms, rupees are completely worthless and seemingly the only reward you get for exploration, the dialogue options are redundant just forcing you to pick Yes, there's tons of things the game just doesn't explain, there's tons of things the game over explains, the map is useless, a lot of the only sidequests in the game are fetch quests, nonexistent swimming controls, arbitrary limitations between child and adult link items, the teleports between areas leave a lot to be desired, no faster movement mechanic for young link, the challenge is virtually nonexistent, there's a lot of backtracking for 100% completion, Navi gets stuck repeating the same info routinely, many items are just palette swaps or replacements with the same functionality, and there's no world building or character development.

For its time like 30 years ago it must have been really impressive, however these days I can probably give it a 7/10. I would rather play basically any other game, at all, or in this franchise even.

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>>741158819
It's prettier than the original by a huge shot

The cold truth is Nintendo's legacy is falling apart bit by bit. You will live to see people asking
>What is so great about Mario and Zelda?

>>741159340
Zelda is the most overrated gaming series of all time. So many games over the course of 30+ years and they aren't able to fix its issues.

>>741149598
It's largely the framerate and the graphics for folks, the reality is the formula changed so little and the sequels did their own gimmicks each that OoT's gameplay basis remained for every single game that wasn't either a 2D homage or BotW/TotK. Everyone can get into that shit.

>>741149598
I don't think it did.

>>741150058
laughing at the thought of you trying to explain all this gay meta shit to me at 9 years old when I was enjoying it initially

>>741149598
HEY! LISTEN!

The combat is extremely rudimentary.

>>741149598
Its getting a remake. That by itself means the game is bad. Look at how many people are excited for this piece of shit to be remade

I played it the week it came out and played it like once every two years so I could never feel how it was dated.
However, I could see certain things like swapping items requiring a full pause and no controllable camera as being outdated. Both of those were so easily solved in newer official and fan made versions though. Just a few tweaks and it's already basically a modern game.

>>741160330
It's actually super advanced, but the game really sucks at using the mechanics it developed.

>>741160330
That's just Zelda in general. Even when you get more advanced techniques in WW and TP, or the physical combat changes entirely in SS, the games are all balanced around using dungeon items and slash mashing, or slashing with timing, and not much else. SS certainly added a bit more challenge and spectacle to the affairs, at the cost of overall depth.

>>741160753
>but the game really sucks at using the mechanics it developed.
Funny, that’s true for a bunch of Nintendo games, like Odyssey.

I played it for the first time recently and the only things that felt dated to me were

>The graphics, although I found the style to be charming enough in spite of them (I know OP already discounted this but still, just saying what I found to be dated here)
>The lack of a free camera that requires you to Z target to reset it, with some locations just being a fixed camera
>Way too much pausing to select items, Water Temple especially bothered me and I think this is why people remember it being "hard"
>Every time you restart the game it resets Link to either his house or the Temple of Time

Other than that not much really bothered me, I thought it was still a ton of fun. The final fight against Ganondorf was pure kino.

Games age, and that's exactly why Star Fox 64 could easily be released with its level design and gameplay unchanged in 2026, but Ocarina of Time couldn't.

>But… but… OOT doesn't need to change a thing! If you can't play it today, it's your own fault!
If you hold this opinion, then you don't understand video games in the first place, and that explains why you think OOT is a "good" game when it's actually extremely flawed.

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5th gen aged the worst. By far. It was the first 3D gen and a lot of games were experiment with basic textures and geometry. So basic it was pretty much a rectangle made in Paint thrown up as a wall. With shit fucking controls (there's a reason why every game uses 2 analog sticks), shit fucking camera angles that would give zoomers PTSD, and insane limitations like loading or space or memory. Hell, 5th gen was so bad, 4th gen aged better due to pixel art. There's a reason why they were putting out slop every 2 years. Only a hand full amount of games were worth playing and they were all pretty much made obsolete by sequels from the next generation.

>>741161261
>but Ocarina of Time couldn't
It absolutely could, but its problems are mostly so trivial to fix that there's little reason not to if you're going to do something like that.

>>741161161
>>Way too much pausing to select items, Water Temple especially bothered me and I think this is why people remember it being "hard"
Hit it in one. 3DS version had quicker assignments thanks to the touch screen and let you set iron boots to either a face button or an extra screen button, and swapping on the go plus three lines in the dungeon to indicator where the water level changes were basically turned it into the same length and challenge overall as the rest of the Adult dungeons The infamy entirely relies on the old version being kinda crummy to play and it being very easy to lose track of progress amidst all the pausing. And that damn water change point beneath the floating platform in the central tower.

>>741161261
All things point towards them doing another Star Fox so far in terms of probably not changing a lot though we'll have to see. Besides being baby easy for the majority of the game, there's really not much that has to be changed or considered outdated. You just sound angry about something and are vagueposting about why.

>>741150758
Why do people shit on OoT for starting you at preset locations when LttP also does it and is way worse because it kicks out of dungeons? There's a single starting point in the entire Dark World and the only way to fast travel is going to the light world, playing the flute, and hoping that your destination has a convenient portal.

>>741161503
>5th gen aged the worst.
It's the gen with the most classics that hold up, by far. It's funny, because you'd think it would be wack for the reasons you gave, but somehow devs immediately made compelling use of 3D space despite barely doing so before, and the gen immediately after turned most shit into tedious, repetitive slop and pushed garbage 3rd person shooter mechanics into every place it didn't belong.

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>>741149598
The skill ceiling of this game is that of what a 5 year old is capable of. There is no way for me to play it more skillfully than a 5 year old can short of completely breaking it. Additionally, dungeons are extremely linear, and the overall world design makes me feel like it's a precursor to open world ubisoft games, which is unsurprisingly what the franchise ultimately morphed into with BotW later down the line.

>>741161503
Reducing 6th Gen to "online multiplayer, co-op, and sports" is fucking crazy. That was like the most experimental and weird gen by far.

>>741162009
>That was like the most experimental and weird gen by far.
lol

>>741159529
I think Zelda is good at nailing an atmosphere which makes you feel immersed in its world as a player, not just in visuals but also the soundtrack and the way every settlement and area in these games are made to feel alive. This is why so many people in these threads have an undying nostalgia boner for even the clunkiest entries in the series like OoT. Outside of that factor they're not particularly remarkable, nobody's playing Zelda for the "gaminess" of it.

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>>741161737
Every 5th gen "classic" was immediately followed by a far superior 6th gen sequel people regard as the gold standard even today.
MGS1 -> MGS2
Half Life -> HL2
Smash Bros -> Melee
Twisted Metal -> Black
Silent Hill -> SH2
RE1 -> RE4
Sonic3D Blast -> Sonic Adventures
GTA2 -> GTA3
Gran Turismo 2 -> GT3
Unreal -> Unreal 2k4
Not to mention, Halo, Max Payne, SSX, Total War games, Splinter Cell, etc... There's a reason why 2001, 2004, and 2007 are the most competitive years for GOTY.

>>741149598
I think it's mostly aged well, my only real complaint about it is that some elements of it are tedious like hopping into the menu to change gear constantly for some parts of the game (Water Temple most infamously) and planting the beans as Young Link to be used as Adult Link later. Not to mention there's this whole thing where you can find heart containers to improve your healthbar but it doesn't really matter because most enemies in the game do trivial damage. It could be tightened up but it's a good game and it's crazy good for its time.

>>741149598
It's fucking boring

>>741149598
It was pretty impressive when 3d was new. Easily surpassed today by games like Genshin Impact with amazing graphics that run on a phone and anime waifus.

>>741149598
camera, menus, general 3d design structure and sheer fucking EMPTINESS of everything, lack of environmental threats (on top of jumping/platforming being automatic and fake), not integrating enemy threats with environmental threats, combat fucking SUCKS, endless interrupting cutscenes and unskippable text boxes (i dont need to zoom in on the door closing. i dont need to know how bombs work for the 30th time), empty rooms with "just look up, shoot the eye/switch", the actual music sucks (sheet music is fine. modern arrangements are fine. actual in game music sounds muffled and shitty. the horns sound like farts through a kazoo), money is worthless, everything is painfully slow.

its too easy, too primitive, too hand-holdy, too empty, and doesnt respect your time.

>>741150058
All non-issues listed. Just things that annoy you because you are autistic enough to care.

>>741162009
lol have you seen the best selling games for 6th game? 2 Maddens made the top 10 for Xbox and 2 Marty Parties for Gamecube. Meanwhile PS2 had shooters, racers and RPGs. Multiplayer was getting pushed hard by early 2000s and because Sony didn't try to catch the future, spent their entire time with PS3 trying to catch up to Xbox.

https://vgsales.fandom.com/wiki/Best_selling_games_(sixth_generation)

>>741151023
oh for sure, dude. NOTHING has better camera controls. nothing has better lock on controls. nothing has better item swapping. nothing has better combat. nope, not a single thing. everything else is simply trying to ape it.

you're beyond fucking retarded.

>>741163052
Well fucking said.
Keep in mind I adored Ocarina of Time when it first came out but 10 years later, every single game was doing it miles better. Even shitty fucking Morrowind 4 years after Ocarina managed to impress more people.

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>>741151127
>noooooo!!!!!
>you have to look at it in a vacuum!
>you're not allowed to compared it or utilize a wealth of experience and standards to judge it!
>you have to pretend like its the only thing you've ever seen!
yes, if we follow your mental gymnastics and just pretend nothing else exists, it becomes the best ever by default. if we just remove it from the timeline of progress and quality then it stops aging.

what an absolute zealot. willful ignorance to the max. btw, you forgot the true goat of games, pic related

>>741162009
Gen 6 had a lot of weird shit but none of it really sold that well. It was basically the generation where super experimental games died while sales went to increasingly normalfag shit.

>>741159246
Now add a CRT filter

>>741162921
Ocarina of Time is overrated and your gacha casinos will never ever be video games that prey on addicts.

Know your place gachashitter it's in the trash bin.

>>741163194
>NOTHING has better camera
Correct, the way the game deliberately uses the camera to present the world is amazing, though you don't have that much control over it

>nothing has better item swapping
No. The items it has are varies and interesting in the context of a world where there's so much you can interact with. The pause menu is art of the expereince.

>nothing has better combat
No, I genuinely don't believe a better 3D combat system exists. Plenty of games have harder enemies, but the actual mechanics are absurdly satisfying and haven't been surpassed.

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>>741164427

>>741152096
>top best game ever on /v/ of every year
Yeah sure.

>>741149598
Just buy the remake, mmkay, chuddy?

>>741164530
Funny enough it only started getting voted that highly after there was mass influx of nintendo fans from neogaf.

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>>741149598
People will do anything these days except playing the video game they are talking about.

>>741150394
Standards change but the game remains the same.

>>741164530
this place is filled with contrarians, retards, and nostalgia blind zealots. a circle jerk of zealous anons doesnt magically fix all of the objective and demonstrable flaws and problems oot has.

>>741149598
It looks like shit
Has no voice acting
World is empty
It's gameplay sucks
It's puzzles suck

>>741164845
Now say it without buzzwords and meaningless insults.

>>741164897
i was very direct and explicit in my word choice. none of it was empty or meaningless.

>>741165146
Your entire existence is meaningless, subhuman.

>>741150058
Is that you St1ka?

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>>741165196
oot aged like milk, and there is no refuting it's flaws. deal with it.

>>741165272
You are brown and smelly.

>it's boring
Not an argument. Stop frying your dopamine receptors.

>>741160330
The Iron Knuckle fight is where it shines the most desu but I still cant fully disagree with your statement.

>>741164607
>>741164845
N-nani?! The goalpost... it just disappeared!

>>741165428
its been propped up on an artificial pedestal for 20 years. this isnt the only place it happens. no goalposts were moved.

it rode the high of novelty and impression for a good 5-10 years, where people would go "yeah, but ocarina though? remember THAT? so amazing" and everyone just collectively member berried and agreed. it became a habit. it became a bandwagon. it became a ritual. and from that ritual, in order to protect that ritual and the cool kids club of the bandwagon, they became willfully ignorant of any critical analysis or thought. they outright deny and deflect any criticism. they became zealots. purely performative zealots. a lot of them are probably stupid enough to actually believe it too, which just makes them more zealous.

>>741157443
>OoT hyrule field
>1 minute walk where you encounter maybe two enemies
>BotW open world
>15 minutes walk where you encounter maybe 4 niglet goblins
Vvovv...

>>741149598
Games don't age, OoT was always trash propped up by journos and fanboys.

>>741165925
Well, yeah, it's either all that schizo cuck cope or OoT is still a fun game to play that managed to win the hearts of gamers over 30 years and that Nintendo still can't manage to replicate. WW is like, what, 25? Where is the illuminati nostalgia cult for WW? TP? Hell, Alttp? Zelda 1?

>>741162194
half of those aren't even praised to begin with and have basically nothing in common with the newer games, stupid-ass post

>>741162194
>MGS1 -> MGS2
People fight about this all the time. I like 2 better, but there are many that say the atmosphere of the 1st game can’t be topped. There’s also the Raiden element that people are still mad about.
>Half Life -> HL2
Another highly contested opinion. Lately, I get the sense that more people like the 1st game better.
>Smash Bros -> Melee
Agreed. It’s not even close. The original is trash.
>Twisted Metal -> Black
Agreed
>Silent Hill -> SH2
Agreed
>RE1 -> RE4
There are the purists who like the first 3 games as horror games over the action movie presentation of 4, but agreed.
>Sonic3D Blast -> Sonic Adventures
Agreed
>GTA2 -> GTA3
Agreed. Arguably not even the same genre of game when the jump to 3D happened.
>Gran Turismo 2 -> GT3
Agreed
>Unreal -> Unreal 2k4
My age will show with this, but I disagree. The original Unreal Tournament is on its own. The speed of play, how smooth it ran, the maps. It’s the perfect LAN game.
I think you’re largely correct, but there are some exceptions to the rule.

>>741149598
>Out of all the 3d 5th gen games, it is probably the most polished and has the least amount of jank
It aged like milk and I've suffered you faggots enough. The game was shit back then too.

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>>741149598
I finished it very recently, like a few days ago for the first time at 30 years old. It's honestly a phenomenal game with very few flaws, especially considering it came out during the 5th gen. Playing MM right now and I enjoy it but holy fuck that opening sequence was rough. I completely somehow missed the fairy in the laundry room or whatever and was wandering around for ages, quite literally only barely made it to the top of the clock tower with like a minute to spare before the boss fight started and I was able to rewind time. Still don't know what happens if the moon hits the town, does the game just end if you haven't gotten the Ocarina?

>>741166935
>game is good because it never had a challenge, which I describe as "flaws"
>other game is bad because I had the slightest adversity

>>741165970
The difference is that traversing Hyrule in BotW is actually fun compared to OoT press roll(or side step if you're an autistic speedrunner) to get to the destination faster

>>741167083
>strawman
kill yourself retardo, I never said it's bad.

>>741167201
also I missed the last bit where you're literally just asking for a walkthrough instead of playing the game and figuring it out, truly OoT's smartest fanboy

>>741167257
>>741167201
>>741166935
and the absolutely horrible scanline shader over everything, holy fuck dude you're a parody, a perfect example of why you should never take OoT fanboys seriously, absolute braindead NPCs that simply don't play videogames

/v/'s hate of OoT is peak contrarianism, especially since anons worship MM which plays almost exactly the same.

>>741167257
>>741167330
>asking for a walkthrough
Where? I was asking what happens if the moon hits on the first day when you don't have the ocarina if the game ends. I already have one, faggonio. How am I a fanboy if I only just played it? I don't even play Nintendo games lmfao.

There’s no reason to not spam the insta spin attack once you discover the input

>>741149598
The core is solid and fun, but a lot of the way the mechanics are built is genuinely dated.
>slow scroll dialogue
>slow animations for all kinds of actions, like playing the ocarina
>at least the 3D remake fixed boots/tunics, in the original even that required a slow menu
>Hyrule Field is ultimately mostly a bunch of empty space
>Epona riding was revolutionary for its time but feels clunky to control today
>combat is LAUGHABLY easy
>some puzzles are genuinely fun, some are babby tier retarded with massive arrows painted on the floor or "ooo hit BOTH of these switches!" tier, especially child link dungeons
>money is meaningless
>the sidequests mostly don't have interesting rewards, and are only worthwhile for completionism
>the minigames are clunky as fuck
>villages and towns are barebones, making the world feel empty by modern standards
>Hyrule in particular is a minuscule setpiece due to the technological limitations of the time

A lot of it stems either from 3D games being relatively new, or from the technological limitations of the time. For what it was, one of the first transitions to 3D, it is really fantastic and it really nailed more things than it failed. It's still a GOOD game by today's standards, and it's still fun; it just does have obvious flaws and it could be done better today. Similarly on the technical side - it was great for the hardware of the time and surprisingly much of the game really holds up today if you're fine with the retro style; but some areas really suffer from the limitations, notably the lack of proper towns, and the flat low poly emptiness of Hyrule Field.

>>741167431
Why can't you simply accept that Ocarina of Time is not perfect?

Much of this thread is people expressing valid flaws with the game which you're assigning as "hate".

>>741167172
Yeah, no sorry, slow walking for 10+ minutes with a stamina bar is not my idea of fun.

>>741149598
>People keep claiming that's its a product of its time and it's aged like milk
no they don't.

>>741167681
Pressing roll from point A to B is?

>>741167586
Literally none of those things can be "dated" since they were specifically nintendo tropes that they still do, and everyone always hated it. Every chest and side gimmick being completely worthless kills it for me, there's zero sense of reward and economy going on.

>>741167330
The only one that's a parody here is you kek. Losing your fucking mind over someone expressing joy at playing OoT and then shitting yourself in turn over MM getting the slightest bit of criticism, which it's not even criticism, more like saying it's somewhat challenging at the start with the whole new mechanic and time limit and not knowing what to do. And the first loop was still cleared without failure anyway. Are MM fanboys seriously this autistic? What a fucking loser LOL

>>741157443
BotW has all the elements to make an amazing game and I wish BotW followed OoT's formula. It's got an interesting and well crafted overworld map. It's got NPCs that do shit, it's got tons of random encounters and interesting stuff scattered on the "empty" parts of the world map. It's got a massive scale that's honestly impressive, kids playing OoT back in the days could only dream of a world like that.
Unfortunately BotW then throws away all concept of going across the world to visit proper dungeons or explore properly unique areas, and populates the entire world in like three varieties of enemies or whatever.

Imagine a BotW with proper enemy variety, with the central massively open world leading to a variety of areas with a more linear traversal path that would each culminate in a massive dungeon, at LEAST as deep as OoT's but ideally with a scale to match the rest of the world. Imagine what could have been, if 99% of the game was not reduced to "traverse open grass field and fight sneedoblin variant #959 (it's the same as every other but it has two shiny pixels on its butt)" plus a bunch of irrelevant shit like cooking and item durability

I genuinely think Skyward Sword did good things with its pre-dungeon areas. It had tons of other issues, but a modern game could easily have a BotW-like central hub overworld, SS-like specific challenge areas leading to classic, OoT-like dungeons. But none of them do that.

>>741168139
I'm not even a MM fan and you can shit on that game as much as you want, it's just that everything you've posted is deeply retarded and shows a very deep lack of human-level thought.

It lacked proper camera control that came with dual analog sticks.
It was barren of enemies.
Obviously the technical aspects of the graphics were severely limited. What was the greatest thing ever done at the time is obviously the weakest aspect.
My at the time 12 year old sister who didn't really play games beat this one.

>>741167956
I'm pretty sure animations for random shit are faster in modern games, they've at least got UX improved so you're not interrupted with a mini cutscene every time you need to interact with some item in your inventory. TotK has the shitty fucking crafting menus but IIRC BotW isn't even that bad, it's just a consequence of bloating a bunch more content onto existing systems without rethinking them. (Skyward Sword's item select wheel even lets you use all of your items at any time with barely any interruption at all.)

The overworld has at least improved in recent games, especially the WiiU and Switch ones. At the cost of everything else of course but you can't say an open empty field is a Zelda trope anymore. SS also did it in a different way.

BotW horses work decently well.

Villages, towns and NPCs have absolutely gotten better over time. It's never become absolutely amazing but it's also definitely clear that OoT's cities are a product of its time. Fuck even Twilight Princess had a more populated Hyrule City, as boring and drab as it was, it felt less claustrophobic and minuscule than OoT's.

>>741149598
Ship of Harkinian fixes everything

It’s too easy, some of these bosses even in the adult dungeons go down way too fast. Morpha and Bongo Bongo, what’s the deal with that?

It's just the facts. Genshin Impact looks amazingly good while running on a phone. If we look at the two games side by side objectively, without bias, it's way beyond OoT, but even by today's standards this is already a feat of technology.

>>741168718
>genshin impact
kusoge

>>741149598
It ran at sub 20 fps

>>741167778
The difference is that going from Kokiri village to Kanariko is one minute of rolling away.

Genuinely honest, just the frame rate. Going from 120FPS to 15FPS takes a long longer for me to adjust to than back when I was a console peasant who just got used to 30FPS. Outside of that? Nothing.

>>741149598
Theres too much downtime and long winded nongameplay between each area

Ship of Harkinian mostly fixes this though

Zoomers won't understand that OoT was THE "moviegame" before moviegames were a thing. There was no other game that came close to creating an experience like it with the set pieces, music, exploration, puzzle solving, combat, cut scenes, etc. Nobody ever considered it "too slow" or "too easy" the first time playing it when you had to figure out all the puzzles and enemies on your own without just looking it up on GameFAQs or whatever. I don't think I would replay OoT every year, but as a game you replay every 5-10 years it's fine. It's more about enjoying the experience than the "gaminess" of it. OoT and SF64 are the greatest games Nintendo ever made in my opinion.

>>741169619
>framing a moviegame as a good thing
>not even being aware of MGS which came out the same year or the hundreds of FMV games that came before and literally played out like movies with real actors
retarded-ass nigger post

>>741165970
>botw bad because everything is not next to each other
That's some cope. You realize there's multiple ways to get around right? The entire point of open world games is to get lost in them and to have to travel through them.

>>741166606
Thanks anon I appreciate your honesty. Also you really prefer original UT over 2k4? I think 2k4 was peak. It had so many game modes including Onslaught and Assault, so many maps, vehicle warfare, mutators, etc, etc. The content was insane. I could never go back to any previous Unreal games after 2k4 came out. Shame about 3 and 4. 4 is playable right now but with a basic bitch bombing run and around 3 players and that's it.

>>741170840
Travelling through an empty field is not fun. BotW is almost good, it's not quite as empty as Wind Waker, but it's nowhere near interesting enough to be the entire game. Even Wind Waker had proper dungeons.
The point is that in OoT, Hyrule Field is pretty empty and boring, but ultimately small, and a tiny fraction of your playtime will be spent with it. In BotW, the open world is kinda cool, and could be fun to traverse, but it's simply nowhere near fun enough to be 100% of the game.

>>741149598
Your mother articulates my name while gargling my balls LMAOOOOOO wrecked gg ez.

>>741168157
Doesn't BoTW have more enemy variety than OoT and pretty much every other Zelda game? Also I preferred shrines to dungeons. I wouldn't mind if we went back to dungeons but shrines had so many fun minigames to beat I stopped caring about dungeons. The 4 bosses themselves were basically minidungeons.

I hope the OoT remake is based off BoTW. I really don't want a 1:1 scale remake of OoT again. I want something new.

>>741171120
>Travelling through an empty field is not fun.
You need to slow down and enjoy the atmosphere. The scenery. The immersion. It would be ridiculous if they threw nonstop enemies at you. Or if Hyrule Castle was 2 feet from Kokiri Village. There needs to be downtime between activities. There needs to be a sense of distance traveled. It's literally an adventure game, how do you expect to NOT go on an adventure? Stop being a speedrunner gamer.

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>>741171229
Botw might not, but Totk does. Totk has well over 100 different enemies, meanwhile Oot is lacking substantially.

>>741170284
Moviegames are only bad because now there's too many of them, and they usually don't have good writing or enough focus on the "gamey" elements like puzzle solving. OOT came out in an era when most other games were still very arcadey-feeling. OOT was a "moviegame" because the scope of it felt like something only movies had at that time.

>>741171451
This anon gets it. Trends suck because whenever someone comes up with a popular idea, everyone starts doing it.
e.g. pissfilter era or cinematic gaming or arena shooters or battle royale.
There's always one game beloved by all that comes up with something interest and 100 clones that quickly follow it that destroy that interest permanently.

>>741168157
>I wish BotW followed OoT's formula
It does where it matters. You do four dungeons and then enter the wider world, which is the same as the young link portion of Oot. Then there's the opportunity to do over a hundred dungeons and explore all the regions before fighting Ganon.

>>741171229
>more enemy variety
I never completed BotW but out of the parts I did see, not really. Especially not in the fucking overworld, which is a problem when so much of the game takes place running around the overworld.
BotW went the path of having a ton of variants of the same enemy. In an N64 game, a sword enemy, a sword and shield enemy, a bomb-throwing enemy, and a bow-shooting enemy would all be separate. BotW just makes like a dozen variants of bokoblins, strong bokoblins, big bokoblins, tough bokoblins, bigblins or whatever the fuck, and calls it a day. The end result is that it feels very samey and boring. You got bokoblins and you got guardian statues, woohoo.

>shrines to dungeons
Shrines are cool as a minigame IMO. But their capital sin was replacing dungeons entirely. BotW sorely lacks these major progression capstones, and the random shrines you find everywhere with no rhyme or reason are great as a bonus feature, not as a complete replacement. That's the issue.

>>741171442
I don't play Zelda to play cozyslop. Skyward Sword's sky also gave you "downtime" and was rightfully criticised. The gameplay needs to be interesting, not just travelling from point A to point B.

>>741170284
MGS does it all wrong, that's why there's that youtube series where they make Ocarina of Time just like MGS complete with all the radio transmissions.

>>741171548
The child link section is widely recognised as one of the least interesting parts of the OoT formula.

>>741171674
And the great plateau is celebrated as being good, so what's your point

>>741171596
>I don't play Zelda to play cozyslop.
well you're doing it wrong then, Dark Souls is literally more your speed. a big draw of Zelda is the comfy atmosphere, the little nuances of helping a chicken keeper, or racing a dead spirit, or rescuing men from a camp of all women.

>>741171596
Anon the entire point of an open world game is to explore and transverse. If that doesn't sound interesting to you, then you shouldn't even have an open world to begin with. It should just teleport you from the end of one dungeon to the start of a new one. The fuck?

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There are two types of aging: technical and philosophical.

>Technical aging
is the kind that's hard to notice at the time. For example, Heretic looked as good as it possibly could back in the day, but the game was locked at 35fps, 320p, 4:3, and mouse support wasn't the best. A modern port can rejuvenate it technically.
OOT also has these technical issues, the most obvious being 240p/20fps (values so low they can even cause physical discomfort). But it also suffers from philosophical aging, due to a game design riddled with serious problems. These were already obvious back then (and unlike technical problems, they weren't inevitable), and if you could see them, congratulations, you're more perceptive than 80% of the cattle who are blind to problems because brands like Zelda/Nintendo cloud their vision.

>>741171849
I dunno man, I think helping a chicken keeper is more interesting than riding across five million miles of grassland with random bokoblin camps every two minutes.
And in between the chicken gathering you always had epic dungeon adventures.

>>741171905
>explore
Exploration is only fun if it's interesting
>and transverse
Traversing an overworld makes it sound like a chore (which it shouldn't be).

>>741171905
NTA, but I literally would enjoy a few hundred shrines selected out of a menu as a little spinoff game. Just the one time would be neat.

>>741172031
They are pretty even all things considered. Helping a chicken keeper is as mundane as riding a horse around the world and engaging in some combats. Zelda is about all of the things, if you dont like one aspect too much then the series might not be for you. As the other anon said, how do you expect to do anything if you're bootyblasted over travel and exploration.

>>741168430
>Villages, towns and NPCs
A lot of games have way more barebones cities than oot though the situation could be improving. Fromsoft/botw(kinda feels that way but there is a few settlements spaced out)/FF. You can talk to npcs, grab a chicken and jump roofs, I think there's a well. Being small makes it lively.

Step 1: Install SoH
Step 2: Look at all the stuff in the options menu that you can toggle.

>>741171445
why do you need more enemies than this

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>>741173027
>randomized items
>different colored equipment and ui
>mirrored overworld
>master quest dungeons
>objective is find 100 triforce shards

It's time to play fucking Ocarina of Time

>>741173113
you dont, go play Botw, same as it ever was lmao

>>741149598
Nobody should; games don't age. Only retards trying to cope with their own aging try to claim that or graphicwhores but then again, graphics don't matter in a game.

>>741167431
Saying that OoT aged isn't a particularly contrarian viewpoint at all. A fucking IGN article will tell you that.

>>741173317
seriously though, IGN finally admitted Botw and Totk have surpassed it, and they are completely correct

>>741171445
soul

the textures are very bad
sometimes it makes me feel sick when textures on walls move
but remake will easily fix that

>>741173113
>bro, botw needs more enemies
>10 enemies..why do you need more enemies
the duality of ootsnoys

>>741166935
As someone who played Majora's Mask for the first time recently I got to say you sound completely retarded. Not just for not being able to figure out what to do at the start but also for not appreciating just how much more interesting the start of the game is than Ocarina of Time. I found myself laughing at OoT being considered the "best game ever" when just looking at how much better a job MM did at being interesting.

>>741149598
Ngl I play every oot Romhack just because it's that fun to play by itself

>>741149598
the idea that oot aged poorly is fucking hilarious and is something that is only said by people that play zero retro games. i mean just compare it to mario 64, it's 10x less clunky and jank than that game because of the camera alone.

>>741174563
Just because it's interesting doesn't make it better. You can easily tell that just by how little the time system matters in the long run.

>>741171445
>Totk has well over 100 different enemies
recolors and visual variants with no mechanical changes are not "separate" enemies

>>741149598
the #1 thing about it is that the cool new features it has are no longer novel. Its like star wars, when episode 4 first released it had the best special effects in film. now if someone watches it they wont be wowed by those things and they just judge the movie by the story.

>>741174863
>i mean just compare it to mario 64
My immediate thought is "where's the cool movement mechanics gone"? Using lock-on to compensate for bad camera has also aged as a concept.

>>741175083
good thing oot isn't a platformer and doesn't need cool movement mechanics. camera mechanics however are something that are important in most 3d games regardless of genre. also both games are great idiot, I was just using it as an example.

no jump button for one

>>741175083
>Using lock-on to compensate for bad camera has also aged as a concept.
It hasn't aged worse than just flat out having a dogshit camera with nothing to compensate for that fact.

>>741150058
>Ocarina is constantly holding itself back.
Xister, this game came out on the Nintendo 64.

There's also no other game on that console that is even remotely as good. KYS i aint reading your reddit post.

>>741174917
Tell that to Oot, it thrived on precisely that.

>>741159246
>file.png
dumb nigger

>>741159246
Game looked completely fine in the late 90s on a CRT. 3DS versions are soulless with weird looking models and animations. Screenshots of emulation is not the real experience and never will be.

>>741175784
Good movement is always wanted in an action game. And when acknowledging the different genres it's worth noting there is less of a need for a lock-on in a platformer.

>>741173182
would I still have fun with a randomizer if i barely remember anything about the game, or will I get knowledge checked?

>>741175851
It has still aged though.

>>741176472
>it's worth noting there is less of a need for a lock-on in a platformer
it doesn't need lock-on. simply having a snappier way to center your camera would suffice.

>>741176612
Depends on the settings, if you dont remember the game too much then just dont go randomizing gold skulltulas or grass, I would wager you dont remember where all those are located.

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>oot aged poorly
>Botw and TikTok are basically unplayable after a couple of years

lol?

>>741161503
You're joking right? With seventh gen right there? It was a 15 year dark age for video games. Pissfilter, mainstream normie shooter, SPORTS, artless, thoughtless cash-ins due to video games exploding financially. It was especially noticeable coming off of the fifth and sixth gens.

>>741177538
>7th gen
>dark age
bahahahaha

Played it when I was a kid. Playing it now (I'm 6 dungeons in).

Stuff that's timeless:
>OST
>sound design
>art direction
>strangely, some of the cutscenes are actually very memorable or otherwise make a strong impression, even ones like Kaepora Gaebora carrying you down from Death Mountain or back to Castle Town from Lake Hylia
>atmosphere, especially in dungeons

Stuff that was impressive at the time and you can't fault for aging:
>the graphics
>a lot of the generic NPC models are noticeably lower quality than others, and it isn't surprising that they weren't reused in MM
>quality of life, especially regarding dialogue
>the controls, at times (these will be fixed)

Stuff that has aged badly:
>the combat, enemies, and bosses are very rudimentary
>most enemies fulfill only one, narrow function, and badly at that; it takes a long time for enemies to be presented in novel contexts that add more depth to how you interact with them
>the puzzles are nowhere near varied enough
>rewards for exploration and side puzzles are almost always rupees you can't hold, get owned
>worthwhile rewards like magic, quivers, pouches, bottles, etc. are concentrated behind very obvious side quests and minigames
>several progression gates are surprisingly annoying, and Navi or Saria explicitly telling you what to do feels like a failure of game design
>the way that the world is laid out is incredibly dated, and there's a lot of awkward backtracking and criss-crossing through Hyrule Field

>>741177583
Without any hint of doubt.

>>741177651
To give an example of two of these "aged badly" problems intersecting, I got the master sword with about 150 rupees in my wallet. I entered a hole in Hyrule Field where a small chest gave me 5 rupees (wow), and then decided to go to Death Mountain instead of the forest out of curiosity. I tried playing the song of storms in front of Goron City and found another secret hole with a small chest that gave me 200 rupees, of which I could only hold 45. Then I ended up doing a side puzzle in Goron City that I'd ignored as child Link (the maze of rocks you blow up), which rewarded me with 2 small chests. Thinking that one of them would replenish my bombs, of which I only had 2 left, I opened both and got 50 rupees x2, none of which I could hold. I gave up and went to the Forest Temple.

After being taught the Minuet of Forest, I desperately didn't want to go into a dungeon with a full wallet and 2 bombs. I decided to go back to the Temple of Time, go back in time, buy the Goron tunic as child Link, sell a poe I had to the poe collector, and then buy some bombs. So I walked my ass back through the Lost Woods, through Kokiri Forest, across Hyrule Field, into the Temple of Time, and lo and behold Sheik was sitting there cucking me out of going back in time, even though I'd just talked to her 10 minutes ago at the Forest Temple.

Just an incredibly fucking annoying and cumbersome process. I've come to just completely hate rupees and Hyrule Field.

>>741177583
he's not wrong, the beginning of the end, way past the golden age

>>741151715
>it's a waiting puzzle
my nigger, what kind of puzzle can be done instantly?

>>741177660
7th gen was when video games really started being real things that people played and enjoyed, lmao

>>741176267
the whole series thrives on that, a large number of problems you can levy at OoT can be thrown not just at the 3D games that followed its example but also 2D games it derived from in the first place. Zelda is a very "economical" series

>>741149598
Playing it now but the jabu jabu dungeon makes me nauseous, think i'm gonna quit

>>741177651
>the combat, enemies, and bosses are very rudimentary
I'm replaying Twilight Princess and it really feels like they still haven't improved any of these. I think basic, boring combat is just a staple of the 3D games at least.

They cloned OoT up until BotW, so it clearly didn't age much. People saying the game aged are being blinded by graphics. I saw a friend play it for the first time recently and he felt no friction.

>>741177660
bahahahaha

>>741178450
No they didn't, they took the worst part of ocarina instead of the good parts ocarina. (xbox huge open world, boring dungeons, useless items, etc).

so WW and TP feel like bloated boring messes where nothing is coherent. BotW and TotK are dogshit, not a single good thing about them

>>741178204
Maybe not by Twilight Princess. I think Breath of the Wild actually has a few really fun, well-designed enemies that can be dispatched in varied ways, but there's problems there too. The obvious one is that there's too few of them. Another is that aside from guardians and lynel, they're not very dynamic and there's no motivation to do anything but dispatch them in the most effective, efficient way. Because the game's so big, there's so little enemy variety, and the environment design is so much more open-ended (and therefore lacks interactable elements for the enemies to interface with), every enemy - even guardians - is rapidly reduce to a same-y chore that interrupts your exploration. The cyclops and golem mini-bosses are the worst in this regard.

I think it's entirely possible to make enemies interesting in a traditional Zelda game; in fact, it's probably easier than in a game like TotK or BotW. They need to figure out how to ground enemies in the environment. Think about how basic Dark Souls enemies are, yet people still talk about the Anor Londo archers. An ideal game would do this while retaining BotW's level of physics / environment interaction, but that's outside of the scope of traditional Zelda.

>>741177782
Just say 7th gen was when you turned 8

>>741178757
There's also the problem that a variety of methods in defeating foes = parts mixing and tool usage more than anything, because every weapon is only slightly more advanced than N64 mechanics thanks to a manual jump attack and expending them as throwables. If you just give Link a sword and shield, the actual moment to moment combat mechanics in BotW/TotK are still absolutely barebones and rely a lot on the sandbox and enemy weakpoints/weaknesses to actually make anything interesting out of them.

>>741178768
just say 7th gen is when you turned 40

>>741178450
>They cloned OoT up until BotW
So Wind Waker and Twilight Princess which people consider the weaker titles.

>>741178995
They should just roll all the interactivity back into a smaller number of traditional Zelda items. I'd rather have like 8-10 items with a decent amount of depth that can all interact with each other than 30 different flavors of weird throwable thing that only does one or two things in niche contexts.

>>741177782
>video games really started being real things that people played and enjoyed
>the moment it died and the decadence began

>Muh empty Hyrule Field
This is pissing me off because everyone saying this is outing they/themselves as a zoomer. Before the days of constant internet access via phones it wasn't uncommon to play and replay games trying to find different things. If you played this game as a kid (as I did), you didn't just make a beeline for the next quest objective. You would explore and try to find hidden areas. There are quite a few in the game (including in Hyrule Field), and it gave you a reason to believe that there were even more places in the game that you didn't know about.

>>741181063
meanwhile you already had a shitload of WRPGs and JRPGs with actual open worlds you actually have to explore instead of an empty plain

>>741181214
Name 5 that were on consoles.
I'll admit that CRPGs had the edge on OOT, but they were marketed at a different demographic.

>>741181214
>actual open worlds you actually have to explore instead of an empty plain
This is a detriment; this strays you from game progression and you'd end up with Ubisoft tier bloat

>>741160220
I got a good laugh out of this as well, excellent post

>>741178450
Having replayed it recently, the biggest issues were the camera and the item menu. The rest held up rather well.

>>741181314
JRPGs were almost exclusively on consoles and the Ultima brand of open world RPGs was already an ancient genre with many other subgenres, including MMORPGs. Never did I think of OoT as innovation in anything and I doubt anyone did.

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>>741173317
>i base all my opinions on what ign says
jesus christ

>>741181557
And what JRPGs/console Ultima clones have an "actual open world" instead of an empty plain?

>>741177651
>the way that the world is laid out is incredibly dated, and there's a lot of awkward backtracking and criss-crossing through Hyrule Field
Only if you're a retard and don't figure out the shortcuts. A classic example is learning Saria's song. Sure you can go the long way and run all the way back to Kokiri village but if you pay any attention at all the clue will lead you to the shortcut in Goron City to the lost woods.

>>741181751
All of them? Hell Ultima II has the literal entire planet in 5 different timelines, and Ultima VI went away with scale shifting by introducing a completely seamless world with wilderness, towns, dungeons with object permanence all in the same space, NPCs with daily schedules and day/night cycle, and that's 8 years older than OoT. I facepalm whenever fanboys try saying OoT had a remotely impressive world or tech.

>>741181809
I know that these shortcuts exist, but they aren't as useful as you'd think. A lot of your time is spent going to castle town or Kakariko, especially if you're doing the mask side quests, and these locations are the least served by the Lost Woods shortcuts to Goron City / Zora's Domain. The real shortcuts come relatively into the game, in the form of the light, shadow, and spirit songs. The forest song is useful too, but you get it as soon as you're an adult.

I guess the real issue is Hyrule Field. If you value your sanity, you shouldn't do any backtracking / side quests whatsoever until you've finish the Forest Temple.

>>741176389
>Game looked completely fine in the late 90s on a CRT
No, it didn't lol. Ocarina of Time is ugly as sin there were better looking games in 1998, before 1998 and after 1998.

>Screenshots of emulation is not the real experience and never will be.
It's recording of a real N64