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File: marveloustencent.jpg (184 KB, 901x1332)
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https://x.com/Wario64/status/2069294115867537674

The guillotine is over Marvelous' neck now. Make a new Senran Kagura or die.
>>
>>741685347
>Make a new Senran
>Cant sell it on console
>Cant sell it on Steam
>Game sells 5k copies and studio dies
>>
>>741685951
You can sell it on Switch 2 (see LoveR Kiss) and Steam makes exceptions if the publisher is major enough (see Chaos Head Noah)
>>
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>>741685347
>Good news
>Biggest finance left
>>
>>741686069
Chinky influence pulling out is good. And if Marvelous dies it's because they were too up DEI's ass to save themselves.
>>
https://www.reddit.com/r/UpliftingNews/
>>
>>741686069
Companies should be financed by customers
>>
>>741686205
That didn't go so well with Senran ain't it
>>
Just a month ago, Marvelous appointed Tencent as their Controlling Shareholder who has the most influence and can direct the company

https://corp.marv.jp/english/img/260515_Shareholder.pdf

This must be very sudden news for them
>>
>>741686542
they fucking did what!!?

okay. i hope this kills them. fucking traitors opening their whole ass goatse style for chinkoids
>>
They've been doing fine lately, they can survive as long as they avoid more high-profile (*) flops like Titanic Scion.

(*) for their standards
>>
no great loss. does Marvelous even make anything aside for 4th rate farming sims? Senran Kagura was their one big game IP and they killed it because californians demanded it.
>>
>>741685347
Good, get FUCKED you NIGGERS. You ate shit for years and the final turd is getting squeezed out.

I have the last laugh now gacha niggers. No more sonybro scapegoating
>>
>>741686858
Harvest Moon/Story of Seasons was always way bigger. No individual Senran Kagura game ever sold one million copies like a couple SoS games have.
>>
You sealed your fate by paying for mediocre spinoffs instead of demanding a 2 port
>>
>>741685347
>marquee studios like PlatinumGames
Is Marvelous somehow less successful than Platinum or something? Platinum lost almost all of their talent and Ninja Gaiden 4, their only game in years flopped. They must be making some live service shit that keeps the Tencent moneymen interested.
>>
>>741686069
Yes
if only chinks can abandon their shares in kadokawa/fromsoft now so we can see some REAL kino happen.
>>
File: muramasasteam.jpg (150 KB, 576x834)
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>company was going kino again
>fucking dies
At least let this come out. Please.
>>
>>741685347
Will we get non censored Senran Kagura games again, now?
>>
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>XSEED will die
holy SHIT
>>
>>741686858
Marvelous owns XSEED which is practically just an empty shell nowadays since they lost Falcom games

Marvelous USA does most of the publishing for Marvelous

The only shit they've done lately are pretty much ports of the shit they have the rights of that aren't Marvelous games

Like: >>741687279
And the recent Ys ports for Switch
>>
>>741688043
GOD BLESS CHINA
>>
>>741688043
>Xsneed will file bankruptcy in our lifetime
couldn't be happier
>>
don't they own no more heroes? i could see them making a new game of it instead of senran to make some quick bucks with a safer bet but i don't consent
>>
>>741688846
3 was shit
Also Grasshopper is going to be affected by this, though for them its the Netease situation. Tencent and Netease are withdrawing all funds from foreign studios. Romeo might be their last game.
>>
>>741686982
>CHINKS ARE TAKING OVER KADOKAWA!!
>look inside
>Oasis Management - Activist Hedge Fund
>Founder: Seth Fischer
>Education: Yeshiva University NYC
>>
>>741688846
XSNEED screwed over Senran so hard for the west

I will never forgive them
>>
>>741688846
They don't value it that much. They made the NMH1 and 2 HD remasters and lent the IP to Grasshopper for five years to makes TSA and NMH3, but IIRC it was because Suda himself asked rather than great interest from Marvelous itself.
>>
>just keep making endless remakes of old harvest moon games and fucking doremon farming
>still waiting on a sequel to story of seasons trio of towns
fuck marvelous
>>
>>741686936
they are making a ninja turtles game
>>
>>741685347
will the next story of season game be good again
>>
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>>741689104
13 years ago, XSEED were like this

Fuck them

https://thewiredfishnetwork.com/2013/05/08/xseed-looking-into-localizing-senran-kagura-games-but-afraid-due-to-cultural-differences/

Senran was already falling out of favor, but it didn't help that the people who actively localized them utterly despised them
>>
>>741689104
How so? If anything I remember other parts of the industry screaming at them to never localize Senran games and they did it anyway, in one case even telling Nintendo Magazine UK who was trying to organize a boycott to fuck off. They also ensured the Steam release of Burst Renewel remained uncensored after Sony became Snoy.
>>
>>741689235
The main people who localized the game hated them, on streams they would often show disgust at the mere mention of Senran

Namely Tom and Hatsuu who both got fired as soon as XSEED lost the rights to localize for Falcom games
>>
>>741689147
The 3ds games will almost certainly be what they start remaking next.
>>
>>741686117
>Chinky influence pulling out is good
Explain why then?
>>
>>741689321
>20+ more years of remakes until they run out of material
but i doubt they'll last that long, everyone is tired of their shit
>>
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>>741689381
lol
lmao
They are doing way better now after POOTs failure. The Grand Bazaar remake is highly rated everywhere.
>>
>>741689457
FUCK, who keeps buying these remakes!?!
>>
Why does China make /v/ seethe so much?
>>
>>741689457
>POOTs failure
Critically maybe, but it sold over 1M copies. I think Grand Bazaar is almost there too.
>>
>>741689351
chinks have sabotaged jp games for over a decade at this point
>>
>>741689305
>Tom
I'm sure he's was the only one against any censorship, I remember him writing about that on neogaf.
But he then left when the other employees were against him.
>>
>>741689561
For no reason at all
>>
>>741685347
>[Good News]
Don't you mean [Marvelous News]?
>>
>>741686542
Anon, I think it states the opposite
>Therefore, the independence of the Company is ensured. The
>Company and Tencent maintain a close partnership and strive for continuous growth,
>development, and improved results, with full respect for mutual autonomy and independence
>>
>>741687356
Hope you learned enough japanese by now because thanks to payment processor niggery they will be banned by NoA and steam will happily ban it without even getting orders to do it, leaving the jp nintendo eshop as the only place to play it.
>>
>>741690409
Some devs nowadays include English even if the game isn't going to be sold on western storefronts.
>>
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>>741689104
the senran IP holder fucked over senran, such is the mental damage from suddenly getting cut off so hard from the hard drug known as "fancy sony bribe dinners"
xsneed was just the killing blow
>>
>>741690464
Hope they cut off pointless costs by axing the westoidese dub and translation entirely.
>>
It's interesting to see the second video game crash unfolding in real time.
>>
>>741690409
You mean, the good ending?
>>
I wish the people who impose restrictions in game design because they want to control what people see long painful freak accidents.
>>
>>741690754
Yes, but I'm warning the subhumans to stop being subhuman and learn japanese already.
>>
Please let NISA die next
>>
>>741690832
Based. Any good resources?
>>
>>741691048
Themoeway and go into immersion asap.
Don't pay for shit, anything that tries to sell you something is a literal grift, you can learn everything you need with the basic kaishi anki, a conjugation sheet, and anime/manga/vidya.
>>
>>741691196
Nice! Thanks anon!
>>
>>741690995
There was a recent interview with their former president who said at the time of leaving, Falcom games made up over half of NISA's revenue. And now NISA has seemingly lost the Falcom license to Gungho, so...
>>
>>741691553
GOOD
all westoids deserve to die in the streets for ever fucking with jp games
would be nice if they got raped to death by the shitskins they helped bring over but even just starving will do
>>
>>741688043
>back in the day they used to be our guys along with Fatlus
I hope Tom is doing well wherever he is now.
>>
>>741692616
Isn't he just a loser teaching English in Japan now?
>>
>>741686007
>You can sell it on Switch 2 (see LoveR Kiss)
It would only be allowed in Japan which means it would sell like shit because Japcattle don't buy games any more, all they know is roll they gacha and supacha their favorite e-whores. Even back in the day, games like Senran Kagura and Neptunia always sold more in the west. Even in Japan, it wouldn't be allowed to have stuff like Intimacy Mode and clothing damage would be neutered to 3DS levels (see Tokyo Clanpool, every qureate game since Prison Princess 2).
>and Steam makes exceptions if the publisher is major enough (see Chaos Head Noah)
LMAO, do you really, honestly think they will have a single compunction about kicking Marvelous in the shins, especially when they don't have Tencent backing them any more? Hell, I don't even think Chaos;Head could pull off what it did in 2022 any more because Horses had almost the whole media backing it too and had the excuse of being an "artsy" western game instead of a problematic Japanese sexy anime game which inherently inspires contempt in normalfags, yet Steam still refused to unban it.
Point is, this is hardly the glass break scenario you think it is when Senran Kagura has so many barriers to being successful now. Most likely they'll just keep doubling down on making gay farming sims for the wine aunt audience because that's their main income now. If they do make a new Senran, it will be the most lame, censored shit imaginable (even more than Nepran Ninja Wars) and will just exist as proof that something like Senran shouldn't be attempted in the post MeToo world.
>>
>>741685347
Bump for interest.
>>
File: 1776574116052276.png (1.06 MB, 1920x1080)
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>Blue Reflection revived and cucked for modern audiences
>Marvelous teasing a new "global standards"-friendly Senran Kagura game
>New Neptunia mainline after a decade, but now with obviously censored designs
>Aquaplus talking about bringing back Dungeon Travelers after the last Utawarerumono game had zero fanservice
>Inti Creates teasing Gal*Gun
You know, maybe all those people hoping that these developers were all waiting for Switch 2 to go full otaku mode again were right, except since Nintendo bitched out and became Snoy on steroids, now it's all going to be cucked. This was going to be our year and Nintendo betrayed us all. I hope the next crazy Jap bomber gets through and blows that gaijinsucking yellow nigger Furukawa and his company straight to Hell.
>>
>>741687279
That explains the ultimatum marvelous hit VW with, they are about to get fucked and needed a big hit.
>>
>>741695530
>nintendo's just as bad

my copy of lovers kiss on my desk says otherwise
>>
>>741695541
Well shit, maybe I should pirate Muramasa instead.
>>
uh oh compile shart fag melty
>>
>>741695337
>It would only be allowed in Japan which means it would sell like shit because Japcattle don't buy games any more, all they know is roll they gacha and supacha their favorite e-whores. Even back in the day, games like Senran Kagura and Neptunia always sold more in the west. Even in Japan, it wouldn't be allowed to have stuff like Intimacy Mode and clothing damage would be neutered to 3DS levels (see Tokyo Clanpool, every qureate game since Prison Princess 2).

When in the fuck did Japan itself get so fucking lame? 2013? 2008? 2004? 1998?
>>
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>>741686007
>You can sell it on Switch 2 (see LoveR Kiss)
Yeah, and this is the numbers you can expect from that
>17. [NSW] LoveR Kiss: Endless Memories (Dragami Games, 11/27/25) – 3,435 (New)
Switch 2 version didn't even chart btw. Seem enticing to you? Blame Nintendo for blocking them from the west, but also blame the Japs for abandoning everything for gachashit and forcing these developers to rely on the west to begin with.
>>
>>741689654
Explain why half of the anime coming out every season are dogshit romcoms
>>
>>741688043
Tom was ultimately right, once they started advocating for censoring their localizations everything went to shit and they slowly but surely lost all consumer trust. Niche game companies can't afford to fuck over their customers while hoping normalfags will buy niche games, they're niche for a reason.
>>
>>741693292
Not sure, but I seem to remember he indicated he could go back to more boring Japanese translation work where he wouldn't have to deal with in trannylator bullshit.
meanwhile I think Hatsu became a camwhore or vtuber or something.
>>
>>741695783
> [NSW] LoveR Kiss # <ADV> (Kadokawa Games) {2020.02.27} (Â¥7.800) - 5.838 / NEW <60-80%>

fun fact the PS4 version didn't chart on release either but you'll never bring that up because you are a anti-japanese sony fanboy
>>
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>>741695938
She became a pretty awful VA
>>
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>>741695763
A few years before Covid, when gacha really started taking off with stuff like Fate/Grand Order and Kantai Collection. Prior to that, games like Senran Kagura and Moero Chronicle sold a much healthier ~20-30k in Japan if not upwards of 50k. Still not comparable to what they did in the west but much more enticing development prospects for Japan-only development, a niche A/AA developer like Compile Heart or Marvelous could probably make a living on such sales. But around 2018, sales for games in Japan started collapsing with the sequels to Omega Labyrinth, Mary Skelter, etc. selling less than 10k. The death of the Vita and 3DS, the last true handheld consoles, accelerated this since these budget A/AA games now had to compete for space with the big AAA boys on HD consoles like PS4 and Switch instead of just their walled handheld gardens. Thus why games like Omega Labyrinth Z started trying to come westward to get more sales to fill the void, only to get hit with regulatory backlash that lead to the great Sony censorship fiasco that just destroyed the vast majority of development for these games. Once stuff like Blue Archive hit the scene in the 2020s, gacha specifically designed to draw in the people who used to buy Vitacore moe ecchi games, it was over. Almost EVERY SINGLE former Nep/Senranfag I've talked to is now completely addicted to Blue Archive, it completely oneshotted that audience to an extent you can't even imagine. Japan's game market is now 90% mobile gachashit and ads for it have completely taken over Akihibara, the otaku Mecca.
>>741696064
This is just proving my point btw, sales for these games have just continued to trend down in Japan over the years and you'd have to be stupid to want to be confined to such a dying, stagnant market in 2026.
>>
>>741689097
>He doesn't know about how deeply embedded the Jews are in the matters of Chinese business and economy.
>>
>>741696373
This, just compare how the top 10 famitsu weekly games sales have cratered over the last few years. Save for a few exceptions they've been on a decline.
>>
>>741696373
Damnit, well, thanks for the comprehensive analysis chief, I didn't realize things were that dire. It does kind of contextualizes the rise of Chinese and other SEA nation indie gaming studios.
>>
>>741696458
Those exceptions being of course bing bing wahoo shit and the few heavily marketed AAA games like Monster Hunter that manage to break into the average salaryman's attention bubble, which is why the Famitsufags constantly jerk themselves off about Nintendo dominating (in reality they're just kings of an empire of dirt, traditional gaming in Japan is dying a very slow but steady death to gachashit and Nintendo is merely competitive with Playstation and Xbox in the markets that actually matter).
>>
>>741695783
>Switch 2 version didn't even chart btw
Why would it?

Switch 2 version came out April 30, 2026, and you could just buy the upgrade pass.
>>
>>741685347
Having a big company behind them was the only thing they had for resisting censorship, this isn't good news at all
>>
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>>741696674
It also contextualizes why Japanese gaming is so pozzed and lame now. They made a Devil's bargain with the west to withstand the collapse of their home market and said deal involved stripping anything out of their games that might offend the average western Twitter normalfag. Almost every significant Japanese studio now takes the ESGbux and hires western consultants, even niche ones like Falcom, because they view it as the cost of doing business in the only market that still matters. If Japan hadn't collapsed as a market, they wouldn't have to do this to survive. Again, blame the Japs for abandoning their home game studios for gachashit, this shit is all downstream of that. The next time you see some Jap on Twitter getting uppity about this, you make sure and drill into their heads that this is THEIR fault. THEY made the conditions that allowed this to happen.
>>
>>741696373
It was earlier than that, it began 2011-2013, before [A Certain Magical Gate Incident], this back suddenly for reason at the global just decided that Japanese entertainment was not dignified enough to be released to broader audiences so they just began shitting on just about anything Japanese made. Once [GATE] happened and exposed just how much we don't video game journalists and critics enough. It escalated to the localizers flat out intentionally refusing to do their jobs properly, causing this artificial need for (((consultants))) to step in and "help". All the while the same entities suffocating the Japanese, they are coddling the Koreans and Chinese for doing the exact same shit they've been harassing the Japanese to not do. It was literally just like only 2 years ago blue archive became a "problematic series" before that point it was crickets.
>>
>>741695541
What ultimatum
>>
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>>741686858
Story of Seasons Grand Bizaar is a fantastic farming game and sold more than your child predator gooning simulator ever would or will, check yourself while begging for fap material you dog.
>>
>>741697247
Make the fucking port to pc or we will find someone else to do so.
>>
>>741695530
>Aquaplus talking about bringing back Dungeon Travelers after the last Utawarerumono game had zero fanservice
>when 2 and 2-2 were denied off Steam
It will stay JP exclusive if it ever does happen. Good riddance.
>>
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>>741695337
It's so fucking over
>>
>>741695763
When the UN through American voice pushed Japan to ban possession of child porn because of (((western))) sensibilities. After that it has been slippery slope after slippery slope. 1980s desu
>>
The japs that wanna get their games to fans in the west should just get an english translation made and put it into the base game, then western fans can buy that. It wouldnt matter at that point if say NoA tried cock blocking the release in the states for example
>>
Maybe all these Jap AA and indie studios should stop releasing mediocre games at full price.
>>
>>741697395
It's just gonna get pirated on PC anyway, PC release wont benefit them.
>>
The company that released RF5 deserves only death.
>>
>>741697668
Remember when Sony under Jim Ryan, the brit, established that rule that all games made for PlayStation, even if they are Japanese only, still had to be reviewed by the Sony HQ in California? Shit like that doesn't even work. And it's not just Sony, prior to that Nintendo was having this problem back in the Wii/DS days, resulting in Reggie Fil ams burning down the first Nintendo Treehouse.
>>
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>>741697358
>seethes to fap material
>reacts with fap material
huh????????
>>
>>741697876
>t. kamitani
>>
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>>741689654
>>741695906
>blaming Chinks
>when the Japs themselves calls out the Americans for ruining their games
>forgetting the Dragon Quest video that got taken down where the artist literally called out the West for interfering in their designs
>Sweet Baby Inc
>recent happening of Visa and Mastercard banning JP game sales and doujins
You are retarded.
>>
>>741698121
just say jews already
>>
>>741696373
I had no idea SK sold better in the west
>>
>>741685951
Nigger there are literal porn games in Steam
>>
>>741698121
>>when the Japs themselves calls out the Americans for ruining their games
They call out Californians, not Americans, and Sweet baby Inc is Canadian.
>>
>>741698121
The first three talking points are showing how the japs did good
>>
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>>741696986
It's not just that (something I agree completely with you).
They don't even do gacha shit right as they are jew kike levels of greedy with their pull rates and gacha coins. Plus they are sanitized experiences depending on famous IPs that lose track after a year just so the kike CEOs old farts decide to pull the GaaS plug because they don't make enough money for their 3 apartments where they fuck 3 JK whores in each one. Oh, how lowly to only cost 2 JK whores instead of 3, let's EoS a 6 month gacha to recoup the costs.
Gooks and chinks beat them all them so easily by making what they don't do anymore: Better rates and fanservice.
Yes, I said gooks and chinks, in fact, they have better writers BY COMPARISON (before someone starts breaking my balls).
>>
>>741698257
The japanese games very commonly have the porn removed while wegslop gets a pass. It’s unlikely that SK would make it onto Steam in 2026 when games like Dungeon Travelers are shown the door.
>>
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>>741685347
>Make a new Senran Kagura or die.
Did people already forget this interview
Shit's fucked
>>
>>741698257
Recently steam denied a VN that described a teenage girl being naked in a bath while the screen was completely black
>>
>>741698653
It did come out a couple days ago.
>>
>>741698596
Japs are fucked since they keep bending over
>>
>>741698780
If they don't they get banned from western store fronts
>>
>>741698826
Downsize your shit. Check your market. Ban countries from buying your shit. Make your own digital market. So many things you can do instead of bending over to Americans
>>
>>741698423
>Japs gives up on AA for gacha
>but also lose the gacha market to chinks and koreans
lmao
>>
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>>741698204
Americans enabled them for decades now. They're as ignorant and responsible. Instead of taking responsibility, they're blaming Chinks.
>>741698303
>California
>not American
Bro...
>>
>>741698893
Japan can't rely on their own market domestically to keep their entertainment studios a float, they've been embedded into the global economy too long for them to just dip out become a self reliant market. On top of that it's not the Americans pushing them around, it's literally the entire global economic establishment imposing it's will on them, they are just wearing the masks of the Americans companies they hijacked and occupy as cover to make it seem like i's not.
>>
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>>741685347
Meh

I'm glad we got Muramasa for modern platfotms tho
>>
>>741699181
Californians are not Americans, Americans have been telling everyone one this since the 1980s.
>>
>>741699181
Don't deflect the chinks responsability. They are also fucking with censorship

>>741699276
>On top of that it's not the Americans pushing them around
It is. You must be blind if you think it's not Americans

>Japan can't rely on their own market domestically to keep their entertainment studios a float
Don't ignore the rest of what i said though. There are more ways to sell your products nowadays as long as you show a good product and a good process. If you play games you will know of companies that sell very niche games even now with limited copies
>>
>>741689038
>Tencent and Netease are withdrawing all funds from foreign studios.
Is there a contraction of the Chinese economy going on or something?
>>
>>741698893
They have DLSite but payment processors are fucking over that too. If getting a japanese CC was easier we wouldn't be having this issue.
>>
>>741699398
Tell that to the Japs.
>>741699534
>Don't deflect the chinks responsability. They are also fucking with censorship
An ESL, great. Let me guess, a seething Flip?
It's 2026 and you still don't know that Chinks do in-house censorship?
They don't go to the Japs and tell them to censor anything. If Japs do anything they don't like, they don't bother importing it. I have seen 0 reports of Japs seething at Chink censorship unlike America's censorship.
Let me guess, you think Visa and Mastercard are Chink-owned?
>>
>>741699704
I think they're pulling out of making Japanese ran studios and investments because of wukong and 3d gachas
>>
>>741699846
If you're having trouble buying from DLsite as an English person, you might be third-world.
>>
>open thread
>wumao subhumans posting
>close thread
>>
>>741699918
Wumao nigger is dat u?
In case you don't know the push for loli censorship in a lot of media comes from China and it started when they got a foothold on several investments in Japan as well as reaping profit from their endeavors in the (((western market))). Again, just like with America, the japs bent over
>>
>>741700318
Who said I did? My point is that it's affecting their content and reach.
>>
>>741699704
It's the opposite, China used to have an insanely strict regulation for video games and every chinese studios combined could only release like 20 games in a year and had to beg the government to get their sport. So they invested in non chink studios to be able to release more games and make more money.
But slowly the CCP is loosening those regulations because they see how much money they'll make so there's no need to invest as much elsewhere.
(and let's be real, every of the studio they invested in were shit and couldn't make a single good game so they won't lose anything of value)
>>
>>741697358
Rope yourself lil bro
>>
>>741699534
>Don't ignore the rest of what i said though.
How about you stop ignoring the rest of what I said instead. There's a whole other part of that quoted sentence you are refusing to acknowledge.

And if you need proof of what I mean when say Japan is too big to go back to being an isolated, self reliant economy, Sega tried to stay predominantly a Japanese release only company, and they nearly died because of it, forcing them to reassess their decision and re enter the international release market. The same thing would happen to a company even bigger company like a Nintendo, if they tried now to confine themselves to staying in just japan and limited involvement with the west, they'll hit the problem of exhausting all their sources for potential real customers, grasp desperately keep drawing in newer people who have aren't interested enough to keep sustaining them, and then they'd stagnate and bleed out existing customers while trying to find and increase in more with how small their population is in comparison to doing business with the vast global population.

Japan needs to be able to do business with the west and the US is one of the biggest western markets to have access to. This is why access to the US markets isn't being control by Americans, it's being controlled by (((westerns))). If you don't believe ask your self this, If Americans were the ones dictating the terms, wherever the Americanade games being shoved down everyone's throat?
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>>741698212
The last series total sales number we got was a bit over two million sales for the whole series. Since they tended to sell around 50k in Japan, the majority of that must be western sales. Gal Gun Double Peace sold over 100k and the vast majority of that was western sales.
>>741699918
They may not have consultants and investors all over the place like the west does, but China does the same thing the west does; they threaten to bar access to their 1 billion+ market if Japan doesn't comply with their standards. It's not as apparent as the influence of western standards, but anime studios have admitted that they take the Chinese market into consideration now and it's lead to certain things being censored or depreciated from modern anime.
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>>741700675
>ignores it again
No point going over this again

>Japan needs to
Line also needs to constantly go up constantly. When line go up grok happy

>wherever the Americanade games being shoved down everyone's throat?
Think of it like advertising. If you only show me your slop i can't know that the japs are making something nice. Because i saw your advertisement i can be more likely to spend my money on your product even though your product is a steaming pile of shit. Worked with Germany and Germans and their retarded censorship
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>>741685347
Marvelous has sucked in recent years, they've totally mismanaged Harvest Moon into a clown version of its old self, no difficulty, no death or sickness or rivalry, anything that would compliment that sense of a life sim and the darker aspects that make the light aspects shine, just sterilized plasic HM



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