How do we fix status effects?
>>742424470Me make poison purple
>Fire also applies panic>Poison also makes the enemy sluggishboom done
>>742424470Make them strong but have them require buildup to be applied
I already did. My game has a pain meter and being lit on fire makes the pain meter shoot up like crazy. Poison makes you weak and gimps your agility/endurance just like it does irl. Also poisons from different origins have different effects so some of them are straight up a delayed instadeath.
>>742424470My favorite class in Maple Story!
if you're burning you probably should be incapacitated. you're not going to be making any action but putting the flame out.
>>742424470Poison does % of max health dmg
>>742424778What does the pain meter do?
>>742424856the higher it goes the more pain you feel
>>742424778just link the itchio you tease
>>742424470Stop worrying about making everything 100% banalced.
>>742424856it pains
>>742424856The more pain you have the more likely you are to flinch during combat and keeping the pain meter filled for prolonged periods of time can cause the brain damaged status making you lose access to a randomly chosen ability. I'm undecided if i want the effect to be permanent thoughever.
>>742424470Warframe did it already.
>>742424470Just make fire deal 6 damage instead but cease on its own after a set period of time while poison goes on forever if you don't treat it. Also needing different antidotes for different kinds of status effects IS balancing.
Make it %HP damage.>but balanceFuck the boss' feelings.
>>742424470Pokemon honestly has some pretty good status effects. What makes Burn bad isn't just taking damage every turn. It's that your Attack stat is cut in half. Your heavy hitter suddenly just isn't anymore. What makes Paralysis bad is that your speed stat is cut in half. You suddenly are not the first to attack anymore. But also there's a 25% chance that you do nothing and your turn is a waste. Status in pokemon fuck up so many things and the fact that almost everything is vulnerable to them means status is something to be feared.
>>742424470Just remove them because games aren't allowed to be fun anymore
>>742425127what do any of those mean, anon?
>>742424470fire fucks up accuracy due to them running around in a panicpoison fucks up speed/damage done because it makes them sluggish
>>742424778Sounds cool to me but being lit on fire should have more consequences than just being painful.
Mewgenics already did it best:>Fire spreads and the debuff decays over time as the fire dies out, water will cleanse. Terrain affects fire spread and splash damage. Wind attacks spread fire.>Poison is damage/turn that cancels healing
>>742425295Viral makes enemies take more HP damage, heat reduces their armor, everything else is garbage you'll ignore.
>>742425252or just reduce the % done if its a boss so its not just a cheese strat
>>742425295
>>742425103What if you're a Big Guy?
>>742425403This is grossly outdated.
>>742424470This has already been solved.Some enemies have resistances or weaknesses to specific debuffs.
i liked the burn implementation in rabbit and steel, where application deals the same amount as the hit that caused it after a set period of time - it lets you build around it by choosing to have slow skills that hit big
>>742425468yeah wtf this is the actual current effects
>>742424470The last faith did it in a fun way
>>742424470allow bosses to be affected by it.>oh look, you can cast confusion, silence, rage, zombie, stone,etc on enemies you can beat in 1-2 attacks. But not the hp sponges, that would be unfair. Gotta grind through that one
>>742424778I have a dual hp mechanic as well>>742424994>>742425057Heh
>>742425396Better yet, just have the boss have 500% HP.
>>742425539Yeah so is this.It's missing the Scaldra, Techrot, and Anarchs factions.
>>742425264Doesn't make sense why fire reduces attack. Common in jrpg, fire dragons in tactics ogre do that, too.
>>742425127Warframe's way of doing it is awful though because heat's status ailment is strictly better.>Heat>Applies a DoT based on the strongest instance of heat applied>Can be exploited by applying a single super strong heat instance + many smaller ones to do massive damage>Also lowers enemy armor which multiplies the damage they take greatly because all the toughest enemies have tons of armor>Also makes most enemies panic which prevents them from fighting and essentially stuns them>Toxin>Does a DoT that's strictly inferior>Only benefit is that it passes shields, except that's pointless because shielded enemies are weak as fuck and your Non-Toxic damage will strip their shield before toxic lets you kill them through shield anyways
>>742425354If you survive being on fire long enough through regeneration, you get increased strength and endurance. Also you get a buff character model.
>>742425703Constant ouchie makes you hit with less strenght, this is logical and common sense. Think about sore muscles.
>>742424470Do it like Warframe
>>742425354Of course. Being lit for long enough can still kill you.
>>742425539Mmo are fun mechanically
>>742425703you swing a fist with the same power and intent while it's got 3rd degree burns on it and i'll concede you have a point
>>742424470I'm always weirded out when I hear soulsfag being so happy with their status builds when in practice they're just a different color of DPS
>>742424470Where did the green poison meme even come from? Purple just makes sense.
>>742425762there are new enemies that are immune to heat, toxin, and viralso no, despite what /wfg/ will tell youviral + heat is no longer meta
>>742425853>warframe>mmolollmao even
>>742425578Do tell, I've been eyeing the game for a while.
>>742426037It is a massive multiplayer online game, yeah.
>>742424470secondary effects.Poison should do percent based damage so it scales with HP making it more effective on beefy biological enemies, it also causes enemies to be weakened and do less physical damage. Mechanical enemies would be immune.Fire would cause consistent damage based upon armor, the more armor an enemy has the higher the damage. It also panics biological enemies but deals little damage and weakens enemy defense. Mechanical enemies can overheat and become stunned if they burn long enough.
>>742425814Being on fire constantly results in death. You have like a couple of seconds more or less and will hit very hard and move very fast when on fire. If anything, accuracy goes down. Think adrenaline.
>>742426105show me the massive beyond social hubs that most games have always had.
>>742426105>4 ppl>massiveWarframe troons are so funny.
>>7424259433rd degree isn't as bad as it sounds, as long as it isn't threatening t the system.>t.regenrated large parts of the knee that was burned to the boneIf anyone is curios how long that takes, a bit more than 1.5 years
>>742424470fire deals more damage but makes enemies faster, poison deals less damage but makes enemies slower.
>>742424785
>>742424470theres nothing to fix you’re just a retarded cherrypicker retard that only plays bad normie coded games
I’m making them work differently.Being set on fire causes you to not be able to move until you put it out, as well as slowly damaging youPoisoned causes you to periodically vomit, losing some HP
>>742426038Very cool metroidvania or bloodborne vania. Story is convoluted and unnecessarily difficult to follow but done really well (watched it online). Game isn't too difficult and fun all the way. Has ng+, free decent dlc with plenty of unlockables.Iirc electricity shocks you, you are open to attacks and can't attack, fire decimate hp increasingly faster, ice obviously leaves you frozen and with low def and there's dark that inverts controls. With the dlc there are now enough weapons and spells to choose from. Very cool 2d bornevania.
>>742424778>>742425103Ok im interested provided you're really working on something and not larping.
>>742424470>FireRegular DoT>Poison1 hour debuff, if you don't cleanse it you die instantly
>>742425794Do you also become insane due to the agonizing pain you're constantly feeling?
>>742424470fire deals morale damage in addition to fire damagepoison reduces stats in addition to poison damage
>>742426661The other guy did mention a brain damaged status effect which admittedly sounds hilarious but fun.
>>742424470>use status effect on random encounter>waste a turn inflicting status on an enemy your fighter could kill with two hits>use status effect on boss>"[boss] resisted [effect]!"make them work on bosses or don't bother putting them in
fire gets buffed by oil or gas attacks, but can be doused, and enemies will make an effort to put it outpoison can be cured by spells or antidotes and applies weakness
Make a skill that applies both at once, and make them infinitely stackable.
>fireTake damage every turn>poisonReduce small % of your stats every turn, increasing the % with time
>>742424470I like what path of exile does. Poison and burn are both dots, but they do work quite differently.
>>742426195The usual status effect is more akin to burn rather being literally lit on fire.
Ok mr avant garde game designer now tell me how you'd fix paralysis vs freeze.
>>742424470Give secondary debuffs to each one, depending on the level of the effect
poison is slow dot until it's cured, gives str/end debuff that slowly decreases in intensityfire is fast dot which expires, gives a perma max hp/dex debuff until next rest/full heal
>>742424470Fire spreads between both entities and terrain. Water puts out fire.Poison doesn't.The real issue is making poisoned VS bleed distinct.
>bleed and poison are virtually identical in game>except poison can't kill the target so they just hang out at 1hp unlike bleed
>>742426229>>74242630860k+ is massive.
>>742424470Pokemon got it right>Poison does more damage over time>Burn halves your attack
>>742424826>Poison does % damage>poison damage doesn't have a timer and only cures when potion is applied>poison damage stacksNow we are talking
>>742427034That's a different story altogether
>>742425264>Burn bad isn't just taking damage every turn. It's that your Attack stat is cut in halfWasn't that only a thing in Gen 1?
>>742424470>Fire lowers Def and lasts less>Poison does less damage but lasts longerThere, now you can build a strategy upon stacking effects
>>742427064freeze takes bonus physical damage and decays into a slow if not reapplied
>>742425403This is oldIt got reworked
i like it when status effects make some of your attacks stronger, like a combo.
>>742424470Persona 5 did it great.Nuke and Psy do massive damage on enemies with ailments but remove the ailment when used.
>>742424470there's nothing to fix not everything needs to be some shitty wacky effect that's gonna end up useless garbage because killing your enemy asap is always the best and funnest startbet you faggots love damage on tuesdays too
>>742427064Freeze requires items from another party memberParalysis has a chance of going away from damage received
>>742425975It's not like we didn't have a million one shot builds that can melt level cap by using every single status and damage type around.Shit's wild and that is what makes grindframe good
>>742424856Dougs harder.
>>742425975>make enemies immune to status effects>instead of balancing them properly
>>742424470Games need more mechanics and mechanical simulation. Numberslop (Blizzard game design) is objectively trash. If fire and poison are just red and green damage numbersl ticks that you need resistances for, the game is trash designed for literal retards. Obviously this doesn't apply as much to a turn based game, but fire should come from sources of fire, should spread to other flammable things, should be made worse by something flammable, should be put out by water, and could also occasionally make the character on fire spaz out and lose control. Poison should be just a slower DoT that needs treatment, because that makes sense.
>>742424470D&D 3rd edition got this right. Fire hurts HP, Poison is an attribute debuff, usually to constitution, which means reducing maximum HP rather than the value.POE1 also does it well. Fire is stronger, but only the highest damage stack does anything (unless you use some unique item), and Poison is weak, but stacks infinitely. Burning benefits from stacking the applicator hit damage as high as it can go, while with Poison you want to be scaling speed so you can be stackmaxxing as there's no upper limit.Also, even if they're made to be the same thing in a game, they'd inherently do different damage types, so different resistances would apply.
>>742427064freeze is a stop, character's time meter stops running entirely until status relievedparalyze is a chance for actions to fail as the character twitches, just like in pokemon
>>742424856for you
>>742427064Freeze is shattered when you take damage, paralysis isn't. Freeze is cured with fire, paralysis is cured with item.
>>742425382Corrosion strips armor, anon
>>742427118>Poison/toxic does % damage>doesn't stacks>insta kill when hp reaches 5%>Bleed does % damage>stacks>causes more % damage when more stacks are applied>causes more damage the lower the hp depending on how many stacks are applied>corrosive damage>base damage is applied>stacks>stacks cause more base damage to be applied>reduces armorI wish somebody did this
>>742427157by that logic counter strike is an mmo
>>742427247No. Still a thing to this day. The only Pokemon immune are Fire types, Pokemon with Flash Fire, or Guts which doubles attack when afflicted with status. I don't know if Magic Guard protects you from the stat reduction, only the burn damage
>>742424470DoTs>Burn deals its damage to those adjacent to the burning entity as well>Poison also reduces offensive stats>Bleed stacks more easily>Infested spawns larvae after a certain amount of time, or when the afflicted entity dies>Corrosion also reduces defensive stats>Event Horizon also limits mobility
>>742427948It is.
>>742427919% damage in general is broken or has to be balanced separately for bosses/elites/whatevermight work for a slower paced game though and mechanically I like the rest of the ideas
>bleed damage creates wet surfaces upon death>fire damage causes smoke screen upon death
>>7424248564 damage every 0.5/s
>>742424563VENOM is purple you fucker
>>742427064causing enough blunt damage to frozen characters can sever body parts.
>>742424470gaming is dead and you want to make damage over time debuffs more interesting?
>>742428121Just reduce the % damage for bosses, easy. Also i really hate when they do damage immunity or damage mitigation for bosses. Just give them a huge amount of hp and a few phases. If they get melted then it is because you worked hard to make bs build and that's exactly the fun many people want.Trying to balance shit for bs builds is pointless and takes all the fun from the gaems
>>742427432>because killing your enemy asapTrue in most games, if not all. Proc'ing poison is a waste of time.
>>742427432redundancy is bad game design, anon.
>>742424856When filled it takes the mask off
>burn and poison do the same thing but they can be stacked with each other for massive DoT
>>742424856rises and falls, like me benis :-D
>>742424470Pokemon solved this immediately because burn is less damage than poison but cuts the opponent's attack in half
>>742428578that's still lame as fuck
>>742425103>pain causes staggerstop stealing my ideas anon!!
>>742427432>>742428410I like debuffs as a concept but rarely do games make good use of them. Conditional or low uptime buffs are fucking awful though. Or when you have to gain some stacks of a buff to deal damage and then it drops off in like 5 seconds. I hate that shit.
>>742427064Freeze stops the enemy until the next hit and deals big damage on shatterParalysis slows and interrupts attacks on a RNG basis
Fire in Wukong can be put down by rolling.
>>742428614youre gay and im going to rape your twink ass
>>742428624I had your ideas and now i have your code. You're finished.
>>742424856When it gets to a certain level you start typing ouch in chat involuntarily and its really annoying
>>742427432Against common trash enemies sure, but bosses should be beefy enough that the main way to deal with their mechanics should be through things other than just a DPS raceAlso having multiple types of otherwise identical debuffs is useful if your game segments their mechanics in some way, such as allowing you to stack them together rather than refreshing a duration.
>>742424470Live life and understand how pain works. The problem with so many games is that they only think of mechanics in terms of numbers and reflexes and nothing in regards to feel.Although Mewgenics did it okay without having to add something weird to the stats (burn gets reduced per turn and water elements while poison gets reduced by healing)
>>742424470Now add bleed to the equation
What are some games with neat psychological status effects?
..i like playing lockdown status characters…
>>742429436What game is this icons from?
>>742429436Darkest Dungeon has the different affliction and virtue statuses once they accumulate enough stress. Different afflictions hinder in different ways and prompt unique behaviors for different classes, with Rapturous being exclusive to the Flagellant class. Upon reaching 200% stress they have a heart attack and die. Reducing their stress to 0% can cure them of their affliction. While they are cleared upon returning to town, their history influences what afflictions they could get in the future too
>>742428835Your Freeze sounds like the usual Sleep
>>742429920Stoneshard
>>742425403Ugly
>>742425539missing tau damage
I don't want to make it seem like I'm a fulling drooling idiot who has never conceptualized "Hurr, all damage in games is just the same numbers behind the graphics!" in some form or another, of course I have. But recently I set about making my own little game, an RPG of sorts where in my head I wanted it to have all kinds of things from all of the games I really love; Randomly generated gear with tons of stats so you're always chasing an upgrade, 'unique' items with their own distinct effects that do different things in combat, statuses and enemies with different combat moves, and blah blah blah. Here's the thing: It really is very, very fucking difficult to design any of that shit in a way that is as interesting as it sounds in your head. Meaning, if my game is going to have Bleed, Burn, Poison, Rot, etc. as DoT status effects...yeah, they're all going to be the exact same thing under the hood. Because what else are they supposed to do? How are you meant to build out unique mechanics for each of them? They do damage, that's their job. You're better off just making each effect carry a hook/tag so that you can make other things interact with it while it exists, but otherwise it's just going to be the same thing happening under the hood, maybe with different numerical values based on whatever you choose to base it on. Enemies in my game don't even have stats. They have an HP value, and they have a damage value that is set by their progression number, and some types of enemies have different attacks that sometimes replace their default attack, but outside of just the base numbers being different and the sprite being different, there's nothing else going on there. If I want them to be harder to kill, I just give them a flag that gives them more HP. If I want them to be a bigger challenge, I give them a flag for more damage. That's all that exists because as a player you're just going to make the rest up in your head.
>FFT's Atheist status effect>those inflicted don't believe in gods or miracles, making them incapable of casting magic>...but it also makes them completely immune to magic effects, so they cannot be hurt (or healed) by magic skills>this means there are different situations where it's advantageous to inflict yourself and/or your enemies with the status
>>742424470DoT damage is based on the skill that inflicted it instead of having the DoT always do the same amount of damage. That way you can have the damage reasonably scale up over the course of the game to keep pace with enemies without having the issue % damage has where it needs to be balanced for both bosses and normal enemies.When balancing also consider if you want your DoT to do damage before or after an enemy takes their turn. DoTs that tick after the enemy turn need to be stronger to make up for the damage being delayed.
>>742425762>Heat>Applies a DoT based on the strongest instance of heat appliedhahaha, if only thats how it actually workedheat proc damage is entirely based off the FIRST instance of heat damage that successfully proc'd, so for example Uriel's 1's heat aura will gimp your damage significantly if you dont apply heat before the aura does because it doesnt do any damage
>>742424470Have more than one bar for them to affect.
>>742427064>freezeEnemy is frozen in place, can be shattered on impact MIGHTY FOOT ENGAGED>paralysisEnemy is not physically stopped but loses ability to control his limbs, usually falling over, takes damage if tumbling down stairs and can easily fall from ledges or other places where maintaining balance is required.
>>742424470fire can spread to other enemies if they make contactpoison also gradually slows the afflicted down more and more
>>742429321Take what this guy said >>742424778 but it drains more health with time unless treated and attacks to you deal more damage. Also in Survival Mode, temperature debuffs are worse and you need to sleep more often.
>>742426661You stop feeling any pain after you're on fire for a while.
>>742424563>mgs3 had purple poison >remake changed it to green for no reason
>>742430947SHE'S FASTSHE'S AGILE
>>742424470Fire goes away faster if you move around.Poison goes away faster if you stand still.
>>742425378I really wish more games had the approach Mewgenics has with its elements. Hell, I wish they consulted with physicians when it comes to the consequences of being attacked with different types of melee weapons and guns. For example: Shots to the side of the body deal more damage than to the front because of how organs are arranged in the body.
>>742424470hunt: showdown figured this out already.fire decreases your maximum health along with your current health.poison just damages you over time and prevents you from healing until it is dealt with.
>>742424470What is the problem with two status effects having the same practical effect? Why is that bad game design? Can you actually articulate this?Because there is an illusion of depth if the effects are not distinct? Then by that logic if two different classes can use, lets say a sword, but only a subset of classes can use a sword, there is also an illusion of depth? Every class must only have unique abilities with no redundancies whatsoever or generic abilities shared by everyone? A class is a sum of its abilities. The fact that two classes share the practical ability to inflict damage over time is the same as two classes being able to melee attack effectively. The fact that two classes can do the same one thing is not a problem within itself unless two classes can do exactly the same things only as to make them identical. Just like one class can inflict immediate damage via melee and another can as well but they can still be widely different otherwise, so can they inflict damage over time. Just like one character can only use short swords and the other blunt, so can they use fire as opposed to poison to achieve the same effect.The question is how these nominally same effects interact with the environment as well. Blunt may be strong against skeletons but you do understand that it doesn't differentiate blunt from short swords in principle. It is the presence of skeletons that does. And same, what makes fire and poison special is enemies that are weaker or stronger against them.
N*me one example of a game where poison and fire is just the same thing but named something else.If a distinction is made between fire and poison it's because there is a difference. This is a problem some fag made up in his head because they/them lacks creativity and can't think how poison and fire can be different.
>>742424470Generally speaking no ability should just be>inflicts a status effectto make it worth using it needs to be one of the three at the bare minimum>deals damage and inflicts a status effect (e.g. Poison Strike)>inflicts a status effect to all or multiple enemies at once (e.g. Poison Cloud)>inflicts multiple status effects at once. (e.g. Blinding Poison)Buffs are the exception to this, its much more useful to cast haste on a single party member than slow on a single enemy.
>>742431401If it was a problem it would be the bloat. If fire and poison are functionally the same thing then making a distinction is only adding fake bloated ''depth''But the thing is that this is not a thing. There is no game where fire and poison act the same. The two are different in many ways, from huge things to small things. Like a game may have fire spreading while poison stays on the floor. Or you could have a small thing like poisons can be cured with potions but fire can't be extinguished.
>>742431432Blue Archive has several debuffs that are functionally the same: deal damage at fixed intervals. With the damage scaling with the inflicter's atk stat.What is important is how they stack, different debuffs stack very easily. A boss can be burned, poisoned, shocked, and chilled all at the same time no problem.When you have 2 sources of the same type of debuff, they only replace the existing stack unless they come from a different type of skill. This is mostly relevant for teambuilding, as youd want to avoid having multiple units that apply the same DoT in the same manner, youd want to diversify the sources as to not waste potential DoT damage.
>>742431625Then how is having both melee and blunt in your game not bloat? They work exactly the same if we were to reduce them to the level of OPs picture. Both are do x damage once. The difference like I said is that skeletons are weak to blunt. In fire poison, even if they were the same, it would not be bloat if you have water creatures which cannot be burned but can be poisoned. Games aren't pure mechanics after all, mechanics work in service of specific content.
>>742431939>Then how is having both melee and blunt in your game not bloat?because a lot of time breakdown of blunt, pierce and slash has reason to exist>blunt bypasses armor but least lethal>slash deals most damage to unarmored targets>pierce is between
>>742424470>Fire10 dmg per second for 5s, can be removed by rolling once>Poison3 dmg per second for 30s, can only be cured by using a restorative item>Bleed1 dmg per second for 10s, then increase to 2 dmg per second for 10s, then finally 3 dmg per second for 10s. Remove by using any hp restoring item
>>742424470I like how most status elements work in dominions, since they're designed as a counterplay to combat certain strategies. Poison has its own HP bar so it ignores health regeneration and debuffs your stats. Fire inflicts burn damage which does damage based on your size so the dice roll is more volatile if you're a larger creature. Ice damage freezes and deals fatigue damage. Lots of strategies involve pushing out the spells before they have the spells to counter it.
>>742430495how can you turn someone temporarily atheist?
>>742432224But anon. Unless they literally use player equipment, enemies don't have armor. They are only labeled as armored or not. That is also an arbitrary weakness per enemy on par with being labeled a water creature.
>>742432474Make them listen to mumble rap
>>742424470>fireHeavy damage over time that spreads to oil surfaces and causes explosions if you get near barrels with gunpowder.>poisonLight damage over time that ramps up if left untreated, makes your character weaker if not healed for a while.
>>742424470we should make them more unique. fire could spread and cause nearby units to combust. poison could be an infectious disease that's contagious.
>>742424470you just make them different>poison scales with int>ramps up the longer its applied, stronger multiplier>can't stack poison, either poisoned or not>applied as a side effect to other abilities, never the main purposevs burn>scales based on application method>certain abilities apply fixed damage burns>others are based on certain stats>very low scaling>no limit to how many burns you can apply at once>common for abilities to apply multiple burns>burn ticks very infrequently>significant portion of many abilities damage is through the burns>abilities can interact and do things based on how many burns are appliedand this is just some basics to make them play very differently
>>742424856missed the perfect opportunity to respond to this with>makes you weak and gimps your agility/endurance. Also straight up a delayed instadeath
>>742424470>Fire ticks faster but has to go through shield and gets a damage reduction when applied to shield>Poison ticks slower and bypasses shield completelyBasically Fire counters regen and poison counters shieldYeah it's a rock/paper/scissor thing but it works simply and is intuitiveIn practice fire is distinctly stronger than poison but it would be reasonable to balance the two
>fireHigh base damage over time and can spread to nearby enemies and makes affected enemies run around chaotically>poisonHigh spread damage over time and removes debuffs and lowers speeds (movespeed, turnspeed if any, attack speed, casting speed if any)Against a single, powerful target poison makes more sense, against a group fire is better>>742424470Ññ
>>742424470>game offers poison spells>90% of enemies are immune to poison>game offers fire spells>Bosses are immune to Burn condition>Only good way to deal consistent damage while surviving is to stack health and armor and only auto-attack
Spiral Knights solved poison. It stops you from being able to heal. Bing bang bosh, perfect.
>>742427118I made burn deal damage based on the enemies defense, and bleed deal damage based on the enemy's max health.
>>742425403>Radiation>confusion
>>742432712>fire>dot that spreads>poison>dot that spreads>this is somehow making them uniqueplease tell me this is bait
>>742424806This. Maybe every hit tick you get slowed down, while poison simply damages. POE also made fire to apply single time while poison can stack multiple times, similarly in slay the spire where this is the whole point of poison.
>>742427064freeze causes instant death and makes the party member immune to resurrection outside of save points
>>742431401This is just a basic design principle that applies to everything not just video gamesYou don't put an extra handle on a door just because you can You can't just add redundant features without a costEverything comes at a costFor one at the simplest level you now have to draw/model/animate a whole extra set of things the same way you would have to use more resources to add that extra handleTwo you risk confusing the user and wasting their timeYou can't JUST have statuses or elements that certain enemies are weak to or notThat's a trivial waste of the players timeIn something like Pokemon you have a complex type weakness/strength chart however the types ALSO have unique identities tied to their moves and stats AND the statuses themselves have unique properties on top of thatIt's not just a cut and dry blue always does this and beats redThere's literally a water move that can inflict burn
>>742433841I think the in-lore justification is that it disables IFF systems. A few of the status effects should be swapped around to different elements honestly, but are kept in place due to balancing.
Burn: Your attack is lowered and you take damage. Some games make enemies move faster while burnedPoison: You take damage every turn. Some games have stronger poison where the damage accumulates each secondFrozen/Cold: Your speed decreases or your movements are all halved Bleed: If you make a movement, you lose health. The faster you move, the more health you lose.
fire degrade armorpoison inhibit stamina
Spiral Knights does it well with the debuffs, Shock stuns you every few seconds, Fire burns you every few seconds through shield, Poison makes you weaker and disables healing. You don't want any of them on ya.Do it like Minecraft and make fire a separate thing entirely, something you can only stop by waiting it out or dowsing yourself in water. Poison on the other hand won’t kill you, but it makes life difficult if you don’t drink a bucket of milk.Easy fix.Fire can be stacked, each stack applies an additional tick of damage every second until the status wears off. Build around applying as many stacks as fast as possible in a burst and then defending or evading while the damage ticks.Poison reduces healing while applied
>>742434430Confusion is a fun idea in theory but sadly it’s the most useless status bar none.
>>742425264I have been playing pokemon for years and i had no idea whatsoever that burn reduced attack or paralysis reduced speed. I thought it was just burn = DOT like poison except it doesnt last out of battle and paralysis = sometimes you cant attack. If thats true the games never tell you this
>>742427064Freeze vs Stun is the real problem
>>742424470>fire also lowers attack>poison also lowers defenseezpz lemon squeezy
>>742436071stun is instant, lasts longer, taking damage doesn’t break itcold applies slow that gradually ramps up to frozen, frozen enemies can be shattered for extra damage but it frees them
>>742424470I've rarely ever seen them be the exact same. Even in Pokemon, the biggest franchise out there has>Burned: Halves phys atk stat, minor damage every turn>Poison: Minor damage each turn, but can also be inflicted as a more severe version that doubles the damage every turn
>>742435753only now did I realize half of the posts in this thread are copy pasted from that tweets replies
>>742424470Make them interact with other systems.Like a burning effect "cauterizing" wounds preventing healing, Warhammer does this or Dragons Dogma where it can interact with other status effects like "oiled" or "drenched" to either explode or become dry.
>>742430495That's dumb, in reality not believing in magic makes you completely defenseless against it because you aren't subconsciously protecting yourself.
>>742438698That's how real world astral attacks work, not magic.
>>742424470Even pokemon somehow does it better>Burn does damage over time AND cuts attack in half because... Well they are burnt >Paralysis has a chance they can't move and cuts speed>Poison is admittedly just faster damage over time>Freeze and sleep... Well they do exactly what you would expect
>>742427646Yeah they're not big balance guys, remember release arbitrations?
>>742425649Play etrian odyssey
>>742435898Pretty sure it's in the fire red/leaf green teach tv thing
>>742425814sore muscles are from tissue dmg. pain by itself = more adrenaline = more strength. also some ppl most notably redheads have different pain response mechanisms
>>742427064freeze causes death unless theyre an amphibian or spider type
>>742424664Panic:Enemies can't attack while panickedSluggish:Reduces enemy ATK rateresult: enemy DPS reduced by 4hp/s
>>742428260Toxic
>>742431401>What is the problem with two status effects having the same practical effect? Why is that bad game design?Because good game design has distinct mechanical parts that interact and do things and shitty game design for retards just makes numbers go up and down and changes the damage number color.
>>742425264And the status effects aren't arbitrarily nerfed against bosses either.
>>742424470There's nothing to change in the status itself. You change how they're inflicted and how other stuff interacts with them. Poison is cured with items and spells, fire can be cured if the right other spell is used anywhere else on the battlefield. Enemies that inflict Fire tend to just inflict big stacks of Fire, enemies that inflict Poison tend to work together with enemies that punish poisoned targets.In the end, the abstraction of fighting fitness and will into HP is kind of nonsensical, if you look at it too hard. So... I don't object to something being "just a DoT" at its core.
>>742426191>Poison should do percent based damage so it scales with HP making it more effective on beefy biological enemies, it also causes enemies to be weakened and do less physical damage. Mechanical enemies would be immune. This is backwards. The amount of poison you need to hurt/kill something grows cubicly as the creature gets bigger and beefier. It's why 20 shots of liquor will kill a tiny asian woman, but do absolutely nothing to an elephant. Poison's effectiveness should scale inversely with the target's size.
>>742427064Freeze decays your body's heat meter. If the half of the meter decays you suffer [hyperthermia]. During [hyperthermia] your body's heat meter regeneration triples, but you cannot move until it's full again.Paralysis would require you create at least 5 different overlapping systems at minimum in order to make it actually immersive. Unfortunately standard human education program doesn't teach that humans (brain) are essentially computers and nerves are nothing more than power cables. So nobody would be able to comprehend those systems in the first place.The only out from this situation is to make paralysis prevent any movement or action for set amount of turns.
>>742424470Why did you write two time the same thing if you meant to say they were the same thingis this some retard AI picdo you really need ai to make something this simple
>>742424470In some games like diablo the method in which damage is applied is different. fire is ur typical dot but poison deals degeneration damage which overrides regeneration effects, making it more effective against enemies with high regen where as the fire dot may be better against standard enemies due to its higher damage per tick
