Video essays have taught me just how influential Ultima is. I have a newfound respect for this boomer series. The father of both WRPGs and JRPGs.
>Ultima>JRPGsDumb zoomer
They lied, nobody played it. PC games in the 90's were sidecrollers and adventure (point and click) games.
Wizardry is the actual father of JRPGS albeit
Majuular rules. Can't wait for his Ultima Online video.I recommend the Ultima playlist from him for everyone that wants more video essays to fall asleep to.
>>745796480>>745796482>>745796532>Getting outknowledged by a zoomer that watched youtube videos about the subject instead of actually living through itI'd kill myself to be haitch famalam
>>745796410...did you actually PLAY them?>>745796482Ultima's peak influence was in the 1980's anon. The sierra games then all were playable without mice because GUIs were just starting out then.Orign 1990shttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xh-VxgMGhQYCrusader: the evolved form of Ultima 8's engine, turned into a quasi imsim isometric arcade game.>>745796532The other parent.
>>745796480Ultima and Wizardry are both highly influential game series in Japan and are considered the fathers of the JRPG style of game.
>>745796480>>745796532not op, but while wizardry is undoubtedly important for jrpgs, final fantasy and dragon quest clearly took more inspiration from ultima
>>745796532Every JRPG that involves walking around an overworld and not just dungeon crawling took from Ultima.
>>745796532>The father of both WRPGs and JRPGs.Crazy how the Japanese ripoff and bastardize everything from the west and pass it off as their own and nip otakus just eat it up without ever realizing, lol
>>745796597Majuular is exactly who I was referring to.>Can't wait for his Ultima Online video.Same, bro>>745796724>...did you actually PLAY them?No, nor will I. I see them more as cool historical artifacts to know about. Bit too old for my blood (Which makes sense, cause the only good one released after I was born is Ultima Online)I'm playing Morrowind right now instead.
So, what, there's no JRPG that has map traveling before Ultima? This sounds like bullshit propaganda by westcels.
>>745796778You don't understand Japan at all. Their entire culture is based on that. They got their original core culture from China via Korea. They went feudal, and then they THREW AWAY their feudal culture to copy german industy and the brittish emprire. Then they copied American corporate consumer culture. And copied disney. And copied german and detroit cars. And copied IBM. And copied Xerox and the copy machines, and copied atari.They are the world's BEST at copying shit.
>>745796532Wizardry was more influential for Dungeon Crawler first person combat solo style games like Phantasy Star and Dragon Quest, it also heavily inspired the storytelling through environment style of King's Field and Demons Souls because Wizardry was famously very badly translated in Japanese so it was a very mysterious and incomprehensible game to most Japanese players.Ultima pioneered the 4 niggas in a row style of party based gameplay, quest based overworld exploring and third person combat styles of every other early JRPG
>>745796924Huh? Isn't Dragon Quest more of an Ultima like?
>>745796901You understand that there are almost no RPGs at fucking all before ultima? And we're talking about mostly text interface games.
>>745796532try actually playing ultima, wizardry and NES JRPGs
>>745796835If you want a fairly painless way to experience ultima, do this:1) Skip 1 through 3.2) Play 4 on Sega Master System, it's the easiest and best way to play it.3) Play the Dungeon Siege total conversion Ultima V Lazarus4) Play the FM Towns version of Ultima 6, 6 is when the series became very playable and got decent graphics.5) Play Ultima 7 and Serpent Isle through Exult, this is still a really good game.6) Skip Ultima 8 unless you want to suffer and be sad about the lost potential7) Skip Ultima 9 unelss you want to see the funniest buggiest, and most broken game in the series.>>745796986Yes and no. The very first DQ was more inspired by Wizardry, from DQ2 onwards, it became 4 niggas in a line, but kept he first person battles.
>>745796986That questions is debatable. Combat in DQ 1986 is more like wizardry.Ultima 1 had first person dungeon views and combat, but most of ultima is from top down for most combat.
>>745797152the first DQ is literally a streamlined version of Ultima. it has nothing to do with Wizardry other than the combatyou niggers should actually play the fucking games you talk about instead of watching youtube videos
As a zoomer that tried going through the series a decade ago, I had to stop at Ultima 6. Ultima 4 and 5 were pure absolute kino, but 6 is too much a product of its time. What innovations and groundbreaking achievements it had back then now only make it look like an outdated and extremely annoying version of modern RPGs.
>>745797152If you're trying to experience the video game history part, you really shouldn't skip 3, the introduction of 4 nigga gameplay.
>>745797203Exodus is painful to play though, and the events are re-told in later games.
>>745797201It's too bad, because there's cool shit in 6 and 7.....and a HELL of a lot of jank and growing pains. I still remember my childhood, discovering new and bizzare ways the game could get messed up by animating random objects in 6.
JRPGs never evolved past Ultima V, and maybe that's a good thing.
>>745797272Maybe a money cheat to reduce grind.
>>745797201Yeah, I really didn't like Ultima 6 and 7. Particularly 7 with that fucking ass perspective.Didn't even try 8 and 9 cause no one likes them.
>>745797293I fucking wish JRPGs still played like U5 instead of being hallways between cutscenes simulators
>>745797187No, it's like 70% wizardy:First-person, isolated screen combat against single monster groups.Menu-based command choices for fighting, spelling, and running.Reliance on magic points (MP) instead of complex Vancian spell slots.Numerical stat growth and grinding for experienceTorches and Radiant spells: Dark dungeons require purchasing torches or using MP on light spells, which slowly burn out just like Wizardry’s "Milwa" spell.Key management: Special doors block progression, requiring players to buy and manage limited inventory slots for keys to explore further.Stat-draining tiles: Swamps and hazardous floors drain hit points with every step, mimicking Wizardry's hidden pit traps.Isolated encounter screens: Moving through the world suddenly cuts to a separate, abstract screen focused entirely on the enemy and text menus.
>>745796532Wizardry aged incredibly well and is basically a JRPG series now so the continuity is obvious. Ultima had some influence but was always pretty bad and was the breeding ground a lot of W"RPG"isms.
>>745796901there's no JRPG that predates Ultima
>>745796901Ultima is older than the NES
>>745797479Much of what ultima tried to do was be the leader in immersion. In mechanics that didn't tie directly into the gameplay loop of gaining power and killing shit, but to try to make the world richer , and more mechanically interactive. And this isn't just on the proto imsims of underworld. Hell, they day night activity cycles of ultima 5 are well beyond most RPGs to this day.>>745797660I mean RPGS around this era are frequently mostly piles of text.
Check out this faggot's blog, there's tons and tons of interesting stuff you have never even heard of.>https://crpgaddict.blogspot.com/2021/06/brief-everything-we-know-about-1970s.html
>>745796901The Black Onyx and Hydlide were among the first RPGs made in Japan for the PC-88, and they were all released a year after Ultima had already been influencing Japan via imported copies of Ultima 1 and Wizardry.
Is there a wizardry 1 ps1 remake adjacent version of Ultima 1? Ie faithful but not excruciating UI/controls/qol etc
>>745797736You ever play those two games? Hyledyle is a early as fuck action RPG. Proto zelda. Black onyx I thought was made by a european. Checking further, the design was a european, but programming was japanese. It's legit one of the very earliest games, and not as well known because it didn't have sequels like Ultima and Wizardry, and started in Japan.
>>745797963I'm not saying they are influenced by them, just giving exampled of the earliest Japanese made RPGs, which came out 1+ year after Japan had already been influenced in general by Ultima/Wizardy.There are no Japanese RPGs made in a time before Wizardy and Ultima is the basic idea.
>>745797887LOL. Ultima 1 as you see it is actually is the second remake. Akalabeth was even jankier and older, and it was rewritten in ASM in the mid 80's. The best quality remake was the FM towns one, which was never retranslated into English. Even then, it is still creaky 1970's jank everywhere.
>>745798086Right. The shit earlier than that is pretty much unrecognizable as what we think of as JRPGS, or RPGS. Pic related. It's koeis game, Condo wife fucker. A maze game with some proto RPG elements.
>>745797479"WRPGisms" are based.
>>745797152>6)Skip Ultima 8 unless you want to suffer and be sad about the lost potential>7) Skip Ultima 9 unelss you want to see the funniest buggiest, and most broken game in the series.Performative poser detected.kys
>>745798747Don't know about 9 but 8 really is ass.
>>745796410>video essaysholy cuckoldry
>>745798959>Play vidya>Take a break from vidya by shitposting on /v/>Play vidya>It's late>Watch a vidya essay about a game I'm interested in knowing about but not in playing>Then fall asleep to a podcastNeet life
>>745796901dumb zoomer
I thought wizardry was the father of jarpigs
>>745799408Wizardry's influence is overstated and Ultima's influence is understated. Having said that, they're the two parents (Three, when you count manga/anime as the third)
>>745799480Wizardry's influence is correctly stated. If anything it's Ultima's influence that is overstated.
>>745796410Ultima VII Black Gate was fucking amazing. It had an extremely free open world that dind't get matched until decades later. Though, there were lots of ways you could eternally fuck yourself in that game.Serpent Isle was OK, too linear coming from Black Gate.
>>745796532>>745796410Nethack often gets left out of being listed with the greats even though SMT draws from it more than it does Wizardy when you get beyond the UI.
>>745800125one of the most retarded posts i ever read.
>>745799742Retard
>>745799742No, anon. Ultima is far more influential to almost every JRPG you can think of than Wizardry. How many JRPGs do you know that are just dungeon crawlers? Not many.
>>745796410Same op, at first I didn't like or cared much about thing either but then I watched someone on the internet saying thing is good and cool and now I'm a huge fan of thing, still not experiencing thing myself, but thing 4 lyfe thing-bros!
>>745796410Yeah, I also watched those Majuular videos.
>>745802119I didn't say I'm a huge fan of thing, nor "thing for life". I said that I have a newfound respect for it. As the historical grandaddy to many of the games I enjoy.>>745802159They're so based.
Added his playlist to my watch list, OP
>>745800663>The game about controlling a character capable of using equipment supplemented by a party of monsters with a lunar cycle dictating their behavior and steps-based resource management, about several mythologies crossing over revolving around deciding who gets to replace an evil Canaanite god whose powers are derived from a device made by Marduk featuring the four horsemen of the apocalypse as a major endgame obstacle has no bearing on a series containing all of those things a couple of years laterA later port of Nethack in Japan even changed the HUD to be closer to Wizardry's to make the parallels more apparent
>>745796410Truth
Played Ultima 7 back in the 90s, had great fun with it. My favorite pastime was to move a piece of bread on a market table in Britain and watch the carnage unfold.Also played Ultima 8 before 7 and beat it, but it was really a weird experience. Majuular's video really made me understand what was wrong with it.
>>745800125SMT has more DNA from Rogue in it than most actual roguelikes at this point.
When is his Ultima Online video coming?
i played ultima online in 1999; i literally cannot fucking believe how much worse life has gotten since then
>>745803448Dunno. Figured it'd be around now, judging by his usual release schedule, but I know his community made some community server for people to play together in, so maybe he's taking shit from that and it will take a bit longer.
>>745796410>A few years ago Michael Abbott, academic and “Brainy Gamer,” sparked quite some conversation with a blog post telling how his students had rejected Ultima IV as “boring.” Predictable outrage toward those kids today followed in the comments and the heaps of reaction posts from other bloggers. Yet my own reaction is to side with Dr. Abbott’s students; Ultima IV is, most of the time, pretty boring. Good on them for recognizing this, I say, for refusing to get sucked into doing boring things for the sake of it. I think kids today are at a minimum every bit as smart as those of my generation were when Ultima IV first hit store shelves, thoroughly capable of deciding that a game is mostly just wasting their time. We shouldn’t begrudge them that freedom if more refined entertainments make their verdict an uncomfortable one for us. Ultima IV stands for me as a hugely important work in the history of its medium, but also one that hasn’t stood the test of time all that well. I love to think about it, love the fact that it exists, that Richard Garriott had the courage to make it — but just thinking about playing it makes me tired. Like a work of conceptual art, to some extent the real power of Ultima IV today is just the fact of its existence.The Ultima games suck ass
>>745804440Who are you quoting here retard?
>>7457989178 has the best atmosphere and world of any rpg to this date.
>>745804440Like Majuular said in his videos, it was a different time. RPGs like these were very rare, so it was alright to have a game that "wasted your time" by basically being designed as if it's the only RPG you'll play for years. And if you never finished it and just mucked about in it, that's fine too.>>745806214The Digital Antiquarian
>>745806365>The Digital AntiquarianSo no one of any particular relevance.At least you didn't quote a streamer or a youtuber, but the fact still remains that what you qouted is pure shit.
>>745806816Anon, that's clearly not me.
The twist in Ultima 6 is one of the greatest in all of gaming. Still gives me goosebumps thinking about it all these years later
