Who has the better video game writing, Japan or the west? Who has the best story games?
>>748434246Not the game that was written by communists, that’s for sure.
>>748434246The SG vn is peak jap writing but there are very few vns of that quality. The west has more decent to good narratives to pick from.
>>748434246Plenty of retarded writing on both sides. But the most retarded of all is trying to rank writers based solely on their country of origin.
You won't get a genuine take on DE from /v/ because most of the droolies here haven't played past the tutorial day
>>748434246Disco Elysium absolutely mogs steins;gate, even danganronpa is better
>>748434246No VN has good writing.
>>748434635Absolute retard taste but what else do I expect from /v/ these days.
>commieslavs>westLMAO
>>748434246I know who wins the best girls contest and that's all that matters.
>>748434763OP just posted one.
>>748434246Western writing used to be good but it has become pozzed as fuck over the last 10-15 years.
>>748434514Japanese writing is markedly different from western writing, there's no denying this unless you're being disingenuous.
>>748435008Based Kurisuposter
>>748434514/thread
>>748434246>posts two overrated games
>>748435008Kim does and it's not close
>>748434246>Shits;Gay vs Dicks Ew!lysiumI'd rather die.
>>748434246>Game made in Estonia>Eastern Europe>Formerly Russia>"The West"If Japanese weren't the furthest thing right on the common map this shit would be nonsensical
>>748434246It's not fair to compare a commercial product, embedded within an already established and succesful VN industry, with an unhinged countercultural passion project made by literal outcasts. S;G is a very good but still mass made product made by two well-established studios, DE is an anomaly that will never be repeated in this kike ass world. There's a reason 5pb. is still going strong and pumping out titles while ZA:UM was already being dismantled before the game even launched.
>>748434246Is Stein's Gate actually good, and what does make it good? How long is it?I think overall, Western writing is a bit more cerebral; asking questions about 'human condition' so to speak. Japanese stories usually tamper more into identity of culture or sociological or social issues.Disco Elysium was well written, but not well told - however its characters carried it.I enjoy Persona 5; quite a lot even - however the pacing is not that great.If you ask me, first Metal Gear Solid is the greatest written japanese game (if i had to award one), it's a good spy thriller scratching some bit of a deeper issues of human psyche.t. screenwriter
>>748436436SG has some of the best character writing in a Japanese story and a very interesting time travel plot, most others in the genre can't compare to it. It's a classic for a reason.
>>748436206Have you been to Estonia lately? They're as Americanized as Sweden.
>>748436436can you read more VNs? oh no this isn't a diss or anything but there's some great VNs with some great twist and turns and indepth shit. like I've read a lot of classic books but some of my favorite VNs stick with me way longer. (but tbf, japanese writers steal a SHIT ton from western literature its not even funny, my favorite VN is literally a rip off of Fight Club)
>>748436517Are the games good way into introduction to this series; or where should one start?Im in a bit of binge of retro games recently; playing Final Fantasy 7 just about now. Are there any good games on PS1?
>>748436315Plenty of purely commercial enterprises release only one product and fail. That Disco Elysium devs went under has more to do with their politics, that were exposed in their product. DE debs were incompent commies, to consider them more worthy of praise because they failed to suceed is precisely the leftist logic. The loser is morally superior for losing.
>>748436552Idk what "lately" has to do with it when the game came out 7 years ago and was in development and creation before then.
>>748436590Play SMT1.It's a bit "light" on plot but I think the cosmic journey through the post apocolypse is really fucking neat that I don't think is replicated elsewhere.
>>748434246Japanese writing is sucked off super hard for no reason. Everything considered corny and retarded in western writing gets dismissed as being quirky and cool when Japan does it.
>>748436552The Americanization is pretty clearly reflected in the work with all the race and feminism and gay shit but it's also pretty clear that it's just a thin veneer what's a pretty classic post-communist depression piece. And that's the point, it's like that to Harry and it's like that to Revachol and it might be like that to most post-communist eastern European countries.
>>748436315>SG is a commercial product unlike muh renegade gameAre you dumb? If you've actually read SG you would know how much sovl that VN has and it never ended up in its own ass like DE did.
>>748436517>time travel plotso it's definitely garbage
>>748436894Try reading it instead of turning your brain off because it's in a genre you don't like.
Despite being as close to a book as you can get for a videogame I didn't think DE's writing was very good. It gave me the impression of a novice, unconfidant writer trying to emulate their mental image of what "good writing" is. Dialogue sections go down these holes where a lot of words are used to convey very little while the writers go ham on a thesaurus (because older writers use a wider range of vocabulary so trying to emulate this makes it better writing) which makes a lot of it feel forced and unnatural. Its like a parody in some parts and eventually I just started tuning out anything that wasn't raw dialogue driving the plot.
>>748436785>quirky and cool when Japan does itThat's because it is. The west could NEVER write a character like Okabe Rintarou, you have never seen it and will never see it because western ironic culture cannot handle being anything but safeslop.
>>748434246I should get around to reading some of these story games.
>>748436780How cryptic is it? I enjoy Nocturne; but i dont think i'll ever revisit that game. >>748436568I really don't care of VNs. For me they somehow land perfectly to the worst part of video game and story. I rather read a book/comic than VN, and i rather play a 'movie game' than "play" a VN.As a reader, i love to skim pages back and revisit scenes, VN's don't usually allow this.>>748436785I think this is a bit dishonest and cherrypicking, but at same time i cannot but agree. Japanese writing can do a complete 180 on tone mid scene. Something of a 'Marvel quip'. It is annoying, and Final Fantasy 7 has done it a few times this far my way through Disc 1.>>748437056This is a *you* problem. You're blaming the writer for doing their job; instead trying to evaluate it by unfair terms for the creator. All writing will come "unconfident emulation" if you stick your head to complete different dimension and expect the outcome be of that field. Writing in Disco Elysium is good, sometimes even great - however the story is not told very well.t. screenwriter
>>748436985>just read some shit you don't like because a guy on 4chan said sonah I don't think I will
>>748437650>All writing will come "unconfident emulation" if you stick your head to complete different dimension and expect the outcome be of that field>t. screenwriterThe saddest part is that I don't even doubt you, I think you're telling the truth and you're that retarded and still have that kind of job.
>>748437786kek
>>748437650Not really cryptic. It's pretty straight forward. There's a voice "guiding" you sure, but that's typical JRPG fare. There is maybe one or two sections in the game where you're like "wtf how was I suppose to know that". >VNsLame. You also have multiple saves/back log for this so I dunno what you're talking about. Some VNs even have a chapter select. It's literally a book with music, voices, and art.
>>748434246Japan. Japan gets dragged down by bad translation and still manages to cultivate critical acclaim. Western games have no such handicap.
>>748437650>This is a *you* problem. You're blaming the writer for doing their job; instead trying to evaluate it by unfair terms for the creator.The writers are going for that angle though? Genuinely if they stopped trying so hard I think the game would have much better writing. Even simple character interactions are bogged down by unnecessary text that doesn't really add much and contributes to it all blending into white noise. DE is a testament that editors are needed to reign in writers by taking an axe to shit that doesn't really need to be there.
>>748437786Funny enough, you seem to understand exactly what i mean - still, doing the same here: *choosing* to misunderstand my point to have some sort of jab... at least there was an attempt for actual conversation; now back to endless hornybait/twitter screencap threads?>>748437905Give me three good VNs. No porn/gore nonsense, something that's actually complete story.
>>748436619Fuck does morality have to do with anything? And what does winning or losing have to do with it? Kurvitz was on a high horse and there was a lot of convoluted internal power plays that we may never know the true extent of, but at the end of the day, the DE IP was still his and his friends', all of whom were fucked over by soulless corporate hacks who immediately proceeded to fumble everything and kill the franchise with their kike-ass antics and subpar follow-up game. At the end of the day that's the whole story and it's got nothing to do with the devs' ideology. In what quadrant of your bread and circus political compass astrology for chuds they happen to land on doesn't change the fact that the original team were all non-compromising, complete outsiders with a clear artistic vision, and that's not the same as an established studio with an established audience and corporate backing. Both are good titles, but the comparison isn't fair. DE was lightning in a bottle because of the extremely atypical circumstances surrounding its developments and the team behind it.
>>748438427People already recommended the SG visual novel to you. How about you read it instead of going on and complaining about shit you barely know anything about?
>>748438427>you seem to understand exactly what i meanWhere the fuck did that conclusion come from?You type like you're halfway to an aneurysm and English is your fifth language.I have no fucking idea what you're talking about and you probably think I'm someone else that replied to you before.
>>748438427>No porn/gore nonsenseb-but those ones have the most soul! unironically, when you can be unhinged and have no self filter, it's usually when you see the most soul.but sure>Utawarerumono 1>Utawarerumono 2>Utawarerumono 3two more since you probably won't count those as 3 hehe>Clannad (Kanon is good too but there's really one bad route I hated going through - tumblr people looooove this one though so it's a coin toss if you like it or not) >Mabu Labu (fuck that might be gorey but it does have an all ages version...)
>>748434246You definitely could've picked a better vn than S;G for this image.
>>748438849just warning uta has the "anime weeb" stuff in there but holy fuck the twists in 3 has to be the best moments I've ever read in any books or movies. the only thing that's probably close is when mercedes finally confronts dantes of being the count and to stop his revenge or when bigwig holds down the fort for hazel.
>>748438343Are they? The writing never felt to me like it was trying hard. Are you talking about the dialogue? I am used to play a lot of adventure and point and click games where most of the gameplay is just heads on the screen with voice actors. The writing didn't feel any more excessive; unnecessary text - maybe because i enjoyed most of it?Surely some characters were very archetypical, but you always have those.Anyway, I am not interested convincing you to like something you do not. Is it best written game ever? No. It's enjoyable for me.>>748438806English actually is my fifth language, only my French is maybe worse. Enough to make you upset seems?>>748438849Thank you; will be checking these out. I don't remember what i tried to read years back, but I just didn't *get it*.
>>748434246SG is good but it's mid tier compared to other Nitroplus stuff
Western writing has been trash for years. Look at movies.
>>748439586t. doesn't watch anything but Hollywood slop
>>748438343I don't mean to get bogged down in matters of subjective taste, but in my personal experience with the game, I got the clear impression that the 'white noise' effect was intentional, just a tool used on occasin to portray Harry's turbulent mind and instill a sense of dizzying overstimulation when needed. There is a lot of wordswordswords sections even when not much is happening on-screen, yeah, but the le fewer words = more betterer is just as much of a tired old cliché as the verbose amateur writer, and neither is the case with DE. The truth is the prose in DE flows well even if it's a bit extense or even tangential at times. It very rarely gets bogged down with long-winded sentences, awkward or clichéd turns of phrase, etc. it's extremely punchy and quick and can be poetic when needed. You can even skim it like poetry and the images are still able to come through with enough clarity. Readability is what makes the difference between something being a slog and being entertaining, not just the mere number of words on screen, and I personally think DE does well in that regard.
>>748437650>t. screenwriterWhy did you add this? Considerong the state of modern screenwriting its like adding>t. RetardTo the nd of your post.
>>748434246>Visual novels Not video games.
>>748435008This, except Mayuri is best girl
>>748439859I'm not watching your le special Balkan films dude.
>>748434246>Who has the better video game writing, Japan or the west?This has to be a bait thread. It's not even a contest.
>>748440932Balkan films are kino you uncultured swine.
>>748440932>Western writing sucks says the guy who only chooses to engage with the most commercial product that gets advertised.Take a moment and think.
>>748440932What the fuck man? Our movies are fine enough all things considered.
>>748434246Based on your image, both are shit
>>748435067No he didn't.
>>748434246Gamers don't read unless there are sexy cartoons attached so who cares what they think
Japan writes actual stories.That piece of shit in the OP is literally styled after twitter.
finna reinstall right now, thanks /v/
>>748434246Japan for NTR kino western for anything else
>>748435582>Japanese writing is markedly different from western writingThis is true but mainly in literary fiction, not genre fiction (which video games are a strong part of). Novelists like Tanazaki and Yoko Ogawa are obviously very different from China Miéville or George Saunders (yes I'm a /lit/fag, get over it). The differences in arcs and prose are so vast that they are assuredly cultural differences, not just differences of literary technique. But comparing Steins Gate and DE just feels like comparing two different flavors of junk food or bubblegum. They're not trying to be cultural, they're trying to be common-denominator products. The compacted syntax is a dead giveaway, especially since Japanese prose shines best with longer, flowing sentence structures. VNs always need to have short-to-medium sentences that can fit on screen and in the designated textbox.
>>748434763of the devil has good writing
>>748442090Jeepers, look what I found! Ya reckon I'll enjoy it? My favourite vidya are Saya no Uta, Sengoku Rance and Black Souls. Oboy oboy, I heard the Bianca sections are mighty fine.
>>748442715As long as you plan on reading every book in the meme trilogy then I approve. Although GW is definitely the "randiest" of the bunch if you know what I mean.
>>748434246The West, Japan can't right for shit and Anime VN's are the lowest form of their writing.
>oveerrated;newfagbait
>>748434246Both of these games would have been 6 or 7/10 novels if they were released in book form, they're only impressive to gamers.
>>748434246I tried playing SteinsGate and I couldn't make it past like the second scene, the writing was so fucking dull and repetitive and it managed to make even the concept of time travel seem lame.Haven't played Disco yet but there are very few Jap games that can rival the best Western ones in terms of writing. Silent Hill 2, Metal Gear Rising, maybe Killer7, but it's a short fucking list.I'm sure they're all better if you're fluent in Japanese but learning more Jap has made me hate the language even more. They have like ten consonants, use three of them, and then they treat puns as clever wordplay. Yeah no shit you can have layers of meaning in a sentence when there are a dozen valid ways to pronounce every single fucking kanji, that's not good writing, it's pretending that your shitty language being vague and imprecise is a feature instead of a sign that the whole fucking thing is retarded. No wonder Japs just speak English nowadays.
>>748434420well played
>>748443047nta but kek
>>748434635I mean, as much as I love steins gate, DE is one of the best written games of all time, its tough to find equals, and thats not a west vs east kind of shit.
They're both popcorn flicks in gaming form, no need to pretentiously overthink it and pretend they're psychological/philosophical masterpieces
>>748434246Great storytellers are individuals more so than members of any kind of collective. That said, neither of those pieces of media are good or well written.
>>748442908>>748442859Nobody is impressed bybyour contrarianism retards.
>>748443286You only think it's contrarian because you don't read
>>748437213Okabe is such a based protagonist most aren't able to handle him.
>>748443253This. I bet none of these individual writers from either game could make it on their own as a good novelist, especially considering how tropey and infantilizing both games can get
>>748442314based enjoyer of disco
>>748443286Learn to type probably before calling someone else a retard, doubleretard
>>748442314It sure takes little to convince you lol
>>748443431DE's lead writer is a failed novelist. The dude wrote a book that ended up being a 2/5 on goodreads and was so poorly recieved that he ended up depressed. That book is also the basis of DE iirc.
>>748443431In 2013, Kurvitz published the novel Sacred and Terrible Air (Estonian: Püha ja õudne lõhn), on which he had worked over five years.[12] The novel, set in the fictional world of Elysium, centers on three men who, twenty years after the unexplained disappearance of their classmates, are still determined to locate them. It received positive reviews,[13][14][failed verification] with literary theorist Johanna Ross highlighting it as one of the few books to successfully bridge science fiction and "literature proper".[15]Literary scientist Jaak Tomberg emphasized the great attention to detail in his review: "Through that novel we bear witness to (1) a style which seems to be in its actually realistic and simply reflective way to be attentive towards the world to an almost paranoid degree, and (2) to a made-up world, which in its relentless interconnectedness is far more systemic than the reality we recognize as 'our own' and also remarkably more systemic than most of the fictional ones, which may by their similar way of building reservedly be called 'fantastic'."[16] Despite its positive critical reception, the book was a commercial failure, selling between 1,000 and 1,500 copies, and causing Kurvitz to "succumb to a deep alcoholism".[17]
>>748443615I know about Sacred Terrible Air, I've heard it's mid as fuck after a few chapters
>>748443569I've been meaning to anyway lolI keep reading about that new spy game, and I don't wanna dive into that. But Disco I can manage.
>>748443580>was so poorly recieved that he ended up depressedI guess we can thank his book failing and putting him in the right mood to write for the game.
>I don't read but if I copy/paste wikis then I can be a big boy!
>>748443580KEK. Proof's in the pudding
If DE commited to being a detective story instead of having the mystery be set dressing for the ideological commentary by the writers I would have liked it a lot more.
I'm playing DE for the first time and I'd like it a lot more if everyone shut the fuck up about politics for a minute. Real people don't feel the need to inject politics into every single conversation they have irl, that's an internet thing. The game just feels like a Reddit subforum with everyone trying to outdo each other with how wordy they can get, whilst simultaneously saying nothing of interest. I get the feeling the creators must not get out much and they're probably insufferable to be around.
>>748443580>Gaming's so-called greatest writer couldn't hack it in the real writing world
>>748444006Just maybe, maybe reading is not your thing? Thought about that? Just continue reading your moms grocery list alright?
>>748443952I had the same thought early on in my playthrough and I'm glad I trusted my intuition because it was a dead-on bullseye.>>748444006>The game just feels like a Reddit subforum with everyone trying to outdo each other with how wordy they can getIt does, and it should also help explain who the type of people are who think this writing is masterclass.
>We have Andrei Bely at home
>>748443952DE is a detective story if you build your character properly like a detective and play it like one. You might not realize it but the feeling of the game changes a ton depending on your build and how you play.
>>748443615The reason you posted Wikipedia is because even you don't want to read that piece of shit novel for yourself.
>>748443732
>>748434246>Peak;Gate vs Mid Elysium I know which one I prefer.
is it really that good?13 Sentinels is by far the best sci-fi weeb game ever, is Steins;Gate better than that?
>>748444996What the fuck
>>748434246I like Steins Gate but Disco Elysium is on a whole other level above SG with it comes to writing.
>>748434246for video game writing it's the west, but for regular/real writing it's definitely the east
