Could the DVD have stopped the rampant Piracy that, ultimately, was the demise of the Dreamcast?
>>12669454absolutely nothing couldve ever saved the dreamcast, the saturn, the 32X, or even sega itselfstop posting
Could breathing through his nose have stopped OP from making this thread?
Now the Dreamcast plays dvd but Ps2 furst titles still blue and on cds!?
>>12669454>Piracy that, ultimately, was the demise of the DreamcastThat's revisionist cope, the PS1 was just as easy to pirate with.
*hides thread*
>>12669454Dreamcast piracy came after Dreamcast was already dead
>>12669593>the PS1 was just as easy to pirate with.Nah, you needed to get the console chipped.Dreamcast you just burn games and they work.
/DVD/;boards:vr;op:only
>>12669454Cope. If the Dreamcast had been worth buying, low piracy rate countries like Japan would’ve picked up the slack, but they didn’t give a shit about it and moved to PlayStation and PS2. People not buying the Dreamcast is what killed the Dreamcast.
>>12669627that only matters if people are buying the console. no one i knew growing up had a dreamcast. hell, i never even saw them in stores.
>>12669454Piracy was possible because of a flaw in the bios that allowed games to boot from a cd. Not directly relevant to DVD.Also, the sega was already on its deathbed when piracy was ramping up.
>>12669810So make every game 4.7gb so they can't be burned to a cd, wala
Everyone here is a retard except me. If you keep engaging in this low quality thread after this post, you deserve to die.
>>12669454Can someone design a floppy disc drive for the dreamcast to replace the aging gd-rom drive, so that we can start publishing ms-dos games
>>12669904They couldn't even make the games fill 1gb sufficiently that a dedicated crack group couldn't find enough content to cut to get it back down to 800mb. Wii games were all padded to 4.7gb, tools were made to decrypt them, strip the padding, re-encrypt them and release.
>>12669627CD burners were still mostly a thing you had access to at best. Not enough PCMR with a dedicated CD burner to shift the needle on piracy. If you were a pirate in the late 90s and 00, you bought your discs from a local dodgy, and he'd chip your PS1 for you.
>>12669615/threadstill, games sold per console is higher than the N64, a console designed especially to fight piracy.
>>12670062why is gamecube higher than wii here, wtf
Could being carved from marble have saved the dreamcast?
>>12669454Yes. DVD formats were harder to pirate for at the time. New technology & formats makes it harder for piratefags to pirate video games. They would need a mod chip. That's why PS2 was a major success, it was hard to pirate for. The Mil-CD exploit led to CD-R pirated discs, which killed the Dreamcast.>>12669593PS1 required a modchip. It wasn't common on the PS1. That's why the PS1 had many greatest hits titles, after selling out the original releases.>>12669615False. Piracy was around in June of 2000, thanks to the Utopia Boot Disc.
>>12670246None of my friends knew about it.
>>12670246>It wasn't common on the PS1.You should have visited south america.
WOOD you pay extra for a woodcast?
>>12670246>Piracy was around in June of 2000The dreamcast was already at an unrecoverable state by then.
>>12670246This argument completely falls apart due to >>12669719. Your precious honoribru Japs didn’t give a fuck about the Dreamcast and the rest of the world followed suit.
>>12670246PS1 had swap trick and modchips were common. Why would you spend $30 on greatest hit game when you could have chipped your console for the same price?Another thing people conveniently ignore is that the utopia releases were not only sparse, but they were pretty shit with cut content and downgraded audio/FMVs to fit onto CD-R and that was only for cherry picked games, many larger sized game where you couldn't easily manipulate the data were never properly published as burnable CDIs.Pretty much your best bet was pirating an arcade game and funny enough they still sold at anything between 500k to 800k copies (you would think on le pirate infested console games wouldn't even hit 100k sales!).
>>12670132Hardware to software sales ratio.Most people who owned a Wii only had the pack-in games
>>12670043You still needed a cd burner with a modchipped psx.Also>from a local dodgyHow things work in your third world country =/= how they work in America.
>>12670272The console sold good the whole time they were making it. The Arcade division going bankrupt made it so that they needed fast 3rd party cash so they just dropped it.
>>12669454No. Not having MIL-CD support would have saved it... at least a little more.
>>12670289>How things work in your third world country =/= how they work in America.Hence why >>12670246 is full of shit. Normies who bought a Dreamcast had no clue what Utopia was. This would’ve been a subset of dorks who were into that sort of thing.
>>12670292It absolutely did not "sell good". It completely bombed everywhere but North America, where it only did okay because it was the only next gen console on the market for a full year before the PS2 launched.
>>12670301nah it did fine. Better than GameCube and Xbox when you compare the first 2 years of those systems. Get over it fag.
We keep telling you that if people actually bought the dreamass, then piracy may have been a problem. The same segnigger shitting up this board over and over didn't need to make an entire thread to showcase hid retardedness.
>>12670254or Wood you prefer this?
>>12670383>everyone i disagree with is the same personShut the fuck up faggot
>>12670368Again, the first year of the Dreamcast had no competitors on the market.
>>12670385The population of this board is so low that you can easily recognize the same posters.
>>12670293They did remove it later actually. I imported a suspiciously cheap Japanese DC only to find out it's useless :(
>>12670441
>>12669615WTF?!
>>12670394It did well in the second year too. But you're also moving the goalposts, it competed with the 64 which was really late to come out.
>>12670536The Dreamcast launched a full three years after the N64 in North America, anon. Sega was retarded to launch it so early in Japan.
>>12670247None of your friends owned a Dreamcast.>>12670248I don't think you even lived in South America.>>12670265Actually Dreamcast was still doing good during that time, before piracy became widespread and scared away third party publishers.>>12670272You know nothing that goes on in Japan. You're just making shit up. Hence your shitposting.>>12670280The PS1 swap trick is risky and finnicky. Modchips weren't common at all and unless you wanted to brick your console or void your warranty, modchips were not an option. $30 was fairly cheap at the time, plus having physical copies were always better to own than pirated copies. Either way piracy ate at Dreamcast profits. 500K copies could have been 1 million copies. 800K copies could have been 1.6 million copies. Piracy negatively impacted sales to those games. Usually publishers prefer to sell in the millions, not less than a million.>>12670298Actually your full of shit. Normies didn't buy a Dreamcast. Normies bought Playstation 1 & 2. Dreamcast owners played online, owned a computer and pirated everything from music, to movies, to games.
>>12670985Time to face reality, faggot. The Japs didn’t give a fuck about the Dreamcast. Sega tricked you into buying yet another flop console and you’re still coping 25 years later.
>>12671001The only reality here is that you're seething I don't buy your troll post or false narrative. Piracy Killed The Dreamcast.
>>12671032Nope, grorious nippon should’ve bought more Dreamcasts, but they didn’t because it was garbage. You got suckered.
>>12671035Actually you got sucked for choosing to buy a PS2 instead of a Dreamcast, because now Playstation is going digital only. No more physical copies. Nice going piratefag.
>>126710461. You’ve probably been buying digital only from Steam for over a decade at least. 2. By your own logic, the Dreamcast didn’t sell well enough in low piracy rate regions like Japan to balance out the high piracy rate areas. Simple as.
>>12670985Yes we did.
>>12671032>you were tricked into having fun•Fighting: Capcom vs SNK 1/2, DOA 2, Fighting vipers 2, Force Five, Fist of the North Star, Guilty Gear X & 1.5, Jojo, Kenju, KoF Evo/2001/2002/XI, MvC 1/2, NeoGeo Coliseum, Power Stone 1/2, Project Justice, Rumble Fish 2, Samurai Shodown 6, Soul Calibur, Street Fighter Alpha 3 & III-3, Vampire Chronicle, Virtua Fighter 3•RPG: Black/Matrix AD, Grandia 2, Pier Solar, Segagaga, Skies of Arcadia, Time Stalkers•Horror: Alone in the Dark New Nightmare, Blue Stinger [NTSCJ], Carrier, D2, Illbleed, Resident Evil 2/3/CVX, Seven Mansions, •Platform: Frogger 2, Jet Grind Radio, Ms Pacman Maze Madness, Napple Tale, Rayman 2, Sonic Adventure 1&2, Super Magnetic Neo, Super Mario 64, Tomb Raider Revelations & Chronicles•Action/Adventure: Berserk, Draconus, Dynamite Cop, Elemental Gimmick Gear, Industrial Spy, L.O.L (lack of love), Maken X, Rent A Hero, Shenmue 1&2, Soul Reaver, Spawn Demon's Hand, Slashout, Volgarr, Zombie Revenge•3PS/FPS: Alien Front, Bang! Gunship, Cyber Troopers Virtual On 2, Doom 1/2/64, Frame Gride, Gundam Side Story Ashes, Head Hunter, Maken X, Outrigger, Red Dog, Slave Zero•Run 'N Gun: Bangai-O, Baldr Force, Cannon Spike, Charge 'N Blast, Dolphin Blue, Expendable, Gunlord, Metal Slug 6, •Rail/Shmup: Border Down, Chaos Field, Fast Striker, Gunbird 2, Ghost Blade, Ikaruga, Karous, Last hope, Mars Matrix, Neo XYX, Psyvariar 2, Rainbow Cotton, Redux Dark Matters, Rez, Satazius, Shikigami Shiro 2, Sturmwind, Star Fox 64, Trigger Heart, Trizeal, Under Defeat, Zero Gunner 2•Vehicle: Crazy Taxy 1&2, Mario Kart 64, Re-Volt, Sega GT, Star Wars Racer, Stunt GP, Test Drive 6 & V Rally, Tokyo Xtreme Racer 2, Toy Commander, Toy Racer, Vigilante 8 2nd, Wipeout, •Other: Bomberman Online, Chu Chu Rocket, Cosmic Smash, Frogger Swampy, MoHo, Mr. Driller, Popn music 1-4, Sega Extreme Sports, Space Channel 5, Tetris 4D, Tony Hawk 2, Virtua Striker 2, Virtua Tennis 1&2, Wetrix, Worms Armageddon
>>12671119Whole lot of "meh" in this list, which was the big issue with the Dreamcast.
>>12671052Actually...1) I've been buying games from Steam since 2024. Shenmue 3 being released for the PS4 derailed my path to PC gaming. Completing my gaming PC in 2024 allowed me to skip the PS5, Xbox Series X and Switch 2. The fact that I still have more Dreamcast games in my collection than I do PS4, Xbox One, Switch, Xbox 360, PS3, Xbox, Gamecube, PS1, Sega Genesis, and SNES, shows me that I got my money's worth with the Dreamcast.2) False. Piracy killed the Dreamcast everywhere. Simple as.>>12671118No you didn't.>>12671119Yes those games are fun. Loved them.
>>12671119what is this list supposed to be?
>>12671161>Piracy killed the Dreamcast everywhere.Would be interested in seeing a source for this. I'd also like to see any source for a third-party developer dropping Dreamcast support specifically due to piracy.
>>12670254>>12670384I would prefer you to take your slop elsewhere.
>>12671232shut the fuck up
>>12671279
>>12671279You can almost smell the curry in this pic.
>>12671191He won’t provide one because there is no source as usual. You can’t reason with delusional Dreamcast cultists.
>>12669454Look up the Dreamcast attach rate. Piracy didn't kill the Dreamcast, the Saturn did.
43yo American here. Bought a Dreamcast at launch and had no idea what Utopia boot disc was. In 2000, the vast majority of home internet users were still on dial up. I was able to download songs on Napster and had NESticle, ZSNES and Genecyst since those were small game files. I definitely didn’t know anyone who was pirating Dreamcast stuff since it wasn’t as simple as downloading a ROM and copying it to a CD-R until later on in the mid to late 00s.
>>12671621Also, that one guy keeps citing June of 2000, but that also coincides with preorders for the PS2 ramping up in anticipation for the fall launch. It’s no surprise that Dreamcast support began tapering off at that time.
>>12671635Oh, one more thing: The PS2 had launched in Japan in March of 2000 while Dreamcast sales in Asia had already slowed significantly. Out of the 10 million or so lifetime Dreamcast sales, Asia as a whole accounts for less than half, around ~3 million.
>>12669615Based fifa and easports truth speaker.NO fifaNO SALESSimple as. Go time travel to 1998-2002 and ask teeanger what games want the most.
>>12671959Fair point. EA refused to support the Dreamcast at all.
>>12669968This is the best post on the entire board. This anon a real nigga.
>>12669810>Piracy was possible because of a flaw in the bios that allowed games to boot from a cd. Not directly relevant to DVD.yeah buthear me out on thiswhat if, just what ifusing a DVD drive meant that they could have changed the bios to only ever load code from the DVD portionbecause even assuming people burn CDs, they couldn't burn DVDs. not until many years later, once DVD burners came down in price.even many PS2 games used DVDs even when the game would have fit on a CD, for added anti piracy measure.
>>12672030Remember that the Dreamcast launched in Japan in fall of 1998. A DVD drive would’ve upped the cost quite a bit.
>>12670246>PS1 required a modchip. It wasn't common on the PS1.I remember TV spots where they talked about PS1 modding, they even showed a modchip with something like "you connect it here and here".>>12670272Japs never gave a fuck about anything Sega related with the exception of Virtua Fighter and maybe Sakura Taisen.
>>12671119This list is AI generated and includes games never released on the system. Not to mention stuff never released outside japan.
>>12670985>Actually Dreamcast was still doing good during that timeAnon, good was not enough.
For how long does this fag intend to keep this "muh piracy" schtick?
>>12672178Just another troll. He knows this board’s population is low enough that he’ll keep getting attention.
>>12672178at least a decade given all of the other forced memes that are still posted here
>>12671959a teenager would ask you what the fuck FIFA is and say soccer is for fags though
>>12671467>muh attachment rateIs not an argument. Piracy killed the Dreamcast.>>12671621Sounds like the fakest story I've ever heard. Also you didn't need to download Dreamcast games from the internet to burn them to CD-R's. All you needed was to rent from a video store or borrow from a friend who has a copy of a Dreamcast game you didn't have, download it on your hard drive, burn it on a CD-R and it was ready to go.>>12671635June of 2000 was when the piracy started happening. Piracy wasn't available before then.>>12672042That is some fake news. There were never any advertisements on TV where you could pirate games with a mod chip. Sony lawyers would have a field day with the advertisers and the people selling the mod chips.
>>12669627People sold them chipped so you would buy their burned games from their stores>t.was there
>>12672369Fake news, just like the idiot who claimed there was advertisement for mod chips.
>>12672362>Sounds like the fakest story I've ever heard.I got Ready 2 Rumble, Sonic Adventure, SoulCalibur and Power Stone at launch, so go fuck yourself. You also don’t know that much about the Dreamcast. I’ve seen you claim in other threads that a pre-existing ISP was needed to play Dreamcast online, which wasn’t the case at all. You are not the all knowing Dreamcast expert you seem to think you are.
>>12672383Holy AI tard, no one was super tech literate back then or terminally online, a lawyer wouldn't give a fuck if some random store chipped Playstation games or sold burned games. Zoom zoom you could walk into any videogame shop that wasn't a brand and you would stocks and stocks of pirated games, these are small unnamed stores I'm talking about not fucking gamestop dumbass
idk, did publishers ever consider making games affordable for kids and teens? no? well I'm finding it tough to give a fuck
>>12672362The PS2 launched in March of 2000 in Japan. That’s why devs started shifting away from the Dreamcast.
>>12672369>>12672383no hes totally right there was fucking bodega marts that sold like toilet paper, cigarettes, weed, and burned games/DVDs/CDs
>>12672410What about outside of the favela?
>>12672445Yes the rest of the world also knew how to burn discs, no one was some sheltered pussy like you
>>12672446Bootleg DVDs were only found in the roughest parts of the city closest to me, but no bootleg games, and bootleg DVDs being sold on the side of the street wasn't even common until around 2004 or 2005. I know things are different in Brazil, but it wasn't anything I ever saw in the US back then.
>>12672391>go fuck yourselfSeething piratefag detected.>>12672392>getting triggered by AISo much anger your little post, all because the AI debunks your false claims. Which means these newer claims you're making are also unreliable/unverified. >>12672394False. They shifted away because of the rampant piracy.>>12672410Except selling those burned game discs would do them no good without modchips. Also it doesn't debunk my screenshot.
>>12672456I’m >>12671621. How about you cool your autism and consider that people have different life experiences from your own? I wasn’t a big forum browser back then. Early IGN was the only video game website I went to. So no, I had no idea Dreamcast piracy was possible back in 2000. All my games were bought legit until around 2007 when I amassed a whole binder full of Dreamcast CD-Rs. And again, you were wrong about Dreamcast online needing an existing ISP, so your memory can’t be trusted here.
https://dats.site/rls_dclist.php?start=2501According to dats.site the very first DC warez releases started coming out in June 2000. Not sure if they were selfbootable or this came a bit later.
>>12672510I don’t think anyone is denying that Dreamcast piracy was possible in 2000, it’s more how widespread it was. I simply didn’t know about any of that stuff until later in the broadband internet era.
>>12672030That is exactly what they did with GD-rom. But there was a bug in the firmware which was exploited.
>>12671001Fuck you, okay?!The Dreamcast was loved by japanese gamers!
>>12672054It's my list and that's homebrew you dumb nigger
>>12672362>>muh attachment rate>Is not an argumentHow is that not an argument? How else would you measure the profitability of selling games for Dreamcast?
>>12669454Remember when sony made a custom chip to play backups that was as expensive as the console itself? If sega did the same nobody would remember ps2 since it would have suffered same fate as pspgo, psvita, psp 3100, ps5 and so on all of them dead on arrival, not even the highest specs have saved the ps5.
>>12673079ps5 sold like 90 million already
>>12669454Nothing could have saved the Dreamcast.By 2000, PS1 piracy was widespread. Its slim version alone sold nearly 30 million units. The Harry Potter game, released in november 2001, sold ~8 million copies.Only games can save a console.
>>12669454can someone just make a firmware that reads games from a DVD drive? I only play burned reproduction games with fancy art printed on them, not ODE shit.
>>12673114That Tomb Raider statistic is bogus. It was pulled from a 2006 Squenix finanical report which listed Tomb Raider as having sold 7 million copies across ALL platforms. 20+ years later, illiterates continue to cite this statistic as solely representative of PS1 sales.
>>12669454Not supporting MIL-CD would have stopped the piracy issue, which is exactly what Sega started doing with the last Dreamcast revisions they produced.The reality is piracy isn't what killed the Dreamcast. It would have become a problem for sure going forward but from 1998-2000 burners weren't nearly as common as some people try to claim. What really killed the Dreamcast during this time was the simple fact that Sega was bleeding money and selling the console at a massive loss digging themselves into a massive hole. Even though the console was selling decently and had a good software attachment rate, it wasn't enough to make up the massive losses they were taking on it.
>>12673459Yeah, you can look at old NPD and Famitsu data and see the PS1 version sold about 1.8 Million in the US and about 100k in Japan, Europe is probably somewhere in between that. The Saturn version probably accounts for another ~100k and the rest is most likely the PC versions.
>>12673465Piracy could have been significantly mitigated for new titles going forward. It would not be difficult to code games in such a way that would make them extremely difficult to fit onto a CD. They could of course still be cracked eventually, but each game would be a significant reverse engineering effort.
>>12673803> It would not be difficult to code games in such a way that would make them extremely difficult to fit onto a CD.How? A GD-ROM is only about 1.1GB. Most of that is going to be assets like textures, FMVs, music, etc. which can be reduced with compression, quality reduction, or just removing them entirely which is what some cracked versions of Dreamcast games did already. The fix would be what Sega already did which was patch out the MIL-CD exploit in VA2 revision Dreamcasts. You'd still have about 7-8 Million Systems out there with the exploit but it is what it is. Best thing developers could do to mitigate those Dreamcasts would be things like what Spyro 3 did where the game actively starts fucking with you if it detects it's a cracked copy.
>>12673816Well firstly, you stop using a standard file system. Hard code disc lbas. Any free space on the disk should be wasted by duplicating assets such that different parts of the game load different copies of the same asset. Mutate duplicated assets to make it difficult to de-duplicate. Sprinkle some checksums into various parts of the game code to make sure the assets have not been shrunk/removed. As for video/audio content. Remove the ability of the game code to play any bit-rate except the exact one the game uses. Maybe even mutate the codec format a little so it can't be re-encoded with standard tools.
>>12673861>Well firstly, you stop using a standard file system.You can't really do that when the the disc format is enforced by Sega for publishing and has to adhere to the ISO standard. The hardware itself is also built around reading that format. On both the Saturn and Dreamcast the disc drive is effectively a black box that the developers interface with through a series of commands. That black box has it's own operating system that even the BIOS has to interface with. At boot it looks for the first file in the TOC in alpha-numerical order and loads that in as the entry point of the game. If the disc isn't in ISO 9660 format it wont be able to do this and therefore wont be able to boot.
>>12672468Funny, I didn't address you. But your story comes off as false anyways. So spare me your b.s. story about not knowing about Dreamcast piracy when every Dreamcast owner who didn't live under a rock knew about it, save your b.s. story for someone who is gullible enough to believe it. Also bragging about having a binder full of pirated Dreamcast games make you sound like a poorfag(which you most certainly are).
>>12673018By the individual sales of games. Attachment rates don't mean squat, especially when piracy is involved to hurt the sales of those games. If a game doesn't sell a million copies or more, it's either because of piracy or it's a really bad game(LJN levels bad).>>12673114Widespread piracy wouldn't allow those games to reach millions of copies sold you idiot.>>12673465False. CD burners were extremely common by 2000. I remember having my friend burn a copy of Slipknot's Mate Feed Kill Repeat for me since that album was extremely rare & wasn't mass distributed. I also managed to get another friend to let me use his computer to allow me to download diss tracks dissing Eminem and burn it onto CD-R. All before I would buy my own PC(with a CD burner included) since I was getting tired of the time limit of using the internet at a library. Also attachment rates don't mean shit, piracy still negatively impacted sales of Dreamcast games.
>>12674113A binder full of pirated Dreamcast games in 2007, you retard. Why the fuck would I still be buying secondhand Dreamcast games in the mid 00s instead of just downloading them? You were wrong about Dreamcast online and you’re wrong about this.
>>12674136>Widespread piracy wouldn't allow those games to reach millions of copies sold you idiot.go back to school
>>12674136>CD burners were extremely common >I didn’t have one though and had to mooch off a friend lol
PS2 is the most pirated gaming console of all time from the get go. Many games sold millions, including later releases like FFXII, God of war 2. GTA SA sold over 17 million copies.The PS2 also has a ratio of nearly 10 games per console. selling over 1.5billion games.Pic related shows how quick games dropped in prices.Segatards need to find another cope.
>>12674136> CD burners were extremely common by 2000.> I remember having my friend burn a copyIn other words they weren't extremely common because you didn't have one and had to rely on a rich friend to burn stuff for you.Now CD Burners did become very common a year or so later, but during the time before Sega discontinued the Dreamcast they weren't that common yet.> Also attachment rates don't mean shit, Attachment rates mean a great deal because it indicates that software is actually selling. Dreamcast had an attach rate of about 8:1, which is right up there with the PS2, Gamecube, and original Xbox. While that kind of attach rate was fine for other consoles it wasn't ok for Sega because they were literally hemorrhaging money selling the Dreamcast at a massive loss.They needed an unrealistic attach rate to not be bleeding money.>piracy still negatively impacted sales of Dreamcast games.Prove it. It it truly was negatively impacting sales of Dreamcast games it would be reflected in the software attachment rate
>>12674169Dreamcast games were still relatively cheap in mid-00's dumbass. I remember buying Power Stone 2 for $3 at a thrift store. You're just a poorfag with a binder full of trash.
>>12674332Good for you I guess. Complete waste of money.
>>12674170>go back to schoolI'm not the one stupidly claiming that PS1 had widespread piracy while selling millions upon millions of official copies. If PS1 piracy was widespread, those games would have sold way less.>>12674174Just because I didn't have one at the time, doesn't mean it was uncommon. Having friends who already had PC's with CD burners was easier to come by than it would be to find a modchip in a used PS1.>>12674184You could lie all you want, but piracy wasn't widespread on the PS2 either. Millions of legit copies of games were sold. Widespread piracy would have prevented that.>>12674320False. Just because I didn't have one at the time, doesn't make it less common. In fact I ended up owning a PC(with CD burner included) myself by the time I was 20. I was middle class like my friends were, but didn't see the point of owning a PC until going to the library became extremely inconvenient. You know what I did have in 2000? Dreamcast, PS2(bought it at launch), N64, PS1, Saturn, Sega Genesis, SNES, NES, Master System, Game Gear and Game Boy. I was considered a "rich kid" by poorfags like you.False, attachment rates don't mean shit. Just because Sonic Adventure was a best selling title before piracy, doesn't piracy didn't negatively impact Dreamcast games by mid-2000. Otherwise Sega would have kept the Dreamcast going if the attachment rate was so "good". That's why Sega stopped production of the Dreamcast, the games were negatively impacted by piracy and scared away third party publishers.
>>12674365Not really, Power Stone 2 is hella expensive on eBay. $3 was a steal!
>>12674373Yeah but I don’t actually care about collecting for the Dreamcast so it would be pointless for me to own actual retail copies.
>>12674369>j-just because I didn’t have one blah blah blah lol fuck off. You’ve been fucking moaning about everyone having CD burners when you didn’t even have one yourself at the time. Retard.
>>12674376And that's where I have the advantage. The moment I stop caring about Dreamcast games, is the moment I will sell it on eBay and make my money back. But I'm wealthy to the point where I don't actually have to sell them.
>>12674381I fail to see how that’s an advantage. They play just the same on a burned CD-R.
>>12674369>False. Just because I didn't have one at the time, doesn't make it less commonIf they were common you and everyone else would have had one. Especially if you were middle class as you claim. I was middle class and we didn't get our first CD Burner until around 2002, after the Dreamcast was dead. Most of my friends were in a similar boat. Only the rich kids at CD burners from 1998-2000.>False, attachment rates don't mean shit. Repeating a lie to yourself doesn't make it anymore true.>Just because Sonic Adventure was a best selling title before piracy, doesn't piracy didn't negatively impact Dreamcast games by mid-2000Again if piracy was rampant and having a negative impact we'd see a much smaller attach rate. Software was still selling, just not enough of it to make up the massive losses on the hardware.> Otherwise Sega would have kept the Dreamcast going if the attachment rate was so "good". Again you're ignoring a key factor here. Sega was selling the Dreamcast at a massive loss, especially in the US. Every time sales started to slow down they'd cut the price again. At one point they were literally giving them away for free with rebates with the hopes they'd make up the difference in software sales. The problem was the amount of software sales they'd need to pull that off was unrealistic regardless of piracy. Every time they cut the price they needed to increase their software sales target to balance it out. Each price cut was digging a deeper hole.>That's why Sega stopped production of the Dreamcast, the games were negatively impacted by piracy and scared away third party publishers.They stopped production because they were bleeding money due to selling the hardware at a massive loss that couldn't be made up without unrealistic software sales. Throw in the fact they weren't in the best financial situation coming off the Saturn and you can see the writing on the wall.
>>12674396You need to shut the fuck up.Walls of texts will not change history.In 2002 you could literally send your PS2 for a messiah modchip installation for just $50.
>>12674417>You need to shut the fuck up.So you can't counter the arguments with actual facts then.>In 2002 you could literally send your PS2 for a messiah modchip installation for just $50.Ok? Doesn't mean it was wide spread and everyone was doing it. Secondly if CD Burners were just becoming common around 2001-2002, DVD burners certainly weren't common yet.This is kind of the issue you're not grasping here. For piracy to have hurt Dreamcast software sales it needs to be a problem before it was discontinued at the start of 2001. So that time frame is from 1998-2000. CD burners definitely weren't common yet during that time period. Sure they quickly became common place after 2001 but that's after the Dreamcast was already discontinued. It would have become a problem had they not discontinued the Dreamcast in 2001 for those ~7 Million VA0 and VA1 revision systems sold, but as things played out it wasn't the main reason they discontinued the system.
Love the dreamcast like any real gamer.But piracy isn't why it failed. It's the Saturn's fault and PSX being such a smash hit that nobody cared about any other consoles after that, people just wanted the PS2 even if it had NOGAEMS* on it for more than a year.And the PS2 had great games right away on launch IMO but the normalfags weren't going insane over Ridge Racer V, they bought DVD of movies and got Madden.You mfs never learn, it was never about the games, it's all marketing and manipulating the cattle normalfags into thinking you just need to buy the thing. Sony was extremely good at this back then and they kinda still are today. Holy shit even the PLAYSTATION 5 sold 100M and this thing actually legit has no games and value to it.
>>12674446I wouldn't even say it's necessarily the Saturn's fault. Sega was actually still turning a profit with the Saturn from the Japanese market alone. What caused them to have a major loss in FY98 was liquidating all the unsold Genesis and Game Gear inventory Sega of America was sitting on. If you really want to save the Dreamcast, you need to go back to around 1993 and start bitch slapping Sega of America into not making stupid decisions. Get them to realize the Genesis is on it's way out and get on board with the Saturn, don't do the 32X. Prepare for a 1995 US Saturn launch with western focused software. Sure Saturn wouldn't beat the PS1 but a 2nd place finish was doable. Then they could be in a better financial situation by the time they'd be ready to release the Dreamcast around 2000. And releasing the Dreamcast in 2000 then they might have been able to beef it up a bit with more RAM, hardware T&L like the NAOMI 2 board had, and possibly a DVD drive.
>>12674446>it was never about the games, it's all marketing and manipulating the cattle normalfags into thinking you just need to buy the thing.What the fuck?
Is a memcard exploit like the freepsxboot one theoretically possible?
>>12674385False. CD-R's take away a lot, suffers in quality and there's even bugs. Official discs, no issues at all.
>>12674378>fuck offYou lost the argument and couldn't debunk my valid points. Stay retarded piratefag.>>12674396>I was middle class and we didn't get our first CD Burner until around 2002You're just proving my point. I can be middle class without having one in 2000. My friends who lived in the SAME middle class neighborhood as me had one in 2000. >Repeating a lieIs what you do. I just speak the truth.>Again if piracy was rampant...It was, there is no disputing it. If software sales were good, Dreamcast would have stayed afloat. They weren't good because Dreamcast owners were pirating for games they didn't care to have in their collection.>Again you're ignoring...Actually you're ignoring the valid points I made. Of course Dreamcast consoles were selling at a loss. Guess what would have made up for that loss? Software sales. Guess what prevented software sales from going up? Piracy.>They stopped production...Because of piracy, which made them bleed money.>>12674446You didn't love the Dreamcast. Any true Dreamcast fan knows damn well piracy killed the Dreamcast. Those who say piracy didn't kill the Dreamcast, are the ones guilty of pirating during Dreamcast's lifespan.
>>12675747Uh oh, someone had a meltdown lmao. You didn’t have a CD burner, end of story. Credibility gone.
>>12675858False. You couldn't debunk my valid point and so instead of dressing each point I made, you simply decided to act like a dumbass. Stay triggered fag.
>>12675897Uh huh. It’s on your for over sharing, dumbass. Now we all know you’re completely full of shit and have no idea what you’re talking about.
>>12669454it was already dead with the single analog stick moving into 3d games
DVD-RAM would've saved teh Dreamcast
>>12676131>it was already dead with the single analog stick moving into 3d gamesThere were like five games in total that used dual analog for the majority of the DCs life time.
>>12676150That’s because it came out in 1998. The first DualShock controller made it obsolete around the same time.
>>12676131ps1 has 1 dual analog game.n64 has zero.GameCube nub was shit.a lot of ps2 games still use shoulder buttons for camera
>>12674417You win, I hate the dreamcast now. all the fun I had was Fake
>>12675927You're the only one full of shit here dumbass.
>>12676442Wrong thread buddy
>>12676452Mmhmm. Remind me again how you thought Dreamcast online worked. You fucked up.
>>12675735How would you know? You didn’t have a CD burner.
>dreamcast games didn't sold because of the piracyFalseDreamcast games didn't sold because 1/5 are just shovelware, the other 2/5 are merely ports of PS1 games. The other 1/5 consists of arcade ports. The remaining above average games weren't impressive and didn't gave that next gen feel, especially after seeing the news and previews for the PS2.You can't convince developers to create games for your tiny install base, especially considering the fact that the PS1 was at its peak between 1997 to 1999. Sega did tried to take the hit and sell the Dreamcast for peanuts, but everyone was saving up for the next PS2 to play the next Final Fantasy, MGS, Tekken, Resident Evil, Gran Turismo, etc., while enjoying the latest releases from those very same franchises.Therefore, piracy is not a problem if your machine have the desirable games... You know, the games all the kids in the neighborhood and at school are talking about. People who have the money buy games will buy original copies regardless. It is up to the company to captivate this marketshare to empty their pockets. Unfortunally, Sega didn't have the games needed.
>>12676286>a lot of ps2 games still use shoulder buttons for cameraThe dreamcast didnt even have shoulder buttons lol. It had less inputs than the Saturd 3d controller
>>12675735True. Even my CD-R copy of RE1 for the Sega Saturn didn't allow me to finish the game. I decided to buy a Sega Saroo instead to finish the game. Here's my CD-R copy of Resident Evil, with a paper print on the disc and a paper printed cover on a DVD case.
>>12676478>Dreamcast games didn't sold because 1/5 are just shovelware, the other 2/5 are merely ports of PS1 games. The other 1/5 consists of arcade ports. The remaining above average games weren't impressivet.Someone who's never owned a Dreamcast. Nice larp dude.
>>12676464>>12676476Says the fuck up who thinks CD-R's plays Dreamcast games flawlessly. Yet I've been vindicated with this anon's comment ---> >>12677332Thank you pirate anon. You're not a fag unlike the others.
>>12677536Cue end credits. [/thread]
>>12677536Uh huh. Explain to me again how you thought Dreamcast online worked and how you didn’t have a CD burner in June of 2000. All credibility gone.
>>12677332That’s great, but we’re talking about burned Dreamcast CD-Rs, not Saturn.
>>12677575You clearly have no experience in burning pirated games, do ya? My Dreamcast CD-R's aren't flawless either, there were bugs and graphical glitches in my CD-R copies. My Saturn copy of RE1 was the final straw that led to me buying a Saroo for my Saturn and a Terraonion MODE for my Dreamcast. Fuck your CD-R's bitch boy.
>>12677713Okay, but the entire premise of "piracy killed the Dreamcast" is that the games were very easy to copy to CD-Rs and worked fine the majority of the time.
>>12677909I don't care about whether or not piracy killed the Dreamcast. CD-R's don't work fine the majority of the time, there are clear flaws. That's why ODE's are better than a piece of shit CD-R.
dude what would you even pirate on there? nobody talks about any dreamcast shit other than like 4 games. shit was DOA cause it had no game
>>12678060You haven't played any Dreamcast games obviously. Shenmue, Sonic Adventure 1 & 2, Jet Grind Radio, Crazy Taxi, Seaman, House Of The Dead 2, Virtual On, Dead Or Alive 2, Soul Calibur, Resident Evil Code Veronica, Spawn, Metropolis Street Racer, Looney Tunes Space Race, San Francisco Rush 2049, Cannon Spike, Ecco The Dolphin, Bust A Move 4, Power Stone 1 & 2, Heavy Metal, Fighting Vipers 2, PenPen Triicelon, Spider-man, Virtua Cop 2, Sega Bass Fishing, Zombie Revenge and Virtua Fighter 3. Those are just the ones that came into my head. I know there are way more, but these ones I have fond memories of. No games my ass, you're just a casual/normie gamer.
>>12678098More than half of the games on your list are arcade ports. Bust a Move 4 and Spider-man are PS1 ports.See >>12676478 is accurate.
>>12678172Ports or not, those titles were worth owning and honestly who wants to buy a whole arcade machine when they could just buy the games & play them on their Dreamcast? And who wants an inferior PS1 version of Spider-man 1 when the superior version is on the Dreamcast? That poster and your opinion is a shit take.
>>12678182http://archive.thegia.com/news/0001/n27e.htmlThis is famitsu's 100 best selling games of 1999. Only one Dreamcast game made the list.The superiority of the Dreamcast is nowhere to be seen.
>>12669454No, Dreamcast wasn't killed by piracy no matter how much you repeat it.>>12669615Pretty much.
>>12673465100%. It sold reasonably well and the games it had were pretty well received at the time, but they were still heading towards financial ruin and simply had to bail, while piracy wasn't yet easily or widely accessible for these kinds of games at the time.OP can cry and shit and make things up, but this is true.
>>12678060You're thinking the n64
>>12672383I need to remind you, this same technology less than a year ago, told people to put glue on their pizzas and cook spaghetti with gasoline...Also, PS1/PS2 had an insane amount of pirated copies and yet they succeded. This alone does not explain why the dreamcast sunk.
>>12679059Actually PS1/PS2 had good anti-piracy protection. You basically needed a modchip before pirating the games. So piracy wasn't widespread for either console as a result. Leading to great sales for software. Piracy was niche on PS1/PS2
>>12669454almost nobody had a CD burner when DC came out, at least in bongland. An even smaller number approaching and possibly including zero had the entire Dreamcast library and knew how to copy the discs, then distribute them.
>>12669454No the problem was the launch window hardware with the 1 in a circle underneath had no copyright protection built in. It was a colossal fuck up.
>>12681016Don't think bongland exist, but CD burners were quite common by 1999/2000. Was becoming a huge problem for music artists.
>>12670985>Modchips weren't common at all and unless you wanted to brick your console or void your warrantyThat ia simply not true, by 1998 every chinese owned business in north America had playstation modchip signs in their windows. >phone cards>key cutting>playstation mod chips $50 installed>western union >drycleaningI was in a city of 150,000 people back in the late 90s and there were easily 20 places activley advertising playstation modchips in signs in store windows. We had a small chinatown (a whole 2 city blocks) and mod chips were ubiquitous with owning a playsation. Every game you rented you burned a copy for yourself, as this was at the point costco started selling spools of CD-Rs cheap.FYI these same chinese shops sold the white VHS tapes with bootleg anime and jackie chan/jet lee movies that were unreleased in the west. They were especially popular for their DBZ tapes as it was the only way to see the cell or frieza saga in 1998, aside from online realmedia digital fansubs that were 20mb for 20 minute episodes, and quality was fucked. Police just didnt care, as long as they were not selling satelite tv priacy equipment. Fuck the 90s were a comfy time.
>>12681078Things that never happened: The Post
>>12681078>aside from online realmedia digital fansubs that were 20mb for 20 minute episodes,Those were early 00s.
>>12678363>No, Dreamcast wasn't killed by piracy no matter how much you repeat it.I knew people who worked in game stores, when the Utopia boot disc came out their game sales completely dried up but hardware sales were the same.
>>12676152>That’s because it came out in 1998.That's the joke you mongoloid.>The first DualShock controller made it obsolete around the same time.The Dualshock came out in like 2 years into the DCs life, and less than a year before the DC was discontinued. it's like arguing that the SNES was outdated for being 2d-only once the 3DO came out.
This thread is silly. Sega was already doomed because of nearly a decade of bonehead decisions. The dreamcast was one last hail mary that merely did ok when it needed to be a record breaking success to save them so sega pulled the plug and pivoted into full survival mode outside of the console market
>>12681286See >>12677909 and >>12678049. Can’t have it both ways. Either CD-R copies worked fine most of the time and killed sales or they were shitty with a lot of flaws, which would mean piracy wasn’t the main factor in its demise.
>>12681293The original DualShock for PS1 came out in 1997, anon.
>>12669454Piracy isn't a problem. Especially if it has a lot of games. It means you try more games. Probably still buy the ones you like.Using the Voodoo2 Sega was contracted to could have saved it. That gpu was fairly powerful. About 3x better than the NEC chip. It could have run Deus Ex.As always what really matters is the games. If the games were great everyone would have gotten one.I like lightgun stuff. A shame they were banned in america.I don't think the Dreamcast was better enough, and people were already satisfied with their N64 and PSX.Saturn should have gotten more attention. It was twice as powerful than a PSX according to sites ive read. It should have been what the PSX was.I guess it's all timing. But sometimes like with the Xbox it's just a good console.
If the Dreamcast used regular cds. Piracy would be through hiring and sharing discs. Would have made it more social, so more liked.
>>12681439>But sometimes like with the Xbox it's just a good console.Sega discontinuing the Dreamcast was 100% tied into the upcoming Xbox launch. They canceled Shenmue II’s NA release in favor of the Xbox port as an exclusive.
>>12681353>The original DualShock for PS1 came out in 1997, anon.Yeah and how many games used the 2nd analog? Five? Ten?
>>12669461This. The Japs would rather fall on their swords and double down on their failures.
>>12681467Okay, but that doesn’t make this >>12681293 post any less ridiculously inaccurate.
>>12681439>Using the Voodoo2 Sega was contracted to could have saved it. That gpu was fairly powerful. About 3x better than the NEC chip. It could have run Deus Ex.lol watthe voodoo 2 was a four-chip setup that required a ton of memory chipset to get 100 MPixel/s fillrate. the powervr2 in the DC could do 3.2 GPixel/s (or 800 MPixel/s with transparency on) with a single chip and 4 SDRAM banks.voodoo 2 chipset alone would cost more than twice as much as an entire Dreamcast.
>>12681480Yep. The main reason the Dreamcast did pretty well for its first year in America is that it offered next gen 3D graphics at a low price.
>>12681283>Those were early 00s.No, realplayer 4 was included on win 98 disc so it got a lot more use in 98 and 99. My hyper police fansubs from 98 or so were srill the tiny rm files. My berserk weekly fansubs were 100mb per episode asf filesThe 100mb asf meant you could get a whole season (12 episodes) on just 2 cds if lucky, and at much higher quality in around 2000-2001 and RM died fast for fansubs. They replaced the old 90s realplayer software with the realone player which was a combined movie and music player and everyone hated it. >>12681247>Things that never happenedIf you are doubting that playstation mod chips were common in the 90s it means you were not alive in the 90s, simple as.
>>12681286>No, see, here's a reason I made up!
