>60k copies solddid people just not get it when it came out?
It just wasn't all that fun.
>>12757612but i've beaten it recently and it was one of the greatest. what filtered you?
system slop isnt a game you actually play. you pretend to play it on message boards for le old school clout
PC games with any sort of RPG elements or complexity were not in demand 1998-2010(or so) and the CRPG genre essentially died with Lord Brinne, well at least all the last true CRPG sequels (and Deus Ex) have a grave marker dedicated to him. Games like Thief and System Shock 2, with their "complicated" controls (compared to Half-Life, for example) were not what the new breed of gamers wanted anymore.Morrowind got ported to Xbox and sold over twice the amount of the PC version, which triggered the switch to consolized RPG experiences.
>>12757615Not true. SS2 is way more fun than any other immersive sim.
>>12757614I said it wasn't fun, I didn't say it wasn't one of the greatest. Learn to read.
Niche game for niche genre for niche platform
>>12757627Don't pretend to be me, faggot.
>>12757626>more fun than any other immersive sim.the bar is in the mariana trench
>>12757615>system slopLet's all point and laugh at this rtard
>>12757625The PC RPG market died when Wizardry, Ultima, AND Might and Magic all managed to shit the bed around the same time in the late 90's/early 2000's.
>>12757608Because SS2 is easily one of the worst "games" ever made. It's generic moviegame slop but back then we just said boring. It was sucked off by a bunch of reviewers who never played a video game in their life.The only good thing to come from SS2 was the soundtrack that is admittedly awesome, but outside of that SS1 is an objectively better game in all regards.
>>12757727I don't think Killer7 is fun and it's in my top 5.
I'm playing it right now and enjoying it. I would say it gets a bit repetitive, which I guess is a danger for any shooter. I was just replaying Thief, so it's a little jarring going from such a tightly designed game to this (although everything in SS2 is better than the rushed levels at the end of Thief). It's generally fun to explore, although in certain areas it's a little annoying to backtrack, like in deck 4 with the sim units. It excels pretty well in atmosphere and the music is great. The level design is pretty cool. Probably my biggest complaint is most of the skills and whatnot feel completely useless. I honestly think I prefer System Shock 1 but it's been a while since I last played that one. Overall a good game.
>>12757608the weapon durability and respawning enemies REALLY pissed people off. I'm not saying they were necessarily bad design decisions, but they're mostly what did the damage.
Gaming was a lot smaller back then and more expensive.Fun fact I rented the game from a public library so yeah no money from me...
>>12758212I think the respawning enemies is bad game design but only because they don't drop ammo often enough.
>>12757608I played it like 20 years ago and didn't really get it and gave up pretty quick. I played it again recently and finished it just last week though and it is pretty good, probably the closest thing to Deus Ex I reckon. The only problem for me was that it kind of dragged in the middle for a while because the maps are like big mazes so there was a fair bit of walking around lost. Was fun though overall
>>12758212>respawning enemies REALLY pissed people offIt annoyed me for a bit at the start but there was an upgrade early on to show all enemies on the map/minimap. Most of the respawning guys were the grunts I could take out with the wrench anyway so it wasn't as big of deal I thought it would be
>>12758212The respawning enemies are there so that you never run out of credits / healing / bullets. I've played it without respawning enemies and it's actually harder because your resources are very limited
>>12758212>>12758281>>12758437>>12758447In the original System Shock, the respawning enemies actually had an intricate system behind it.Not sure what SS2 does but it's far easier to deal with than SS1 because the enemies in SS2 that respawn don't just hitscan you the frame they see you. Also they die in like 1 or 2 wrench swings.
>>12757625>PC games with any sort of RPG elements or complexity were not in demand 1998-2010Ultima Online, Deus Ex, and Diablo were pretty popular. I don't remember seeing SS2 in stores or hearing about it much until later though. Kind of reminds me of VtMB in a way where it sold poorly but still became a classic.
>>12757608>"why didn't it sell?">"also you gotta play it with the fan patch and mods bro"
>>1275760860K is good for an "indie". AFAIK the problem was that their games always took too long to make and cost too much for the "low" sales numbers.
>>12757615>everything i dun like it's SLOP.>zoomer words everythingall zoomers and zoomerspeak should be banned. if mods can ban "ecelebs" and youtube channels they happen to hate, they can ban zoomers who post like them.
>>12757625>the last true CRPG sequels (and Deus Ex)Deus Sex 1 came before SSs, and it wasn't a consolised RPG. Invisible War was consolised and flopped. by that logic, action RPGs on consoles or made for console designs, should have flopped more, for betraying superior PC games and trying to appeal dumdum normie consolefaggotrons.
>>12757608Great game but Rickenbacker is dogshit.>>12758769Because the original release doesn't load in modern jeetdows. It's made for 98.
>>12758787>Invisible War was consolised and floppedBecause of the universal ammo gimmick, which is just a completely pants on head retarded decision that doesn't have anything to do with Xbawks, and goypod-sized levels with long-ass loading screens separating them. Given DX2's code is such a mess it makes Indian programming look like the peak of competence, I'm willing to bet it's not as much as 64MB RAM's fault as the skill issue on dev side (we're talking about ISA who decided to nuke the grid-based inventory in Dude Sex 1 PS2 as well when nu-Jew Sex brought it back, despite being console games).It's just not a well made game, Ecksbawks or not Ecksbawks.
>>12757608PC games were a much smaller market back then.
Amazing how much this board sucks off toddler slop like Mario and Zelda but shits on a truly legendary game like System Shock 2.
>>12759171Because 4chan is full of normies now. Back in the day /v/ loved SS2 (which is why I first played it) over Zelda or Mario.
>>12757626Its actually a lot more restrictive of a game than the immersive sim label would imply, IMO.
>>12757608People are retarted and Im proud to have been one of those 60k initial buyers.
>>12757625>PC games with any sort of RPG elements or complexity were not in demand 1998-2010(or so)Bullshit. Diablo and deus ex alone make this claim a joke.>CRPGSo system shock is a crpg now? Nor elation to the topic or anything else.> Games like Thief and System Shock 2, with their "complicated" controlsComplicated controls? The controls were simple fps for fuck sake.Thief failed because stealth was never a seller regardless of platform and system shock failed because half life come around and introduced cinematic elements which were lacking in system shock 2.>Morrowind got ported to Xbox and sold over twice the amount of the PC versionAnother blatant lie.There was never any breakdown by platform and pc was the main platform.
>>12759171You realize we're a bunch of individual posters with varying opinions, and not a single mutated hivemind conquering the website and turning people into meat monsters, right?
>>12759442System Shock, Deus Ex, VtMB, Thief, Morrowind, Dwarf Fortress... /v/ used to talk about all of them long before it was cool.
>>1275860948 hoppers? good grief
>>12757608Gaming and especially PC gaming was VERY niche in the 1990s.10k sold copies was a good score in many countries. 100k copies got the game the Platinum/ Greatest Hits release.
>>12759913>Gaming and especially PC gaming was VERY niche in the 1990s.I think that was true up until Doom. Doom was installed on more computers than windows after all, by 1995
>>12759653It feels like they endlessly respawn, same with the invisible mutants on the 3rd level but at least they don't have a ranged hitscan attack but a slow-moving projectile.
>>12759471True. Immersive sim was always a stupid label. All it means is first person ARPG.
>>12761614Then you'll have people arguing that "ARPG" specifically means Diablo 2-type games and you should call them action RPGs. I don't really care much for the imsim label either and lately I've been wondering if there is a term for games like Deus Ex, System Shock 2, and VtMB where they're action RPGs but they have no grinding/random loot. Some people will say that's just what imsim games do but then again people argue saying VtMB isn't an imsim. These labels suck.
>>12757608Games sold better on consoles because PCfats pirate everything. Should have done a PS2 version.
>>12761696Plenty of games were still selling well on PC at the time, tribalist retard.
>>12761709Games sold better on consoles, lardass.
>>12761726Piracy still wouldn't explain its poor sales. Other PC games were selling 500k+. The year before, Half-Life sold around 200k within weeks. System Shock was a niche series. Piracy is almost never a major cause of poor sales. Wash your butthole.
>>12757608>>12757608>>12757608It's the Thief argument, a lot of people "played" Thief, but 80% of you never actually played through the entire game. System Shock 1 and 2 have the same problem. Both critically well-received, but people didn't buy enough copies and didn't play them outside of the first hour or so. System Shock 2 goes from "alright I can do this" to "junior chemist set mixing" to "extremely complicated backtracking, micromanaging your inventory, upgrades,and dealing with RPG elements." It's unsurprising that people got irritated by that in lieu of simpler first-person shooters.
/v/ is that way>>745519676
>>12761762Console games raped the shit out of those numbers.
>>12761787I think the problem was genuinely the competition at the time. The market was flooded with a lot of options too. 1999 alone was a crazy year for PC games.>During 1999, the original Half-Life sold 445,123 copies in the United States, making it the country's fifth-best-selling PC game that year.
>>12759642why do you resist the many, anon
>>12761696>Should have done a PS2 versioni'm glad they didn't care about consoles when they were designing thief, deus ex and system shock because they would not have been even as half as good as they are.
>>12757608It's a high IQ game, most people are mid to low.
>>12761950>games>being high IQgames are just like football, bread and circus for the goyim while they're being replaced
>>12759442This. See also the Halo threads. Everybody licks Halos ass nowadays, back in the day it was pointed out as the mid game it is.
>>12761910Deus ex got a PS2 port and it was actually quite good.
>>12761956Regardless, some games appeal to intelligent people, others appeal to the dumdum masses
>>12761696PC gaming was expensive. Ofcourse a 299 PS2 raped everything.
>>12761657By ARPG I mean an RPG that has real time combat. Which applies to every game in the imsim category.
>>12762254Yeah I know what you mean, it's only recently where I've seen people saying that "ARPG" is specifically for games in the style of Diablo 2. They treat "ARPG" and "action RPG" as two entirely different things.
I finally played SS2 last year after finding out that someone on a SS forum (ZylonBane) made a subtitles mod which I depend upon (very grateful for that mod.)SS2 a stylish game but I'm not surprised it didn't sell well. If you're looking for a FPS in 1999 or 2000 and you gave to people those exact specifications - must be sci-fi, some horror, maybe RPG elements, there's no way you're not going through 10 or 20 or more people who'll suggest Half-Life or Deus Ex before someone submits SS2 as a candidate. Just writing this alone makes me want to replay DX, and I'll be replaying SS1 before 2.
>>12761962Yeah*loading screen*it*loading screen*was*loading screen*certainly*loading screen*great.
>>12757614OOOOOHHHH SHIIIIIIIITTTTTTTIMMM WAAAALLLKINNNGG AAARROUNNNND AAA SPPPPAAACE SHIIIP SWINNNNGING MMMMYYYY WRRRREEENCH VERRRRRY SLOWWWWLLY
>>12762484did you try putting points into agility
>>12762476I will never understand why people prefer Deus Ex to SS2. Deus Ex has atrocious level design and shitty combat.
>>12762484Your game was installed wrong, you're not supposed to be playing a Hybrid.
>>12762653It's more fun.
>>12762653Wandering around a grey maze with zombies infinitely respawning and chasing you everywhere isn't fun
