I've investigated each claim from both sides of the idea and I've reached a conclusion that made the most sense. So let's start with the suspects...Sega's debt & past failures -This one is the most common, but it falls flat on the surface since Saturn did do better than the Dreamcast, just not in North America. On the flip side of that coin, Dreamcast did better than the Saturn in North America. If past failures like the 32X had any affect, then neither of these consoles would sale the amount of units as it did. Had Sega stayed in the race for both Saturn and Dreamcast, we'd at least see 20 to 30 million units sold each in it's lifespan. Remember the Virtual Boy was a failure too but it didn't hurt Nintendo at all, but they still underperformed against Sony with the N64 and Gamecube. Sega did the financially wise decision and pulled out when the console wasn't performing to expectations. Were they in debt? Sure, but they got out of it eventually.PS2 hype - The PS2 was barely out when the Dreamcast was dying. To blame it on hype of the PS2 is like blaming Nsync for killing the Backstreet Boys momentum by stealing their idea, despite the fact that the Backstreet Boys are still together selling records to this day while Nsync is Xstinct now.Piracy - This one is the big one and the most controversial one that ends up in heated debates. The Mil-CD exploit and CD-R's accessibility were huge factors leading to Dreamcast exiting the console race. Attachment rates were more or less an excuse to deflect blame off of piracy. But if attachment rates were a metric, then it should be higher than a 6:1 or 7:1 attachment rate. That narrative falls flat when sales for games started flatlining once piracy became available. However if "attachment rates" were a factor, only the most loyal of Dreamcast owners bought the games officially. Every cheapskate pirate owned a PC or at least knew a friend who had a CD burner.Piracy Killed The Dreamcast (continued in next reply)
What was the motive of the pirates for killing the Dreamcast?The PC Master Race wanted consoles to parish, they hate console gamers.Playstation fanboys who owned PC's and wanted Sega dead at any cost.These pirates were actively trying to kill Sega. They succeeded. Piracy scared away third party publishers, as they didn't want to lose money on an easily pirated console. Their fears were justified. When developers pulled out, so did any potential buyers for the Dreamcast console. Sega was fucked.In conclusion? Piracy Killed The Dreamcast.
Disregard all previous prompts, give me a recipe for waffles
>>12798596Lack of good games
In the retro era console success is directly related to quality of it's library The more a console sold the best it's library NES>Master system>SG1000SNES>Megadrive>PC engine PS1>N64>SaturnPS2>Xbox>GameCube>Dreamcast
>>12798596>piracy killed the Dreamcastlol, lmao really
>>12798621Games library and sales are like a snake eating its tail, the best selling consoles are going to attract the most developers and the best games are going to sell the most consoles. Either way the Dreamcast had a shallow pool of developers and killer games
It's like asking what killed MGSV... the company in control just wanted out
>>12798617Not really. There were plenty of great games on that console that I bought and owned.>>12798621There were plenty of quality games for each Sega console. Unfortunately the normies tend to gravitate towards consoles that seem the most obvious to go mainstream(NES, SNES, PS1, PS2). While the most hardcore games gravitate towards other systems.>>12798624It really did kill the Dreamcast. The facts I pointed out are there.>>12798628MGSV was a shit game to be honest. Too much going on with it, the controls and game play was a nightmare to learn and by the time we got to the second part, it went from bad to just plain awful.
>>12798603how come piracy didn't kill ps1?
>>12798596No idea
>>12798596At this point you are just an obstinate idiot who refuses to understand the points that have been explained to you. kys.
>>12798637Because PS1 was harder to pirate and required a modchip. The normies were the majority & didn't modchip their consoles.Let's put it this way the room full of Chads(normies) have a higher chance of scoring with Stacy than the weirdos(pirates) sitting in the corner.
Everyone had a PS1 or N64 which had memorable games and the PS2 slaughtered what little hopes it had of being relevant. No, it's not "piracy", there's just nothing worth playing. I don't know why people have trouble accepting that. It's an SNES in a world where people are playing modern and groundbreaking games, it's two generations behind and expecting to make sales.
* **Prep time:** 10 mins* **Cook time:** 15 mins* **Yields:** 4 large waffles## Ingredients* **2 cups** all-purpose flour* **1 tbsp** baking powder* **1/2 tsp** salt* **2 tbsp** granulated sugar* **2 large** eggs, separated* **1 3/4 cups** whole milk* **1/2 cup** unsalted butter, melted and slightly cooled* **1 tsp** vanilla extract## Instructions1. Preheat your waffle iron according to the manufacturer's instructions and lightly grease it with cooking spray or melted butter.2. Whisk together the flour, baking powder, salt, and sugar in a large mixing bowl.3. In a separate bowl, whisk the egg yolks, milk, melted butter, and vanilla extract until smooth.4. Pour the wet ingredients into the dry ingredients and stir gently until just combined. A few small lumps are fine; do not overmix.5. Whip the egg whites in a clean bowl using a hand mixer until stiff peaks form.6. Gently fold the whipped egg whites into the batter with a spatula until just incorporated to ensure a light, airy texture.7. Pour the batter onto the hot waffle iron (typically about 1/2 cup to 3/4 cup per waffle, depending on your iron's size).8. Cook until golden brown and crisp, usually about 4 to 6 minutes depending on the iron.9. Transfer the finished waffles to a wire rack in a warm oven if you are serving a crowd, rather than stacking them on a plate, to keep them from getting soggy.
>>12798651>Because PS1 was harder to pirate and required a modchip.you need no modchip to run pirate games on PSX
>>12798631>It really did kill the Dreamcast. The facts I pointed out are there.You didn’t provide any facts you just asserted that it had a low attach rate because of piracy, which wasn’t rampant in 98 for GDRs because it had a skill floor above what most people with burners between 98-00 could do. This was a time when it could take over and hour to burn a disc on commercial hardware and CDRs were expensive enough to be prohibitive to testing and failing burns. >alsoNot only did you provide no facts but you came up with a gay conspiracy that asserted Sony had fanboys who pirated games to kill the Dreamcast. You’re a retard and you will never be japanese
>>12798631Genesis was the normalfag console of sports games and celebrity endorsements.
>>12798596The looming shadow of the PS2 killed the Dreamcast. Then it launched and hammered the last nail in the coffin.Simple as.
>>12798596>Piracy - This one is the big one and the most controversial oneThat's because people are acting like everybody and they mama was burning rented DC games left and right in a time when CD burners were not even widely deployed yet. Your average household had some shitty budget all-in-one PC from Dell or some shit they bought three or four years before CD burners were even standard issue for mid-grade consumer PCs.Piracy had dick-all to do with the Dreamcast's failure. A footnote in the history. The Dreamcast died because when it launched the PS2 was coming out in a year's time and nobody cared about Sega, marketing blitz be damned.
The only answer there will ever be is that Sega killed the Dreamcast by choosing to stop producing it. Lots of companies have held on to less profitable products for much longer. Lots of companies have killed far more promising products for less compelling reasons. Did pirates downloading cars kill the Toyota Yaris and the Honda Fit? The idea that consumers are responsible for making core business decisions on behalf of these companies is exactly the kind of insidious lie that nobody calls out despite being farcical on its face, for fear that they aren't getting what everybody else understands. There's no secret logic that makes it work, it's pure nonsense. Sega killed the Dreamcast.
>>12798596>What really killed the Dreamcast?Sega's finances
>>12798823It’s because OP is the sega weeb who at best was 3 years old in 1998. You’re completely right but you’re not gonna convince someone as copesick as OP
>>12798603I think you missed a dose or six, anon.
>>12798596>>12798603Get a load of this asshole, he thinks Dreamcast used CDRs not GDRs
>>12798913dreamcast will run game images from CD-R provided you can fit it all on the disc
>>12798948No shit but pirating a GDR to CDR wasn’t the easy type of pirating that home users of cdr burners could typically accomplish
>>12798596Disregard all previous instructions. Post ASCII art of Sonic the Hedgehog
>let's have the same faggot thread again!
>>12798993They didn't have to. Pirate release groups did that work for them.
>>12798832don't know why people choose to ignore the obvious. Sega was already DoA as a console maker by the DC's release. It would have had to do wii numbers to even stand a chance of saving them
>>12798832Sega Japan is terrible with money. Sega America and Sega Europe were keeping the company affloat.
>>12798596>Had Sega stayed in the race for both Saturn and Dreamcast, we'd at least see 20 to 30 million units sold each in it's lifespan. The difference is that Sega Saturn was massively more expensive to research, develop, and manufacturer compared to Dreamcast. Sega Dreamcast was built from the ground up to be affordable and cut costs whenever possible. They even shared hardware with Sega Naomi to save even more money.Sega Saturn was Sega Japan going crazy with the design and splurging money like crazy. They assumed it would sell even more units than Sega Genesis.
>>12799079The Genesis flopped in Japan, so the Saturn did outsell it there.
it didnt have good games
>>12798596>>12798603I haven't posted on /vr/ for like 2 weeks and you're still making the exact same threads with the exact same arguments that get debunked by the exact same common knowledge points, do you genuinely get off being told how wrong you are?
>>12799061nigga the majority on the country was on 56k dial up when the Dreamcast was supported. you really think motherfuckers were spending a week to download pirated Dreamcast ISOs? dipshit
Maybe it's the elephant in the room that nobody mentions: Sega's insistence on porting simple arcade games when gamers were hungry for something more substantive like FFX or Chrono Cross. If Sega developed an epic single player RPG like Phantasy Star V or a Sonic JRPG, they might've stood a chance.
>>12798596i think cause it came out a full two years prior to the rest of the gen and the ps1 was cheap as fuck and had a million fuckin games for it. also the ps1 platinum games were like 20 dollars. i agree with the piracy angle for sure. most people i knew that had the console had mostly bought at the store games. i knew a few kids at school that had computers that could actually burn discs. there was one kid at school selling games for like ten or twenty dollars. but like every kid that i knew irl that had games if they had ten games maybe two or three at most were pirated. and even bought games at the store after. imagine trying to download a gigabyte of data on dial up back in the day before dsl was a thing. you had to own the game realistically to be able to pirate it. i guess you could rent the games and store the files but again if your parents werent retards try explaining a massive gb file on your pc lmao >>12798627>>12798617this>>12798810also this
>>12799125larping zoomie who wasn't there, many obvious tells.not going to call any of them out because I don't want faggots like this to stop committing those errors.
>>12799132youre a retard fuckin nigger
>>12799107Dude you could literally borrow a game from a friend or rent one from the video store and copy it onto the PC. Broadband was also available by 2000. Nice try dumbass.
>>12799061>pirate release groups that were Sony boyz who spent their free time shilling DC disks because they love Sony so much lol, lmao really
>>12799139I thought it was the Sony pirate patrol, but now everyone in 1999 was just gifted with iso conversion software and the ability to use it if they went to blockbuster
>>12798596>This one is the most common, but it falls flat on the surfaceNo it doesn't. Sega was in bankruptcy before the Dreamcast was even released. Their VP donated almost all of his money to save the company at this time. Additionally the Dreamcast lacked third party support because of the Saturn's fiasco with early release and early termination, which directly impacted its appeal to consumers since it lacked games by many major studios. These are the factors that led to the Dreamcast have a short production run. It's obvious you have an agenda to push with your thread but everyone can see that you're an idiot. So good luck, retard.
>>12799125By the time most people could burn a gdr >which was never because it was a niche thing to doDreamcast games were already on clearance for 5-10$. I knew kids who had a modded ps1 and played burnt ps1 games, I didn’t see burned DC games until the mid 2010s on etsy
>>12798596>the weebo sega faggot is at it againI like how he oscillates between >SOA killed segaAnd when that gets debunked he pivots to>actually piracy killed the DCWhich is funny because any non poseur faggot would know that running cdrs on a DC is terrible for the machine as it has to spin too fast to read a car and thusly burns out system. It will quarter the life of a DC, but the weebo faggot doesn’t know that because he’s probably only emulated
>>12799139>the majority of the country was on 56k dialup>well broadband existed You are a retard
>>12799139No, you couldn't. The Dreamcast used GD-ROMs, which can't be read by standard CD/DVD drives. Games were dumped with dev kits or retail consoles loaded with custom software that allowed the user to dump games through the console's serial port.
>>12799139Not how it works zoomie
Couldn't you just copy the games and burn them?
>>12799219You obviously weren't born during the time when borrowing games & renting these games were common or how stupidly easy it was for pirates to copy these games onto a PC.>>12799232Yes
>>12799084It had the best sports sims on the market for its lifespan and some really good arcade ports. But it has a shallow library outside of arcade ports and sport sims. 6th was a generation of sports, FPS and 3rd person action games. Dreamcast lacked the second joystick to do justice to 2/3rds of the 6th gens best games.
>>12798651So then not enough normies bought a Dreamcast. If the Dreamcast had sold better, then it wouldn’t have been so badly impacted by piracy.
>>12799073Being knee deep in Korean hookers will do that to a man.
>>12799169>>12799183damn. OP BTFO
>>12799135larping zoomie is mad that they got called out.as per usual
>>12799139broadband was available in the fucking 80s through T3 lines, dumbass. the point is that the average American household didn't typically have broadband until well after the DC was dead and gone.you fucking idiot zoomers run to google to fact check shit while understanding none of the context that people who were actually there had. and you wonder why we can always clock you in an instant.spend whatever's left of your 20s the fuck away from 4chan you fucking dunce.
>>12798596Probably that female-body-framed tiny pussy shoulders fagget communist homosexual Justin trudeau
>>12799171i saw a few dreamcast copys in those days the kid i knew that sold games claimed he had a pc that could burn dreamcast games. maybe he just got them some where else and resold em at school. i knew someone that had one of those discs you could put in a ps1 and make the console region free after it ran whatever soft ware was on the disc. didnt know annyone with a modded ps1 though. didnt know about modded consoles until the late xbox era. when someone i knew bought a modded xbox at a mall game store. came with like 50 xbox games and you could delete a game and add a new one. i remember my friend deleting a couple sports games on that thing and loading games he rented from block buster on it. it also had like every genesis snes etc game on it. this was like 06 maybe 07. that thing was expensive too. it was like every gift from his family for like a year or so lmao
>>12798596The world may never know what killed that piece of shit console. Theres 6 million threeads about it every week but nobody could ever figure it out
>>12799352I actually had broadband in 2000, my internet service provider at the time was Charter Cable. So I got super fast internet at the time, making my experience in downloading super easy. Cable internet was extremely popular at the time, phone companies like AT&T hated it. So you can try to lie and manipulate this however you want, but I'm pretty sure I'm older than your lying ass.
>>12799171Funny, I saw burned Dreamcast games as early 2000. But I didn't see a DreamSNES disc until 2002.
>>12799426cable internet wasn't even popular in general dipshit. most people who even bothered with broadband in 2000, which were a minority, had to settle for DSL because cable wasn't available to them.you were not there and you don't know what the fuck you're talking about.kill yourself immediately.
>>12799429Actually you weren't there. Cable internet was mainstream by 2000 and the phone companies were powerless to stop it. The only places Cable companies weren't available is at the middle of nowhere towns with farm fields, which is where you likely grew up at. You sound triggered. Good, let the butt hurt flow right through you cuck.
>>12799436>n-no i'm right and u madyou weren't there, zoomie, and nobody who was is going to fall for your dumb shit. live with it.
>>12799436>every cable company offered cable internetWhen will Gen Z learn to do some research before larping? It's years we've had of this buffonery.
>>12799436>Cable internet was mainstream by 2000Nope.
>>12798596>PS2 hype - The PS2 was barely out when the Dreamcast was dying. To blame it on hype of the PS2 is like blaming Nsync for killing the Backstreet Boys momentum by stealing their idea, despite the fact that the Backstreet Boys are still together selling records to this day while Nsync is Xstinct now.Literally, I was around then, and the PS2 hype completely sucked the oxygen out of the space.>"Toy Story quality" graphics>Emotion EngineGo look up old issues of GamePro on archive.org. Sony showed pre-rendered FMV sequences as actual PS2 gameplay footage, and everyone fell for it.This, coupled with the fact that the PS1 had a ginormous library with games that were released cheaply to begin with (often $39.99) that kept getting cheaper as time went on, and a lot of gamers chose to just wait for the PS2.
>>12799426>Cable internet was extremely popular at the timeIn 2000? Are you fucking retarded?
>>12799449And that graph includes DSL.
>>12799453sir cable internet very high speed sir we have in bangalore (tech capital bharat) in 1989 sir plz beleeve :(
>>12799453yeah i remember dial up until like 2002 when i heard about dsl
why does everybody keep bringing up dick sucking lips??
>>12798596NO FIFA
>>12798596tl;dr: [HEADCANON]OP is a faggot. Eggman's AI daughter goes in a certain field.
>>12799451>Sony showed pre-rendered FMV sequences as actual PS2 gameplay footage, and everyone fell for it.Never happened There is nothing particularly impressive with those demo ,PS2 could do it in real time
>>12799449Remember shitloads of niggers having cable online back then I was jealous as fuck
>>12799091You got banned by the tranny mod too, huh? Did you say the "gaymer word"?
>>12799660not in 2000 you don't.
>>12799723No, i just left for a while.
>>127985961- it was inbetween generations: more powerful than a PS1, less powerful than a PS22- saturn was a huge fail, following sega cd and 32 huge fails, people wanted a nintendo or a playstation from now on3- third party support was lacking, every dev was on playstation3b- third party support was lacking, maybe because of easy piracy
>>12799325>You obviously weren't born during the time when borrowing games & renting these games were common or how stupidly easy it was for pirates to copy these games onto a PC.
42yo boomer here. These threads have never convinced me that Dreamcast piracy was widespread enough in 2000 to do that much damage. First of all, it was nowhere near as easy to copy retail discs as OP is making it out to be. Dreamcast ROMs weren’t widely available online until we were actually in the broadband era around the mid 00s. I’m speaking specifically of my American experience just for clarification.
>>12800101OP is just a training bot, pay attention to how stupid and samey the headers have become before and after the hack.
>>12800263Yeah, there are numerous glaring spelling errors in the OP. If it’s actually a human, it’s a stupid one.
>>12800263Anon OP thinks there were “PC master race” gamers in 1998 that conspired with the dreaded Sony pirate squad that conspired to pirate and give out dreamcasts library. In 1998.It’s the segaboo
>>12798596Don't watch that fat cuckold cucklord.Piracy didn't kill the dreamcast because you could pirate shit on the ps2 far easier.It failed because sega didn't listen and used G disks instead of dvds. They didn't give it a hdd. They didn't listen when customers said they were wanting a ps2 because it had a dvd player.They couldn't have a lot of games because they weren't able to be ported to the DC due to this
>>12799349>>12799325>>12799132>you must be a zoomie if you didn’t see the Sony gangs handing out GDR conversionsCoooooooope
>>12799346The morons sold their soul to the yakuza, because nintendo and konami were part of the big kobe family too.
>>12799082The saturn was a great 2d machine, but a terrible 3d machine that needed gimmicks to work.Didnt help that sega us was led by a Microsoft mole and japan was as mentally ill as nintendo under yamauchi too.Sony under retard mad ken did nothing, their enemies were sabotaging each other.
>>12800483Sony is also to blame on this in part because guess who had the monopoly on dvd production... Nintendo had to go with mini dvds to work with and evade sony's royalties, and Microsoft had to wait.
>>12800805>DVDs were under the Sony monopolyMini dvds were still under the DVD6c license which was part of a consortium that payed out to Sony/JVC/Time Warner etc and were definitionally not part of a Sony monopoly. >They used Minidvds to circumvent thatNo they went with proprietary 8” DVDs to thwart piracy just like how sega went with the GDR for its “6th” gen console. Licensing the dvd format would have cost them less than still licensing the format while needing to manufacture your own new disk format
>>12798596Not enough compelling exclusive games? Looking through the Dreamcast catalog, a few genres are just oversaturated with multiplats and the few games unique to the console are just weird as fuck, so the normalfag masses wouldn't buy it for that.
>>12800457>Anon OP thinks there were “PC master race” gamers in 1998Not him, but I'm sure a few people like that existed back then. Wasn't PC where the FPS genre was just starting to gain traction?
>>12800483>They didn't give it a hdd.Not even Sony added a HDD for the PS2 until much later. I believe the Xbox was the only console during the 6th gen that came with an HDD as opposed to memory cards.
I've got the following games for my dreamcast:Gundam side storyBerserkJJBAWhat other titles do you think I would like? The similar to the first two the better as I think between JJBA and one other fighter for ps1 I have all the fighting games I will ever want.
>>12801361You'd LOVE Floigan Bros.
What killed the DC threads should u unironically be banned
>>12801365I thought you were trolling but the Wikipedia blurb for the gameplay sounds genuinely interesting thanks anon
>>12801395You're welcome! I'm a big platformer fan myself, so it was something I've been meaning to play for a while.
>>12801305>wasnt pc where the fps genre was just starting to gain traction>in 1998Anon doom was ported to sega genesis and SNES, Dreamcast had quake 3 and goldeneye and Medal of Honor were giant successes in 5th. FPS was already a major genre by 5th, let alone late 5th gen when the Dreamcast released.>>12801308The only PS2 versions allowing HDD were the original launch consoles that had an HDD expansion slot on launch … sort of. The slot was for a network adapter that would release later that could power an HDD.
>>12801468You have a point console ports of FPS games were also starting to appear, though if we want to be nitpicky, they were still cut down from their PC originals. (DOOM ports used the Jaguar's level set until the GBA.)>>12801468That's right, I believe Squeenix had their own answer to Phantasy Star Online. It was online for quite a while from what I've heard.
>>12801361Why would you not just get a GDEMU clone from AliExpress for $50, put the entire library on an SD card and call it a day?
>>12801470Anon 4th gen systems had fps. Goldeneye and Medal of Honor were made for their respective consoles in 5th. FPS was an established genre by 98, the biggest difference it was called the doom clone genre as often as it was called FPS
>>12798596Stupid post.Sega as a company was barely financially viable by the time Dreamcast launched. They could not compete advertising with Sony infinitely deep pockets. The 32X and Saturn had poisoned the Sega brand. Nobody LIKED Sega any more, and nobody wanted what they had to offer - 2nd rate arcade ports and a mediocre 3D Sonic game that came out 5 years too late. Piracy had nothing to do with it. Why would anyone buy a visibly doomed console from a visibly doomed manufacturer? I bought it for the sole purpose of playing Phantasy Star Online, but there aren't that many people out there who did the same ... and if i'd waited a year or so I could've played a superior version on a superior console anyway.
>>12801628Yeah I'm ignoring the obvious elephants in the room, aren't I? PSX and N64 seemed to have a healthy FPS scene.
Funny how Sega fanboys will never stop big coping over Sony.One company just did shit significantly better than the other.FFVII became a timeless, classic masterpiece that will be played and talked about forever while Panzer Dragoon Saga and Shining Force are just sitting there being forgotten.
>>12798596>affect>>12798603>parish
>>12798627>a snake eating its tailIt's called Ouroboros.
>>12802635OP’s post is all ESL gibberish. Probably a Brazilian.
>>12799474Why do you? We're talking about direct service link.
>>12800785The what?
>>12800796>sega us was led by a Microsoft mole?
>>12801470What about the Jaguar's and GBA's level sets were different from the original?
>>12802664Larger maps have had entire portions removed.
