Dunno bout zoomers, but I think it improved some things over Morrowind, mostly by simplifying mechanics (guaranteed to piss some nerds off).
Enchanting is a lot more straightforward, reduced armor/weapon classes (not reduced variety) was also a good change. Combat is better in pretty much every way. Fatigue was improved (but I don't agree with being able to fully heal by just waiting an hour).

Skyrim was just more of the same, IMO. None of the changes were particularly noteworthy because the game itself, just like Oblivion, is not that fun or that interesting.

>>3935360
>Why do zoomers treat this as a hidden gem now?
Because they were impressionable children when they played it on their Xbox, and now feel nostalgia for that time. It's really not complicated. Same reason I'll always love Morrowind.

>>3935402
I'm an '03 zoomer and played Morrowind for the first time when I was 16. It's a fantastic game and not just nostalgia bait. That being said, the unique world and environments is what carries it, if it had been a generic Roman/Viking setting like Oblivion/Skyrim Elder scrolls would have been retired.

>>3935360
Gen X and Millennials convinced me years ago that Oblivion is smaller than Morrowind that's not even fucking true. So what else did they say about Oblivion that was negative that's probably not true?

>>3935360
The negative elements of Morrowind were goofy combat and dorky animations.
The negative elements of Skyrim were shallow quests and shitty factions.
Oblivion has none of the above, and does a whole lot of things better than those games.

>>3935627
>So what else did they say about Oblivion that was negative that's probably not true?
It's all lies, and I'm being deadass. Never listen to unhappy old guys.

>>3935360
Childhood nostalgia + shitty contrarianism

>>3935360
>with none of the positives
then why do so many people like it?

Leveled encounters completely ruined this game to the point it's unplayable. There's literally no point in progressing and gaining powerful if it just means your enemies will also be more powerful. Random bandits in glass armor (the rarest and most valuable armor mortals can produce) is fucking retarded. Ruins all immersion, completely ruins the fun, makes me wonder why I'm even playing because it sure isn't for the story.

>>3935728
This.

>>3935360
It has the best and most interesting quests of every elder scrolls game tho

>>3935779
yeah this is a fucking lie

File: Inn.png (730 KB, 557x553)

730 KB PNG

>>3935792
it has the best and most interesting quests of every elder scrolls game
also the best aesthetics and soundtrack

File: mostpleasantoblivionface.jpg (31 KB, 554x554)

31 KB JPG

>>3935793
>best aesthetics

>>3935793
>best aesthetics
you mean boring generic fantasy setting with absolutely no original thought?
Morrowind created an engaging, unique, well thought out world that was unlike anything we've ever seen before. And set Oblivion up to do the same. The Empire was supposed to be a crazy mish-mash of Aztec/Incan tropical jungle Empire with Roman Imperial aesthetics, but then the Oblivion developers were like, no, too risky, let's completely overhaul the timeline to make it the most bland, white-bread European fantasy setting imaginable

File: Yes.jpg (8 KB, 220x229)

8 KB JPG

>>3935796
>Bro what if giant mushrooms and 50 different not!realworldcultures!

>>3935796
>skyrim
>adjacent to a steaming jungle
dude skooma lmao

oblivion is just really fun to play as a thief. every year i just create a bosmer character, download higher independent thievery requirements and actually valuable valuables, and then rob all nine cities in game. every single shop, palace, chapel and wealthy looking house. it's just so fun to sneak around at night, especially in palaces where you legitimately have to plan heists, overcoming guards and stuff. it's also fun to rush sigil stones in oblivion gates with only sneaking and running, fun to run and bunny hop around the game, fun to crawl dungeons in secrecy, to create your own spells, to do daedra quests. dark brotherhood is well written too and i love whodunit a lot. it is janky, but i think it's a labor of love and it has its own mystique and charm. i mean just look at shivering isles. one of my fav games, i have hundreds of hours in it. wish my laptop could run remastered but i'm a poor shitskin unfortunately

File: 4119088_orig.jpg (106 KB, 640x342)

106 KB JPG

>>3935801
These are the Andes mountains, less than 100 miles away from the Amazon rain forest

>>3935798
You try too hard. Name one game with environments like Morrowinds. You can't. You have the Dark elf settlements, contrasting with the imperial outposts, contrasting with the area around the volcano, the islands, then when you somehow get sick of that you can travel up to Soltsheim and visit the filthy pagans.

>>3935809
skyrim has tundra and taiga
show me some of those within 100 miles of jungles

>>3935792
Literally name a single quest more fun than whodunnit in Skyrim and morrowind

>>3935815
>"show me one game with volcanoes, swamps, rocky islands, english villages/castles, and primitive tribal camps"

>>3935826
Show me one game with settlements carved out of the carapaces of massive prehistoric crab creatures, vast underground insect egg farms that fed the population, and swift travel carriages which were 60-foot tall ticks driven by physically manipulating its exposed brains

I'm waiting

>>3935832
sorry, giant mushrooms AND giant insects

morrowind is basically dune + nausicaa + dark sun

>>3935845
okay the entire plot of Morrowind is basically a direct plagiarism of the plot of Dune. I'll give you that.

>>3935360
>Why do zoomers treat this as a hidden gem now? It's literally the negative elements of Morrowind and Skyrim with none of the positives.
Nostalgia

>>3935823
Whodunit sucks because it's broken. You can stab people right in front of each other and they won't notice. It would be a good but not great quest if it worked.

>>3935907
>I saw a dark brotherhood assassin the other day. Dreadful creatures.
>goodbye.
>Goodbye!

>>3935360
It actually has good gameplay but the level scaling ruins it. Thats why I keep recommending people to play Nehrim, German autism mogs Todds everything.

>>3936142
hey, how about that
never heard of it; thanks anon

>>3935823
Mystery of the Dwarves.

File: Trebonius.png (159 KB, 910x158)

159 KB PNG

>>3936182
>Mystery of the Dwarves

>>3936193
>refuses to promote you so he can steal all the credit
Maybe there's a reason he made Arch-Mage after all...

>>3935646
Fucking this. So much this.

>>3935793
>>3935795
LOL

>>3935822
It's magic stuff, no need to explain.

>>3935815
>You try too hard. Name one game with environments like Morrowinds
Zeno Clash 1 & 2

The only reason anything elder scrolls pre Skyrim did well was because people back then were conditioned to the long term, actually fucking read, and probably not normies by a long shot.
There was just a patience to be had when playing those old games. Go play them again and you'll probably find yourself trying to speed run thst shit because its so slow going. Thats how much the mentality and actual gameplay has changed.
Zoomies think is a gem because its so radically different and forces one to plan out. Oblivion's level scaling really punished leveling up willy nilly and forced commitment to the build; Skyrim you just kill shit pick a stat pick a perk rinse repeat in a different line.
Elder scrolls is a brand I hate going back to older games because its a deep dive into how the real world used to behave

>>3936664
>morrowind bad because its target audience wasn't normies like me
Ok? Click off the board them dumbass.

>>3936843
>Click off the board them dumbass
What did he mean by this

>>3935360
I just kinda started the game, now I'm at the sewer gate as a nord, and for some reason Baurus assumed I was a bard.. and hell I might just roll with this, and go full roleplay, or rollplay lol (because I feel like the class was rolled on me)

>>3936198
Incompetent retard having hung post because he is friends with right people is top tier immersion.

>>3935728
>>3935736
Yeah that was always my biggest issue.

The answer (before mods) was to just stop leveling past lvl 10. Stopped enemies from becoming sponges, kept itemization and quest rewards good, didn't fuck the economy.

>>3935793
While I wouldn't say it's "has the best" aesthetics they are pretty on point. While I do love the more alien world Morrowind gives Shivering Isles proved that the same thing could be achieved within Oblivions engine.

>>3935796
On one hand I hate when they fuck with established lore. On the other hand I hate tropic environments. I do with they didn't go quite as bland as they did. Really should have focused on that Colovian/Nibenay divide.

I do appreciate that they tried to give every major town it's own style tho.

>>3935802
Based

Just in it for the love of the game

>>3935845
Yeah! and it's based!

>>3936944
The game takes notes of the skills you use up until that point and suggest the class that overlaps the most with what you've done.

>>3935360
Arguments that only occur inside OPs head.

Meds. Now.

>>3935360
oblivion has always been the best. its better than morrowind and skyrim by a mile, and im a millennial.

>>3935360
As someone who played morrowind oblivion and skyrim at release, all of these games are masterpieces and can be enjoyed by anyone.

>>3939229
>oblivion has always been the best. its better than morrowind and skyrim by a mile, and im a millennial.
I was in college when Oblivion came out. Its only improvements over Morrowind are manually blocking, and object physics . Peak Oblivion was shooting a fireball at a bowl full of apples and snickering as they fly. Once you’ve done that, you’ve seen the whole game

>>3935360
>It's literally the negative elements of Morrowind and Skyrim with none of the positives.
what do you mean

>>3935728
Oh look, another retard who didn't find the difficulty slider in the options menu

>>3935736
>>3937194
It's an epidemic

>>3939372
>just put the game on journalist mode to restore your immersion after random pissbaby bandits shake you down for 10 gold while wearing an extremely rare suit of armor worth thousands, bro

File: 1621886937547.png (1.03 MB, 1024x1024)

1.03 MB PNG

>best thieves guild
>best darkbrotherhood
>best player homes
>cool underrated official expansions like the wizard tower or the pirate cave or that weird dunmer insurrection Mehrunes Razor quest I've never seen anyone talk about
>Shivering Isles being strange and wonderful
>BEST conjuration gameplay in the series
>castles in every town to sneak around in and burglarize best thief gameplay ACROBATICS and CHAMELEON
>excellent Gladiator questline
yea Oblivion gaming. hell yea.

are there problems? yes. I have more hours in Morrowind/Tamriel Rebuilt at this point, believe me, I GET how much more interesting of a setting Tamriel can be compared to what Oblivion gave us. Oblivion has the weakest modding scene, Skyrim is clearly more comfortable for 90% of gamers for whatever reasons. The levelling is FUCKED to SHIT in TES:IV we all know this and must mod around it.

btw any of you niggers that don't play on PC and don't mod get the fuck out of the fandom/community/discussions I don't want consoleniggers that can't work a mod loadorder to ever speak to me about elder scrolls again

>>3939409
>>Shivering Isles being strange and wonderful
Stopped reading here. I replayed Oblivion a few years ago. The base game was tolerable, KotN was based, and SI was extremely cringe and I couldn't stand it. It's aged extremely poorly.

>>3939409
Woah based

>vampirism gets me journeyman level destruction, illusion and mysticism at level 1
A vampire high elf mage it is.

>>3935360
Morrowind is known for its setting and atmosphere.
Oblivion is known for its quest design.
Skyrim is known for its open world and fluid combat design.

Sounds like zoomers just discovered decent writing mixed with compelling storytelling, which is ironic since they’re collectively all ChatGPT-brained illiterate retards that don’t and/or can’t read books.

>>3935823
Rise of House Telvanni, Trade Disputes & White Wolf of Lokken shit all over whodunnit.
>>3935845
Morrowind was made for old head chads that appreciate good writing mixed with eastern esotericism/spiritualism.
>>3936664
It’s like we’re witnessing zoomers achieve sapience in real-time, incredible.

>>3939409
I’m still running Tamriel Rebuilt 19.02 (with the factions, preview, and travels .esps) because those motherfuckers broke so many incredible old mods when they updated everything from TR_Data to Tamriel_Data. Never forgive, never forget

>>3935402
/thread

>>3941426
I decided not to go vampire, not yet at least, but I got destruction, illusion and conjuration to journeyman, so I'm all set for some fun mage gameplay. I also got some training in blunts so I can use the bound mace to pound some poison on those breton mages.
I tried Drain Magicka, and it seems to work like a cheaper Silence spell, at least on imps, probably some other creatures. I'll have to try drain fatigue spells too.

And I had some great RNG and found rings of alteration and destruction. Usually I never see these. Now I just need one for illusion, and robes with some Shield on them.

This whole thread OP started was just a trollbait.
Oblivion has the best faction quests of any elder scrolls games, best music with Skyrim and Morrowind, gave us Sean Bean and Patrick Stewart as voice actors, beautiful and lush scenery contrasting to the ashy wasteland of Morrowind and grey mountains of Skyrim, comedic NPCs interactions... etc.

I also think it's the more balanced of the last 3 main titles: enchanting and potion can't be exploited to ridiculous numbers, and spell crafting you had to work for to unlock (unless you got the dlc). Even then, spellcrafting depended on you mastering the schools of magic to cast ridiculous OP spells, and need several others spells as setup to increase your magicka.

Leveling system is garbage, but once you max your character, you can just spam transcended sigil stones on your armor and destroy enemies with spamming a "drain health 100 + weakness to Magic 100%" lol

>>3942057
>contrasting to the ashy wasteland of Morrowind and grey mountains of Skyrim
Stopped reading here

>>3942057
>Oblivion has the best faction quests of any elder scrolls games
The Dark Brotherhood is hard carrying that opinion. Mage's guild was not good, Fighter's guild at least had a twist, and the Thieves' guild was at least better than Morrowind or Skyrim, but that's a low bar.
If every mage's guild big bad didn't enter combat at monologue range it would solve a lot of my issues, or if Mannimarco wasn't dramatically revealed to be some guy.

>>3942130
IMO only Morrowind's main quest can compete with any of Oblivion's quests.

Mannimarco may have fallen flat on his arse, but the questline still had many fun and unique quests. Doing the recommendations and getting access to the university grounds is peak.

>>3942137
>Doing the recommendations and getting access to the university grounds is peak.
That's kind of the rub, that is where the questline peaks.

>>3942153
Hard to compete with it. Rip it off snd plant it into Morrowind's main quest and the university would be the peak there too.

But the questline still had aces up its sleeve. My personal favorite is the Skingrad vampire hunter quest, thanks to the choices you're given on how to complete it. Jskar, wood elf battlemage, assault on the altmer cunt were memorable too.

>>3935360
>more concerned with what others think than discussing games you enjoy
There's something wrong with you

>>3935360
Oblivion felt like an empty promise. We never got to see the full potential of this title. Numerous retcons and lore shifts were introduced to make sense of the world as presented in TES IV. I wouldn't have been a fan of the jungle Cyrodiil, but I am neither a fan of the LOTR-inspired main quest and feudal world, where every major city is just some county/duchy.
The way Oblivion's world is structured feels very familiar to us, and that's why a lot of anons cling to it and defend the game.
If you watch documentaries on the making of Oblivion, you get to see how rushed the development was and the sort of constraints they were working with. I get the impression that Todd wanted the world to be as good as a facade while prioritising technical advancements like graphics (even if they didn't age well). This was made worse by the fact that they needed to get the game to run on consoles, which didn't have great hardware.
So what we got in the end was a passable Elder Scrolls entry that needed to be palatable to the masses so that Bethesda could survive this development cycle. I can go on, but my main point is that Oblivion failed to live up to the success of Morrowind with respect to its depth in storytelling and novelty.

Oblivion was the first elder scrolls game I tried. Thought the character models looked cartoonishly dumb and hilarious, fov was too compact and everything felt bigger and weird, especially the close ups on npc faces during dialogue. Then the crashes during tutorial level alone were the nails in the coffin.

Few months later I played skyrim for the first time, loved it, felt more streamlined and enjoyable for a casual experience, and I wanted more, so I eventually went back to oblivion and after a while, I enjoyed it. I loved it almost as much as skyrim. It had a unique charm with its design and npc interaction, and it's music! Ugh, everything about it was just so comedic and charming, I can't even describe it. It oozes charm and feels like you're in a cartoonish oil painting. It's like if the original Fable doubled down on janky and comedy unintentionally.

Looking back, my young mind wasn't ready to enjoy oblivion back when I first played it and I may have judged it too harshly.
Perhaps one day I can learn to enjoy morrowind and daggerfall to the same degree.

>>3935360
Spell Crafting! anon

>>3942137
>>3942153
I also liked when you were sent to create your first staff.

The questline really made you feel like you were actually joining an academy. Unlike the Skyrim College questline.

But even now when I play a mage in Skyrim I go to each of the towns to learn from the court mages before making my way to the college.

>>3944690
>But even now when I play a mage in Skyrim I go to each of the towns to learn from the court mages before making my way to the college.
Yeah pacing things yourself, and making appropriate decisions for the character always enhances roleplay.

>Pretty soon, the beastfolk all knew how to read and write... which was handy, since it made them better slaves for the Ayleids, hahaha.
This line of dialogue genuinely made me laugh.

>>3935646
>It's all lies, and I'm being deadass. Never listen to unhappy old guys.
Starting an oblivion playthrough, where can I pick up my first crossbow?

>>3945559
>Some people desire special bows that require a long loading time and use special arrows called bolts. M'aiq considers these people idiots.

>>3939385
If you build a journalist-tier character, then you should expect to have to use journalist-tier difficulty, yes.

>>3946203
Not very bright, are you?

>>3946205
>No argument
Thanks for playing.

>>3946382
You quoted the wrong post. Here >>3946203

>>3946382
Let me spell out the reply chain, and see if you can read and comprehend it this time:
>>3935728
>Random bandits in glass armor (the rarest and most valuable armor mortals can produce) is fucking retarded. Ruins all immersion
>>3939372
>Oh look, another retard who didn't find the difficulty slider in the options menu
>>3939385
>just put the game on journalist mode to restore your immersion after random pissbaby bandits shake you down for 10 gold while wearing an extremely rare suit of armor worth thousands, bro
>>3946203
>If you build a journalist-tier character, then you should expect to have to use journalist-tier difficulty, yes.

I've played daggerfall, skyrim, and morrowind and was able to enjoy each of those in their own way. I could never enjoy oblivion though. Not sure what I'm missing. The faces are so fucking ugly without the benefit of being "dated" or pixelated like the older titles. The main plot is fine but not something I want to waste time pursuing. Mechanics are like morrowind minus the diceroll, but not as "responsive" as skyrim. There is almost nothing that makes me want to go back to this game like the other titles.

>>3935641
>The negative elements of Skyrim were shallow quests and shitty factions.
>Oblivion has none of the above
lol. lmao even.

>>3935360
Literally how is [vanilla] Skyrim better in any way compared to Oblivion?

>>3946775
I feel like you owe it to yourself to give it a try, considering you already played morrowind and skyrim. I thought oblivion was trash too when I first picked it up, but I went back to it years later after skyrim and started feeling a sense of homeiness to it. It's charming, funny whether intentional or not, and something about it makes me come back years after I beat it. Faction ranks and progression, the art style of the menu and character page, the npc dialogue and interactions... give it a shot

>>3935796
The lmao jungle was a retcon idiot. Muh PGE people are the fucking worst.

>>3946903
>Muh PGE people are the fucking worst.
It’s time to log off.

>>3946854
>Literally how is [vanilla] Skyrim better in any way compared to Oblivion?
Hmm what would be the least subjective improvement..

Gameplay in third person view. I played an archer entirely in third person mode. Doesn't play that well in Oblivion.

>>3946854
To play devils advocate:
Combat is more fun and dynamic, being able to power attack and shield bash was a big improvement, just like oblivion adding manual blocking improved over Morrowind
Level scaling is significantly less stupid
More interesting character building and better perks
Environments are more varied and interesting
Doesn’t have the terrible “radiant dialogue”
Doesn’t have the persuasion wheel minigame
Looks nicer, plays less janky
Better music (Can’t remember a single song from Oblivion honestly but Morrowind has peak TES music)

There are things that Skyrim downgraded from Oblivion (dropping the stats was a big mistake, both gams continued the streamlining and dumbing down trend, factions went downhill, loss of things like spellmsking) but overall Skyrim is the better game imo. I started with Morrowind and will always be fond of it, in the same way I think most people who love Oblivion and don’t think of it as the goofy redheaded stepchild of the series were probably Xbox kids who played oblivion first

Oblivion was supposed to improve upon Morrowind, not shit on everything that made it so great...

>>3947008
It improved a lot of the mechanics, but it also took the adventure out of it by implementing quest markers and fast travel. Voiced dialogue is an objective improvement, but it was also a downgrade because it severely limited the amount of dialogue and its content.

>>3947076
>Voiced dialogue is an objective improvement
Oblivions voiced dialogue was not an improvement in any way, much less “objectively”. Morrowind already had voiced dialogue, and the perfect amount (just enough to provide characterization, not enough to feel restraints of storage space, time, or budget). It also had unique VAs for each race/sex combination, while Oblivion started sloppily reusing the same VA for multiple races, which is immersion-breaking and annoying once you notice it. And Oblivion had the God-awful random conversations stitched together, which sounded like shit and were a meme two decades ago.

>>3947083
The presence of an optional feature, compared to the absence of said feature, is an objective improvement, when all other things remain equal. Morrowind only had voiced greetings and combat taunts. Imagine if (and this has most likely already been done) every line of dialogue in Morrowind was voiced, with nothing else changed. Imagine you could also turn this feature off if you preferred the "authentic" experience. There would be literally no downside to this feature being there, thus making it an objective improvement. I already pointed out the fact that in practice the voiced dialogue did come with several major drawbacks, such as the dialogue itself being limited in the number of lines spoken, as well as the things you mentioned. So please, don't reduce my argument into "oblivion voice dialog = gud", because that's neither my opinion, nor the point I'm trying to make.

>>3947076
>Voiced dialogue
>it severely limited the amount of dialogue and its content.
Is there proof? I doubt this, since almost every NPC in Oblivion has unique dialogue, random conversations about the quest player has done, etc.
Tons of dialogue despite being voiced.

>>3947088
>The presence of an optional feature, compared to the absence of said feature, is an objective improvement
No. You’re starting from the assumption that full voice acting is a desirable feature, which is debatable, and it is not optional.
>when all other things remain equal
All other things did not remain equal.

>>3947089
>Is there proof?
This is when games shipped on physical media and there were constraints on the amount of data that can be stored. It’s also expensive and consumes a proportionally larger amount of the budget, as the volume increases. They famously blew a large portion of the budget on big name actors like Patrick Stewart.

>>3947089
Play Morrowind and you'll have your proof. There are so many text lines of dialogue per race+sex that no reasonable person would think Oblivion would be able to replicate the amount in 2006. In fact, when I first found out that Oblivion would be fully voiced, my genuine first reaction as a kid was "Ah shieeeet. So we're gonna lose content."

Interestingly enough, AI has effectively solved that problem.

>>3947091
>No. You’re starting from the assumption that full voice acting is a desirable feature, which is debatable
I'm saying that being able to choose between ash yams OR scrib jerky is objectively better than being limited to ash yams only.
You're saying having the choice is not objectively better, because you didn't like the scrib jerky that you got served at Black Shalk Cornerclub last year and that others might not like it either. Grow up.

>>3947094
Do you have numbers on how many dialogue lines there are in each game?

>>3947100
Not off the top of my head. But as I said, consider that for each generic line, you'd have different voices depending on race and sex. If you had a different voice for each, you're looking at a multiplier of 20. All 3 elf races have the same voice actors in Oblivion most likely to help with voice line reuse, while in Morrowind they all had distinct voices (but were limited to greetings / idle noises).

>>3947106
That doesn't mean there is less dialogue.

>>3947108
It's not proof that there's less dialogue per se, but just looking at individual NPCs and their lines should give you a good general idea. Generic Oblivion NPCs will typically only have "%TownName" and "Rumors", ~10 seconds per line. A generic Morrowind NPC, if fully voiced, will likely talk at you for 5-10 minutes straight before exhausting every line. Not to mention it being text based, makes it much easier to implement more immersive aspects like %PCRace, %PCSex, %PCFactionRank, etc. How many times did Oblivion even have an NPC react to those things outside of the dark elf in prison?

>>3947113
>A generic Morrowind NPC
>will likely talk at you
But not among themselves. And yes there are different dialogue lines acknowledging race. Even PC's skills. The time of day. Asking or telling you to leave their property.

But enough of this, if we don't have the actual numbers for the amounts of dialogue lines in Morrowind and Oblivion.

>>3947099
>I'm saying that being able to choose between ash yams OR scrib jerky is objectively better than being limited to ash yams only.
You seem to be describing some counter-factual hypothetical different game than the game we got. There is no option or choice or toggle between Oblivion style dialogue and Morrowind style dialogue. You get Oblivion dialogue and that’s it.

>>3935360
Because the DB and Thieves Guild quest-lines in Oblivion still have not been matched to this day.

>>3947115
>>3947099
you're an idiot and the other guy is right.

>>3947147
That's because the only thing we're in disagreement over is my definition of "objective improvement". Such a thing can only exist at a level of analysis you're seemingly not willing to go down to. If I say "an audio mixer having 4 channels instead of 2 is an objective improvement", you can always say things like "yeah but it's more expensive, you'd have to buy 2 extra cables to make use of it, building it required more components that are harmful to the planet, the chink had to work extra long and hard to make it, etc etc, so (to me) it's not an improvement, much less an objective one".

We're not even in disagreement over how we feel about Oblivion being fully voiced. I don't disagree with almost any of the stuff you've been trying to lecture me on. It's just that I haphazardly made one very specific point with a very narrow meaning and you simply couldn't figure out why would someone say "voiced dialogue is an objective improvement" in a TES thread, if they're NOT trying to make a point that "voiced dialogue in Oblivion results in an overall improved game experience compared to Morrowind (objectively speaking, of course, because that makes me right by default and you can't argue my point)". So yeah, my bad, I forget not everyone is as autistic as me.

>>3947484
You're replying to two different people.

>>3947490
>voiced dialogue is an objective improvement
Nta. Who doesn't prefer hearing Dagoth Ur's speech during the assault on his citadel, over what I imagine would instead be silent text boxes over the screen?

>>3947541
I'm sure there's people out there who can't stand Dagoth's voice and would genuinely rather enjoy silence. Anyway, preferences are subjective. But if the game gave you the *option* to disable the voice, that would be an objective improvement, not because disabling the voice is an objectively better thing to do, but because having the option would satisfy a wider range of preferences.

>>3947551
>But if the game gave you the *option* to disable the voice
Doesn't it? I'm pretty sure Oblivion does.

>>3947552
I think you can turn the speech volume slider to zero. But that's besides the point.

>>3935360
its actually the best balance between morrowind and skyrim. you still need to build your character well to enjoy the game, but you can't turn into a god immediately. its also got the best storylines, best DLC's, and best atmosphere. it was actually a good thing that todd watched LOTR, chinese cyrodil sounds stupid.

>OP bumps his dead thread from page 10

>>3950709
>you still need to build your character well to enjoy the game
I don't see why this wouldn't apply to Skyrim?

File: 1705115827432018.jpg (140 KB, 359x394)

140 KB JPG

You people fight over the dumbest shit it's insane, this thread gives me vivid flashback of a whole fanbase and wannabes having a massive autistic meltdowns about MUH LORE and MUH KIKEBREED when ESO was announced.

I have faith in Skyblivion because I want Oblivion to get mod support like Skyrim does

>>3950822
In Skyrim, you hardly build your character at all.
There are no stats, and no skill specialties.

>>3951028
Then ESO arrived, and all the rage was immediately justified.

>>3951171
>In Skyrim, you hardly build your character at all.
>There are no stats, and no skill specialties.
I guess you mean strictly during character creation? More like character set-up than character building.

>>3946854
Oblivion having better writing for some sections of quests (not all of them, unfortunately) is diminished in this type of game on the list of priorities. Skyrim having even just the minimum of dungeon variety and the minimum bar of tiny stories scattered around in the world is better. That minimum bar of mini stories scattered in the world means more small things for someone to think about "my character would think this about this detail and react like this" for a fleeting moment, in spite of Bethesda themselves being terminally and utterly lazy

>>3946854
>Literally how is [vanilla] Skyrim better in any way compared to Oblivion?
Followers.

>>3935360
everyone thinks its bad now, though. the remake convinced everyone.

>>3952374
The remake reminded me why I love the original. Replaying it now feels like a nostalgia trip to when 2000s games were good, colorful, and perfect. Something no remaster can recapture.
Then I see the horse armor dlc...

>>3935360
It came out in the Xbox360. That is it.

>>3935641
>The negative elements of Morrowind were goofy combat and dorky animations.
and the static, empty world
and the awful writing
and the dogshit quests
and the ugly models
and the unfinished mechanics

>>3953113
>empty world
Stopped reading here

>>3935728
just mod the game retard faggot

>>3935360
Because they still have never played it. The best case scenario they played that demaster slop. Not a single zoomer has played the original.
>>3935641
Oblivion has shitty factions and bad quests. It has extremely goofy animations. There is no Todd Scrolls game that has good animations. At best Skryim's animations are more "realistic" in a sense. They're still pretty goofy in their own way. Morrowind's animations are excusable as a tech demo.

Morrowind's quests are often overrated. Usually all the high praise comes from a handful of quests that you see in some of the factions or the writing associated with a faction. Strip away the writing and you have just another fetch quest or a mostly linear do X, go back to Y. At least daggerfall had the excuse of being a tech demo for procedural quest generation.
>>3941455
>Oblivion is known for its quest design.
Oblivion's quest design is no different from Skyrim or Morrowind's generally. The only thing that sets it apart is the character of writing. It's quite common for many to believe something as insubstantial as writing is the same thing as quest design. It's just the little cutscene you watch or voice acted dialogue you listen to. In computer games in general, there is very little difference between quest design from game to game. The biggest difference is simply execution of the particular template.

>>3935360
I think you boomers forgot the impact of accidental, not manufactured meme potential as a form of appeal in video games today

>>3935360
Idk to be honest, they all have their strength and weaknesses. The combat is leagues better than Morrowind, not as good as Skyrim but it's not really that far off. It has a better speech system than both, I especially liked that during the DB quest line I had to bribe and use the speech mini game before they would give up information. Skyrims speech skill is worthless with characters having few dialogue options. Morrowind has a fuck ton of dialogue options but 75percent of them are repeats that you can have with any other character
Your skills actually matter in oblivion, and while you can't jump to one of the 2 moons like Morrowind it is noticeable.

>>3954210
>It has a better speech system
Stopped reading here

>>3954146
Games that require heavy modding to be sufficiently playable aren't games really worth getting into. Just play Oblivion as is, maybe only Unofficial Patch.

>>3954210
>Skyrims speech skill is worthless
Actually it's Mercantile and Speechcraft merged.

File: es cosmos.jpg (185 KB, 1131x707)

185 KB JPG

>>3935360
wrong

>>3935360
The positives?

>>3947076
>Fast travel
In every game BUT Morrowind, zoomer-kun
>quest markers
Not everyone likes looking for needles in haystacks
>amount of dialogue
A long list of random ass topics that usually don't give any meaningful information is worse.

>>3947094
You're arguing for quantity over quality, and even then that's debatable.

>>3953116
It is an empty world. The landscape being dotted with one-room ancestral tombs with no loot in them and MAYBE a single zombie does not mean it's not an empty world.

>>3962816
Morrowboomers be through 50 dungeons with random leveled loot and only remember the one with mentors ring

Oblivion's side quests are the best in series, simple as.

>>3935728
Your enemies stop getting powerful around level 25. You don't have to.

>>3963094
>Your enemies stop getting powerful around level 25
Several (not all) categories of enemies continue to level scale infinitely and become bloated HP sponges.
>>3962993
>Oblivion's side quests are the best in series, simple as.
Based, I loved being sent to “collect N bottles of wine to receive a gold reward”, truly inspired writing

>>3935360
>Why do zoomers treat this as a hidden gem now
Bro, are you high? Oblivion has always been popular. Nothing "hidden" about it.

>>3963358
Oblivion has always been ragged on and treated as the red headed step child of the 3d TES games. It lacks the depth and worldbuilding of Morrowind, and the accessibility and slickness of Skyrim. It’s janky, but not deep or complex. All it pioneered was object physics and manual blocking. Millennials like Morrowind more, zoomers like Skyrim more, while Oblivion is an awkward middle ground beloved only by a certain subset of late millennials/early zoomers who played the game on Xbox when they were kids

>>3963358
A cult classic for the hardcore RPG fans

>>3963345
>>Oblivion just had basic fetch quests
>Go find a guy who disappeared from a locked room
>Go murder a guy who might be a Vampire
>Go save a shop keeper's daughter from cultists
>Find evidence to prove the guard captain is corrupt
>Go ask about a guy who's missing and become the most dangerous game
>Go spy on these people for a paranoid bosmer
>Go find out why this town's residents are invisible
>Get these two people in town to hook up
>Investigate a stolen painting
>Investigate these women who are seducing all the men in town
I feel like you're one of those people who complains about your video game NPCs being one dimensional and not being real enough.

>>3963345
>Based, I loved being sent to “collect N bottles of wine to receive a gold reward”, truly inspired writing

Nonsense. Oblivion didn't have misc short quests like skyrim so this doesn't even make sense. Some kino quests I can think of:
>a town turns invisible
>a goblin worshipping cult kidnapped a girl
>a painter is trapped in a painting
>the one where the ship/Inn gets hijacked
>investigating a stolen painting in a castle
>being caught in a game where the rich hunt poor people
>the corrupt captains
>schizo wood elf quest
>the twins quest
>the haunted house quest
>the two married theives in Bruma
I'm not even going to mention the faction quests and the daedric quests which are also top tier.

>>3963373
>personal preference doesn't exist, everything is dictated by when you were born
whew

>>3963447
>I feel like you're one of those people who complains about your video game NPCs being one dimensional and not being real enough.
Nonsense. I still fondly reminisce about how my paladin rescued that n’wah who was stuck in the water without any pants outside of Gnisis to this day.

>>3963461
>Oblivion didn't have misc short quests like skyrim
Sure it did, but not many. Kill necromancer, kill bears, kill goblins, kill skoomadealer, fetch research notes.

>>3963461
>Nonsense. Oblivion didn't have misc short quests like skyrim so this doesn't even make sense
Did you even play the game, my friend? How could you forget such an unforgettable quest?
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:A_Venerable_Vintage

>>3963464
>The golden age of science fiction is age 12.
Yes.

File: isla_500x500.64310394_87ne4luf.jpg (40 KB, 500x500)

40 KB JPG

>>3963471
>>3963470
>the game may have dozens of good side quests however I just found 1/2 fetch quests therefore all quests are fetch quests

>>3963515
>heh, you may have scored, but I’ve moved the goalposts, better luck next time chud

>>3939409
Whoever came up with Oblivion's version of Golden Saints is a Man of Culture.

>>3964069
They should be in TES 6

>>3964069
they looked ugly in Oblivion

>>3939409
Anon is mostly right. The level scaling fucked Oblivion so hard, and the story was dogshit. I forced myself to finish the story once and then never again. From that point on, all the characters I made had major/minor skills I would never use so I would only level up when I wanted to by training. Only way to enjoy Oblivion.

>>3972440
>all the characters I made had major/minor skills I would never use
Shiggy diggy. Just make a reasonable character and you’ll be fine.

>>3935360
there are positives to morrowind and skyrim? or any bethesda game for that matter?

Marrowind fags are literally the worst people on the planet.

>>3972440
>oblivion is fucked dogshit!!
>*goes on to play oblivion for 5000 hours more*
Bros what makes Oblivion so gosh darn good ya just can't stop playing?

>>3935373
>reduced armor/weapon classes (not reduced variety) was also a good change.
this heavily reduced variety. I don't know how you can say that. Morrowind has one of the best dress up systems in a RPG. being able to put a robe over armor is amazing
I can only count on one hand how many games have clothing layers and one one of the other ones is fucking Fallout 4

>>3935641
>goofy combat and dorky animations.
>shitty factions
all three of these apply to Oblivion

The scaling is poo poo

>>3935360
oblivion is flawed but the quests are 10/10
the problems are shit like level scaling and copy paste dungeons
id want a game with oblivion quests and skyrim gameplay and world design

>>3973293
From a mechanical perspective, it feels better to be able to equip Steel Boots, Steel Gauntlets, Steel Greaves, and Steel Armor than having to find and equip each piece one at a time. Even Daggerfall gave you matched sets of armor.
>being able to put a robe over armor is amazing
Also in Daggerfall.

>>3946504
>Builds character poorly, gets outleveled
>Gets called out on building character poorly
>Complains that he has to lower the difficulty to accommodate his poor build
>Gets called out for being surprised that water is wet
>"It's everyone else who doesn't understand, not me!"
Save it for the video, Arin

>>3973293
I don't think you understood the point of the comment. Fewer classes does not inherently reduce item variety, or have anything to do with one's ability to wear a robe over armour. You can have the same exact variety of clothing/armour split between just light and heavy classes as you can between heavy, medium, light and "unarmored". A lot of the "medium" armour sets from Morrowind became either light or heavy in the later games.

>>3944752
Mage gameplay seems so nerfed in Skyrim compared to Oblivion and especially Morrowind. Skyrims magic is just flashier but less effective until you get to like Master Destruction.

>>3952327
Yeah followers are pointless in Oblivion just use conjuration magic.

>>3952327
>Lydia blocks the doorway again

All I want is more RPGs with the gameloop of
>explore world
>kill enemies
>find unique loot
>display unique loot at your customizable house

I dont understand why no game even tries to copy this aspect of Bethesda games. They either dont have any housing, dont have an open world to explore, or have randomly generated loot that isnt unique or meaningful

Oblivion gives me this despite all of its other problems

>>3980923
Diablo 1, as long as you don't mind living in the Butcher's little bachelor pad. It's not so bad when you get used to it

>>3980923
Bethesda fully specced into virtual world creation.

Oblivion just needs modded followers/companions to be perfect. Skyrim has Kaidan, Val Serano, Xelzaz, Lucien, Inigo, Auri, Remiel etc etc and they all bring huge, huge improvements to playing. Oblivion doesn't have the same because modding Oblivion is not as easy as modding Skyrim. I hope Skyblivion fixes this.

>>3946854
Food and sleep providing lasting effects

>>3946854
More spell effects. Destruction magic having secondary effects and properties so they aren't just different colors, different magnitudes.

>>3946854
More hand-placed loot. More exterior locations.
I need to make a list of these before posting more.

>>3980133
Daggerfall gave you one piece at a time *AND* had multiple varieties of each kind of armor so you could end up with non-matching steel.

>>3936193
>Trebonius

You know, I never did figure out whether he was an idiot, or senile, or batshit insane, or playing 4d chess with everyone.

>>3946854
>Literally how is [vanilla] Skyrim better in any way compared to Oblivion?
Stealth got much better. Sound now plays a role, with armor, weapons and spells making noise. Daggers are the best melee weapon for being quiet and getting the highest sneak attack bonus. Sound can also be used to misdirect enemies, which is great for those times when an enemy stands on your path. And you can poison enemies with pickpocket.

Illusion magic works better, now that NPCs levels don't quickly scale past what illusion spells can affect.

Alteration's shield spells being more effective for robed wizards.

Restoration's wards are the best. Magic resist, shield, spell absorption. Finally moving away from boring passive resistance maxxing.

Conjuration's necromancy and bound weapons.

>>3983749
And Destruction's stuns from overcharged spells letting me control the battle instead of backpedaling.

Dual casting in general. Upgraded spells, without having to have multiple copies of spells with different levels of effect.

>>3981970
I thought it was made pretty clear in the questline that he's a Telvanni plant. Conceptually, I don't think he is really meant to be as much of an idiot as he appeared, I think it was made deliberately overt to give the player an obvious justification over the Guild's discontent with him, through relatively few player interactions. If his questline was more elaborate, then I'm sure he would have been made to be far more subtle.

>>3935360
imagine you JUST played skyrim, for like a decade straight. then suddenly, you grow a brain, and play a better game
id be impressed too

>>3935815
I don't know why people pretend anything original or creative is automatically superior to the status quo. When I played Morrowind for the first time it looked ugly as fuck, the generic fantasy setting is way better.

>>3983933
Also, if later games didn't follow up on Morrowind's setting is probably because they realized it was shit

>>3983749
>Sound now plays a role, with armor, weapons and spells making noise
that is in oblivion
more important tho, encumbrance actually matters a LOT, as it not only affects the above, but also your speed and ability to jump. imo this gives light/heavy/no armor some rly different playstyles. as opposed to skyrim where armor types are basically aesthetic and perk differences only.

>Illusion magic works better
i disagree about "better" because i distinctly remember some absolutely hilariously OP custom illusion spells in oblivion i made. but i will concede that its the best magic in skyrim. however.
>now that NPCs levels don't quickly scale past what illusion spells can affect.
is not true. at least not vanilla. past like lvl 35 or so, probably around half of all lvld enemies will totally resist your spell, no matter the spell lvl. not even a diceroll chance. you NEED fortify illusion effect of some kind (vampire lord works, or a potion) or your illusion magic will literally stop working at high lvls

>Alteration's shield spells being more effective for robed wizards.
no idea wtf youre on about. even with the magearmor perks its laughably weak, even compared to shit armor. whereas in oblivion it is quite literally the easiest way to get max damage reduction (85%), simply by stacking some shield/resist spells. even at lower alteration lvls the spells you can make will sometimes double or triple what you can get from armor at your lvl

>Restoration's wards are the best
wards r fun
>Magic resist, shield, spell absorption
none of which are spell effects you can cast anymore, which is gay af
>Finally moving away from boring passive resistance maxxing.
buffing attributes with resto magic/enchants is literally half the reason morrowind and oblivion were so fun to fuck around in

>Conjuration's necromancy and bound weapons
solid
tho we rly didnt need to remove bound armor imo. idgaf if its "redundant". i dont like how alteration is basically forced on you if youre a mage

>>3983964
>>Sound now plays a role, with armor, weapons and spells making noise
>that is in oblivion
In Oblivion only boots matter, take them off and you're fine even in heavy armor. And invisibility makes you noiseless and undetectable. In Skyrim you also need to eliminate noise.
>illusion
>past like lvl 35 or so, probably around half of all lvld enemies will totally resist
Try dual casting.
>armor spells
>the spells you can make will sometimes double or triple what you can get from armor
Magic was OP in Oblivion.
>>Magic resist, shield, spell absorption
>none of which are spell effects you can cast anymore, which is gay af
Wards are a spell that has those effects. As well as mage armor spells being shield.
>i dont like how alteration is basically forced on you if youre a mage
I don't think so. Even if you don't want to wear actual armor, mages in Skyrim have many means to avoid getting hit.

>>3946854
>Literally how is [vanilla] Skyrim better in any way compared to Oblivion?
Block. Bethesda managed to make using shields active and fun. Dealing damage, interrupting attacks, disarming, sending enemies flying by charging at them. I had fun using a shield + destruction spell combo.

Luck finally giving better loot. Well, not really. There's a perk that apparently increases a 10% chance of some chests having loot to 15%, which should add up if it affects numerous chests. And I think this specific loot chance is the reason I have in the past found good equipment way earlier. I wish I took this perk earlier on my current playthrough, since I'm 100 hours in and I haven't seen a single piece of daedric or dragon equipment yet.

>>3935641
>The negative elements of Skyrim were shallow quests and shitty factions.
Existing mechanics like alchemy and enchanting suck. Crafting is the one major improvement in terms of mechanics. Everything else sucks (if it even exists. RIP Spellmaking)

>>3984001
>I wish I took this perk earlier on my current playthrough, since I'm 100 hours in and I haven't seen a single piece of daedric or dragon equipment yet.
Which is funny to me, because personally one of the first things I do is mod the leveled lists so that I will never ever see those things as random loot.

>>3983991
>Try dual casting.
again
you dont know wtf youre talking about
vanilla skyrims illusion tree, perked all the way out, dualcasting the highest lvl illusion spells that can be dualcasted, does not affect max lvl (aka lvl 50) mobs without a fortify illusion effect active. period. its a well-documented fact by now, and likely anyone who ever played an illusionist in vanilla skyrim ran across this issue.
the lvl50 mobs start showing up as end-dungeon bosses around lvl 30, and become common in nearly every encounter from lvl 40 onwards. this makes illusion fall off and become more and more unreliable as you lvl. so you either bring potions, or become vampire lord. those are the only options in vanilla

by contrast, in oblivion, its not retarded, and i have zero clue why they changed it to be so obviously worse.
in oblivion, when you make a max strength illusion spell (25), it will be able to affect any lvl enemy from lvl 25 up to max. even oblivions completely borked lvling system isnt enough to stop it. it literally just works. this is what makes illusion spells among the strongest in the game on higher difficulties

>>3983991
>Wards are a spell that has those effects
after burning a few perks, sure, it has absorb
wards have a slightly less severe version of the same problem illusion has tho. lesser ward is GOAT for dragon breath. but other than that? you need the big boy wards, often dualcasted, if you wanna catch any high lvl mages spells. and thats just unwieldy most of the time. youre better off atronach + breton racial bonus + facetanking, and going on offense instead. but then youre stuck always being breton, and thats no good either
destruction is another ex
i did a pure mage on legendary up to like lvl 50 or so, so i know. even using that aspect of terror perk glitch for the extra flame damage, your damage falls off so hard as you lvl up. eventually i broke down and smithed up a sword that could just kill everything because i just couldnt be fucked anymore

its not something youll notice till you lvl up a ton as a mage, but once these issues start, they dont go away due to how enemy scaling/spawning works. they just get slightly worse with every dungeon cleared this "saves" the lvls for any future respawns. and its a direct result of magic in skyrim having too low a "ceiling". the spell schools all "max out" in power at a point thats lower than the game scales to naturally. also the master lvl spells are often completely unusable except as opening moves due to their long animations

>>3983934
>>If later games didn't follow up then the realized it was shit
>Skyrim: DLC that literally takes you back to Solstheim, complete with ash wastes, giant mushrooms and a Silt Strider
>TES Online literally recreates Vardenfell, complete with questlines surrounding Baar Dau and the building of Vivec City, and many *many* familiar landmarks beyond.
Looks like it was just you.

>>3984171
>dualcasting the highest lvl illusion spells that can be dualcasted, does not affect max lvl (aka lvl 50) mobs
Even without perks, Pacify and Rout go from 20 to affecting lvl 44 when dual cast. With perks it goes to lvl 80 something.

>>3984194
>lesser ward is GOAT for dragon breath. but other than that? you need the big boy wards, often dualcasted, if you wanna catch any high lvl mages spells. and thats just unwieldy most of the time.
Even the novice level Lesser Ward nullifies an adept level Fireball, without dual casting. Steadfast Ward carries you to the endgame, and with Greater Ward you don't need to worry about a thing. No dual casting required, unless you're gang banged by a group of mages at once.

If you lack the magicka, try equipment with fortify restoration. Wards are immunity to magic, spell absorb and additional armor.

Wards are well worth it.

On the subject, Ahzidal's gauntlets give wards 50% absorption at the cost of them being 25% less effective, so you will need the apprentice level ward to catch a fireball. Worth considering if you're specializing in Restoration.

File: camonna_tong_by_alexeyrud(...).jpg (288 KB, 900x1458)

288 KB JPG

>>3984244
I won't lie, seeing Red Mountain in the distance while the first NPC you interact with is some cunt in full Bonemold telling you "alright listen 'ere n'wah, you're in Morrowind now, and basically, eat guar shit" made me think
>aw bois... we so fuckin back :')

>>3946854
>Literally how is [vanilla] Skyrim better in any way compared to Oblivion?
More diverse creature behavior. Wolves hunt in packs, bears announce their presence, falmer are silent ambushers, conjurers raise corpses, spriggans ally themselves with wild animals, mages might be preoccupied crafting potions, briarheart's hearts can be pickpocketed, flying dragons, giants herd their mammoths, draugr rest until disturbed, wispmothers with their wisps and shades, ice wraiths blending in with snow and wind.

>>3946854
>Literally how is [vanilla] Skyrim better in any way compared to Oblivion?
Regions tracking crime separately. Makes more sense to evade the law or break out of jail when you can go live elsewhere.

File: 8iTF8MmX6xToeceCrkKfbR.jpg (66 KB, 445x445)

66 KB JPG

Oblivion marked the end of a Golden Age in RPGs. IMO That Golden Age started sometime around '97 and ended with picrel. It was the first game I remember having quest markers (something not even Vanilla WoW had) and the first one with "DLC". The final nail in the coffin was Mass Effect. After 2006, RPGs were specifically designed for console layouts & easy builds, unlike decades of traditional RPGs which required more precise consideration.

File: Pay no attention to the R(...).jpg (1.07 MB, 2560x1440)

1.07 MB JPG

>>3984480

>>3984480
It was the music that did it for me. Hadn't heard it in 20 years. Felt like coming home.

it would be cool if you could join the cult and lead an army of daedra into cyrodiil as an enemy of the mortal realm

>>3946854
>Literally how is [vanilla] Skyrim better in any way compared to Oblivion?
Pickpocketing
1. Savescumming isn't necessary
2. NPCs carry good stuff
3. Can be used for combat purposes
4. Separate from Sneak skill

>>3946854
>Literally how is [vanilla] Skyrim better in any way compared to Oblivion?
More roleplaying "opportunities". What does your character do when coming across a certain group transporting a prisoner? Will he sacrifice his companion to gain the favor of Boethiah? And what will he do, knowing that those thugs were after him because a week ago he stole a ring from Olfina in Whiterun?

On a related note, it's cool that there's a couple of druid style nature spells in the form of shouts: call storm and animal allegiance. Lightning zapping your enemies dead is cool as fuck.

>>3935796
>Morrowind created an engaging, unique, well thought out world that was unlike anything we've ever seen before
yeah I don't want to wander around a brown wasteland full of bugs and shit. I'm white, I want to walk around lush deciduous forests.

>>3935815
Zelda games handle a wide variety of biomes within a game world better than Morrowind by a long shot.

File: elder_scrolls_modern_trilogy.jpg (67 KB, 1280x720)

67 KB JPG

>>3935360
>Why do zoomers treat this as a hidden gem now?
They don't. Oblivion Remaster's player counts sunk like a rock and everybody went back to Skyrim. There's a small group of zoomers who played Oblivion when they were like 8 years old and formed an emotional attachment to it. There's an even smaller cadre of zoomers who think simping for older games will make unc like them.

Skyrim was a massive improvement over Oblivion in almost every single way except for some nitpicks like guild presence, spell crafting, acrobatics, and birth signs (yes these are nitpicks, they're not nearly as important as Oblivion fans make them out to be). If you want the TRUE reason why Oblivion has so many ride-or-die fans look at the rest of the RPG landscape. There are a LOT of people who ADORE the high fantasy Renaissance Fair aesthetic.

>>3946912
>More interesting character building and better perks
wrong
>Environments are more varied and interesting
wrong
>Doesn’t have the terrible “radiant dialogue”
this is bad actually
>Doesn’t have the persuasion wheel minigame
this is bad actually

File: riven_environment.jpg (349 KB, 608x392)

349 KB JPG

>>3935815
>Name one game with environments like Morrowind.
Morrowind's much more of an exemplar of its time than you might think. Riven, Fallout, and Planescape: Torment all have the same sort of aesthetic beats going on:

* muted, earth tones
* contrasting tribals against extinct industrialized civilizations
* organic but also alien kind of vibe; more bugs, eggs, and mushrooms
* more existential even philosophical themes

My guess is inspirations like Dune and Star Wars were starting to displace Tolkien's overbearing influence on fantasy before the LotR movies came out and immediately snapped everything back to elves, dwarves, castles, and woodlands.

>>3980923
play Gedonia

yes it's jank but it's kino, you can tell the dev learned as he went so it onky gets better as you play

File: 1761565109711890.jpg (108 KB, 635x457)

108 KB JPG

>>3946912
You think you're just gonna get away with spouting easily fact-checked lies like that? Where do you even think you are? You don't think anyone else here has played any of these games??

>>3986433
>My guess is inspirations like Dune and Star Wars were starting to displace Tolkien's overbearing influence on fantasy before the LotR movies came out and immediately snapped everything back to elves, dwarves, castles, and woodlands.
That's actually interesting and insightful. I agree with your assessment, and I'd add in Spelljammer, Mad Max and Waterworld.

>>3986433
>My guess is inspirations like Dune and Star Wars were starting to displace Tolkien's overbearing influence on fantasy before the LotR movies came out and immediately snapped everything back to elves, dwarves, castles, and woodlands.
Thank god for those movies. Real life is already brown and shitty enough these days.

>>3986454
>You think you're just gonna get away with spouting easily fact-checked lies like that?
Good luck “fact-checking” subjective opinions, retard-san
>Where do you even think you are? You don't think anyone else here has played any of these games??
I’m on /vrpg/, where I frequently find myself as the only person in a thread who has actually played a game. My point stands: Oblivion is inferior to both Morrowind and Skyrim for different reasons, and is beloved only by a certain subset of adolescents who likely played primarily on console. If it wasn’t one’s first entry in the series, it clearly marked the decline of TES (and Bethesda as a whole) from PC games to watered-down console-focused games.
All Oblivion had to offer was object physics and flinging fireballs at bowls of apples (which was admittedly really cool for five minutes)

>>3986462
>Oblivion is inferior to Morrowind
Debatable. Oblivion saw improvements to many aspects.

File: whiterun.jpg (427 KB, 1600x505)

427 KB JPG

>>3986455
Good adds. You can even see the same kind of inspirations permeating through such far flung franchises as Bionicle. I think partially it was just easier to render this aesthetic with early 3D graphics but I do kind of miss it.

By contrast Oblivion and Skyrim are both post-LOTR but Oblivion is more recalling D&D (or TES1&2) styled high fantasy whereas Skyrim is much more explicitly Tolkien. Like Whiterun is just straight up Edoras. Kind of makes sense because Tolkien's fantasy was cribbed from Scandinavian/Germanic folklore and Skyrim is about the "Nords".

My guess is TES6, which is almost certainly set in Hammerfell, will be more of an Arabian Nights sort of deal given Redguard and the fact that Todd is obsessed with Indiana Jones.

>>3986462
Filtered.

>>3946854
>Literally how is [vanilla] Skyrim better in any way compared to Oblivion?
Merchants have better quality mercandise. I had poor luck with dungeon loot, but was able to find suitable equipment from shops.

Come to think of it, Oblivion didn't have much equipment variety to choose from.

>>3946854
>Literally how is [vanilla] Skyrim better in any way compared to Oblivion?
More character motivations for roleplaying. There's tons of bounties and jobs. A craftsman might be looking for ore in caves. A mage searching for new spellbooks. An enchanter hoping to learn from old magical items. A bard interested in skill books. Master of the voice uncovering words of power. A hunter selling their skins and meat.

Not that there's anything wrong with being a simple murder hobo man.

>>3946854
>Literally how is [vanilla] Skyrim better in any way compared to Oblivion?
More speech options in quests and random encounters

>>3935360
i hate the leveling system, the way it works. it's very annoying. makes it very hard to get the stats you want.

>>3935360
Oblivion is ugly as hell

>>3987525
You're ugly as hell.

>>3946854
>Literally how is [vanilla] Skyrim better in any way compared to Oblivion?
Roleplaying a healer. With followers there's constant uses for healing hands, and there's some random occurrences too, with the civil war or predator animals attacking prey.
I started letting Lydia handle physical attackers, while wards let me handle spellcasters. I really enjoyed this dynamic. The most memorable fight was against an elder dragon on the whiterun plains, where the dragon kept oneshotting my healer, whose only ranged form of attack was the fire breath shout. The winning move ended up being casting courage and heals on Lydia, who was then able to tank the dragon. I mustered up the courage to strike the final blow and got a killcam, so I didn't have to end the fight feeling like a complete wuss.
Sometimes the difficulty in Skyrim strikes a perfect balance that makes all the mechanics work perfectly together. I even used one of those magicka regeneration potions that let me conserve just enough magicka to sustain spellcasting throughout the long ass epic battle.