As in a master's degree in theology. Was it worth it?I'm having this crazy idea lately to pursue a bachelor's and master's degree in theology though remote learning in parallel to my job (seems extremely hard and unlikely I would succeed, but possible nevertheless)I have no intention to use it professionally, it would just be for my personal growth. I looked at the curriculum and it seems all very impressive, I can't see someone self teaching such a complete and exhaustive curriculum without a structured program.Thoughts?
>>42485897I was told that protestant theology is very different from catholic theology, and that the catholics learn actual occult stuff.
>>42485908Possible, I am not interested in catholicism
>>42485908Catholicism is extremely different from Protestantism, but no, they do not learn occult stuff (at least not the laypeople). If you have a local Catholic church, I recommend you sign up for RCIA classes. Protestants will let anyone join their church so long as they have been attending for a while, but Catholics are different. They don't care if you attend, but if you want to become a member, they make you go through a year long course where you learn all about their theology and history. It's the only thing I actually respect about the church. They want to make sure people who join the church actually KNOW all the beliefs and stuff. Also, RCIA classes are free.
>>42485897>degree>personal growthno. that's not what degrees are for whatsoever lol.
>a master's degree in fucking nothing
>>42486001The average church attending catholic doesn't know Jack Shit about the bible
>>42486457Why not? What about appeal to authority benefits
>>42485897I minored in theology and considered going to grad school but then the coof happened and I wasn't willing to take a jab for it. I self studied instead.What do you think a theological education will give you? That determines whether it's worth it. It will not make you saintly or wise. If that is your goal, then prepare to be distracted by a lot of pointless mumbo jumbo. Enter a monastery instead. The typical university/seminary curriculum is intended for people who will become pastors or professional scholars.>>42485908They are pretty much identical nowadays unless you go to a traditionalist seminary like Econe, in which case the entire pedagogical method is fundamentally different.If you want to study occult shit, any university theology department will probably enable you to do that, a few even have faculty dedicated to it.>>42486001RCIA is just adult catechism. A theology degree won't prepare you to be a practicing Catholic and RCIA won't teach you theology. No one's reading the Summa in RCIA. And everyone is reading it but no one's understanding it in grad school, by the way. Yes, it's only an introductory textbook from the 13th century and yes, standards have fallen that far. >>42486457>>42486553Trve.
>>42487309>RCIA is just adult catechism. A theology degree won't prepare you to be a practicing Catholic and RCIA won't teach you theology. True, but it's a hell of a lot more involved than the "catechism" kids learn. It's obviously not a comprehensive theology class, but it gives a pretty decent overview on Catholic beliefs and history, and gives you a good jumping-off point to study things yourself.
>>42487369>"catechism"So by implication, the kids aren't properly catechized whereas the adults are? Can you see how this might be a problem?Anyway theology is not "advanced catechism." There are basically two approaches to theology in a university curriculum, the first is more philosophical and the other more historical. In the first approach you study philosophical metaphysics and use it to treat dogmatic questions systematically. In the second you apply historical criticism to primary sources. Neither presupposes any degree of catechesis. Nevertheless, RCIA typically presents the scholarly consensus, that is, the conclusions of both avenues of research, even where they contradict one another (and they frequently do).The exception is scholastic theology, which absolutely requires the student to be a fully catechized man with a strong prayer life, upright moral character, and average or better intellectual ability. But qualified teachers are now extremely rare.
>>42487309>What do you think a theological education will give you?A structured framework which will lead to great understanding vs randomly reading Bible and Bible commentaries on my own
>>42487524It won't lead to great understanding, but it will give you a semi-structured, if biased, way to read the Bible and the commentators. This won't be the only possible way to do it, nor is it necessarily the best, nor is it even the same way in which most of the commentators you will read studied scripture, but it's better than nothing. FWIW, and I don't know what your financial situation is, but I wouldn't go into debt for only this much if I were you.I personally don't believe that erudition is necessary to attain a profound understanding of revelation, but erudition is certainly more accessible. What you're probably looking for sounds like an initiatic teaching such as that given at Plato's academy and in the early Christian monasteries, which involves the practice of "spiritual exercises" under the guidance of a teacher who is accomplished in them. This kind of training is supposed to lead to spiritual realization in which one understands supernatural matters intuitively. Its methods inspired medieval scholasticism and the Jesuits, for instance, and Freemasonry was originally an example of it before the "speculative" turn. Overall Protestant theology represents a reaction against this kind of pedagogy, being generally opposed to any kind of spiritual elitism, although there are exceptions that you might be fortunate enough to find. However, remote study is out of the question.
>>42487616Everything I watch a video by Anthony Buzzard I feel like mannnnn I wish I was that guy. Supreme Bible smarts and stuff like that.How to achieve that? This is srsly my motivation, to become a supreme gentlemanhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U_zaRx2q-e0
>>42487616In short how do I become him
>>42487636He's simply a professional academic. You will be surrounded by his clones in any prestigious theology department. Literally just get into a doctoral program at Oxford, know Latin, Greek, and Hebrew, and crucially, have strong opinions, because the rule is "publish or perish."
>>42487662>just get into a doctoral>justThat seems rather extremely hard
>>42487668It's extremely hard if you're unwilling to study at an institution that won't offer you a stipend, which you should be, by the way, because the professors will phone it in if they're not interested in you. Otherwise it's only moderately hard.
>>42487636On the other hand I am watching the video and he is talking trash about my hero John Nelson Darby.How dare he! Darby wrote a great Bible translation. Prove me wrong (cite what is wrong)
>>42487687At 04:00 mark in the video he is implying Darby is going to be thrown in the lake of fire.
>>42487682I have a lucrative career going and theology seems like it wouldn't pay a lot of money at all.So I just want to study theology as a hobby. Therefore, all of this is probably very unrealistic.
>>42487705It is in fact unrealistic unless you are prepared to change careers. Theology only rewards the unscrupulous with money.
>>42487717Theoretically if I sacrificed all my free time (and hopefully not burn out and negatively impact my real career) I could study a 3 year bachelor and 2 year master program of theology, I looked it up the other day, it's possible through mostly remote learning. But that would be extremely tough. 5 years of hard sacrifice
>>42485908Both ideologies are completely meshuga, and it's very easy to demonstrate. First, going to heaven is not even real salvation. Second, Yeshu is a false prophet. Third, soul based ideologies are egoic AF.
>>42487746>going to heavenThis is an unbiblical idea with roots in Greek and pagan traditions. The Bible talks about resurrection after the return of the messiah in the coming age
>>42487739Definitely, though understand that maybe 80% of the benefit of a graduate program for any aspiring academic (extremely important if you are trying to become Anthony Buzzard) is not the course material, it's the professional mentorship and the connections you make, which require you to be physically present on a campus.>>42487746>How do you do, fellow goyim?Only Jews call him Yeshu. Christian salvation is brahmaloka not moksha, but many advaitins consider Jesus a jnani. Sankara says the soul is maya, the Bible says it is made out of nothing, what is the difference?
>>42487781>trying to become Anthony BuzzardI was not really serious, I don't think I have what it takes to be someone like that. Somehow I don't even really know what I want because I don't have a good realistic idea of what all this stuff is. Somehow feel like theology is the most important topic in the world though, but also suspect they barely make any money at all. (Except a few mighty)
>>42487774Paraphrasing sir anthony here after reading his free booklet this weekend called what happens after we dieLol
>>42487798>Somehow feel like theology is the most important topic in the world thoughI know what you mean. Do what you can to grow in wisdom, anon, and best of luck to you.>>42487804There were Jesuit priests at my university who would agree with that. Strange times.
>>42487829I always find out about new people,binge their stuff and then cracks begin to appear and it allfalls apartFound Anthony last week and so far he seems very solid, although he seems like a very mean person, dunking on people ruthlessly
>>42487829Here is the 100% free and legit booklet (no copyright infringement, no advertising)https://focusonthekingdom.org/WHWWD.pdfI read it last weekend. Riveting
>>42487829What are your views on John Nelson Darby. He is somewhat of a hero of mine because he translated the Bible and so far it has proven almost perfect. Many people bash him brutally but so far no one can demonstrate to me that his translation is corrupt. I will gladly accept fair criticism and open to learn facts
>>42487859>focusonthekingdomἰδοὺ γὰρ ἡ βασιλεία τοῦ θεοῦ ἐντὸς ὑμῶν ἐστιν.Thanks for the link
>>42487899You're welcome. There's a lot more of free books and booklets on his website. Which indicates to me he is not in it just for the money like John Lennox
Not his work but he links to it on his website so it must be important Also 100% free and legithttps://archive.org/details/gospelofkingdom00jone
>>42487842It's unfortunately common for theologians to be arrogant. They behave brutally toward other theologians and condescendingly toward laymen. It's too easy to forget that there is still so much that you don't know, especially when it's your job to appear to know everything.>>42487880No opinion, don't know the first thing about Darby or the Plymouth Brethren. Even if I had read his translation, I could only prove to you whether it contradicts the exegesis of another sect or tradition that I know about, not whether it is faithful to the original text. Let the Greek and Hebrew scholars debate that. Would love to have enough Greek to read the untranslated New Testament and LXX but I won't for a while yet.
>>42487944>It's unfortunately common for theologians to be arrogant. They behave brutally toward other theologians and condescendingly toward laymen.It's very disappointing when you have high hopes then find out they are like that
>>42487944>Would love to have enough Greek to read the untranslated New Testament and LXX but I won't for a while yet.That means that Darby was probably way higher level than you are. And you are higher than my level so don't take it the wrong way. But it blows my mind how random people on the internet trash him
>>42488220>That means that Darby was probably way higher level than you are.Definitely. It doesn't imply that he understood the Bible, since there's a very large gap between where I stand and that, but I'm certainly not in a position to judge. I do at least know that I know nothing, though, whereas there are many who don't even know that.
>>42488274I often feel it's nothing short of a miracle that my life has worked out as well as it did, considering I am like a literal retard compared to these kind of genius scholarly people
Facebook KJV warriors speaking with great confidence on things they don't understand
>>42487636You might just have guru syndrome. Very common for university aged people to admire their professors, but they will see through the status and vanity when they get older. So maybe you love the idea of a crowd of people hanging onto your words of obscure and impractical theology, rather than actually putting things into practice. He speaks a lot of fluffy words - but Jesus words in the gospel of putting love into action, where sometimes it hurts a little, is where true Christianity meets the road.You can get a powerful Christian mystical practice on your own:>read the Gospels and actually do what they say (the hard shit like forgiveness, mercy, charity, love, restraining anger, etc)>daily meditations on your vices and virtues and sins and repentance - this is very common with the writings of the saints>do hundreds of hours of devotional prayer practices (common in Catholism, some mystics will focus on the Jesus prayer)Try devoting 75% of your time towards Christian practices.Doing the big good deeds that may hurt a little bit - this shows putting faith in action, and is the path of developing a personal relationship of seeing God working in your life. There are theologians who worship their ego and status - and the status games and money games of the churches they are tied to, and haven't opened up love - being still intellectuals. Working with the homeless while doing daily prayer and Bible readings might be a more genuine path.
>>42486001>RCIA classInteresting... I never heard of that. I do not like the Catholic church though. I believe they are deceptive at the highest levels.
>>42489018Thanks but no thanks
>>42489547And for the highest levels you're damning the entire Catholic world?They're the Katechon. They're weakened, but they are the Katechon. The current Pope knows what's up, he has inherited ages of problems he is not guilty of, and is giving himself out to Christ for the punishments he'll face, punishments he has no fault in personally.
>>42485897Their all polytheistic
>>42490908Cardinal Prevost was accused of covering up clerical sexual abuse prior to being elected. It's almost like this is one of the prerequisites for papabili.By far the most annoying thing about lay converts to "Catholicism" is how much pro-Vatican political propaganda they consume and regurgitate, and they mistake that for the religion itself. Historically the vast majority of *good* Catholics wouldn't even have known who the pope was and certainly didn't stick their noses in his political affairs or follow his every move like some kind of psychic paparazzi. The papal cult of celebrity began with the Judeo-Masonic news media fawning over the election of John XXIII but it really got going with John Paul II. It's an innovation in Catholic morals.
>I looked at the curriculum and it seems all very impressive>degree in theology>no intention to use it professionally, it would just be for my personal growthare you for real? like seriously? this has to be troll/baiti know one, who studied catholic theology, respectable man, knows his stuff. he knows a lot, but this study made his thinking unflexible and rigid and prejudiced to different ideas than mainstream/accepted ones.studying this would make you a "technicly/lore-wise you are (semi)correct, but really, its different but you are unable to see it anymore" guy. rather boring at parties too.also if you want to know something/growth you are going to do it on your own, yourself. theres no need for a prefabricated indoctrination package by the establishment, that in some cases you even have to pay for yourselflol, lmao even
>>42487859>https://focusonthekingdom.org/WHWWD.pdf>An AppealThe difference between received tradition and the teaching ofScripture, we contend, involves the difference between truth andfalsehood, between the teaching of the apostles and the poison ofGnosticism.19>poison of Gnosticismsay what now? how is knowledge (of Christ or Truth) a poison?
>>42492327>are you for real? like seriously?I am 100% serious. Why? I have a very good career but would like to have a theological education for my personal growth. How is that strange or bad?
>>42492335I read halfway through this booklet, then stopped because I was already unitarian to begin with and reading half sufficiently affirmed my beliefs, it seemed like a waste of time to go on driving the same point so I got started on his other free book which is just fascinating. It seems it was written just for me personally, that's how gripping it is on the big questions I have had for years. (The meaning of life and how to achieve immortality, in no uncertain words) It's phenomenal so far although I only read the first 2 chapters yesterday night.Would highly recommend. It's free you have nothing to lose.https://www.focusonthekingdom.org/Aims%20and%20Claims.pdf
>>42492327Read your post a second time because I find it that unsettling. You really hate knowledge! And you talk about being "this or that guy" and "being fun at parties". I really feel sorry for you. What a superficial world view!
>>42489018>You might just have guru syndrome.While it is not the answer to the question, I will confirm this is true. I have a tendency to put high hopes in bible teachers and scholars, then feel very disappointed when I notice the cracks.This is actually why I want a theological education, so I won't have to look to teachers anymore but have all the answers myself so to speak.
>>42495846>Now people today sometimes go to extraordinary lengths to preserve their lives for a few extra years (many die much too early due to smoking or other practices which take years off their lives). Some in California have their dead bodies frozen in the hope that science will find a way of bringing them back to life! What these people do not understand is that Jesus has already told us how we can have life forever, indestructible life. He said that the secret is bound up with his Gospel Message about the Kingdom of God. In another chapter we are going to look at, and hopefully listen very carefully to, that Gospel of the Kingdom which Jesus said was the very purpose of all his preaching and teaching. Remember that Paul said that Jesus had revealed the way to immortality in that Gospel or “word.” Presumably you are interested in living forever. Does the idea of having eternal youth — in fact finding the fountain of youth — and not being able to die grab your attention? It does mine! The secret of life forever and ever is sitting right there in the pages of the Bible, but I doubt that it has been clearly explained to you in church. If that sounds incredible please hear me out. Read on and see for yourself. (There are historical reasons why important Bible truths have been largely lost to huge church organizations.)
