Why is SAO lumped in with haremshit? Asuna is established as the canon love interest very early on. Other girls have feelings for Kirito, but he doesn't reciprocate and the series never pretends they have any chance because he's already with Asuna. The other girls are just orbiters that aren't really important at all, they're window dressing.
>>288497486>plain ugly mc>tons of girls around him
>>288497486
"harem" in modern times means one person of gender A surrounded by multiple people of gender Bthe word is essentially worthless now
harembait will still get harem tagsimple as
>>288497553Harembait isn't a thing. It's either a harem or it isn't.
>>288497545That's really puzzling especially since Apothecary diaries seems to be popular and there's a genuine harem in there.
>>288497573the tag is only relevant if it involves the protagonistif Maomao consistently had other men around her other than Jinshi people would call it a harem (or a reverse harem I guess), even if there wasn't any romance or sex involved
>>288497573The harem is the emperor's not the main male mc.So no one cares.
Same reason why it is also lumped in with isekai; The type of person who cares about light novel and their adaptations are fucking retarded
>>288497573That's a based and trad imperial harem
>>288497623Isekai doesn't exist. There is no isekai genre.
>>288497634The publishers don't agree with your assessment.
>>288497486Because that’s how 99% of harem anime have worked for the last half century, newfag.
>>288497796Those aren't harems either, they're romcoms with multiple love interests
>>288497486The fact is that they have feelings for Kirito in spite of Asuna's relationship with him.So yes, it effectively is a harem series because Kirito continuously collects new bitches to add to his harem.And I'm pretty sure the original web novel series ended with Kirito giving each of the girls their own happy ending and fucking them all in that version's Alicization arc.
>>288497486>bakemono>MC dates first girl he meets>next 100 eps is new girls falling in love with himAsuna is the first wife. The rest of the girls are just his concubines.
>>288497911>And I'm pretty sure the original web novel series ended with Kirito giving each of the girls their own happy ending and fucking them all in that version's Alicization arc.Something like this would've been brought up in every SAO thread we've ever had so it's probably horseshit.
>>288497486A lot of people just hate SAO and will lump it together with whatever other shows they also don't like
They wish the shitty incest girl won instead of best girl Asuna.
>>288497885retard
>>288497486That's most harems
>>288497486Asuna is the perfect cuck queen. Not only is she famously paired with other guys and BBC in doujins, but gets regularly cucked herself in canon and elsewhere because Kirito is a bitch magnet.
>>288500808Nah, most harems don't establish a relationship until the end, and entertain the ruse of "WHO WILL HE PICK?" throughout. SAO on the other hand locks it's couple down early, gets them fucking, married, and with a "kid" before most of his orbiters are even introduced.
>>288501868>most harems don't establish a relationship until the end, and entertain the ruse of "WHO WILL HE PICK?" throughoutoh boy, are you 2026 newbie or something
unironically I think Asuna would be fine with a 4some with Sinon and Alice.
>>288501868Kirito and Asuna's "relationship" barely exists, it's almost Goku/Chi-Chi tier on how little attention it gets. We barely ever see them do anything romantic, so it ends up being more of a thing that just exists in the background while other shit happens
>>288497545the fact that so many anime have a loser male MC with multiple girls pining for him only tells you that anime watchers are pigs who demand that kind of content in great amounts not that they're a different category from some kind of true harem for elite superpigs
>>288502835There are almost zero "loser" MCs in anime.
Harem" is pretty fucking useless as a genre descriptor or tag, mainly because it refers to basically 4 different things.>Actual Harem. A collection of intimate partners who have little problem "sharing" their love interest in both emotional and physical aspects. I find these to be exceedingly rare, to the point I don't even ascribe this definition to the general "harem" tag. And when it does happen it's either at the very end of a work as a "reward for the journey" or the population of the "harem" is very small. 2 or 3 individuals at most. Supporting or side characters may have these but it's almost always just background dressing and has no impact on the tag.>A collection of strung along love interests who are all in a cold war "competing" with each other over the main character (male or female) without actually sharing them in an appreciable manner romantically. This is what I ascribe to the "harem" tag when I see it even though it's not by definition a harem. It's dumb, and rarely executed well. I see this type in as many stories without the "harem" tag as with, making the tag itself (or lack of) generally useless.>A series, usually not more than 3, of different relationships over the course of the story. With beginnings and ends but all from the perspective of the same character (MC). Also sometimes adopting the "harem" tag.>No official relationships and the MC is minding their own business but is pursued by multiple love interests with no resolution, usually used as a vehicle to fan the ego of the self insert template.
>>288502860because if you deliberately make them "losers" you end up alienating the people you want to buy your mangaso instead you have MCs who just are losers portrayed completely uncritically
>>288502894I already inb4'd your copypasta, superpig
>>288503097If the story doesn't criticize them, they aren't losers.Supposed "loser" MCs in anime don't resemble real losers in any way. They have no issues socializing. They have friends and hobbies.They're only losers if your definition of "loser" is "doesn't have a girlfriend".
>>288503214Yeah, it's less them being losers and more them being average joes.
>>288503214I don't know if the only harem anime you've seen are Chiramune and Strike the Blood but you should know that the majority of MCs are weird asocial otaku that the reader can self-insert as
>>288503322There are almost zero "weird" or "asocial" harem MCs. The majority are just normal, if slightly introverted.
>>288503453That loser from DxD is hated by everyone at school for being a creepy pervert.
>>288503453lmao all you're doing is demonstrating the power of self-insertion and you probably believe that you are normal
>>288503510He has two male friends that are implied to be gay for him, as well as three other males that are explicitly gay for him.So he doesn't remotely qualify as a loser or outcast.
>>288503749it's like you see having two friends as an aspirational concept beyond your reach
>>288503651If the writers intended for the character to be a "loser", they'd make him, ugly, fat, give him a video game or porn addiction, anything. But that never happens.The only thing "weird" about your average harem MC is not having a girlfriend. Because getting one is what the story is about. They're completely normal in every way except the thing that the story is about them overcoming.
>>288503874>give him a video game or porn addictionSo, the DxD guy.
>>288503874wow you're retarded, the entire point were making is that no matter what the intent is harem MCs simply are losers because the writers are losers and the audience are losers and losers are who they relate to, you being a case in point
>>288503984A character is only a loser if they're deliberately written as one.
Whenever it comes to addressing issues regarding anime and manga romcoms aimed at men, it is quite common that the first thing one usually mentions is how the male protagonist is portrayed as a "loser", only for the work to never give you reasons to consider him one, leading to narrative incoherence.You only have to watch the first episode of any of these to see that the protagonist, at best, is an introverted geek boy who cannot or does not want to interact with others voluntarily, preferring to stay in his comfort zone. Wakana Gojo (My Dress-Up Darling), Ichikawa Kyoutarou (The Dangers in My Heart) and Takuya Seo (Gals Can't Be Kind to Otaku!?) are a clear example of this, the three are easily protagonists with whom any introverted boy can identify and even more so if they follow their backstory.And while we can criticize how they always end up falling in love with the conventionally attractive protagonist of each of their series, it cannot be denied that each one has significant development as characters, becoming more open to social relationships with others and finding comfort in the company of other people who share or respect their tastes, and all this without ceasing to characterize themselves as somewhat geeky introverted boys.So definitely, the label of loser cannot be applied to any of them, since they never actively do anything that causes the rejection of third parties and therefore contributes to their involuntary isolation from the rest of the characters.
>>288504004who wrote your story then? what a cruel sick motherfucker
>>288504028This in a way reminds me of the tropes that were often used in romantic comedy films of the 2000s, which generally featured one or more male protagonists actively seeking to fit into a social group that actively rejected or isolated them, regardless of whether the protagonists were good or not, which led the latter to want to prove their worth to the rest and be accepted, usually seeking to sleep with a woman, affirming and demonstrating that their manhood and her value as a person depended on whether she was a virgin or not.
>>288503984The only thing that matters is writer intent. If the writer doesn't intend for the character to be viewed as loser, then they aren't one. The audience's opinion doesn't matter.
>>288504049This is the key point people tend to miss when critizing stories like this. The male protagonist of the story isn't just the primary point of view - he's also the character who must undergo the most change in order to succeed. He is the character who must confront and overcome his flaws in order to find the happiness he desires.So he has to start off at a bit of a low point, so that he can reach a new peak by the end of the story.It's such a fundamental aspect of male-focused love stories in general. It's almost as old as story telling in general. It's the classic formula - if the brave knight wants to marry the princess, he has to slay the dragon first.And this is why the "main character is a loser who somehow gets the girl" critique can be somewhat annoying at times. The entire point is that the main character must prove that he is not a loser in order to be worthy of the love interest - or really any love or respect at all. He has no intrinsic value as a person until he achieves greatness.
>>288504137On the flip side of male characters having to prove they’re not losers, there’s also the tendency for female characters to prove they are losers for disinterest to be justified. As if the guy should be inherently grateful that a girl looked his way (unless there’s already a fan favorite love interest).Furthermore, even though Shoujo romance is rife with the genderbent dynamic, there are far fewer complaints with an unremarkable girl gaining the one-sided attention of an incredibly popular boy.In both instances, fans treat female characters as if they have inherent value in romance, even in blatant self-insert stories.
>>288504096did you learn death of the author in high school but your teacher was a woke roastie so you internalized the exact opposite of everything she said to "break the conditioning"?
>>288504325"Death of the Author" doesn't exist. The author is the one who wrote the story, so their word is law.
>>288504362you probably like Ready Player One let alone SAO
"They're losers because I said so" does not make for a very convincing argument
>>288504536it's been a while since I've seen the obvious loser of an argument in a thread do the thing where they reply to nobody as if they're "not that anon" and they hadn't clearly lost, but then again I've been better about clicking on these kinds of threads in the first place
