Why was Yu-Gi-Oh! so popular? Does it deserve a remake faithful to the manga?
No Kaz, no remake. I wouldn't trust it to be even remotely decent without him around, especially with the industry being the way it it now.
>>291764438it'd be better to just make a spiritual successor around a wholly new character with the same gimmick of "the power of the dark spirit haunting me will curse to death anyone that makes a wager with me and loses"
>>291764438it's popular because it's good
>>291764438I swear to god I had a fever dream that we would be getting a Season 0 remake but instead of Megumi Ogata coming back it's Shunsuke Kazama
I deserve an official release of the season 0 OST.
>>291764438Yugioh was popular for the same reason magic the gathering was popular back then
i wonder how quickly they would run out of interesting game scenarios if they tried to make an entire new season 0 style show
>>291764612The sequel series are already the "spiritual successors", but they’re too focused on gameplay mechanics.The original Yu-Gi-Oh! is unmatched simply because Kaz really gave no fuck about actually making a balanced card game.
>>291764438youtube.com/watch?v=lfMJLmmDBx4&t=32s
>>291764491Yeah they'd probably still censor the more violent bits, agree about Kaz and the industry as well.>>291764438When you look beyond the TCG and merchandise, it's a really creative work on its own with this dark feel to it. Both the manga and 2000s anime had solid art, it was a good product.
>>291769934>When you look beyond the TCG and merchandise, it's a really creative work on its own with this dark feel to it. Both the manga and 2000s anime had solid art, it was a good product.What are the best animated episodes?
>>291764438No Kaz. No point.
>>291764438I want a new anime not more fucking boomer slop
>>291769991I felt that it had consistently great animation considering all the different interactions between cards and duelists, with a more challenging style to capture to boot; but on terms of fluidity, episodes with Pegasus' toon world and Yugi vs. Marik imo
>deserve a remakeWhy don't you drown in acid?
>>291770299Sorry, Yu-Gi-Oh appeals to the same people who think Dragon Ball Super: Beerus is a good thing.
>>291773038YGO is a genuinely cool series.
>>291764438The actual trading card game desecrated it by not being more faithful to the manga, but ESPECIALLY the anime. And so...Yu-Gi-Oh! Yuggidrasilhttps://www.romhacking.net/hacks/10163/Press SELECT on the main menu: an Options screen opens with ~36 house rules. Some come from the anime, some from the manga, some from the early days vidya, some from modern formats, and some are completely new. Each one is a switch, and you can mix-and-match them freely. Everything starts on Normal, so until you change something, it's the classic game (Eternal Duelist Soul) exactly as you remember it.Looking for any and all feedback and ideas. The actual Yugioh game community doesn't seem at all interested. Maybe anime/manga fans here will find it more fun.>>291764491Agreed. He even did us the favor of giving it worthy send-off.>>291764612Disagree. Therein lies the dilemma for Yugioh. Nothing will ever be as iconic as what Kaz created.
>>291769342>Kaz really gave no fuck about actually making a balanced card game.the irl game has literally never cared about being balanced lmao
>>291764438>>291764491You can see they went through a lot of effort to restore and celebrate his art in the latest product. I don't doubt they have a real artistic intent to go through with it, not just something superficial.That said I'm also somewhat concerned about the censorship.>>291773038The Yugioh manga is 10/10.>>291774529I think a faithful Kaz like remake could be a first start. Then maybe later they can try to make something cool that doesn't involve just selling more cards and is more about flexing their art, which is the whole point.
>>291764438Or we could just make new things and stop remaking shit
>>291769342Kaz understood what made an engaging storyWhich is why he invented Raigeki just to ban Raigeki because nobody wants to read a story where monsters can just be removed for no cost
>>291774529Can someone Decompilation Duelist of the Rose/non-TCG Yugioh Game pleaseI do not known how to do it
>>291777433This is a different case, the original anime butchered Kaz's art so a remake would actually help here.
>>291764438In another timeline the author continued with his own vision of yugi instead of focusing solely on duel monsters and it would've been great, I'd like to see that, alas the author is dead.
>>291764438>Why was Yu-Gi-Oh! so popular? Great storyline, characters, creative games and great upsets. Also great designs even if the artwork itself is kinda rough at times.>Does it deserve a remake faithful to the manga?I mean, I wouldn't ask for it after Shaman King but its kinda weird that, relative to how popular the overall franchise is, most people aren't familiar with the kino that was the original story.
>>291774529>The actual trading card game desecrated it by not being more faithful to the mangaThere really wasn't a coherent proper playable game there. It mostly worked for the drama.A chunk of TCG's issues come from sticking to the original manga rather than otherwise.
>>291779899>continued with his own vision of yugi What makes the original great is that he did do that.
>>291779899I hate larpers who never read the manga, talk about "season 0" and think YGO was better with these shallower one-off games. The manga we had WAS the vision and it peaked at Battle City.
>>291781091It's a shame so many IRL circumstances dragged down Millennium Word from whatever Kaz originally envisioned for it
I think the only semi-practical thing they could remake are specific important duels to paced a lot better or be more faithful up to a point, and allow Konami to use them as marketing/stream events. And make sure to put some merch ads in there somewhere during commercial breaks. The DM anime has painful pacing in several places because of the time it was made, but a lot of episodes are still good besides that.
I just don't understand who a remake is forIf they use the OG cards then it's not a commercial for anything so it won't get made but if it uses the new cards (all the DM characters are getting new decks right now) then the nostalgiaboomers will throw a tantrum and refuse to watch.
>>291769991Look up the episodes that had Takahiro Kagami or Kazunori Takahashi as the animation director
>>291781347The DM anime has a lot of good episodes but a lot of very bad ones and the censorship is comically bad
>>291764438only if they leave in yami killing dudes
>>291764438Neither adaptation truly gets Yugioh. Toei felt too sanitized alongside bullshit like Miho or Green Kaiba yet DM had the problem of having to constantly shill the card game so we have Johnny Steps suddenly becoming a duelist in the anime. Alongside some fucked shit like having Yami take center stage during DDM (removing the entire plotline of Yugi having to play on his own) or the forced Yugi vs Jonuchi duel during DK, or all the censorship that just sanded off the horror edge Kaz still had in the manga.
The anime fucking sucks.
>>291764438No, it's good as it is, if you want the full experience just read the manga.
According to a recent interview, Torishima (yes, THAT Torishima) was a big help.>片岡義朗 (Kataoka Yoshiro) was a producer involved with producing Yu-Gi-Oh! Duel Monsters. He discusses how Yu-Gi-Oh! Duel Monsters came to be.>Asatsu DK>-- The more I learn, the more it seems the approach to making a TV anime became quite diverse in the 1990s.>Kataoka: I think it's something only Asatsu could have pulled off. As I said earlier, they had overwhelming dominance in the industry at the time. Our Sponsors included Bandai, Namco and Sega (our regular clients) as well as Takara and Tomy. It turned out that every company that made products for children had to use Asatsu as their advertising agency. Of course, there were people who preferred Dentsu, and it definitely had the clout of the industry leader, but when it came to the children's market, Asatsu was by far the strongest player. A really good example of this was "Yu-Gi-Oh!". It first aired on TV Asashi for six months starting in Paril 1998.>Toei's Yu-Gi-Oh!>-- That's the Toei Animation version, right?>Kataoka: Yes. It was handled by Dentsu, and they canceled the broadcast because they said it wasn't getting good viewership ratings. Torishima Kazuhiko-san, who was the editor-in-chief of "Jump" at the time, came to talk to me. That was actually the first time Torishima-san had ever visited Asatsu's office building. So, even though it looked like the "Yu-Gi-Oh!" anime was going to end, the reader surveys in "Jump" were doing incredibly at the time, so it was ludicrous for the anime to stop airing at a time like that.
>>291785529>So, he asked me "Please turn this into an anime and get someone to air it, no matter what". But, this was basically impossible under the rules of the broadcasting industry. Even if the broadcast ended, the general rule at the time was that TV Asashi would have the rights to rerun the 27 episodes produced by Toei for 2 and a half years. During that time, decisions regarding merchandising and all other forms of secondary use will be made by Toei Animation, so essentially, the basic rule was that other production companies or entities could not use the same title as "Yu-Gi-Oh!".>So when Torishima-san came to ask me for a favor, I told him "If Asatsu pulls some strings, I think we could get TV Tokyo to give us a time slot. Asatsu also did business with Konami and Bandai. So, finding sponsors wouldn't be a problem, but if we did the show on TV Tokyo, TV Asashi would get mad, right?">That would just end up with us shooting ourselves in the foot, wouldn't it. I told him "There's no way Toei Animation or TV Asashi would ever approve of something like this", and Torishima-san told me "Just leave that to me." He told me "Kataoka-san, just focus securing a time slot on TV Tokyo and getting the show on air as soon as possible". So when Torishima-san went to Toei Animation, he was told "No way, don't be absurd". He told them "Are you sure you want to say that? If that's how you want to play ball, then here's my trump card: "I'll revoke all secondary usage rights for "Dragon Ball".">He even told TV Asashi, who was airing a bunch of shows at the time like "Hell Teacher: Jigoku Sensei Nube", that he was going to pull them all off the air and used the full force and clout of Shueisha's "Shonen Jump" to make them back down. I found about this later, I wasn't in the know at the time.
>>291785560>Dragon Ball>I actually watched all 27 episodes of the Toei Animation version. It's really well done. The reason the show(s) didn't get high ratings is Toei and Asashi would plan and produce these shows based on "Jump" manga before they really took off, so they weren't made with the assumption that they'd ever become popular. However, the Toei Animation version was crafted with incredible care and attention to detail. It carefully explains things like the Muto Yugi (the hero), his family background and his school friends, in the style of "The Seven Samurai", detailing exactly what happened with each of them and how they became friends, as well as how Muto Yugi got into card games. It's all presented in a very easy to understand, digestible manner.>I made the new show with the old show in mind. I told the staff I assembled "If kids watch this "Yu-Gi-Oh! Duel Monsters" animated TV show, they should be able to win at the card game." I told them "Let's make it an anime that teaches viewers how to win" so we brought in people who knew a lot about how card games. They taught us things like "In the Yu-Gi-Oh! Card Game, you can win with this kind of combination", and when we made the show how they advised, it ended up being a massive hit.Source: https://ygorganization.com/kataokayoshirointerview
>>291785529With the anime? What did he do, other than pull strings to get the slot?>I told the staff I assembled "If kids watch this "Yu-Gi-Oh! Duel Monsters" animated TV show, they should be able to win at the card game." I told them "Let's make it an anime that teaches viewers how to win" so we brought in people who knew a lot about how card games. They taught us things like "In the Yu-Gi-Oh! Card Game, you can win with this kind of combination", and when we made the show how they advised, it ended up being a massive hit.Lol. That's a very stupid advice and far removed from the anime's (far and few between) qualities.
>>291764438>Why was Yu-Gi-Oh! so popular?one of those things where you had to be there lil z
>>291764438Only if they make the shadow realm canon
>>291779220no it didn't.
>>291788712It did >>291785105Try rewatching Yugi Kaiba 2 and then reading it
>>291785105>>291788764yugi pretty much eschewed anything but card games mattering in any appreciable sense. they don't care if joey gets beat up to move the story along. even Kaz had joey be beat up by the rare hunters several times for convience.
>>291788945Getting beat up by a group of people is understandable; even if you're a veteran street fighter like Jonouchi is, numbers tend to still win out. Getting stopped by a washed up fuck like Keith is kind of dumb though. This is all besides the point that he's actually talking about though, which is the anime's art style generally being inferior to the manga's, which is true but unfortunately a given for any cheaply made adaptation of any manga where the artist is skilled and has a fairly distinctive style.
>>291785529>>291785579>Just leave that to me." He told me "Kataoka-san, just focus securing a time slot on TV Tokyo and getting the show on air as soon as possible". So when Torishima-san went to Toei Animation, he was told "No way, don't be absurd". He told them "Are you sure you want to say that? If that's how you want to play ball, then here's my trump card: "I'll revoke all secondary usage rights for "Dragon Ball".">He even told TV Asashi, who was airing a bunch of shows at the time like "Hell Teacher: Jigoku Sensei Nube", that he was going to pull them all off the air and used the full force and clout of Shueisha's "Shonen Jump" to make them back down. I found about this later, I wasn't in the know at the time.This pretty much shows how key it is for shueisha to interfere to get shit done.
>>291789075yugioh's format and market appeal made a long running card commercial the only viable way for its anime to succeed. yugioh's not OVA or movie material.
>Last arc is a complete nonsense clusterfuck>Ten years later get a chance to finally make a sequel movie>Make it about Shadi's backstory>Raise more questions than you answerWhat the fuck was Kazuki thinking? I really wonder what sort of character Shadi was inside of his head.
>>291789432>>Last arc is a complete nonsense clusterfuckWhat's wrong with it
>>291789563Nta but i remember loving it, though i have not read it in a while. I really liked the twists
>>291784704> forced Yugi vs Jonuchi duel during DKDon't use words you don't know the meaning of.
Yugioh's manga is the kind of wild ride that can mostly only exist as a manga. It's the exact kind of thing you get from that environment of trying different tactics every so often with the same work to raise your profile and then maintain it. The anime on the other hand is a perfectly respectable take of capturing the exact commercial peak of what it reached and selling just that.If you want a weird, experimental series where characters appear and disappear and the tone constantly wavers and suddenly there's a long arc about something and then it gets dropped, yeah that's the beauty of manga baby. No place else to get it in the world.
>>291788945Jonouchi was hit from behind, Kaz remained consistent with Jonouchi being kind of a thug and good at fighting.>>291789075Also this. Well it's a combination of raped artstyleand horrible changes/censorship turning a pretty cool story into something much worse
>>291789873It was forced though, in the manga Jonouchi forfeits against Yugi because he doesn't want to risk giving Pegasus any more information on his deck and playing style than he already has. The anime has them play it out for a bit of filler, same with shit like the random Anzu vs Mai duel.
>>291789563It's a bit rushed, especially the Atem vs Past Kaiba. Still a great arc.>>291790070There are so many bad changes it's hard to list, this forced duel doesn't even make it near the top
>>291789432I think in terms of how he intuitively thought about it, because Zorc was already a 'normal' destructive chaotic evil, he wanted to use Shadi as a different force who wanted to plan out imposing better order (his own idea of what's better for people) onto the world but didn't estimate wisely enough how that plan could go terribly wrong.He was feeling out for a different kind of opposing force first, and the details getting hashed out more cleanly was secondary>>291789563>>291789703The Atem vs past Kaiba incarnation part obviously didn't turn out as the huge clash between two incredibly strong wills vying to be the dominant ruler of Egypt that someone could imagine anticipating back during Battle City. Unstoppable force meets immovable object epic clash.But the actual thing wasn't completely chaotic, there was still some kind of understandable moving thread in how Egyptian Kaiba's father wanted to elevate his son and thief Bakura wanting vengeance for the sins of the royal family
>>291785808>What did he doLiterally making it possible, as the interview says.Torishima could cure cancer and you trannies would still hate him.
>>291790239I'm not saying making it happen is nothing, it quite literally made it possible obviously. What I'm questioning is whether he had actual editorial input like "change this story beat and focus on that" which is what most people say he does well, and when you read>I told the staff I assembled "If kids watch this "Yu-Gi-Oh! Duel Monsters" animated TV show, they should be able to win at the card game." I told them "Let's make it an anime that teaches viewers how to win" so we brought in people who knew a lot about how card games. They taught us things like "In the Yu-Gi-Oh! Card Game, you can win with this kind of combination", and when we made the show how they advised, it ended up being a massive hit.Then you can tell it's not the case and he has retarded takes when it comes to the actual media.
>>291785808>>291790258Unfortunately, that's Kataoka Yoshiro speaking. not Torishima. The entire interview is Kataoka. Also in that article in the link it brings up how yugi's voice actor was casted by him.
>>291790461the confusion is that it was kataoka recounting how torishima helped yugioh get to air on tv tokyo instead of tv asahi. it isn't a torishima interview.
>>291790491Okay, so I believe Torishima didn't have any editorial input? And Kataoka is the one being silly with his editorial feedback. Good on Torishima.
>>291790514Kataoka Yashiro was one of the asatsu dk tv producers from the reading the article. he's wasn't an editor at jump. As an editor in chief, torishima wasn't the one giving kaz editorial feedback chapter to chapter, that would have been the editor assigned to kaz, who's not really talked about often, i don't think.
>>291790593>that would have been the editor assigned to kaz, who's not really talked about often, i don't think.Do we even know the guy's name?
>>291785105Anime took a lot of Jono's aura away and made him a bit too dumb.The worst part is the 4kids version of Jono is smarter than the anime version SOMEHOW.
>>291790593next time i'll read properly. gomenasai
>>291764438Because, filler aside, it was fucking awesome. Specially battle city and all the yami no game supernatural stuff. Not to mention Ishizu, Anzu and Mai were all pretty hot.
>>291790622looking up, it's Yoshihisa Heishi. for at least a couple years probably. sometimes they switch out the editors on manga after a few years. looks like he did a lot of editing and production work for shueisha afterwards and became chief editor later.https://www.animenewsnetwork.com/encyclopedia/people.php?id=107161
>>291764438Reiwa anime is the epitome of soulless. DM + Toei are serviceable enough, whatever they could shit out today would be worse, the ship for a faithful, full adaptation sailed decades ago. Just read the manga if you want the undiluted experience.
>>291790905They're clearly focusing a lot more on Kaz's art which means they clearly value the right parts of YGO. I don't know if they can pull it off but they at least understand the assignment
>>291790070"forced" means they had to twist the plot to make it happen. It was the final match that they were supposed to play in the manga too. they didn't twist anything to make it happen, they just had it different to the manga. You don't know what the word "forced" means.
>>291790258>I'm not saying making it happen is nothingNot only you dissed his contribution, you outright had it wrong because its clear Kataoka got the slot.>quote that wasn't torishima.
>>291791747It was forced whether you accept that reality or not, bub. Try harder next time.
>>291791797Yeah, I hated how they forced Argentina and Spain to play the WC final too.
Best products to buy for classic YGO cards?
>>291777863>Can someone Decompilation Duelist of the Roses?You're lucky it's beloved...repo: https://gitlab.com/Zusk/dotr-decompilationwrite-up: https://zusk.neocities.org/dotr_decomp
Honestly, the fact it's about a card game aside, YGO does genuinely have an interesting dark fantasy premise and the characters are fun and work well with each otherIt's like if Fate was written with TCG rules in mind
>>291764438I'm surprised it's still so popular, I haven't got round to watching them but I downloaded dual monsters and gx a couple weeks ago and have already uploaded over 300gb
