>>34540900
Shift your desire from outcomes to efforts. Rather than seeking a desired outcome, which requires the hope that it might come true, you should focus all of your care and intention towards the effort that you yourself put in, which is something that requires no hope because you can guarantee that it comes true since the amount of effort that you put in is under your control. This way, even if you don't get the outcome you wanted, you'll be pleased with the effort that you managed to put in, knowing that the effort you put in today was good practice towards putting more effort in tomorrow. A man with this outlook can never really fail and never becomes discouraged, he just learns and grows forever and finds pleasure in that learning and growth process.

>>34540900
Some jew likes to tortures animals and you start thinking that's all there is to life, that your human thinking and feeling brain is a dog's? That's learned goyness, dude.

It's not easy in the first place. Things would be easier if you had friends who scout better roads but that's not there. You have to learn discipline to stick with the bad things.

>>34540904
>shift
>just gaslight yoursef broo, just stop hoping and be content in your suffering
Here comes the jew.

>>34540909
Did you even read my post? It was the opposite of what you're implying in every possible way.

>>34540900
Think* about failure until you truly see it as admirable. Failure is truly admirable. What isn't immediately intuitive is that the word itself is actually wrong for what is being described, usually. It implies no value, and that it reflects on the person, they are now branded a failure for life. But this is inaccurate. If you try to play a piece of music and you only play the first 3 notes correctly, it's more accurate to say that you have a partial success.

In fact the only way to actually fail, to achieve NOTHING, is to not even try. People think they can escape failure by never trying, but actually it's the only surefire way to choose real failure. The more logical, and more enjoyable mentality is to love failure. You should be eager for it, the training to running a marathon involves failing to run a marathon hundreds of times, but getting more partial success every time. Failure is truly admirable, someone who fails the most will eventually succeed.

*When I say think, I mean as an activity, sit down and really think about it until you have an epiphany that you actually believe.

>>34540920
>shift your desire
It seems some people just don't understand there are cases where this is not possible. Since it's so easy to say it, when results don't add up they'll just say you didn't try hard enough without saying anything else. That "shifting" thing is gaslighting in the first place. It doesn't make sense to me how you're supposed to be in tune with the world yet you manipulate yourself to be something you're naturally not.

If the world is shit, just say so. Stop blaming people's symptoms for the world's sickness.

>>34541014
>Stop blaming people's symptoms for the world's sickness.
Nta but the amount of times I've seen opinions like these on 4chan is mind boggling, I would truly do myself a favor by using TikTok instead
The world does not give a fuck about you, your suffering is your problem. There is no solution that exists outside of yourself

File: 09colombia-jungle-rescue-(...).jpg (129 KB, 884x589)

129 KB JPG

>>34540991
Some colombian kids on an airplane crashed in the middle of the Amazon. The kept roaming the jungle in a large spiral instead of staying put to be found or even walking on a beeline to the nearest town.

Seeing failure as a positive thing is fine when you have unlimited chances to try, like gambling in stocks, building one machine, even trying out a startup or "getting a girlfriend", as in any female hole would do.

Those kids had one life, not even a full life, they were found at the limit of their lives. They "tried" something, but had no direction. They were lost and the window of time passed. Time passes when you're lost, failure is a deadline and when you cross it there's no going back. In this case failure meant death. The cause for success was not because "they tried", it was because there were many actors that joined to the effort of success, with a better plan nonetheless. Even that better equipped team had trouble, but their trials were better informed than the trials of the kids. If the kids had not tried at all and just sat in place while the rescue team tried to save them they would have gotten to civilization quicker and in a better state.

So sorry if I call that repetitive failure theory bullshit, there's a lot more nuance to it, and the thing goes like "The conjoined and progressive efforts lead to success", meaning individual success is entirely out of the picture, and some lives end up being accursed to not see a measure of success but having being paramount to the future success of someone who is remembered. So the entire thing gets reduced to luck and the skill to position yourself where efforts are finally giving fruit.

cont.

>>34541074
Yet the matter of individual failure is unresolved. I think people deserve good rewarding lives, and I think gaslighting yourself to believe an accursed life is part of the greater good is unfair. Instead of conforming to that hivemind manipulating thought how about put some effort into making the best out of people who have limited trials instead?

After all those kids wouldn't have come back if nobody went out to seek them, or would have been found if the army hadn't had both trained commandos and native navigators.

File: Schopenhauer smirk.jpg (296 KB, 1920x1441)

296 KB JPG

>>34541074
You are based, son.

>>34541014
>there are cases where this is not possible
It's never not possible. You're in control of your own desires. They come from you. You are their cause, meaning no one and nothing is responsible for them other than you.

>That "shifting" thing is gaslighting in the first place
Adopting a positive and productive attitude is not "gaslighting", and the fact that you see it that way is the reason why you have a shitty, defeatist, negative attitude. You're actively resisting positivity and then wondering why there's no positivity in your life.

>It doesn't make sense to me how you're supposed to be in tune with the world yet you manipulate yourself to be something you're naturally not.
You've already manipulated yourself into being something you're not and believing in something that isn't true, that's why you're miserable. The goal at hand is to correct yourself so that you can become aligned with what you truly are and what is true. You've made the false assumption that your starting point must be your true nature. It's not. Your starting point is fallen away from your true nature, and the goal is to return to it.

>If the world is shit, just say so. Stop blaming people's symptoms for the world's sickness.
You're guilty of not actually reading the post you replied to. Nowhere in that post does it say to give up, that the world isn't full of problems or that people aren't suffering real issues. The point of that post is that you should spend more time perfecting your efforts and learning how to enjoy the sensation of personal growth and progress, while wasting less time wallowing in self pity. A man whose only incentive is outcomes will be miserable, downtrodden, unfulfilled and spend every waking moment pitying himself. A man whose main incentive is the pursuit itself, the triumph of personal growth and the mastery of the self will never pity himself, never be defeated and go from strength to strength as a whirlwind of purpose, determination and domination.

>>34541074
>>34541079
>>34541111
Again, you are based, I could pass my entire afternoon reading what you have to say.

>>34541111
>It's NEVER (absolutist distortion) not possible
>Because it comes from you (anthropocentrist + idealistic theory)
>I abritrarily define gaslighting as "only when it's negative"
>btw It's your own fault

Dude, the problem is you're huffing the farts of some german jews form 1930. Society has progressed, new issues have arised and a new diversity of difficulties have come to light. The world is becoming ever more hostile as well. You really don't know what anon is like, you can't say he has it in him to pull himself by the bootstraps or be immune to the world of shit we live in. If you're gonna say something, it better be rooted in real human behavior, something you could see in feral kids, in poors, in shut ins, in chads, in rich people, and it should make sense with the difference of their background. You can't just say everything comes from "the soul gnosis pneuma" etc.

I don't think anyone should give up, but I noticed almost nobody gets helped to achieve things they set out to do, and if they're lacking in social skills much less. Frustration is obvious when they start out something in their own that groups of people already outcompete them in from shared knowledge, you're trying to rebuild 10,000 years of human history on your own two feet and you have what, 6 months before your savings run out?

Get real man.

>>34541141
Alright then, stay miserable and continue to put zero effort towards the betterment of your situation. Everything is everyone else's fault and there's absolutely nothing you can do to improve on your end. No effort whatsoever is required out of you, for any purpose imaginable. I'm sure that that's a belief that will get you far in life and lead to prosperity. Good luck.

>>34541141
holy fuck you are fucking stupid

>>34541141
But yeah, I get what that positive gaslighting anon is getting at. I say it's not possible for everyone, specially if you have a critical mind, suffered or became jaded which is like 90% of this site. But if there's something that cheered me up even if just a little was The Count of Monte Cristo, the final quote is amazing, "All of human wisdom is found in two words: Hope and Wait". All I can say is, You have to get through it anyway. You won't find all the answers, people won't want to take the time to give them to you, but you have to keep going. It's not an affront to anybody, it's just you're not done. You're always at the middle of something, and if your life went to shit and it's finished that's the middle of yet another story. Just do me a favor and never conform to shit. Giving up is conforming, so just keep going. Try to find your way when you're lost, but keep going.

(bet none of that helps you becoming more positive OP, kek).

>>34541141
>most fart huffing post ever made in human history
>accuses other people of huffing farts
I'm so fucking glad I'm not a niggerbrained moron like this.

>>34541151
>>34541148
These two anons, despite being idealists, just gave up out of their own frustration. Never be them, OP, that's what I'm getting at.

File: Kobe.jpg (3.54 MB, 4459x3103)

3.54 MB JPG

>>34541111
I choose to believe these quads are Kobe speaking through you from heaven

>>34541074
>Seeing failure as a positive thing is fine when you have unlimited chances to try
>unlimited chances to try
This is most problems you face in life

>>34541167
>These two anons, despite being idealists, just gave up out of their own frustration. Never be them, OP, that's what I'm getting at.
No, they gave up on explaining because the person they're talking to has a double digit IQ and cannot comprehend logic. Discussing with a stupid person is useless. They will drag you to their level and beat you with experience.

>>34541167
I didn't stop explaining because I gave up or got frustrated, I stopped explaining because OP made it clear that he was intentionally bending over backwards to misunderstand what I was writing on purpose, for the sake of massaging his own inflated ego. I'll help anyone who wants to be helped, but when somebody is essentially asking me to stop giving them advice, even if it's in a roundabout a childish way like in this case, I'm going to stop giving them advice as a matter of courtesy. And besides that, someone who asks for help finding hope and then proceeds to assert that hope itself is inherently coping or gaslighting is the kind of person who deserves to suffer and needs to suffer. Nothing can be done for him right now other than, as you say, hope and wait. Time and maturity will do the work that we can't right now.

>>34541188
I'm the op of this thread. I haven't responded to you once, that is some other dude. Let me read through all this and formulate a response when I got time

>>34541365
That's infinitely worse for him in that case, because that would mean that that guy came to a thread asking for ways to find hope with the sole intention of tearing down other people's hopes with the aim of ensuring that everyone stays as miserable as he is.

Glad to hear you aren't him, OP. Hopefully you find something good in the advice offered.

I read 2 or 3 posts so far. Is this another "anon refuses advice and instead starts arguing in favor of the problem(s) he was initially complaining about" thread?

>>34541423
No, this is a "op asks for help and then some faggot shows up and derails the entire thread with loser bullshit" thread.

>>34541423
I didn't read your post, only like the first 2-3 words. Is this another "I won't read" post?

>>34541111
>from your true nature
Is it even possible to know it in the first place? Maybe I was born miserable.

>>34541520
Everyone's born miserable, but that doesn't mean that misery is your heritage or destiny. Everyone is born weak, they have to become strong. Everyone is born in ignorance, they have to become wise. Everyone is born cowardly, they have to become brave. Everyone is born selfish, they have to become selfless. If the same is true for every other good quality, why wouldn't it be the same for happiness? The fact that everyone else in history has had to make the same journey means that you can, too.

>>34541520
>Maybe I was born miserable
Oh lord. Nta, but dude you are depressed, and it's because you're going through some shit. And by the way, it's never ogre, you will only ever get better little by little, but one of the best things you can do for your mental health is staying away from negativity and black pill thinking. Maybe you are truly too chronically stressed to see how to not be like that, so seriously think if you can be at least a little bit less stressed about things.

>>34540900
I was like that for the past two years. Start fucking with the world, test it. Exert control. Change things. Starting small is fine.

>>34541523
I guess but it seems that other people have something going on even if its a dream or just a hopeful future. It somewhat reminds me of my attempts to be a bit more positive but then it makes no impact towards other people or world.
>>34541536
I wish I could be a little less stressed but living among other people is a constant reminder of stress factors and not be stressed is like deluding yourself away from cold reality.

>>34542867
>reminds me of my attempts to be a bit more positive but then it makes no impact towards other people or world.
That's not where you ought to be looking for the impact. The most important thing is whether or not it has an impact on you and your outlook. If you can change your perspective so that you actually enjoy and see purpose in effort for effort's sake, then you won't need outward confirmations, because you'll already have inward confirmations. A good deed is worth doing for its own sake, not for the sake of the praise you'll get or for how you'll transform the world. Likewise, putting effort towards something positive is valuable inherently because it teaches you something and helps you grow towards a better tomorrow. Even when you don't get a hoped for result, the effort that you put towards that result was meaningful and purposeful.

Or, to put it in other terms, every task is broken up into ends, causes and effects. Right now, you're fixated on the effects and wishing they were different, and that's why you're losing hope, because effects are by definition at the very end of the chain and thus always just outside of reach. Even when you get the effect you wanted, your attention will move on to the next desired goal, thus putting the new effect out of reach again. What I'm proposing is that you stop fixating on effects and start fixating on causes. Caring about causes and letting effects naturally come as they may will turn you into an engine of sorts. You find satisfaction in the causes that you put forward alone, which makes you utterly immune to hopelessness because the causes are always within your power, since causes are nothing more than your own actions. If you only care about the causes, then not getting the desired effect is still acceptable because you can be satisfied with your own actions, with how much you learned and with the improvement of your own character. And when you do get the desired effect, that's just an added bonus.

>>34542867
>not be stressed is like deluding yourself away from cold reality.
I get what you mean. But there are good kinds of stress and bad kinds of stress. Probably the bad kind of stress comes from the feeling that you're forced to do something for somebody else whereas the good kind of stress comes from a sort of peer pressure. But it's difficult to find that mindset and keep it.

>>34540900
>I keep failing at whatever i set out to do
What were the reasons for the failure in the past?

>>34542867
>not be stressed is like deluding yourself away from cold reality.
Think of it this way instead. Being stressed is deluding yourself away from morality. It's only possible to be stressed if you've allowed yourself to temporarily forget that this is all impermanent and that you will die someday. Someone who always keeps his mortality in mind never has any logical reason to be stressed, because he knows that the absolute worst case scenario is death, and that death is inevitable anyway.

>>34543710
Mortality*, not morality.

>>34543710
You're having a point, anon. But you're ignoring the *how* and the role that pain is playing in your death.

>>34543721
The main point is that stress is the delusion and calmness is the reality. Even if you knew that you were at risk of dying painfully or embarrassingly, there are only two possible outcomes. Either it's avoidable, in which case there's no sense in worrying yourself because it won't actually come to pass unless you let worry paralyze you, or it's unavoidable, in which case it makes even less sense to worry because there's nothing that you can do about it anyway so you may as well just calmly accept your fate. There's no situation in which worry is additive or helpful. It's just a delusion that sucks away energy from your task.

>>34543736
Bro.. being stressed is hard-wired in your biology. It is not something you are able to consciously control. This is pure delusion.

>>34543750
If that were the case then everyone would be stressed about the same things all the time and nobody in history would have ever learned how to be less stressed. Everyone would have an equal fear of spiders, of death, of taxes, of public speaking, of whatever you could imagine. There would be zero deviation between individuals, and zero deviation within an individual life. But the reality is that different people have different stresses, and even within a single individual that person can learn to become less stressed. Public speaking is scary at first and gets your palms sweating and your heart racing, but after you've done it a dozen times it's no longer as stressful. That would never be possible if it were "hard-wired in your biology". Stress comes from your opinions about things, not the things themselves and not from your biology.

>>34543758
>Stress comes from your opinions about things, not the things themselves and not from your biology.
No. It comes from your experiences in your past and, to a degree, from your genetic make-up. Somebody who was in war, for example, will not be able to trick himself into forgetting it. It is impossible. To a degree, I agree, you are able to mitigate it and you should. But you'll be able to do it fully. This is delusion.

It is not good to tell people that. You set them up for failure.

>>34543773
I never said to what degree it can be done, nor should that matter. The fact is that it can be done, so the goal is to do it as much as you can for as long as you can. No one can be morally perfect, either, but that doesn't mean that you should despair and give up on trying. Every step forward towards perfection is a step worth taking for its own sake, it doesn't matter if you ever reach "perfect" itself. Even thinking about that is a total waste of time. Your perspective is the only one that's setting anyone up for failure. You're telling them to despair and give up, to make less progress than they could because they'll never reach "the end", as if such a thing exists.

No one will ever be completely and totally stress free, but the power to be less stressed one day at a time is in your hands. Even with something like a war veteran, he has the power to be a little healthier today than he was yesterday, and that little step forward was worth it for its own sake.

>>34543788
I mostly agree with your take here. And I'll not argue about minutia.

>>34543758
It's literally genetic, that's why it varies. You have no real control over your stress tolerance besides avoiding stressful situations or using substances.

>>34543862
You can control it partly by how you look at the world. But is not as powerful as avoidance and substances, of course. But it is making a difference that is noticeable.

>>34543862
It's literally not, otherwise all fears would be inherited at the moment of birth from your parents. But people gain fears and lose fears as they progress through life, and not everyone fears the same things as their parents. The idea that you simply have no control is absolutely irrational and unscientific. Exposure therapy has been proven to work and is literally the single best tool against fear and stress.

>>34543875
Sometimes it is better to NOT expose yourself to something that you are afraid of. Some people are broken by that. It is not good for them.

>>34543685
>>34543710
Maybe thats why I somehow long for death, just to be free of all this stress of being inadequate among other people and punishing myself for being myself and someone else (better one). Being positive for positive sake feels like an act a small unit of happiness being outnumbered by depression.

>>34543879
For someone like that, it's just a matter of choosing lesser degrees. If someone is too afraid of spiders to be in the same room as a spider, you can show them a picture of a spider. If someone is too afraid to look at a picture of a spider, you can show them a drawing of a spider. There's no one who can't make any progress whatsoever, so it's just a matter of choosing an acceptable entry point and not rushing it. Telling people that they're just broken and that they shouldn't even try on the basis of a baseless supposition is just pointless defeatism.

>>34543912
It doesn't need to be an act if you genuinely love goodness. Acts of courage, self-sacrifice, love, compassion and justice ought to be sweet enough to you to bring a tear to your eye. If you truly and love everything good, virtuous and beautiful, you'll always be satisfied with steps that take you in that direction, no matter how small those steps may be. And all goods exist in unity, so if you head towards one you're necessarily heading towards the others, and together they outnumber any reasons you could ever have for being depressed.

If you don't love goodness that much yet, then all I can say is that you will eventually if you live long enough. After you're intimately familiar with the suffering that good's absence causes, you'll learn to love goodness more than your own life.

>>34543945
Sometimes hope is only prolonging somebody's pain.

>>34543962
People are not that complicated. In fact, life is not that complicated. It is about power, which is actualized by violence and sex. For all we are able to know, that's all there is to it.

"Goodness" only enters the equation, when you are not able to satisfy this desire. Then you're starting to delude yourself and think
>Oh well.. you see.. maybe there's more to life than that.
But no, there is not. There has never been. Do not get me wrong. In my opinion, it is okay to cope. But you have to be conscious of it. Not delude yourself and lie.

>>34543971
There's absolutely no way to determine that until after you're already dead, because every moment you live is another moment you could have tried and could have succeeded. If you don't want to try you should just admit it to yourself and give up honestly, rather than try to justify your defeatism. Defeatism is opposed to rationality and can't be justified using reason, by its very nature.

>>34543984
Life is very simple, that's true. Good is objective, and goodness is good for its own sake. Thus, a good life is spent in the pursuit of good. Any belief other than that is a delusional cope. Your obsession with sex, violence or whatever you're getting at is just your cope for your own inability to either see goodness or pursue it.

>>34543984
most retarded faggot midwit post of all time. this is the kind of dumb bullshit someone says after reading the wikipedia article for nietzche and starts thinking of himself as a tortured intellectual

>>34543988
But I did accept it. I accepted that I'll be lonely. I do not hope to escape it. You know how long I had been fighting, until I was ready to admit it? I clang to the hope, as if my life depended on it. To my detriment! I wished I had given up earlier. It would have protected me from the pain.

>>34543997
Why are you so angry? Yes, I am average. But you do not have to to have a high IQ to understand what I said, anyways. It is really not that complicated.

>>34543875
You fell for right wing spiritual self-help nonsense. You have two parents that you share genes with. In genetic recommendation, you get traits from your parents, some shared, some dominate and outweigh others etc plus both family trees have many people that can pass you something else, also mutations happen.
Probably the best analogy is the Soviet conscription, where many people across the Soviet Union had to serve far from home with complete strangers, often nationaly. Many people committed suicide while serving or thought of doing so, others could bear it and just went with it, some got out and still were patriots of USSR. All of them were trained to become cannon fodder, yet they responded to the stress/ fear vastly different.
Exposure therapy is gaslighting and has no success on actual mental(genetic) issues and just cause more trauma. It's proponents are retarded privileged boomers and foids with a silver spoon in their mouths. Therapy without meds(real thing) is useless.

>>34544006
You're still in pain now, aren't you? Sounds like it didn't protect you at all and you're simply wallowing. If you had actually accepted anything, you wouldn't consider yourself lonely or have any feelings of loneliness. Accepting that you can't have your heart's desire is a valid choice, but it never comes with the bitterness you're expressing. Bitterness means you're still clinging, which means you haven't reached a state of acceptance. And none of that is contrary to hope, either, because if you had asked hope what it thought it would have told you that happiness can be achieved even without companionship.

>>34544010
I hate to say it, anon, but he's right. Nothing you said is correct in the slightest and it just goes to show that you haven't read many books or broadened your perspective. If you think there's nothing more to life than hitting people with clubs and having sex, then you haven't yet lived a single day of your life, haven't learned anything and haven't experienced personal growth. You're at the same level of intellectual advancement as a barn animal. I'm not saying that to put you down, just to show you that there is more out there if you dare to look.

>>34543991
>goodness is good for its own sake
It'll get you crucified.

>>34544011
This is too on the nose, it's pretty obvious you're just baiting.

>>34543962
How one should love or embody goodness when being denied of it? Sure, dont expect anything in return but it sounds strange unless you're believer.

>>34544014
I am managing the pain, yes.

>Bitterness means you're still clinging, which means you haven't reached a state of acceptance.
You are correct. I admit. I accepted it intellectually. Not emotionally. Perhaps, this is impossible. I am only an animal, after all.

>And none of that is contrary to hope, either, because if you had asked hope what it thought it would have told you that happiness can be achieved even without companionship.
I prefer to talk to the spirit that he met on the mount. He does not dismiss. And he argues in a way that I understand.

>>34544021
>that you haven't read that many books
I do not need that many books. Nobody does.

>If you think there's nothing more to life than hitting people with clubs and having sex, then you haven't yet lived a single day of your life, haven't learned anything and haven't experienced personal growth.
I am adhering to the truth. Is it not what I am asked to do?

> I'm not saying that to put you down
Yes, you did. Of course. And you confirmed what I was speaking of.

>>34544029
Goodness comes from your own behavior, not from anyone else's. If I have an honest neighbor, that's his honesty, not mine, and nothing he can do can force me to be honest unless I learn to value honesty. But if I value honesty and uphold it as a principle, then there's nothing that anyone can do to tarnish it, nothing that anyone can do to budge me away from it and nothing that can deprive me of my goodness. If you're looking for a reward for being good, or expecting goodness to come out from other people and enter you, then you aren't yet in a state where you even understand what goodness is, let alone love goodness for goodness's sake.

It may sound strange, but if you analyze it critically you'll see that the goal I'm describing is the only kind of happiness that can exist. A man can only be counted as happy if he has everything he wants and avoids everything he doesn't want. If either of those conditions aren't met, he's by definition in a state of want, which is a state of misery or lacking. No man has the power to control reality so that it matches up with all of his desires at every moment, meaning the only happy man is the man who has learned how to control his desires so that they match up with reality. That's what it means to be wise, and that's the only condition in which happiness exists. Someone in this state concerns himself with his own actions, his own behaviors and his own goodness, because that's what lies within his control. He finds continual joy in improving himself, becoming better and wiser, and being a relentless source of positivity to the world around him.

>>34544042
You're as far from truth as humanly possible. So much so that your very position is the rejection of truth. You can only believe what you believe if you also believe that truth does not exist and isn't objective. If you were to admit that truth is objective, then you would also necessarily have to admit that truth is life's purpose. And if life has purpose that goes beyond sex and violence, then you've refuted your own position.

>>34544037
You're not only an animal, you're a man. Man has rationality and understanding at his disposal. You never have to be at the mercy of your own bitterness, you can always learn how to adopt a purer and more truthful perspective. Bitterness and falsehood go hand in hand, as do truth and gladness.

>>34544048
I do believe in the truth. Which is known by the evidence. And the evidence is not your side.

>hen you would also necessarily have to admit that truth is life's purpose
No, this is not necessary. Sometimes, lying is necessary for life. This is what hope is.

>>34544054
If you believe in truth and that truth has value, then you're saying that values outside of sex and violence exist. Thus, you contradict yourself.

If you're saying that truth exists but has no value, then why are you arguing? The fact that you're trying to convince anyone of anything contradicts that belief, since you wouldn't argue if you didn't place value on truth. Thus, you contradict yourself.

Either way you slice it, you've lost here and there's no coming back from it. The evidence is absolutely on the side of what I'm saying and have been saying all thread long, which is that defeatism is a sure path to defeat and that effort is the only path towards success. It could never be otherwise.

>>34544052
No, false. Very often truth and happiness are OPPOSED. Very rarely what people *want* to be true is what is *actually* true. Very rarely this is the case. This world is callous and it does not care for our sensitivities.

>>34544062
If truth and a desire are opposed then that means the desire is what's false and has to be given up. If you manage that, you'll become happy. It's never truth that's the problem, just your and your own clinging.

>>34544059
It has a value *for me*. *I* do place value on it. Which I'll explain, if you want. Maybe you're able to guess it. It's not complicated. But I know, of course, it is not an objective one. I am not contradictory, at all.

>>34544066
If truth itself is objective then its value must be objective. Truth's value could only be subjective if truth itself is subjective. So yes, you did contradict yourself. You can only value truth if you see that truth has value. And if truth has value, then values exist apart from sex and violence. No amount of lying will cover up this contradiction.

>>34544065
No, it does not mean it. Only because it is *feeling* wrong does not mean that it is wrong.
>If you manage that, you'll become happy.
It is an impossibility to give up on your desire.
>It's never truth that's the problem, just your and your own clinging.
Problem.. it is not a problem for me.

>>34544075
>It is an impossibility to give up on your desire
You're the cause of your own desires. Not only is it possible, but it's impossible to be unable to. The issue is that you aren't willing to. You've already given up desires you had as a kid. Surely you wanted things back then that you've now realized were foolish and undesirable. You can do the same for any other desire you have today.

>it is not a problem for me
You just admitted to being in pain, feeling lonely, coping poorly and having no hope. You're just going into denial now to avoid having to accept responsibility for yourself and your desires.

>>34544074
Truth has value for me, since it is satisfying my desire for violence, which is caused by my bitterness. I know that it hurts you.
>If truth itself is objective then its value must be objective.
There is no "if.. then.. " here. It is not logically connected.

I'll stop posting and I'll leave 4chan for an hour. A part of me does not want be cynical. You're trying to be a light. And I respect that, even if I do not have the strength to believe in it. Take care.

>>34544083
Truth can't have value for you unless you believe that it's true that truth has value. If you answer "it's true that truth has value", then you admit that truth has value, which contradicts your conclusion. If you say "truth has no value but I value it anyway", you admit to being a walking contradiction. Truth doesn't ever lead to a warped view that only values violence and bitterness, which is why your view necessarily ends in self refutation and incoherency. Hopefully you find your way out of this mire someday.

>>34541074
Like many anons you are a coward because you want a guarantee. What is ritual? An attempt to guarantee an outcome. What is madness? An attempt to preserve a fantasy that is in danger of collapsing so instead of moving forward you do nofap, you looksmax, you rationalize that the Jews are stopping you, etc etc because you know that if you move forward your fantasy is in danger of collapsing. Like a covert narcissist you secretly think you are above others that's why it hurts because when ur fantasy is constantly in danger of collapsing from the world telling you ur not special ur not secretly smart your not gonna get the girl etc that's why you freeze up in social situations etc anxiety is asking the thing that you think will bring you meaning "what do I do now what am I supposed to do where do I stand how do I move what is the correct thing" over and over again you need to act and you need to fail and not let these mechanisms control you by relating differently to them. One way is to not expect a satisfying outcome but dont give up on your desire and take it to the end anyways this is how you transcend this loop

>>34544043
Lol it's so funny how you run into the structure of what's actually happening in the background.

Having everything you want and having nothing you don't want is literally a fantasy of completeness and will never ever ever exist because it structurally can't. You don't understand, a state of want is fundamental. Lack is built in. Lack is an engine and it's the state of having something that collapses the desire and consequently the enjoyment that desire generates. A man can only be counted as happy if he is actively chasing something he wants but accepts the distance between himself and his goal. Once you reach said goal you will feel good for a little bit but desire will shift because that is how is structurally operates. You will never be fully realized never be made whole because wholeness is a fantasy that drives us to act on higher abstract goals. It's recognizing that lack is structural and acting anyways on your desire knowing there is no final satisfaction and the fun is in enjoying the healthy desire as your move towards your goal and enjoy the structural fantasy that this will complete me (while knowing it won't) and once I attain this goal I will simply rachet it up to the next level and chase another goal sustaining healthy desire and enjoyment and actual happines

>>34544162
>A man can only be counted as happy if he is actively chasing something he wants
That's why he has to chase his own moral perfection. It's a pursuit that will never let him down, never leave him unfulfilled, never disappoint him, never be outside of his reach and never lead to listlessness or lethargy. Desire and pursuit themselves are fine, but what has to change is the target. Targeting things outside of yourself that don't depend on you leads to hopelessness. Targeting goals that are within your reach ensures that you stay motivated and always achieve your goals. Then goal of "I'm going to perfect my own conduct within this life for as long as I live" encompasses all other minor goals because it by definition includes morality, integrity, employment, relationships, fitness and hygiene, while serving as a lighthouse or a meta goal that never goes dim.

>>34544171
Hmm I know exactly what ur saying but that's the great news is that lacan gives us the real tools to not give up on our desires, you can desire to fk bitches smoke weed and act like future all the time and it doesn't matter once u understand desire structurally. You don't need to be a monk anymore. Nothing can hurt you. I can be a freak.