Is FIRE a meme?Been living frugally stacking index funds for 7 years and still seems I wouldn't retire that much earlier. I've got a few years worth of living expenses saved. Kind of tempted just to live paycheck to paycheck (spending on restaurants, travel, sugar babies) at this point while not touching the emergency fund and at least enjoy my remaining youth to the fullest. I feel I'd be bored retiring anyhow.
>>60998351>7 years not approaching at least 500kLoser.
Not really. A lot of crypto degens are gonna come for you but spending 4-5 years being poor and saving sets you up well. You legit have two years of life expenses that’s quite a lot. If you’re in your 20s and have even 100k liquid that’s a big bonus. I’d peel back and chill a bit and spend more if that’s the case but nothing wrong with saving meticulously for a couple years
>>60998359Started making 80k pre-tax and now 120k pre-tax. Saving half after tax is around 30-40k, so I've just got around 150-200k from throwing it to index funds. Any more than that would have been from getting lucky, which I didn't want to stress about.>>60998365Yeah, grew up dirt poor. Both parents in bad debt living in poverty my whole childhood. Made it my mission to get a good degree, good job, live in a cheap apartment just saving up, but now at 29 coming to realize it seems kind of pointless after having a solid emergency fund and a good low-stress wfh job. Anything more seems like the juice wouldn't be worth the squeeze.
>>60998477200k is make it territory in large parts of the world.
>>60998492like where? I just live in a rural cheap mountain town in USA. There isn't much to do but it's cheap as hell. I mostly just entertain myself, but might just decide to splurge. I pocket like $3k a month after bills, which I usually auto dump to savings/index funds but I guess I might as well pick up some more expensive hobbies or something. That or maybe just keep dumping to savings and not really thinking about it. Seems money just gives you better tools to numb the same void we all feel. I feel I'd barely feel different if I saved or spent it anyhow.
>>60998351You need to have a balance. Don’t save 90%. Don’t save 0%. Save a bit, spend a bit. Really not a hard concept
>>60998598The biggest thing you should do is reject consumerism and realize it’s not going to make you happy. Living a simple healthy life is going to maximize happiness and is actually cheap. Mindless consooooomer behavior is the issue
>>60998598Just wondering at what point it makes sense to keep saving. Got 150-200k. Seems overkill at this point. I don't think it really makes a difference to retiring early, especially when I enjoy my job. Most of the time I have free time to work on music/art etc, so it's pretty comfy.> reject consumerismyeah, that's what I was getting at above >>60998571It's the only reason I haven't spent anything and keep cheap hobbies like video games only buying stuff on sale and kind of living like a monk minimalist. I guess sometimes I look at how much money I've hoarded and wonder if its overkill, that maybe I should just give it away to family or something. I've also tried gambling with some of it before but nothing makes me feel worse than losing money, so to me it's a horrible hobby. Idk, maybe the satisfaction of seeing the number slowly go up and having that security just in case is mentally the best move.
>>60998571Bulgaria, SEA, Africa, anywhere where singles have to survive on less than 500$ a month (3% of 200k p. a.).
>>60998682I'd consider Bulgaria and SEA, but not Africa. Seems I'm still just better in a cheap part of USA. One hour drive and I'm at a decent sized city if I want to do stuff.
>>60998692Just grind a few more years, you will not regret having money to go life innawoods, watch sportsball, go fishing or camping and doing nothing else all day (my dream of a perfect life).
>>60998477the difference in these two pics as that the one on the bottom is 68 years old and the one on the top is 240 years old and has been replacing his blood with his descendants' blood in order to stay alive and run his empire from the shadows
>>60998351It's not really a meme, it's just boring. You're on your way to WAGMI and you've really money is kind of boring. Do you have any BTC? If I were you, I would outright buy an entire BTC or at least .5 with your emergency money. Doesn't make a lot of sense to keep that much in cash, should have ~1 year living expense only and the rest in Bitcoin.
>>60998877Dont listen to this retard. Buy an etf.
>>60998877Yeah, I've thought about just stacking BTC, but idk, index funds and cash in a 4.5% yield savings account is pretty comfy. With BTC it just seems more like gambling. I'd feel like shit if it were to drop like 80% and just stay like that for some long bear run. I've tried investing in speculative stuff that seemed liked a sure bet before and somehow I always immediately got the black swan situation. I feel if I were to buy BTC I'd suffer some black swan and lose my quality of life/sanity. Idk, maybe I'd just need to auto buy every paycheck and just not think about it for a decade. I just don't want to be one of those people checking their portfolio every hour and stressing what if this or what if that happens etc.
>>60998877OP’s pic is almost me.>lived like a retard in 20s>hit 28, oh fuck I haven’t saved shit>start dumping into Roth at work>hit $35k>switch jobs with far higher salary, transfer Roth into bitcoin (about .32 btc)>new work 401(k) is all VOO, continuing to buy bitcoin with RothBut honestly, holding bitcoin is kind of exhausting. Every stock I would’ve invested in otherwise is up 25 percent this month. And it’s like… is bitcoin going to hit $500k? $1m? When does it taper off? Like my entire net worth right now is in bitcoin. If it pays off, I get tax-free bitcoin returns. If it doesn’t it’s “oh shit”. I would rather put half into Tesla. And usually bitcoin follows tech stocks, now it’s just been crabbing. I don’t know what to do.
>>60998920>tax-free Bitcoin returns Oh sweaty…
>>60998910Honestly bro I would just now focus on self development. I’m move to a city or somewhere new and figure some stuff out.
>>60998929Unless they change the rules for a Roth through passing a new law in Congress, my bitcoin returns will be tax-free. But it wouldn’t really make sense to change Roth rules, because the whole purpose is to contribute after-tax earnings and get tax-free returns. Changing it would make it a regular IRA.
>>60998938For reference I’m 27 and have about a 65k NW. it’s mostly all in stocks, some crypto, with a 20k emergency fund. Still rent. I just started making money a year and a half ago, making 95k now I make 110k. Before that I made 65k for two years and barely saved shit.I live in a city and from talking with peers most are poorer than me. So for reference you’re doing very well. The main focus of your life now should be hobbies, finding something. passionate about, moving, starting a business etc.
How much do you need to be considered financially independent? Is house laid off and 2k a month after taxes enough? I have a gf and she could keep working as an accountant if we get married
>>60998351Its more like standard self control, but redditards need to make a whole movement (like they always do) over basic common sense.Tbf, its one of the less retarded things I've read. Still its basic common sense.Almost everything in FIRE can be summerised in one sentenced (that will have you banned on Plebbit, divoiced & fired at work) DON'T FALL FOR THEIR JEWISH TRICKS!It's that simple :)
>>60998598No you don't need a balance, stop falling for Jewish tricks its that simple.I got to 7 figs at 25, how? BY NOT FALLING FOR GOYIUM ADVICE LIKE YOURS. SAVE EVERYTHING YOU CAN.
>>60998896why would you buy a bitcoin etf instead of buying actual btc. Wow.>>60998920How are you buying 'Bitcoin' in a roth ira? NYKNYC>>60998910I encourage you to study Bitcoin and consider moving at least half your cash into it.>it's a network>it's a store of value>it's code; it's law>it's an energy currency>it's the hardest money ever >it's the scarcest asset evergood luck
>>60998997That’s basically what I have to live with if I want tax-free gains, yeah.
>>60998938self improvement for what? Wouldn't enjoy getting drunk at bars or listening to normie-babble and being around tons of immigrants etc. Already work out at home and got a clean diet. Rather not do something unless I have full conviction on it.>The main focus of your life now should be hobbies, finding something. passionate aboutyeah, like I said above mainly just making music/art in my free time. I probably spend 2-3 hours a day on just that, maybe more on weekends. I guess I could make my goal just turning this to a business/monetize it all well enough to make a living from. >>60998950It's different for every person but income from investments should be greater than expenses. If you're married probably need to double the amount since she could take half if she wanted.>>60998997Maybe if we see another 50% discount. I'd feel horrible buying the top or dca-ing the top to the bear market when I could have just dca'd in a bear market to begin with if I were a little more patient. Seems we're around max risk. I only want to buy in max opportunity give or take.
>>60999083The 2k after taxes is from disability. I said the army gave me PTSD and tinitus
>>60998571Why don’t you go somewhere where there are women snd start dating, partying, hooking up ect.? I live in a big city and it’s nice because here are most of the hot women. Indeed fuck retiring early, what would you even do? Just masturbate all day while your brain rots because you aren’t using it?
>>60998972>>60998351Yeah I mean that is the bottom line. Avoiding Jewish trickery should be the highest priority. Not falling into debt or getting out of debt is rapidly the easiest way to feel better and be more secure.Should you stop working immediately once you have enough money you calculate you can indefinitely live in a shack in North Dakota without working? Probably not. But knowing that you could, knowing you have money for whatever unexpected financial emergency makes life a lot nicer.The other important thing is that while cutting expenses and being super frugal won't make you RICH, spending fuckloads will make you poor, or at least keep you from making it. Until you get into crazy escape velocity money, plenty of "normal" shit is enough to keep you down. Buy a Land Rover, a Gwagon every three years, get a nice but not crazy house and the cost is fucking massive. If you're sitting on $50M, ok, but if you're asset poor and bringing in $400k a year it's easy to see that shit getting eaten up.
>>60998351You won't really feel the results of compounding until it doubles a few times. So if you're stacking in SP500 and want an 6~8x, for example, you're looking at a time horizon of 20~25 years. For some, that's half their working life. Some will never be able to retire at all. FIRE is not a get rich quick scheme. It a get rich safely in a moderate amount of time scheme. You should have understood this coming in.The three levers in your investing returns is capital, time, and rate of return. If you want to shorten time, and you've maxed out how much capital you can put in, then your only option is to increase returns. That means taking on more risk, and being more active in your investing.However, there is another way to look at this. Once your investment returns outpace your annual investment capital by a factor 3, you can stop investing and add only 2 or 3 more years to your retirement timetable. In other words, you can stop being frugal sooner than you think. So decide what's important to you, and bust out a compound calculator.
>>60998351Actual retirement is pretty fun tbdesu, I wouldn't worry about being bored if you're the kind of person with enough of a personality to make it to 4chan. You can always go back to working if you really are bored, or take a job as a bartender to have something to do... Keep saving brother
>>60999110Yes, I earn around 300-400k USD a year (from my own company)However I still refuse to fall for Jewish tricks, almost out of spite. Having that mindset in the supermarket helps to, so u dont' buy stupid unhealthy crap. It's amazing how easy it is to avoid issues if you simply repeat that one line in your head. kek
>>60998351Moving out of your van that you plug into the chuch every night for free electricity might help you actually get a woman OP.
>>60999247kek
>>60999106>Why don’t you go somewhere where there are women snd start dating, partying, hooking up ect.?Already did that for a while and only remember a handful of girls without thinking too hard on it. My favorites by far were the 18-19 year olds, hence the sugar daddy Q. I just used dating apps but I'm sure throwing money around would cut out a bunch of BS and keep it more exclusive to sex while leaving me alone to my hobbies. Dating normally works too but then you have to be mr. perfect, no icks, tons of texting, listening to work/family/friends drama, going to lame events etc boring stuff.>>60999166I wouldn't go back to work if I was rich. I meant my job is chill enough to cover the bills and even though I work from home and don't need to do anything most the time, I still work on stuff like music, which nets me a bit of money off royalties. Even the work from my job itself is satisfying enough. It's not quite play, but it's not painful. My question is more whether the work to retire early (stressing over investments and whether you mix-maxxed correctly, being ultra frugal) is worth it after having a few years of an emergency fund and a good job.
>>60998663150-200 isn’t enough to start relaxing. 500k minimum preferably 1M
>>60998351It's what you make of it. A lot of folks will never be able to retire early and convincing yourself that not having to grind everyday is tots boring is a very reasonable cope.My dumb advice is to still save your money even if you don't want to retire early.It's not generally incompatible with "enjoying your remaining youth to the fullest", unless that's code for hookers and blow in exotic locales.pic related, it's me. except I'm older. and I'd hate myself even more if I was a monkey dancing in front of a camera.
>>60998351Yes it's a meme. But so is spending money.I am close to a fire number and kind of fucked up by going cash. It nets me $2k month but spy is doing 3 times that.So instead of a safety net I have choice paralysis that I'm going to lose it.
>>60998477Hey, I rebutted this last time!
>>60998351>is FIRE a meme?It depends. You have people on extremes. They panic that theyre not saving, so they aggressively start saving, they like when number go up, and think they can get more. It will never be enough. They wont recognize the sacrifice they put in, and will never spend a dime. Literally a carrot on a stick. People need balance and enjoyment. Having an investment port that spits back dividends and interest is nice but I found much more enjoyment when I paid off my house, stress was more eliminated with that than some tenets preached in FIRE. My port exploded in value as well since i can put 100% of my pay in it, and live off the dividends. I have to of course account for fixed costs like property taxes, food, maintenance and utilities, school, etc. but its easier to do without a mortgage. Get your expenses under control, save for a house, pay off the house, build savings from there. Its out of order for a lot of people. They think the port will save them, but you should focus on cutting expenses including your house. Then youre slightly more free to do what you want. Ironically when I became financially independent, my salary went from 200k as a comp to a partner at a firm making 400k base and 175-650k bonus through the years. Knowing that you have the ability to walk away is nice, and weirdly enough I enjoy work knowing I have this security. I think people hate their jobs because of those looming threats, so thats why I say its important to not focus on the port. Good luck friend.
>>60998477>Started making 80k pre-tax and now 120k pre-tax. Saving half after tax is around 30-40k, so I've just got around 150-200k from throwing it to index funds.Even in FIRE communities, a 50% savings rate means you still have to work 17 years. It's good, but you're still working into late 30s probably, way better than normies that retire at 65+ but 17 years is still a long ass time in the wage cage.Compounding is nice though, you probably don't see it too much yet, but it'll grow even faster as gains compound into more gains. I didn't really feel it until I hit mid 6figs, seeing my portfolio grow this past year faster than my salary was eye opening, makes me hopeful that I can actually leave my job one day and work on my own things without worrying about it being profitable.
>>60998351Not a memeThe reality is, unless you believe we're headed towards some AI utopian future, where work is something we do for fun and products are free, the number of people who will EVER be able to retire is going to fall with every age groupEvery senior citizen you see at Walmart or home Depot will never be retired, that ship has sailed for themMaybe 50-60% of people born during the 80s will ever retireMaybe 30-40% of people born during the 00's will ever retire So even if your FIRE becomes RALE (retire a little early), you're still way ahead of most people
>>60998351Get your money out of the market now, it's about to crater
My dad is 72, definitely had some financial setbacks imposed on him like divorce, but also continually made financial decisions that prioritized short term survival over long term resultsWell, the result now is he's in his 70s, talking about wanting to retire, but simply doesn't have a way to ever make that happenHe's actually much closer to financial ruin, one significant health issue could make his situation unthinkably difficultI watched this all unfold in my life, and it wasn't really until I was 30 that I figured out how to make a career work, and it wasn't until 40 that I really figured out how compounding wealth works, despite easily understanding the concept in my teenage yearsTrust me, it's different when you live it
>>60998929Retard
Happiness isn't real, but distracting yourself with pleasantries until you die is. Remember that white boy.
Would you rather have 2m at 30 or 50m at 50?
>>61000620Math-wise I think it makes sense for me to take 50m at 50 and use my current savings to retire today. I have enough to last me 20 years, but not enough to retire comfortably for the rest of my life, so this way I can have a comfy 20 year retirement, draw down my portfolio to 0 right by the time I hit 50, so I'll get a huge windfall and have an even more luxurious retirement that's more than I could have ever saved. Even if it's not inflation adjusted and we have 3% inflation that would only cut its value in half in 20 years, so that's still 25m.While 2m is nothing to scoff at, and it would retire me today, it's only 80k/year at 4% SWR, which is comfortable, but nothing crazy. Even if I fully invested it and kept working, at 8% returns it's only going to be worth like 9m in 20 years when I turn 50.This is all assuming we don't get crazy hyperinflation and there's no tricks where the person offering you 50m disappears. In the real world I'd probably take the 2m today just to lock it in and enjoy retirement comfy.
>>61000613I’m just glad I wasn’t born a nigger, you couldn’t pay me millions to be black
>>61000467This meme table doesnt make sense, because you can fuck off after stacking money to lcol area.
>>60998997>How are you buying 'Bitcoin' in a roth ira?NTA but many roth IRAs offer crypto ETFs like IBIT which are effectively the same thing as spot but with a fee/underperformance every year through the expense ratio.
>>61000382Within 100000 years there is very little difference between those two pics
>>60998663>at what point it makes sense to keep savingYou should keep saving until you retire. Even if you're a normalfag and retire at 62, you've still likely got another 25 years which is a lot of compounding time.That said, I wouldn't keep living like a monk, your annual income should be high enough now that you can still save wads of cash and spare 10% for improving your quality of life. You don't want to retire with millions but have no idea how to enjoy it responsibly because you've always lived as a monk.
>>60998942>it wouldn’t really make sense to change Roth rulesIt would if Congress decides there's no point continuing the charade any longer and they're going after all that sweet Roth money.>inb4 but whyPeter Theil (Paypal, Facebook, Palantir) has something like $25B - that's billion with a capital "B" - in his Roth account.
>36>200k net>90% ETF>10% BTCHave been saving for 6 years now and now with that amount want to start easing off a bit. Am I gonna make it?
>>60998351I dont think its a meme.It takes a long time and lucky situation to FIRE, coast FIRE (i.e. save enough so that you can quit your high stress high salary job for something a bit easier but let your stack compound.)I started my company job at 25 after finishing my MS, i'm now 28 3 years later and by end of year ill have about 315k.My per year savings has risen to about 120-130k. If S&P continues to go up 10% ill end up with close to 470k at next years end in 2026 at 29 and 630k or something like that at the end of 2027 at 30. If S&P goes nuts and does 14-15% ill have close to 700k by 30. Assuming I dont get fired from my job or something.I say all this to say, ok can I retire at 30 off that and never work again? No. But I can certainly ease up or do a career change into something easy. I was faced with a choice at 25, go into a funded PhD program with a grant in a research topic and group that I love, try to become a big wig scientist researcher type but only get 30-50k / year for 5 years, or go the route of 6 figure job. I went with the 6 figure job since i wanted money, women, focus on lifting weights etc. I lose interest in it as time goes on, but thats because day to day corporate job shit withers away my passion/soul/intellect. But fuck it, the choice to make to walk away and still be able to retire a multi millionaire in a couple years, is close to being mine due to the whole saving and investing thing. Take the low pay for the PhD for 4-5 years and then even in the worst case try to find some chill 70-80k job to spend the rest of my days on. Choices/Options like that, to give up the grind early and actually follow your heart even if you "still have to work" is a intermediate position between full FIRE and goy cattle wage caging forever. If I find a women by 30 though, I may stick it out until 32-33 and try to get the full million though.
>>60998477Op picrel>In the top pic being taken care of by white nurses that treat you like a human, bottom pick being abused by niggers
>>61001892*But fuck it, the choice to make to walk away in a couple years, and still be able to retire a multi millionaire at 65, is close to being mine to make due to the whole saving and investing thing.
>>61001892Coast FIRE is also based because you're much more likely to accomplish Coast FIRE before marriage than full FIRE. And if you're state lets you protect premarital assets and its divvies/growth from becoming communal property post marriage, you can protect your whole coast FIRE stack from being a divorce rate target.
>>61001914Coast FIRE is gay as fuck.
>>60998477NEVER undervalue your health... it is worth more than wealth
>>61001892>chill 70-80k job to spend the rest of my days onI am here now... 61 years old$1.5 million in a Roth IRA... 3-5 more years, one more doubling, and I am done working forever.
>index fundsIf I had yolo'd all my money into MSTU and then into KTA I would be free....
>>61001892>>61001914I've never understood the Coast FIRE idea, going from a high paying job to a lower paying one just sounds awful. Like I hear people going to coast as a part timer waiter/waitress, fastfood, or retail, and it's like wtf? Those kind of low paying job has always sucked way more than my higher paying ones.Like then you have to deal with clocking in, standing on your feet all day, dealing with shittier coworkers and customers, for a fraction of the wage. Even if it's only a few days a week, those are days of more suck. All my higher paying jobs don't care if I come in 15-30 minutes late since I can just work 15-30 minutes later at night, or work from home. I'd rather stick out a stressful high paying job for a few years rather than resign myself to that kind of work for 5-10 years.That said, I do intend to work on my own business once I FIRE, but there's no guarantee of profit, so in a way I could understood trying to do it as Coast Fire, since you'd get more fulfillment out of a business of your own choice and you get to do it earlier. I'd rather not be reliant on it being successful for retirement though. If it fails trying to enter the workforce in another 5-10 years is going to be an even bigger nightmare than it already is.
>>60999290Funny, 18-19 yos felt boring to me. No personality due to inexperience in life.
>>60998817Most retards have no comprehension of this. You are born poor and will most likely stay poor. Your family's lineage is destined to be poor, as they were since the beginning of time. It is up to you anon to change the course of your family's bloodline. This is how wealth and power are generated. Each succeeding generations' wealth compounds over the decades.
>>61002690That's what I like. They're really optimistic about the future and easily excited about anything you show them, like if you take them to a music festival or a little road trip etc. They're just so excited. Older chicks have already been there, done that, so they expect a lot more spent on them. Dating younger chicks is just the secret to feeling that young spark again. Look at Bill Belichick. He's the happiest I've seen him since dating that young chick compared to all those years with his previous age appropriate wife. I've seen it with a ton of guys. It's like you're the age of the chick you're dating.
>>61002680>I've never understood the Coast FIRE idea, going from a high paying job to a lower paying one just sounds awful.The idea is to go to a job that pays less, but is more spiritually rewarding, you enjoy doing, or offers conveniences your former job does not provide. Becoming a freelance artist, clerking at a marijuana shop, bartending at a beach front resort in a developing country are the kinds of things I see people fantasize about.In reality, most people simply underestimate the amount of work and time those jobs also require.For people thinking about FIRE, it's really best to think in terms of time saved, rather than labor avoided.
>>61002507What advice would u give to a 27 yr old with 2 million? all liquid, like 300k reserved in pension locked away though
>>60998997>why would you buy a bitcoin etf instead of buying actual btcThere is a small but not negligible chance of governments directly robbing you of your self-custodied bitcoin. In fact, isn't this administration building a reserve out of confiscations? Presumably, it should be a bit harder to rob Fidelity or Proshares.You'll also have to formulate a plan for your family to have access to your coins should something happen to you. That invariably creates a weakness to the perceived security of self custody, and turns your family into potential targets. Do you trust anyone in your family to be as well-versed in crypto security as you are?Not that I'm promoting crypto or etfs, just seeing subjective tradeoffs.
>>60998351what else can you do as a wagie? I have at least another 10 years to go and thats as long as nothing goes wrong. as depressing as it is at least you have a finish line, a clear goal you can work towards to in a reasonsable time frame. most people dont have that, they need to work until they die like literally. this "goal" of is what gets me out of bed dunno how regular people do it.
>>60998351It's not a meme, but there's a blurry line between FIRE and normal saving for retirement. The difference is usually whether someone is making a six-figure salary.
>>60998351>index fundsLow testosterone version of a 3x index ETF.
>>61003231how's a 3x index ETF compare to simply buying BTC? I only did that because I don't want to go crazy like most of /biz/ and end up fucking up.
>>60998351Love a good FIRE conversation and seems like most of the anons here have a good grasp on it. Income is a good portion of it and it needs to be a balance of saving for your future while enjoying the present. It's a lifelong financial strategy, not a get-quick-rich scheme.>24>spent most of life working wagie jobs despite degree>Cashier, stocker, secretary>Feelsgoodman.jpeg when I have $2,500 in my account>Annual income ~22,000 (rural midwest fag)Joined the military as an officer at 25>Within four years. six-figure salary post-tax>Twoi years in get exposed to FIRE, start maxing out retirement account (23.5k annual limit), DCA'ing into crypto and stocks, buy real estate>Living trendy, happy, fun life in hype city + location>NormieBegoneReeeeeee.gif> 1 Deployment, continue to stack bonuses> 29, four years later, net worth 150k and projected to easily riseBy 20 year retirement at ~45, between equity, investments, VA disability, pension plan, investments, real estate... on track to have 2-3 million short of a cataclysmic event. Easily clearing 6-figure income never working againI plan to just travel and fuck off to some other country, enjoying the next 20-30 years of life. It's not a perfect plan, 16 years of mil life ahead of me, but all-in-all it's pretty fucking comfy desu and the most assured plan I've got so far.
It's extreme cope. I lived the good life in my 20s so now I feel like well whatever I already won. Medical issues can creep up on you even if you try and live active and healthy. BRO just don't do anything fun for an entire ten years during your 20s and at 55 instead of 65 you can retire. Yeah great I get to be old and slightly richer with a slightly better car in a nation of now foreigners. Not to mention the rug pulls that will happen to all of us in the future. Yeah I'm glad I got my cheap sports car in my 20s when it mattered because now I physically can't even sit in a bucket seat. I'm glad I could travel because Europe went to shit. Fun things aren't even fun anymore when you get older. You want to be an old man in a club? Videogames lose their charm and seem juvenile. Women lose their lustre. Not saying do outright dumb stuff but fire types seem mentally ill and their frugality is actually disgusting... Imagine inviting a cunt out for a beer and he won't drink one because wah saving money
Retiring at 55 instead of 65 will sound pretty damn good when you're 50 like me.You'll be 50 one day, no ifs or buts about it. But you get to influence what your finances will look like.
>>61004290>You'll be 50 one day, no ifs or buts about it.but what if i die before then?
>>61004290how is your sex drive at 50? do you still have the urge to fuck barely legal teens at your age? does your dick still rock hard?
>>61001892Holy shit, you are me. I would have done a PhD (am a huge nerd) but I wasn't dumb enough to take on that opportunity cost and be a poorfag. When I makeit (soon) I will probably unironically go back to school for fun.t. 2M networth at 35
>>61004207There's a balance to be struck which is why you need to focus on growing your income roo rather than just saving money. For that reason I think leanFIRE is a cope for unambitious or even just incapable poorfags for example. FIRE in general can also just be a rationalization for workaholics, but in the end some people just value wealth accumulation more than doing normie things.
From a mathematical POV, it worked.I saved about 50% of my income for about 15 years, and with ups and downs, I am on track to reach my FIRE number in a couple more. I shoot for 3,25% given the current high CAPE.The catch is you need a good income and good saving rate. A few cheap hobbies and pleasures can be included, but not sports cars, a party lifestyle, and a big family is also difficult.But if you are in this situation, I think it's the best way to plan the future.As usual, past performance is no guarantee of future results.
>>60998351Its not just indexes little goiym You need to be stacking quality divvies for cash flow
Also bitfuck is dead150k-200k is the realistic cap for at least 5 years unless the dollar does more massive dumping. The days of 10xing on bitcoin are over. Boomer indexes with compounding have been and will continue to outperform crypto now that the kikes are in control of (((defi)))
>>61004423Still there. 20 year old hotties will never stop looking good to you but having to listen to cringe teenager takes gets to be a real problemDick still works fine, it's usually the live for the day dudes that have the most problems as they age. Don't need to go full on /fit but if you go easy on the booze, stay off drugs and dont get fat you will probably be ok
>>61003236Leveraged ETF over Bitcoin because it's possible that Bitcoin can stagnate for five years. Bitcoin already had stretches where it stagnated for 2-3 years. If we stretch it lightly for the current cycle or a future cycle 5yrs is very possible. Whereas it's not possible for the stock market to remain flat for five years straight. Even if the endpoints are actually roughly the same, like during the 2000s lost decade, there will be stretches inside that period where it it's a bull market, and you profit with 3x ETFs during these. It doesn't matter what the book value of the overall index is between two arbitrary dates.
>>61002860>What advice would u give to a 27 yr old with 2 million?You are young... take chances!Put it all in Tesla... Robotaxi, Optimus robot, Electric vehicles, Utility BatteriesPriorities:1 Health , in the end nothing else matters2 Family , find a woman who is NOT crazy and wants YOUR children3 Wealth , always become richer4 Friends , if you want good friends then you need to be a good friendModeration in life:drinking, drugs, sex, partying... you CAN do it all, just in moderation
>>61004756>laughs in NIKKEI
>>61005031Thank you anon good advice on the lifestyle I've been taking all those seriously past 2 year, quit all drinking I dont' even drink soda anymore, never smoked ect. I feel 10x better after I stopped drinking the goyslop (soda)I'm not so sure about putting it all in Tesla my balls aren't big enough for that kek
>>61005184>my balls aren't big enough for thatUnderstood... do it with only $1 million then.There is a very good chance the upside on Tesla is 3X-10X in five years.
All of this is just a cope for a bad upbringing and a lack of good values instilled into you by attentive parents. Psychologically healthy people spend enough on their own pleasure such as not to make life miserable while also saving enough money for themselves and their families' futures.All this funny terminology does is just muddy the waters and widen the divide between the portions of society that follow both extremes, as the amount of people who attempt to maintain a balance between business and pleasure continually dwindles even lower.
>>61002709Yep
>>61004536Ah your make it number is very big. But i do suppose it has to be atleast 2.5M for full FIRE. Can you briefly describe your income/savings/investment returns over the years? I ask because my best case scenario assuming 11.4% returns per year and saving 130k per year for the next 7 years put me at 2M at 35 as well. Obviously its all theoretical but still cool to see how much our trajectories line up.Do you have concerns/fears of going back to do the PhD at 36-38, and pretty much face the issue of potentially not being done until early 40s? I suppose its a matter of if you would intend to use the PhD or not. Also, do you know what topics you'd like to work on if you were to go back to do one? For me its computer networking for scientific computing.My day job is SWE at one of the prop trading firms, so my skills I developed in my MS about systems programming/networking topics helped me get picked up by one of the prop shops in my city with 0 job search/0 interviewing stress, and compared to other kids grinding leet code and struggling to get good paying jobs I would've been a fool to not go through with it.
>>61004560I don't know if its fair to label all the lean FIRE people as unambitious/lazy poor fag types. OG fire was really about true minimalism and getting away from corporate soul suck. I really empathize that for some people the spiritual bludgeoning they experience via years of corporate waging can be so bad that they'd rather call it quits early with a smaller stack and live out of a van forever. I do concede the point that their tolerance for pain/suffering for a better future is lower than the folks who can withstand it for longer, so they are "weaker" as individuals in that regard.
>>61004755What does live for the day mean?
>>61005184He said you should drink and party in moderation, not become a muslim.
>>61005506People that don’t think about the long term. The grasshopper versus the ant. Then one day you’re middle-aged without a decent job or career prospects, unhealthy, no savings, no nothing.
>>60998351not a meme, just difficult. you also have to make some money, if you're not pulling in 100k+ it's difficult to get to a reasonable savings rate. ive been on the fire path for over a decade now, on track to retire at 40, I've been saving 35-85% all those year, 85 was a fluke with stock options though, mostly in the 50 range. Alternatively I could never save another dime and have a very nice retirement at 55 instead.If you save 25% it's 33 years, if you bump that to 50 it's 17, that's half the time for some minor sacrifice. protip: get a wifey that makes around what you do.
>>61004756Isn't btc projected to increase 50% per year on average? index funds are 10% so a triple leverage would be just 30% thus bitcoin wins long term, say in a 10 year span
>>60998896Yes goyim, pay your management fees like a good boy
>>61005476As poorfag living out of a van is the best gaming theory. >work for too long, the likelihood increases of certain death
>>60998351What exactly is wrong with driving a 6 year old Corolla and buying bulk groceries? This post is extremely semitic.
>>61005582Ok, Satan.
>>61005515Yeah, it is true you should think about you health, such as not being overweight, when you get older.
>>61005476There's a million jobs you can do that aren't corporate waging. Let's not pretend that modern your people want to FIRE for any other reason than spending all their time in front of screens.
>>61005626Corporate wage 9/5 > other shit. Lets be honest.
>>61005582ETFs worth their salt have fees below 0.25 percent. Ones such as VOO are 0.02 percent. That is a great deal, learn math.
>>61005671People here who suggest trades/labor are genuinely retarded. These jobs suck. You think it’s bad working in an air-conditioned office responding to some emails and drafting memos? Try digging a ditch in 100f heat. It’s as though they want to spread their misery.
>>61005871Or working in retail or a restaurant, slaving for a small business owner/exploiter. Take the comfy union job everyday over that bullshit.
>>60998351>Is FIRE a memeAlways was. The point is to accumulate productive capital, not just make number go up.>>61005583>As poorfag living out of a van is the best gaming theoryThis, and you can still collect enough to buy land.Then you buy prefab steel buildings and build your first warehouse. Wholesale trading, direct to consumer adverts and ecommerce work also.
>>61005871I mean things like healthcare, charity ect, hell even politics.
what the fuck is FIRE
>>61006428Wagie cope
>>61005451I'm a robotics engineer who started out 10 years ago, working at both boomer companies and tech startups, started at 80k and up to 200k salary now, not incuding equity or bonuses. Originally I was too conservative and just maxed my 401k and bought index funds, but since 2020 I've had a heavy crypto position which had increased my volatility significantly but IMO worth the returns. I also am undercounting my networth since I did not include my startup equity. If you want advice, I would say that risk (and risk management) is your friend. As for what I would study, probably math or physics desu. I don't need the PhD for a career, least of all in academia, I'm just eternally obsessed with learning esoteric things like that. Maybe I could spin off my learning/research into a quant business though.
>>61000449>when I became financially independent, my salary went from 200k as a comp to a partner at a firm making 400k base and 175-650k bonus through the years.>Just buy a house and pay it off bro, it's easy!LOL
