Aaaaaand, FOR THE LOVE OF GOD JUST PUT HER AND PRIME TIME AND LET HE FIX HERAT LEAST CLARK CAN DEAL WITH RETARDED EDITORIALS!and what anon leaked a while ago turned out to be half true
>>150181202whats with this guy
>>150181694You know why with that face
>Sir, a sixth Gwen Stacy has been added to Marvel 616
>>150181299Chudjak?
>>150181311>I can't write well and it's your faultUh-huhI know it's probably supposed to be tongue-in-cheek meta heeheehaahaa type stuff, but it just falls flat.
>>150181750Holy shit
>>150181299>>150181304>>150181311Cavan... Buddy... This ain't Animal Man and you're no Grant Morrison...This whole mini has had this vibe of "FUCKING FANGIRLS SHOULD KEEP THEIR COOTIES OUT OF MY SANDBOX" and this just seals it...
>>150181843The only people that like this character are fangirls and braindead gooners so is he really wrong for spelling it out for them?
>>150181873you CANNOT leave out the polish child rapists out of this conversation
That's it? Nothing happened. They didn't even give us a reason to care for Gwenpool #2What a waste of time
>>150182093That you expected more means you really had too much hope in Marvel, anon
I was expecting it to be bad and it turned out even worse. What an absolute waste of time.
If this doesn't spell out that Marvel Editorial cares more about ragebait than catering to their characters' fanbases, then I don't know what does...
>haha you wasted your money and timeUh...?
>>150181311This doesn't feel like an attempt at tongue in cheek meta commentary on Gwen's place in marvel, this feels like the writer legitimately hates Gwen Poole the fuck? This was allowed?
Well that was pointless
Gwenpool not written by Chris Hastings was a mistake
Why didn't Future Gwen tell her how fucking awful the September 2025 issue was gonna be?
>>150182588There are many different futures.
>>150181636Don't worry anon, when we inevitably get Secret Crisis they'll get a one-shot together and it'll be so godawful that both characters will be retired permanently afterward.God willing.
>>150182917>shitting on prime timewe found the newfag
>>150181304>>150181311>>150181327>>150181322Fucking yikes. I initially started this series with a no expectations, started to think maybe it wouldn't be too bad, but this, wow. This is a trainwreck caused by unchecked ego.
Another mini that won't be added to the recommended reading list. It's impressive how Marvel continues to release nothing but dogshit.
>>150183512Is the joke supposed to be that this guy is a fucking hack and all of his so called 'brilliant ideas' are fucking garbage rehashes of someone else's better work? Because it seems obvious, and yet Gwen doesn't call him on it.
Marvel really celebrated Gwen's 10th anniversary by releasing a comic shitting on her as a character?
>>150184250Would you expect anything less from modern Marvel?Seriously, what was the last marvel run you can remember that wasn't just a cynical exercise in brand management?
Thanks for the storytime OPI didn't expect the Architect of being the writer himself, but that's because I was expecting something more clever. The writer making himself the final boss reeks of Morrison envy and while the concept can be done with Gwen it's hacky in execution here. I dare to offer Scott the benefit of the doubt and assume he does not actually hate Gwenpool IRL and is playing up the vitriol here for drama, and I appreciate the self-awareness in having Gwen point out all his questionable, dumb decisions. But like Gwenpool Strikes Back: being aware you are writing a bad story does not EXCUSE you from writing a bad story. There are moments his calling out Gwen have some emotional weight - when he calls Gwen a joke and she cries because she actually does care about being seen that way, those panels I actually like for her character - but it's undercut by her only acting this way because he chose to write her that way, he's calling her out for problems he himself is responsible for.Everything remotely interesting Gwen's called out for has already been done in Unbelievable, when it made more sense in the earlier stages of her arc, and were done better in general. Again, I believe the writer doesn't actually hate Gwen as much as his avatar, but the criticisms are weak when Gwen's OP powers have been shown to have plenty of limits (and if they didn't a clever writer could still make use of OP powers) and Gwen herself has absolutely taken things seriously and cared about others before, that was the crux of her original arc. Even LU, as awful as it was, had moments where Gwen realized she was using people and that was wrong despite their being comic book characters. The problems Scott brings up aren't inaccurate to Gwen but they're problems already explored in earlier, better books and everything Gwen does wrong that he calls her out for in this are only problems because he turns her tard-memey humor up to 11 just like every other writer since Hastings does.
>>150184746Also a pleasant surprise Stacypool is sticking around. It would have been easy to just kill her off since any significance she had died with her turning out not to be the real Gwen Stacy but it would undercut the theme of not taking anything seriously even more if they were to dump her. I like Gwen giving her that speech at the end about being a blank slate means she has potential and how people love a story, it's really spot-on for Gwen's character is helping someone who feels like nobody feel like somebody, and I'm interested in seeing what Stacypool might do in the future with Gwen now. It's just sadly undercut by Gwen's insistence she take things more seriously too when, again, the only reason she wasn't is because she was literally forced not to by someone who didn't want to write her that way when she's taken things plenty serious beforeOverall I think Gwenpool 2025 is still a slight step up for Gwen. Cavan Scott writing himself in and shitting on her is a stupid note to end on but being aware of his poor writing, letting Gwen call himself out on it and giving her a cool moment in helping Clone Stacy softens the blow, and though poorly done I like the emotion of Gwen not wanting to be just a joke. The way Scott accuses her feels like what most people think of Gwen at first without realizing how much more there is. But promising to take things seriously feels disingenuous when it's not her fault that she isn't already in this. Whereas GSB starts poorly and ends on a high note, and LU started fairly good and got worse and worse until a disastrous ending, 2025 feels like it was just 'decent' throughout, ending better than LU but not as good as GSB. Which in my opinion does make it one notch over her last run at least, specially since this doesn't end with anything as drastic as the mutant retcon or the asexual thing. It ends with giving Gwen something kinda neat in another Gwen to hang out with and nothing worse than a mid comic to just move on from
>>150182588She wanted to spare her the heartache, better to just let her find out on her own
>>150184804X-31 is going to go the way of the Metahumes.
This honestly wasn't as bad as expected. Still pretty bad, but I expected worse.
>>150184922This for me. I was fearful of the leaks that Gwen was going to possess Gwen Stacy's body and get regen, making her both closer to Gwen Stacy and Deadpool in some bizarre attempt to appease people confused that she isn't closely related to either. The writer was bad, the ending was bad, but it has a few nice notes throughout and it doesn't fundamentally alter her character like her other minis have.
>>150181327>Must be hard for you, Scott.>At least people LIKE jokes!
>>150181368>Gwen actually takes this loser's criticism seriouslyI can't tell how many layers of irony this dude is on, but not having Gwen dropkick this asshole into the gutterspace tells me the writer might actually mean all that shit. Can we not get a writer who actually likes Gwenpool? I'LL fucking do it.
>>150181202See you all in 3 years when The House of Ideas shits out another mediocre Gwenpoo story that is not THAT bad but still sucks in comparison to her OG run. Christ, she and Kamala should hang around since none of them have been able to get a run thats better than their respective debuts
Gwenpool vs The Writer was always a pretty obvious direction to take the character and could definitely have worked if the writer was actually good. This seems to be a case of the writer writing something bad on purpose, which is a difficult thing to pull off and most writers who attempt it greatly overestimate their ability to do it. This writer has his self-insert philosophize upon stakes but there would have been genuinely greater stakes in a straightforward story about Gwen trying to sequence break out of a hostile writer's story.
>>150185712I want a story where Gwenpoole is working WITH her writer, but AGAINST editorial, because the writer is being forced to include a bunch of stuff he knows is bad and against the character but if he doesn't he will lose his job. So he and Gwenpoole are at odds, but trying to find a way out of this mess together.
>>150181396This book ends with 2 Gwens and no good development for the character.
the fuck was the point of all that? that was nothing. this whole comic was a waste of time
>>150185712I agree with the idea that Gwen having to fight her own writer is a concept that could work in general for her stories, I've seen some suggestions of anons in previous threads that had some good ideas for it.This sadly isn't one of them, like you said it's the writer only being a problem because he's making something bad on purpose and then trying to 'develop' Gwen by making her OOC to begin with>Gwen trying to sequence break out of a hostile writer's story.This is one thing I was thinking was the idea might work better if the guy had just leaned fully into the 'hatred' for Gwen, like the story going out of its way to hurt her and her friends to the point where the only way Gwen can save them is by fighting her own spite-filled writer
>>150185712I think I have the opposite opinion. Unbelievable Gwenpool, IIRC, never* talked to directly to the author or the audience. I think that's a very deliberate writing restraint that gave the fourth wall breaking important flavor. It cut out many token 4th wall breaker moments like "xD now draw me fighting an epic dinosaur, rawr!!" and "xD Chat ur so cringe don't watch me change, pervs~", which later versions of her would pull off to the character's detriment. By never *directly* acknowledging the presence of author and audience, I think we got a flavor of 4th wall breaker that still feels very "contained in-universe", which I think made Gwen feel more genuine and less... post-modern? Post-ironic? "Everything's one big joke and nothing matters because writers can do whatever"? Maybe I'm wrong. But I feel like Unbelievable deliberately showed restraint there. I'd be very cautious of any writer attempting to pull those things off.*except for catchup pages
>>150186118No you're completely right on the money. One of the thing that irks me to no fucking end in modern Gwen stories is the writer has her talk directly to the audience non-fucking-stop when she never did that at all in Unbelievable (again, with the exception of catch-up pages). You hit the nail on the head in that it made Gwen feel more like an actual character, like she really was a 'real' girl interacting with 616 and while she eventually learned to see the panels she never saw the audience. Having Gwen speak directly to the reader makes her feel like she's on a perpetual reality show or something, it encourages her being a try-hard memer that's never worked for her and just makes her closer to other 4th wall breakers like Wade or She-Hulk rather than keeping her feeling unique.That was actually one thing I appreciated throughout this run was it finally pumped the breaks on Gwen speaking to her audience directly so much, IIRC Gwen doesn't do it even once in this mini.
>>150181384Honestly? If they got this Gwen back with Peter I'd take it. Would still like him with MJ, but I'd take it.
>Gwen Stacy (Spider-Gwen)>Gwen Poole (Gwenpool)>Gwen Stacy (Gwenpool)Now we just need Gwen Poole (Spider-Gwen)
what kind of stupid fucking last name is 'poole' anyways
>>150186424Apparently exactly what it sounds like: English, references a body of water. As an aside, Mortimer basically means "Deadpool".
>>150186330It's weird to be kind of excited at the prospect of her appearing again, I was prepared for her to disappear by the end of this run. Curious what they could do to make her stand out from the original Stacy going forward
>>150186639She'll be as relevant as Gwen Warren.
>>150186118Is that Gwen with 2003 movie Bullseye? Wut?
>>150186806AU idea where instead of being trained by Batroc she gets picked up by Bullseye
>gwenpool meets her writerTracy Scops did it better.
>>150181396Christ this might actually be the worst comic Marvel has published since Mutant First Strike
>>150187381>a porn artist did a better job at writing gwenpool then an actual writer from marveljust give the writing job for gwenpool to her marvel, clearly you don't know what your doing.
>>150181396i hope this writer dies in a house fire. fucking hack piece of shit. this is the reason why people shit on comics so much, cause of these dickweeds.
>>150181210Bump
>>150186118I also think that Gwen not talking to her audience fits in directly with her characterization as a shut-in NEET failure. She escaped to the marvel universe BECAUSE she didn't want anything to do with the real world. She'll only speak to us directly if she absolutely has to.
>>150181396>For now
>>150188418kek, that's actually a fitting angle I hadn't considered that before. Gwen despises boring IRL so her being adverse to addressing it on principle is funny
>>150184804Let’s be real, we’re never gonna see this Gwen Stacy again and if we do, it’s just gonna be for Marvel to kill her off like all the others
>>150189131Background gag 10 years from now with another two Gwen clones.
Gwen should have been forced back into her original world at the end of Unbelievable.
>>150183558>there's actual Gwenpool material worth reading past UnbelievableI had no idea, is there really? I miss her.
>>150189366she should have just been cameos at best. her comic's been cancelled, but every once in awhile an artist could be allowed to include her in the background or something and she'd be happy to live for another page. she'd accepted her end in Unbelievable and that'd live on for as long as people read her original run, so just roll with that.finality is not a very Marvel trait, though, I get it.
>>150189507Don't get too excited, the second two in that list are doujinshis and the other items are just short spin-offs written by Hastings (but yes I would say they're worth reading, just warning they're short)
I want to think whatever the fuck the writer was going for got thrown out the window when Spider-Gwen wroter herself into 616 and this is just a crash out.
>>150183558I thought the last 2 were the dogshit stories where she comes out as aromantic asexual.Thank you Anon
Should've had the main in the mask be a puppet of MODOK and end with Gwen wearing Clone-Gwen like a skinsuit.
>>150185762That could be pretty cool. Don't have the writer appear in the story, but he could write notes to Gwen in the gutter space.
>>150183558third doujin never ever
>>150190758that's all good, Unbelievable's end was perfect so I don't want a continuation. just little things will suffice.
>>150189507West Coast Avengers was aight enough. Ironically, it ends on a meta joke and she's *not* the one to deliver it.
>>150191367>Literally turning Gwenpool into Gwen stacyDogshit, you're hired, Anon!
>>150192035WCA was definitely the most decent, it was mostly inoffensive to Gwen outside of a forced romance with Quintin. But it also gave her Jeff so it evens out.For all the faults of this run i would at least say it broke the trend of every Gwen run being worse than the last, it at least passes the low bar that is LU and gives me hope the momentum is swingng upwards again
>>150192035>Ironically, it ends on a meta joke and she's *not* the one to deliver it.what was it?
>>150194342the comic was cancelled despite the writer wanting to continue it. the first issue has Kate interview a bunch of shitty wannabe superheroes (each one just being a walking punchline) to find more people for the team. the comic ends with one of the people she rejected getting the comic cancelled
>>150181734>dead OG gwen>spider-gwen>the better spider-gwen(the literal spider woman)>new clone gwenwho are the other 2?? are you counting gwenpool as one??
>>150181377What I wouldn't give to see Gwen punching out her last few writers too
>>150192035>West Coast Avengers was aight enoughwrong, it was awful
>>150181304>>150181311>>150181322>>150181327>>150181377I think he meant for this to be extremely tongue in cheek because the writer has talked at length online about why he likes Hastings' Gwenpool, and he's already done a bunch of Star Wars shit and the editor was the one who pushed for Peter to be involved, but he just REALLY sucks at conveying that he's trying to goof on stuff and the joke isn't funny.Not defending. Just saying.
>>150185762I think that's what he was trying to do, but while not shitting on his editor and including and justifying and trying to "make work" all the bullshit his editor asked for. Which is stupid and doesn't work.
>THEY LITERALLY JUST KILLED GWENPOOL OFF, THEN BROUGHT HER BACK AS A GHOST, A SHADE OF HER FORMER SELF, AND MADE HER POSESS HER OWN TWISTED AND BUTCHERED DECAYING CORPSEHuh... I am sure there is a symbolism a metaphor or a commentary in there somewhere, but I just can't quite put my finger on it.
>>150196943The core of the story is fine. It's the execution that's the problem.
>>150196955The core of the story was stupid. "I hate Gwenpool so I'll insert myself as the villain and write a stupid and obnoxious story on purpose, see you can't criticize me because it's supposed to be bad."
>>150197245That's very clearly not what the book is about.
>>150197832Explain in your words what it's about then.
>>150196882>the writer has talked at length online about why he likes Hastings' GwenpoolIt's frustrating because there are times I would readily believe it. He makes references to it, bringing up her old crew, and there are moments I think he captures Gwen's outlook like how she actually thinks things like 'continuity' shouldn't get in the way of telling a good story. He refrains from having her talk directly to the reader and I also think the flaws he highlights are fair things to attribute to Gwen. The problem is that I think he's clearly copying Hasting's homework. The things he brings up with Gwen in this issue are all things she's had thrown at her in her introduction arc (Scott calling her a joke feels very reminiscent of Deadpool's 'why you suck' speech) and the idea she doesn't take things seriously enough is silly knowing what she's shown to be capable of. It's also weird to have him comment on her powers being 'too strong' when Hastings made a point of showing while Gwen's panel-hopping powers are versatile they clearly have limits too, and it's a shame because I thought the writer made a very clever use of them in the Fin Fang Foom fight and then pretty much never again for the rest of the run.There's also the dialogue, I don't know how a guy who claims to love the original run could think Gwen (or any actual person) would talk like this. To be fair that's not JUST Gwen in this, I think everyone has sounded off, Kate and Peter as well. So I get the sense maybe he doesn't do dialogue all that well save for rare moments where he dials back the quips and just have people sound like regular fucking people.
>>150196955The interesting parts of it are entirely things the writer accidentally stumbled into and doesn't even recognize.
>>150196882>the editor was the one who pushed for Peter to be involvedEditorial interference strikes again. On one hand I get why you'd want Peter in a story featuring the ''''original'''' Gwen Stacy but then that turned out to be a pointless set-up anyhow.Still weird how despite knowing of Gwen's original friend group he did not have a single one of them show up to her funeral, JUST Kate and Jeff it's insane. I am half convinced there is some mandate issues in using Cecil/Sarah/Tony at this point for some reason
>>150199685It's a hack writer making excuses. Jordan White isn't even a Spider-Man editor, they can't even do anything that affects the spider-titles.
Thank you for the storytime, op. I missed the other four issues, but I don't feel I'll go back to read them. I appreciate your service
>>150196882>the editor was the one who pushed for Peter to be involvedThat's probably the only good decision for this mini. There should be more stories with Gwenpool and Spider-Man since she's apparently the only Marvel "character" that still respects him.
>>150200916One of my favorite ideas for a 'Gwen vs Editorial' idea is her crusading against the One More Day mandate and trying to overturn it so Peter and MJ can finally just living happily fucking ever after in the main universe
>>150201882That sounds like flying too close to the sun.
>>150202212If she's going to be cancelled or mismanaged, might as well be because she tried to do what any fan with "power" would do.
A smart gwen would write herself into a corner.
One thing I feel most disappointed in with this run is just how underutilized the original idea was.Gwenpool vs Gwenpool : the original concept that stood apart from either Deadpool or Gwen Stacy, vs the possibility of what if the idea was played violently straight. You get some jabs between them but in terms of the meta commentary on what Gwen could have easily have turned out to be had they really just mashed Gwen Stacy into a Deadpool shaped hole seems like a huge missed opportunity
>>150181202What are these legs
>>150184250At this point they should have Hastings come back so he can write a conclusive send-off and retire her forever.
>>150204758I knew they would never have the balls to actually resurrect Gwen frfrDon't know why they bothered hyping that up at all
>>150204758I mean, they kinda did>Gwen is cloned again and turned into Deadpool*>Goes to talk to Spider-Man>UhhhhhhhAnd then you run out of shit to write about because the idea is retarded. We got the jackal mentioned, she almost dissolves away like the last gwenzillion clones.
How would Spider-Gwen have reacted to all this?
>>150181299>>150181304>>150181311>>150181322>>150181327>check the writer to see what he's done>Cavan Scott (born 18 April 1973)>(age 52)>he's 50+ and he wrote this
>>150198857Its all too methodical and precise to be accidental. He overcooked it. Tried to hard. Wanted to say too many things instead of exploring a few strong ideas naturally. And he's also just really bad at signposting.>>150198813I agree with that. He gets the source material but stumbled in making his own story. And yeah, the voices are awful here. I dunno what's up with that. He isn't this bad in other comics so idk.>>150198029It's about reconciling what we want vs respect for the material. It's shown in the core ideas through the entire arc. Every act that's chastised, whether it's Gwen or Fake Stacey or even the author stand in, is because it isn't showing respect for what something is. Gwen didn't respect Fake Stacey's drama and got fucked for it. Author rants about what Gwen "should" be for his goals but gets dunked on for it.Problem is the execution is really not good at all.
>>150207454honestly a pretty good interpretation that makes this seem a bit better in retrospect. even the dude's big gripe with gwen was about how she didn't seem to "respect" or take anything seriously, and how he wanted to be respected as well with this story (which he felt people would since it had spider-man), but was annoyed he had to write about gwen because he didn't respect her or acknowledge what she actually represented (only chastising her for being a joke)
>>150186330>marywhorefagepic fail
>>150186330Would be kind of awkward wouldn't it, with this Gwen clone basically being Gwen right after she died and this Peter being like, at least 10 years older since then?
