How do you solve Transformers' Starscream conundrum? Can it be solved?Starscream's most fundamental character trait is that he's a betrayer. From G1 onward, every faithful and honest version of Starscream has spent most of their screentime plotting and scheming to stab Megatron in the back and take over leadership of the Decepticons. There have been attempts to make him different, even make him heroic, but inevitably Hasbro always falls back on the traitorous angle for his main trait.The trouble is that this introduces several storytelling problems. A big one is that, the minute Starscream betrays Megatron for the first time, when Megatron inevitably comes back or recovers the most logical thing for him to do is immediately kill Starscream, or at least drive him from the Decepticons' ranks. If Megatron does not do this he looks like a bumbling oaf and an ineffectual leader, as, well, he was in G1. It lessens his potency as a villain and makes him less impressive as a threat.But if he DOES do this, if Starscream is killed or driven off, then that introduces problems too. The biggest one is this means Starscream can't interact with the rest of the Decepticon cast any more, and valueable runtime in episodes and seasons has to be devoted to showing Starscream off doing his own thing in addition to whatever the Autobots and the rest of the Decepticons are up to. It also means he can't have meaningful plots with some of the other "famous" Decepticons like Soundwave or Shockwave since they'll be sticking with Megatron and the rest.Whatever choice you make with Starscream's character presents storytelling obstacles. How do you fix them? Can they be fixed?
>>150417581Even in G1, starscream was all bark and no bite He only actually overly tried to make a play for power once, only to find no one backed his coup, megs survived the shot, and he was abandoned on an island for his troubles He was only welcomed back after he brought the combaticons back as a peace offering to megs and he doesnst pull another betrayal until the movie In the movie, galvatron nukes starscream for his bad comedyNo keeping around the obvious judas, just dusted him and took control of the decepticons
>>150417581The reason why Megatron doesn't just kill Starscream is for a few reasons.One, better the enemy you know. Starscream is in a position of power where he can get off on his ego/power to keep the ranks in line, while also making him happy between schemes. He's sort of predictable too in some regard. Two, Decepticons hate him more than they hate or fear Megatron. He's a whipping boy, and frankly a good punching bag to strike fear in the lower ranks. Three, believe it or not Megatron is trying to teach Starscream. The Decepticon motto is "strength means you have the right to rule", and Megatron is trying to craft him into what the Decepticon ideal is.
>>150417581I know people don't like the Netflix trilogy but I do loved that. He was loyal there with useful scientific knowledge (he's a scientist after all). This or remove him as a whole. Beast Wars had the best characters anyway.
>>150417581I think Animated handled him the best. It's like they wrapped every neat Starscream staple into a lovely bundle.
>>150417581>The trouble is that this introduces several storytelling problems. A big one is that, the minute Starscream betrays Megatron for the first time, when Megatron inevitably comes back or recovers the most logical thing for him to do is immediately kill Starscream, or at least drive him from the Decepticons' ranks. If Megatron does not do this he looks like a bumbling oaf and an ineffectual leader, as, well, he was in G1. It lessens his potency as a villain and makes him less impressive as a threat.This has already been done to good effect.>But if he DOES do this, if Starscream is killed or driven off, then that introduces problems too. The biggest one is this means Starscream can't interact with the rest of the Decepticon cast any more, and valueable runtime in episodes and seasons has to be devoted to showing Starscream off doing his own thing in addition to whatever the Autobots and the rest of the Decepticons are up to. It also means he can't have meaningful plots with some of the other "famous" Decepticons like Soundwave or Shockwave since they'll be sticking with Megatron and the rest.This has also already been done to good effect.>How do you solve Transformers' Starscream conundrum?Sounds like this can be solved by actually consuming Transformers media. Git gud, OP.
>>150417581I don't see a problem.Starscream plans his betrayal. Fails at the half way or 2/3 point of the show. Makes his own faction creating a 3rd side to the conflict for a time. Finally he dies and the members of his faction go back to Megatron.
>Megatron, Soundwave, and Shockwave in a room>Shockwave: "Lord Megatron, do not take this as an insult, but I must inquire on the logic of keeping a traitor like Starscream around.">Megatron: "You see, Shockwave, the decepticon cause truly values might. What is a leader who does not know combat, tactical ingenuity, and above all knows the best time to strike. I keep him around because he has all of these traits ingrained into his very spark. If I was 2nd in command and thought that I'd be a better leader, I'd assuredly try the same.
>>150417581OP are you calling storytelling a conundrum and asking for ways to fix it or are you trying and failing to identify the fact that you don't enjoy recycled and rebooted and reimagined media and crave something new
just a reminder that Starscream was the one who killed Cliffjumper, in case you forgot
>Megatron desperately tries to train Skywarp and Thundercracker to a point where one of them can lead the Seekers so he doesn't have to deal with Starscream anymore>Thundercracker's too much of a moralfag>Skywarp lacks the initiative to be a leader>But at least neither of them is Starscream
>>150417581personally I'm a fan of how Transformers vs GI Joe did it where Starscream was presented as being loyal until right at the very end where he finally betrayed Megatron, the anticipation from waiting for him to do it made the moment all the sweeter
>>150417581If Megatron is willing to put up with him then he has to be useful for something. Is Starscream worth the trouble?
>>150417581i liked how unicron trilogy, earthspark & skybound did him.but i'll always stand by my headcanon that he was a deep cover autobot. as for why megs would keep him around i just assumed that he was sort of grandfathered into the role of second in command since the seekers are basically the backbone/workhorses of the the decepticon army while the other alternative seekers, skywarp is a retard and thundercracker is one bad war crime away from joining the autobots.
Some future series should do the Shockwave assuming command of the Decepticons story from the Marvel comics, but have Megatron team up with Starscream to regain command. No one can plan duplicitous acts of betrayal like Screamer and he knows he has a way better chance of eventually wresting leadership from Megatron than Shockwave. Also gives them a reason to excuse a future act of betrayal as Megatron 'owing him one'.
>>150417982NTA but I want something new. Doesnt have to be truly new ideas, just actual attempts at different premises
>>150418306I've been tinkering with the idea of Starscream managing to succeed in "killing" Megatron and taking command of the Decepticons as a season finale kind of thing only for next season to have Shockwave show up with the Mayhem Attack Squad lead by Tarn, who takes control the old fashioned way. So there would be this dynamic where Tarn is calling the shots, but Shockwave is secretly manipulating him from behind the scenes in a sort of Gus Fring type of fashion.And now at least some of you are imagining Shockwave voiced by Giancarlo Esposito.
>>150418353Back in the day I did extensive planning for a Transformers series, and my plan was for Starscream to betray Megatron out in deep space in a way that looked like an accident and that he had plausible deniability about.Megatron gets killed in the attempt, but then, a bit like in the original movie, he drifts out into space and is found and resurrected by Unicron, and as Galvatron he basically spends a season being the Silver Surfer to Unicron's Galactus. I'm actually surprised nobody seems to have used Galvatron in that capacity before, to my knowledge, as basically Unicron's herald. Why not, I wonder, when Unicron IS Galactus for all intents and purposes?
>>150417581You could make Starscream into a Jester type of character. Make him the only one that's willing to tell Megs that his plan is stupid, and will fail while pointing out segments that're prone to failure, and if he keeps going this way, he'd be better off leading. None of the other Decepticons like him for speaking so out of line, but Megatron does like having someone that's not just another sycophant to him, and was willing to make him an advisor because of that and his intellect and battle-prowess.If it's only Screamer and Megs, Screamer would be willing to admit that he does have a deep admiration for him, and that most of his plans are actually sound, but still have issues he needs to point out. The admiration is also there when Screamer's alone, but he still has some desires to lead the Decepticons, even if he knows Megs is still the best option.
>>150418578Interesting idea.
>>150417581Megatron thinks he’s autistic and let’s him around due to pity
>>150417581Have him actually succeed, at least for a while, and have him actually be competent as both a schemer and a leader. Make him a real threat, just as dangerous as Megatron but in a different way. They'd have different ultimate goals and different methods of achieving them (if you're familiar with the lore behind Lord of the Rings, think of it like the difference between Morgoth and Sauron. Morgoth was focused on destroying the world and bringing ruin and chaos, Sauron wanted to dominate the world and order it to his will. Obviously it's not a 1:1 comparison as Megatron has goals besides "destroy everything," but I think it still works).Of course Megatron will eventually come back and retake the mantle of leader of the Decepticons. At which point you could either kill off Starscream (by then he will have had plenty of time in the spotlight and plenty of time to interact with other Decepticons, both as their leader and as Megatron's underling beforehand), make him a prisoner of Megatron, or have him escape and try to do his own thing.
>>150418578i like this.ngl having been watching Beast Wars II as of late. that Starscream very much is that except more bishonen.
