Why don't cape comics fuck around with more crazy superpowers and fight choreography?Why do they tend to resort to flying brick slugfests? It doesn't even need to be that crazy martial arts, just something with a little more technique.
How bout you make one?
Cause you have 22 pages that cost $5. Fight scenes are cool, but if you paid $5 for just a fight scene most readers will feel like they were paying for nothing since most are paying for(even the slightest) plot progression. Manga being $5 for 300 pages lets them extend fights more.
All the examples of memorable, well drawn and panelled DC fights I can think of are either martial arts, street level, relatively grounded brawls. One of my favourites is Ollie taking down Grundy in the Archer's Quest, minus the narration (which I also like) it would fit like a glove in an action seinen manga or some shit. Love the determination and guile in the face of bad odds.I guess Orion vs Darkseid by Simonson is the exception, that was some Dragon Ball Z shit with some Kirby on it.
>>150929540>Why don't cape comics fuck around with more crazy superpowers and fight choreography?You're asking for a street level comic and you're posting Superman and Doomsday. Go read Sideways.
>>150929808You're dumb, LeVar.
>>150930603>trying to get anons to read comics instead of complaining about them
>>150930664Sideways is garbage.
>>150929540Because.
>>150929693>normal human takes down a roided-up undead wby just pulling a string on his neckFucking hell, did they also give Ollie the Batwank treatment?
>>150931933Grundy's power level is inconsistent as fuck, you should know this, he's gone from smacking Superman into the moon to being handled by Robin. This Grundy also had been atrophing in the Arrow Cave for years and it's a sick ass fight so I'm better with this than with say, Batman smacking a planet-level guy in a single panel.
>>150929540Golden and Silver Age comics used to have what you're talking about. Almost every fight was characters trying to one-up each other usibg their powers in creative ways, and explaining everything with huge dialogue bubbles. I'd tell you to read any Superman story from his first 40 years to see an example of wacky use of powers, but it would definitely filter you because it was created for a different time. It's also not huge on choreography because the pacing was rapid fire, not a panel wasted on filler.
>>150932182The word balloons got in the way of the action.They should keeps short and sweet anyway, but with good choreography. A lot of comics show fights that don't make any sense, as if the artist has never seen anyone fight.
>>150929540Stop having shit taste. Things like "fight choreography" and "technique" get in the way of what truly matters, the story. I don't know why anyone would want the story to drag out just to fit in fights, which ultimately don't matter. Like look at this page from a manga called Tenkaichi. It's shit. An entire page focusing on an action. The entire manga is filled with garbage like it.
>>150929660>but if you paid $5 for just a fight sceneYou just described a shitton of mangas and modern comics.
>>150929540Because they're easy to understand for the average person just reading them. If you get too crazy then you get battle shonen syndrome where every page has tons of dialogue about characters explaining everything that's going on so the reader doesn't get confused, which turns into long periods of boring talking when they're adapted into anime. Comics after the Silver Age tried to limit that much dialogue in fight scenes.
>>150929660>but if you paid $5 for just a fight scene-ack
>>150933610If you want a story, go read a book.If you're going to present anything visually, it better fucking look good. People talking, rain on the sidewalk, fists flying, whatever. These are fucking filler comics anyway. At least draw some good action.Also, Death of Superman is mostly this terribly-drawn series of fights. I'll take that Tenkaichi manga any day.
>>150934074We aren’t ants
>>150934074yeah but you're getting like 250 pages of fights, not 22, and plot progression on top of that
>>150934074Toriyama is recognized as a master for a reason, but don't pretend the majority of action-heavy manga and anime don't rely on grotesque amounts of exposition for everything. There's a reason it started being referred to as "Speedwagoning" and JJBA isn't even the worst offender.
>>150934477You shouldn't be a phoneposter either.
>>150934074read the rest of my post. $5 for 300 pages is a good value, $5 for 22 pages is not.
>>150929540Do you have any examples of the type of fight scenes you'd like to see in Superhero comics?
>>150934460i've always despised that comic characters always have full blown conversations with each other in their fights in the milliseconds of time between them either throwing or dodging blows. If this image was in an issue, both superman and goku would be speaking paragraphs at each other in this split second of goku blocking the punch. They all do this and it has never not looked STUPID
>>150929540Fight scenes are retarded and just a cheap way for manga artists to pad out his material for a year.
>>150934998Manga is worse when it comes to that.
>>150929540>more crazy superpowers Comic writers are pussies who try to nerf crazy/strong powersets. They're by and large brainlets who literally lack the imagination and creativity to handle any powers that aren't simple/braindead/weak.>fight choreography?Nigga, this is Western comics where you don't do choreography. You just draw action figures in dynamic static poses and draw some lines to around that to indicate movement. Most of the time, the posing doesn't even make sense with whats supposed to be happening.Fight choreography in Western comics is mostly non-existent or complete dogshit.
>>150935076Comics don't generally deliver in story or characters or nice visuals. What the fuck are they good for?>>150935416Absolutely not.
>>150935076Dude, why even read superhero comics if you don't want action?
>>150935968It's some kind of modern retardation that I see regurgitated here a lot and I just don't get it.Capeshit has always been a subset of action genre and watching larger than life characters duke it out is fun. Do a lot of capeshit writers suck at building up to fight scenes, so they end up feeling shallow? Yeah. But that's not a problem with fight scenes themselves.
>>150936006what is this panel bwo
>>150934477ˢᵖᵉᵃᵏ ᶠᵒʳ ʸᵒᵘʳˢᵉˡᶠ ᵇᶦᵗᶜʰhttps://youtu.be/IjWZ7FAsYHk?si=F5zfbk8xu9Vkj1Xa
>>150929540Because comic artists do not think in terms of animation or cinematography.They are approaching comics like an illustrator and not a director.Furthermore, comic artists are incentivised to to draw things that can be later sold as prints, so everything becomes a flashy illustration. It is the goal of most comic artists to only draw covers and never internal pages
>>150936644contChoreography exists only in animation, it exists only in motion, never a static image.You cannot describe the choreography of the matrix with a single image, because no matter what frame of the movie you choose, it always looks goofy outside of the context of the entire sequence.There is no sequence in a splash page, there is just the illustration, and if you want it to look good, you ahve to pick poses and compositions that look good as illustration and choreography is never included in that.
>>150936664Even in interior pages where there is a sequence of events, the artists are soo deeply entrenched in this mindset of creating illustrations and not animations, that they are simply incapable of thinking of choreographies or any other sort of thing you would find in animation.If they need to draw 5 panels of a fight scene instead of 1 splash page, then they will draw 5 panels that could also be illustrations.The result is skillful art... but a very stiff comic that does not feel truly alive.
>>150936685Contrast this with a comic that does think in terms of animation: Sonic the Hedghog 2018The artist here is not concerned with making pretty illustrations but is instead rather concerned with telling the story through animation, which is what all comics frankly should be doing.None of these panels are very exciting in isolation, you cannot cut them out and put them on your wall as a poster, the overal composition of the page also does not serve as a very interesting poster.But as a sequence... as animation, the comic is far more interesting than anything drawn with a focus on illustration.In the prior comics we remember the splash pages, but in this sort of comic we remember the sequence and forget the individual drawings.
>>150936703One more example of the former kind to really drive the point home.The first three panels are dynamic, compositionally beautiful, you are in awe of the skill of the artist, you want to cut them out and paste them up on your wall, remove the text and ask the artist to redraw them but with oil paints.As illustrations they are very good, but as animation (which I believe all comics are better when they are treated as animation), they are stiff and lifeless. The poses were not chosen with any thoughts of choreography, but rather to static composition.Had this been approached with the same mindset as in the Sonic comic, it would have looked very different and likely would have featured a more interesting choreography.
>>150934074Toriyama is the god of movementgoku vs vegeta is so clean and readable its insane
>>150934535Cope
