So I watched season 2 and didn't feel strongly either way but I found a lot of youtube video essays saying that it is the worst season of any series ever created.
>>151587582It’s like season 1.Adam and Lute have strong bits.Alastor and Rosie have strong bits.People like the Vees a lot.Sera still sucks.Pentious is great but has a forced romance.Chaggie is a IDCAbel and other side characters appear to be annoyingly relevant to take up slots from out of nowhere. But Abel at least could be used for season 3 and 4 for cool moments and bonding.
>>151587582The fact they released Gravity before the show came out actually pisses me off. Pic related was me all season.
>>151587702Lute is basically the new Vox. Except they shilled her even earlier.
Am perfectly fine with chip moderating, knows the staff, was revenge, did public service and earned her redemption
>>151587582I liked it
>>151587702If Gravity had been the cliffhanger instead of yet another scene baiting Lilith I would have been slightly less butthurt about season 2.
>>151587775
>>151587790Sorry I apologize this is first
>>151587775Season 3 is for Lilith, Eve, and Lute since they are related to Lucifer and Adam.
>>151587796
>>151587806
>>151587825And that’s why Jesus is coming soon. So enjoy what is good now.
>>151587815The yuri we deserved instead of Chaggieslop.
>>151587867You ever feel like everyone in heaven was fully aware of just how little Lute was keeping it together, yet nobody really even talks to her outside pf meetings?
>>151587887
>>151587899I swear I don't remember these being as yuri when I originally saved them
>>151587582embarrassing use of Lucifer nobody cares about Pentious and Cherri relationshipLillith cliffhanger from season 1 was nothingon the plus though, Adam and Rosie really came into their own as Lute's ghost and Alastor's master
>>151587910
>>151587921>Sera being there for LuteGood joke
I want to make babies with Emily
It was fun and the music was great. Complaints I've seen on twitter are almost universally retarded about shit that doesn't matter.
>>151587582Hated how they made charlie and lucifer completely fucking retarded this season
>>151588916>this seasonthey've been retarded from the get go
>>151588916The only non retard this season is Alastor.
Season 2 is so fucking bad it made flashgitz work on 3 (THREE) EPISODES.And flashgitz is as lazy as they are racist and old.And boy, are they racist.
>>151588984qrd?
>>151587582Didn't like it. There were parts that were cool (1 or 2 songs, 1 or 2 scenes) but for the most part it was a huge misstep. First of all, they sidelined all the interesting characters with the most possibilities for advancing the plot (Charlie, Alastor, and Lute) so that they literally weren't doing anything all season. Even Angel was sidelined into not really doing anything. For the most part the entire season was Vox singing and ranting while he plotted to take over and then Sir Pentius being shown around Heaven and bemoaning his loss of friends he didnt even like and wasn't friends with. No one else really did anything all season. Alastor's backstory was unsatisfying. He really should've stayed an Eldritch manifestation that was mysterious, creepy, dangerous, and controlling. Vox was whatever but considering the previous he should've also just been some kind of manifestation. Making them previously people takes a lot of wind out of their sails. Also Alastor's whole deal thing didn't really make sense to me and seemed kind of contrived. Another Anon pointed out Vox's characterization is inconsistent in that if he was a murderous cult leader in life he shouldn't have been a naive wholesome little boy type when he got to Hell to get his feelings hurt by Alastor. And Alastor amis incredibly out of character from the Pilot, most likely due to the original wroter leaving the series. Vaggie's whole name thing was silly and should've just been ignored, and Baxter had no reason to be in the season considering his almost non-existent screen time. They could've just figured out a different way of resolving the finale. The whole everybody sings and puts their powers together thing was unsatisfying, too. The whole plot really needed an overhaul.
>>151589037Lastly, I'll say all of the songs were unsatisfying. Instead of committing to a theme they all did 2-3 genre changes throughout which kind of ruined them and made them not the type of thing you'd want to return to as a song you listen to. There were also too many songs. Especially considering the small number of episodes and how little happened we really didn't need 3+ songs per episode. We could've done with one or even just a few really good ones soread throughout the season. There's more things but those are the main ones. I really like seeing indie animation taking off, but those were my thoughts on it in a vacuum.
>>151587582This show is highly satanic because it has demons. It's made only to upset christians
>>151587790It would've been better to get a Vaggie flashback sequence instead of a quick montage during a song.
>>151587582Liked it way more than season 1. Still not even close to perfect but I truly don't get the hate for this season (aside from criticism of Charlie's character development) and think the series is going in right direction......
>interesting characters with the most possibilities for advancing the plot (Charlie, Alastor, and Lute)>Charlie>Interestingkekalastor is more the protagonist of the show than charlie isshe's just a side character really
>>151589087Then you don't mind her dying...
>Vox's characterization is inconsistent in that if he was a murderous cult leader in life he shouldn't have been a naive wholesome little boy type when he got to Hell to get his feelings hurt by Alastoryou don't think dying might change you a bit?at least for awhile
>>151589049kill yourself spammer
>>151589037>Vox's characterization is inconsistent in that if he was a murderous cult leader in life he shouldn't have been a naive wholesome little boy type when he got to Hell to get his feelings hurt by AlastorOh boy, you don't know many people, do you? Besides, there's a thing called "POV". That's the reason why Valentino is a massive monster when we're following Angel but a moeblob when we're with Vox. The flashback was explicitly told from Vox pov, and still the fact that he was literally talking about conquering hell and the fact that he stayed mad at a refusal for 70 years should tell you that the asshole was still there
>>151589087Charlie is such a useless protagonist. I keep expecting Vivzie to give her something actually cool to do and she keeps disappointing.
>>151587582I really like it I don't know what the fuss is about. It's like all the people complaining about Smiling Friends too. I feel like I'm in opposite world because I thought both had really strong seasons and they were the best so far.
>>151589161>s3 is all about Morningstar dramaDropped
>>151589201Maybe Charlie could finally drop some motherfuckers instead of being a retarded hippie bitch?Right?
>>151589136Fact: if you lower your guard for even a nanosecond, Satan WILL immediately jump out from behind a streetlight and whisk your soul off to Hell. That's why every work of fiction that doesn't mindlessly sing God's praises must be destroyed. Humanity is meant to become a race of obedient prayer-bots.
>>151589214
>>151589214If Lillith is going to be manipulating Charlie next season then the chances are nonzero.
>>151587582Vox's serial killer backstory was kinda strange and the Angel Dust drama is getting tiresome but I liked everything else.
>cartoon finally gets no-holds barred hypnosis scenes where the villain hypnotizes the fuck outta the hero>WORST SEASON OF ANYTHING EVER, KILL THE CREATORS, UNDER THE JAIL, NUKE THE JAIL, BAKE THEIR REMAINS INTO A FRUITCAKE AND FEED IT TO THEIR PARENTSWE’RE IN THE MONEEEY
>>151589144>blah blah blah I'm a simp and here are my excuses for fat Viv and her fat writingWhy? Why even? Why not just admit it's bad instead of getting on your knees for her?Embarrassing... so embarrassing...
>>151589580That sounds like most anime.
>>151587582The problem is that they keep making dumb choices with regard to the songs and even dumber choices with regard to voice direction.Probably my least favorite song on the entire soundtrack is Live to Live. Why? Because they take two of the best singers in the cast (Patina Miller and Alex Brightman) and have them sing the vocal equivalent of spaghetti. They take one of their valuable song slots and waste it on Alex Brightman struggling to do Pentious's accent so that he can rehash It Starts With Sorry while Patina Miller sings a completely different song over him that doesn't mesh at all.The same thing goes with Christian Borle. He can clearly sing, but they're almost afraid to let him do that. Half the songs Vox is in are either drowned out by someone else or they have him talking to music rather than singing. Look at Brighter, where 70% of the song is spoken. The clear answer there was to do the part with Human Vox first and then do Brighter after that as a song instead of trying to insert one into the other. This isn't even touching on the fact that Viv insisted on so many of the characters having stupid accents that the singers can't do without multiple takes. Valentino is pretty egregious in that his VA can't figure out what nationality he is and so half the time he's an uber gay guy from somewhere in Europe and the other half he's vaguely hispanic. Blake Roman has the same problem doing Angel Dust - he's better at the accent than Brightman or Valentino, but he still can't do it consistently. Just watch the Broadway recording where he does Poison without it.
>>151587582I liked it a lot. Season 1 was very uneven and rough while Season 2 seems much more cohesive and thought-out. I think the music is generally better this season, too, I'm ecstatic that Kimiko Glenn got a fun j-popish numberPlenty of things moved forward, character dynamics were revealed and progressed, Lucifer's secret is out, Charlie knows how redemption works, it was a good and productive season.My sister, who loved season 1 way more than me and adores Helluva (which I can't stand), hates season 2 and refuses to finish it. She stopped after the episode with Vox's backstory. When pressed the best reason she could come up with was "season 1 was darker"I don't get what people aren't liking.
>>151589037>Making them previously people in season 2OhOh I seeThe people that don't like season 2 are genuinely stupid
>>151589856Is she a Lucifer fag? Because females and kids who liked him went pretty mad that he wasn't a deus ex machina
>>151589161Charlie's purpose is to be a disney princess in hellShe's just the impetus for everyone else to stop sucking so hard This is a really simple story it's crazy people don't understand it
>>151589877No she's 100% obsessed with Alistair.I guess she could be mad he got sorta sidelined and "lost" to Vox (she refuses to watch the finale so doesn't know it was all according to keikaku)
>>151589885>she refuses to watch the finale so doesn't know it was all according to keikakuDon't wanna sound harsh, but she's pretty damn stupid. That was clear from ep4, and I can't think of a single way they could have made it more obvious
>>151589880I won't be hearing any arguments in favor of Charlie.You can have a character like this but they still need to grow, need to evolve beyond "hopelessly naive adult baby".But she doesn't. She just falls into the same pitfalls over and over and over again, and it's already gotten tiresome.How can I root for a character that's incapable of learning and growing?
>>151589899To be fair I don't know if she understands that or not, I just know she didn't reach the actual revealLike I said the most I could get out of her was "not dark enough"
>>151589907>Nooooo Charlie is too naive and idealistic!Nigger that is the entire fucking point of her character and a requirement for her role in hell.If Charlie stops being naive the hotel is dead and the show is over.When did people stop understanding how stories function?
>>151589908>not dark enoughWhich is stupid, since S1 was way more light-hearted, besides a couple moments in ep 4 and Pentious death in the finale, which was immediately eased in a win for the heroes
>>151589923Are you stupid?She can still be idealistic and hopeful without being braindead.She should have known after the pilot not to fuck around with Vox and his network.Katie Killjoy absolutely destroyed and humiliated her in that interview AND outside the interview.Vox and the Vees also very clearly have an agenda to push and were smearing her too.It's very obvious that they were going to shred her if she invited them for an interview, but she invites them anyway.Then they do it, and she's so fucking stupid she sets herself up for them to do it again, setting up an interview with... Katie fucking Killjoy. Are you seriously defending this?And that's with, of course, everyone she asked telling her it was a terrible idea every step of the way.
>>151589907>>151589923Ok am I going fucking crazy?I'm discussing Pluribus and Hazbin at the same time and in both cases all the people I'm talking to are mad because they keep expecting shows which are very clear about what they are to be something they aren't.With Pluribus it's people expecting the hive to be finally revealed as evil for sure every episode or wanting Carol to make progress on a cure when the show is about her being a miserable bitch not saving the worldWith Hazbin it's people mad that the musical is being a musical and that Charlie isn't beating people up and ruling pride with an iron fist.I just - what the fuck is going on? Is there something in the water? Why are people incapable of parsing media now?
>>151589961Yeah man let's have the character whose naivety is literally the impetus for the plot be less naive so fewer things can happenStories are most interesting when everyone is hyper competent and there's no conflict right?Yes, Charlie's actions are stupid. They're naive. Overly hopeful.That is her character.It isn't changing.
>>151589962>and that Charlie isn't beating people up and ruling pride with an iron fist.That's not what I said, at all, you illiterate buffoon.>>151589980So she's just a retard forever, and you're fine with that?She's a mental midget who can't grow and won't change?Has no arc, has no development, no growth... and that's good?Holy shit, are you Viv? You're fucking retarded. More than Charlie even.God, nu/co/ sucks so fucking much. You people are a joke.You deserve this trash writing.
>>151589996>NOOOO MUH ARC THE CHARACTER MUST CHAAAAAAANGEDespite what you may have heard every story is not the hero's journey.You are a child.
>>151589980>It isn't changingTo be fair, next season she may get a slap on the face with her mother entering the scene and not being the angelic being Charlie thinks she is
>>151589996Anon you're arguing for the character that represents a beacon of good in hell to stop being that beacon.Being trusting and naive is a part of the package. Giving people second, third, fourth, and fifty-seventy chances is part of the package. She is a saint in hell and doesn't need to change, everyone around her does.You're retarded and no one should ever let you near pen and paper
>>151589962Why can't you retards ever argue in good faith, always making shitty strawmen? Is it because you have no actual arguments?>why are you expecting the main protagonist of the show to actually do something instead of being a damsel?>why are you expecting a fight scene in a show that had several (including one involving Charlie in season 1)Gee, I wonder where people got that idea from.
>>151590035Try again but this time make a coherent post.
>>151590035Anon if you don't understand how this show works yet that is very clearly a (you) problem.I don't have time to teach you the fundamentals of storytelling from scratch, why don't you go watch something more your speed like Naruto? You can jack off to all the training arcs.
>>151587582If they're scared of Lucifer solving everything they could easily write him out of the plot when they need to by just making him actively governing Hell again.
>>151589962>Why are people incapable of parsing media now?It was always like this. I read comments from back when Twin Peaks was airing and all they talked about was shipping wars and when they resolve the mystery already.
>>151590004You're too stupid to have a discussion with. It's time for you to be quiet.>>151590023>Anon you're arguing for the character that represents a beacon of good in hell to stop being that beacon.No, I'm not. All I'm arguing is that having Charlie be overly stupid is harmful to her as a character. She can still be good without being stupid. It's insane that you don't understand that. How can you not comprehend that there's something between "I walk face-first into walls over and over again, if someone gives me a bag of nails and says it's candy I'll eat it" and "I have become Hell's Hitler. I will genocide everyone and everything in my path"?>Being trusting and naive is a part of the package. Giving people second, third, fourth, and fifty-seventy chances is part of the package.Yes, giving people a chance when they're asking for it is part of the package.Repeatedly going swimming with the sharks when they keep biting you is stupid.>She is a saint in hell and doesn't need to change, everyone around her does.She can still be virtuous and good without being laughably dumb.A dog with a shock collar is smart enough to stay in the yard after a zap or two.I don't understand why you cant comprehend this.You're subhuman. Your brain isn't even functioning, is it?No wonder you like Charlie so much, you find her relatable.
>>151590121>Nuh uh I just want her to not be naive!And I explained why that's retarded and breaks her character's entire purpose.She. Is. A. Saint.Good. Is. Naive. Trusting. Innocent.You want a badass protagonist making smart moves? Fuck you, go watch JoJo you dumbass.That YOU don't get this is baffling.Here's what it comes down to my stupid friend:Charlie is a mentor character that will not change. What you see as a flaw is her virtue.If you want her to change and be more practical you will stay mad.You fail to understand the basics of character and story.
>point of the character is to be naive and innocent>that means she must be a frustrating idiot (who is also always right in the end and the people who went against her were misguided or meanies anyway)Literally any magical girl show written for toddlers does that better, Viv and her gang just can't write
>>151590168>No, the bad writing is actually good!>You like anime! Go watch anime!>You just don't get it. Psh, nothing personnel, kid.You are such a fag. Nobody's asking for her to be a "badass protagonist making smart moves".Not even close.All I'm asking for is a person, an adult woman, to learn from putting their hand on the stove.You're acting so ridiculous about it. Like it's unreasonable to expect the tiniest shred of intelligence from her.Fuck, you're stupid. I feel so bad for your parents and anyone else that has to deal with you and can't just walk away like I'm doing after this post.
>>151590094It really doesn't feel like it used to be this bad
>>151590211>>151590216>Literally posts a show for little girls Go watch that instead, dumbass>I'm asking her to stop being what she isToo bad?
>>151589856>season 1 was darkerShe's wrong. Everything in season 1 was played for comedy EXCEPT Angel. Season 2 is way more dramatic
>mom would be so proud of thisOur FUARKING innocent pacifist and saintly HERO while an army of brainwashed soldier women (that her gf used to be part of) are being slayed, you can just see the pure agony in her eyes as this pointless massacre is being committed.
>>151590216Not that anon but she wasn't that bad. She sort of learned by the epilogue even though it felt it happened offscreen and the only bad thing she actually caused was Angel being mad at her. Everything else would have happened with her input or not.The actual reason I'm excusing it is because it's obvious this season was a Vox filler season and they're keeping Charlie development for when Lillith comes back.
>>151590424kekpretty sure she was gonna fucking rageslaughter val if angel hadn't stopped her toomy FUARKING saintly retard hero
>>151587582Didn't enjoy that muchI'm hoping for season 3 though any predictions for the upcoming season already??
>>151590480I always wondered why she can't just buy Angel from Val? Is it a huge scandal if the princess gets involved with soul contracts or what?
>>151590536You can only buy if the other side is willing to sell. What does she have that he would want over Angel.
>>151590549Doesn't she have authority over sinners?
>>151590043It's coherent, you're just fucking retarded.>>151590063>no argumentAs expected.
Just out of curiosity, are these actual shills?
>>151590609Usually I'd say they're shitposters but I have seen how rabid the fans can be on xitter, so who knows
>>151590480Well to be fair in s2 rageslaughter wasn't an option with her problem of being cancelled on helltwitter. It'd just make more people mad when she wanted to convince people the hotel was good and peaceful actually. Disemvoweling Vox live on stream is not gonna help her PR.
>>151590688>Disemvoweling Vox live on stream is not gonna help her PR.What about the moment Vox was blasting Lucifer piss lasers all over Hell, and she decided to go rescue sinners who would have respawned anyway instead of stopping him directly?
>>151590571What authority? What is she gonna do about it? They don't even respect Lucifer. The only one who had authority over them was her mom.
>>151590725I don't blame characters for a writer's contrivances.
>>151590725Lucifer piss laser was perma death.
>>151590480anon are you joking right nowdo you have any idea how stock this trope isare you actually 12this site is 18+
>>151590790Yes, but she was rescuing people under the rubble while Vox was doing the actual permakilling until Rapeman stopped him
>>151590725>why doesn't Superman just ignore all the people in danger and focus on the monster>why doesn't Superman just beat the shit out of Lex and throw him into the sunThis is what you sound like.
>>151589202
>>151590832THE SURVIVING FAGS THAT WERE JUST KIND OF WOUNDED WEREN'T IN DANGERTHE PEOPLE BEING BLASTED BY VOX WERE AND SHE JUST NEEDED TO KICK HIMAIEEEEEEEE
>>151590852
>>151590831They joke about him stealing all the credit but he really did save the day.
>>151590831I think Charlie simply isn't strong enough. Vox was still at his boosted state and Charlie potentially has power but she's been living a sheltered baby life her entire existence. I don't think she even knows how draw out any power besides getting some horns and hissing like an angry kitten. She only got a lucky hit on Adam because he was underestimating her and he was beating her up most of their fight.
>>151590922My much more cynical take is that they simply don't want the protagonist to get her hands dirty, so they have the other characters conveniently do it for her.
>>151590571The setting is fucking retarded. She's simultaneously le hecking princess who's extremely powerful and some pathetic underdog nobody respects at the same time.>i-it's because she's childlike and naiveListen, most people wouldn't try pissing off a 6'9 heavyweight boxer just because he's nice and friendly.
>>151589772A lot of the songs sounded sloppier, overcrowded and less baked than season 1's, which is why I'm surprised so many people think season 2's soundtrack is superior overall. I watched the Brighter sequence again and don't understand how you're supposed to get into it with the sheer amount of talking. They should have just let someone else have a song that episode instead of Vox again and told his backstory without.The only thing that notably improved this season was the animation. And the only reason the pacing seemed better is because they shafted so many characters in terms of development to stay on plot track and make it work, including the main character.
>>151590884Gracias señor abusador
>>151590964I don't mind if she doesn't get her hands dirty. The problem is just that she's potentially too strong that she could reasonably solve a problem by just beating it up.
