Why did Omniverse feel the need to retcon the Osmosian backstory for Kevin?I know people hated it, but by retconing, all you did was create a massive amount of plot holes.Example, how did Kevin's mom get one of the pieces of the Map of Infinity if Kevin's dad wasn't real and he wasn't a plumber? Not only that, it wasn't just Kevin, Aggregor, and Max that use the term Osomsian, Azmuth, Paradox, and Kybher used it. Did the rooter brain wash them too?
>>151703982Also, removing Kevin's backstory of a kid trying to live up to his dad's legacy sucks.
>>151703982Ben 10 really liked to retcon a lot of stuff from the original series for the worse.
>>151704149that backstory wasn't in OS for a reason. It was fabricated by Servantis between the OS ending and AF
>>151703982They hated UAF.
>>151703982They really wanted you to feel like you were reading a comic book by introducing a ton of retcons.
>>151703982They really just wanted to "fix" the lore, plot holes be damned.
>>151705639They fucked it up more.
>>151703982I don't care about the retconsLet's talk about our favorite aliensI think it's neat how many species we saw in the show, who we know should be in the Omnitrix but Ben never unlocked
>>151707113I like Six-Six and his family
Recently watching AF again, and while I still like it myself, you can really tell this show is from 2008 lmaoNot necessarily a bad thing, but I can understand why the UAF era is kinda hated nowadays.Also, Kevin was really horny for Gwen almost right away, huh? She's like, mildly nice to him, and he just immediately folds.
>>151703982Celestial-sapiens be hitting dat dank weed man
>>151703982I never really liked "everything is aliens" in UAF. Gwen did not need to be part of a race of energy fae aliens, she was fine as a human that does magic. Kevin did not need to be an energy-absorbing alien, he was fine as a human mutant.It's more annoying because they go out of their way to retcon these things to be aliens but simultaneously add things that would have been more fitting BEFORE the retcon, like an entire fucking parallel dimension of magic with wizards and shit, and other actual human mutants like darkstar.OV is far from perfect, specially on a rewatch, and some of the retcons it introduced are on themselves retarded (or complicate way more things than they fix), but I vibe more with their brand of retardation than I do with UAF's.
>>151703982DJW autisim.>>151705570Also this.
>>151708183>and other actual human mutants like darkstar.Oh yeah that fucker, why wasn't HE an alien? They could've easily made him another Osmosian or something.
>>151708452I thought he and the blond kid, the technopath, were Plumbers kids tooI assumed their dads just banged human looking aliens
>Gwen has an older brother named Ken>its implied he's so beloved that Ben names his son after him>never mentioned again after the one episode he was inthe Tennyson family is weird, like don't get me started on the cousin Sunny.
>>151708538Don't forget cousin Lucy
>>151708510I find it funny how casually Kevin just confirmed the Plumbers were constantly fucking aliens and having kids in the third AF episode.Like, of course they would fuck aliens, naturally occurring human-alien hybrids makes complete sense.>>151708538After watching the OS finale again, I really want to know more about Ben's parents Sandra and Carl in particular.Like, I know the main Tennysons are just Ben, Gwen, and Max, but the implication that Max was kind of a distant father to Carl made me really curious about him and their relationship.
>>151708574>Max told Ben their race is called sludgepuppies>turns out this is a horrific slur in-universeYet Lucy doesn't seem to mind being called that, girl is a freak.
>>151707113Big fan of Loboans. Sci fi werewolves with sonic howls are, and always will be, fucking sick
>>151708695>Sci fi werewolves with sonic howlsIs that a common trope?
>>151708760only sci-fi werewolf I can think of is the one from Star CommandAnd I don't think he had a sonic howl
>>151708669She gives her family the S pass.
This reminds me...how is Scott Adams doing? He was given just some months to live...in May...
>>151703982>Did the rooter brain wash them too?Rooter brainwashed the whole universe, it was the biggest gaslighting scheme ever.Alternatively, it was an extreme case of manipulated mass hysteria.
>>151707705Kevin is literally doing what any anon here would have done, if he can't beat Ben might as well beat his cousins pussy.
>>151703982DJW wanted himself to be the sole authority on Ben 10 so he was getting rid of anything he didn't like. How did an artist get so much power over a franchise? Who the fuck knows. I just ignore Omniverse
>>151707705>I can understand why the UAF era is kinda hated nowadays.Folks that quit at Omniverse kinda left the fandom, and the ones who stayed already hated the UAF era or started with OV. You have a selection bias here
>>151709438 I only checked out of back right before the reboot. People really seem to forget just how hated the art style swap at the time. Replacing Gwen and Kevin certainty didn't help and it's pretty clear they back tracked later on with the two showing up a few times every season.Personally out of all of them I feel the OS aged the worst.
>>151709438Maybe, that would imply that there's a silent group of casual UAF fans.
>>151707113>how many species we saw in the show, who we know should be in the Omnitrix but Ben never unlockedMost of the aliens feature throughout the series DNAs are all more than likely in the Omnitrix, Ben has the completed Omnitrix, it wouldn't make sense for certain Aliens to still remain locked until Ben end up randomly unlocking them by chance.The closest you're gonna get to seeing any of Transformations is through fanarts done by the Ink Tank on the Ben 10 5 Years Later Playlist.
I like agreggor
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cuI0YxR4QTE
>>151710911Soul
>>151708538Its defintely weird.>>151709419Late stage OV had no plans and four different conflicting visions fo rthe show, and wasnt selling toys enough so they kinda did whatever. So DJW got more influence than he would have gotten in tfa.>>151709767UA was the show that did the best in terms of merch, and asking outside of ben 10 circles tends to show that.>>151707705AF is still popular, its UA that gets the hate.
>>151709497Kinda? It's the least talked about ironically enough.
>Why did Omniverse feel the need to retcon the Osmosian backstory for Kevin?because DJW went full retarded and wanted to pander OS fans even the nonsense stuff like pic relatedSame with the fact Ben 10k was an AU
>>151711211It's a side effect of not really having any character development in the OS. Ben and Gwen are largely the same character they start off as.
>>151703982I wrote that one greentext father's day episode to try to fix it.
>>151709419Clearly DJW was more than just an artist, both Wikipedia and the Ben 10 Wiki credit him as a showrunner.It's weird, cause every time I hear about a story decision from OV, it's usually "DJW said" or "DJW wanted" or "DJW's intention was".Obviously he wasn't the only guy making decisions, but it sure seemed like he was the face of the show.>>151711161>AF is still popular, its UA that gets the hate.Ehh, I feel like most people just lump AF and UA together when talking about them, from what I've heard they were basically the same show split in two or something.>>151711409>Same with the fact Ben 10k was an AUTo be fair, I feel like most people would go out of their way to make their favorite AU canon if they had any control of a franchise that they liked.>>151712083Would you mind sharing it again?
>>151712327Find it kind of ironic that a lot of the change backs received lukewarm reception at best and downright condemnation at worst. Ben/Kai MAYBE breaks into stop 5 ship for Ben
>>151712327>Would you mind sharing it again?
>>151710609He’s ok. Kinda basic but he gets the job done as a villain
Also, clearly they forgot Aggregor existed when they made this retcon because he's not mentioned in this arc and it's was DJW tumblr that explained it away.
Julie and Ben breaking up in Omniverse was kinda a deal breaker for me.
I’ve lately grown to think that as much as I like his artstyle, DJW really shouldn’t not had as much influence as he did. Man’s built for giving a show a nice look, not on deciding the story that it takes. Especially if said retcons make some stuff look even more retarded.like seriously, is it that hard to buy that some aliens fucked a few humans to have hybrid kids? why make them test tube babies? It’s fucking stupid
>>151713293I was fine with it because it led to the harem.
Kevin should've stayed as a villian. He could've been Ben 10's Bizarro instead of Albedo, who I felt was too one dimensional of a character.
>>151713293Most bullshit reason as to why Julie broke is >>151711409. Breaking up Julie for Kai just because of an A.U., along with creator notes that Julie and Ben's relationship limited their creativity.
>>151713319Kevin should have been redeemed in the OS, he's vastly more interesting as an anti hero than as a villain and less of a one note character.
>>151708183I never really questioned Kevin's Osmosian backstory since the OS never really explained what his deal was.I guess it was technically a retcon, but not one that went against anything they said about Kevin in the OS, which again, wasn't anything, his powers just went unexplained.That lack of explanation probably meant we were supposed to assume he was just another mutant like the many ones we already saw, but like, if you have mutants in a series about aliens, I feel like at least some of those are gonna have aliens involved in their creation one way or another, specially if you're gonna have a secret organization that has been fighting them for who knows how long.If aliens are gonna be part of the human history of your world, and you have weird people with looks and abilities that some would call alien, it makes complete sense to link at least some of that.
>>151713411It should’ve been after he mutated because think of the shenanigans
>>151713319Even as a kid I thought Kevin was treated too harshly in the original series.Like, he was an 11 year old thrown into the hell dimension along with Space Hitler and other horrible criminals, that felt a bit too harsh lmaoI would've kept him on Earth, having escaped from the Null Void at the last minute, but losing his powers somehow, no more power absorption, no more mutation, no nothing, that'd be his punishment.How? I dunno, they were still just making shit up and adding random functions to the watch back then, so let's say he tries to steal power from Ben's newer aliens like Cannonbolt and Wildvine, but it backfires and the Omnitrix instead detects his mutant DNA, and fixes it, leaving him as a normal human.
>>151714060>Kevin has to sleep with his Heatblast arm hanging out so he doesn’t accidentally light the RV on fire
>>151708574Who could!
>>151703982Could he beat Battle Beast in a fight?
In DJW attempts to fix the timeline, he fucked it up even further.During the rooters arc, it said that Jonsey, the heatblast kid from UAF, was an orphan that Servantis found and he was introduced to Kevin and the the Plumpers Kids. They also met Ben and Gwen when they were 11, but they didn't recognize them, which explains Ben and Gwen meeting him in AF. The following up,it turns out Jonsey lived in Ben's neighborhood, was friends with Ben, and he, along with Ben and Gwen, met Kevin before the Rooters are. They also learned Kevin could absorb minerals before AF.
>>151703982I'm more annoyed that they retconned the plumber kids being mutated human kids instead of hybrids.
>>151714838The Ultimate Rath vs Battle Beast fight would be so fucking cool
>>151714910I think you're confusedhttps://ben10.fandom.com/wiki/JonesyI don't see anything that says Jonesy was also Alan AlbrightDid you assume they were the same person because they're both black?
>>151715083oh, I'm an idiot. You're right
>>151713293Them breaking up wouldn't be bad per say, but damn if the way they did it in OV wasn't awful. It would've been less insulting if they just had Ben offhandedly mention they broke up so she can focus on her tennis career.
>>151714049>OS never really explained what his deal wasOS is surprisingly pretty vague about alot of things aside from Max's past and the Omnitrix, and even with those 2 it's really not as explored as often as people think they are.
>>151708760>>151708802Oh I was just breaking down Blitzwolfer into his base essentials of why I think he’s cool. But I do like in science fiction has werewolf themed aliens or creatures like the Shistavanen’s from Star Wars, the Lycan’s from Roswell Conspiracies, and even that werewolf from that one Doctor Who episode
>>151714937Classic shirt and the UAF jacket is a bit much you think? One or the other imo
>>151713293To be fair we saw the groundwork for them breaking up in UA. Honestly it felt like the writing team of Ultimate Alien was split, there was one half trying to break them up by making Ben a bad boyfriend while the other half really was trying to make them work as a couple.
why is people pretending they liked this bitch?
>>151716768Because Kai is worse, simple as that really.
>>151716768She actually wasn't bad in AF.
>>151716768I liked her dog.
>>151716768Pretty privilege, she's cute.Also, like many things in Ben 10, people like them more for their potential rather than their execution.
>>151717340bitch has an alien that can turn into any machine in the universe, and is more interested in playing tennis.
>>151712327DJW was involved at the start of story meetings. But he was mostly suggesting stuff, and there was still charlotte/matt wayne and youngberg who were also all super involved. But after a certain point you can tell he's the guy pushing for certain stuffThe season 1 malware plot was made by dwayne, its actually still visible on his take on OV in the series bible. The biggest difference is that rook (under a different name) was a traitor (who probably would have been redeemed) and that the predatrix was used by the hunter, rather than his dog.>>151711409Apparently he wanted ben x attea, but did kai due to the ben10k thing.
>>151717590It seems unreasonable to make her abandon everything else she likes because of Ship.
>>151717874Traitor Rook sounds lame imo. Glad they didn’t go that direction
>>151717878Know what is unreasonable? wasting your time on normalfag shit when the universe could be yours. Say whatever you want about Omniverse, at least it didn't make Ben abandon the most powerful item in the universe just to play football soccer.
>>151704149>Kevin's backstory of a kid trying to live up to his dad's legacy sucks.Kid Kevin was a criminal and a maniac who would go on rampages and try to kill Civilians for fun.
>>151717874>Apparently he wanted ben x atteaThat would've been fucking crazy.>>151718371The human mind clearly yearns for ball games.
>>151704149Tbh, AF redeeming Kevin on the first episode was dumb too. Dude was a lil' psycho in the OG.
>>151704800>that backstory wasn't in OS for a reasonThe reason was that OS Kevin was an actual evil psychopath, they didn't want him to have any kind of sympathetic backstory since they were gonna throw him into the Null Void and treat him as still irredeemably evil 30 years later.All we got for a backstory was him saying that his folks didn't want a freak for a son, which could easily be explained as him just lying to cope/save face.AF was when they decided that Kevin could actually work as an ally, so they decided to actually give him a more traditional tragic backstory.>>151718820To be fair, I think that could be explained as him mellowing out with age somewhat, growing out of his evil childish ways for a still selfish but not as outright evil attitude.Still, they probably could've found a way to make his redemption work better instead of just>Well, I'm horny for Gwen and this plumber guy saved me so guess I'm good now
>>151718956Wasn't it explained that absorbing energy made him crazy, so he started to absorb matter instead?
>>151718820I like good Kevin more.
>>151707113I still think it's bullshit that Celestialsapiens have DNA in the watchBut Anodites don't?
>>151719075>erm, actually he was just a poor mentally-ill boy all alone on the streetsI remember something like that, it's kind of a cop-out but also probably the best way to somewhat absolve him of his more evil and murderous tendencies from the OS.The unintended consequences of that is that they basically had to ditch his powers from the OS, and they couldn't use them again without him going evil again.
