I don't really like how the reactionary side of the internet has such a problem with characters showing panic attacks or having mental problems.
>>151829136Because /co/ wants DCAU-esque action cartoons back instead of faggy Steven Universe "MUH FEELINGS" shit.
>>151829136The problem is that for the past 10+ years adult orientated cartoons seem to hyper focus on mental health for some reason. We have entered an era where big animation or internet based indie cartoon shorts are no longer heavily focused on action or comedy that you would see with the early 2000s. Even attempts at serious stuff was not really big on mental health as a topic and with indie stuff being almost comedic in how edgy they came off as by trying to be serious. Now though it doesn't matter whether it is indie or a studio cartoon, adult or younger audience, there is a fixation on mental health as a topic in some capacity.But I am biased and have shit taste in cartoons, so what do I know.
>>151829136Online culture war bullshit has ruined the nuance surrounding storytelling, as with many other things.
>>151829136Because it's been done to death at this point. One animated series or movie looking at trauma or mental health issues is a novelty. Two is okay. Seventy-two is just fucking obnoxious. The problem is that at this point trauma has become trendy, and so now every interesting or original idea gets coopted by some faggy shit-tier director deciding they want to make it about their unresolved daddy issues or their lingering trauma about that time a kid in gym class pinched their butt, or their fucking sad lizard story, and nobody wants to watch that shit when every fucking movie is that.
>>151830021Can you name even 3 examples? I keep seeing people say this is everywhere, but never any examples of it.
>>151830035nta but:>TDAC>Steven Jewniverse (Anything by Rebecca Sugar, actually)>Anything by Vivziepop
>>151830098Except TADC actually does it well. People don't want to just have these tropes written well, they want to get rid of them all together.
>>151830145His issue wasn't the execution of the trope, it was the oversaturation of it
>>151830179Which is exactly my problem. People want these tropes to be gotten rid of wholesale instead of wanting them simply written better.
>>151829579it's not just cartoons, there's too much mental health shit in the general conversation
>>151829382fpbp>>151830145>Except TADC actually does it well.Not really, the episodes just turn into therapy sessions with the characters telling rather than showing.
>>151830035>Turning Red's director is on record as saying she used the movie as a therapy exercise, changing it to more closely mirror her own unresolved issues about her relationship with her mother.>The director of the Pixar short Versa has stated he made the short to work through unresolved issues about his wife's miscarriage.>The addition of "realistic" panic attacks in Puss in Boots: The Last Wish and Inside Out 2 were both pushed by members of the creative teams of the projects who, of course, suffer from frequent panic attacks and wanted the films they were working on to promote awareness.>The Amazing Digital Circus - 'nuff said>Steven Universe Future - 'nuff said
1. It's been done to death.2. Their reasons for having these issues always comes across as them being huge pussies rather than actual truama, specially when it comes to women's issues.3. The solutions to fixing their issues never feel realistic or feel even more toxic and worse, specially when it comes to men's mental health issues.4. When they do have breakdowns it always seems to be over real small and stupid shit that just reinforces that they are over sensitive pussies.5. These issues aren't that common in general so no one cares and feels stupid to try and teach and preach about something that is probably never going to happen, unless you are an over sensitive pussy.
>>151830225>Not really, the episodes just turn into therapy sessions with the characters telling rather than showing.What are you talking about? The episode in picture related does it perfectly. Preceding: The climax of the ghost house seqence with the shotgun action scene, very high energy, and foreboding hopelessness, as they have clearly lost all control of their fates in this adventure. That is immediately undercut by calming music and LOVELY sight of Ragatha, a comedic release of tension. The pace slows down and, in a safe environment, establishes the question of how Kinger and Pomni are going to escape.The talk: The calm pace is continued from the previous scene. The previous question is materialised in the more dire actual circumstaces with Pomni's panicking, which Kinger soothes down to a mere anxiety. His logical investigation also grounds the moment just as Pomni's anxiety leads to a short horrifying scene of possession. The music drops very fast, noting how short the moment of horror truly was, letting the audience return to the previous anxious calm. Trying to cope with her horrifying situation, her anxiety transforms into just apathy. The pace has been naturally lowered for the moment of caring introspection, with an air lingering despair surrounding them, which facilitates the reciprocity for meaningful communication.After: Truly driving the point home about how these talks are integral for the story, just as Pomni finds acceptance, the situation is also resolved in a spectacularly visual and hopeful scene. The quiet music of the talk seamlessly grows into a triumph as they exit. And it ends warmly when they reunite with the others. And a gentle joke to finish it off.
>>151830145>TADC actually does it well
>>151829579spbp
Panic attacks are self-inflicted suffering, and therefore are low stakes / not relatable to people who haven't suffered in the same way. If you've never suffered a panic attack, watching one from the outside is confusing and, frankly, irritating, until you realize the person isn't just making a scene for no reason, but is suffering a physiological shock. Then you might feel sympathy, but you'd still be at a loss for what to actually do. If you have no medical or psychological training, which is most people, you have no idea what to do if a person is having a panic attack in front of you. This is where the difference between men and women kicks in.Women will rush to soothe and calm down the person, men will try to actually DO something. That is the social conditioning of the sexes. But there's nothing for men to actually do if they're not specifically trained to handle medical emergencies. It's self-inflicted. There's no external threat to be confronted, or outside factor to be analyzed and dealt with. Without specialized training, there's no clear task to be done. It's not a problem that men's general skill sets can easily deal with. But for women, a panic attack is a field day to showcase all their womanly social skills: they can rush to soothe and calm the panicking person, create a safe space around them, and try to keep them under control until medical help arrives. If a man did this he'd look like the biggest pansy in the world and no woman would respect him, so he wouldn't ever try it. It's not panic attacks themselves that are the issue, it's making them a big part of a fictional narrative and a character arc. Publicly displaying your private mental health issues is not manly. The way to deal with panic attacks is not manly.
>>151830204But they can't be written better if everyone is doing them, has done them, and is just trying to emulate their favorite depictions of it. It's a trend, it's run its course.
>>151830249You've named literally two cartoons and two pixar movies. Hardly enough to say that this is "everywhere"
>>151830311>Publicly displaying your private mental health issues is not manly.This is the entire problem. It's basically a denial of human vulnerability, which is a very reactionary and bad mindset.
>>151830249Anon, do you realize that this is basically in almost every work of fiction ever? Lord of the Rings was Tolkien coping with his own war experiences and several scenes from the book are literally ripped from his own wartime memories.
>>151830335Anon asked for three examples, I gave five.
>>151830361>Having a different opinion is reactionary and bad
>>151829136Because it's weak bitchy shit written by weak bitchy people for weak bitchy people.
>>151830411Nice reductionism into strawman.
>>151830425Thank you
>>151830361It's not something you can fix. Men cannot show weakness or they are ostracized. And it's mostly women's fault. Women despise weakness in a man. They refuse to socialized with obvious weaklings, and if a man reveals weakness to a woman he is close to, she loses all respect for him. Men learn this lesson early in life, and if anything, are actually more sympathetic to weak men than women are, and might even try to offer him advice about how to make himself stronger and more resilient. That's actually why there's a whole industry of self improvement for men.
>>151830423Do you think Tolkien was weak and bitchy for writing LOTR based on his own war experiences and having Frodo suffer from trauma so badly he never wants to fight again?
>>151830361I hate to tell you this, anon, but no amount of therapy sessions or public advocacy can overcome ten million years of human biological instinct to be disgusted by displays of weakness in males.It sucks, but them's the breaks.
>>151830434It's not a matter of just "having different opinions" it's about having beliefs that impact other people.
>>151830459>>151830447This is the reason why men's suicide rates are so high by the way.
>>151830449Quit playing dumb.
>>151830506Anon, answer the question. Was LOTR made by a bitchy and weak man for being about his own war experiences and how war affects people?
>>151829136>the best thing you can do to a person suffering a panic attack is rape and murder themwhy did kinger say this? seemed out of character
>>151830335>>151830387the duality of anon
>>151830483No it isn't. Women actually attempt suicide far more often than men do. Which means that even though men face far greater pressure to bear their pain alone, they are far better at bearing it up and soldiering on.Men die from suicide far more than women because, as with many, many other things, men are simply better at it. They choose far more lethal means of killing themselves which have a higher chance of working. Women tend to pick wishywashy performative suicide methods because they want attention more than to actually die half the time. Pills, wrist-slitting, and other soft methods fail more than they succeed. Men are more likely to jump off a building or in front of a train, or to shoot themselves or hang themselves. Far more effective.
>>151830527You're arguing in bad faith. Go fuck yourself.
>>151830465Your beliefs also impact other people. But, let me guess, yours only have good impacts and mine only have bad impacts?
>>151830548I'm not arguing in bad faith at all. You only think I'm arguing in bad faith because you know you're wrong and don't have an answer. Was LOTR made by a bitchy and weak man for being about his own war experiences and how war affects people?
>>151830537>Women actually attempt suicide far more often than men doATTEMPT
>>151830554Politics is fundamentally about power and how your beliefs control other people, so yes.
>>151830584Read my whole post. Attempting suicide is a sign of despair, whether you succeed or fail. Men dying more to suicide is because of their chosen methods, not because they succumb to despair more than women do. Women are still far more prone to giving up.
>>151830598I want to respond but this is such a nonsensical answer. Because politics, you're right and I'm wrong?
>>151830661No, you're wrong because I've given a logical argument for why. You haven't given a logical argument showing you're right.
>>151830661>um, wow, just, wowStop this shit.
>>151830534Anon, I've stated multiple times that my problem is that people want these tropes to be gone wholesale because "they've been done too much" instead of wanting them written better. That fundamentally doesn't contradict anything I said.
>>151830701I must be legitimately retarded because I don't see any argument beyond>let me guess, yours only have good impacts and mine only have bad impacts?>Politics is fundamentally about power and how your beliefs control other people, so yes.
>>151830773That it's a toxic mindset because it's a denial of human vulnerability? Are you just pretending to be dense?
>>151830314>But they can't be written better if everyone is doing them, has done them, and is just trying to emulate their favorite depictions of it. It's a trend, it's run its course.>They can't be written better because they just can't okay!?This is completely retarded. Especially considering all the examples are clearly not copying off of each other.
>>151829136cause you're mentally ill
>>151830335Maybe I’m just a fanficfag but the perception this trope is overdone is not about seeing the Puss in Boots scene and the Inside Out scene and thinking you’ve seen it all, it’s about internet people projecting decades of Tumblr anxiety soothing neuroses onto mainstream media. If you were in a fandom with woobie characters you can tell when Hollywood panic attack scenes today pull from that well because they use the same structure and conventions as the fanfic version but rarely do it the ways that were common in older books and movies. Also why it’s perceived as a new trend and people don’t remember or recognize portrayals of anxiety from the past. They feel like they’ve seen it a million times because they have in a specific sense, it’s not the reality though.
>>151829136The way I look at it, you see what authors care about based on what's happening. I dislike what I see as west coast therapy cult shit.It's a legitimate subculture among upper middle/lower upper class white people to become an ultra-normie therapy addict. It's a religion that tells you you're always right.
>>151830791>Are you just pretendingI wish.>it's a toxic mindset because it's a denial of human vulnerabilityWhy is denying human vulnerability toxic? Why ought we not deny human vulnerability?
>>151829136I've never seen a character that has a good reason to be mentaly ill. It's always the most a basic shit.
>>151830894>I wish.You aren't. That's the problem.>>151830894>Why is denying human vulnerability toxic?Because vulnerability leads to more connections and more authentic communication. Denying it only creates more harm and a cycle of harm.
>>151830940Your fault
>>151829136It’s a reflection of mentally unstable artists and their projects would be more successful if they bothered to care about things like rationality and responsibility that provide stability
>>151830361Portraying emotional regulation techniques is one of the few things children’s entertainment does that actually benefits the children, which as we know is bad because nabisco might make less money and women are another species.
>>151829136For me, it's because they only sell sanitized, quirky depictions of mental illness. Trendy little things people want to identify with, because it's in vogue.Mental illness is not pretty. It's not a fun little personality trait. It's involuntary commitment and being unable to keep down a job. It's scratching your skin off and smearing shit on the walls. It's screaming about the Jews or the FBI or whoever and people just looking at the other way, because they don't want to associate with you.But when people talk about media depictions of mental illness, that's not what they want. They want characters who are totally fine, except for one episode about the problem. There can't be any violence or indecent exposure or unacceptable language, just simpering, harmless little fluffballs who just need somebody to care and understand. Everybody has to pretend that mental illness is high functioning autism, self-diagnosis, and occasional therapy. It's just insulting.
>>151830961>You aren't.I'm not pretending or I'm not retarded?>vulnerability leads to more connectionsThat other Anon brought up the fact that men actually risk losing connections by being vulnerable.
>>151831158>I'm not pretending or I'm not retarded?You're retarded and not pretending.>That other Anon brought up the fact that men actually risk losing connections by being vulnerable.All evidence shows that when men are vulnerable around people they trust, it tends to form more intimacy and deeper bonds.
>>151831183>You're retarded and not pretending.Well, I wouldn't want to be dishonest and claim not to be retarded, so I suppose I'm succeeding>All evidence showsWould you be willing to share this evidence or should I just put my trust in your anonymous internet post over his anonymous internet post?
>>151831258>Well, I wouldn't want to be dishonest and claim not to be retarded, so I suppose I'm succeedingYes, you're succeeding at being retarded.>Would you be willing to share this evidence or should I just put my trust in your anonymous internet post over his anonymous internet post?https://healthforlifegr.com/emotionally-vulnerable-in-relationships/
>>151830249Steven Universe Future isn't a panic attack, it's an emotional breakdown.
>>151830311Protecting and defending the vulnerable is pretty much the main cultural expectation of males in all societies. Taking someone aside so they can crash out in private is hardly beyond the general skill set of men, nor is being supportive and talking with someone. >>151830537There is actually a debate about that. Given social conditioning it's also theorized that women are less likely to choose suicide methods that will result in disfigurement.>>151831107There are way more kinds of mental illness than outright psychosis. Hell, there are plenty of outright psychoses that aren't anywhere near as severe as what you're talking about.
It is always really cute when retards bring up Tolkien as some bastion of a bygone era of media before the weak liberals invented mental health like he didn't start writing a few years after or at the same time as Hemmingway, Kafka, Lovecraft and Nabokov. That is ignoring that LOtR is a long winded fruity adventure story about elves and shit with poetry breaks.
