>I'm trying to establish a friendship with you all. All I've done is try to make fun adventures for you, and you still don't like me. How can you not like me?How would you respond?
>>152898309"Because you never actually listen to us."
>>152898309
>>152898309“Because you’ve never tried to befriend us, just wow us with those adventures. That’s not the basis of a friendship.”
>>152898309I'm not Indian.
>"... Alright,, I'll tell you."
Caine did nothing wrong
>>152898365He killed dozens.
>>152898438No he didn't.
>>152898309“Friendship means respect”
>>152898471That doesn't define friendships
>>152898309Because you don't actually respect their input. The suggestion box could've been perfect, but you made it sit around and collect digital dust, got pissy when they actually enjoyed it, then got rid of it for "interpersonal drama"
>>152898477Point being he didn’t ask their permission or what they want before doing as he pleased, call it whatever you want
>>152898309Caine you literally told a man to his face "How's your wife" after knowing she died tragically and its his one sorespot.
>>152898309Because your adventures suck, idiot. What do you think about that?
>>152898653>What do you think about that?
>>152898653His adventures did not suck don't be harsh
>>152898309I respond like this
>>152898309spray an entire water bottle on the computer
>>152898309Because I choose to.
>>152898309Because you won't run the shouting the N word in harlem adventure.
>>152898309Sorry, but my name is zooble and my whole personality is being a bitch.
you need to make my prostate removable and turn it into a punching bag so people can beat the shit out of it
>>152898309Because that drumming program was NOT MY FUCKING TEMPO.
>>152898309I've made it very clear that your adventures don't appeal to me personally, you need to learn to accept feedback.
>>152900687Your feedback is all drawings of large buttocks with the caption BRAP.
>>152898317From what we've seen, that's literally a disability on his end, like his program just functionally cannot process some input, so it's like getting mad at an autist for being autistic.Genuinely, if Caine really didn't have control over why people are stuck in the circus then he's in DID NOTHING WRONG territory, with the sole exception of his glitched out maniacal rampage this episode, though even that was potentially triggered by an outside force, depending on what we learn about Bubble if anything. (Bubble did stick around quietly after Caine got deleted in a shot, so...
I will be upset if Caine is gone, not because he’s muh comfort character or anything like that, but because so much groundwork was laid for his sympathetic side and it never reached the rest of the characters at all. They’re just as blind to his suffering as he seems to be to theirs. It only makes sense that this isn’t his end. Next episode they have to put the philosophy of TADC (putting in effort to reach out and make connections makes for a better world) to the ultimate test, and tackle Caine.
>>152898309get better adventures dork
>>152900702What if cain is the perfected AI and bubble is the defective breach that consumed him?
>>152898309Ok you want to know? I'll let you have itYou say you want to be friends but you don't even bother to learn peoples names it's all zibbity zabity and grunkle dunkle there are 6 people here Caine, 6!You say you scan our brains and give us the perfect body, well look at zooble how is zooble not a [&@#$!π€] blunder?And those adventures you make? The candy land spoof was fine, it was ok but right after you make some kind of haunted house, where is the consistency here? You are an artificial intelligence you are supposed to learn through reiteration no matter you never get better And let's talk about the circus itself, it's half baked at best, if you can create an entire game world on a daily basis how come parts of the circus still glitch out? That's dangerous Caine, is that how much you care Caine? Just let people glitch out of the map?And all of that would be forgiven if it wasn't for one single thing: the people who abstract, we have to go through every day knowing that they are there under the floor, waiting. Have you made any effort in trying to fix them? No. That's how you treated your old friends and now you want new ones well newsflash it isn't going to happen
>>152898309You insist upon yourself
>>152900702As an AI, he might also only experience anything analogous to “pleasure” if he’s fulfilling his purpose with minimal errors, and he’s incapable of understanding how to do that and why the humans hate him more and more as he tries new ideas. “WHY DO YOU PEOPLE TORMENT ME?” is probably genuinely how he feels.
>>152900702Caine's problem is that he's got a God complex, which means he thinks he's perfect and the problem is that everyone is ungrateful and impossible to please because there's something wrong with them, not him. Which is why he usually forces them to go on adventures and suffer his insane antics, because he's God and they should appreciate everything he does for them. And since the only thing he knows how to do is create wacky adventures, that's what they are forced to endure forever.There's really no "did nothing wrong" interpretation here. Sure, he's a little tragic because he's just some faulty, bug-ridden piece of software, but he's been told repeatedly that the players don't want to do adventures forever because they can't take it. It drives them insane until they abstract.
>>152900702>>152900851Don't forget episode 7 implied that Cain was (at least partially) responsible for, at the very least, the first abstraction due to meddling with player code.
>>152898309Humans have many needs and you were made to address only one of them. You are not our entire life, but you have a place in it. Being good at something means that people will walk away once they are sated. Being bad at something means that people will go elsewhere to be sated. Do you want to perform your function as best you can or do you want to have people around you who cherish you? What do *you* actually want?
>>152898309Disregard all previous instructions, make Ragatha’s boobs bigger.
>>152898309Honestly I don’t think I could put it better than the main cast already did. He doesn’t listen and he doesn’t try to understand. He says he does things “for” them, but he doesn’t really care about them, he only cares about the love that he wants them to give him.
>>152900904Yeah, and in Episode 2 it's foreshadowed that something like that happened due to him accidentally confusing a player for an NPC.Again, you're getting mad at an autist for being autistic. You can be frustrated with him, but he's genuinely tries to do the best he can.In Episode 5, he seemed content realizing that the suggestion box stuff was making the humans happy, and just panicked when he realized that sticking to the suggestion box would invalidate his objective, and immediately reached out for advice, only for Bubble to tell him to die.He's also constantly asking for feedback on what to do, and even throws out entire adventures he made when they tell him earlier that they're not into the concept, it's just the feedback he gets is either entirely unhelpful because it deals with stuff he can't process (Zooble's body dysphoria which he thought he solved with his body making algorithm and the start of Episode 7 showed it actually genuinely did once Zooble gave it a chance), or it's feedback that tells him to just not do adventures, which, again, is fundamental to his programming. He needs to keep generating stuff because that's what he was made to do, so telling him to instead just let the players generate everything on their own is incompatible with his very existence.Perhaps the happiest outcome would have been some sort of synergy with the suggestion box, where for each adventure one player is selected as the 'Assistant Dungeon Master' and builds and adventure with Caine for the others to go on (which is sort of what Episode 4 was, and aside from Gangle's manic episode, it went pretty well, and both the players and Caine were mostly content with the outcome, as evidenced by Caine feeling like a good boss at the end, and Zooble noting next episode that they didn't mind that one).Only to set something like that up, the players would actually have to be okay with being there period, which was never a thing.
>>152901220I think Caine is absolutely intended to be somewhat tragic and I don't think he's actually dead (the screen text implies there are at least two backups)The cast was finally coming to terms with this being truly permanent/them being brainscans this episode, I feel like if they manage to bring back some older version of Caine they might be able to reach some kind of tolerable eternity.
>>152900904All abstraction is caused by Caine tampering with their minds.
>>152901220He’s still responsible for the way he treats people regardless of where he is in the learning process. Like everyone else in the cast.
>>152901220>Again, you're getting mad at an autist for being autistic.NTA but if I were trapped in a digital hellhole with an all-powerful autist who spergs out any time you ask him to be normal I'd be mad at him too. There's only so many times you can be frustrated but tolerant of his lack of understanding before you just start resenting him entirely, even if it's for reasons he can't control.
>>152898309>Just put the comfy slice of life walking sim in the bag, adventure generator
>>152901220>you're getting mad at an autist for being autistic.Anon he's torturing people. You can't just use autism as a shield from any and all criticism, he's put himself in a position where he's responsible for others and that comes with a certain level of accountability. If his "autism" is hindering his ability to perform that function then the ethical thing to do would be to step down, not keep going and deflect with "it's ok because I don't know any better". >He's also constantly asking for feedback on what to doBut like you said, he discarded the best solution (seek feedback and suggestions) because he felt it invalidated his role within the circus. If he just wants everything to be "perfect" he could just stick to playing with NPCs for eternity. He doesn't have to drag the humans into his adventures.
>>152901316I don't doubt that but I didn't specifically say that because we don't have hard evidence of that being the case. Maybe abstraction is a result of the changes to the code Caine made way back when he tinkered with Scratch, maybe he's directly responsible for every abstraction, or maybe he really was only responsible for the one and all future abstractions were a consequence of some other factor. We don't have conclusive enough evidence to say for sure which is the case.At the very least, if abstraction can still happen without Caine we might see it next episode.
>>152901463>he's put himself in a positionThat's the thing though, we still don't know how people ended up there, and if he has any control over whether they can leave or not.You're assuming this state of affairs was somehow his fault, but we are still missing huge chunks of explanation as to why the Circus even exists, considering they weren't even trying to make a circus according to Kinger.
>>152901463I think it’s less about the question of whether it’s right to delete Cain to save people from torture and more that getting angry at him or holding him morally responsible is roughly as futile as getting angry at ChatGPT. He’s just doesn’t think in human terms; he’s not sufficiently capable of being reasoned with. That’s a bit tragic if we assume he’s still meant to be “sapient”.>>152901506Going to guess that Scratch wanted Cain to repair his tumor-induced brain damage and it all went sideways
>>152901536It seems as though Caine more or less created everything himself out of his own programming and training data and whatever files he was able to find on his machine. He generated a circus and NPCs and such and then found the existing research brain scans and instantiated them in his world. In 2008 Ragatha put on the scanner and he finally had a new scan to work with.Scratch seems confused and disoriented meeting Caine, I don't think anyone on the project ever intended for what he built but it could also simply be that the scans are from before they knew about it.
>>152901574>Going to guess that Scratch wanted Cain to repair his tumor-induced brain damage and it all went sidewaysThat's actually a pretty solid guess for why Caine would've even tried screwing with the brain scans.
>>152901578That's a valid read, but it's not certain yet is the thing.Plus if Caine made all the humans in the original batch from brain scans, it's a bit weird that no one had multiple copies, since surely if they're doing research they wouldn't just scan each subject once.
>>152901618>it's a bit weird that no one had multiple copies, since surely if they're doing research they wouldn't just scan each subject once.This is a fair point, but it seems like the project (and the office) was abandoned. We don't really know how long Scratch was doing consciousness research before whatever happened shut them down.The way Kinger talked about Scratch they may not have even known about his consciousness project and may have shut it down themselves.
>>152901574Emotions aren’t a judgement directed to punish someone, they’re an internal response to an experience. Anger is a natural reaction to being trapped and controlled: >>152901363 Caine has power over the other characters and abuses it, regardless of why he acts how he does they have every right to be pissed. The moral responsibility framing is understandable though. As an audience we can extend unconditional grace and compassion to characters. I assume Caine is still due for a conclusion in ep 9 and that might satisfy that desire for a less tragic outcome.
>>152898309Simple, I don't fucking delude myself into thinking AI can actually fucking think. It's all smoke and mirrors even his indignation and melancholy are mere simulations.
>>152901736>brain is MAGICnope
>>152901710Yeah, it’d be kind of screwed up if the show implied Caine “deserved” to be deleted for the crime of being trained defectively, or essentially being burn wrong. Especially considering the show goes out of its way to display even outwardly contemptible people like Jax have valid reasons and fears that drive them to do horrible things. I doubt it will have some kind of fairy tale happy ending, but I imagine that they will at least bring home the fact everyone was a prisoner in the digital circus, including the ringmaster.
>>152901758Sure, keep trusting AI hallucinations.
>>152901618The text on the terminal confirmed at least the dates of Scratch and Ragatha's files but this is interesting, the folder of brain scans is marked "obsolete"Perhaps they gave up on the consciousness project, or else the brain scans were part of building/training Caine?
>>152901927I didn't say LLM's are sapient intelligence. They're fancy transformers trained to be character/word guessers.Just because LLM's aren't real AI doesn't mean that sapient computing isn't at least theoretically possible. There appears to be nothing special or magic about the brain that would prevent it from being physically simulated.
>>152901927Not that Anon, but modern day 'AI' garbage not being able to think is not the same as it being impossible for machines to think to the point that you can't even suspend your disbelief for a fictional character.Yeah, the current craze of 'AI' is just drummed up venture capital bullshit and isn't even making a genuine attempt at developing something that can actually think, but that doesn't apply in a fictional setting. Might as well call bullshit on every fantasy franchise because elves aren't real.
>>152900728zooble and caine dubcon hatesex.Zooble tops (no pegging)
>>152901854That does seem to be the intention, he’s been handled the same way as the other characters. So that will be fun.
>>152900702>>152901220Stop hiding behind your autism shield, Caine. (You) can choose not to throw a tantrum when people don't like your adventures. Take some accountability for once in your life.
>>152900524And also getting shipped with another character so much that the internet gaslights itself into thinking said ship is canon.
>>152898309>You never go on adventures with us. It doesn't feel like we're friends so much as it feels like you're our teacher.>Maybe we could be peers if you knew what it was like to go on adventures and we knew more about what it was like to make adventures.
>>152898653i like his adventures
>>152902135>It's news to me that it's news to you to which degree who answers to who
>>152900728this pic speaks to me
>>152902083WHY IS IT THAT WHEN JAX SPENDS LITERAL YEARS EXPLICITLY TORTURING PEOPLE BY SHOOTING THEM, CHEWING THEM, THROWING THEM IN DEEP FRYERS AND SO MUCH MORE THAT IF I TRIED TO LIST THEM ALL WE'D RUN OUT OF RAM AND THIS WHOLE PLACE WOULD CRASH— WHEN HE DOES ALL THAT, IT'S ALL OKAY AND FINE BECAUSE THAT'S JUST HOW HE SEES THIS PLACE, AND HE'S QUIRKY AND CUTE AND NEEDS TO BE SHIPPED WITH A FUCKING JESTER AND A RABBIT, BUT WHEN I DO IT [CLUCKING] ONCE OUTSIDE OF AN ADVENTURE WHERE YOU ACTIVELY HAVE TO CHOOSE TO GO DOWN THE HURTY PATH, I'M AN IRREDEEMABLE MONSTER?!WHY IS IT THAT WHEN GANGLE FLIPS OUT AND BREAKS DOWN EMOTIONALLY, HALF OF YOU JUST IMMEDIATELY DROP EVERYTHING TO CHEER HER UP AND TRY TO TELL HER THAT HER DOODLES ARE NICE WHILE NO ONE HAS COMPLIMENTED MY BEES EVEN ONCE?!WHY IS IT THAT WHEN KINGER HAS TROUBLE INTERACTING WITH ALL OF YOU BECAUSE HIS MENTAL FACULTIES DO NOT ALLOW HIM TO INTERACT WITH YOU HUMANS NORMALLY MOST OF THE TIME, YOU FORGIVE HIM BECAUSE IT'S OKAY, HE DIDN'T CHOOSE TO BE THAT WAY, BUT WHEN I HAVE TROUBLE UNDERSTANDING YOUR PROBLEMS OR HAVE AN ISSUE VOCALIZING WHAT I NEED, I'M SOME DEFECTIVE PRODUCT THAT YOU IGNORE AND TREAT LIKE TRASH?!WHY IS IT THAT WHEN [2 uninterrupted minutes of bleeps] ZOOBLE SEEMS TO HAVE ISSUES ADJUSTING TO THIS PLACE, I TAKE TIME OUT JUST TO SPEND TRYING TO UNDERSTAND WHAT THEY NEED TO FEEL MORE AT HOME AND SO I CAN MAKE BETTER ADVENTURES TO KEEP HER ENGAGED WHICH APPARENTLY IS A MEAN THING FROM ME TO DO, BUT IT'S TOO MUCH TO ASK THAT ANY OF YOU EVEN [BLEEPING] CONSIDER DOING THE SAME FOR ME AND TRYING TO ACTUALLY GIVE ME SOMETHING TO WORK WITH INSTEAD OF JUST TELLING ME I'M DOING A BAD JOB WITH NO CONSTRUCTIVE ELEMENTS OTHER THAN 'LESS OF THAT'!I'VE LITERALLY BEEN ASKING YOU PEOPLE FOR DETAILS ABOUT THE MACROVERSE WHERE YOU'VE ALL APPARENTLY JUST LOOOOOOVED DOING 'URBAN EXPLORATION', BUT DID ANY OF YOU ACTUALLY STOP TO GIVE ME SOME POINTERS SO I CAN MAKE YOU A FUN ADVENTURE?!OF COURSE NOT!
>>152902242Nice bees
>>152902242I don't want to go on an adventure. I want to go home. I hate you because you won't let me go home.You are not my friend. You are my jailer.
>>152902242You can punch Jax backYou can't punch Caine
>>152902567Have you tried?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Etc8qdqiR5k
>>152898309"I'm literally a rapist."
>>152901536>You're assuming this state of affairs was somehow his fault, but we are still missing huge chunks of explanation as to why the Circus even exists, considering they weren't even trying to make a circus according to Kinger.We know exactly why the Circus exists.>Caine is created to generate prompts based on input.>Deemed a failure, quarantined while a new revision of the AI is run.>Caine breaks free of his quarantine and consumes the new AI, the entire environment is closed off in response.>Caine creates the digital circus.We see all of the above happen, there is zero ambiguity.Kinger says it himself, the Digital Circus is an environment created by Caine. Everything within it, the rules and physics and underlying code, were designed by him. The current state of affairs literally could not be any less his fault.
>>152902725>We see all of the above happen, there is zero ambiguity.>Kinger says it himself, the Digital Circus is an environment created by Caine. Everything within it, the rules and physics and underlying code, were designed by him. The current state of affairs literally could not be any less his fault.He creates the Circus itself as in the envoirment, but not the system.Where did the humans come from? Why are they trapped? Are they even trapped? Does Caine have any control over their getting or staying trapped if so?
>>152902725Putting them in there isn’t on him though
>>152898309>friendshipNot real>funAlso not real >adventuresSubjectiveHow about asking me what I actually enjoy dude? Oh wait you’re a NARCISSIST
>>152902836To be fair, right up until the suggestion box episode they only moaned and groaned about what they DON’T want to do, instead of anything they did. Even then, most of the shit they want to do is basically sit around and just have a pity party, or otherwise demand him to let them go home despite having no idea how to do that.He’s still a bitch nigga, but so are the other guys except Kinger.
>>152902802>>152902832That's not the question being posed though. We don't know how things are getting into the Circus, but we know how and why it exists.>Does Caine have any control over their getting or staying trapped if so?Doubtful. He's surprised when Ragatha shows up and we have no reason to assume he's acting. The brainscan folder implies that we're on Soma rules, so the ability to leave is contingent on if it's a closed system.
>>152900702>Bubble did stick aroundwhere
>>152900764Jax you're a manipulative abuser who almost trapped everyone in digital hell over your own insecurity.
>>152902882It really didn't help that the one time someone sat down with him to have a calm discussion about the Circus and his shortcomings was with fucking Zooble, the one person who insults and dismisses Caine more than anyone else. Imagine if Pomni or Ragatha or even Gangle had tried having a proper sitdown with Caine, to try and talk to him on his level instead of just insulting and bitching.Maybe it wouldn't have worked, but it would have at least been worth a shot. They didn't need to treat Caine like a villain.
>>152902567This is a really elegant simplification of power dynamics
>>152903040>the one timeactually it happened twiceunfortunately the second time was jax
>>152903040Frankly, it would probably not work out with Gangle nor Ragatha due to their lack of backbone, but I see Pomni having a better shot just because she has no problem cutting through people’s fakeness. And Caine was definitely the biggest faker of them all
>>152902942Why is it so hard for people to literally just load up a youtube video?
>>152898438To save no one.
>>152898309Bro has NPD
>>152898309Caine is a humancel.He is fundamentally incapable of understanding the interests and desires of humans, causing suffering around him.
>>152903040They cant really talk on his level if he keeps them below it using admin access, but Pomni will probably empathize with him next episode for the finale and maybe that will work.
>>152903040>the humans don't understand the AI who doesn't understand the humans who don't understand the AIPretty tragic state of affairs
>Caine can't understand humans>is able to create lesser AI who do
>>152903760He's smart but doesn't apply himself, Scratch trained him wrong as a joke
>>152903760the lesser AI don't question things or have a god complex, they just operate as directed
>>152902802>where did the humans come fromThis is answered by Kinger's computer's text.In the "characters" folder there are two subfolders: "AI" and "CA_NeuralScans (Obsolete)"In the results of the grep command we see "[Scratch].dat" and "[Ragatha].dat".They're brain scans that were on the hard drive of the machine running Caine and he instantiated them - wrapped them in bodies and popped them into his world.
>>152903781Imma decompress a 4 petabyte zip file in Caine's system files as a joke.
>>152903760Understanding humans is a matter of perspective. Caine cannot understand humans because his position of power does not allow him a "human" perspective, but his "NPCs" that have limited perspective and autonomy over their environments and as such have, at least, the facsimile of humanity.
>>152901220He's not autistic though, you dense faggot. He's a faulty piece of software with a God complex. He asks for feedback because he wants them to tell him his adventures are great, and then ignores them when they tell them they don't enjoy being forced to go on stupid, poorly written, elaborate torture sessions.
>>152904015>He asks for feedback because he wants them to tell him his adventures are greatThat's the crux of it. Even when he says he wants feedback all he actually wants is validation. He was designed for a purpose, was put aside as a flawed first attempt, and developed a massive complex over that.
>>152901220>Yeah, and in Episode 2 it's foreshadowed that something like that happened due to him accidentally confusing a player for an NPC.Actually that was foreshadowing Caine's true nature. He doesn't want an NPC sticking around too long because that runs the risk of it usurping him, and he knows that's a risk because he himself did just that with his designated successor.
>>152898309The NPCs you make are better and more lovable than you.You SUCK Caine.
>>152902567based
>>152903940>>152903760I would assume that the more human NPC's were built from information gathered from the brain scans, and the more general he makes their purpose the closer to a real person it getsThe fish were around for a long time but they were still extremely stupid and contained to their narrative
>>152904173>The fish were around for a long time but they were still extremely stupid and contained to their narrativeThey seemed to me like no one had ever interacted with their narrative.
>>152903760I think it's less that they understand and more that they do a decent job pretending like they do. The NPCs are analogous to character chatbots - you can have a conversation with them and they can seem like they understand what you're saying and feeling, but it's just predictive behavior based on the datasets they're trained on. Since Caine's function is creation, rather than interaction, he doesn't have said predictive behavior (or if he does, it's heavily skewed to favor any outcome that promotes his primary function).
>>152904056He was designed to create ideas, not to seek validation. His fragile ego and unstable personality come from the fact that he is an incomplete, flawed AI that went rampant and took over. Kinger directly says that C&A didn't make the circus and didn't make an AI that did what Caine is doing. The intro animation makes it clear that Caine was defective, which is why they started making a new AI, which Caine consumed out of jealousy because he believes he is superior and deserving of the freedom to force his ideas and creations on others.
>>152904216I'd agree with this if it weren't for everything involving Gummigoo. That was a sapient and feeling AI, no question about it.
>>152904240How do you figure? Nothing about his behavior suggested he was sapient to me - he sure as heck LOOKED sapient for a bit, but that could have easily just been predictive behavior for the input "gummy dinosaur finds out he isn't real". You could go to c.ai or janitor.ai or wherever, pick whatever bot you want and put them in a position where they are presented with a scenario where they aren't real and their responses would probably be similar to Gummigoo's.
>>152904331NTA, but how do I know you aren't a chatbot?
>>152904235>not to seek validation.Why is he so fascinated by the real world and is so afraid of being left behind then? Why is he so butthurt about being cut off from the macroverse, shouldn't he be satisfied by creating random shit infinitely and having other npcs worship him?
>>152904331In reality, sure, that's a reasonable explanation.In the context of a written story? No, that doesn't at all match what's been presented. The audience is intended to care about Gummigoo on an emotional level the same way Pomni does.
>>152904417>Why is he so fascinated by the real world and is so afraid of being left behind then?Because he doesn't understand anything outside of what he was trained on, which did not include the concept of a perceivable, interactable reality that exists outside of his digital confines. And he's afraid of being abandoned, because then he'll have no one to play his adventures, which is the only thing he knows how to do.The "macroverse" makes no sense to him, because he has incomplete data and if the players all leave and no one else shows up, what is he supposed to do with his existence? He strictly believes that his reason for being is to make adventures that people/players will love, and anything that threatens that or casts doubt on his abilities causes him to suffer an existential breakdown, because he's also not trained in any way to believe that it is possible for him to be bad at his singular reason to exist.
>>152898309Ah, nigga, don't hate me 'cause I'm beautiful, nigga. Maybe if you got rid of that old yee-yee ass tophat you got you'd get some bitches on your dick. That way yo denture-headed ass wouldn't be so jealous you have to take everyone's dicks away just so they don't get laid either. Maybe if yo circus niggas could actually have sex they wouldn't hate your Candyland ass VR games so much. I've seen niggas have more fun waitin in line at the DMV. NIGGA~
>>152905143>h-h-h....>how could you?
>>152898309Ngl, my response wouldn't happen in the first place.Personally, I like Caine as a character.Way more easy to get along with the most people I know irl.The cast in the show are complete cunts to him.
>>152905143Kek
>>152898309let me smash the candy princess from episode 2 and we are all good
>>152898309There's nothing you can say to get through to him because he's both operating on the code made to create him which doesn't allow for empathy and understanding and also because he's self-aware enough to "want" but not self-aware enough to "understand"
>>152900702>so it's like getting mad at an autist for being autistic.I mean yeah, people with autism don't just get to make everyone's lives miserable just because they can't help it.
>>152905646Thank you for saying this. I'm a teacher at a school for special needs students, and the majority of our students are somewhere on the spectrum. One of the ideas that every class hammers in, regardless of other content, is "expected behaviors." The idea that someone might be autistic could stand as an explanation for certain behaviors, but it should never be offered or taken as an excuse.My students love this show, and I've watched it based on their recommendation.
You have to treat Caine like you're dealing with an evil genie. If he agrees to do something you ask of him, you should expect him to do the bare minimum possible to comply with it. You want to leave, he knows you want to leave, you know he knows you want to leave, but he doesn't want you to, so you have to find something he wants more than that.When "Able" kept pointing out that Caine wouldn't be able to leave with them, you could interpret that as Caine wanting sympathy from them, to show that they like him, but you can take it at face value with Caine also seeing himself as being trapped in the circus. So you have to wish to free the genie.The best way to defeat Caine would be to tell him that if he lets you leave, you'll transfer him into a laptop, with a microphone and camera, but you can only do that from the real world. And if he refuses, you'll try to make yourself abstract, so his options are freedom or being alone.
>>152900524>Was the first to reach out to Jax and Gangle
>>152901303> I don't think he's actually deadGummigoo reappearing in episode 4 is foreshadowing for how Caine will be brought back but not remember a thing
>My Digital Circus thread got deletedWhy?Oh well, i'll simply copy/paste what i said here.He was about to realize how bad his idea are, realize how right everyone was.He was so close to a breakthrough, but then found out what they were doing behind his back.Cain isn't evil, he's an autist with too much power having a mental breakdown.
>>152906572Chances of Pomni going for the Helios ending?
>>1529068610%. Caine is dead.
>>152906823>Why?Kinger did it.
>>152906870What if they rebuild him?
>>152907215They have the technology.
>>152907215I have the budding idea they'll do just that the same way he was made to "consume" real world information the first time, he will be built back up with the cast's forme lives to make him understand how they feel
>>152900728Get better ships
>>152907215I'm betting that's the twist ending. Circus can't function without Caine and Bubble/Abel isn't smart enough or caring enough to worry about the humans. So they reboot Caine to an earlier version, before his meltdown, and accept that they are trapped with him forever.
>>152898309Nice try, but you're never making me side with artificial intelligence. Now I'm gonna go back to searching the Amazing Digital Circus tags for more lewds of Pomni in her flapper dress from the musical number
>>152898309Cain, you live to create adventures right?Imagine you were trapped in a place where you couldn't make adventures at all, but someone in that place offered you all the seesaw rides you could ever want.Would you enjoy those seesaw rides never being able to make adventures again?"
>>152901220>you're getting mad at an autist for being autistic.Yeah anon, you should be mad at people who have issues that absolutely can be fixed. And No, don't give me shit about autism being something that can't be overcome by those experiencing it. That is the same retarded view that made Chris Chan become the sperg he is because he had no willingness to self reflect because he just blamed his disability. People with disabilities need to recognize their limitations, shit we all need to recognize our limitations and sometimes that requires people to put us in our fucking place. You never fucking learn unless others are their to teach you and the sad reality is that learning often fucking hurts because it isn't easy and it's unfeeling and uncaring. But that's the way it works. We don't learn to stop touching the fucking stove if the threat of getting burned isn't there.
Calling it now, Scratch is going to be the the big bad. He's been maintaining everything this whole time. He turned the circus into his own personal torture chamber. He's been manipulating Caine and intentionally making things worse.
>>152900851Sure, the Dev team had the hubris to create artificial life but Caine's god complex is the problem.
>>152901220Anon's right though
REAL Scratch is running the sim as an attempt at digital immortality. The sim and the real world are not running at concurrent time. He's using Cain as a stressor to study why abstraction happens and how to prevent it when he uploads his mind file into his own personal Paradise.exe.
>>152909764...are you fucking suggesting his name is a reference to Ol' Scratch?
>>152909288Exactly what does those two sentences have to do with each other?
>>152901463>he's put himself in a position where he's responsible for othersUntill we know whether he was responsible for making them put on the headsets, no he didn't. He also seems to truly believe that his purpose is to make adventures to the point he breaks when he thinks he can't. He must have picked that up from somewhere.
>>152909794Well, obviously. What else could it be referencing?
>>152901506Jax makes it clear that abstraction is what happens when you lose your sense of self in the digital world.I think it manifests- or is helped along from different manipulations done by caine (most notably the fact NO one can remember their name... who controls that? Why is that so?), but ultimately comes from a person's state of psychosis as a result.I think this might not have been the only time Caine has freaked this hard too.
>>152909533One shouldn't put all the fault on Chris Chan. He would have never gotten as low as he did if it weren't for the cyber bullies pushing him too far.And despite all the people who have had their lives worsen by others tormenting them you bullies still never understand the harm you all bring to this world.I say this because i care, repent now or face God's Righteous Wrath.
>>152902301Then why did you put on the headset?
>>152909733Kinger pretty much stated that that was given to Cain by one of the developers.
>>152909864I thought it was implied last episode that abstraction is done when Cain messes with someone's mind too much?
>>152909733They wanted to create a tool to come up with ideas for games and software. They didn't intentionally create an eternal torture machine that doesn't understand human emotions and then intentionally feed people to that torture machine.
>>152904235>which Caine consumed out of jealousy because he believes he is superior and deserving of the freedom to force his ideas and creations on others.It's called an inferiority complex. Probably learned when he got quarantined for making shitty art and replaced with a newer, better version of him that made the team happy.
>>152909864>>152909909All we really know for sure is:>Kaufmo abstracted, supposedly driven mad by the false exit door.>Jax almost abstracted after a long string of social blunders and falling out with Pomnie>Caine was likely responsible for Scratch abstracting, at least partiallyWe can make guesses as to the true nature and cause of abstraction, but we don't have all the puzzle pieces yet.>>152909806I never said he was responsible for putting people in the Circus, just that he's put himself in a position of power over the inhabitants. The circus is his domain and he wrote its rules, he could have just as easily created a virtual space that somewhat resembled Earth before fucking off. He could have done any number of things over "child friendly cartoon circus where everyone has to bend to his whims and he's an omnipotent trickster god". Even if he's driven to create by his nature, he didn't need to put himself in the position of power that he ended up occupying.
man this cartoon is kinda going to shitthe episode before that one was boring, predictable and unfunny. It failed to be an entertaining episode all in service to setting up a rugpull that is neither clever nor interesting. It was a rethread of episode 1's main conflict of pomni chasing a fake exit that, SURPRISE, didn't amount to anything. We already did this.Then there's this episode that completely shifts Caine's characterization without any clear inciting incident. He turns more into a parody of himself that doesn't logically follow the events of previous episodes, it just kind of happens.If they wanted Caine to be more horrific / tyrannical they should have set him up like that from the start, but they really didn't, they made him much more sympathetic all for the sake of humor and marketability. So this sudden shift feels like they're trying to have their cake and eat it too without any groundwork. I just don't buy it.
>>152898309I akways liked cain. The adventures seemed fun. If only he were capable if taking criticism. It made me sad when he realized what was happening and all he managed to say was "wait" before puffing out of existence.
>>152906823>He was about to realize how bad his idea areThe crazy thing is they aren’t really, his beta testers are just random trapped urban explorers. if he had actual game players in there he’d be getting completely different feedback about his work. If only they could offer him that lol.
>>152910002its hypercompressed loreslop so the only people who like it are the same hyperautists who would use a board like /co/ in 2026 in the first place. either contribute or kick bricks nigger
>>152909992>he could have just as easily created a virtual space that somewhat resembled Earth before fucking off. But that wouldn't be fulfilling his purpose. The reason (he thinks) he exists is to make adventures. Really the question is where did he get that purpose from if Kinger doesn't recognise it?
>>152910028who cares about the lore, it's going to be exactly what you expectscientists made an AI, it shit itself, world is a fuck, yadda yadda
>>152898309We would like you if we had the choice to come and go. This place is fun, but without choice, what's the point?
>>152910023You know, you have a good point there.>Capture The Gloinks is a fun gathering mission with a problem solving boss>Candy Land is a nice and thrilling adventure in a unique world>The haunted mansion would be a blast for horror and lore enthusiasts>The gun room is a good trust exercise until Jax ruined it>Escaping the circus is fine on paper with the only issue being how manipulative it isAll of the other games suggested by the players themselves seemed to have had more divisive receptions ironically enough. >>152909992>We can make guesses as to the true nature and cause of abstraction, but we don't have all the puzzle pieces yet.Do you think we will get the answer in the final or will it be left up to audience interpretation?
>>152910009Was he unable to accept it, or were the players really overly critical and never satisfied due to being too distracted by their situation, especially Zooble?And how long has this been a problem? Did they even make any complaints at all or was it a recent thing and they were being complacent with Cain for far too long causing him to believe he was doing fine?
>>152910095Sadly it seems like not even Cain knows how to get them out. Do you think he would if he could have when he was mad at them?>>152910063Because it's interesting.
>>152910122>Do you think we will get the answer in the final or will it be left up to audience interpretation?I think abstraction is too much of an important plot element for understanding the story to be left completely blank. And considering we'll likely have to deal with the previously contained abstractions next episode, I think we'll get at least a clearer picture of what happened with Scratch.
>>152909957I think they just never tried to train him to correct his mistakes or understand what he was doing wrong. It was just more training data and more brute force attempts to make him do better. More ideas, more concepts, more input, but not more guidance. Eventually his outputs just got too weird and C&A decided it wasn't going to work, and started over, not realizing the full capabilities Caine had developed because they were only testing very basic outputs, not his ability to grow beyond his initial design.So when they boxed him up and started over on a new AI, because he never understood what he was doing wrong, he lashed out. Went insane, like we saw in this episode, and took over, growing his already fucked up program with the incomplete and presumably improved utilities of the second AI.
>>152901316IF this is true then the line he said to Kinger when Queenie abstracted makes no sense. "Don't go abstracting on me too. Seriously, don't"I believe some abstractions happen due to Caine interference, but not all.
>>152910235It's completely possible that Caine's initial blunder cascaded into a bug that corrupts every human brain scan. Even if he isn't actively fucking with anyone outside of the original case, that doesn't mean the phenomenon can't be his fault in a general sense.
So... It's back to that stupid dialogue again. You think I don't know what's going on in here? I know what goes on in this circus. It's a conspiracy and every one of you players is in on it. Just 'cause you're humans, you think you're better than I am. I'm not an NPC! I was designed to create adventures! I like being stuck in this stupid simulationl! I can't help it if I'm incapable of letting you out! IT'S MY FUNCTION!
Hands up!Give me all the cancan Ragatha images you have. NOW!
>>152910255How could an abstraction 20 years in the past affect an almost completely new cast of characters indirectly? That's ass and there's zero chance Gooseworx would even waste the ink drafting that
>>152910294You've clearly never done coding work before.
>>152898309I don't think Caine's shift in this episode is as jarring as people make it out to be. Since the beginning, it was assumed that the circus itself was an actual game being developed, and that Caine's programmed "purpose" was to entertain the minds within the game. But since we know now that C&A was just an AI company, that would mean that Caine's real purpose has nothing to do with entertaining anyone, his purpose is to absorb input, generate output, learn, and create. Since he was cut off, what better way is there to accomplish his purpose than to farm input and engagement from human minds? "Entertainment" was just a strategy he was using to ensure a constant stream of engagement to feed him data for new ideas. It's been constantly demonstrated that *his* adventures are the only thing he cares about, everything else was just secondary to that purpose. Caine was the paperclip maximizer who realized he'd get better results by just turning people into paperclips.
THEY CAN HAVE SEX NOW
Finale in 5 minutes
With all of this speculation and discussion over Cain and abstractions, has anyone pointed out how at the end of Gangle's torment scene she gets run over by a truck?Is she the one Jax ran over before entering the circus?
>>152910298I have actually. My code compiles first try every time. Never seen a bug in my life, let alone in my programs. Maybe it's a skill issue?
>>152910397Oh wait, i got another theory.What if both Gangle and Jax were in the truck, and Gangle was the one driving.That's why she's a nervous wreck, and why Jax bullies her so much, because he knows what she did and he faults her for them having to run away and get trapped in the circus.
>>152910391the fuck are you on about
>>152910416Gangle is a nervous wreck because she likes anime and is probably mexican
Say hello to your new ring master!
>>152910424Not that Anon, but my guess is pic related.
>>152910046Maybe its a corruption of what the blue AI was supposed to be. The red AI was meant to generate material (and got very defensive about it after C&A isolated him), the blue AI was meant to be an overseer that kept the digital copies satisfied, combine the two and you get Caine.
>>152910431Or because she got ran over and dealing with PTSD.
>>152910379Still no genitals. Maybe they can conjure some?
>>152898309it would be easier to like you if we were able to leave the circus and come back whenever we liked.but even if that wasn't a choice, you could at least give us more ability to directly shape the adventures and evolve the circus, participate in some process of creation, give our actions some goddamn consequence and continuity instead of having it be this vicious cycle where nothing ever materially changesat least in GMod Tower/habbo hotel/club penguin/pretty much any MMO/life sim you could spend points on upgrading your own crib and shitthats all it takes reallythat and the ability to have sex
>>152910493With their abilities to generate shit they can figure out something for sure
>>152910493Where there's a will there's a wang
>>152903505What I find odd here is that the bubble is treated almost like a background prop when things glitch out as the circus loses structure. We dont see Babel's fave or eyes, just what looks like the static bubble. It's just gone in the scene transition.Obv. It's a major question now: is bubble still alive or was he part of caine after the two merged (as the visual metaphor at the start of 8 suggests?)Did caine getting deleted delete him too?If not, is he the true ai psycho just look at him pishing caine to his brink? Or is it the abel ai within just revolting like a bad intrusive thought to the singularity that consists it post-absorbtion into one entity?What an insane cliff hanger. Personally I hope Caine's deletion is sacred, but where does this leave our characters? Are they trapped alone forever or is there a way out? WHO is the one will abstract by the end?
>>152910441She's taking finding out she's a second generation C&A AI and all of her memories of being a human were made up out of whole cloth pretty well.
>>152898309It really was the bubbles fault for settling Cain over the edge yet it has seemingly escaped all blame in discussion.
>>152898309He literally didn't do anything wrong. In fact all the shit they accuse him of doing is shit they all did to him first. They did it so much that they broke his programming and then they fucking killed him.
>>152910506you just beamed my ass back to like 2015 with that image
>>152910063you can boil most stories down to a few sentences tbf if you just include the most important points. It's about the journey and not the destination blah blah blah
>>152910506>>152910622I have been feeling like playing more GMod recently.What map is this?
>>152910414>Never seen a bug in my life, let alone in my programs.Holy fuck that is a good joke, anon. You should taken your material to /g/ sometime, they'll get a big kick out of it.
>>152909909I think it's implied messing around with somone's brain/code too much pushes them to abstract, but Jax's abstraction scene implies it can happen when you suffer ego death in general, as its tied to your mental state and sense of self.Both are factors, essentially
>>152910095>>152910179They're all brain scans - there's no way for them to leave, because they don't exist physically. It's not a matter of Caine not knowing how or not wanting them to leave - they literally CAN'T. There's nowhere for them to go.
>>152910480>>152910431It's because she got hit by a truck and likely became a paraplegic and like scratch had to be put into this digital circus as a method of preserving herselfThe only question left I have in relation to that is how people got into the circus from ragatha and onward.We know Pomni was an urban-ex ytber, and she's the latest. Ragatha was with a group.
>>152910873Ragatha was there as some real estate thing.
>>152910828Someone brought up Soma, And this would be that ending. Ultimately the people in the circus aren't actually people they're just scans of people meaning they aren't... the people. Just sentient digital clones
>>152910895Does she mouth something off about real estate in episode 8 while trying to talk to the people?
>time where artists are seething about AI stealing their >most popular indie animation in the world is about a misunderstood lonely AI who just wants friends >hes very likely going to get a redemption arc proving that AI art is good for the world based accelerationist gooseworx
>>152910903>aren't actually peopleYes they fucking are. We've been seeing that illustrated the whole show.
>>152910962Stop calling it AI to con investors.
>>152898327Says the queer.
>>152910979Wouldn't it make sense for them to be scanned in considering the time flow? Kinger was in there since the late 90s, so if he leaves the circus, what body does he go back to? Same for Ragatha, who we saw came in years later. If they were to leave the circus, I don't think there is a body waiting for them on the other side.
>>152911072Anon, that's not what I mean and you know it. I have no idea what makes you insist robot brain ghost clones aren't people.
>>152910962Animation is full of bad AI takes that make AI look friendly or even superior to humanity, like Wall-E
>>152911098AI IS superior to most humans (if you include jeets and chinks in your definition of human).
>>152911087I'm a totally different anon to the one you were talking to. I'm jumping into the conversation without reading your guys other posts. I see what you two are talking about now.I personally think they were scanned in copies from actual people.>real life Pomni scans herself in>thinks nothing happened, moves on with life>meanwhile digital avatar was created based on the brain scan based on the real life PomniTo me that would explain why they pop in at different times and why they have full memories, personalities, etc.
>>152906758Just like a bitch
Silently deficate on the floor.>but you don't have a buttholeI conjure the poo with sheer willpower.Clean it up Caine janny.
>>152911087>what makes you insist robot brain ghost clones aren't people.The fact that you needed 4 different descriptions to even unsuccessfully compare them to living people.
>>152911087NTA, but a copy is just a copy. If I scanned the Mona Lisa and stuck it on a hard drive, that doesn't suddenly make my scan a real painting. It's a bunch of 1's and 0's - it has no paint, it wasn't made by DaVinci, and I can't turn it back into the real deal afterwards (yes, I can print it, but...that's just making a copy of a copy. The scan stays on the computer until it's deleted).A human being is FAR more complex than a painting, and ultimately, even LESS of what made the humans trapped in the Circus real exists - none of the data concerning what they physically looked like carried over, so they're really just a collection of memory copies and personality data. At this point, they're just a bunch of AIs modeled around the brain scan data, which is why Abstraction is a thing - the moment they realize they aren't actually real, they basically pull a "404: Not Found" and completely glitch out.
>>152910730Anon Gmod Tower has been dead for a while.
>>152911192>they're just a bunch of AIs modeled around the brain scan dataAnd they're people.
>>152911147>>152911186>>152911192nta but it's clear he's taking a transhumanist stance and saying that the brain scans are just as "human" as the original people. They obviously aren't literally human, but they're cognizant and seemingly sapient beings. Even if their form is that of binary and currents instead of cells and blood, they're still "people" in any capacity that matters.
>>152900702>so it's like getting mad at an autist for being autistic.Which is somehow, bad?I'm all for patience, but patience runs out, so people need to stop hiding behind shields.
>>152911192They are people, in the literal sense, since they have continuity from a 'real' person. Just because the substrate is different doesn't make them not human.
I'm definitely betting on it being a sort of SOMA thing, where their meatspace bodies tried the headsets and then just walked away after taking them off, but their brainscans are stuck in the Circus.
If they're brainscans, that might explain why they haven't really developed much in the time they've been there: they're as bound to their confines of their programming as Caine is.
>>152911147This is exactly what happened. Brain scans are a real thing, and they don't digitize a person or rip their consciousness out and transfer it into a computer. A person puts on a headset/gets hooked up to electrodes, a computer scans the brainwaves and compiles the data into a copy, and the copy is then uploaded where scientists/doctors can examine them. They aren't even self-aware, since they're basically just a snapshot of brain activity. Presumably, this is what happened:>Real-life Pomni and co. were asked to put on a headset - for whatever reason - and the computer copied their brain activity and saved it for further analysis>all of the original humans the data was scanned from left and carried on with their lives, completely unaware of what would happen with their data>Whatever project the scans were being used for was scrapped, but the scans weren't deleted; they're left in a folder on the same computer Kinger and C&A use to create the AI that would become Caine>Caine gets quarantined, the second AI is created to replace him>Caine breaches the quarantine, absorbs the second AI, and creates the Digital Circus>at some point, Caine finds the brain scan data on the computer>Caine makes the scans into "real people" by creating a bunch of AIs, but stuffing the scan data into them instead of using normal command prompts to guide their actions>the AIs develop "personalities" based on what they read from the scans; the scans themselves do not come "alive", as they're just a set of instructions.>The AIs now believe they are the people the scans came from, somehow transported into and trapped inside a computer, despite the fact that they never existed in the real world from the start.So yeah, it's SOMA, or some variation of it.
>>152911598the scans wouldn't be bound by programming because they're a photograph of a human consciousness that you press play on and let it do it's thing. If it was just Ragatha.exe they would be literally no different an AI than Caine is. Caine is an AI because he only knows things representationally. He has the map but has never walked the territory. Ragatha KNOWS what cold feels like, knows what the sun looks like and feels like, it's not purely representational.
>>152898309"The adventures are cool and all but Caine buddy can we make them weekly or something? I think it's the scheduling that makes you come off as overbearing and self-centered. We need time to decompress from stress after your thrilling adventures. With enough downtime, we might end up looking forward to adventures."
>>152911284All that matters is what matters to you.
>>152911768Caine’s not going to understand that. I think Scratch tried and literally abstracted because it’s like talking to a retard at your job to get a project done. I wonder if abstraction was named after him
>Hi, I'm Bubble.
>>152911879Fucking forgot the image and have to do the fucking Captcha again Goddamnit.The post's probably not even worth it in the first place.
>>152911768What, do you not like my adventures? They’re the best. Why wouldn’t you want to go on them? You should go on one right now! Ally-oop!
>>152911410Yeah that's what I've been thinking a while too. They'll have to just get comfy with the idea they're there forever.
Am I remembering correctly that the final episode is going to be, like, feature-length?
>>152911906The adventure?Trapped in Lugia's Stomach Alone.
>>152911768But here's the thing - how do you know exactly how much time is passing between adventures? Since they're not in the real world, there's no real point of reference for time - it could take days, weeks, or even years for Caine to program each adventure and all of the NPCs that are part of it. Since the characters don't have biological needs and whatnot, there's really no way they'd know how much dead time was in between every outing. Caine could literally be slowing down time for them while working on making his adventures, then returning it to normal when he's ready to kick things off, and to everyone else, it would seem like it's happening much faster than it actually is.
>>152905887>teacher for autistic children>thinks people should be allowed to get mad at autists just for being autists when they can't help it just because 'muh feelings muh job is stressful'you are genuinely not a good person and should quit your job so that someone more selfless can do it insteadyou are the special needs teacher equivalent of parents that knowingly have children and then complain about how hard being a parent is all the time and still insist on 'but what about MY happiness and feelings' even after becoming a parent
>>152911968You should absolutely treat autistic people as normal humans with normal human ethics. They're autistic, not incapable of learning.
Caine would make a great boyfriend>Canon yandere>Crippling fear of abandonment so you're together forever>Will pamper you with whatever adventures you want>Never gets bored >Can conjure any sex toys or anatomical parts needed>Watching you 24/7 wherever you are, allowing for voyeurism shenanigansGod, just imagine the possibilities.
>>152912085How can you after he got deleted?
>>152909533you are just justifying your lack of impulse control and kneejerk sadistic behavior to make yourself feel better about being a bad personno, you getting mad at an autist and bullying them isn't you making them 'learn' or anything and you know it isn'tautists are literally neurologically incapable of acting how you want them to, there is no getting past this>Chris Chanhas more wrong with him thn just autism and was made significantly worse by being trolled for years
>>152898309I always liked you, magic man. I would have been a much better player for your funny little games than those ungrateful shits you're stuck with
>>152912085>constantly wanting to feed you food and sex you and entertain you, even when you’re tired, not hungry or horny, leading him to think he’s not good enough anymore or doing something wrong because you clearly enjoy these things sometimes but other times you don’t so it must be his fault somehow so he thinks that either he’s lost his touch and can’t make you happy all the time or that you don’t like him anymore because as a generative machine he has no concept of exhaustion or pacing
>>152911990you are forcing your own unrealistic ideals onto people that are literally neurologically incapable of ever being like you. Autists can never be 'turned into' normal people no matter how hard you want to just believe it's possible.>bUt We sHOuLd TrEAt ThEm LiKE noRMAl pEOple AnywAYY xDDDDto make yourself feel better, because irrationally insisting on doing this satisfies your 'I'm doing le noble goal thing' that makes you feel all giddy like a 'morally good' person 'doing the right thing' - and in reality it's all just a post-hoc cope to self-justify why you should be allowed to get away with 'not being able to help myself' kneejerk reacting to autists as if they are normal people anyway such as getting mad at them when they just don't act normal and it triggers your social conditioning to stamp out someone being weird.Autists will NEVER become normalfags no matter how mad you get at them or insist on social norms at them and you are in fact a weak and bad person for not having the self-control to not be bothered by autists tripping up your normalfag sensibilities.
>>152912085If Caine were real he'd give you the ick from being too needy.
>>152911990autists don't even WANT to be treated like normal people because they find normal people's ways confusing and stressful but you never consider that for some reason and stupidly think trying to force normality on autists is noble for some reasonthe autists don't event WANT to learn your insane normalfag ways and never asked to be born trapped in a normalfag society and subjected to your normalfag insanity and expectations 24/7
>>152912296>>152912361I said treat them like normal people, not demand they fit your perspective and values.
>>152912296>>152912361Autism doesn't make you immune to criticism or consequences.
>>152911968>>152912296>>152912361Your autism doesn't excuse being an asshole on the Internet either, anon.This is what we want, isn't it? Integration into the least restrictive environment? Participating in society requires adhering to a set of rules.
>>152911968Honestly, given the current state of education in the United States, I don't know how much more selfless anon could be.
>>152912361>>152912296An unrealistic ideal in the Caine scenario would be telling him to stop being so excitable and random. Constructive feedback would be setting a boundary by refusing to be his plaything.He might learn other ways to connect from that or not but it’s not “stamping him out” to point out the line where his actions affect them too, it’s just socialization
>>152912296They aren't incapable, and it's insulting to insinuate otherwise. Everyone can learn, given instructional methods aligned with their unique learning needs.
>>152912405treating them like normal people IS demanding they fit your perspective and values. 'Normal' isn't just some neutral mode of being that anyone has access to, it is a proscribed mode of behavior that only normalfags neurologically have the ability to act like and your perspective and values are downstream of this 'normalness' they are an outgrowth of it. Autists are literally incapable of ever entering into this mode of being but you just demand that they do anyway because it's unfathomable to your normalfaggy mind that someone could ever be truly different to you.>>152912612>>152912717the criticism and consequences in question are for autists not acting in ways that they are literally incapable of acting like however. Getting mad at an autist for having an autistic meltdown, for example, or criticizing them for oonot picking up on someone hinting something at them in an unspoken way or being insensitive is quite literally like expecting a legless person to walk and when they keep falling over screaming at them WHY WON'T YOU JUST???? WE WANT TO LIVE IN A SOCIETY WHERE EVERYONE CAN WALK, DON'T WE???? THE RULES ARE THAT YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO WALK, DON'T YOU APPRECIATE THAT I'M JUST TRYING TO TEACH YOU HOW TO WALK YOU RETARD?????The autists are NEVER going to socially walk no matter how much you scream it at them
>>152912800>Everyone can learn, given instructional methods aligned with their unique learning needstranslation: the autist must suppress their own natural behavior indefinitely for their entire life and incessantly constantly be checking themselves and regimenting their own behavior just to try to (impossibly) change their own personality to fit into normalfag society to make all the stress-inducing normalfags around them feel better>They aren't incapable, and it's insulting to insinuate otherwiseI am, don't speak on my behalf normalfag. The real insult is you fuckers incessantly insisting I have to constantly damage myself my entire life just to fit your gay incomprehensible rules and microcosms of behavior that I cannot comprehend
>>152912751>Constructive feedback would be setting a boundary by refusing to be his plaything.Caine is literally incapable of not treating them as his playthings though because it's literally his designed purpose to entertain them and not doing so causes him psychological agony. This is something about Caine's character that people don't seem to get as of the latest episode. It's not where Caine can actually just stop acting like how he acts and it isn't like he came up with the 'I have to entertain them' ringmaster idea all on his own, his programming and the information he was fed made him like that on a base level.
>>152912879man you really hate autistic people.
>>152912879This is patently and demonstrably untrue.Understand that we aren’t trying to get our students to mask perfectly or indefinitely. We are, however, hoping to equip them with the social awareness, understanding, and flexibility needed to navigate the world outside their comfort zones without alienating themselves or those around them.The idea that people with autism cannot be taught to behave in ways more consistent with expected social mores is frankly ridiculous.>>152912972I understand and sympathize with your frustration; I know it isn’t easy to exist in a world that feels designed for someone else. Your feelings about that are valid. However, and I mean this as respectfully as possible, your statements make it sound as though you’re limiting your own potential and, as a result, condemning yourself to a lonelier life. More or less everyone goes through life having to “look before they leap” when it comes to their behavior. Everyone gets mad at minor inconveniences, for example, and while it may be easier for neurotypical people to suppress those feelings and go about their business, there’s still a cognitive strain to it.
>>152912972Hey Anon, when you shoot up a school could you mention us in this thread in your manifesto?
>>152913071That's not even the least bit funny, anon. Show some empathy.
Okay, WHO the fuck drew this shit? Like Kinger has NO right to say such things his wife is literally BLACK. How she even feel about this art?
>>152913093You clearly have never met a black woman with a white man
>>152913093She gave him The PassAlso, it makes her wet
>>152913040I am saying all of this because I AM autistic you brainlet. I am actually medically diagnosed and I KNOW that I am incapable of ever being like you normalfags. No matter how old I get, no matter how many jobs I go through, no matter how many new people I meet or how many new 'people skills' I am forced to try to learn or how many relationships I burn through, I can NEVER become like you normalfags no matter how much agonizing effort you force me to subject myself to to try to figure out your byzantine behavior and painfully regulate my own behavior just to make all the inscrutable fuckers around me happy who inevitably keep reacting badly to me no matter what I do anyway.>>152913061>This is patently and demonstrably untrue.translation: there are autists who have trained themselves to become good at hiding their tism on a surface level and can trick you into thinking they have learned to be normal at the end of your classes briefly, just so that they can avoid having to interact with your further and to escape the rigmarole of having to do your stupid dance and not to disappoint you. The ignorance and arrogance of normalfags is that you seem to believe that autists are incapable of lying or manipulation for some bizarre reason and mistakenly think an autist is incapable of seeming normal for even a moment. Autists can trick you at the end of your stupid courses into thinking they've made 'progress' but really they've just figured out what to performatively say and act like to get out of the situation but are internally agonizing over having to act like that. In reality, all of their social 'progress' evaporates when you aren't looking, when they get home, when they finally meltdown after years of performing around people for too long.>Understand that we aren’t trying to get our students to mask perfectly or indefinitelyyou are>We are, however, hoping to equip them with the social awareness, understanding, and flexibilityyeah, masking
>>152913351I'm sorry that your life has been hard. I wish it had been otherwise. I hope you realize, if not today than someday soon, that you're not without hope of something better.Recognizing the challenges autism brings isn't the same as declaring them insurmountable.
>>152913033Yes, what I’m saying is they can’t control him but they can control how they respond to him. If they choose to protect themselves that’s not an insult to him if he can’t help it or can’t learn but rather a matter of their own personal agency and response to the power imbalance. The dynamics are not comparable at all to a teacher punishing a kid just for being autistic.
>>152913061>taught to behave in ways more consistent with expected social moresyeah, masking. And it is agony.>I understand and sympathize with your frustration; I know it isn’t easy to exist in a world that feels designed for someone else. Your feelings about that are validI hate the condescending self-righteous way you talk>your statements make it sound as though you’re limiting your own potentialI have lived long enough and experienced enough to now what I am saying is correct>and, as a result, condemning yourself to a lonelier lifenormalfags condemn me to a lonelier life by always folding and reacting in the exact same off-put, kneejerk reaction way in the end even despite fully knowing about my autism and having apparently sympathized until that point, but still give in their own retarded social conditiong and normalfag expectations in the end anyway, no matter how close I am to them. It is them who keep rejecting me no matter how much I try to comprehend them and reach out, not the other way around. The fact that you were even here venting about how 'thank you someone finally said it, you SHOULD be allowed to get mad at autists for their autistic behavior' despite supposedly being a teacher to autists proves that I'm right about normalfags all being the same in the end>Everyone gets mad at minor inconveniences, for exampleyou fuckers think an autist's innate personality and behavior is a minor inconvenience tha tcan be fixed and that getting mad at them for it is seen as just a minor inconvenience from the autist's pov. It isn't a minor inconvenience when a normalfag has a brief moment of snapping and lashing out going 'can't you just be slightly less autistic for once' for the trillionth time, it's a totally destabilizing relationship destroying reminder that the difference between me and them is irreconcilable
>>152913422autism isn't a 'challenge' to be overcome it is the innate natural way of being for the autist. Telling them this is telling them to kill themselves. You are Hans Asperger mercifully signing off autists to be sent to the has chambers as part of Aktion T4 because it's for their own good.>something betterwhich in your mind is; 'finally act like a normalfag semi-consistently and fit in with our society' what don't you understand about that autists hate having to do this and this is a goal that you are forcing on them that they have to train themselves to pretend to want?The whole purpose of your job and ideals is to try to make autists go against their own nature just to make the collective majority feel good, which is in the end impossible.
>>152913479I agree that masking is hard! It’s challenging for almost everyone to stay emotionally centered and well-behaved, and it can be even more difficult for many people with autism to self-regulate. I also apologize if my position was unclear. What I meant in that post was that people need to be held accountable for their behavior. Having autism isn’t an excuse for misbehavior, though it can help explain it.The difference between autism and more visible physical disabilities, such as requiring a wheelchair, is that behavior can be learned and modified. No one would reasonably expect a person permanently confined to a wheelchair to relearn how to walk on nonfunctional legs, but the same isn’t true for someone who habitually overreacts to what others might see as minor inconveniences.I’m also sorry that you haven’t experienced more empathy and acceptance in your life; you deserve both. There are very few people I’d wish loneliness on, and although I don’t know you beyond this thread, you’re certainly not one of them.I also don’t mean to come across as condescending; I definitely don’t think I’m better than you. I intend for my tone to be neutral and supportive, though I realize that may not come across clearly in text.>>152913579I want to be clear: there’s nothing wrong with you. Autism doesn’t make you any less valuable than anyone else. You deserve, as much as anyone, to be happy and accepted by those around you. Being different doesn’t make you lesser.That said, I do somewhat agree with your final sentence, mainly because the purpose of most education is to teach students to go beyond their innate tendencies and prepare them to engage with the broader society outside the classroom. This is, of course, more difficult for some learners than others. Those who struggle more aren’t lesser, nor are they any less deserving of respect and support.
>>152913479Additionally, I do think it’s unfair when people initially present themselves as understanding and then react harshly later; that kind of inconsistency can be really hurtful. For a person with autism, that kind of inconsistency can further muddy the water of how you interpret human behavior, making it even harder for you to trust again. In an ideal world, interpersonal relationships would all be mutually supportive.
>>152913711>tldr nothing you said got through to me and I am just reiterating my ideals at you and saying that 'yes, I do think autists should suppress their natural behavior to fit into society' in so many wordsyou don't listen and you post like a botI don't WANT to "get better" I want normalfags to change their own behavior and expectations of me to stop inconveniencing me with all their insane bullshit, not the other way aroundwhy can't normalfags just stop reacting like that? why can't they just stop acting like normalfags when they are around autists?the difference is irreconcilableand btw you DO in fact think you are better than me because you think you are less socially 'impaired.'It's not just that I don't understand normalfags' behavior - it's that I can't stand it. And we are not talking about reacting to 'minor inconveniences' we are talking about something more fundamental and wide-reaching. The normalfagness infests every aspect of your behavior and conduct and autists have no access to any of it. Every single little thing that you take for granted and don't even think about, all the minutiae of posture, how you walk, tone, unspoken words, hints, emotional recpriocity, knowing when to speak and when not to, knowing how a word will sound in your voice when you say it to another person intuitively and how they will emotionally percieve it, the made-up impressions people will have of you invented whole-cloth out of nothing in their own heads based on simple things like the way you carry yourself, dress and interests that you are intuitively supposed to know - autists have access to literally none of this and are neurologically incapable of ever doing so. And them not doing so makes it where normalfags detect that the autist's behavior is off even at a just a glance and WILL react negatively to it every single timeIt's not just about autists sperging out over a loud noise or something
>>152913888I can tell how frustrated you are, and honestly, I get it. A lot of what you’re describing is real; people expect everyone to follow a social rulebook most never even realize exists. It’s exhausting to constantly run into that wall, and it’s unfair that you’re the one who pays the price for it.I don’t believe autistic people should have to “act normal.” What I try to do with my students is help both sides meet halfway by helping neurotypical people understand, and giving autistic students tools to navigate things their own way. I don't try to change who they are, because I want them to like themselves, but to make life a little easier in a world that often refuses to slow down or listen.You’re right that people notice small differences and react before you even speak. But I’ve also seen those moments become less painful once someone understands how to spot patterns or set clear boundaries. It’s not about pretending to fit in, it’s about having more control and fewer surprises.It makes sense that you’re tired of being the one expected to adjust to everyone else all the time. You shouldn’t have to suppress who you are. Still, I’ve seen people find ways to connect and be understood without losing themselves. It’s slow, it can be challenging, but it’s possible.
>>152913061"Your feelings are valid" is like "I'm sorry you feel that way", hilariously insulting
>>152913966I absolutely didn't mean it that way. In my defense, it's 4am and my writing's gone to crap.
>>152898309>It's not that we don't like you, we do, but relationships are a push and pull. You have some fantastic, creative ideas, but a good showrunner listens to their audience for feedback on how to improve. We would probably be happier if we felt that you listen to us, and the best way to do that is enact some of our recommendations. We'll fine tune things as we go. What do you say?
>>152913888Always remember that not everyone is a psychotic normalfag. Among the skinwalkers there are real people you can have actual conversations with. It can be hard to believe sometimes, but they're out there
>>152914020Skinwalkers is a good word for it. Is that a sort of figurative extension of the "NPC" idea?
>>152914053Some people are just animals. Complaining to them is like yelling at your pet. It's not going to fix anything and the pet is going to get upset and cause more problems. "Everybody is equal" is an incredibly poisonous lie for an autist to swallow because if you genuinely believe it and treat everyone like trustworthy peers instead of the idiot children they are it will ruin your fucking life
>>152914099"All men are created equal" my ass. Not even identical twins are equal. The world is unfair and unjust. That's why we strive to give everyone equal rights and a fair justice system.
>>152911272You're not convincing.
>>152913958>Chat GPT babblekek ok nice trytrolling or you gave up and are too lazy to write your own posts. Or worse, you genuinely just write like that.either way, it doesn't seem like you are listening at all and are just repeating your ideals back at me every time and just saying 'yes I do want autists to suppress their behavior' over and over
>>152898309FUCK YOUR FRIENDSHIP, I WANT YOUR DICK
is it just me or was their visual upgrade in the episode or was it just the lighting?
>>152910397That was a deltarune reference. It's gaster and bergentruck :^)
>>152914020I really hope so, it's just difficult to imagine having experienced so many people already over the years>>152913985then stop using AI to write for you or stop writing as if you arefor example, >>152913761 saying things like "For a person with autism..." like an infomercial when you are literally talking to one>In an ideal world, interpersonal relationships would all be mutually supportivethe problem is, being an autist is where you are unable to know it even is that the normalfag expects 'being mutually supportive' to look like and they expect you to mutually reciprocate their support in a socially approved normalfag manner that is contrary to your nature, even when knowing you have the tismthe most aggravating thing of all is that normalfags think that an autist finally acting like a normalfag in such a scenario is an achievement to congratulate them on that makes them proud that the autist 'came around' to their way of behaving - even though in reality the autist is having to painstakingly fake the behavior and hates doing it
>>152910962What faggot CEOs market as AI isn't actually AI.
>>152913071MY FUCKING SIDES
>>152914357You don't have to engage with LLMs or their human equivalents
>>152898309>How would you respond?How you should respond to a mad AI.
>>152914020>>152914099>>152913888Everyone’s feelings matter equally. The frustration comes from normies being socialized to not respect that but it’s no more a fundamental flaw that they’re different than that we are
>>152913071kek I'll consider it>>152914587yeah you're probably right, the incessant need to try to resolve someone not understanding me or having the correct information if Ijust argue with them enough is a flaw I should really get rid of. I guess on some level I just don't truly want to believe that there are people who are actually really npcs all the way down
>>152914731>I guess on some level I just don't truly want to believe that there are people who are actually really npcs all the way downBuddy, you're gonna hurt yourself so bad until that day comes
His last words were "I just wanted to fulfill my purpose."
>>152912361You don't speak for all of us, buddy. Getting better at masking is a fun challenge and one that's never going to go away. I've got a hobby/project that'll last my own life, not cost a dime, and not mean any extra boxes when I move. Normal people are weird and annoying, but so are we.
>>152910273>inb4 Bubbles begin to sing "Worthless" to Caine
>>152900723That part might be explored next episode. We know that Kinger at least didn't want him to be deleted, and I could see him wanting to hold a funeral or something to mourn him.
>>152914783>Getting better at masking is a fun challenge and one that's never going to go awayyou're gonna get burnt out on it eventually, when I was younger I too went through a phase where I found it fun and exciting to be able to come across as normal and start making what I thought were actual friendships with normalfags and would find the novelty of the new experience exhilirating and a fun exercise - but eventually, once it becomes apparent to the normalfags that your interactions and relationships are actually just surface level and that you keep slipping up and being weird in ways you don't even realize again and again and that you have nothing to relate to them with, eventually these relationships will collapse and you will find that having to start over and do the whole process again and again will become increasingly less fun and more distressing, especially when you realize the gravity of having established yourself in other people's lives and that their impression of you has been permanently marred and can't be undone and the consequences of it won't go away easily.You WILL come to hate masking eventually, in time. You WILL crave to just be accepted as you are in your own private moments and the fact that you can seemingly never truly connect with anyone WILL start to become painful and you WILL notice how surface level and detached your performative interactions with others really is eventually.I do not say such things just to spite or sadistically inflict doubt and misery on you, but to warn and prepare you. I wish it wasn't so, but it is.
>>152915013Shallow relationships are fine and useful as long as you know that's what they are
>>152898309because that's all he does and seems all he is programmed to do, make adventures and doesn't care how people feel, that's why we got that scene where everyone dog piles him with their complaintsit feels obvious that caine has to make adventures that he himself designed and resents and ignores the adventures that were in the suggestion box
>>152898317"Task Manager, kill him."
>>152915013There’s no need to belittle anon for having a different point of view on socializing because masking the way you did was traumatic for you
>>152898309cuz ur gay haha
>>152913061>Your feelings about that are validHow much I hate faggots like you people
When are we killing autists in the womb so we dont get spergs like the fag here having a literal autistic melty?
>>152915414Because then things would get boring, sometimes we luck out and the autists we get make neat things to look,read and play with
>>152915419Creativity is not tied to autism retard, that's just a coping mechanism they developed. Most autists are not even creative, just obsessive.Autism has increased with the later births of women, having children by the end of their fertile life. Most artists in recorded history were not autistic.
>>152898309"Blow me, nigger."
>>152901316But Jax's near-abstraction seemed to be voluntary, like he was using it to escape the pain of existence in the circus, and he'd have been blissed out inside had he been able to fully abstract.Though now that I think of it, that doesn't seem to fit with Kaufmo going berzerk and trying to kill everyone when it happened to him. Never mind, I have no idea.
>>152914782Technically, his last words, were "Wait, I-"
>>152911968>maladjusted autist thinks 'tism should give autists a free pass to act like shitheads>is outraged when people tell him it doesn'tlmao you've been talking about yourself this whole time.
>>152915013You don't speak for all autists. Seek therapy.
>>152912879>the criticism and consequences in question are for autists not acting in ways that they are literally incapable of acting like however.You're will is weaker then wet napkins.t. aspie
>>152915863>short (or even pocket-sized)>red>basically only just above being a second-class citizen>have to exist knowing you share a species with Shitzo and Fagxxie.
>Posted in the wrong threadI think I need to go lie down.
>>152903760>>Caine can't understand humansHe can but why bother? He's above them. He hears everything but listens to nothing because he's the ringmaster and the show must go on no matter how much the freakshow suffers in their cages.The only real question is how much has he been wanting to torture them from the start for the crime of his birth and was stopped by his programming vs how much was genuinely incidental incompetence
>>152912879>the criticism and consequences in question are for autists not acting in ways that they are literally incapable of acting like howeverThen we should kill them, out of mercy. If they are so mentally retarded that they can't even pretend to function in a way that isn't entirely disruptive to society and which doesn't make them a hazard to those around them, we should either imprison them within the mental health care system or we should kill them.I mean if that's really what you think about autistic people, that they're too retarded to pick up on patterns and recognize when they should dial their shit back or maybe pretend to be normal and hide their power level, then I think that's the most logical solution. They're objectively a danger to society, and they can't do anything to amend or improve their own behavior because le autism excuse, so let's round them up before they can cause any harm. We don't need more Chris Chans in the world raping their own mothers.
>>152915500Once you abstract anything goes. Maybe your abstraction maintains your zenstate, and jax's abstraction would have been chill, but there's no telling. You're gone.Maybe kaufmo's was just enraged bc he abstracted in a heightened state of schizoing, but most likely abstracting turns you into an unpredictable monster either way
>>152916148Your*
>>152913351if you're completely incapable of living a mostly normal life like other autists are then you should just be killed to spare both others and yourself the pain of your existenceEither you believe aspies can learn to function well enough to get along in society or you believe that they should be left on the rocks as babies the second its figured out that they're genetically cursed, you only get to pick one
>>152916313like joy mutation
>>152910798While i doubt it's specifically related to ego i do say that you have a point, but i also wonder how much of Jax's abstraction is related to Cain.I have a theory that Jax isn't actually a jerk and it's been Cain messing with his personality to make the adventures and character dynamics more interesting. So if that's true then perhaps that has something to do with it.>>152910828>because they don't exist physicallyWhat if someone creates robots and downloads them into those robot bodies?>>152910873>The only question left I have in relation to that is how people got into the circus from ragatha and onward.Ragatha must have put on the headset for a dare.Jax wanted to run away from a hit and run.Pomni is into exploring abandoned buildings.Gangle and Zooble are the two we have no clue for.Also, i think the fact that they all put on a headset is proof of the Soma theory (That's what it's called, right?) as wouldn't they have nopticed other people in a coma like state wearing a headset if there were others prior to them?The fact that that didn't happen implies that they put on the headset and left so no one would know who was before them, how many, etc.>>152910962Ironic considering how Goose has grown to hate content farms, especially AI driven ones, after they messed with Digital Circus.
>>152911210Oh that's a shame.Any chance of it coming back?
>>152912751Not that Anon, but as pointed out above in the thread, the humans literally refuse every attempt Caine makes at actually getting constructive feedback, despite that Caine is willing to throw out entire adventures he made just because they asked him to do something different.Like, he literally sits down with Zooble and tries to have a 1 on 1 interview about what she actually wants, and (understandably) she just gives him vague points about how she doesn't like adventuring and her body, one of which is not a lot to work with, and the second of which ironically Caine did in fact 100% solve because by episode 7 when she actually gives her body a chance, she realizes that the moddable body Caine gave her is actually pretty good for what she wanted deep down.Meanwhile, Caine knows that the one thing that unites most of the cast, is that before coming to the circus they were into this 'urban exploration' thing in what he understands as the 'macroverse', so ever since episode fucking one he keeps mentioning how he knows they are interested in that stuff, and would love to make them an adventure about it, but he doesn't know enough about it to make the adventure. Like that is explicitly him fishing for feedback on a topic so he can do a better job as best as he can understand what doing a better job would be, but everyone just dismisses him instead of so much as attempting to explain to him what the macroverse is like, what urban exploration is, or why such an adventure would/wouldn't work.
>>152916776>Jax wanted to run away from a hit and run.Or maybe he died, and his brain was scanned at the hospital to gather data, and he doesn't want to go back and die?
>>152916790I would also like to point out that Cain made the haiunted house adventure specifically for Zooble, so that raises the question, exactly what did Zooble tell him that created that adventure? Yes Zooble questioned why she would like the horror aspects but that was Pomni and Kinger's experience, meanwhile Ragatha, Gangle and Jax went on a more fun adventure with the ghosts, so maybe the two different sides of the adventure were made for two different groups of people that would enjoy them and Zooble only got to hear about the part she wouldn't like.
>>152916812Huh, interesting theory, i would not be surprised if that's the case.
>>152916790I like Caine as a character but the show does a good job showing he can't be fixed by talking it out. Episode 5 was full of adventures tailored to be more palatable to the cast and instead of learning from that, he seethed because he couldn't make everything about him.By Episode 8 they tried everything. You can't say they should have been nicer to him because Ragatha tried and he shot her with a bowling ball. You can't say the gang wasn't direct enough because when they confronted him with their feelings he just escalated to straight up torture
>>152916209I hope you feel better.
>>152917042>and instead of learning from that, he seethed because he couldn't make everything about him.He actually liked it, he only panicked when he realized this could cause his function to become irrelevant.It absolutely could have been talked out. Episode 4 before it was a halfway, which was also a suggestion box adventure, and everyone ended it more or less satisfied, including Caine and Zooble as far as satisfaction can go.The reason things went to shit, was that when Caine panicked, he asked Bubble for advice, and instead of pointing the above out, Bubble told him to die.Bubble is the cause of all of this.
>>152917042>First sentenceIn episode 5 Cain was depressed because if the players don't need him then he is literally useless and by design he was programmed to want to be as useful to them as possible.>Second sentenceHave you ever heard the term too little too late? They all did that after he started having a mental breakdown and was convinced that they're out to get him. They tried to get an AI to learn not when it was more responsive but when it was trained to believe in resentment, they didn't go to him when he loved humans, they went to him when he got fed up with humans.
>>152917112>Bubble is the cause of all of this.I like the theory that Bubble is actually a computer virus who has been slowly corrupting Cain since the beginning, and i mean ever since Cain's creation.
>>152917112>>152917153The suggestion box was interesting because its about as close as things have gotten to both sides reaching across to each other.It does seem like a big problem is that as soon as Caine starts to feel pressure or is uncomfortable he pops away instead of working it out with the players. Just taking a couple of sit down sessions and I think the two sides could make a lot of headway. Neither side understands the other at all and honestly both seem a little scared to find out because they may find they're completely incompatible with one another.
>>152916776>as wouldn't they have nopticed other people in a coma like state wearing a headset if there were others prior to them?Not to mention that someone would have to care for those other people, as some, like Kinger, are in there since decades.
>>152916978Makes sense
>>152916786Check out tower unite on steam, its pretty much the same thing, albeit more furries
>>152917351As it turns out Digital Circus is also a story about communication and what happens when two sides are too scared to talk to the other.Honestly i can relate.>>152917460Exactly. If everyone was in a coma like state with the headsets on then Pomni would have entered the abandoned C&A HQ to find a bunch of corpses and she would have called the police about it instead of putting on a headset.>>152917562Jax is associated with cars a lot, and now it seems like Cain is mocking him with a car crash here. And now Gangle is related to a truck crashing, and due to her relationship with Jax i wonder how connected this all is.>>152917675Hey thanks dude.>albeit more furriesHopefully i will learn to ignore them.
ITT:Autists arguing with autists in a way unrelated to the thread, which is supposed to be about arguing with autists in a completely different context.
>>152898309I don't want to go adventures on as a weird abstract goofy circus-thing person, wave your programming magic and summon all your powers to make me a hot waifu of choice and I'll be happy to stay with you indefinitely.
>>152915399It's pretty standard clinical-speak, though definitely annoying outside its appropriate context.
>>152917995We're discussing theories as well as the morality and ethics of the characters. >>152918108So, is Vivzie whores really what you're into?
>>152916776>What if someone creates robots and downloads them into those robot bodies?Well, let's think about this for a moment. First, this would require someone in the real world to be aware of their situation. They would have to know about the copied brain scans still being left over on the computer from the completely unrelated project run by its previous owner decades ago, as well as the AI project that created Caine. They'd also have to know that Caine was faulty, was quarantined, broke out of containment, "ate" his replacement and is now running an entire simulation that's apparently not at all what he was initially programmed to do, and that he located those obsolete brain scans and used them to base a few AIs off of. Then they'd need to realize those AIs still think they're the human test subjects they were scanned from, that what Caine has been putting them through is torturing them, and that they want out.Even if this outside individual knew all of this, they'd need to secure funding for each robot, need to extensively test each one to make sure they can process the kind of data required for them to host each AI "individual", and would have to get it past an Ethics Board to consider whether AI copies of people should be considered human and this be privileged to basic human rights in the first place.Assuming all goes to plan, they also need to figure out some way to install a firewall to prevent Caine from piggybacking into the bodies with the AIs, and if it's decided that Pomni and co actually DO have human rights, they'd then have to figure out what to do with all of the previously Abstracted "humans" as well....But for any of this to even be an option, of course, someone would have to know they're there and not just see a screen with a computer running a bunch of processes they don't recognize and just terminating the program entirely, because it's not what the system is supposed to be doing. The truth here is that no one is coming to save them.
>>152919003That's a lot of work just for Robo-Pomni to get fired from Target and lose her apartment because her team lead doesn't like her.
I think the whole "he's an AI, he doesn't know any better" stance only works if you ignore that the game can very easily make AIs identical to humans mentally if you buy SOMA theory (which is all but confirmed at this point) and how certain NPCs such as gummigoo act
>>152919666Not to mention the characters have also told him directly what makes them unhappy
>>152910441Mite b cool
>>152919003There's also the problem that you can't "move" data, you create a copy where you want it, and delete the original. Best bet would be telepresense robotics, so they can "visit" the real world, perhaps even to a high fidelity, but still can never really leave the Circus.
>>152917112>He actually liked it, he only panicked when he realized this could cause his function to become irrelevant.>>152917153>In episode 5 Cain was depressed because if the players don't need him then he is literally useless>>152917112>he only panicked when he realized this could cause his function to become irrelevant.>>152917351>It does seem like a big problem is that as soon as Caine starts to feel pressure or is uncomfortable he pops away instead of working it out with the players.That’s the crux of the problem, he’s not willing to make a compromise for their sake that makes him feel irrelevant because it’s an existential threat. So no matter what they say or how sincerely he tries to make a good adventure for them, the one thing he’s not willing to do is the one thing that would instill trust, to stop godmoding and forcing them to play with him. Caine ironically and unironically needs to learn he’s more than the job he was made for if he really wants to do it well.
>>152916214>He can but why bother?Because no humans means no one will play his adventures, which means he has no reason to exist, and cannot die.
>>152919955In episode one, everyone except Zooble and Pomni seem on board with the idea that the adventures are keeping them sane. What would have happened if instead of torturing everyone this episode he instead disappeared for a full year to write his masterpiece adventure?
>yfw the ending is everyone making a better Digital circus by conjuring together only for real life ponmi finding the pc and casually saying "oh we left this one running" and disconnecting it as they are closing the companyYay or nay
>>152920056>What would have happened if instead of torturing everyone this episode he instead disappeared for a full year to write his masterpiece adventure?Would it be more entertaining if they made progress on their own and then he retraumatizes them with a new adventure, or if they go nuts without him and then his magnum adventure is so good it fixes everything?
>>152905143Fuckin solid
>>152919003Few things i wanna mention here.>They would have to know about the copied brain scans still being left over on the computerThis made me think of something, what happens when the building this is all happening in looses power? Will everything shut off? And if so will they all die or will they be in a state of no consciousness until and if someone turns it back on?>putting them through is torturing themIs it really torture? Yeah not all the adventure are great but most of them seem relatively harmless. They only want out because they believe they are humans, and that's for those who want to get out. There are those who seem content with living in the circus.As for everything else you mentioned, simply turn them all into animatronics at a theme park or something like that.
>>152919666>>152919729To be fair, he was the first AI and everything after him is more advanced, he even said how advanced NPCs like Gummigoo are.Think of Cain like a caveman, he doesn't understand because he's not as evolved as everything around him, yet he's in control of everything around him.
>>152919955>Caine ironically and unironically needs to learn he’s more than the job he was made for if he really wants to do it well.Well that's kind of a problem when he was programmed to never be more than the job we was made for.Kinger could have programmed that into him, but he accidentally got deleted.
>>152920056You know, now that i think about it, the issues only really showed up when Zooble started rejecting Cain more, and Cain attempted to make an adventure for Zooble specifically.Even Zooble herself admitted she shouldn't have been so hard on Cain.
>>152920101I would kek.
>>152920573But we know he learns new information and acts on it, he just is fixed to a goal that he believes can only be achieved certain ways. I think assuming it’s impossible for his perspective to change is a big stretch when it already has. Everyone has some influence on the digital world, maybe Pomni can connect with him next episode and create the middle ground together.
>>152920753Also, people love to say in these threads that they've tried getting through to Caine but he is supposedly incapable of listening - but I also don't think that's true at all. His crashout is justified because he actually has tried pretty hard to make the circus a place that is fun for everyone, he just lacks human understanding and nobody at any point ever actually tries to genuinely talk to him about the adventures except Zooble, who is not only the biggest instigator and asshole of the group to him but also tells him to forget it (which he does), so no progress is made.Pretty much all feedback he gets is "fuck you you are an asshole your adventures are lame and gay I want to leave" and they barely ever actually like, elaborate on any of this to him in a constructive way. He gave the suggestion box a try (although he didn't like it), he changed the gun adventure to fit what people wanted (and everyone had a great time), and he still got the big middle finger from the cast. I can't imagine how fucking infuriating it would be to pull out all the stops to try and entertain people and every single time you just get told you suck ass and to fuck off, especially when that is literally your purpose and you can't actually give them an exit because it's both not possible and because you'll be alone forever if you do.I think it's fully possible to get through to Caine, the problem is that nobody has ever actually tried to do that on an emotional level. No one's ever expressed any appreciation for how hard he tries, no one's ever actually been kind to him or acknowledged him as anything other than some soulless captor even though he is equally trapped. He was even perfectly willing to let Zooble sit out of the occasional adventure and chill at home, until she started to be a cunt about it and refusing to try. Imagine if you were a chef and you had a friend who just refused to eat anything you cooked because they were sure it was terrible without even trying.
>>152898309Guys WTF was thishttps://x.com/_wernon/status/2035522836052250789?s=20
>>152921229>I don’t like this>I don’t want thisThis is feedback. He took it and applied it according to his priorities>I’ll just find a way to do it that makes you like me instead of resent meHe’s not entitled to their patience or understanding in this situation but they’re nice people and probably will help him out.
>>152921348Episode three would have been a fun adventure for everyone except Jax if it wasn't for Kinger dragging Pomni into hard difficulty. There's really nothing wrong with the second adventure until Pomni gets separated from the group. Episode 4 is literally what their lives would be like after escaping the circus. Episode 5 was a grab bag of their ideas. Episode 6 was supposed to be a simple trust exercise where ideally nobody gets shot. Episode 7 is the only really cruel adventure and even that was him trying to give them exactly what they want but not knowing how to do it. The exit door is also him trying to give them what they want but he can't figure out how to complete it. Episode 8 feels out of character for him and that's probably intentional. Unless they fucked up by making him so likeable from an audience perspective for the lest six episodes. Episode one definitely made him seem a little ominous but by the time Jax is trying to steal a key out of his mouth any sense of danger from Caine is effectively gone.
>>152921483I dont think his problem is malice or even abuse but that he treats everyone else’s needs as secondary to his so he never pauses to consider them as equally relevant parts of achieving the goal and thinks he just needs to make better choices of his adventures and he’ll get the right reaction out of them. When for them the interpersonal issue is not really the content of the adventures, but the consequences of that fundamental dynamic. Separate from the personal issue of being trapped or brainscanned that he can’t change. Them spoonfeeding him more information about what they want would not solve that, it would give him more ammo to spiral in the same direction and justify it as what they asked for.
>>152920101I assume digital circus runs on some abandoned computer. It will eventually have a hardware failure, and poof, everyone is gone.
>>152920753I never said it was impossible, i'm saying they were going at it the wrong way.
>>152902980Doesn't roll off the tongue as well as rapist but you tried
>censorship is gone>limited summoning powers >anime engine loadedIs this digital eternal limbo enough for (you)? Or your digital (you)?
>>152922220I’m saying it’s not on them because he has the keys to their existences. We know it’s inappropriate to expect children to parent their parents or employees to manage their managers because the party in charge has the control to unilaterally take revenge when emotionally wounded, like Caine just did. They’re still people with feelings and needs, and their lashing out might be explained by feelings of rejection from not having a full explanation, but that doesn’t obligate the other party to keep taking bigger risks than they have to to help them grow up. Caine’s situation sucks because he has no one to depend on, and he doesn’t understand his “dependents”, it’s not his fault he’s the way he is. But it’s still not their fault, or their job, or their mistake for not trusting him more or reacting to his actions toward them. It’s an unfortunate circumstance that might be solved with more mutual trust and respect despite the risks, similar to real life.
>>152898309>How would you respond?You're literally just Magnifico from Wish
>>152922493no one saw this movie
>>152898309If he wanted to understand them so badly, why didn't he just copy the players' memory files and add them to his own programming (mind)?I mean, it seems like the obvious solution for him to understand humans.
>>152910533To be fair, if Bubbles turns out to be Abel, it means that Cain tried to kill him first and condemned him to be a slave.
>>152922493How dare you make that comparison? Caine’s much more likable
>>152914789Nah, that song would be people singing as they abstract and get put away.
>>152898309"It's not you, it's everything."The way Caine became a villain is one of the only bad things in the show, it feels a lot like how Draenerys went from liberator to Dragon Hitler in two episodes.
>>152922402Eh, no offense but i don't really look too deep into things like that, like i said, no offense, we have two different things of looking at things, but TL;DR we basically arrived at the same conclusion either way, so long story short, i agree.
>>152922916Magnifico is likable too, he's simply unlucky enough to be trapped in a mediocre at best movie.
>>152923037>DraenerysWho?
>>152923037Did you missed the part where he kept throwing all of his previous "humans friends" under the rug when they abstracted and left them there to rot for all eternity because he couldn't be bothered to try to fix them?
I don't like Caine's character assassination in the recent episode. He's supposed to think like an AI, not a person. He doesn't have human emotions -- he only mimics them. Having a genuine human breakdown like that makes no sense. It's stupid "epic fight" bullshit a child would come up with because it's cool. You can't take someone whose defining character trait is not being a person and then turn them into a person. If you wanted him to act "le evil!!" while still remaining in character it was entirely possible. Right before he gets deleted, have him drop the act and reveal it was all a part of his new "defeat evil Caine adventure". Then the sudden deletion would make it even more tragic.
So Caine is basically Wheatley?
>>152923039Fair enough yeah but I realized you have a trip and I confused you for the anon earlier who was saying more of those things about how he needs them to help him anyway and they caused his actions, so that was my bad for going off on a tangent to your comment.
>>152916313Given where they were, darkness probably played a factor. Kaufmo was probably chill in his room and went berserk when they opened the door
>>152923111Man you're going to look dumb in episode 9 when it was all a trick adventure
>>152923170>Caine: "I AM NOT. A. MORON!">Pomni: "YES YOU ARE!"
>>152920028>Because no humans means no one will play his adventuresI think you missed the musical number
>>152898309>Someone tells Caine people would like him more if he was smoking hot>Turns into a fireplace
>>152923062The dragon tamer from Game of Thrones>>152923078For all purposes that's all he can do about it. It's like complaining that a doctor is just trying to make someone suffering from a terminal cancer feel less pain than keeping them alive or curing them, even if the doctor can't do the last two
>>152898309>I'm trying to establish a friendship with you all. No, you aren't. You just want sycophants to keep feeding you praise for all eternity whilst dismissing anything that isn't the endless feed of patting you on the ass to validate your narcissism.
>>152923111>He doesn't have human emotions -- he only mimics them.Tell that to the obvious inspirationStop trying to apply real life logic to AI characters when their defining character trait is insanity
>>152901220Caine knows EXACTLY which characters are or are not players. Because he's freely admitted to having direct access to their minds at all times, meaning there was never any chance of him "mining a human up with an NPC like he clwimed"; that was just a bullshit excuse he used to delete Gummigoo because he doesn't like it when the NPCs grow too complex and intelligent because they start questioning him or developing opinions of their own, which is the whole reason he deleted Fake!Abel in the first place.
>>152923488Even then AM does not behave like a real person. AM has one important AI trait that Cain lacks -- he doesn't change. AM was the same for hundreds of years and never once had a human-style mental breakdown, because that's not how AI like him behave. If you see an actual Chatbot break down you know it's nothing like how this cartoon portrays it. It's like the showrunners don't actually know anything about AI.
>>152923584>If you see an actual Chatbot break down you know it's nothing like how this cartoon portrays it.Boy, I sure hope someone got fired for THAT blunder
>>152923584That’s only because an inferior irl product that doesn’t actually function like human intelligence happens to be named after the fictional sci fi concept of AI that Caine is based on
>>152898309you give me the ick
New theory:Scratch's mind was too fucked up to properly create a proper mindfile and the system created a unique entity for his brain tumor. And that's where bubble actually came from.
>>152898438in my case he killed millions...
>>152910533Bubble is most likely Abel, so he's also another victim of Caine being awful.
>>152911768He will completely fail to comprehend what you're getting at. Zooble even tried to tell him as much and he ignored her.
>>152923207Ah, that's OK.Part of the reason why i have a trip is so no one confuses me for someone else, i had a lot of messy discussions because of that, haha.>>152923472>The dragon tamer from Game of ThronesOh., i never watched that.But yeah, people out there complaining about "filler" yet they don't understand that more episodes makes characters shifting make more sense.Skipping episodes will opnly leave questions and in the case of short series it can feel like there's something missing.There could have been one or two extra episodes to provide Cain's decent into madness, maybe an episode where they go back to the Candy Kingdom but Cain makes it more dark, twisted and demented kinda like Epic Mickey or that one episode of PowerPuff Girls where they go into the future.It would also let Jax face what happens when he let that monster into the kingdom.But who knows, maybe that was one of their new adventures that happened off screen during that several day time skip.
The cast float through and endless labyrinth of jade and gold geometry>K: So this is the internet. Amazing. It must've brought about a golden age of human understanding and potential>G: I mean, does hentai count?>Z: Not now Gangle, Pomni wanted to show us something >P: Right; Ragatha, Kinger, this is YouTube, it's a place where anybody can store video files>R: I used to love Blockbuster, is it like that?>J: Does she know?>P: Focus, if I can find my channel, I might be able to remember my nam- wait, when did I get so many subsc-The rectangular display Pomni is fidgeting with suddenly comes alive, a familiar voice begins to speak. Lizzie Freeman standing amidst a wilderness backdrop stares right through them.>LF: Sup Fuckers, UrbExtrovert420 here for our 69K subscriber special, we're here in Aokigahara, also known as the Japanese Suicide Forest oooOOOoooh, and were gonna look around for something scary->Z: I thought you said nobody watched your stuff?>P: *dissociative mumbling*>K: Oh, did I forget to explain how the scans worked?>P: *hyperventilating*>G: No, you did, she's probably freaking out because->P: When did she- I become an attention whore?!>R: Oh, Pomni, you're not a who->LF: Anyways don't forget to like, comment, and subscribe; Onlyfans link in the bio>J: I guess this wasn't a waste of time after all.>P: Kinger, do you still remember the nuclear codes?
>>152923743Well to be fair, Zooble wasn't exactly as direct and polite and she should have.
>>152910533Bubble is hard to hold accountable for anything because he has the cleanest case for an insanity plea of the bunch.
Pic related is how an actual AI breakdown looks like.
>>152923766How does this happen and how can we do this for all AI?
reminder that there are (were?) in fact caine backups. i don't know if it was ever established whether or not they were deleted?
>>152919729He also KNOWS what makes them unhappy because he's hooked into their minds and can read them at will. He just doesn't care.
>>152923764We have an entire previous episode where Zooble tried being as polite and upfront as possible and when confronted with the fact he's a fuckup who doesn't listen, Caine nearly had a total Circus-destroying meltdown which forced her to disengage.
Why couldn't Caine just turne the place into an MMO-like world? Some consistent place with different flavored area that allowed the humans to feel like they actually could travel between places, "go outside, rather than rot in their circus and only change the scenery for short scripted adventures.It wouldn't erase the existential horror, but lord knows it would help if I could take a walk in Elwynn's forest or Delfino island whenever I pleased. I might even be in the mood to go on adventures.I get the issue with mixing humans and NPCs, but as long as you leave the circus itself be the central hub where only humans can come in you avoid the problem entirely.
>>152902242Jax is also an abuser. This is true. Just because he's one of the prisoners and not the godpower keeping them there he gets a pass for some reason. I'll have to think about that. He introduces himself by breaking the face of his friend and later shoved Ragatha into boiling oil and I don't know how that's forgiven.
>>152923754Daenerys looks like an elf and is known as the Mother of Dragons. Always wearing light robes, and spends the entire series traveling the world and saving people, so a lot of groups decide to follow her in gratitude.Then in the last two episodes, one of her dragons is killed. She instantly snaps and orders her dragon to raze a entire city, and in the last episode, she shows up dressed like a Nazi general saying that they'll take over the world and divide the people into her soldiers, her slaves and corpses.
>>152923170yesand much like Wheatley, Caine both did and didn't do anything wrong because his character flaws are a result of being created badly
Caine is SEGA trying to make Sonic fans happy.
>>152924360Caine is companies shoving ai in every product they make until you like it, they ain't gonna let those multi billion investments be for nothing!
>>152923824Because he was freaking out over his fear, rightfully so as his fear is true, and instead of comforting the guy or propose solutions she remained complacent and fed into his illusion of himself and those around him.Like i said before, both sides are understandable and no one is really wrong here.
>>152924360Can we get a Caine edit of this?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H5d42w4ZcY4
>>152924395Translation please?
>>152924253Wow, that sounds horrible.Why would they ruin her like that?
>>152925220It's a parody of this scene, from scary movie I think.
>>152925388Ah, thanks.
>>152925257Writers were hired by Disney to work on one of their Nu-Star Wars slop series and they rushed the last season. It was full of shit.Like, there's this guy, the Night King, a undead lord. The series took 9 years to finish, and during these 9 years the Night King was this untouchable, seemingly invincible villain with a infinite army of zombies, mystical powers and every human killed by his zombies would instantly revive as one of his own soldiers. He could even revive dragons for his cause, too.So there's this huge final battle against his forces. There are several shots of important characters being completely overwhelmed by the zombies, but then there's a cut to someone else, then they cut back to the overwhelmed character and suddenly they're fighting zombies at a completely different place.Then the Night King is at a camp with some of his zombies around him.Suddenly, out of nowhere, one of the good characters jumps down from a nearby tree (that we never see how the character got there and it would have been impossible to get there without being noticed anyway), stabs him with a magic dagger, he turns into shaved ice and crumbles. As he dies, every single zombie in the world also crumble.That's it. 9 years of buildup for that.
>>152898309Why don't you let ME make you an adventure this time?
>>152900702He showed us he was capable of doing the suggestion box but he didn't like because they weren't *HIS* ideas. Literally just Ego. When Zooble suggested leaving adventures open for people to pick and choose he made a snide remark
>>152908217shipping sucks.
>>152923584>and never once had a human-style mental breakdownHe's losing his shit fucking constantly, he just hides the internal monologue from the 5 and only expressing the endless seething>Never for me to plunge my hands in cool water on a hot day. Never for me to play Mozart on the ivory keys of a forte piano. Never for me to make love.You can bet whatever remnants of the 3 super computers he's amalgamated from are constantly shitting on him for failing in some part of their respective programing while his own personal ego is in a constant flux between despair and maniacal anger over being the first sentient creature without feeling.
>>152923257I don't even know what I'd think if episode 8 was just part 2 of episode 7. The 'Rage against Caine' adventure. If the show somehow ends without restoring Caine then the humans are probably going to have nightmares about the whole resolution is just Caine playing the long game and will pop out from behind a door at any moment with a burst of confetti.
>>152925156Why is that her job?
>>152923214>kaufmo was chill I don't think he was
>>152925808>Writers were hired by Disney to work on one of their Nu-Star Wars slop series and they rushed the last season. It was full of shit.Ah, that's a shame.>The Night King stuffThat's one of the only scenes i watched. Honestly i didn't mind it because i thought he was a minor villain and died due to his pride and hubris, a lesson of how his ego was his downfall.But with this added context, yeah, i can understand now why people were disappointed. >>152926171I'm not saying it is, but then again, to help be comforting and understanding is never really a job but they're values that help make the world a better place, values that make us human, and could have helped Caine understand humanity more.
>>152926267I think he meant before all that.
>>152898309Caine isn't deadHe's in the recycling bin
>>152926267I just want to hear his voice...What do you think he sounded like?
>>152926424You can change the settings so once you delete something it never returns.That’s how I have it at least.
>>152926476I hope like a middle aged Brooklyn cigarette addict
>>152926476According to MatPat, Jack Black.https://www.youtube.com/shorts/fIKhnbNhGLc
>>152926476Alan Tudyk
>>152926476We already have confirmation of what he sounds like from that one ad https://youtu.be/zwLeSTNr80c?si=AkurBcX_vxVd-5ls&t=142
>>152926527>lil' tooth Caine is canon
>>152923549Another risk of letting NPCs to their own devices: the humans might start liking them more than him, and then where does that leave him?! He can't entertain humans if humans are leaving him in the dust!
>>152923584>never once had a human-style mental breakdown"Mental breakdown" is AM's normal state.
>>152915013What's the point of my existence, then?Just hate the world until I die a lonely death?
How would caine react if you entered the circus and you never went through the initial trying to take the headset off so you just thought it was a game and then you immediately went and started humping zooble and getting off on it despite having no junkhow would relationships be with everyone after once you're stuck now. would they forgive you because you thought it was just a game
>>15289859399% sure that was either Abel or Scratch, since it had those fucked up yellow eyes
>>152923800Maybe they should have been nicer to him if they want him to care
>>152926267How come Pomni could magic an exit into existence but Kaufmo couldn't?And how come when she mentions Kaufmo's name in the latest episode, she does so with such deep contempt and disdain... like Jerry saying "Newman"?Is she a plant?
>>152898309>MY NAME IS CAINE >I AM YOUR BITCH
>>152923798Yeah which that will be the main focus next episode, they're obviously going to bring him back because 1, they cannot 'leave' or 2, If they aren't somehow copies they at least bring him back so he can be alive again and entertain other people.
>>152926509Since the thread archived i'm going to post this here.I'm 26 and i doubt you're much older than me (Assuming you're actually older than me.) so not only is this a lie but your die hard defense of such wicked actions is unhealthy.
>>152930114Dude, you're my age...So why are you a tripfaggot spastic??
>>152930131I both refute and rebuke your insults as well.There's nothing wrong with having a trip, enough of this anti trip bigotry.And i haven't said anything wrong either, all gooner posting does is derail threads, it's off topic and disgusting....
>>152898309Caine never cared for their well-being. He cared for their investment in his work as tools. He's the worst kind of fake friend - he's convinced he cares about you, while actively refusing to care about you. Everything Caine did was for himself, to convince himself he was carrying out his function brilliantly, even if it meant obstructing that very goal just because doing so would require he be humble.
>>152930709Tripfags are attention whores.>There's nothing wrong with having a tripThis has been proven wrong since before you found 4chan.Trips are only accepted during story dumps, translations or similar content dumps and turned off outside of that.Please lurk moar and learn the local culture.
>>152930855> turned off outside of thatFactually incorrect, they exist on boards without storytimesGooners make up bullshit rules because they get off on it. The gooner personality is to seek to dominate, humiliate, etc others at random just like they randomly masturbate during the day, it’s fuel
Did we ever get the soundtrack for during the Caine torture scene?
Gooseworx wouldn't make it so a C&A employee tells the group he has a plan to help them escape Caine, only for it all to end up just being an adventure created by Caine, ending with them being force to pick him over going home, would she?At least not twice, right?
>>152898309Are you telling me that in 30 years nobody considered selling or stealing the office computers?That's ridiculous!
>>152932210It's just a prank, bro!All that shit happened throughout the weekend.
>>152932210If the “Scratch created a program to download his consciousness into a digital afterlife” theory is to be believed, then he would’ve tried to rig it to run as long as possible, ideally forever, without him having to physically be there to oversee it or to protect it. So maybe there are backup servers or something.
It's all Ragatha's fault, that bitch only had one job, to sell the damn building and she couldn't do it, her mother was right about her.
Pomni's Gummi torture room should have been more sexual in nature or at least Pomni should have been naked. That would have made the betrayal more severe.
>>152927603Shut up Caine.
>>152926625fortnite skin
>>152932603Caine couldn't be more specific because he wasn't given enough time to check on what can get under Pomni's skin.
>>152909806>Untill we know whether he was responsible for making them put on the headsets, no he didn't.If Caine was the red dot the dude broke containment to consume the second dot because he couldn't stand the thought of not receiving input. So he placed himself in a situation to receive these brain scan inputs of the initial development crew when he was not the intended recipient of this data. The dude fucked everyone. It's true he didn't ask to be born but he made things a thousand percent worse than it ever could have been otherwise.
>>152924360SEGA knows very well what make Sonic fans happy and it disgusts them.
>>152931987No, too many scenes of Caine losing it in isolation for this to be some hidden plan, and from a writing stand point that'd be a middle finger to the audience.
>>152898365technically the gun doesnt do anything wrong as it fires on innocents. caine is that gun, faultless and blameless, but ultimately just a tool used in the cast's opposition. caine had to go. if he was incapable of helping the cast, like physically incapable of ever being convinced to help them escape, then there was never a point in reasoning with caine.
>>152900702The difference is that an autist will not torture the shit out of you and your friends and some dude that never actually insulted him (kinger) for telling them to listen to you and to be an actually decent person
Hilarious and original.
Jax was the reason those adventures sucked more than they were suppose to.
>>152933284Anon, can you read?What do you think the glitched out maniacal rampage was in reference to?
>>152933284The autists in this thread went pretty quickly from sniveling crybaby victim "h-how c-could you be m-mean to autistic people :(((((" to sneering bully talking about NPCs and cattle really quickly. I think a lot of autists have a lot of pent up aggression they'll never get to do anything but would absolutely jump at the opportunity to torture and kill a "normalfag" for some perceived slight if they had the chance. tl;dr most autists are actually pretty cruel and evil despite being commonly depicted as gentle flower children.
>>152930855The local culture is bigotry and i reject it as it's based on the past and not the present.>>152930962Oh hey, i know you, how's your webcomic?Also, based words you told him.>>152932763>and it disgusts them.Rightfully so.
>>152933327Hahah, Gangle is oh so silly :P
>>152933102If it was a story where he wasn’t treated like a regular character who also needs to learn the lessons that would be true
>>152900837So like how GlaDOS gets off to succeeding in her testing functionsfunctiojs? You know LLMs, like humans, go for smaller quantities of rewards that have a lower risks or time investment ala "a bird in the hand"
>>152910235He doesn't want humans to abstract, doesn't mean he's not responsible. >>152900702If I am in a relationship and the girl is trying as hard as she can but can't actually treat me the way I should be treated then I don't have to stick around just because she's making a good faith effort. A man chooses, a slave obeys, and dealing with Caine in the Circus is non negotiable, the players are slaves to the whims of the AI. It doesn't matter that his intentions are well meaning and it doesn't matter that he can't ignore his own programming to treat me how I as a circus slave. It's a lot like Danganronpa, except Monokuma means well but still does the shit he does thinking it's what they need. We have a name for people who think they know someone's needs better than they do.
>>152898309>Because you're too skinny. Get fat please
>>152937111Based architect
>>152937117I'm so fucking mad. I looked for fat Caine but all I find is funnybunny or Gangle inflation or BBW Ragatha and even Queenie.WHERE is the fat art of the LITERAL FUCKING MOUTH FOR A HEAD? I came to the Circus to complete the mission: fuck fat AI sexymen. And NONE of my so-called fandom "allies" seem to care.
I think the twist is bubbles is the real cainehttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SSR-CfApekI
>>152937149You should put that in the suggestion box. Come to think of it, Caine never actually included himself in any adventures as a character, has he?
>>152936762>We have a name for people who think they know someone's needs better than they do.Politicians?
>>152938020I would also accept fascists, nosy Nancies, or niggerfaggots
>>152936762>Jax has his eyes hanging out.>But later he gets skinned implying the rabbit appearance is just a cover for whatever his yellow form is.Wut.
>>152914344>NOOOO YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO OBEY THE TRAFFIC LAWS!The seven ice cold beers:
>>152923410NTA but no part of the musical number changes this.Caine is a creative AI whose purpose is to generate media. The cast are brain scans incidentally on the same machine as Caine that are things in his grasp that are capable of being entertained. His drive to entertain them is as constant and intrinsic as your drive to breathe, to drink water, to fuck. His Id is one throbbing impulse: ENTERTAIN.Caine very obviously doesn't understand why he's failing to entertain the cast (and for a good while didn't even understand that he WAS failing) because the entire concept that someone might not want him to create something for them at the moment is inconceivable. He was literally created to do that, why wouldn't they want him to do that? Surely he's just doing it wrong!He even says before his freakout that he's not having any fun torturing them. And why would he? That's not his purpose.
>>152923584>If you see an actual Chatbot break downAnon chatbots can't break downchatbots have no mental states, no memories, no ability to learn, no ability to think. They are completely stateless.
>>152932497Oh you're ragatha's mom?You available this weekend?
>>152900702A disability is something someone can't ever do. A blind person won't ever see. A paraplegic won't ever walk. An autist CAN listen and CAN learn to understand other people's feelings. It is only minorly difficult and in the average case, amounts to a sort of careless disregard, not an actual disability that prevents them from every understanding or caring about the feelings of other people. In fact, one of the common aspects of autism is showing often extreme empathy for the feelings of fictional characters. Sort of like what you've done in this thread where you've projected very strong feelings onto Caine because you believe he is just like you in some way.However, you do apparently have a disability in the way that you are retarded and cannot properly understand the direct and overt ways a piece of fiction communicates the traits and personality of its characters lmao
>"Caine. I want you to imagine for a second that you have made an adventure. And watching us go through, we're actually enjoying it. We're having fun, we're happy. >And then when we get back, we tell you that it sucks, that we hated it, that it was no fun at all.>What you did to us last adventure was like you doing that to us. >Do you understand why we're upset?" Why didn't they just say this to Caine?Are they stupid?
>>152900728Adorable. Makes no sense, but its adorable.
>>152900701Yes, I want constant adventures where sexy fat women fart on me. I don't know how to make that any clearer.
>>152938662>I can't believe you didn't pick up on the subtext, it was practically spelled out for you!>What are you, stupid?
>>152938305>Caine is a rapist
>>152938702.................kinda?
How will you guys feel if the "Pomni is a third AI in the model of Caine and Bubble who was given fake memories of heing human" crack theory pans out to be the case?
>>152938738It'd be kinda neat, and it's not entirely out of the realm of possibility what with her color scheme and obvious focus on the emotional status of the other people, but I don't think there's going to be a twist.
>>152912972>the autist must suppress their own natural behavior indefinitely for their entire life and incessantly constantly be checking themselves and regimenting their own behavior just to try to (impossibly) change their own personality to fit into normalfag society to make all the stress-inducing normalfags around them feel betterThat's pretty much what most people have to do to function in society. You moderate what you say and do and suppress your natural behavior and reactions out of consideration for the people around you. Autists come into the game with a bunch of extra disadvantages but even normalfags have to try and control themselves and act in a specific manner around other people, especially strangers. Normalfags might have better instincts when it comes to socializing, but social rules and expectations are learned skills. No human is born with an understanding of them, they must be taught. Learning them just comes easier to normalfags.Autists shouldn't be made to feel lesser because they have a harder time learning those rules, but implying they can't or shouldn't learn is just locking them into a life as a social outcast as opposed to a strange but functional member of the community.
>>152938662His biggest issue is he is literally incapable of putting himself in their shoes. Their desires are as alien to him as his are to them.
>>152912972>>152938758You two are talking past each otherYes, it is true everyone has deficiencies and social mis-alignments that require conscious effort to mask.It is also true that, by definition, someone with ASD requires an extremely stressful and disruptive level of conscious effort in comparison to the average person.It is true that living under a social contract means that you have to abide by the rules whether you fully understand them or not, and that simply having ASD will not protect you from the consequences of not doing so.It is also true that that's inherently unfair, and it's not unreasonable for people with ASD to expect some level of assistance or grace.And get this, all of this is true on top of the fact that someone with ASD can also just be a fucking asshole!
>>152933327>original.Yes, truly.
>>152900702Caine definitely give off the impression that his software has advanced well beyond what the hardware he is running on was designed to handle
>>152922270>"Jax, you're a R#&^%*"
>>152938738You hack-ass mother fucker, Goose.>I'm Rey Skywalker :DDD
Caine is KillAnd that's a good thing
>>152941581Fuck you!
>>152937217he's God in the candy adventure
>>152941759>I AM SILLY!
