Seriously, why tho?
>>152980126A lot of it is just Korean studios mimicking anime.
>>152980144And without the talent or budget. Sometimes it's guys from Texas animating it so it occasionally looks better
>>152980126Was Megas XLR the oldest example of this?
>>152980126hey look it's nega shaggy
>>152980126Because you dont pay the studios to do better
>>152980200Totally Spies
>>152980126Hiring cheap Koreans and not involving an actual single Japanese artist will kind of get you these results. I don't hate faux anime but you get what you are willing to pay for.
>>152980126Mmm... Pizza...
>>152980369A lot of your favourite animes are probably outsourced to cheap Korean studios anon
>>152980126im more bothered by shit like my adventures with superman, but really most faux anime will have US culture sensibilities plastered over an anime "inspired" look and clash hard and be gay
>>152980126I loved it in Castlevania (and Invincible?), but it got tiring so quickly. Not only was it repetitive, it got worse with each use.
>>152980126>western animeLike what?
>>152980126Because while these shows try to copy Japanese design flourishes and other visual cliches, they have the workflow of typical western productions.
>>152981282True, but they usually have japanese in key places like character designer and director to maintain the anime feel.
>>152980215>youI assume by "you" you mean "the companies funding these shows."Fucking Invincible is funded by Amazon, one of the richest companies on the planet, and its animation is on par with a mid-tier indie youtube cartoon.
>>152980126I like how "western anime" just has basic animation styles and tricks from fucking 20 years ago, meanwhile modern anime has left that shit in the dust.Like, where is the "western anime" that looks like this? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d1reryPOMX0
>>152980317Wasn't that a French Japanese production?
>>152981256making home made pizza is a lot of fun even if it takes quite some time. Dominos and papajohns are so shit now
>>152982506Made in France, but animated in Korea.
>>152980126I watched the video. Congratulations, anon. You got me.The youtuber does pose a fun challenge to himself - redrawing faux anime characters to be more like actual anime. While I don't think he's quite capable enough for this, we already have examples of this all the time when westaboo artists draw western characters, which undermines some of his own theories. Westaboo fanart can follow Western designs to a tee, and still feel Japanese.His general conclusion though is correct. Western artists tend to underestimate the premium anime places on form integrity, which you'd think is quite important in animation.
>>152982810I'd argue that people over-focus on the style of the characters in terms of how japan draws the, and in doing so misses the much more important aspect of how motion and action is conveyed. Panty and Stocking is drawn like an adult swim show, but it moves and breathes like anime. Meanwhile, netflix Voltron and Castlevania brands itself to be anime but still moves and feels like a cartoon.
>>152980126I haven't watched the video, but I think the reason is because western 'anime' has no art direction.It's just an amalgamation of "anime-isms" like big eyes, colorful hair, etc. But no individual artist actually draws like this, not even in Japan
>>152982877When you watch an anime, what you're seeing is the art director's personal style, whether it's adapted from a manga, or is direct to anime, it's not a fake art style.
>>152982855Agreed, and I should have made a better effort separating the discussion between design and animation itself. The youtuber is definitely more about design choices.This is revisiting an old chestnut, but most of us intrinsically know when we're watching a Japanese-made episode of an American show. It's in the drawing, it's in the animation, it's in the workflow, it's even in the camera choices. If faux anime wants to pass the smell test, it has to nail all of those things. In fact, design might even be the least important thing on the list.
>>152982916There's also a big misconception that western artists make when copying anime.They think stylization in anime means drawing in symbols. Like making the chin pointy, or the hair spiky, or the eyelashes drawn a certain way. And so they stop looking at what they're drawing as a real human with a real chin or real hair, but instead as these 'anime symbols'. And this results in a very plastic result that lacks realism. In actual anime, they don't draw in symbols, they think of a real chin/nose/etc and then draw it in what they personally believe to be an appealing way, which just so happens to resemble a dot nose or whatever. But it is a real nose.
>it’s another “good animation=anime, bad animation=cartoon” thread
>>152980126Because anime studios have decades of experience creating anime. They have standard practices, established workflows, and an eye for what anime is.Imitations are trying to recreate it from scratch with an amateurish understanding of these things.And in many cases, an aversion to actually copying the anime style too much.
>>152981282that doesn't count
>>152981282>animes
>>152981399Invincible doesn't resemble anime at all
>>152983138You know, this is also a good example. Look how much emotion is conveyed in that face, but without being cartoonishly exaggerated. Compare it to >>152983023 and how out of the 7 people there most of them just have dead fish expressions. Even the guy on the left who is pulling a frown doesn't really have any oomph behind it. I lack the artistic background to be able to define why the anime face has stronger emotions than the vox machina gang, but I can feel that its true just looking at them.
>>152983138>kimonos>tsunamis
>>152983247I think it's just a lack of attention to detailThey draw an angry face by drawing a frown. It looks like a frown, so they call it a day, but they don't actually step back and ask themselves "does it feel like real emotion?"It feels like they phoned it in. They're not really personally invested in whether that face actually looks expressive as good as it can be.
>>152983138>>152983370> I'm not a fucking furry! I'm kemonomimi, you FUCKHEAD.
>>152980126Buy an ad faggot
>>152980126Made by people who have never watched a real cartoon/visited John K's blog in their life.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zAPf5fSDGVk>>152980317We got Jewel Pet out of that because Japan went "Hold my beer" after watching it.>>152982120Avatar.>>152982916Which never happens in this day of age.>>152983247Watch A Gruesome Twosome, it puts what you just posted to shame.
>>152983560>John GayIdc what that fruity nigga is doin
>>152983599John K is straight.
>>152983560>avatarhow do we tell him that all the animation staff was asian
>>152983399>>152983247Those details come with experience. The imitators are just happy to hit the broad strokes, but when you work in that medium for years you hone your craft.You can't expect them to cultivate those skills in a single attempt.
>>152983637He knows.>There is no point in animating in Korea, because you get nothing creative out of it. (Studio Mir excluded). They are really there just to move model sheets from one position on the screen to another.>What we call Korean animation is really just inbetweening.>If you do send them specific customized key poses (which most studios don't) they won't use them anyway. Or even if they do they will tone them down so badly that it takes all the life out of the cartoons.>This causes you to lose a lot of time and money in retakes.>BUT! The problems with trying to get service studios to use the work you send them are so immense and expensive that it has finally dawned on me that it's not worth it. I don't care whether the service studio is in Korea or a block away.>In a post Studio Mir world it's sickening that nobody is catching up to them, seeing that Voltron:LD is only $90,000 per episode and Lego Elves:SOED being less then that. You think that studios would be catching up to them as was the case with Disney in the late 20s (this is what killed off Felix the Cat in 1930), Warner Bros in the mid 30s and TMS in the 80s but instead of doing the right thing (catching up with Studio Mir) they shit all over the industry by making the 70s look like the 50s.
>>152982810I got a headache just reading this trite.
>>152980126not a problem in project nortubel
>>152983247The american faux-anime lacks passion and sincerity. Everything about them is snarky and cynical and filled with winks to the audience that try to say>yeah we're so cool and awesome, but we're not like those GROSS foreign cartoons. Aren't cartoons so fucking stupid haha? But anyways, remember to give all your money to the animator's union and tell hollywood that we deserve more money.
>>152983560>visited John K's blogOpinion discarded. John K just regurgitated advice he copied out of better animators' books in between his own retarded screeds.
>>152983801No, visited John K's blog is a requirement when it comes to making cartoons.
>>152983832No one cares about John K, anon. Haven't for years.
>>152983890Yes they do.
>>152983832John K couldn't even maintain his own career, let alone finish Cans without Labels.
>>152984113
>>152983247While doing a little touch up on this, I noticed a couple of things.1. The absence of line weight can be felt, even when the lines are very thin.2. For some reason, they are all slightly more wall-eyed than they should be, which gives them a thousand yard stare and compounds the "dead fish" expression.
>>152985029>2. For some reason, they are all slightly more wall-eyed than they should be, which gives them a thousand yard stare and compounds the "dead fish" expression.Do you think its a matter of the artists being bad at perspective, and handling the upward angle wrong? Or is it stylistic regardless of shot?
>>152980126Adopting anime techniques doesn’t make it “imitation anime.” Pointless video
>>152985109I'm not sure, but it's something I've noticed in shows like Teen Titans or occasionally in Avatar.There may be a point about artists treating anime features as completely flat and copying them without considering the form or perspective. Or these flaws are just more noticeable when you have more elaborate designs.Consider the fact almost all of our modern cartoon characters have perfectly round eyes, no matter which angle they are viewed from. If someone is learning to draw by copying from cartoons, that's going to wreck their perception.
>>152983023This picture bothers me as the noses have a yaw different to the rest of the face.A lot of westoid art suffers from things I learned in a child psychology class. Young children have a period where they draw toes on shoes, because the feet are inside the shoes. A lot of the nostril fetish in this picture stems from that immaturity, draw X because X is there. My asian jeans tell me to abstract X as it's visually taxing.
>>152983890>>152984113Irrelevant to his blog being a great resource.
Honestly this topic has always interested me because of how many people can instinctively FEEL the difference even though they're not trained artists themselves. The average person can just catch subtle details that they cannot necessarily explain why but are there
>>152980126a lot of modern us animation is eithera. lgbt/blm-type tumblr styleb. family guy "adult" slapstick with lots of torture porn and edgy humorc. wannabe generic anime/marvel fusion that all looks the same
>>152985909Part of that I think is because of the sound design and music, which anime does well and western animation often doesn't do at all. this creates an emotional context that persists long after episode is over, but people struggle to recognize thats why they had the reaction they did when later trying to figure out why the animation felt better because they are looking at the visual elements only in an audiovisual experience. Take this clip. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Am3T0F9uw6cSuperpowered enemies fighting each other. But how powerful does it feel when they trade blows? The fight is basically the same *swish* *smack* *wet crunch* sound effects over and over again in a row for each hit that is swung. People only barely react to being hit. The whole thing is set to stock music. The overall presentation feels very much like none of these attacks matter, you are just going down a checklist. If it wasn't for the gore at the end, nothing would distinguish a killing blow from a regular hit. Now, compare that to this objectively lower stakes fight where no one even dies.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e15OeeUr1_0Doesn't that feel like those punches each had more weight than the logically much stronger attacks in the first clip? Enemies get sent spiraling away in chaotic ragdoll physics, or express actual fear as they realize how fucked they are instead of being video game NPCs that just trade blows until they run out of HP and die. Instead this 'fight' is only three punches long, and with every one of them your visceral reaction is that was a knockout blow.
>>152980200No megas was definitely going for more of a comic look
>>152982488>Like, where is the "western anime" that looks like this?They'd have to pay their animators actual wages, can't have that for a non Hollywood studio
>>152982971In all fairness most faux anime shows tend to be weak in terms of actual animation. You've got stand outs like teen titans or avatar but studios nowadays are way too cheap to make something that consistently looks that good. This isn't exclusive to the west as japan has been getting more stingy with animation budgets in recent years as well but the decline is nowhere near as drastic. You'd be lucky to get something thats as creative and expressive as Ed, Edd, and Eddy or My Life as a Teenage Robot in a modern production
>>152986114>Enemies get sent spiraling away in chaotic ragdoll physics, or express actual fear as they realize how fucked they areI think apart from the sound design, another major difference in your clips is the role backgrounds play. The setting in the anime clip interacts with the characters more. It's sort of like comparing movies shot on location versus movies shot in the volume. Volume tech is convincing enough, but the actors often just stand there. It's like a big skybox, and you notice it.Also notable is how one can literally see wind and air pressure in the anime. It's like every Jackie Chan movie in the 80s seemed to be covered in a layer of coke, or the particle effects in eastern video games. It adds to the impact.
>>152982810isnt shera forgotten and dumped by mattel and they'll pretend it never existed?
>>152980317I would have said Inspector Gadget.
>>152980126The reason why Western animation and comics are copying anime and manga is because people got so used to those mediums being simplified to very specific examples, that anything not part of them somehow has to be from outside.Animation: Disney, Family Guy, BeanmouthComics: Superheroes, Garfield maybeThey see anime as the only alternative to the others because they never heard of any other exampleWe just lost Sam Keith recently, now take a guess how many comic book fans even know about The Maxx
>>152986707Do Japanese-animated cartoons from the 80s and 90s count though? I keep seeing debates as to whether or not it actually counts. Especially with DiC and Marvel's output.
>>152986809thankfully no one because 90s shit was cringe
>>152986906Bait
>>152986851I would say yes if only for the instances where the shows that were animated in Japan weren't done in an anime style. There was something to the style of those shows in the '80s that lend itself to a sort of western anime style of that time.
>>152983023This shit just looks gay
>>152986851>>152986924> There was something to the style of those shows in the '80s that lend itself to a sort of western anime style of that time.what does this mean
A lot of Western 'anime' DOES NOT want to look exactly like anime. It wants to look like it's own thing and blends elements of both Western and Japanese art. Seems like a lot of people genuinely believe that Western productions are actively trying to look 100% like Japanese anime and are failing at the task. It doesn't occur to them that the people in charge are making conscious decisions to prevent the artwork from looking more Japanese. There are a lot of Westerners now that can accurately mimic anime art styles. Whether this approach is actually effective at attracting and retaining viewers is a different matter, it's entirely possible that the modern viewer completely dislikes any element of Western stylization and would prefer for everything to look exactly like typical Japanese anime art styles.
>>152985109I think it might be a "depending on the situation" type of thing. Sometimes it appears to stylistic/on purpose as part of the art style, other times it comes off as the artists involved not having a good idea about how to draw things at a certain perspective.As someone who also has a hard time drawing things at certain perspectives, I have an easier time figuring things out like that.For example this: >>152985340Appears to be stylistic since not only is Raven supposed to be the "creepy" one of the team, but a lot of front views are like that thanks to how the eyes are drawn by default. Whereas the Vox Machina one comes off as the animators trying to get a realistic look from their characters, but makes them look dead-eyed and samey. All it really would take to fix that would be adding in some more sneers or furrowed brows to at least give it SOME semblance of variety in the emotions, even if it is surface level.>>152986809>We just lost Sam Keith recently, now take a guess how many comic book fans even know about The MaxxGod, I need to give that a re-read at some point.
>>152986943I dunno, just vibes I guess.But, you know what's odd, is that the '90s really didn't have that going on.
>>152986924Elaborate that for me. Are we talking shows that slipped in anime cliches as part of the art style like G1 Transformers, Gadget and Ghostbusters? Or stuff like Disney's late 80s output or TMNT's first season where it's less obvious that the Japanese influence is there.
>>152986985I was also thinking even stuff like Thundercats. There's just something about the eyes. A lot of the time western cartoons have no eye color. It's just white circles with black dots in them.
>>152987036Oh shit yeah, forgot about ThunderCats.
>>152986949If you're just curious about what the visual differences are here you go:>A LOT less detail on the clothing. Far less folds, wrinkles and complex shading that follows the 3d geometry of the clothing.Western animation is expensive so they need to cut corners and simplified clothing and shadows is an easy way of doing that, it makes the clothing look flat or painted on>ALOT less detail on the hairFor the same reason above.>Reuse of the same small set of character designers and Korean outsourcing studiosThere really isn't that much Western 'anime' being made so visual similarities are more easily comparable. If we had 10x the production there would be more visual variety because they simply couldn't all use the same studios and staff>more emphasis/detail on lips and nosesEven French 'Franwa' stuff tends to put more detailed lips and noses because Westerners consider it important to beauty. Anime typically only uses lipstick on older female characters but shows like Totally Spies have no issue giving teenaged characters lipstick and French shows like Lolirock has a younger cast where all the girls have more detailed lips, it's not used to signify age but beauty. The noses because nose is also an indicator of beauty or lack thereof, compare to Japan where they don't care about noses as much; their anime characters tend to lack noses and IRL women that are considered beautiful there often have what are considered 'bad noses' in the West.>less lineweight varietycosts money>less post-processing effects like bloom and color gradingcosts money>heads and faces are often 'taller' and more verticalJapanese art styles tend to have rounder, more horizontal bent to it's facial stylization. This is also a common difference between Japanese and Korean art stylesI think people tend to underestimate how much more detailed good Japanese animation is.
>>152986949The issue is less the style and more the presentation.So much of it is just, for lack of a better term, really fucking lame.Too sarcastic, too drenched in irony, and too much of it just feels like the writers don't want to be making an animated property.You could make a show that looks almost identical to an anime, but if it's still written like any other adult cartoon, a lot of people are still going to dislike it.See: Castlevania
Every wannabe anime just ends up being as shit as actual anime lol
>>152986949>A lot of Western 'anime' DOES NOT want to look exactly like anime.They couldn't even if they wanted to. The budget isn't there and legally western studios can't get away with paying their animators pennies to work a week straight to meet deadlines. This simplified style is a compromise resulting from the constraints of the western animation industry. If they had the money and the people they'd just ape anime wholesale
>>152987160See I have opposing opinions on Castlevania. I think it is held back by it's writing. The writing is quite simply: Bad. The presentation though? It's actually surprisingly good (at times). I watched the show degrade and degrade from season to season (watching out of masochism), and while I can't defend the writing there were several moments where the show impressed me with it's visual presentation. There are talented people at the studio doing their best to make something that looks interesting and unique when compared against anime, carving out their own visual identity, but I absolutely can not recommend anyone waste their time watching the show when the written content is so fucking dull. The occasional spots of visual shine don't compensate. I hope the staff and studio get the opportunity to sink their teeth into something that's actually worthwhile one day.Relatedly, Lenore is one of the most beautiful animated women I've ever seen. I like the lipstick, I like the blush, I like the nose. Actual anime wouldn't design something like her anymore. Too bad she was a shitty character trapped in a shitty show.
>>152981256>>152982771This but a burger instead.
>>152987325>and legally western studios can't get away with paying their animators pennies to work a week straight to meet deadlines.Anon, stop it, major western shows have been caught outsourcing to fucking North Korea of all places.And not just some random no-name it was fucking Invincible of all things, probably the biggest western animated show so far this decade.All outsourced labor is inevitably being outsourced to some studio paying their animators pennies to work a week straight to meet deadlines.
>>152985340Good thing at least Faux anime understoof you DONT draw cheek lines on a woman unless she is meant to be ugly or past 42
>>152986114But modern anime avoids showing impact flash because they are still paranoic over the PokePorygon Myth, they just jumpcut to the impact release, but there is no impact.
>>152980126americans already are too self aware, irony poisoned and "trope aware" to do proper western animationwhat makes you think they can do anime any better?
>>152987489why does it have to be done better?
>>152987395Hell, it's not even a new practice. Apparently the Simpsons Movie did it too, as did several Italian productions and even the 2003 Ninja Turtles series gave an episode out to North Korea that was openly documented around the time of its production.
>>152980126Americans can’t draw
>>152987586What's the point of doing something worse?
>>152980126/a/ fags go out of their WAY to obsess over usvery tsundere of them ngl
>>152980126>>152980200>>152986345Its interesting, there was a creative lineage started in the 70s of realistically proportioned western animation that by the time we hit the 2000s had fully embraced the more stylized thick outline look drawing from the alt-art styles of the time and anime that kept the realistic framework but stylized it heavily.Sadly this tradition died alongside 2d action cartoons in the late 2000s-early 2010s.
>>152982877Yes, that sounds did about right. Also its the imitation for that project where the japanese animators have been developing that house style over many projects.
>>152985918Also...d. Ren and Stimpy knock off.>>152986428>You'd be lucky to get something thats as creative and expressive as Ed, Edd, and Eddy or My Life as a Teenage Robot in a modern productionReminder that Animaniacs'2020 would've broke that mold if Wellesley Wild didn't show up and that Yuichiro Yano (who was a episode director on the original series) was it's show runner as was the original intent for Animaniacs'2020.
>>152987597Akom has been using North Korean Studio SEK since The Simpsons and Tiny Toon Adventures (see The Wacko World of Sports as that episode looks more jittery then Akom's usual affair) and was likely using SEK on Tracy Ullman Simpson as well.Also Empress Chung where it's jittery animation was because of SEK who did the actual animation for Akom, and that jittery animation was found in The Simpsons and Tiny Toon Adventures.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K9ZgM_farEU
>>152980126>Seriously, why tho?Because they don't go to Japan to learn from them.
>>152987804Oh fuck off Famicom.>>152986428No, Japan's real issues are:1. The rampant abuse of outsourcing to dozens of outside teams and animation studios per episode. Which is all thanks to2. The absolute dogshit conditions those animators are being put through. Sure you got a few exceptions out there, stories where shows either get the time they need to be made, or shows that are near or fully completed their production orders by airtime of episode 1 or 2, but they tend to be the minority. Not helped by a good deal of the studios in Japan having a baseline level of quality that ranges from "passable" to "why aren't you bankrupt yet?"Not at all surprising then that American companies like Disney, Netflix, Amazon and Warner took the wrong lessons from their Japanese partners from all the times those companies outsourced to Japan
>>152980200LIVING HERE IN JERSEYFIGHTING ALIANS FROM AFAR
>>152987907You know that Ulman Simpsons was done entirely in the US, right?
>>152983023>peoplethe art style is the least of VM's problems
>>152980126TT2003 is the only faux anime show I actually enjoy visually. I don't know, maybe it's the exaggerated proportions
>>152986428>My Life as a Teenage Robotgod that show was genuinely beautiful to look at, wish I appreciated it more as a kid https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HkT9A8evx-A
>>152986114>brutal fucking ryona is a 2026 animeholy fuck I didn't think it would be more brutal than the manga. I was disappointed in the lack of tackle ryona (anime and manga) but this is still pretty great
>>152987957Ulman Simpsons was farmed out to South Korea as the earliest shorts which were done locally were too expensive to produced, in fact the first animation to be sent off to South Korea had The Simpsons eating red kimchi, which the US supervisor had to tell Akom that "Americans don't eat kimchi" (it was the 1980s after all, that wouldn't be a thing until the 2020s).Pic related, and all because Akom fucked up on Transformers G1 that badly.
>>152988029My Life as a Teenage Robot isn't Animaniacs.Now Animaniacs, that show was genuinely beautiful to look at.
>>152986809I did, though reading Kieth's other stuff is a trip
Part of it is the idea that manga/anime "style" is more "mature" than western art styles, but at the same time not getting that each manga/anime has their own distinct "style" outside of generic shonenshit. It becomes this weird uncanny valley effect where they use the tropes of a typical anime "style" while also restraining themselves based on western philosophy of animation instead of letting loose.One consequence of this is the overall stiff animation in these faux anime. Anime itself, especially these days, have very stiff scenes (And poor lighting but that's another thing for another discussion), but have moments where the animators are allowed to let loose occasionally. Most of these faux anime don't have an Itano missile circus moment that people make compilations of. It's like they have more movement than a typical anime scene, but then use that same level of movement for action scenes as well.Whereas a lot of more traditional western cartoons (Action kids shows typically for this example) do have a lot more moments of animators letting loose for key moments.
>>152988066Source: http://www.akomkorea.com/bbs/board.php?bo_table=s22
>>152988066Where is your proof? other than the ass I'm pretty sure you pulled that out of.links? Confirmation by the crew? Seriously, every time something like this gets brought up, it gets questioned because no one has found whatever sources you have, and when asked, you ALWAYS dodge the question.>>152987951IT'S HARD TO FIND FIRST GEARIN YOUR GIANT ROBOT CAR
>>152988066>>152988123Also... Answering what the hell red kimchi is.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MOa52-N2zZs
For Invisible specifically, the problem is that Kirkman doesn't care about good animation, and basically treats the series like a live action tv show
>>152988123That's a typo. They point out that they did 39 episodes of G1 Transformers too, even though I've only seen 19 of them actually being handled by them or a subcontractor tied to them.
>>152983560I hate what looney tunes did to western animation.It standardized animation in the west as wacky slapstick cartoons for children, undermining any attempt to make something serious.
>>152988155Direct from the horse's webside.http://www.akomkorea.com/bbs/board.php?bo_table=s22
>>152987333>There are talented people at the studio doing their best to make something that looks interesting and unique when compared against anime, carving out their own visual identity,Agreed. Nocturne had its flaws, but god damn if they didn't have a memo from management on the wall they had to walk by every day that said in large letters "Alucard must always look very cool".
>>152988179Not a typo, Nelson Shin is right on this.>>152988186What Looney Tunes did is a good thing, plus those cartoons were aimed at movie going adults, not kids.Wacky slapstick is what animation is supposed to be, otherwise you do it in live action.
>>152988197See previous post I made>>152988179IIRC, not even Nelson Shin himself has stated AKOM worked on the Ulman shorts. He always brings up their tenure as either 1988 or 1989 when the show itself entered production.
South Park, Family Guy, Drawn Together, Brickleberry, Rick and MortyCurrent U.S. adult animation is homogenized.
>>152988262Nelson Shin did say he worked on the shorts, otherwise they wouldn't be eating kimchi in the short >>152988066 posted
>>152988244>Wacky slapstick is what animation is supposed to be, otherwise you do it in live action.Thats a wild limitation for a medium that has the benefit of being able to depict anything you can imagine and draw. Animation should be used to do science fiction and fantasy better than live action ever could, because sets and special effects are expensive but a dragon isn't particularly more expensive to draw than anything else is.Like, do you honestly think that over the top action like pic related would be at all improved by being done in live action?
>>152988244>Wacky slapstick is what animation is supposed to be, otherwise you do it in live action.There are things that Live action would not be able to do well that animation can do really well. I can't imagine some of the fight sequences of say... Macross for example being done in live action without being disorientating.>inb4 top gunNot as crazy as Macross.
>>152988287Tell me WHERE he said it.I dare you. I fucking dare you.
>>152988310http://www.akomkorea.com/bbs/board.php?bo_table=s22>1986, where production on those shorts started.>>152988304And Chuck Jones did do science fiction and fantasy subjects.
>>152988339That doesn't count, and you posted that link three times already.Post an interview or ACTUAL crew confirmation claiming this. If you can't then I know you're full of dogshit.
>>152980126Genuine Anime are based in mangas of 50 chapters and novels of 6 books. "Western anime" are 100% original and they have a padding problem, they need fill a episode with original "plot"
>>152988379That does count, that is from the ACTUAL crew confirmation claiming this.You're the one posting dogshit as the FUCKING kimchi is right there.
>>152985745You know that real people dont have small noses like in anime right
>>152988389This raises a valid point.Most shows are indeed glorified infomercials for you to go and read the source material. Not to say ALL adaptations are done with that purposes, but that is for sure the main bulk of current seasonal anime.
>>152988396That proves FUCKING NOTHING. It's like how you claimed DuckTales 2017 was ggoing to be animated by TMS because the crew had roast duck.How mentally retarded are you? Are your parents happy that they raised someone with your "intellect?" Fucking up what should be a meaningful discussion with your bullshit?
>>152988472This is why Japan is 20 times worse off then the US, at least the US is allowed to make content for the sake of making content and not hawking shit no one wants.
Gee. This thread is another derailed thread by Famicom. And why is Ron Stoppable grey and looking like Dante from the Devil May Cry series on OP?
>>152986949One of the consequences of anime getting this popular is that the retards that only watch that think every cartoon that doesnt have basic shape design like samurai jack or rounded out simplified features like Steven Universe is trying to be anime.Its getting so bad im seeing people call fucking ben 10 "western anime" now.
>>152988491Chicken, and TMS was asked to do DuckTales'17 before Disney rejected them for costing/asking for too much, plus TMS was still given money for the Lupin III characters that were used in DuckTales'17 and TMS did use that money to make Lupin III Part 5.FUCK OFF!!!! You have been debunked again.
>>152988516Famicom has nothing to do with this, this is Guy's doing.
>>152988561Also Barneyfag as well, he is in this thread too.
>>152988561Bitch please. If it's all Guy's idea, why isn't his "Lovecraft's Cat" tripfag name not used? It's obvious it's the "samefag" that is (you).
>>152987990I always thought that this show weakest parts was when it was trying to do the 2000s faux anime bs and it was at the strongest when it just played it straight about being a action cartoon
>>152988623He skips it from time to time Barneyfag.
All rise for our most holy of texts.
>>152988581I thought Famicom, Guy and Barneyfag were all the same person.>>152988550Again, post a FUCKING SOURCE. The fact that you don't is why you're hated by everyone.
>>152988624Same here, actually. The few episodes I watched when I was yonger, I noticed it was much stronger when it was going for straightforward action and drama, and not the anime-influenced wacky drawings and humor.
nobody in this thread knows dick about animation. holy fuck. you're all talking out of your ass to rationalize your respective hangups about cartoons and anime.
>>152988687I did.http://www.akomkorea.com/bbs/board.php?bo_table=s22Famicom, Guy and Barneyfag are not the same person.
>>152988718Blame the dipshit who decided to hijack this thread. This motherfucker right here. >>152988723Oh, and speaking of. That's the same FUCKING LINK. I said to post an interview, why don't you do that. Hell, why don't you post the source of this claim >>152988066 while you're at it?
>>152988656>>152988687But slugfucker posts on /v/ too
>>152987153>A LOT less detail on the clothing. Far less folds, wrinkles and complex shading that follows the geometry of the clothing.There arent "western anime" where a character wear 1800s clothes with laces and ruffles. Its always T-Shirt + Pants.
>>152988808this thread was retarded long before famicom lugged his ugly mug in
>>152988808That is the source to >>152988066
You guys have /a/ and twitter to discuss this why come here
>>152988491Let it go. All you'll only get is hypertension and grey hair if not alopecia.Look at this A.J.
>>152988842Famicom is light years better then the rest of the people in this thread, fuck off Barneyfag.
>>152988859Again, where did the damn claim origin ate from? That's what I'm trying to get you to show. But you have consistantly refused to show it beyond that link to AKOM's website.So I will ask you this one last time before I give up. Will you PLEASE post where the information regarding the claim in >>152988066 originated from? What interview did it come from? Was it posted on a site like Poligon, Kotaku, a message board? Who made the claim to begin with? These are the fucking questions I'm trying to get from you, and you have not produced anything but that link to AKOM's website.
>>152988938Nelson Shin himself as that why I brought up his own website.
>>152988836Problem is, that's also most anime that isn't set in a fantasy world, and the same issues apply.
>>152988982Okay, but what INTERVIEW did he bring it up in? That's what I'm trying to get you to produce, but so far, you haven't.And I'm convinced at this point, that you never will.
>>152988836> detailed clothing> those laces and rufflesKaoru Mori designs would make western animators shit themselves in fear.
>>152989781I think any animator would shit themselves in fear of animating this
>>152987602Thisss
>>152980126people just don't understand american anime, I mean, look at this masterpiece and tell me japan is not falling behind, not only artistically but plot wise
>>152990442Thats a different type of show, this thread is mostly about action anime with some comedy shows mixed in there, what you posted is lolicon/shotacon.
>>152989819They have computers for that, Chowder did it.
>>152990948>Chowder did itThey cheated with a gimmick approach where the character masks a static texture. It's fine for a cartoon like Chowder, but not if you're aiming for realism.
>>152991036Thats the only way you can do it.
>>152991036>>152991070Ironically, at least one anime did this before Chowder.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qaG9Kkkdfx0
>>152982337Because spending more won't make the show better. You could buy a used Toyota for 5$ or a Rolls Royce sub for 180k and yet both will get you to work in the same time
>>152981282>>152983538go back
>>152980200The 80s Mighty Mouse had an anime parody episode where the Ghostbusters are drawn in anime style since that show was animated in Japan
>>152987468It wasn't a myth, the Porygon Incident genuinely fucked a lot of kids up. At the time, nobody but the British had been taking epilepsy seriously, and researching the event's cause and impacts actually advanced medical science quite a bit.
>>152991362
>>152991362Thing was they got back Saint Seiya instead.
>>152980126Why does the guy in OP look like Wild Kratts Martin Kratt?
>>152987333She's beautiful, but the design is super generic and has no personality.
>>152980126Ron?
>>152991388>>152991362No, it was animated in Taiwan by Wang Film Animation, and it was a miscommunication on behalf of the Americans, they wanted a Real Ghostbusters parody and they got a weird mishsmash of SaintSeita / Macross Vibes, but BADLY DRAWN.
>>152991365No it did not, dumbass, Japs felt for that shit, it was just mass histerya and fake news, (yes, unironically I am using that term)
>>152991365The "research" was just some old Jap fart pundit of the government being a spokesperson for lying to the people and asshole media talking heads just sucking up to the government to overreach and censor art.It's OK to question these things.
>>152987804>Famicom is HereUuuuuuuuuuuuuuuugh
>>152988092Shut up Famicom
>>152980126Anime takes more pride in animation, both as an art form and as a business, they are incentivized to make shit that’s pleasing to look at in all sorts of ways you may not even notice. Just look at the final episode of JJK season 3 that just released, that shit completely and utterly blows Invincible out of the water. Meanwhile Invincible will NEVER get that level of animation because the higher ups simply don’t care, they think it’s good enough, and they’d much rather spend the budget on more celebrity voice casts
>>152991706>Meanwhile Invincible will NEVER get that level of animation because the higher ups simply don’t careHypothetical question: if you were given the choice between boosting budget by 50%, or having a good Japanese studio work on the show within existing budget constraints, which would you choose?
>>152991539That is the case.
>>152991437Ron blanco...esto es el fin...Invincible is finished
>>152991831Japanese animators get paid more then Korean animators, so the budget had to be tripled to hire a Japanese studio to do these shows.
>>152991847Yes and no.Japanese studios just don't want to work on crap. They'd rather work cheap and make stuff they love than work cheap and make crap.Korea has no standards so they take any job.
>>152991831>budget for an episode of JJK S3 is supposedly $160K>for an episode of Invincible it’s supposedly $2-4 millionEven if you consider that an episode of Invincible is twice the runtime, you’d still be paying the japanese studio around 10x their normal rate per episode
>>152988624>>152988709I don't know I thought the chibi bullshit was charming, but I guess that's just me
Why do western "anime" never have intersting shots or direction? Look at something like Bakemonogatari. That show is 99% characters talking and its carried by the direction.
>>152992023It was novel at the time but nowadays a action cartoon with that style is a billion times more interesting than another animation half pretending to be anime but not really
>>152992243You can say the same thing about 2020's Looney Tunes Cartoons as well as those shorts are shot like a episode of Family Guy.
>>152986809>We just lost Sam Keith recently, now take a guess how many comic book fans even know about The Maxxholy shit i didn't know. fucker had a form of dementia, goddamn. that sucks.
>>152985340>Consider the fact almost all of our modern cartoon characters have perfectly round eyes, no matter which angle they are viewed from. If someone is learning to draw by copying from cartoons, that's going to wreck their perception.or how about anime always has the mouth more facing the camera than anatomy would suggest. it does cut both ways, but if you don't take it into account directly, then it produces the uncanny valley equivalent.
>>152992441>or how about anime always has the mouth more facing the camera than anatomy would suggestThis doesn't happen that much. I can't remember any time it happed this season.
>>152988680>Art book titled "How to draw manga">artwork in question is prebeg tier>drawn by some literal who weeabo who took the time learn Japanese let alone draw to actually draw a page from a real mangaThose western art books were a mistake
>>152992472*never took the time
>>152980144Checked & fpbpWhat's interesting is that even Japanese studios hire Korean studio to make their own anime.
>>152980126The issue is westerners haven't outgrown the rubberhose phase in cartooning while Japan went full moe 30 years ago. Westerner cartoons have stagnated skill wise while anime kept evolving .
>>152992519Is your concept of "evolving" when the industry starts appealing in masse to pedophiles?
I propose we lobotomize every wannabe anime animator/director into copying the style of Shinbo Akiyuki
>>152992644We need to by copying Kazuhide Tomonaga instead.
>>152992441I don't understand why flounder mouth is associated with anime, when it is much more prominent in cartoons.
>>152987395Tbf, the Invincible situation was a subcontract situation. Invincible used a korean vendor, who themselves subcontracted out to a north korean studio. Was a case of the cheap outsourced labor trying to outsource their own labor and make a profit being the middleman.
>>152992638There are already pedophiles in the cartoon industry so let's not throw stones in glass houses
>>152993775Fixed.
>>152994175I think you're giving Amazon too much credit. They themselves outsource manufacturing to the lowest bidder in various Asian countries, often infringing on the designs of their "partners" in the process. I find it unlikely Amazon would have any genuine moral qualms with outsourcing to North Korea. They just didn't like the PR black eye. Can we verify that Invincible stopped outsourcing to North Korea? This season doesn't look much different to me.Corporations love this kind of stratification in the production/supply chain, precisely because it gives them plausible deniability. If Amazon really wanted to prevent prison/slave labor in their animation, they would increase the animation budget enough so that the outsource studio doesn't have to outsource itself. Heck, Amazon could easily afford to tie up any South Korean studio's entire production capacity for 2 years, but they don't want to do that. They know exactly what they're paying for.
>>152991706I’ll also add that it’s not even just the corporate higher ups, it’s also a problem with western creatives. Fucking Kirkman himself clearly would have wanted a live action show but had to “settle” for animation, so the episodes all have to be almost an hour long with obnoxious writing, terrible pacing, and more celebrity voices out of fear that people wouldn’t take their silly cartoon seriously. The whole system is fucked
>>152994209Lets not starting making more cartoons geared towards them then
>>152988155YOU DIG GIANT ROBOTSI DIG GIANT ROBOTS
>>152994175>Invincible used a korean vendor, who themselves subcontracted out to a north korean studio.You're missing a step there.Invincible outsourced to a Korean studio, who outsourced to a Chinese studio, who outsourced to a North Korean studio.
>>152980144That doesn't make sense when anime and cartoons both come from korean studios
>>152997634It does make sense since anime used to come from Japan studios. Now they have Koreans do it for them.
>>152997634>That doesn't make sense when anime and cartoons both come from korean studiosIt does, actually. Especially since one of those studios, DR Movie, has done both regularly. I mean the Simpsons staff specifically hired them BECAUSE they worked on anime for their Death Note parody.
>>152980126Female artists tend to do minimal details and cutesy styles, leading to thier faux anime looking very similar.
>>152982916why don't you cowards compare to a contemporary?
Samefagging, but>>152991539Unfortunately...>>152991493How is it a miscommunication? It's literally making fun of the fact that Real Ghostbusters was animated in Japan.
>>152987333She's just a copy of Tokiko Zaizen.
>>152996594Anon, pretty much all cartoons are geared towards them by virtue of being geared towards children.
>>152980126Some of it has to do with line economy or how anime prioritizes stillness over constant animation (something seen with cartoons and fauxnime), but I'd also wager that the problem with western faux-nime stems from not being derivative enough. Beginner and hobbyist artists in Japan are encouraged to copy/trace constantly, enough to the point that lots of artists can almost perfectly mimic the art style of another. Even when artists are signed on to work on established IP with specific art direction and style, their own individual style usually doesn't shine through unless it's specifically permitted.But in America, we typically frown on the idea of copying/tracing as a learning tool. No shit that western fauxnime looks wonky, our culture actively discourages us from figuring out how it works. If France can pump out comics that look near-identical to manga, there's no reason why we can't do the same.
A lot of anime's intrincases are deeply tied to Japanese culture. You can't just emulate that.
>>152990442I'M GOING THROUGH CHANGES
>>152999971But most of it is deeply tied to Disney (Ub Iwerks) and Fleischer (Grim Natwick), and that severely out weighs the Japanese culture stuff.Also William Hanna and Joseph Barbera (Ken Muse and Ed Benedict) to a lesser extent (Tom and Jerry and Wacky Races).
>>153001667The real difference is that Japan due to being the real workforce behind a lot of shows in the 70s and 80s actually continued to improve and refine those roots, while the American creatives started shipping those aspects oversees and so became disconnected from the craft proper.Its a same that modern Japanese animators are starting to fall into the same trap with importing the gruntwork.
>>153001812Japan never had their John K to set things straight.
>>152980126>why does western "anime" look like THAT?Western cult of ugliness.
>>152992638>muh pedosNot an argument. Go be a moralfag somewhere else.
>>153001876Ironically John K's influence helped set the bar in terms of animation quality before lowering the bar again with the advent of flash animation.
>>153001876Japan doesn't need a John K. They are the John K as a collective.
>>153001812Pretty much this. It's a skills issue.
>>152980126Skills issue.
>>152996594It's already geared towards them. The difference between westerners & Japan us that Japan is not afraid to embrace it. They took the lolipill over half a century ago.
>>153003230Yes they do, having a John K will get rid of the 22+ minute ads that plague the industry over there.
Enough with this John K, TMS, "anime", same links, mumbo jumbo hurgusburgus talk, dude! You're engaging with some resident schizo talking in third person with claims of crap. >tl;dr: Thread should've died hours ago, but no! They took down this thread instead. https://desuarchive.org/co/thread/152995769/
>>153004340Nothing you said is true.
>>153001812>Its a same that modern Japanese animators are starting to fall into the same trap with importing the gruntwork.They've been doing that since the 1970s. It only got real bad by the mid-1990s and never really recovered.>>153004340Frankly, I'm amazed his posts haven't been removed. Either mods are alseep or being bribed to look the other way.>>153004585Dude, shut the fuck up.
>>153005492Famicom hasn't post in this thread, seek help.
>>153004221> John K sperg in Japan telling the entire, globally successful anime industry how they should be more like western animation> Japan looks at the state of western animation> "I think we're good, thanks"
>>152980126Highly satanic show because it has DEMONS
>>153007558That "globally successful" industry is only "globally successful" because of Tom Ruegger, Sherri Stoner and Paul Rugg, otherwise it's 20 times worse then what it is in the US and modern wise it's even worse then that.Japan is only good when the west had a leash on them, case in point from Dan Haskett (Disney paid for it).
>>153008063> Meanwhile, in Japan:> ...who the hell is Paul Rugg?> I think that's the guy who plays Ant Man in the marvel movies> Huh. Weird.If you think that 90s nickelodean animators are any significant part of Japan's animation lineage these days, you're high on your own farts. They have their own directors and animators to be learning from. Trying to take credit for their success because they copied from Disney once way back at the start of their industry is about as relevant as saying that the US is an islamic nation because we use arabic numerals for all of our math.
>>153008297No.>Who the hell is Paul Rugg?>He did a bunch of stuff at Telecom Animation Film in the 90s.>I see then.Learn and study before you open your mouth.
>>153008297Paul Rugg was Warner Bros, not Nick.
>>153008326Yes. I'm sorry anon, but they don't care. In the 90s, they have dozens of high profile animators coming out of passion projects during the OVA boom to be studying instead. They didn't need to copy notes from Pinky and the Brain. You can tell, because *nothing Japan made at the time was anything like that*. If they supposedly worshiped your 'golden age' western animators and spoke their names in hushed reverence, where is the imitation of them? Where is the influence?Do you honestly fucking think that in the same year that Neon Genesis Evangelion aired, japan gave two shits about FREAKAZOID of all things? A show that even in the west is largely forgotten by all but grognards while Evangelion is a 30 year juggernaut of a franchise that prints money every single day? You're delusional.
oh great it’s that one schizo
>>153008397YES THEY DO!!!!https://web.archive.org/web/20110912073627/http://www.telecom-anime.com/telecom/sakuhinshokai/shokai_tinytoon.htmlhttps://web.archive.org/web/20110912073723/http://www.telecom-anime.com/telecom/sakuhinshokai/shokai_animaniacs.htmlSpeaking of OVAs, this is the most influential OVA to exist, and you can thank Telecom Animation Film for that.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xlSdwrCcDXUAs for Pinky and the Brain, A Pinky and The Brain Christmas and a number of Pinky and The Brain shorts from Animaniacs (before they were given their own show) were PRODUCED in Japan by Telecom Animation Film, you have no idea what you're talking about.Toshihiko Masuda, Kenji Hachizaki, Takashi Kawaguchi, Yoshinobu Michihata, Kazuhide Tomonaga, Nobuo Tomizawa, Keiko Oyamada, Hisao Yokobori, Atsuko Tanaka, Teiichi Takiguchi, Hisao Yokobori, Hiroaki Noguchi and Shijiro Nishimi are all legends in their field and their country (Japan), they dished out plenty of influence for over 40 years.>Do you honestly fucking think that in the same year that Neon Genesis Evangelion aired, Japan gave two shits about FREAKAZOID of all things?Yes, but Freakazoid was by Animal Ya as Telecom Animation Film was doing The Sylvester & Tweety Mysteries at that time.Plus the less merch you have the more respected you are, thats why Sazae-San lasted as long as it did.Evangelion is not a juggernaut, SpongeBob however is and the only Japanese IPs that comes close is Mario, Kirby and Pokémon, strictly.You're the one that is delusional, so please touch grass, for Reiwa's sake.>>153008431No, far from it.
>>153008670>Evangelion is not a juggernautI don't think I even need to attempt to argue with anything you else you said when I can just point to this one line and its immediately obvious how disconnected from reality you are.
>>153008768>SpongeBob is not a juggernaut.No, that is the case, SpongeBob is a juggernaut.
>>153003230Now if more of them can create proper "kemono" instead of slapping animal ears and speech impediments on 13 year old girls and calling it a day...
>>152992243SHAFT anime are their own thing, you can't compare them to anything. Most anime are very bland, tho.
>>153009345There are a lot of garbage anime that just do the bare minimum, its true. But lets not pretend that we don't get more interesting scene composition from anime on a pretty regular basis.
>>153008670>>153008768>>153008794This whole argument is stupidIt's obvious to anyone that anime is far better animated than virtually all of western cartoons save for maybe Avatar, and its stylistic influences are entirely native.
>>153010613Other way around.It's obvious to anyone that western cartoons made between 1928 to 1958'ish is far better animated than virtually all of anime save for maybe Ghibli and (pre-2000) Telecom, and its stylistic influences are entirely native.
>>153008670SHUT UP! FAMICOOOOOOOM!
>>153008063>>153008297>>153008397>>153008670>>153011482What, is this, RETARDATION!? MODS?
>>153011482Ghibli hasn't been the high water mark for anime in a while, anon. You're out of touch. "Old good, new bad" in the form of a person.
>>153011691Yes it is, theres also it's successors Chizu, Ponoc, Colorido and CoMix Wave Films as well.
>>152997832>How is it a miscommunication? It's literally making fun of the fact that Real Ghostbusters was animated in Japan.No it wasn't you retard, it WAS miscommunication.
>>153005492>Either mods are alseep or being bribed to look the other way.Schizoposting makes the board look like it's more active than it actually is, so the Mods aren't inclined to do their jobs
>>153011915That isn't Schizoposting, those are facts.
>>153012025Said every schizo ever.
>>153012078No.
>>152982916>>152982959A lot of Western "amiermanga" artists just don't have much life experience, and it's pretty clear from the way they write and draw and can never really seem to find their own voice. Svetlana Chmakova wrote and drew Dramacon, Nightschool, Witch and Wizard, and various other comics. She was even the character designer of "My Life Me." But it's clear that outside of being an anime/manga fangirl- she really didn't have much experience in life actually doing things and going on adventures. Her art style ended up drawing most character faces as triangles and slapping anime symbols onto them. Ben Dunn drew Ninja High School for nearly 40 years. Despite all this time and 200 issues- he still isn't really that good at writing. Ninja High School constantly got de-railed and went on parody tangents. His comics were mostly just good when other people wrote for him. The comics were probably best during the Jeremy Feeple Shidoshi arc. I doubt NHS will ever be made into an anime because of how little actual story there is after 200 issues. Fred Perry'sGold Digger does feel like it's own thing. But at the end of the day, it's probably too porn-y, it has too many furries, and his artstyle too weird to make it as a mainstream comic series.
>>152982488https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-w3jaZnXo0k&list=RD-w3jaZnXo0k&start_radio=1
>>152987153>less post-processing effects like bloom and color gradingthat's a good thing, modern anime looks like shit because they abuse the fuck out of filters and bloomalso a lot of what you're saying sounds like cartoons are specifically copying 90s/2000s style anime instead of modern anime where everything is softer
>>152988687Anon, I can tell by the typing style this is a specific recurring autist. Don't bother with the replies, just let it be.
>>153012389Oops, sorry, wrong video.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A-beABuGcKw
>>153012436No, that isn't the case.
Anime the fights are incomprehensible
>>152980126French faux-anime looks good you mean american not western
>>152980126>watch video>he pronounces doraemon "door E mon">close video
>>153012112I don't think 'life experience' is as big of a deciding factor as people think it is. It's certainly a big factor, but I think what ultimately filters out Western animanga artists is the fact that they don't read enough regular books or watch enough movies, or have a varied set of interests.Akira Toriyama finished school, worked at an advertising agency for a few years, then went straight into doing manga. Hirohiko Araki didn't even finish college before he threw himself into doing manga professionally. Both are avid cinephiles. Araki is known for his love of high end fashion and cultured music taste, while Toriyama was super into tokusatsu and animals. Hideaki Anno was working professionally on animation while he was in college (note: he got expelled from college). Toriyama was a big fan of animals and motorbikes. Araki grew up Christian and loves to swim. Anno was pretty much THE geekiest otaku among his peers.Most artists in America barely read. And if they do watch TV or film, it's just slop.
>>153011482>his only point of reference for good animation in anime is Ghibli normie shitCompletely worthless opinion.
>>153012514Maybe if you're a senior citizen.
TL:DR; most Western parodies of anime are painfully shallow and writers are too lazy to do actual research.Robot Chicken being a prime example. So glad they never did a Toonami special
>>153013313>shakes camera which means the animation is good
>>152992243>look at something like "complete dogshit"No thanks weeb
>>153013392>The camera moved, that means the animation is bad
>>153013428It looks bad because Its just too anime. I dunno how to describe it when I see this slop it just screams trying too hard to be "epic"
>>153013447Famicom, when are you going to get a job?
>>153013477I dont know who famicom is but if he hates anime as much as I do then hes based. Fuck weebs. Fuck anime. Fuck niggers.
>>153012717Has France even put out anything of note in that regard since 2020?Mars Express looked pretty good, but I wouldn't call if faux-anime.
>>152980126normies say that 90% of anime looks the same, but the majority of the series from all decades actually have a lot more diversity than all modern Netflix """"""""""anime"""""""""" made by Jewish Americans. like literally all modern Netflix animations have the exact same visual style and cinematography. it feels like all of it is made by one studio
>>153013613And yet the only good show you posted is dbz
>>153013719>tells me that his skin is brown without telling me that his skin is brownkek
>>153013751what kind of retarded 1hpu form is that? You'd completely destroy your elbow
>>153013751Tell me how youre a faggot without saying youre a faggot? Whatever show you just posted doesnt come close to the cultural influence dbz had. Nor does any other anime you posted in your example.
>>153013786Anon's right, you're definitely brown.
>>153013719Gurren Lagann>Mononoke>Ergo Proxy>Death Note>DBZ>Lucky Star
>>153013813Dbz > shit > whatever those other boring slop anime are.
>>153013786>popularity = qualityyup. you are definitely brown.
>>153013613Does this include the anime Netflix makes with actual Japanese studios like Baki or Terminator 0? Or is it just the "anime" like Castlevania, DMC, MOTU: Revelation or Transformers WFC?Because I barely see any difference between the genuine anime titles and the cartoons they pass off as "anime".
>>153013385Considering how shallow RC's parodies are already, even when they parody themselves. That is definitely a good thing.
>>153013852Nah im saying that dbz is a better show than whatever those other anime are
>>153008670MODS?! Can we contact this jackass's IP provider and tell them to ban him from using ANY form of internet again?
>>153013867I mean, even if Netflix hires a Japanese studio, they tell them to make shit in a style that appeals to westerners, so...
>>153013934Why even bother watching something else when everything else is boring as shit?
>>153013921but anime already clearly appeals to westerners so that doesn't make any sense...
>>153013972Why try to deny anime peaked with dbz?
>>153013990I WON'T play basketball with you
>>153013913They won't because he's canadian.
>>153014010I like how you imply only blacks have the good taste in anime. Probably true.
>>153014076>liking baby's first shounenshit>having good tastepick one
>>153013852Ergo Proxy was boring dystopiaslop.
>>153014094>something exciting is bad taste
>>153014173it's exciting if you are 12 years old
>>153014411Or a black man?
>>153014429or... BOTH
>>153014433So why do I need more? Clearly dbz was made just for me.
>>153012717No, it's 20 times worse then whats going on in Canada, Illumination using it as "Euro India" due to it's massive amount of migrant workers who came from countries that are on America's shit list is the only good thing about it since 2010.>>153013267No, that is a fact.>>153013595Just outsourcing for Illumination.>>153013867>>153013921Netflix Japan =/= Netflix America, they both have separate projects.
>>153013613Fixed.
>>152980126Looks like the guy from Kim Possible.
I'm about 40% of the way through clearing out all the syndicate shops.Holy fuck the amount of time I will be able to allocate to other farms will be great and the only thing I will lost is my double dipping mastery farm.
>>152980126Anime is a western term. France invented it.
>>153016606Miss the Warframe thread, friend? I suppose I can guess which side of this retard war you're posting on
>>153016662You caught meAlso I just consider the EU hours a wash at this point.
>>153016662>>153016727Oh wait I thought you meant to ongoing /wfg/ retard war, this retard war I stopped posting once I realized that Famicom was here and forgot to close the thread.
>western animeNo such thing.
>>153013910obviously brown
>>153008670You forgot about Yuichiro Yano.
>>153017423Oh yea, thanks.
>>153008858Kemono already exist there. There's just more into kimonomimis because they're not a bunch of furfags.
Anime is taken way more seriously as an artistic medium. Producers would rather (poorly) imitate something safe than challenge preconceived notions of traditional Western animation.
something i see people do when trying to mimic anime is copying anime screenshots instead of studying mangaanime screenshots are polished and go through tons of revisions and post processing to look good and on model meanwhile, manga art can range from amateurish to really polished and detailed, but you can see more of the original artist's style, strokes and more importantly, mistakes so if you ever want to develop your own anime style, study manga art >>152980126the lack of detail in general in the linework. they're obsessed with simplicity to the point where it make it not look like anime >>152985029 >>152983023 the hair is all blocky with little to no detail, shading is minimal, but doesn't follow any logic to it at allyou can see the same thing in that my adventures with superman show and voltroneven comparing it to a newer anime with more minimalist style and with little to no shading, the anime still has detail in the liinework and the shading follows a certain logic to it
>>153017561If that were the cast the Mario would've been produced locally rather then being farmed out to Illumination.Japanese normies view this shit grimy, the only way they would touch it is it it as created by foreigners, hench why Illumination made the Mario movie instead of someone like Madhouse or Production IG.If it were not for Detective Conan (Japan's second highest rated anime only behind Sazae-San as everything else is either below 2 million views (One Piece, PreCure, Pokémon) or is as simple and flat as Family Guy and Bob's Burgers (Chibi Maruko-Chan, Crayon Shin-Chan, Doraemon) that style would've been outlawed it is that hated.
It's weird how /co/ is the only board that has it's own version of Famicom.Other board autists are annoying and autistic, but they don't literally spend hours just blatantly spouting made-up shit or talking about random Youtubers they're obsessed with and insisting that they're super popular with "the younguns."It's fascinating to observe.
>>153017691Nothing about these reports is "made up shit".The younguns love Game Sack, China Uncensored, The 8-Bit Guy and LGR.It it not fascinating , it's depressing, you're the one who needs to seek help.
>>153017561>challenge preconceived notions of traditional Western animation.how would you do that exactly?
>>153017733Make a Stanley Kubrick film in the visual style of Disney.
Western Animation is stuck in a pool of piss. On one end there the FG/R&M/Big Mouth/Brickleberry clones. On the other, psuedoJapanimation without fully understanding how the real McCoy works, a factor not helped by anime being censored, toned down, or cut by U.S. S&P/FCC over the previous decades.
>>153016789This. It's called ACTION CARTOONS
>>153018686Thing is we don't want that, we want COMEDY CARTOONS that are done professionally.
>>153018748we?
>>153018754Yes we.
>>152992644Done.https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLzIyhvKbqDPDCy5fekgqc47qwGtXTJBZWhttps://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLzIyhvKbqDPA6bK54yHu1urRoJH-7quZz
>>153012401No, it isn't about emulating older styles. Even if anime looks softer now in the end both eras still have more detail in the hair, clothing and shading and I posit that this is crucial to the anime look. Both eras also still have rounder skull shapes.
Japanese animation is all pointless and flashy with none of the emotional nuance of American animation. But sure, be a pleb and get wowed by shallow spectacle.
>>153018891
>>152980126>draw an artstyle that doesn't look anime>call it anime
>>152980126>western "anime" not a real thing
Why can't Americans animate?
>>153021862Because they've been outsourcing to Asia, Canada and Europe for decades and Disney keep hoarding any animators with a semblance of talent.
>>153013945I know, that's why I asked. Hell, WFC and Castlevania had Japanese studios involved with their productions. Which I feel muddies things further.>>153014029Pretty sure Bell, Rogers and the other companies have their limits.>>153016763I deeply sympathize for you.
>A random Teacher's Pet thread that got posted twice got nuked twice.>While a thread that got derailed by "Guy" isn't nuked yet.All those replies from Famicom should be gone, but mods have other plans.
>>153021862too hard
>>153023378Castlevania:TAS was produced in Texas, I have no idea what WFC is.
>>153001448banger
>>153015565FAMICOM, PLEASE GO AWAY!
>>153017671>People still not realize that Famicom is just a role created by the jannies and mods to shitpost and derail
>>152980126I’m disappointed the guy skipped the "appeal" section. It’s really the most important part. Even if you do manage to one-to-one copy the anime artstyle it’ll still fail because you’re not Japanese and that’ll show in your work. And if anything it’ll feel even more jarring since it’s almost "anime" but not really. Like this redhead waifu from the Castlevania show certainly looks cute. But then I listen and watch her character and she just feels like a femme fatale from a Hollywood movie. The illusion is broken. You can’t hide what’s inside. Embrace your westerness. Make it your strength like Teen Titans or Skullgirls did.
Are there any Western animated works that legitimately feel like they were made in Japan, not just in terms of art style but in terms of writing? In other words, something you could show an experienced anime fan, and they'd think it was Japanese even though it's American?
>>153013313Did this have one of his famous rape scenes?
>>153027258Teen Titans only has a good reception thanks to the kindness of time. It's art style got lambasted when it was actually airing. I do not think it had a particularly nice art style personally. Funny you bring up Lenore from Castlevania because she's an example of a character design that I like significantly more than most anime. I don't have any issue with her feeling like a Hollywood femme fatale, there's no illusion being broken because she isn't going kyaaaa~ and squealing in Japanese, in fact I like that she isn't. But she's a shallowly written character in a badly written show and writing is still more important than art at the end of the day.
>>153026126No, this is what we're talking about.
>>153027337No not really. And I don't even want to see something like that. I want Amerimanga to feel different from Japanese anime and manga. I don't want to read Amerimanga comics that are set in Japan, I'd much rather read something that is based more around the author's personal experiences and the place s/he lived. My Last Summer With Cass by Mark Crilley is better than Miki Falls because of the NYC setting instead of being in Japan. I don't even remember much about Miki falls despite having read the first 3 volumes.
>>153028152>I don't want to read Amerimanga comics that are set in Japan, I'd much rather read something that is based more around the author's personal experiences and the place s/he lived.Although i do agree, you're just not going to find that, because the type of person who spends their time drawing anime/manga wouldn't be the type to lead an interesting life in the U.S.You want an interesting setting? How about asphalt wasteland, or sterile suburbs?Want a school stetting? You already got that in japanese media, but this time it's just bad because it's amercian schoolsAll of the unique things in america require you to actively go looking for it or the author needs to be older than 30
>>153028430How would a high school anime/manga work in an American high school?
>>153024457Still outsoruced some of the work for Season 3 to Japan.WFC is War for Cybertron, the shitty Netflix Transformers cartoon that they greenlit alongside BotBots.
>>153028613No Japanese studio was used on Castlevania: The Animated Series, also Mua Films is a South Korean studio.
>>153028887Look again, dipshit. D'Art Shtajio is Japanese. They did cleanup for a couple episodes later in the run.Unless you think "founded by an American, hence American studio", which is some very smooth-brain logic.
>>153029561They did not do Castlevania: TAS, you're just making shit up.Also in Japanese culture the worst thing you can do is leach off of others/foreigners and it's better to work for a black company then it is to work for foreigners because the black company is local.
>>152980126It don't look like that?
>>152988244>Wacky slapstick is what animation is supposed to be, otherwise you do it in live action.Not really. That is just what the foundation for it was - the proof of concept. Tom and Jerry and the like are proof of how good animation can be - not the limits for it.Meanwhile we can't even recreate the fluid animation of that time and what is worse, we can't even come up with plots to make up for it either. It's the worst of both worlds. At least Japan is trying on some level after you dig through the mainstream slop. So much stuff in the west sucks and unlike Japan there is no production. We get barely any new shows and they all suck, compared to them pumping out dozens and getting a winner here and there amongst all the slop. It is sad that the last good original IP that was being aired on mainstream networks in the west was Bluey, and before that it was Over the Garden Wall. And neither had particularly stunning animation.
>>153031100The thing is there is next to no wacky slapstick comedies now of days, in this day of age you only get 1 Looney Tunes Cartoons for every 1 billion invincibles, and we deserve much better then Looney Tunes Cartoons because thats what the normies want, put Looney Tunes Cartoons to shame.
>>153031120Yeah, like I said, worst of both worlds. Animation barely takes advantage of the medium it is in nowadays and then has the gall to not even tell a good story.So what is the point of it then? Ideally we would get animation of good quality of all genres, but we get animation of trash quality of like 2 genres: infantile """adult""" cartoons for brain dead millennials and political addicts, and lolsorandum kids stuff with zero substance.There is nothing wrong with a stinker here and there as long as we get other stuff, but we barely get anything and when we do it all sucks.The decline of art is just a symptom of a rotten, stagnant society in my view. The same smallminded, nepotistic group has a chokehold on the entire industry and their biases and failures both politically and socially are reflected in their art - both in animation quality and actual writing.
>>152990442This show was made by and is for pedophiles.
>>153031186Cool it with the anti-semitic remarks
>>153031186It shown that America does have both a lolicon and shotacon market.
>>152990442>american anime>look inside>it's jewish animeBut then again, the entertainment industry is jewish-run sector.
>>152991943>Japanese studios just don't want to work on crap.And yet Tori exist
>>153032090Toei*
>>153032090>>153032100That doesn't count
>>153019403>All this effort>All this output>Can barely reach 2k in promotional material>None of the actual story videos have more than 1kTragic, all this passion... Wasted... Can't talk about the story, but at least i have something to watch for a good while.
>>152991943>Japanese studios just don't want to work on crap. They'd rather work cheap and make stuff they love than work cheap and make crap.Oh, please. They're willing to work on actual money laundering projects like the Gokushufudou adaptation.
>>153032776Not the case.
>>153019749How very xenophobic of you to say.
>>153028447There isn't isn't lot to work with, because your average american highschooler doesn't like going to school, or really has anything to do in school other than classes or sportsYour average american highschool doesn't have uniforms either so you can't have a unique aesthetic Guess you could have a sports manga about american football and about how the MC is trying to get a full ride scholarship for college to become a college athlete
>>153032663many such cases
>>153035090I can hear this gif
>>153029634Well fuck you too, you racist bastard.Your parents should have swallowed.
>>153036202Also, source, since I can actually pull them out of something other than a hairy asshole:https://x.com/henry_thurlow/status/1397021328683589632Literally confirmed by the studio's founder.
>>153028447The setting is a prison or a decadent miniature campus, but either way it’s a cutthroat world of scammers and marks
>>153027337The only examples I can think of are instances where the American is aping a specific anime/scene/director and an experienced anime fan can tell where they took it from. Japanese artists also have a keen understanding of this compared to the American perspective on inspiration and homage but it also applies to stuff that isn’t plagiarized, like seeing Pen Ward do Masaaki Yuasa and knowing what part is from Yuasa.
>>152983247>and how out of the 7 people there most of them just have dead fish expressionsMaybe because that's a scene where they are all supposed to show that expression?
>>153036291>Parody account.
>>152986114>Enemies get sent spiraling away in chaotic ragdoll physics, or express actual fear as they realize how fucked they are instead of being video game NPCs that just trade blows until they run out of HP and dieGreat so fights have no fucking consistency to them and are basically made up as they go along.
>>153036749How is that inconsistency, anon?
>>153037003Because a punch in anime will send someone flying 20 meters until it doesn’t, what's the stake then? How do we even know if someone is taking damage
>>153037045>Because a punch in anime will send someone flying 20 meters until it doesn’tThat's not really a problem in Tojima.Why are you even talking about something you know nothing about?
>>153037069>Guy gets kicked in the head >No damage>Girls gets punched in the head>Sent flying with teeth’s flying out in all directions
>>153037121>>No damageHe gets sent flying into a wall, what the fuck are you talking about?Are you genuinely, legitimately bitching about a guy being stronger and sturdier than a woman?
>>153037045In 24 episodes, every single person that Tojima punches gets super fucked up by it, with the exception of two enemies that are literally supernatural monsters far above human ability, where the fact that he can hurt them *at all* is a massive surprise.The only fight that doesn't follow this formula is his fight vs Tackle, who knows in advance that she can't take a punch from him or she'll go down in one hit and instead has to structure her entire side of the fight in terms of counters, throws, and grapples that prevent him from getting that punch on her. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O8ZWLGWsFjA
>>153037148Where is the broken neck? Why are his teethe still attached? Why is his tongue still working? Why isn't he knocked unconscious?
>>153037163Because he's a grown ass Yakuza member male who's shown to beat the shit out of other fully-grown men on a regular basis, and is thus stronger than a 20-something woman who's just some random pop idol.Am I being trolled?Is the cartoon side of this board seriously this fucking autistic these days?
>>153037181No you're blindly defending anime, so you refuse to see reason.
>>153037163The people in black costumes are low grade superhumans, called Combatants. They are basically disposable mind controlled goons made by an evil organization called SHOCKER. This is all a reference to the 1970s Kamen Rider toku series.Combatants are normal humans that have been modified to have this superhuman power boost. The stronger you were as a normal human before getting turned into a combatant, the more powerful you are in your combatant form. The guy who got kicked was a yakuza thug who was a very good fighter even before he became a Combatant. The three girls in that scene were literally stage performers before they got transformed. Yakuza guy has fought all three of them at once previously and held his own before being forced to flee, not able to defeat them due to the difference in numbers. He is, objectively, stronger than they are individually, just not strong enough to make up the difference with strength alone.
>>153037238You're retarded.
>>153037250>Combatants are normal humans that have been modified to have this superhuman power boostIn the original show they get beaten by women with zero powers, don't oversell them too much
>>153037857I'm going off of the explanation that Tojima is a Kamen Rider gives them for its canon.
>>153037919It is but the original show is not great and is inconsistent about it.They show multiple times they only want "the strong" for their combatants and cull any who aren't good enough, but even these "strong" and "above average" humans lose to normal humans and unpowered women regularly. Showa Rider is honestly boring compared to Heisei
This is what I do to /a/nons who post on /co/
Me and my friend are making a webcomic. Does it look more like anime or cartoon?
>>153013027> Araki grew up ChristianThat explains a a lot.
>>153038018It looks more anime in the way the faces are drawn, but the panelling is totally un-anime-likeHere's a collage of a bunch of random manga pages showing just their panels.
>>153038225Huh. I'm the writer/conceptulizer. So I've tried different directions of it. I'm trying to make a hybrid that can be adapted so the panels can be reversed for eastern audiences
>>152981256Yeah I could for some. Has anyone outpizzaed the hut yet?
>>153036597What? What is that scene?
Don't be the Western that people are trying to make you to be!
>>152980126video link?
>>153036673Okay, then give me a source for that Simpsons Kimichi post that isn't AKOM's website.No? Then fuck off and die, Famicom. You suck, your family sucks for not using birth control, and I hope you all die in a housefire.
>>153043448They worked on the damn short, otherwise they would be eating proper American food if that short was done locally.GIVE ME A FUCKING SOURCE THAT AKOM WAS A MISTERMEANER/MISCRIEDTED FOR ALMOST ALL OF SEASON 1 (baring Some Enchanted Night's retakes and The Crepes of Wrath which to your "logic" are the only season 1 episode animated in Korea) AND THE FIRST HALF OF SEASON 2 AND THAT THOSE EPISODES WERE 100% DONE IN THE STATES!!!! TELL ME!!!
>>153043604What are you going to do? Everyone hates you, cunt. Post legitimate sources or go to hell, you filthy waste of sperm.Fuck off and die in a ditch while a hobo pisses, shits and jizzes on your corpse, since you refuse to actually post sources to the bullshit you spew out. Because if this were religion, and God stared you RIGHT in the face. You'd be the kind of guy who'd go "FAKE AND GAY, LOL!" as his final words before eternal damnation.
>>153043668That is a legitimate source.You are the one who needs to touch grass.
>>153043697No, you are. That literally says nothing, and it's a typo (see also their Transformers entry, which says they did 39 episodes. Prove they did). Either post an ACTUAL interview, or get raped by Bubba you pedophile.Otherwise, fuck off and die, Famicunt. I hope you get Swatted and they shoot you point blank.
>>153043604>>153043697BITCH, SHUT UP!! AND HOW THE FUCK THIS THREAD IS STILL UP BUT NOT THE DC COMICS GAMES THREAD THAT FUCKING GOT PRUNED AS SOON THE INFAMOUS BATMAN SCENE FROM SUICIDE SQUAD: KILL THE JUSTICE LEAGUE GOT POSTED?!?!?!?!
>>153043731Yes it does, it is not a typo you stupid fucking minor.I AM NOT A CREAP!!!!!
>>153043751Because the mods hate us and want us to suffer this fickhead's wrath.If the mods were any semblance of smart, they'd find out who his IP provider was, and would contact them directly, suggesting a blanket ban from all internet services.
>>153043773No, thats you.
>>153043791See >>153043751You think I'm the only one here? Or are you genuinely this retarded to think the only two people in this thread, or even board, is you and me.Seriously, go fuck your self and burn in all the hells. I hope your father beats you and your mother spits on your corpse.
they're trying to emulate normalfag anime; anime for people who don't like anime (which is the only anime they've seen). stuff like GitS, Cowboy Bebop, Ninja Scroll, that sort of stuff. really, just the ultraviolent grimdark OVAs that got imported and dubbed in the 90s.
>>152986369you're aware anime is notorious for paying its animators peanuts, right? the typical anime episode is made with about ¼ the budget of an American cartoon episode.
>>152990385>Rosenberg
>>152988186Looney tunes wasn't for kids.
>>153045156Normalfag anime is stuff like Sazae-San and Chibi Maruko-Chan.GitS, Cowboy Bebop and Ninja Scroll is only watched by geeks and nerds, and the Netflix people are not emulating Sazae-San and Chibi Maruko-Chan.
>>152992441cheekymouth is more of a budget thing that didn't even really exist in anime before the early 2000s. I remember kyoani used to get mocked for overusing it
>>153026126>jumps from Ms Grundy (not even an animated character) all the way to DariaI would've put Wilma Flintstone in LONG before a fucking Archie side character.
>>153028447literally Archie
>>153045256I'm talking about westerners. some of the earliest anime brought over to the US explicitly as ANIME rather than retooled to be more American were the 90s R rated action OVAs like what I listed. Maruko and Sazae have never had official English releases and you'd have to be a hardcore weeb to know they exist.
>>153045360So was I, Maruko-Chan has a English Hong Kong release thats on YouTube while Sazae-San is through piracy sites and is subbed into English.
>>153045166And that's before getting into companies like MAPPA who don't pay period.
>>153045382yeah dude I'm sure normalfag Americans were importing bootleg recordings of kiddy cartoons from Hong Kong. absolutely terminal retardation on display.
>>153045499Those shows are all ages like Looney Tunes, they're not Blue's Clues.
