Why did webtoons become so fucking stringent with their episode counts?
>>153112254Are you trying to suggest early Machinimas are on the same level of production as animations?
>>153112254because the people making series for glitch, like liam, gooseworx, dana, ross and the gaslight district guy, don't want to be chained to glitch so they give a (to themselves) resonable yet short series lenght to be able of moving on to do other projects in the meantime after its over in 3 or 4 years (despite being a horrible business pratice that will make glitch bleed money if they don't get hit after hit)>>153112296nigger glitch and rooster teeth had similar beginnings (one did sm64 and gmod machinas for a living before becoming into glitch and the other did halo with bits of animation [rip monty] machinas)
>>153112254same reason as every other animated thingthe "talent" behind the media demands more pay to release more "quality content"
For most of it's history Red vs Blue was a bunch of guys in a shitty office recording themselves playing Halo of course they made a fuck ton of episodes.
>>153112254A lot of early machinima's were usually made by one or a few people quickly since the whole point of a machinima was that you were using game assets to make a video with so you don't have to model characters or create backgrounds. So most of the hard work besides the animation was done, and even than early machinma were still limited on what they could do so animation was limited anyway which cuts production time. Hell you couldn't upload videos longer than 10 minutes on youtube until the early 2010's so you were limited on how long you could make a video any way. And even using your pic as an example by the time Rooster Teeth shifted towards 3D animation the time between seasons took longer because making 3D animation takes a long fucking time compared to a bunch of dudes using theater mode in a lan party.
>>153112296Ops a retard >>153112412Youre a retard
>>153112412I mean when they were doing machinimas they were shitting them out by the dozen yeah, full series not so much
>>153112254>Endless trash vs 8 episodes of trash
>>153112840I mean, not endless, Rooster Teeth died in the end
>>153112254Why isn't this comparing it to things rooster teeth has fully animated and original like camp camp, nomad of nowhere, gen lock, and rwby?
>>153112412>nigger glitch and rooster teeth had similar beginningsThat means fuck all. Back at the peak of Red vs Blue's popularity, they were only able to do like 5 minutes of animations for ever like 7 episodes. Rooster Teeth also got bought out by Warner bros.
>>153112254Because the standards and expectations for web cartoons were far lower and more realistic than today. You could churn out multiple shorts that were animated by one or two guys with limited animation. Now people want fully hand drawn, fluid movement, top tier voice acting, exceptional writing, and 30 minute episodes. In order to do that it takes a lot of time and even more money. This is exactly why the current indie scene cannot and will not be sustainable.
>>153112860They actually did manage a good output with Camp Camp before WB bought them. 4 seasons with 12-18 episodes at 11 mins is really good imo. I wish I could have something like that
>>153112630worthless post
>>153112860Bringing up Gen Lock in a comparison will always make Rooster Teeth like utter complete retards
>>153112254i miss camp camp and ruby
>>153112296Maybe we should go back to low budget production?
>>153113839We should go back to making shitposts and poorly drawn MSpaint animations
>>153113855It doesn't have to look like MSPaint. Like Milky Subway which was made by four guys with Google Docs, Blender and the free version of DaVinci Resolve and it's great all around.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BmcksAVjK7o&list=PL8HS5ab3SK_kSgJoMZySZ0ssV07FDzRWW&index=3
The world we grew up in is dead. Killed. The culture, the economy, the demographics, the sensibilities.
>>153112254Think it's just cause the webtoons still doesn't have that many weeks,but i'm sure we'll get more poc characters soon enough
>>153112254>200+ episodes of red vs. blue>960+ episodes of smg4.I don't think we can judge on either of their machinima alone.Also, RT is dead due to mismanagement, sandal, overreach, corpo sellout.Glitch is thriving (so far...) by staying independent.The two companies took vastly different paths.
oh man Pilot Episode is on!
>>153115293>RT is deadAren't they trying to make a comeback?
>>153116214It's been over a year and nothing has happened since Burnie's "Homecoming" video.He bought back the name, but not any of the IP.
>>153112254Red vs. Blue was just a bunch of guys fucking around in Halo while in Ventrilo together. You don't exactly need financing just to do that.
>>153112254Executives must have two things drilled into their heads. One, there is a finite maximum audience size. You can't appeal outside it without losing from the audience you already have. No "we will make it unisex to appeal to both boys and girls". No "we will make it safe to appeal to both kids and soccer moms". No "we have the nerds in the bag already so let's appeal to minorities".Two, they must invest money. Every time someone manages to make bank on a shoestring budget, executives demand that those under them replicate it and make it the new, unsustainable stardard. We will forgive the flaws of something if it is coming from three guys shooting the shit in their garage Not from a company. And just because we agreed to eat shit once with a company production like with Adventure Time doesn't mean that we will keep doing it.
>>153112254These new indie cartoons are costing a lot of money. I think I recall murder drones being 250k an episode
>>153115293Yeah, but RT lasted like two decades.
>>153112412>glitch and rooster teeth had similar beginningsAnon, all 5 seasons of the original RVB combined didn't cost half of one episode of Murder Drones.
>>153112254Because you don't need 100 episodes to tell a story, plus having a finished product means they can sell it off to someone like netflix sooner.
>>153117935Anon, all 6 years of SMG4 combined before Glitch was a thing didn't cost half the budget of RWBY volumen 3 but here we are.
>>153119173Machinima is cheap. SMG4 ran over 14 years and almost 1,000 episodes.>>153117757Glitch is almost at that figure. Those goobers started in 2009.
>>153112254If Glitch wanted to they could pull a Nickelodeon and endlessly milk the popularity of Digital Circus for several more years to come and instead they're letting the creator complete it on their own terms and moving on to giving another creator a shot.Somehow, this is a bad thing.
>>153113839go back to youtube shorts
If indie animation wants to survive they're gonna have to go back to shorter runtimes>>153114108 is the right idea. Episodes don't seem to exceed 4.5 minsSounds crazy but if you structure right, it can work imo. That's how it was done years ago
>>153114513Nigga, what are you saying here?
>>153112254Whats impressive about pumping out a fake anime that has the same visual fidelity as fingas in his ass
>>153112254I get not having infinite money but is 10 episodes minimum too much to ask for?
>>153112254You mean stingy
>>153112254The Hazbin Hotel pilot and Digital Circus convinced tons of people that their independent web cartoons HAVE to be these super polished pieces rivaling million-dollar Hollywood productions. What they should aim to be is smaller-scale projects with short-form installments and looser/rougher visuals that specialize in either polished drawings or lively animation, but NEVER BOTH. Above all else, MAKE IT FEASIBLE ON A LIMITED BUDGET.
>>153122805Can't say for hazbin, but 3d Glitch stuff does have a number of cost-cutting measures built in. Some are obvious (limited number of sets, assetpacks, recycling of the MD haunted manor in TADC, generic npc model in each series, limited number of new models per episode) and some aren't that obvious (max 13 different lighting setups per episode, use of UE for fast iteration), also they mention budget is kept in mind at all decision levels
>>153113855>We should go back to making shitposts and poorly drawn MSpaint animationsYes, please.
>>153123740Yeah gimme more inferno cop
>>153112254Multiple former Roosterteeth employees stated the company hadn't turned a profit in its final 9 years. So obvious that shit wasn't exactly sustainable.
Animations are expensive, retard-kun. Glitch has money but they don't have Disney money. Hell, not even Disney wants to do full series episodes these days.
How many seasons do you want if you make a cartoon series?
>>153112254What other Glitch series that surpasses 10 episodes or less?
It's taking nearly 3 years to do just 9 episodes of TADC. Good animation is costly and time-consuming.
>>153112254Yeah, the production cycles suck, but eh, if you squint your eyes enough, you can fool yourself into thinking they are basically the new OVAs that would take months between set of episodes. Like for instance, 8th MS Team took 3 years to fully release.Given glitch's quality, i think it's fair that they are taking this long. I understand it's one of the issues with indie animation (Can we even call Glitch indie anymore?).
>>153124536None so far, I believe.
>>153112860>nomad of nowhereI still miss him…
>>153112254Online animation just isn't profitable outside of a few exceptions.Cartoon Hangover tried and failed badly, Rooster Teeth is dead, smosh tried and failed to get into animation, mondo media is on life support. Most of these failures were pre adpocalypse tooEven fucking Eddsworld can barely keep the lights on
>>153125052I honestly don't mind the long prod cycles. But I'm old AF so I'm used to not having instant gratification. As long as the finished product is all they wanted it to be, I'm good waiting.
>>153125052>Can we even call Glitch indie anymore?I personally don't like the idea of calling publishers/production companies "indie" because it kind of goes against the entire idea of being "independent".Besides that, I give them one year after TADC ends before they sell out to a larger company.
>>153127207Well with film studios you have The Majors and then they call everyone else independent because they don't want to call them The Minors.
>>153126395Mondo Media is still ALIVE?? >>153123766Indie cartoons can grow so expensive to produce that they really shouldn't aim to be more than limited series imo, at least unless you're like Aaron Long who can pretty much do all the work with your own two hands. That's the mistake a lot of these more recent attempts struggle with: keeping things small and feasible.
It all started when indie animation shifted from 5 dudes in their garage dubbing over halo footage to big industry names from california larping the indie aesthetic to push their 20 minute, highly funded "pilots" the have their own studio behind them but can still barely afford to make so they rely on shitty looking plushies
>>153128400True. I think the Undergrads pilot was drawn by one person if I recall incorrectly
>>153112860>fully animatedHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
>>153129479not that funny
>>153121627What does Stingy mean, anon-senpai?
>>153130561No it is not. I started watching anime specifically to spite RWBY.
>>153123752Damn...
>>153130694Not stringent, that's for sure lol
>>153133117Glitch is australian
>>153112254I'll let you know when Unforgottem Realms gets an ending. Also you're gay.
>>153130694Ruby's stingy feet
>>153133549Care to tell me the origins and lore on Australian, on how it came to be as?Also why are they white?
>>153135263They're originally british. Which is not american either
>>153126395>Online animation just isn't profitable outside of a few exceptions.All animation isn't profitable outside of a few exceptions, and that's due to just how expensive it is to make in terms of man-hours doing said animation. It's why all the successful animated shows we remember from our youths (assuming we're oldfag millenials) fall into one of two categories:>sustained by the merchandise (think MLP or anything from Disney, Nickelodeon, or The Simpsons)>sustained by networks nigh being forced by the government to make shows suitable for children on Saturday mornings (and merchandising)People will bemoan the likes of Hazbin Hotel or Invincible or whatever having "expensive VAs," but they're overall not that expensive compared to all the people it takes to animate the shows. Flashgitz scrimps on VAs by having the characters voiced by themselves, and even they say the animation costs are the main costs, for example.I'd go so far as to argue that actual independent animation wont really be a thing until AI can help eliminate a lot of the labor costs that come with animation.
>>153112254Lol I dunno
>>1531122544 mins of two halo characters bobbing their head up and down is far easier than 20-30 mins of full new assets
>>153112254Im not sure RT is a good example of success to strive towards
>>153122805but I'm a creator and I want to be in the spotlight and if I don't make something that has tv quality no one will watch it :(
Animations are so unfairly expensive
>>153136124>He thinks indie studios will ever use AI
