What's your thoughts on the follow up to Batman TAS?I really enjoyed it, the writing wasn't as solid but overall it was a nice "bridge" to Superman TAS/Batman Beyond.The only thing I'm not a fan of is how Bruce is written. He's more stern and "ruthless" in this version and feels like he's missing some of his humanity from the original series. I understand why though but still....
>>153138389Barbara is a hot piece of ass in this show.
>>153138389Batman in the DC Animated Univerae has a pretty decent character arc where the never ending battle makes him increasingly jaded over time and eventually turns him into a bitter old man.
>>153138389It didn't last nearly long enough, it really shocked me to see how short that episode list really is. I really did enjoy it once I got past the absolute fuckup that was some of the character redesigns. The animation's even more outstanding than BTAS's and the plots are as compelling as ever. The fight choreography also improved substantially from what we got before, due to both the more adaptable art style and the change of network regulations regarding the nature of onscreen violence. I have a particular fondness for Calendar Girl's episode, which is superbly animated, has some of the best fights in the series, and has a great villain.I do find it rather annoying that they just stapled Jason's entire backstory to Tim Drake's name, but I understand why they did it, because if they just called him Jason literally everyone would have been counting down until the crowbar. Not that it helped him any in the end. Fuckers.
>>153138951Agreed
>>153139576Funny enough apparently Jason Todd happened in that universe anyway which makes zero sense
>>153141735Genuinely really like most of the female redesigns on TNBA, they're all closer to Bruce Timm proportions, helps that more of TNBA was animated in Japan or directed by Japanese directors to keep the quality consistent.
>>153139576Everyone unironically upgraded besides Riddler and Catwoman.
>>153141803I never got the complaints about the redesigns over all when Penguin and Scarecrow are such huge upgrades from their BtAS designs it's not even funny. I'm still shocked Timm & company got the official thumbs up on this hanged corpse design for what was still ostensibly seen as a kid's show. Also they didn't dance around Joker killing people anymore, we see two security guards clearly dead that he gassed in Holiday Knight.
I liked the episode with Calendar Girl. The ending was kino toohttps://youtu.be/Mc6nbLnAHpg
>>153141803And to clarify, the only issue with Catwoman is pupil-less eyes and having Michelle Pfeiffer Catwoman pale face cream. Otherwise the design could've been an improvement too.And apparently Timm intended for the design to have eyes.
>>153141952Timm only simplified it from that design because he didn't trust the overseas animators outside of the Japanese staff. Going back and watching BtAS, it's shocking how off-model characters could get, and then watching the blurays, you can suddenly see the change in shots from film to tape where they hastily had to have another studio re-animate certain scenes or shots because the Korean studios would fuck it up and they'd have to scramble to have another studio reanimate it.
>>153139576Joker is such a massive downgrade
>>153141952Damn this is much better
>>153142664They reduced the Joker to a skull-like face and wrecked his grin which is not a bad idea in concept, but execution it just lacks something that said "clown". When they went back during JLU and reconciled the two designs, that was when Joker was at his best.
>>153143669It just lacked so much emotive ability that the original and later designs had.
>>153143669>When they went back during JLU and reconciled the two designs, that was when Joker was at his best.They used that design first in the Batman Beyond Return of The Joker flashback.
>>153142626That was a factor, but in the BTAS coffee table book he said he was inspired by the Chesire Cat, just wanted her to have a floating grin. The detailed eyes distract from that.
>>153139576croc is the only one that's not a downgrade
>>153143763nuCroc sucks too
>>153138389As a sequel, it's not great. It looks worse and the characterization can be more flat. At its best BTAS is nearly timeless in a way I don't think TNBA is. As a general successor on its own terms it's still very good, though. It's probably my second favorite DCAU series after BTAS itself, tied with Beyond.>>153139576I like all the new designs aside from--ironically--Batman's.
>>153143783He looks like a humanoid crocodile instead of a gargoyle
>>153143763Eh
>>153141748It was a good opportunity to do something new with Jason and they didn’t take it.
>>153141803Pissed me off Riddler didn't get, at least, one more episode. Most he gets, is an appearance in a Superman Ep
>>153141897>>153139576Strangely, I can't stand the Calander Girl episode.Or rather I can't stand the stance the ep takes. The character is a good idea, a former model bitter because she's cast aside when she's not consider "beautiful" enough anymore. But the episode makes it into a whole ageism thing and a supermodel is the worst person to use for that lecture. It's not a person like the Wayne employee whose age would have no bearing on his/her ability. She's literally working in a visual field. Her age is definitely a factor. That's way she was making millions of her LOOKS in the first place. She's not a victim when her fortunes turn around for the same reason. It's telling that the people she's going after are all people who continued to be successful regardless of their age.If the episode would have looked at her the same way as Clayface or The Mad Hatter, then it would've been good, but I can't see her as tragic as the show wants me too.
>>153145728>She's not a victim when her fortunes turn around for the same reason. It's telling that the people she's going after are all people who continued to be successful regardless of their age.>If the episode would have looked at her the same way as Clayface or The Mad Hatter, then it would've been good, but I can't see her as tragic as the show wants me too.Maybe it's meant to be taken as more complex than you're making it out to be? Like Two Face / Harvey, we can acknowledge she's a victim and still disagree with her methods, it's not an either/or thing.Also I like the idea and concept of Calendar Girl more than Calendar Man in the comics, I wouldn't mind if she replaced him in mainline DCU.
>>153145619eh not really. By that point Jason had been dead for about a decade and he was killed off in the first place because he essentially lost a popularity poll. Meanwhile Tim had a popular solo, team book, and had established himself as a staple in batman. Easy to see why they went with the easy synergy. Jason is a strange case because his origin is pretty good, much better than Tim's, but he had almost nothing going for him outside of that. He was pretty much just a Dick clone both pre and post crisis until they made him edgy leading up to DiTF
>>153145852except she's not a victim like Harvey. That's my point.she's someone who was VERY lucky, for a while. she had a privileged life few have BECAUSE of how she looked. To then cry fowl when those same reasons are why she no longer has the sweet life isn't an ageism tragedy. That's why I said a supermodel is the wrong example for an ageism story. If she was someone whose looks never figured into it at all, like doctor or something, then it would be wrong that she was fired because she was too old.Now, a story COULD be written about people who are given an extremely privileged existence only to have it yanked away, the fickle nature of the modeling industry but THIS episode isn't about that. It's just how it's apparently wrong that people want to hire who THEY want to hire for their modeling jobs, how dare THEY have a choice with THEIR money.Conversely, we could be made to see how Page is confused and bitter because she is so used to having people fawn all over her, and then, suddenly the tap is turned off. She's not treated like the top beauty anymore. In that respect, we can understand her pain while still seeing her as completely wrong. Which is why I used Clayface and The Mad Hatter as examples. They are two characters who we can understand their issues, loss of looks, unrequited love, while still seeing them as completely wrong. Their stories didn't make any grandstanding about larger social issues and neither should hers.
>>153139006bitter old man batman is canon in every incarnation besides 66 batman
>>153146301BTAS/Beyond Bruce follows that path, but JL/JLU Bruce is an optimistic believer in the League and their cause. JLU Batman is like a "what-if" where he never went down the Tower of Babble path
>>153146271nta but a running theme in BTAS/TNBA villains is that none of their problems are actually legitimate and all of them could simply choose not to be scumbags at any time. They're criminals and villains because they choose to be. There was even an entire episode about it. So everything you're saying is simply why she's a villain.
>>153146301it's explicitly not for the comics, which is why Terry is hard to shove in. He has too many acolytes and like-minded people in it for the long run. At worst he gets into arguments with other capes over how to do justice
>>153146404I always thought they were the same
>>153146626so you're just ignoring when I said the episode has a whole ageism moral going. With the sideplot about the Wayne employee and the frequent nods about younger people being hired for all the jobs and Sela Ward being the voice of Calander Girl. You're just going to ignore the actual things I say huh?
>>153138389It definitely had a few good episodes, but nothing I wouldn't trade for some more average-quality BTAS episodes.
>>153146271Anon. Shes exceedingly vain and lives a life of beauty privilege surrounded by sycophants and men and others that lust after and worship her. She started going insane because she aged and doesnt look the same. Every tiny wrinkle or slight grey hair terrifies this OCD and beauty obsessed lunatic.That is her tragedy. Shes beautiful. Truly beautiful, but to herself shes hideous beyond reason. Thats the lesson. Thats to story.
>>153145628That had a big drawer full of crappy unused Riddler episodes, he was a difficult character for them to write well.>>153146036The Adventures Continue was just a cheap ploy to sell new toys, entirely phoned-in.>>153147231Bruce Wayne used her example to get rid of a bad policy of his own, but Calendar Girl was presented as a mentally ill criminal having a pity party just like every other person at Arkham.
>>153143669Not in terms of design, but his portrayal in world's finest was probably the best joker content ever made.
>>153147376why do I have to keep repeating myself?so you're just ignoring when I said the episode has a whole ageism moral going. With the sideplot about the Wayne employee and the frequent nods about younger people being hired for all the jobs and Sela Ward being the voice of Calander Girl. You're just going to ignore the actual things I say huh?
>>153138389Supremely midFuck awful costume and personality changes for most of them.Knew where they were going when they did the nightwing and catwoman hookup and "nightwing left Gotham for a reason he doesn't want to talk about" thing. Lots of "I do not like where this shit is going" hollywood faggotry leaking in. And this is coming from a guy who had no problem with clayface being a litteral hollywood faggot or sexy sleepover bisexual hints of Harley and ivy. Its mid with no good episodes at all and tons of forgettable slop
>>153147415Anon.Youre ignoring me. I read your ageism thing but I expanded on it. There is no one hiring a 5/10 because shes 16 to be a runway model over a 20/10.They chalk that up to ageism being linked to being unattractive not less competent. They even ho out of their way to say how beautiful she is despite her age. Its a tone deaf bitchathon about aging from oldsters but I reject that and look for the deeper parallels to the wicked queen a fear of being outshone by younger prettier modelsPlus when you add in how timm loves oldman Bruce with young batgirl it adds a pathetic loser element that ruins it further.
>>153147524okay, but you're expanding what you think on the episode. Which is fine but it's outside what the episode itself is saying and why I'm criticizing it.
>>153147442Holidays Knights, Double Talk, Never Fear, Growing Pains, Over the Edge, Legends of the Dark Knight, Mad Love, and Judgment Day were great episodes. It also had far more consistent animation than BTAS thanks to those new character designs.
>>153147598Those character designs are harder to draw thus should not have better animation.The animation comes from better animation not the worse designs.
>>153147636TNBA's character designs are simplified and more angular, that makes them easier to draw. They're better designs for animation, Timm was young, dumb, and inexperienced when he did BTAS, his style evolved to further suit the medium.
>>153146797NTA but they are TNBA is before JL, then some time after JLU Joker kidnap Robin and all that jazz happens
Bruce Timm's girls were supremely hotThat is all
>>153147738Indeed, I have any and all books of his stuff I can find.
>>153139576How can the Penguin in BTAS and TNBA possibly be the same person?
>>153148009He went on a diet (in the sense of going from obese to merely overweight) and realized legit business was a better road so now he's less of a bitch.
>>153145728Yeah but she doesn't LOOK any different. The moment she passed 30, she was blacklisted. Clearly, visual appearance wasn't the real reason.
>>153148877didn't matter. it's a visual business based on people and their bodies. The companies wanted younger people for their shows and ads as they felt that would be the draw and they have every right to make whatever product they want. Don't go into a field that relies on factors like that. It's fucking modeling, that's the LAST business you want to get into because its based on looks, and yes, age is part of thatas I said, her "talent" was simply being lucky to be the right looking creature at the time and she benefited greatly from it. Everyone else wasn't born the right looking creature and would never be. Page can't complain when she stopped being the right creature anymore. She's not entitled to employment forever.
>>153148922>>153148877also, she wasn't blacklisted. she simply wasn't wanted by anyone any longer. Guess what, welcome to the human race.
>>153146797technically yes according to the showrunners and there's even a couple crossover episodes, but the character is written very differently so the contrast between their characterizations is is jarring at times. JLU Bruce found a community and people he can trust in the Justice League leading to him being a more hopeful and optimistic guy and is 100% bought in to the team. Beyond Bruce is a bitter old man who claims to have only been a part timer. The Beyond movie attempts to square this discrepancy but it still comes across as a retcon and makes Beyond feel more like an Elseworlds or just a possible future compared the the JLU world.
>>153147738
>>153149329Galatea was so hot
>>153149532I wanted her to win
>>153149329>>153149397Damn
>>153138389The true hero in this show is the IRS
>>153143735It's fine but I still think I prefer the more subtle sinister quality of the original design, when it was called for he could convincingly play off as a legit clown instead of just always looking like a vampire.
>>153139576why did tnba do two face so dirty? only got one episode and he was a creepy loser going after a kid.
>>153139576>because if they just called him Jason literally everyone would have been counting down until the crowbar.To be fair, it wouldn't be the foregone conclusion with Timm behind the steerinh wheel. Because Babs in this continuity is the only version of Babs that avoided getting Killing Joke'd. And was better off for it.
>>153147738>Bruce Timm's girl was supremely hotFixed, because he only ever draws one girl with different wigs and outfits.
>>153150399He got two, the Judge episode was him developing a third personality. And the Robin episode was lifted from post-crisis Jason
>>153149895
>>153150399He was based going after a kid
>>153150236What's great is that that episode is straight up based off a comic from the 50's, down to him getting wrapped up trying to deal with the IRS.If you think about it, Capone was taken down by taxes a few decades before so it was probably riffing off that.
>>153148922Fries wasn't entitled to spend millions of dollars of someone else's money to fund an experiment to keep his wife alive either. This was just one of those episodes where Batman has to protect assholes who were legally in the right against an entitled criminal who's legally in the wrong but nevertheless presented as sympathetic. How sympathetic you feel towards them depends on your own views.
>>153143763Scarecrow looks pretty good
>>153143763Scarecrow is the biggest upgrade of all time
>>153152492PHEW MAMMA
>>153149292fuck the showrunners. batman beyond shouldve always been an AU instead of part of the DCAU.
>>153138389I saw TNBA first not knowing the difference as a kid, so working my way through the DCAU later it was a surprise. I really like the designs and villains still.
>>153152492is that granny goodness?
>>153146036I meant The Adventures Continue could’ve done something new with Jason. Aside from explaining where the Red Hood came from, it was just a copy paste from his usual origins.
>>153139576BTAS villains look great.TNBA heroes look great.We should combine them.
>>153138389Some of the redesigns are a bit questionable and generally the writing isn't quite as strong, but I really like TNBA and generally consider it just a continuation of BTAS in most respects.>The only thing I'm not a fan of is how Bruce is written. He's more stern and "ruthless" in this version and feels like he's missing some of his humanity from the original series.As >>153139006 said it's part of the DCAU's whole thing. Keep in mind also that most of the villains have tried to reform in the past and still fucked it up and either chose to go back to their old life of crime, or did so by tragic mistake, which Bruce certainly isn't happy with.They also introduced some brand new cute girls like picrel or Roxy, hard to complain.
Pure sex
>>153150399>>153152054Unpopular opinion, but Two Face is only really interesting for Harvey's turn/fall from grace, once he's fully Two Face, there isn't really anything interesting there, he just becomes another mob boss. Nolan's instinct to just kill Harvey off in the climax of The Dark Knight was the right call, because the cycle just becomes "Harvey is 'fixed', then through circumstances becomes Two Face again" over and over again in the comics.
>>153157972Even in BTAS the villains go from sympathetic in their first episode to committing some heinous acts just a few episodes later.You know how Mad Hatter is a poor deluded romantic in his first episode? Obviously he comes close to basically mind raking Alice, but the show still frames him as a poor loser who snapped.We’ll just a week later, or 3 episodes in the production order, he’s putting Batman a dream coma. He’s never sympathetic again even in the original seasons, he made his choice and isn’t reforming.
>>153159355No, I agree fully. The concept is better than the execution
>>153159355When he’s fully Two Face what you actually get is a villain whose entire existence is structured around an internal moral lottery. That’s not a normal mob boss psychology. The coin is not a gimmick, it’s his moral framework. His criminal behavior is governed by randomized morality and fractured identity, not ambition or control.
>>153159355>>153159505Two-face’s original concept was that his heads coin toss wouldn’t just be neutral or not doing a bad action, but outright do a good deed or heroic action. I think losing that had made it sort of hard to keep up the characters gimmick. I guess it was downplayed because two-face donating stolen money to the ooor or helping an old lady across the street is corny, but I could see them basically making him a wild card vigilante instead.
>>153154929but that episode was calling out the hypocrisy of a supposed "humanitarian" cutting the power on a process that was already started which would result in someones death. That episode went no further in any kind of moralizing.By contrast, the people Paige were after did NOTHING wrong. They aren't obligated to keep supporting her because she thought people would just keep hiring her for jobs forever, regardless of how she looked. and I already explained that the episode frames it as an ageism issue when it ISN'T AT ALL. Her profession is based on how she looks and her body. It WAS the thing people wanted and so she lucked into a privileged life. She was born pretty and young. People are allowed to change their tastes at any time. This is why I mentioned the Mad Hatter. We can emphasize with the feelings of rejection, but NO WHERE did the episode suggest Alice was at fault in any way for rejecting him. She did not owe him love. Both He and Paige are in situations where they need to suck it up, like the rest of us. She is no more a victim than the rest of us. Definitely not as much a victim as Fries
One pet peeve I always had about BTAS, and I get it's a petty thing, is that it had a relatively small cast.Harvey Bulluck was the ONE detective in Gotham (TNBA, the finally added Montoya)Summer Gleason was the ONE reporterGordon handled every case personally even though he was a Commissioner. It would've been nice to see a more believable spreading out. At least they didn't go to Rupert Thorn every time they needed a mobster
>>153143763Ivy and Cat woman looks better
>>153159857It's actually a fairly big cast and inserting more randos in the supporting would lead to worse writing.
>>153160055they don't have to be actual characters. It would just be nice that every time we see the cops at a scene, it's not Gordon and Bulluck like it's one horse town.
>>153159857Montoya debuted in TAS.>>153160222They did have generic cops though. POV also had Office Wilkes who showed up again a few more times in non-speaking roles. They can only have so many VAs, so many unique character designs.
>>153146797>>153147716They're technically the same but JL and JLU were written after BB (which never anticipated them) and it shows. BB makes sense only following TNBA where Bruce was already starting to to get devoured by his crusade and driving people away, so him being a lonely bitter old man made sense there. Less so when it was revealed Bruce ended spending a significant part between them as part of super buddies team he was a loyal friend to. A few throwaway "Lol I'm only a part timer" lines doesn't really change the fact that in The Call it was treated like Bruce barely had anything to do with the Justice League.
>>153160880>Montoya debuted in TAS.but she wasn't a detective until TNAS
>>153160880I'm talking about detectives, not officers. Bulluck was the only police detective throughout BTAS. He and the the police commissioner were the only two seen investigating anything.
>>153147738he should have done mode comics and other cartoons but I heard he was expensive to hire.The harley and ivy comic is fucking great btw
>>153161457It's not that he's "expensive", it's hard for him to fit drawing comics when he's running a division of Warner Bros Animation full-time. He was supposed to pencil and ink the Fantastic Four 'World's Greatest Comics Magazine' anniversary series for Marvel, but did the first two issues and realized he just couldn't fit 12 issues into his work schedule. He would basically have to abandon his cushy desk job at WBA with a salary and health benefits to do comics full-time.
>>153138389Better than anything since
>>153159857I get what you're saying but it really didn't have room for a Gotham Central style police force. Didn't the Amazon series try more focus on the police force and it did not go well?
>>153160222That's like saying it's stupid that cartoon caracters don't change their clothes. You know how difficult that would be?
>>153161761that's why I said it's a pet peeve and a petty thing rather than an actual complaint about the show
>>153161741I just mean in terms of extras, not actual characters. Just like they had loads of different officers, it wouldn't have been hard to have a few random "detectives" on scenes instead of Bulluck and the Commissioner every time or Summer as the reporter every time.
>>153161397When BTAS debuted, that's how it was in the comics as well. Bullock was the only recurring Detective. The GCPD cast didn't get larger until years later.
>>153161915Damnit, I want more detectives! This is Gotham City! (throws computer)
>>153159857>Summer Gleason was the ONE reporterIt was either her or Alexander Knox, and they hated having to synergize with Burton's films as it was.
>>153161944I think you have the wrong Harley in there
Surprised they didn't use Vicki Vale as the main reporter cause of the Burton films
>>153161956could've just made up someone random. didn't even have to have a name. just
>>153161961Close enough and cute enough
>>153161965She was a photographer in the movie. Knox was the reporter, and everybody hated him to the point where Returns was going to have him killed off in one draft.
>>153161904This seems strange, but it’s because of the animation style being more streamlined and specific to a style. BTAS was made as a sort of mash of styles due to Timm having a lot of different artists on his team. Look how different poison ivy looks from Catwoman or Harley. But in TNBA they all have very similar body types and head shapes.Remember how few extras you’d see in Teen Titans? Cities were often empty or sparsely filled. That’s a consequence of character design becoming more refined, every extra has to be properly designed and made sure it’s on model instead of just letting background artists do whatever. Ironically, Bruce Timm started in animation doing background stuff in GI Joe. But compare 80s cartoon crowd scenes with later DCAU stuff. The 80s shows would have a bunch of characters in janky animation, the DCAU would have much less but smoother.
>>153162000I think Knox laws meant to die in 89’s first draft, but Wuhl was liked enough by the execs that they nixed that scene. Burton and the Returns screenwriter Daniel Waters hated him though and wanted to kill him if the studio insisted he be in it.
>>153162014>Look how different poison ivy looks from Catwoman or Harley. But in TNBA they all have very similar body types and head shapes.Poor Timm had to get Lynne Naylor to come in and teach him how to draw women.
>>153162205shut up bitch
>>153162205I dont get it what's wrong with the top Pic, looks fine
i'm surprised this was not replicated. it existed in the one era it could. like that Batman Caped Crusader show, they couldn't get a universe out of it if they tried because it's taking multiple years to make 2 seasons with 10 eps each. For them to do a Superman show, etc in the same unverse would take them until 2040
>>153162350Caped Crusader also looks pretty bad, nowhere near BTAS or even TNBA.
>>153162205I believe they also hated the Bat-Signal and tried to ditch it, but the network execs won out and they had to throw it in. Its debut episode had Gordon complain that it was a waste of taxpayer money as a diss, if I recall.
>>153162349It's fine, it would be completely art home in an 80's show like GI Joe, but Timm wanted more than fine. He wanted smolder and an erotic edge. That's why BTAS is still as special as it is.
>>153162349As he says her proportions are bad, her chest looks weird, her shoulders too masculine.
>>153162387Bruce Timm and Eric Radomski write the initial series bible and wanted it to be purely a "Year One" kind of deal, more low-tech, less gadgets, more firmly set in the 1940's, and that meant no Bat Signal initially. If Bruce Timm had his way, BtAS would have been closer to his 75th Anniversary short.https://youtu.be/IFwOS2R9o_8?feature=shared
>>153147598>It also had far more consistent animation than BTAS thanks to those new character designs.It had more consistent animation because nearly every episode was animated by Dong Yang, the most acceptably mediocre studio by the end of BTAS’s run (they started out making slop in the beginning). TNBA dropped every animation studio from BTAS besides TMS and Dong Yang.The designs in TNBA are simpler than BTAS but not always better. The TNBA designs for the Joker, Mr. Freeze, Poison Ivy, the Riddler, Gordon, Croc, and Bane are inferior. Other designs have aged poorly by being "modernized" for the late '90s, which now means they seem more dated than the 1940s-style designs from BTAS. BTAS had more bad-looking episodes but also more great-looking ones. TNBA sacrificed that for "consistent"-ly mid animation, excepting the few TMS episodes.
>>153149329JLU had the best ryona scenes in American animation
>>153159857That's because it's a TV show anon
>>153162657They had to work within the seasonal budgets they were allocated, and sadly the DCU shows were all given lower budgets than the "Steven Spielberg Presents" shows like Tiny Toons, Animaniacs, and Freakazoid, which had money to blow on more episodes handled by TMS, the DCAU team didn't have that luxury on BTAS, STAS or TNBA, so they had to be selective which episodes went to TMS, and which ones went to Dong Yang. Bruce Timm has been pretty vocal in the past with how frustrated he was by the smaller budgets they were allocated, despite DC shows ultimately doing better in the long run for merchandise sales than Tiny Toons, Animaniacs, Pinky & The Brain and Freakazoid.
>>153162741see>>153161879
>>153162409
>>153162774Was Pinky and the Brain really that huge
>>153162915It had the Steven Spielberg executive producer credit attached (and Spielberg was apparently more hands-on then most exec. producers of his stature), and so because of that, any of the WB cartoons he produced got a larger than usual budget for TV animation projects of the time.
>>153139006And the sad thing is he was actually starting to pull out of in Justice League. He had friends, people he came to trust, admire and open up to emotionally (as much as someone like him can anyway). He almost found love with Diana. And then Return of the Joker happened and he threw it all away...
>>153162915>>153162935They were actually trying to push it in Sunday night prime-time, which didn't last long.
>>153159355How the fuck did Timm get those cool ass texture patterns on two-face's face and the background?
>>153162685by far
>>153163004The paper? Or those sheets they use for manga, I dunno.
>>153162433Okay yeah I can see it now
>>153163004Just a particularly toothy paper he used, probably a cold press watercolor paper.
>>153163142>>153163190>>153163216Tracksuit hawkgirl is sexo
>>153163004>>153163185>>153163611I love that I can answer this. David Williams answered it on a stream last year or so( greybeards)It’s cork board.He takes the back of one of those clipboards and rubs the pencil along it to pick up the texture. That simple but executed so well. Try it sometime. Still gotta be able to draw stylized art well, but it’s a new tool for you to use if you draw.
I really need to rewatch BTAS/TNBA. I wonder how it holds up and whether my fond memories of this show aren't just my nostalgia.
>>153164643There's an odd tension to early episodes where they were using spec scripts by longtime cartoon writers from studios like Filmation or New World/Marvel that approached it as just another Saturday Morning cartoon, and then you'd have writers like Paul Dini or actual comic writers like Marv Wolfman or Gerry Conway who immediately got what the team was trying to do, and suddenly the quality of writing jumps dramatically and matches what the art dept is attempting.There's also that weird thing where they have to dance around BS&P, so Harvey's split personality manifests over a freak bullying incident instead of long-term abuse by his alcoholic father, or they can't just have Joker murder people, so stories really go out of their way for him to do everything but kill people and it stretches credulity, but it was less of an issue later on in the series, and especially wasn't a problem by TNBA, where they could show dead victims of Joker but couldn't show him actively murder them.But when they had a writer who was in symbiosis with the tone and vibe of the show, and were able to work around broadcast standards without losing narrative momentum or quality, magic happens, and it's some of the best Batman material ever made. Obviously episodes like Heart of Ice are iconic, but episodes like I Am The Night, Perchance to Dream, The Demon's Quest, Avatar, Robin's Reckoning Part 1, Clayface Part 2, Mask of the muthafuggin Phantasm? Everything clicks into being some of the best, most cohesive takes on The Dark Knight ever produced.
>>153159355I never got why he turned mob boss or at least wasn't like half mob boss and half psycho vigilante
>>153164829>There's also that weird thing where they have to dance around BS&P,I read somewhere that Timm especially was a menace when in comes to censorship in that he would adhere to the censors' demands to the letter, while still getting what he wanted in the end.Like that famous scene in Over The Edge. The censors told him he can't show Batgirl slamming into the front of a police car directly, because that would be too gruesome... so he showed the scene from the backseat of a car. Which actually made it even more visceral as a result.
>>153164880Kids WB let them get away with way more than Fox Kids did in-general. I remember in 'Never Fear' being genuinely shocked when they show Bruce kills an alligator, we see it float to the surface of the water upside down and blood fill the water around it. This was also the episode that debuted Scarecrow's new TNBA design, which absolutely would not have flown in the Fox Kids era.
>>153162657>The TNBA designs for the Joker, Mr. Freeze, Poison Ivy, the Riddler, Gordon, Croc, and Bane are inferior.Gordon specifically was supposed to have been battling cancer between shows, and that's why he's thinner and more frail looking in TNBA. It was always a fan theory that Bruce Timm confirmed a few years ago, it's not mentioned in the show, but that was apparently the intent of Gordon's redesign, and his mortality was the lingering thread in his interactions with Batman and Barbara through most of TNBA.
How is that new-ish Amazon show, by the way? I remember everybody hyping it up, because it's Bruce Timm and it's going to be the BTAS you know and loved... and then it launched and everybody forgot about it.
>>153163621My wife
