>>153233767
Stop reading only Big 2 comics

>just ignores all the comics and comic series that had endings

>>153233767
Yeah, I think most superhero book readers have this moment of clarity, stop reading capeshit ongoing and stop only reading the big 2 and you'll have a lot better a time. If you want to still read capeshit just prioritize creatives you like and treat their runs as more interesting than just picking up spider-man every month, you get a lot more variety that way too.

>>153233767
I never followed ongoings as they happened and always chose to explore runs at my leisure and pick and choose which parts I thought "counted". But I still vastly prefer limited and standalone series.

>>153233767
>>153233849
>>153233998
I just went to old comics or stories or the ones that did end. oddly I find I like those earths better in marvel and dc's multiverse.
or it's left open for more stories in that earth but never really is seen again except maybe in reference or flashback.
But I cant follow the main timelines in either multiverse or it's backup main as its always the same shit on loop.
oh look joker's poisoning the gotham city water...again...for the 1,652th time. <== implying I give a shit knowing the outcome.

just do that fun thing in the silver age of oh we're in another reality or planet. im tired of the same shit and same boring stories and bad writing with agenda and narrative.
but meh its why I went back in time in comics and really just deal with that.

>>153233796
Even Big 2 comics have endings, OP wants to be mad

>>153233796
Or if one must; read mini-series and "graphic novels" with conclusions of a sort, as well as trades but there pretend those conclude with the creative team.
In the event of sequels like with TDKR it's up to you to decide your cut off.

>>153234089
>Even Big 2 comics have endings
Examples? Even Watchmen got a sequel.

File: baki 214 ng.jpg (107 KB, 712x318)

107 KB JPG

are there any american comics where the protagonist uses actual martial art?
lately i've finally recognized that burger heroes are just wrestlers throwing big punches
would like to see a superhuman using judo or something like that

>>153234229
Watchmen only has 12 issues. Nothing else counts.

File: 1766119571439404.png (653 KB, 591x469)

653 KB PNG

>>153233767
not having endings is tolerable, but there is a real noticeable decline in story telling and world building that's too bad to ignore at least for most of the mainline stuff. The why should I care or get invested thing was always a problem but when the stuff isn't all that interesting or good either it all becomes magnified

>>153234229
A sequel doesn't invalidate the original works. ending. The existence of Aliens doesn't Alien no longer has an ending to the film.

>>153233767
Comics are a soap opera.

>>153234324
>A sequel doesn't invalidate the original works.
Yes it does. Alien 3 killing Newt and Hicks retroactively made Aliens a worse movie.

>>153234229
>Even Watchmen got a sequel.
Well this is your problem. Many comics kind of ended at one point. Man-Thing has many comics... or you could just read the Gerber issues. Which is what almost everyone will recommend.

>>153234942
>bad sequel made by someone that wasn't the creator somehow ruins the original thing
wow you're very smart! Now I understand that 1986's Watchmen is shit, thanks

>>153235021
>wow you're very smart! Now I understand that 1986's Watchmen is shit, thanks
It's not shit, but the original Watchmen is made worse by Doomsday Clock and the HBO series.

>>153234229
Another example is Moore's Miracleman. Not from a Big 2 (Marvel doesn't counts) but Gaiman wrote more issues. lol just stick to Moore's ending

>>153235043
Your opinion (or bait) is underwhelming. If that was true, then everything would be shit. You know what? Yeah everything that was published had shitty adaptations, everything is shit

File: welcome back.png (838 KB, 1920x1080)

838 KB PNG

>>153233767
Yep. This is why so many people have switched over to manga over time: endings are important. The ending is what ties together the rest of the story and makes it about something, gives it a point and a payoff, makes what has happened in the rest of the story matter. Great, beloved characters and series have been cast into the depths to be forgotten because a bad ending invalidated all that came before it, meanwhile a mediocre story can be saved by a fantastic ending that makes the slow parts worth it because of the payoff.

Being on a treadmill forever, never getting anywhere and not just failing to get payoff but anything you did think was good inevitably gets erased by some future writer? Its extremely unsatisfying. Audiences want the time they invested into their fiction to *mean* something, and endless cape comics are inherently devoid of meaning. Not because they are about something childish like superheroes, but because the publishing format makes meaning impossible beyond a limited run which requires you to pretend that the other 80 years of comics featuring this character don't exist.

There is a reason why something like Gunbuster has been fondly remembered for nearly 40 years, while most comic runs of even popular character just blur together into a flavorless slop. Gunbuster is a story. Batman is not. Batman *has* good stories in it, like The Killing Joke or The Long Halloween, but Batman overall is aimless, repetitive, and not about anything.

>>153235107
jumping in to add to you on my end. I used to LOVE batman and also proxy joker and harley quinn. I will add this I do not care for the stuff much anymore and now its select stories. I actually find some of his short cases and old stuff pre 1990s fun. but ultimately its a case of same shit different era. oh wow joker is poisoning gothams water in the 1940s, 50s, 60s, 70s, 80s, 90s, 00s, 10s, 20s. <_< REALLY?
If I have to suffer through this trash can we at least use the 1966 joker with actual attempts at funny ha ha. I can enjoy that joker... oh yeah because the story is done. this is why I read old done runs and manga and stuff I can put down and go very nice. but yeah I leave batman and superman and the stuff to dumb ai art scenes of what if and dont bother with modern comics that wont end.
also looked up gunbuster and now have something to read so thank you for posting.

>>153235072
Again, I never said "shit" I said it was worse than it would have been if there was no sequel.

>>153233767
>Manhattan's dick is the center of the universe

>>153235218
You can just not read/watch shitty sequels, especially if they're made so many years later and even a different medium, different writers, etc.

>>153235245
Kino.

File: 1275525103281.png (398 KB, 735x512)

398 KB PNG

The problem was never that they needed to have real endings for any of the characters. As a kid I didn't WANT their stories to ever end.

The problem is that it needs to stick to an episodic format where each individual comic story has its own beginning middle and end. But someone got the bright idea to make every comic connect to every other comic so there's no endings at all. It's all just one continuous soap opera.

File: man of integrity.jpg (30 KB, 478x478)

30 KB JPG

>>153236862
Very well fitting image to go with that statement too. BTAS especially did this well, it worked within it's own continuity but was respectful to the source material.

I think the idea of a franchise sticking to one singular, finite timeline, that absolutely NEEDS to end at an "appropriate" time in the perfect way exactly in sync with whatever the public was hoping for is stupid and unrealistic. If for example, for whatever reason, Warner and DC let Batman Beyond be the final, last Batman depiction ever made, people wouldn't be happy with it. They would want the character back, because they like the idea, they like the character, that's what a strong premise makes people do, they don't really want an ending, they're just frivolous and think ending a series means it won't get bad things anymore. People bitch anyways, companies want money, fuck em.

File: 1757262630005179.jpg (1.29 MB, 2560x1968)

1.29 MB JPG

>>153236956
when people say they want "endings" they generally mean for certain iterations or versions of whatever character or story. Nobody is mad at something like JLU ending and the DCAU in general being its own contained thing. It's arguably a better way to do things. As is with something like the mainline comics you just pile a bunch of baggage on top of baggage until it devolves into a bunch of garbage nobody enjoys which is why they go nuts for stuff like the ultimate or absolute universes

>>153237046
I've heard people say that unironically, but I suppose that's more about shows and games than comics and franchises with multiple continuities and mediums. It's hard to think of any pros for the eternal storyline format, for lack of a better name. Maybe crossover cancer is a better name. The longer it goes on without being cut or treated, the more it festers and turns the whole shebang unenjoyable due to complication. One organ's cells (A continuity) spreads to another organ (B continuity) and then those spread to others through the body of comics until the whole thing is a dead mess.

>>153237046
>As is with something like the mainline comics you just pile a bunch of baggage on top of baggage until it devolves into a bunch of garbage nobody enjoys
The primary reasons behind that are shared universes / constant crossovers and not returning to a status quo at the end of a story. But "status quo" was basically a dirty word on /co/ for the longest time because morons here had a misconception that stories need to have lasting impacts on the main characters in order for it to be good.

>>153236956
>If for example, for whatever reason, Warner and DC let Batman Beyond be the final, last Batman depiction ever made, people wouldn't be happy with it

But would they have been happy with it being the canon ending of *Bruce Wayne*? Probably, yeah.
Your image references a franchise that threads this *exact needle* where a given Kamen Rider has their own unique story, with beginning and ending, that exists on its own. Then their story is done, and outside of the occasional cameo as a special treat they are done. A new Kamen Rider show arises to replace them, with its own story. Elements and themes carry over, but each new Kamen Rider has their own characters, themes, and gimmicks even if there are a bunch of elements that carry over between them as a common defining feature of the Riders. But Kamen Rider, Kamen Rider OOO, Kamen Rider Gaim, etc are all very much different shows.
Things would not be improved if for the last 50 years it was STILL Hongo fighting the forces of Shocker. Worse yet, if it was liek Batman he wouldn't just still be fighting shocker, 'iconic' Kamen Rider monsters like the Spider Man and Bat Man and the like would just always be around, never allowed to die because they are 'too popular' to be gone for long. Just fighting the same enemies forever with no progress and no escape because there can be no ending for anyone or anything.

File: 1750473555362267.jpg (99 KB, 644x850)

99 KB JPG

>>153237209
It's not just crossovers; it's the nature of a neverending story that also pretends or attempts to sell character arcs and progression. Even if it was just entirely episodic stuff you'd still run into the issue of retreads and general audience retention unless you expected unreal turnover. Big 2 capeshit has a serious problem with identifying target audiences and demographics to go along with questionable writing talent

>>153237244
>Just fighting the same enemies forever with no progress and no escape because there can be no ending for anyone or anything.
Unfortunately, there's a non-inconsequential population of people who want exactly that, you try making new villains, old fans whine the new ones don't stack up. Then you bring back the old ones, and then they whine you're not doing anything original of interesting. I think things like what you describe can work in all honestly I was just posting the I agree with you meme but I appreciate the interesting context but it really depends on the series. I mean batman is such a particular character, how many ___iionaires with detective skills can you spit out before it stops being believable? Even in batman beyond, they didn't make Terry the same as Bruce, and that was very smart to do, but the original character is always gonna be what people want most.

It's okay to not like big 2 comics, Anons. Just move on with your lives.

File: 1250660965553.jpg (28 KB, 381x534)

28 KB JPG

>>153237244
The vast majority of legacy heroes in the Big 2 suck balls. The real issue is when they keep using the same few villains over and over again instead of making new ones

>>153237436
>The vast majority of legacy heroes in the Big 2 suck balls.
How many legacy heroes in the big 2 are actually allowed to be legacy heroes, and how many of them are stuck being an active hero alongside the original that they 'replaced' except that the original got brought back and now we just have multiple heroes sharing the same name in a vain attempt to keep everyone happy?
Like, does Miles Morals on his own work as Spiderman? Maybe, maybe not. But he *absolutely* doesn't work as Spiderman if you force himto share a universe with a still-around Peter Parker who is also Spiderman. What does that leave for Miles to do besides be a pale imitation? Repeat as needed for various Green lantern/Flash/Whatever else successor characters that are just bloating out the universe because we refuse to let the originals leave the spotlights because boomers and gen x can't ever let culture move beyond what they remember from their distant youth.

>>153237505
See what I said >>153236862
>As a kid I didn't WANT their stories to ever end.
So why force it to?

>we refuse to let the originals leave the spotlights because boomers and gen x can't ever let culture move beyond what they remember from their distant youth.
Batman has been around since 1940. It's something greatest generation and silent generation read when they were kids. There's no point in trying to forcibly replace them if people still want them to this day. If you really want new characters, then make NEW characters, don't replace existing ones for no reason other than because you want to swap their race or sex, or whatever other retarded agenda you have.

>>153237617
>If you really want new characters, then make NEW characters

Good luck doing that in an existing setting where the old heroes never retire. How can any new hero in DC ever possibly get any kind of prominence when the 80+ year long roster of heroes never moves out of the way? You can make any new hero you want, but they'll always be a bit player because everything will continue to revolve around Superman and Batman and so on for the rest of time. Of course the new heroes always fail, they have to compete with the JLA for relevance and people like you don't want the JLA to change or retire.
The year is 4,728 AD, after gamma ray burst scoured the planet of life the surviving human race consists of exactly two people whose brains have been preserved in jars with mind-machine interfaces wired into them, and they take turns writing Batman stories for each other. Because there can be no greater priority.

>>153236862
>As a kid I didn't WANT their stories to ever end.
Kids will literally watch the same movie every day if you let them. Sometimes more than once. They love repetition. They don't even retain most of what they watch, you can ask them about the details of a movie they have seen 30 times and they won't actually understand what the plot is they just like watching it.

>>153233767
In my head Marvel ended in the early to mid 90s, DC ended just before Infinity Crisis

>>153237792
>Good luck doing that in an existing setting where the old heroes never retire.
See >>153237209
>The primary reasons behind that are shared universes / constant crossovers
So just don't try to cram a millionth superhero into Gotham city. It's really that simple.

>>153237815
So? My parents are retired and watch constant reruns of ancient shows on MeTV. And I'd rather watch one episode of Columbo I haven't seen before than another drama where it goes downhill fast after season 3 and there won't be an actual ending until at least 10 years after the show started and barely any plot progression in all that time.

>>153236862
For me, it's having both things at the same time, per issue. Back then it was possible...

>>153233767
Fuck endings and fuck you. You don't need to put a cap on the entire world and character to make a story meaningful. You're an idiot. People who clamor for endings are just jackasses looking to rush something to completion so they can pad their lists.

>>153237990
>You don't need to put a cap on the entire world and character to make a story meaningful.
Actually, you do.

>>153233767
And that’s a (YOU) problem.

>>153234942
>Alien 3 killing Newt and Hicks retroactively made Aliens a worse movie.

No it didn’t. How can someone be this stupid.

>>153235107
>This is why so many people have switched over to manga over time: endings are important.

Yeah getting super shitty nothingburger endings with no real payoff, or worse, ones that are so dumb and forced that they sour the entire series time after time is super duper important, isn’t it? I can basically count good, genuinely endings in manga with two hands.

>Audiences want the time they invested into their fiction to *mean* something

To adults this just means getting an entertaining story. If you go into Batman demanding a definitive ending you’re a fucking idiot. Sorry but that is the reality. People like you are bitchy cunts who can’t accept that they can’t get their rocks off superhero anymore like they did as children and then develop these laughable stupid explanations as to why that is. People like serialised fiction. They don’t go to everything insisting it has to deliver an ending within certain time frame and has to give a conclusive ending that encapsulates and gives meaning to everything that came before. People have been watching soap operas that never end for decades. They kept demanding more Sherlock Holmes even after Doyle tried to kill him off. People still flock to sequels.

And it’s absolutely absurd to yap about manga endings when there’s numerous series that went on for fucking decades where people didn’t stick around to get an ending, hell sometimes a series can even keep being published despite the original author dying because they have no intention of ending it.

>>153233767
That sounds like a you problem. Despite modern superhero writers doing everything in their power to ram interest into the ground, the concept of ongoing stories that change hands periodically isn't inherently a bad thing. It's just a tool that unfortunately is heavily misused. Besides, you're free to consider the end of a particular writer's run an ending if you like it enough. That's not even getting into the fact you seem to be conflating a large percentage of superhero comics with the entire medium, but even sticking to that range there are plenty of stories with concrete endings.

As an aside, I never understood why people feel the need to argue in bad faith like this. It's not like anyone's holding a gun to your head and making you read beyond a certain point. You can stop when you don't enjoy a book anymore, and subsequently pick it back up when the writers are doing something decent. The ability to choose your own ending is a feature, not a bug.

People that harp about stories having concrete endings always seem like they're more in love with the trappings of what supposedly makes a "legitimate" story than what works on an individual work.

>>153237990
>>153238343
>>153238414
>>153238470
Crazy samefagging going on here.

>>153238296
>Actually, you do.
Says who? Where is it written? And what does it mean if the ending sucks? Does that invalidate things you spent years enjoying?

File: 1766589676103124.png (607 KB, 759x371)

607 KB PNG

you know these soap-opera and anti-ending posts would be a lot more convincing if it weren't for the actual state of comic. Also the fact that people go nuts whenever they see something that breaks away and seems self-contained. In the end though it's all opinions and the market has and will continue to speak for itself so it'll all sort itself out

>>153235270
this
you can just not consume stuff, i know it's hard, but you can stop, put it down.

>>153237990
>>153238343
>>153238414
>>153238470
Crazy samefagging going on here.

>>153238544
>YOU'RE SAMEFAGGING BECAUSE I'M MAD
Grim.

>>153233767
Forget official canon ideas and think of it as more like mythology. When you read a good book that wraps up a character for you, you can consider that the ending. It doesn't matter if Marvel or DC paid some new schmuck to bring them back 2 years later.

>>153234942
>Yes it does. Alien 3 killing Newt and Hicks retroactively made Aliens a worse movie.
Only for people with low mental faculties who can't decide for themselves that Alien 3 just didn't happen for them.

>>153235107
>This is why so many people have switched over to manga over time: endings are important.
Except several of the most famous manga still haven't ended (and won't because it is the creator's livelihood), or their creator died before they could write an ending.

>>153233767
It's one writer so it's obviously an exception to the format of serialized superhero comics from the big two, however reading stuff like Corto and Usagi I feel there's nothing inherently wrong with seemingly limitless stories for familiar characters, the issue is just once things feel suffocatingly stagnant or circular or, somehow worse, subversive yet ultimately meaningless.

That's what plagues the material, the generations of writers who have shown up to the campfire ultimately to just tell you their version of already told stories, + an OC/Self insert, largely to make an impression or just do their shift with the least amount of effort or ridicule rather than contribute to the folklore.
It's sort of a futile experiment given the result is sort of obvious, but go ahead and try this; get a bunch of people with nothing better to do one night, then you and two or more others begin telling stories with a limited cast. But instead of building off prior ideas in interesting ways or adding new ones, one of you should basically do sequels that are basically beat for beat the same but MORE of thing, or tell the same story except with a SHOCKING retcon twist.

At the end ask people their thoughts, don't lead them on but chiefly you're looking to hear if they got bored from hearing about the same cast and genre or if it was the one asshole who made paying attention become a chore from time being consumed without an entertaining reward. It's just that simple, stop hiring cronies and hacks to steer the ship hoping brand power will keep it afloat.

>>153238873
I don’t really understand why it’s so hard for people to accept that you can just move on if you become bored with something.

I really don't get why people hang on to the bad qualities of comics like this. Having no ending has no real positives.

>>153239375
By this logic everything is bad until it is finally officially concluded and only then it might be good. And then retroactively it becomes bad again if there’s sequel(s). It’s moronic to think like this

Reading history lost a lot of it's appeal when I realized that I won't witness the end of the universe in my lifetime.

File: 1653025069516.jpg (55 KB, 450x334)

55 KB JPG

>>153239375
So what's the positive side of having an ending? If you have something that was never intended to have any kind of overarching storyline, then ending doesn't "complete" it, because if you look at it all as being one big story then it just meanders tremendously and that can make it an overall worse experience compared to simply stopping.

And the worst case scenario, the ending can simply be undone and more is made, defeating the point of having a satisfying conclusion to begin with.

I don't think a literal ending is the appeal, but it's something easy to vocalize as what you feel it is.
I don't think a kid picked up One Piece 30 years ago thinking how it's gonna end some day so it's worth reading. They want to see what the One Piece is and how it's going to be reached, but if there was going to be more story after that I don't think they'd see that as a negative anymore than it being a negative that there's more story after Goku and Bulma find the Dragon Balls for the first time.
What it really is more is a clean cut feel of progression and change, and a clear goal being worked towards in the story overall.
A lot of manga endings are more just step-off points. It's why arcs within a manga can feel like a comfortable enough place to stop reading for some people, especially if there's no overarching goal left.
Comics have arcs that end but there's always a feeling of setting more up for later and less time for breaks. Superhero characters rarely have a tangible overarching goal besides stopping crime, so it's harder to feel like somethings heading in any direction

>>153240320
Why can’t you just treat any single run by a specific writer as a conclusion?

>>153239192
I mean, it sounds like that's exactly what OP did. Fags just didn't like him saying it out loud.

>>153240432
Crying about needing endings for what has always been serialised fiction never intended to end is stupid no matter how you want to spin it

>>153240494
So is crying about people not finding that appealing.

>>153240346
I can, many readers can, but for a lot of people who are now used to action manga or modern prestige TV storytelling as a default for long running stories the feel isn't the same.
Ultimately the big thing is at the end of a writer's arc there's rarely a significant, permanent change that feels majorly different from before they started. They;ll add a character change a costume, maybe shake things up slightly, buit there's still a general status quo adhered to, where even if it's different it;s expected to gravitate back to.
You end a Batman run and he's still Batman, you talk about feeling his age and he's never going to be over 45 or so,
Even with Morrison bringing in Damian and "killing" Bruce, by the end Bruce is Batman again, just with a new Robin.
It's why adaptations can usually bump around events from the comic timeline. No Man's Land, conceptually, doesn't need to happen like 10+ years into Batman's career, the same events can happen earlier, because there's not really any difference into how Batman would approach it at either stage. Same with Bane breaking his back. His allies might be different, but the story beats can still be hit.
To use an example everyone knows, in Dragon Ball, by the end of an arc there's usually a significant enough change, even early on. Characters going and coming and befriending the main group, new skills, new levels of ability.

>>153240512
So is crying about people thinking you are stupid.

File: weet ik .jpg (29 KB, 640x480)

29 KB JPG

>>153240494
It's like how they attempted to turn James Bond into a serialized narrative, only for people to not care and be disappointed by the ending.
You can do finite superhero storytelling in movies and adaptations, but how many people consider these endings definitive?

>>153240545
So what. This is nothing but people overthinking and not being able just enjoy things

>>153240738
Unfortunately, those people are now your general audience.

>>153240738
Counterpoint: you can only continue to enjoy these things because you don't think, just consume.

>>153237505
>What does that leave for Miles to do besides be a pale imitation?
you mean a darker imitation.

>>153233767
True.

>>153233767
that's why manga sells so well. when your series has an end, stakes matter.

>>153240687
Even most super hero movies that do end have a THE BATTLE GOES ON kind of end. Frankly I don't think people know what an ending even is because shy of everyone dying there's always potential for a follow up and even a complete tragedy ending isn't absolute

>>153242743
Every manga ending sucks

File: images - 2026-04-15T101315.169.jpg (11 KB, 228x221)

11 KB JPG

>>153242743
Are you sure you want to discuss that?

>>153242817
An ending doesn't necessarily mean that no new stories can be told with these characters and world. All that matters is that THIS STORY definitely has an ending such that you could drop it here and feel like you have reached The Conclusion.

Like, Die Hard. Die Hard has what is unambiguously the ending of the story that it is telling. The day is saved, Hans Gruber falls off the building, John reconnects with his wife, and so on. No one pretends that this is not the ending of the story being told, and if you never watched another Die Hard movie in your life you wouldn't feel like you had missed out.
The fact that they made more Die Hard later on does not invalidate the ending of Die Hard. That ending is still 'complete'. We are not, in Die Hard 5, still going back to Nakatomi Plaza to fight Hans Gruber again as he comes up with *yet another* heist plan to steal the money, even more convoluted than the last one! The later Die Hard movies might share a character or two, but they are *different stories* that also have their own beginnings and endings.

Cape comics only very rarely have these, and those tend to be the story arcs that people like the most. The rest of the time the 'ending' of any given arc or issue or just a fuzzy blurring of the lines into the next thing thats happening with no real break point, and such endings are never conclusive because these plot points will just be rehashed and brought back within the next year anyway. The neverending format robs the ending of its power, because it can never actually be allowed to have any weight and the reader knows it.

>muh manga has endings
The majority of fucking comics have finite runs and endings. It's only capeshit that doesn't and that's because those are corporate owned IPs that will be kept alive as long as they're profitable.

>4chan is now telling me my posts haven't gone through because there was a connection error
>only for them to appear in the thread while I'm in the process of trying to post them again
Great. Guessing we're gonna see a lot of duplicate posts today.

>>153242886
Just about every writer's run in any given title for the past 20 years has had an ending. This criticism applies to a number of runs from the 20th century with a few exceptions, but not anything recent.

>>153242842
Absolutely not the case.

>>153239552
By your stupid logic, maybe.
When you have to use concepts like sliding timescales and reboots and rebirths, you fucked up hard.
>>153240308
>If you have something that was never intended to have any kind of overarching storyline
That's the fucking problem, isn't it?

>>153243567
>When you have to use concepts like sliding timescales and reboots and rebirths, you fucked up hard.
This is no problem whatsoever.
Golgo 13 is a popular long running manga with a sliding timeline. The original author died in 2021, but the manga is still going, as per his wishes, because he never wanted it to end.

>>153238414
>Yeah getting super shitty nothingburger endings with no real payoff
But enough about american comics.

>>153242886
If you consider Die Hard a complete story, then every arc is basically a complete story

>>153243598
Golgo 13 is the War Picture Library of manga.

>>153243840
It really isn't and you know it. Each arc is, at best, an episode. Sometimes not even that.

>>153234324
Arguing in bad faith will get you nowhere.
Or are you, maybe, really this fucking dumb?

>>153233796
Spawn

>>153243567
>That's the fucking problem, isn't it?

It’s not

File: 1748599341559251.jpg (166 KB, 627x1510)

166 KB JPG

>>153233767
not ending is just one of many problems when you get down to it. The stories, particularly the more contemporary stuff, aren't good either and endings wouldn't change that. That's compounded by the fact that they try to trick you into thinking stuff is actually developing which is 50:50 on what sticks but what usually sticks develops into worse shit which coalesces over the years until you reach a point where people like the x-men literally become 95% of the shit they used to fight against. The whole industry is in a weird place where the stuff isn't that good, there's no real reason to get invested, and even worse it often makes you feel like a jackass for ever caring or getting invested. That's like a suicide recipe especially with the endless other entertainment options, but I guess it'll continue until the last spiderfag or whatever runs out of tears

>>153243956
That's not bad faith that's just the truth. Chinatown is a great movie with a shitty sequel no one remembers. Does it's existence suddenly mean Chinatown doesn't have an ending of it's own?

>>153243968
It is, because there's too much of this shit.

>Comics used to be like sitcoms or soap operas.
>One and done stories but with overarching arcs or plots.
>A lot of media was like this and people got it fine.
>Many genre shows began to have monster of the week plots but would have season long arcs.
>Comics moved towards decompression.
>Stuff moved towards longer formed multi season arcs.
>The media pushed fear of missing out anxiety and all of a sudden people were jumping on to big shows left and right.
>Then some of those big shows massively flopped when their stories went to shit.
>Meanwhile many of the most watched shows on streaming are old sitcoms with one and done plots.

Do you want to know what the truth is? The true issue is the illusion of media "mattering". The meaning you find within something. Personally I feel as though older comics made stuff "matter" more even though they had many of the same issues of retarded changes for the sake of changes or same gimmicks all coming from the issues baked into the industry. I could just be biased. For me the difference is now we get shit like the multiplication effect of bigger stakes/bigger changes which push the artificial marketing of stuff "mattering" so hard at you that it feels disgusting. WHOLE MULTIVERSE WILL DIE. WHOLE CHARACTER IS TAKEN INTO A BOLD NEW DIRECTION. It is artificially telling me: THIS MATTERS. Whilst what mattered to me may have been that character, that side character, their relationship, moments. Not all this other stuff.

To an extent our enjoyment is expectations and the psychology of consumption. Nowadays we have too much choice (choice paralysis) whilst the mainstream offers the same trends (paradoxically little choice) and all of it is force fed to us as artificially mattering as "the next viral big thing, season long arc, get in at the ground floor" and many of us are burnt out so opt out.

tl;dr: the issue isn't so much that there is no real endings, the issue is we are all burnt out on being told what does or doesn't matter.

>>153236862
>>153244040

I could never really get into comics but I've been trying a lot in the past 2 years and whenever I tell people that I find it hard to get into they get mad. Had someone tell me I just dont like comics. They weren't even able to help me with any suggestions. Yeah I know I should pick out runs that look good and things that look cool. But I havent had any luck finding anything long running that hooked me yet. It's mostly one shots and miniseries and weird shit.

I dont think not having endings is the reason why entirely either. I grew up loving satueday morning cartoons and scifi that felt like they never ended. Sometimes I would just miss the ending. Sometimes they'd always be running in syndication and I just didnt care. Some just got cancelled and died before their time. Capeshit adaptations, Gerry Anderson Marionation, ReBoot, toy commercials, Scooby Doos, South Park all the Star Trek and Stargates and so much more. Also whatever the fuck Twin Peaks is. But comics? I just cant.

Theres also the fact through cultural osmosis I know of things like how agenda driven things are like FUCKING EVERYTHING ELSE. I'm a noticer. I noticed some things. One of the few comics I got into ended with someone sliding in an ancient Egyptian child sex change via Green Lantern magic. And that was just a miniseries. I dont want to see Paul. I dont want to see a million Spider diversity people. Ok sure I'll go read the old shit. That's what I'm doing. But research is kind of asking a lot for someone like me who could just read something else and it would be so much more satisfying if I could just read weekly issues. You also miss out on the social aspect of talking about it. I read the Incal and Concrete and and they amazing, but who the fuck is there to talk to about it? Some bald old and literal dead fucks on youtube is about all I can find. And like half the time they're all libtards too

File: e56979f3e534de37b3ddcce2b(...).jpg (375 KB, 1100x1700)

375 KB JPG

But Watchmen has a clear ending. And no prequels or sequels were ever made. No sir. None

Btw it's not hard to find comics that end. Pic related for example.

what about tmnt approach

>>153244301
Oh hey, I bought this from the comic book shop on the corner that used to be in my neighborhood back in 2015 with a girl I was walking home from school with. Man. I miss that comic book store, it turned into one of those "martial arts" schools for kids. I only ever read the first issue because robots are cool, is the rest worth looking at?

>>153244136
Just say you don't want to engage with it. It's not inherently bad just because you don't want to deal with it.

>Comics lost a lot of their appeal
Basically every complaint you can think of is something we all complained about in the past, heck even politics considering how preachy Marvel could be. The issue for me is simply that I'm apathetic towards this medium. I have seen all the tricks it can do. And as a form of entertainment it is too expensive whilst every other medium has simply gotten better, or more accessible, or more numerous, or cheaper.

So tell me, what is so positive about not having an actual ending? Like, yeah some good comics can be made with a never ending story but also (as history has shown us) alot of bad to terrible can be made along the way too

>>153245007
You can make good comics again sometimes without forcing the "ending" to be undone. Sometimes leaving things open is better.

>>153245007
It allows the ability to stop the story where you like, or have multiple possible endings. Batman already had a few possible endings by the 70s even before DKR. And I’m sure there’s people who prefer Batman Beyond as an ending. Some might even like TDKR’s ending.

>>153245007
>So tell me, what is so positive about not having an actual ending?

Short bursts of episodic entertainment that might keep some sense of continuity. This isn't complicated. You can read a Spider-man story line or a Justice League adventure or whatever and walk away thinking THAT WAS FUN on it's own merits. The point is entertainment. You read or engage with a hobby to be entertained. Not to justify it with some decades long payout that isn't even guaranteed.

>>153245130
>walk away thinking THAT WAS FUN on it's own merits
Lol nope. Episodic media is largely BORING.

>>153245190
Majority of people disagree.

>>153245007
nothing It's all just cope. Everything that can be accomplished by never ending could be better accomplished by segmented continuities

>>153243944
No, arcs definitely feel way too loaded to be episodes.

>>153245190
>Lol nope
retard.

>>153245289
Who is the "majority"?

Having endings is a bad thing.

>>153245398
The people who read old serialized fiction like Sherlock Holmes, Tarzan, John Carter of Mars, Conan, James Bond. People who watched network television for decades whether it's long-running daytime dramas or long-running police procedurals like Law & Order and its spinoffs and NCIS and its spin-offs.

>>153246039
So basically morons.

>>153246039
And how many of those things are popular among younger demographic?

>>153246039
>Tarzan, John Carter of Mars
These aren't good examples. Outside of the first three or so books of both every consecutive book was written like it could be the final one. And Sherlock Holmes has an ending anyway.

>>153246333
Doyle killed off Holmes and he got so many death threats and his own mother badgering him about it that he brought him back to life and left his story open-ended.

Let me translate: Good endings are not easily to pull off, so it takes a skilled or talented writer. People who want endings want good endings, so people who want endings want good writing. People who want to consume an IP indefinitely don't care about good writing as much as people who want a good ending.

>>153246928
>People who want to consume an IP indefinitely don't care about good writing as much as people who want a good ending.
Pretty much this

>>153246428
So no-ending fags are mentally ill.

>>153245398
Streaming viewing figures are dominated by sitcoms and older shows.

>>153246428
And then in the third collection ended Holmes story anyway. Even had a few time skip stories showing Holmes long after he stopped doing crime work. He ended it and it was fine.

>>153245007
I think most people you meet tell you "I like trying new things!" to appear open but it is an outright lie because most people are creatures of habit. People like the comfort of knowing and gettined used to things. Stories with no end are just using that universe or group of characters as a vehicle to tell various stories. Like procedural shows, sitcoms, soap operas etc. If we wanted to go further we could say that practically nothing is original, it is all an amalgamation of something. Life is a journey for most people rather than constant satisfying narrative ends and for people, seeing that continuing journey of situations is more satisfying than tying up things in neat bows that don't really exist irl.

>>153246333
So didn't Alan Quartermaine, doesn't mean he wasn't milked for all he was worth.

bump

File: 7090aa2ec79ad08d18f16a53f(...).jpg (142 KB, 585x900)

142 KB JPG

>>153244694
If you like scifi you'll probably like it. The art by skottie young is the real star though.
There's also a sequel series (Ascender) that deals with magic being added to the setting, which was hinted at in the first series.

>>153248512
>Skottie Young
I meant Dustin Nguyen

File: https:⁄⁄external-content.(...).jpg (289 KB, 988x1500)

289 KB JPG

>>153233767
>Comics lost a lot of their appeal when I realized that they would never have real endings for any of the characters.
Read more, either pic related or other comics, where multiple characters are either killed or effectively retired. But I will admit that such a fate will probably not befall an A Lister (Batman, Spider man, Thor)of the big two any time soon....

File: Martial Arts Comics.jpg (1020 KB, 1280x1830)

1020 KB JPG

>>153234248
>are there any american comics where the protagonist uses actual martial art?
Lots, but if we are being totally honest, Baki is about as realistic in it's depiction of actual martial arts as any superhero comic ever. As far as superhuman martial artists, characters like Blade, Wolverine or Daredevil come to mind, so maybe look into those, thanks.

>>153238594
You're not doing the one thing that would prove him wrong though.

>>153248739
The martial arts in The Question is horrible.

Because you are doing an immature and dishonest comparison with other mediums, such as manga or animation that are designed to have start and end. The closest thing you will get is Dragon ball and it will never have an ending now that the taboo of continuing past the original mangaka is broken.

You are supposed to enter capeshit at 6 years old and leave it at 15. Before it feels stale, before it feels repetitive, before you start seeing the patterns of editorial archetypes repeating plot points and events. The problem is that you didnt exit and continue your life. Superheroes are not meant to grow old with you, they are meant to be there forever for the kids and teenagers. In the same exact form and shape.

The issue its obviously that some adults didnt develop properly and couldnt leave it for the next generation of kids to enjoy, so they try to make it more "mature" (aka gore and hamfisted politics) but it simply fails. Its probably the only thing in which Moore is right. You are not supposed to read this as an adult. Of course they ship sailed and the industry is now prisoner of manchildren both writers and audience. Which means luckily that superheroes will die in our lifetime since the average comic book reader is 45 years old these days.

>>153235043
>the original Watchmen is made worse by Doomsday Clock and the HBO series.
Everything is canon upon themselves and once you get past the author's story, you are going into fan fiction.
That doesn't mean future stories can't be good stories, or even better stories than the original, but its not their story anymore once its not by them.
The author who created the story gets final say on what happens. The author of adaptions get final say on what happens in their version. Neither invalidates the other unless you don't know how stories work.

File: 1722575900849886.jpg (20 KB, 640x480)

20 KB JPG

>>153237990
>jackasses looking to rush something to completion so they can pad their lists.
Its this.
Some people just can't help something not being for them, either anymore or never in the first place. Its really hard for some people to move on.

>>153248528
It's pretty clear the people bitching about ENDINGS have quite honestly never actually read any comics at all

>>153249347
/co/ is infested with outrage tourists who have never read comics but come here to complain.

>>153245007
>but also (as history has shown us) alot of bad to terrible can be made along the way too

Having an ending doesn’t stop this from happening, you dimwitted dumbfuck.

>>153246333
>It doesn’t count because it had endless string of new endings each new instalment

Then they were never real endings now were they.

>>153243567
>That's the fucking problem, isn't it?
Why is it a problem other than simply because you don't like it? It's been a thing for as long as there have been sequels and nobody had a problem with it until recently.

>>153233767
>>153233796
Actually stop reading continuing story lines from creators that didn't even create the character (unless you really like the story). Like She Hulk ended a LONG time ago. SpiderMan probably ended with Romita. Batman ended with Dark Knight Returns.

>>153236862
I'm reading Police Comics from the Golden Age and it's crazy how much adventure and story they would give in like 8 pages per character.

Mangaka are the bitch of their editors. They don't plan shit out and either have to drop or extend stuff as their masters see fit.

>>153250232
The Dark Knight Returns doesn't work a satisfying ending to all prior Batman comics.

>>153249347
>>153249372
This.

File: image_2026-04-16_001433682.png (450 KB, 400x586)

450 KB PNG

>>153250232
>Batman ended with Dark Knight Returns.
That would actually be Detective Comics #228, the last one Bob Kane worked on.

>>153250243
And that was considered normal. I've read plenty of golden age comics online for free and it boggles my mind how much people are willing to overpay for new comics where very little actually happens and you can't just pick up a random issue to read without being dealing with a bunch of shared universe bullshit.

Honestly I think Final Crisis and Secret Wars (2015) work as perfect endings for DC and Marvel respectively. They honestly should have just shut down after publishing them because lets be honest nothing in the main lines since has really warranted them continuing, and it's not like anyones making money publishing comics anymore anyway. Should have just bowed out with dignity.

>>153250232
>Batman ended with Dark Knight Returns
I would call this a Redditor mindset, but it might be too normie even for that.

>>153250400
Reddit hates TDKR.

>>153250396
>durrrr no good comics have been produced in ten years

>>153250523
not what I said but go ahead.

>>153250405
Really? Why?

>>153250567
Partly because of Holy Terror and Miller's views on Occupy. Partly because they say it ruined Batman and Superman forever. Partly because they say the art is ugly and the writing is bad.

>>153249429
Yes it does, if you end it at the right before the quality starts to down

>>153250734
>Y-y-yes it is, y-y-you j-just stop b-b-be-before it goes b-b-bad!

LOL
M
A
O

>>153250749
Most people would agree that the Simpsons should ended at season 8 and the show would be alot respected for it

Superhero comics being endless makes them unique compared to most media. If you don't like the fundamental traits of the genre just don't read them. The is no shortage of stories with endings for you.

>>153250848
It makes them shit. It's not a fundamental feature, it's a massive flaw.

>>153251017
It's a fundamental feature whether you like it or not.

>>153250245
Sometimes you need a good editor to act as tard rengler for the writers, there are many cases of this in both Manga and American Comics.

>>153248090
He wrote 20 more Holmes stories after that "ending" and numerous other writers have written their own Sherlock Holmes stories, so the story of Holmes never actually came to a conclusion.

>>153250355
Doesn’t this issue end with Batman being deputized? I think I read it in a 70s reprint

File: serve.jpg (88 KB, 423x414)

88 KB JPG

>>153233796
fpbp
>>153233767
Read works by original creators (can even be done in Big 2) and stop when they leave. Read mini series, GNs, what ifs, anthologies. Ignore the endless corporate canon. Comic strips, European comics, independent comics. It's not that hard if you put a little effort in.

File: Hitman kids today.jpg (196 KB, 1074x620)

196 KB JPG

>>153234229
Hitman, baby!

>>153233767
It ends when you as the reader decide it's over.

File: RCO014.jpg (711 KB, 1123x1600)

711 KB JPG

>>153252247
Nope.

>>153250785
Yet it’s so popular that it keeps getting new seasons

>>153251340
It's a flaw. It's part of why comics are dying.

>>153235107
Lmao, no. Manga endings are notorious for being absolute shit or ending on a cliffhanger because the author quit/died
>Dragonball
>Beastars
>Attack on Titan
>My Hero academia
>Death Note
>Jojolion
>Chainsaw man
>Berserk
>HunterxHunter
>Vagabond
People buy manga more because it's easier to get into. Volume 1 of most manga costs between $8-$15 and you can easily buy it new. Volume 1 of most comics costs between $50-$500 and you have to buy it used from some sweaty nerd.

>>153254117
And that doesn’t even take into account when they release special new chapters or just decide to do endless sequels years later when no other series sells well

>>153253994
This page lists nearly 70 long-running and currently-ongoing manga, the earliest of which started in 1963 and the latest in 2014 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_manga_series_by_volume_count

>>153254703
A lot of those are completed.

File: RCO023.jpg (609 KB, 1041x1600)

609 KB JPG

The best ending is when the both versions of the self-insert gets the girl after getting cucked.
Truly romantic~

>>153255259
Stop this, Dan.

>>153255047
Irrelevant to the point.

>>153255047
>Bro, I only kept reading this manga forty years because I knew one day it would end!

Said nobody, ever.

>>153256457
No.
>>153256528
Correct. We know One Piece has an ending, just like we know Spider-Man will never end.

>>153256792
>We know Berserk has an ending
>We know HxH has an ending
>We know Vagabond has an ending
>We know Dragon Ball Super has an ending
Waiter, this copium you served is stale.

>>153256792
What if Oda dies to tomorrow? There is no guarantee there will be an end

File: 1772507838590772.png (390 KB, 762x342)

390 KB PNG

>>153257087
the world could be a nuclear hellscape tomorrow because shit happens. Doesn't change the fact that something like one piece is/was/has always been telling a story that builds on itself while having an ending destination in mind. Meanwhile something like spider-man, outside of atl universes, has been spinning its wheels for decades now while selling you development, progression, etc. just to justify Peter getting cucked or being a miserable sadsack or whatever all with absolutely no payoff besides readers seething

>>153257154
Ending cucks really are pathetic

>>153257087
>What if Oda dies to tomorrow
hideyoshi takes over

>>153257045
Yeah. Those first three are absolutely worth reading. The best kind of no-ending is the the death of the author no-ending. A series needs to built toward an ending regardless if one is actually delivered. Otherwise, you're working with permanent filler. Leave that for the braindead couch potatoes, pensioners, and waiting rooms of the world.

>>153257154
If One Piece had an ending in mind, why didn't it end 10 years ago? It's not some fucking high art, that damn comic is wanting to be longer than the encyclopedia britannica.

>>153258116
As if filler doesn’t exist with series that have an ending

>>153258479
because he/they didn't want it to end 10 years ago. It's like asking why a song of fire and ice (book game of thrones) is still going. You can argue with the decisions or length but it's all still setup and dheaded for a conclusion

Endings are for weak faggots.