>does literally nothing
Crazy thing about delts is that you can just do tren for 12 weeks
I like doing them like this, but can do only 1 side at a time
>>76865300>does literally nothingNot true, it gives you tennis elbow.>>76865470lol at photoshopping that and doing that bad of a job.
>>76865300Do more
>>76865300I do them diagonally
>>76865300I thk that pullups, especially where one rotates the torso slightly and pull the bar to clavicles, do more for middle delts than laterals. The movement is so heavy and the angle of pull is almost similar to a lateral that it works the rear and the middle delt synergistically and massively. Side delt raises are intersting. but such an unnatural movememnt to perform, whereas chinups and pullups are natural movements. Most people who can go great pullaups/chinups also have good shoulder development.
>>76865470How do I get the black tar to do these?
>>76865300try lowering the weight and fixing your form
>>76865300>replace them with wrist height cable lateral raises >does something
>>76866080Cable almost makes no difference. You just have a cable pulling your arm so you feel resistance even at the very start of the ROM when you wold feel no resistance with free weight because of it being parallel to gravity force.That's it.
>>76865300Probably because you're literally not progressively overloading the muscle.>>76866080Makes no difference but ok.>>76866028terrible idea. ego lifting is the best.
>>76865470yes this exactly. I do them leaning against the wall, arm outstretched for stability and get a massive ROM, as well as peak tension being in the stretched position.I do these and upright rows and my side delts have been exploding in size recently
>>76866110>>76866136>feel resistance even at the very start of the ROM when the muscle is most stretched>makes no difference
>>76866150>wow, if I do an exercise where I have to exert more force in order to complete the lift, I'll have better gains! never mind the fact that I could ...increase the weight I used for the other exercise to achieve the same thing.k
>>76866145>I do... upright rows
>>76866150It s the most stretched just because of how the lateral raise happen.Doesn t mean it is significantly stretched, in fact it is not, you just have an arm hanging down from your body, that is the natural resting position of the arm lol, it s not really "stretched".Yeah you can stretch it a bit more going behind your back but at that point you are also twisting the joints, the wrist, and it s not really that helpful anyway.Stretch makes grow in muscles that are not usually streteched, like in flys for the chest.Having the resistance starting early makes the exercise more efficient, but that s about it.It s not cable are magic lol, they are almost the same as dumbbells.
>>76866156Use two dumbells or a rope on a cable machine. rotate wrists into the semi-pronated (neutral) orientation. Now that you are in external rotation, you will no longer have the end of the humerus putting stress on the tendons
>>76866191>Having the resistance starting early makes the exercise more efficient, but that s about it.Myth unless you're doing slow dumbbelll raises for no reason. If you hang a 50lb dumbbell from the ceiling and kick it as hard as you can, it hurts. That's not gravity pushing back on your foot, it's inertia. Same thing.
>>76866156Shoulder impingement is genuinely a postural problem. I bench 3x a week, do upright rows every week and never have shoulder problems. I do lots of dumbbell pullovers, that's the secret.
>>76865470I do them like that but 2 sides at a time
>>76865300i got great results i hold onto something and do one side at a time.
>>76866191You can cross your arm across your body to get the muscle to a significantly stretched position with cables.
>>76866191>you just have an arm hanging down from your body, that is the natural resting position of the arm lol, it s not really "stretched".That's true only if you do them with a low pulley. If you use a hip/wrist height pulley, then the cable is pulling your arm laterally, so at the bottom portion it's not hanging at all. >It s not cable are magic lol, they are almost the same as dumbbells.They are not unless you do this >>76865470which creates the same advantage as the hip heigh cable lateral raise I described, ie high tension at the stretched position.
>>76865300Incorporate some form of overhead press into your weekly routine and you'll see a difference. If you're gigabased, you'll get into stuff like one hand overhead lifts, handstand pushups, Scott presses, or BTN presses, then just use lat raises as an accessory.
I've done lateral raises on and off for decades but never really noticed anything until recently. I started just doing them to absolute failure to where I can no longer raise my arm at all (as opposed to mere functional failure which is just no longer being able to complete a full rep). The first time I tried that, I only did three sets of them but I could actually feel my side delt was immensely sore the next day. It's a tiny ass muscle if you look at a diagram, and the soreness was in a very tiny spot right there in the middle, a place I'd never felt that before. Been doing that consistently for about two months now and I've gotten way stronger at the exercise (something that never seemed to happen before). Not sure on size difference yet as that's gonna be hard to tell anyway given how small that head of the muscle is, but we'll see.
>>76865300if it does nothing then why are my joints always sore for days after doing them?
ur an idiot. i do dropsets of these things, 3x12 at 30lbs, 20lbs, 10lbs, and there is absolutely a difference.eat more, get ur form right, and actually exert effort into your workouts, maggot.
OHP/Powersharters malding that they can't lift more than 8 pounds on a lateral raise because their triceps and front delts can't carry their shitty form with this exercise.
>>76866572Yeah with a hip height pulley there is a bit more stretch but still, it s not really that important because all of this "stretch thing" is on the arm passing behind your back/in front of your dick being pulled by the cable.As long as the delt is on top of a limb (the arm) which hangs from your body naturally in its rested position, having the arm slightly stretched because it is pulled in the opposite direction by a cable isn t as important for hypertrophy as it would be for other muscles like for example the biceps. Imo that s why stretch is important in incline vs regular curls from studies, but there is no evidence in cable vs dumbbell raises from studies.
>>76866209>a postural problemThe issue with upright rows with a barbell or two dumbbells in pronated grip is that the humerus is internally rotated. In internal rotation, the greater tubercle of the humerus rubs up against the at the Supraglenoid tubercle (just on the back of the scapula where the long head of the biceps originates) causing inflammation. Over time this inflammation can accumulate resulting in a potential biceps tears. People have torn their biceps this way. Whereas if the humerus is in external rotation (such as during a shoulder press), the greater tubercle does not rub against the tendon.There's only two options with the upright row. Fix the orientation of the humerus so that it's in external rotation. This can be done by rotating the wrist in semi-pronated position (neutral grip; the humerus follows as part of the chain) much like one would do for Liu raises to allow more range of motion. With dumbbells or a cable machine using the rope attachment, you can help stay in external rotation as both implements can allow for a much more natural divergence of the hands as.The other option is to not do it and stick to the standard shoulder press or lateral raises with slight external rotation. Most people will be better of just sticking to these two. If they have the genetics for big shoulders, they will get big shoulders. If not, then they will never have big shoulders regardless of what they do. >never have shoulder problemsThere of course always is a sub-population that is lucky and doesn't have problems. Most people are not part of that sub-population.
>>76865300For me I just grab a barbell, load it heavy, and push it over my head. The great thing is it works those muscles plus a lot of other ones, and you can overload it
>>76868597What's your take on monkey rows? I've seen them tossed around as alternatives to upright rows before, and they use a neutral grip.
>>76868597yeah if you just pop your elbows forwards while pulling your shoulder scapula backwards you create enough space between the humerus and supraglenoid turbercle to avoid this inflammation thobad technique will ruin any exercise. far more people ruin their shoulders by bench pressing than upright rows. it's simply that upright rows are immediately painful if you have bad posture, round (rolled forward) shoulders and terrible mobility
Tried doing leaning lateral raises instead, but everyone told me that my form was complete shit even after improving them, so I went back to normal lateral raises lol.
