>>77198637
No.
But sobriety is cooler.

>>77198637
No, they aren't as effective since caffeine increases endurance and decreases fatigue, but they can still help buffer lactic acid in your muscles and extend the duration of your workouts, as well as provide a mood lift. I find non-stimulant pre-workouts particularly helpful in my cardiovascular exercise regimen.

>>77198643
that’s a bummer. I work out in the evenings so can’t take caffeine since I won’t be able to sleep then. But I still like the energy boost :(

>>77198654
Ok

>>77198637
No not remotely. The only significant ingredient is the amount of caffeine and everything else is basically trash used to charge more.

>>77198654
Since that other anon replied in a disinterested manner, I am here to tell you I found your post very insightful / interesting and hope that you have a nice day.

>>77198654
I am here to tell you that I found your post moderately insightful/ interesting and that you have an average day

>>77198637
Non-stim PWOs are just Pump Powders
Pump Powders are fine.
Cialis is better.

Intra-Workouts are also highly underrated.
Like "Recovery" by Granite

>>77198654
I am here to tell you to extend your car's warranty

>>77198898
>Non-stim PWOs are just Pump Powders
not OP but also an evening lifter wondering about stim-free pwo, and that was kinda the impression i'm getting. and if so, i'm wondering if i should just buy some l-citrulline powder instead of a whole pre-workout, it would be a lot more cost-effective

>>77198637
I found it okay
t. lifted for a while at 8-9pm

>>77198637
>stimulant without stimulants
lmao

>>77198637
Physically; Yes. Caffeine is a vasoconstrictor, so it cucks your pump.
Mentally; No. In moderation caffeine and nicotine are near impossible to beat for OTC stimulants.
>>77198670
>L-citrulline does nothing
wut

>>77199062
depends if you like the other stuff like beta-alanine etc
my current pump formula is L-Citruline and Cialis

Sometimes I'll take some Collagen +L-Tyrosine with it too. My joints seem to like it

another tip is to avoid cardio at night
even when I just walk on the incline after my workout for 10 minutes it greatly impacts my sleep

>>77199238
what has worked best for me is honestly just having like 16-24 oz water between when i get home and when i go to bed. hydration is a cheat code, it took me way too long to realize this works kek. i'll do a couple minutes of box breathing and that brings my heartrate down significantly as well, it can linger in the 70s even a couple hours post-workout and that brings it down to the 60s for me

Instead of 8hrs of sleep i need a chemical to do anything difficult :)

>>77199180
>misrepresenting things deliberately

>>77198637
They're better if you don't factor in the caffeine component, however the caffeine component is a huge deal. People who say non-stim pre-workouts are useless are lying, they do work just don't expect them to be the same as regular pre-workout.

I use non-stim because I'm an evening lifter and the amount of caffeine they put into pre-workout is obscene. I rather just have a cup of coffee + non-stim and that's good enough for me.

>>77198898
Basically this.

>>77199257
An underrated part of pre-workout is that the amount of water you drink with it. Niggas need fruity loop lolly pop to drink fucking water these days so do what you gotta.

>>77199790
Based hydration proponent

>>77198637
Just drink your stim-full PWO at 2 PM so you can lift 5-6 hours later and still be good to sleepmax by 11 pm

>>77200301

there's this thing called half life.. if you only want stim, just drink coffee or take energy drink.. taking a pre that's already rip off for what it is for nothing is an extra rip off.

>>77201209
>caffeine from any other source has a shorter half-life than caffeine from a pre-workout
Explain why you think this.

>>77199257
yeah big true i always gotta chug some cold water before bed
im a big dude so 48 oz right after the gym, then another 48+ oz when I get home is what i need
dehydrations gives you insomnia

>>77201553
It doesn't make you wake up to pee?

>>77201507

when i said half life and pwo being rip-offs, think of the ingredients in the pwo that inflate its price.. those don't last long enough and if the sole goal is to stay alert, it's smarter to spend less money and get caffeine or other stim. you didn't do well in school, did you?

>>77198637
i dont waste money on grifter kike bullshit i mog you, but keep listening to your jew overlord

>>77198639
>sobriety
You are one of those obnoxious faggots that think drinking coffee is the same as shooting heroin, aren't you?

>>77202078
Yes, it appears so.

Two days a week:
Two scoops ON Advanced Pre
(The above contains 10g of creatine and 600 mg of caffeine)
5g TMG

Five days a week:
10g creatine
5g TMG
8g L Cit

Caffeine is by far the most effective pre but other things do have a minor but measurable effect.

I personally don't like caffeine daily so I save it for my back days.

>>77198654
well they are not as effective, but they are still pretty effective, just get a good one and see for yourself

>>77198637
No

>>77198639
what an unbelievably gay thing to say. There's people with real problems you faggot.
>muh caffeine, muh struggle

>>77201209
I'm the guy you're talking to originally. I just need a little motivation and not to be dead tired when I get back from work, so the half life works well for me and energy drinks/coffee don't have the same effect for me with equivalent caffeine.

>>77202125
name one problem

>>77198637
for that inflated price no
just buy vitamin b and electrolytes separately

>>77198670
Stupid and poorly informed take.

>>77202276
electrolyte powders and vitamins aren't cheap, i doubt it's cheaper going that route

>>77202392
i checked before posting and it's cheaper, at least it is in my country

>>77202392
I just order bulk from china