>We adopted Rust for its security and are seeing a 1000x reduction in memory safety vulnerability density compared to Android's C and C++ code. But the biggest surprise was Rust's impact on software delivery," Google's Jeff Vander Stoep said. "With Rust changes having a 4x lower rollback rate and spending 25% less time in code review, the safer path is now also the faster one

https://security.googleblog.com/2025/11/rust-in-android-move-fast-fix-things.html

>The development comes a little over a year after the tech giant [Google] disclosed that its transition to Rust led to a decline in memory safety vulnerabilities from 223 in 2019 to less than 50 in 2024.

>The company pointed out that Rust code requires fewer revisions, necessitating about 20% fewer revisions than their C++ counterparts, and has contributed to a decreased rollback rate, thereby improving overall development throughput.

https://thehackernews.com/2025/11/rust-adoption-drives-android-memory.html

>>107859158
Who would have thought that fewer foot-shootings would increase productivity?

>>107859092
Isn't it all open source? If you think something is hidden in there, (you) could be the one to find and expose it.

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>>107859158
So beyond the gay propaganda statistics that comes purely from incompetent jeets who don't juggle memory safely, I am assuming there's something in the garbage collection or other automated parts of the Rust code that gives globohomo some kind of master control or backdoor they don't have in the freedom and transparency of Zig or C. Notice how all odin or zig users are labelled nazis by the rust cult

>>107859240
Let's assume that theory is real, why would zig be any different?

>>107859092
Licensing.

>>107859240
This is what happens when you swap your brain for memes
Have you ever tried to actually form a technical argument?

>>107859479
Literally no one cared about compiler/language license as long as it's FOSS.

> "Wow look! Programming language number №3975624!! This one will defintely replace the industry standard C/C++ this time!!!"
> doesn't even have a standard
> only one compiler, the official one
> is basically C++ with built in CppCheck
> despite everything, still has memory bugs and is therefore worthless
> the cargo package manager uses lots of cpu doing almost nothing
> only still around because of the hype and people rewriting perfectly good software in it and forcing those half baked reimplementations into ubuntu
I'll give it 5 years.

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>>107859519
>>despite everything, still has memory bugs and is therefore worthless
Yeah, and modern medicine is also worthless because luckily one day some fentnigger will run you over after passing out in his car while speeding, thank God the doctor will be able to save the nigger but not you.

>>107859158
>spending 25% less time in code review,
aka no one understands it

>>107859092
>Why is globohomo pushing this to be industry standard so hard? What's hidden in it
They were pushing C and C++ to replace everything. Rust came from the programmers themselves. C and C++ are like eating shit. Rust is like eating a steak. They'll never go back to C or C++ after that.

>>107859799
Some of us who aren't underage K&R babyducks also remember the shitshow that was writing and compiling C code before Stallman said enough is enough and wrote a proper C compiler.
Yes, the same one whose team recently said enough is enough and rewrote it in C++. Now they're working on Rust frontend and guess what comes after that.

>>107859519
Imagine living under a rock.

>>107859519
> "Wow look! Programming language number №3975624!! This one will defintely replace the industry standard FORTRAN this time!!!"
> doesn't even have a standard
> only one compiler, the official one
> is basically Pascal with built in pointer arithmetic
> despite everything, still has memory bugs and is therefore worthless
> the preprocessor uses lots of cpu doing almost nothing
> only still around because of the hype and people rewriting perfectly good software in it and forcing those half baked reimplementations into Unix
I'll give it 5 years.

>>107859471
>>107859480
Yeah I'm just struggling to understand why the globohomo German/EU government is paying Arch Linux to put Rust into its package management

https://youtu.be/t405xcU913c

>>107859092
Because it's superior. Not everyone is a smelly brown who is fascinated with smelly brown things.

>>107859816
>and guess what comes after that
I don't know? What comes after Rust?

>>107860054
how did UNIX get away with this?

>>107860054
Comparing then vs now is crazy. It's like comparing Internet Explorer in the 90s vs comparing Chromium today. The time when a competitor could change everything is long gone. C++ won, just like Chromium won.

>>107860314
...and yet chromium just merged a JPEG-XL parser written in Rust.
makes you think.

>>107860295
It used C which enabled even most retarded faggots to pretend like they're good programmers.
See: justification for SIGPIPE existing.

>>107859092
google, microsoft, mozilla, hauwei, amazon and others were given seats on the rust foundation board. they have much involved in shilling is abysmal trash despite rarely using it themselves, which is pretty ironic.

>>107859158
i can write tests all day that makes C64's BASIC look like it's selinux, so of course google will make all kinds of wild claims with no evidence to support any of it.

grug hate new thing

>>107860359
>comparing a programming language with a LSM implementing MAC
anon, you might not be as smart as you think you are....

>>107860335
including 0.1% of rust into chromium doesn't mean rust is the winner

>>107859222
Ok, NSA.

FOSS is a lot better for security than closed source but that's not saying much.

>>107860379
lmao, seething delusional tranny. holy shit. imagine getting buttfucked in one reply and posting this cope.

>>107860360
>new
>First appeared: January 19, 2012; 13 years ago
>new
it's amazing how this board's collective of sex offenders just keep losing every single day. 13 years and what do we have to show for it? oh yeah, the occasional tool in windows replaced with rust, some libraries on android, bindings in linux for programming kernel modules and hundreds of tools that were originally in another language that worked just fine ported over for no real benefit whatsoever.

it's no wonder rust trannies keep having severe mental breakdowns.

>>107860377
>delusional pedophile can't cope
what a loser lmao

>>107860390
and you? an angry subjective answer dodging the question is the real cope.

>>107860396
SELinux and Commodore 64 BASIC are not even in the same value category, you absolute brainlet.

>>107859222
it's the same thought killing retardation that systemd haters have been saying forever.
>B-BUT THEORETICAL BACKDOORS
you learn to realize, people who hate thing are probably schizo or just incredibly low IQ.

>>107860396
You're just jelly rust managed to ram its fat feminine cock where nobody else could.

>>107860409
that's right. i could write up all kinds of fantasy tests that prove it's as secure as selinux. i don't need actual evidence for this. my word is all that matters. much like how this board's collective of absolute fucking losers read google's slop and take it at face value, a corporation that is more than happy to compromise their own software on behalf of american government. you're a fucking moron.

>>107860422
>13 years
>gone nowhere
embarrassing

>>107859092
ngl now that I've used rust I hate c++. I would still prefer C if working with raw pointers tho

>>107860429
>all kinds of fantasy tests that prove it's as secure as selinux
keep digging that hole, brainlet.
SELinux has nothing to do with programming language safety in the slightest, you absolute fucking retard. it's a MAC

>>107860267
>because it is superior
Not really, just gives less control

>>107860429
>gone nowhere
>fucked the linux kernel into submission
>plowed straight into wangblows
>molested android 'til it liked it
>gone nowhere
You're next twinkboi, rust is cooming for you.

>>107859092
>Why is globohomo pushing this to be industry standard so hard?
rust is growing but C and C++ are growing too, in fact C and C++ grow by more than the entire rust userbase per year, both languages are here to stay even if open flop software troons out more and moer each year.
don't let rustroons trick you, C and C++ have more LOC than every other languages combined and both will outlive us all.

>>107860286
Obviously ATS 4... which is safer and more flexible than Rust, but emits C code so you can have plain C as your "unsafe". Everyone knows Rust unsafe is harder to do right and less documented than C.

>>107860449
>less control
based on what, retard?
Rust is a turing complete language with inline asm and arbitrary pointer ops. there is nothing you can't do in Rust that isn't also a limit in C++.

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>>107860419
gigaglow

>>107859092
If I had to think of a legit answer, it is that the borrow checking system makes vibe coding more viable. I don't personally like rust but it is safer OOTB and rust-style errors are superior to exceptions when AI is writing half of the code. It seems like companies are racing to axe as many developer as possible, as soon as possible and porting things to rust will make that more feasible as you won't have to (theoretically) pay as many devs to maintain the codebase.

>>107859479
Also, this

>>107860481
>but emits C code
That's what toy languages do. It's worse than compiling to JavaScript because at least that has the purpose of running in a browser. Compiling to C means they don't know how to write a real compiler, and real compilers can be tiny like Turbo Pascal and old FORTRAN compilers.

>>107860481
this is just like the Ada cucks.
>just use my meme language with no users
at least I'm using rust code right now to post this post or to find strings in my text with ripgrep or the fish shell and a bunch of other shit. none of you meme lang faggots have anything useful to show.

>>107860252
>Yeah I'm just struggling to understand why
Have you tried actually doing research on the topic instead of listening to random e-celebs?

Sovereign Tech Fund makes it very clear what they do. It's a fund project that you can apply to if you are working on any public, FOSS, infrastructure related projects. 200 or so different projects got funds from them.
Instead of wasting 13min to watch watered down content of a literal jew, just do one minute Google search.
https://www.sovereign.tech/programs/fund#criteria

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>>107859092
>>107860252

The future of personal computing is Rust and Linux, everything else is going to the feed the cloud

>>107860419
yes, talk about deliberate backdoors without evidence is schizo (or more often FUD/bait/retardation). but the systemd package spams SIXTY TWO binaries and counting. it suffers from endless mission creep and expanding attack surface. beyond the "bare" security argument, there is a lot to say about both the details of the "design", and the implementation. but i digress.

<r*ddit spacing>

rust actually helps reducing the complexity tax through both sound abstractions and provably reliable checks, while still being practically usable.

<r*ddit spacing>

you're basically doing the same thing retards do, retardingly grouping things like rust, systemd, wayland, ....etc, where there is no relation at all.

<r*ddit spacing>

taking a different position from the retards against the "group", doesn't make believing in the existence of the "group" any less retarded.

>>107860359
>google, microsoft, mozilla, hauwei, amazon and others were given seats on the rust foundation board. they have much involved in shilling is abysmal trash despite rarely using it themselves, which is pretty ironic.
Now check who is sitting in C++ committee and who contributes to Linux.

>>107860605
the industry standard doesn't need to outright purchase users, unlike rust.

>>107860396
>13 years and what do we have to show for it?
It managed to do what even C++ couldn't. It got into Linux.
Do you remember how many times C++ was suggested there? I stopped counting decades ago.

>>107860456
>rust is growing but C and C++ are growing too, in fact C and C++ grow by more than the entire rust userbase per year
[citation needed]

>>107860515
>If I had to think of a legit answer, it is that the borrow checking system makes vibe coding more viable
No? LLMs are notoriously bad at generating Rust code. Borrow checker is one of the reasons for that.

>>107860631
https://www.cppreference.com/

>>107860614
Neither a standard not a language can purchase users.

>>107860642
This link does not support your claim. It provides no data on growth of any of the languages you've mentioned.

>>107860637
They will likely get better with time though. IMO, rust is fundamentally more suited to vibe coding for the aforementioned safety reasons.

>>107860643
https://youtu.be/t405xcU913c

>>107860614
>your company replaces your computer with UNIX because they fell for the hype
>that version of UNIX only has a C compiler
>you have to learn C to write programs on UNIX
>BUT RUST IS THE ONE PURCHASING USERS
So what's the OS where Rust is the only available language?

>>107860666
No Satan you don't get it — it's fine when WE do it.

>>107860666
>>107860314

>>107860604
>but the systemd package spams SIXTY TWO binaries and counting.
shut the fuck up. holy shit.
you "people" if you can even be called that, are delusional trannies who were too young to know what Linux was like pre-systemd. those binaries are there for legitimate reasons. You don't know shit and are retarded.

>>107860652
if you can't use websites, here saar
https://www.cppreference.com/w/cpp/26.html

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>>107860666
>So what's the OS where Rust is the only available language?

You tell us, Satan. Your devs have an attrition rate higher than 40%.

>>107859092
Maybe they think the safety stuff is a good idea.

>>107860054
>i'm a newfag to computing history
Hello newfag, the only reason C got popular is because UNIX got popular and everything useful for Unix had to be written in C.

The reason UNIX was popular was that it was probably the first and only multiuser operating system that universities could get for free.

>>107860679
>>107860335

>what's hidden in it
A useful and easy static type system and memory safety without a gc by default. That's basically all there is to it.

>>107860718
>multiuser operating system that universities could get for free.
this is the reason honestly. AT&T couldn't legally compete in the space do to laws and whatever consent agreements, so basically we got poisoned with worse-is-better.

>>107860718
>The reason UNIX was popular was that it was probably the first and only multiuser operating system that universities could get for free.
They used to write their own which was an important part of university research.

>>107860718
Get the kids hooked on drugs and shitty software in school in order to play the long game.

It's an excuse to rewrite everything under a license that big corps can use. FOSS as free labor. Donate a few grand a year, or attach a single paid programmer to a large project, and you're basically done for about 10% of the cost of writing proprietary shit in-house. It's all about the money. It's no wonder Microsoft made a 180 degree shift to this shit.

>>107860764
rules for thee but not for rust?

>>107859240
what a cute rustbunny, of course I'll let you into my distro what would go wro-

>>107860769
>It's an excuse to rewrite everything under a license that big corps can use. FOSS as free labor.
That's what BSD is. Rust isn't connected to any license. The license of the compiler isn't related to the license of the software.

>>107860771
Obviously, pull up the ladder before they can do the same!

The fact is PYTHON is the language of the straight WHITE man.
All other languages are for trannies, browns, shitters, jeets, chuds, incles, and techlets.
Python is all you need

>>107860771
Academia is responsible for the propagation of shit software and tools. Get hooked on it in school and use it in industry.

>>107860798
>we're removing goto because we think YOU aren't compenent enough to use it!
meme lang

>>107860657
No, they won't. Same thing applies to Haskell despite it being much longer around.
The problem is that LLM probabilistic nature does not function well in rigid, formal areas like Rust. Even state of art AI dedicated to solve maths need to work in tandem with external deductive/algebraic reasoning systems because they just make so much mistakes.

If you still believe that "the industry" is pushing for a language because of some futuristic AI might make it easier to automate it then you must be special kind of schizo. IT companies can hardly think one year ahead in the future and if you believe they just band together to do something that will only materialize in maybe a decade without any guarantee it will even bring them any profit and not their competition theb you are just being delusional.

>>107860660
Buy an ad, jewduke.

>>107860808
White men don't need goto. goto is for trannies, browns, shitters, jeets, chuds, incles, and techlets

>>107860815
is lunduke in the same room as us right now?

>>107860693
This link does not support your claim. It provides no data on growth of any of the languages you've mentioned.

>>107860820
then why aren't you writing an operating system in python?

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>>107859158
>>107859199
>>107859222
>>107859692

>>107860825
News flash! A parrot learned the sentence
"This link does not support your claim. It provides no data on growth of any of the languages you've mentioned."
and is now the smartest alive!

>>107859092
I don't know, I had to chose which language to learn between Rust and JS, I took JS because it's cooler and more fun

>>107860822
He is certainly in this thread considering like 3 links to his YouTube channel despite no one asking.

>>107860840
Not an argument

>>107860828
Straight white men don't need an OS. We can run the python scripts in our heads.
OS's are for trannies, browns, shitters, jeets, chuds, incles, and techlets

>>107860838
This image really doesn't do you a favor.

>>107860851
go ragebait on reddit.

>>107859092
Gotta love how there's finally a language that produces fast binaries that use little memory - exactly what people on /g/ have been asking for forever because "oh noes, this electron app takes 200 MB of RAM, how will my computer ever survive this" and /g/ finds a way to get mad at it anway.

>NOOOO it makes it muh EASY to produce fast, native binariiiinos! You have to suffer!!!! Using a good compiler can tell when you're doing it wrong it CHEATING!!!

>>107859158
But /pol/ told me rust bad. I don't know what a code is.

>>107860881
we had a tool for that, it's called Valgring and CppCheck. apparently we need a whole new programming language because the users are manchildren.

>>107860895
It turns out that even enabling every single warning in the compiler and using valshit is still not enough to avoid memory related errors.
All those lifetime annotations and ownership rules in Rust's type system exist for a reason. C(++) lack them and without them, static or dynamic analysis can't help you outside very trivial, obvious mistakes.

>>107860847
JS is definitely more fun. It's one of the nicest languages out of all the dozen or two I've tried.
It mostly comes down to the tooling. Many people seethe over webdev tooling being overly complex and constantly changing, but once you get a grip on it, it's one of the most comfy environments out there. You get anything you want with one npm command, you get all the safety and crazy type level stuff with typescript, you get nice HTML mixins with React, you can relax making some pretty to look at things using CSS, and most importantly, you get immediate visual feedback with hot module replacement. It's a really comfy developer environment.
Rust definitely departs from C/C++ by going in that direction with Cargo, functional programming and modern features, but it's a systems programming so it's not as simple, flexible and pretty as webdev.

>>107860906
we already have enough programs written in Chromium.

>>107860881
I think it's the same as raging AI haters. They feel their shitty lot in life is being rugged. Now that being said, AI is shit, which is why I'm not worried, but I can see C++ sissies having a melty their worthless knowledge is on the edge of obsolescence, especially since so much shitty software is made in C and C++.

>>107860881
Because it was supposed to be dead simple as C(or the cope dialect of C++ aka C with classes) so any midwit can use it.
Who would have expected that if you want to be both safe and fast you need to solve some very hard problems first.

>>107860895
There is a reason why even Ada is now adding explicit lifetimes. Many things just can't be checked without explicitly stated bounds and relations.

>>107860688
>am a totally oldtimer and you younglings just don't remember how bad it was before systemd-home-fallback-shell
does this count as working bait in a /g/eet's mind lol

>>107860918
Yeah. Just keep JS for webdev and maybe PWA. Electron is cancer.

>>107860945
>Electron is cancer.
why? show me a cross platform toolkit, that has all the retarded "accessibility" tooling required for meme laws that can make builds for every major OS with at least 1% of users.

>>107860964
how is the ram shortage treating you?

>>107860974
Mem: 64005

???

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>>107859092
They/them hate freedom, that is why they are pushing a bureaucratic turd into the mouths of the willing.

>>107861029
>that is why they are pushing a bureaucratic turd into the mouths of the willing.
Bureaucratic turd is a great way to describe C++.

>>107861050
then why won't you uninstall everything written in C++?

>>107861029
Rust is FOSS wtf are you talking about retard

>>107861029
>that pic
reminds me of that Marine F-35B that got lost because the pilot freaked out when his HUD bugged out when switching to STOL mode from normal flight and it got worse when he put it back into regular flight.
C++ is a shit language that not even the most stringent QA can prevent basic bugs.

>>107861112
Then how is C++ the industry standard for 30 years now? It will outlive Rust just like the other "C++ killers" that nobody doesn't even remember.

>>107861112
>lockheed martin
>stringent QA
kek

>>107861118
Baby duck and sunken cost. That's it.
>>107861121
The irony is it was probably some Collins thing.

>>107861118
Which industry?
From what I can see everybody but games are using Javascript or Java, or they use C if they're doing low level systems stuff.

>>107861112
anyone 'member the Alaska story? didn't the software wagies have a conference call with the pilot before he ended up ditching it?

>>107861155
Windows, Linux, Git, Unreal Engine... (99+ more)

>>107859158
It only took Clownflare to rewrite their core in Rust to start having outages that never happened before with C++.

>>107859199
It depends on what you're trying to implement. Some things are near impossible to express in safe Rust. For example a simple mark and sweep garbage collector is very hard, if not impossible to do in safe Rust and unsafe Rust is a fucking mess you don't really want to touch if you can get away with it.

> is called "Rust"
> breaks systems
It's like some kind of self-fulfilling prophecy.

>>107861050
There is nothing bureaucratic in C++, you can't even tell the difference between Java and C++.
>>107861108
No, is not. Government sponsored malware doesn't count as free software.
>>107861112
Not my problem. Rewrite the F35 code in rust if you believe that will fix anything.

>>107861282
>There is nothing bureaucratic in C++
>standards committees that take years to do anything and compromise on features to make ones that don't solve the problem they were meant to solve are not bureaucratic

>Not my problem. Rewrite the F35 code in rust if you believe that will fix anything.
Not him, but the predecessors of the F35 all used Ada. The fiasco only started when they switched from Ada to C++ because they wanted cheaper programmers.

>>107859158
How do you test for vulnerabilities you haven't found? If they could do that, couldn't they just put "free" into the place their tools are telling them they have a memory problem?

>>107861240
>is very hard, if not impossible to do in safe Rust
That's a red flag. Are you *absolutely* sure you want to shoot yourself in the foot?
If you absolutely positively have to do unsafe stuff, then do so. That's what 'unsafe' is there for. Or write it in C and make a rusty interface wrapper using FFI.

I don't quite see how what you're saying relates to the post you replied to. It's not like plain 'safe' Rust is absolutely safe and babby-proof and you can do no wrong. You as a programmer are still responsible for the correctness of the program you're writing. Rust just makes it harder for you to shoot yourself in the foot accidentally, compared to C/C++. Fewer interruptions for trips to the emergency room means more time for productivity.

>>107861282
>Government sponsored malware doesn't count as free software.
Don't use Unix, C, the internet and pretty much everything made in the past hundred years if you don't want "government sponsored malware" then you retard

>>107859158
If they can accurately determine "memory safety vulnerability density" why aren't they just patching the fucking C code?

>>107861386
Ctrannies when builders want to use steel instead of cardboard:
>If they can accurately determine "holes in cardboard" why aren't they just patching the fucking cardboard?

>>107861386
I don't think you understand the word "density". And in that case you probably don't understand any of the other words you're using either.

>>107861411
d=m/v

>>107861364
>>107861386
>With roughly 5 million lines of Rust in the Android platform and one potential memory safety vulnerability found (and fixed pre-release), our estimated vulnerability density for Rust is 0.2 vuln per 1 million lines (MLOC).

>Our historical data for C and C++ shows a density of closer to 1,000 memory safety vulnerabilities per MLOC. Our Rust code is currently tracking at a density orders of magnitude lower: a more than 1000x reduction.

>>107861417
>Our statistical fallacies and cherry-picking favor our biased hypothesis!
Wow.

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>>107861416

>>107861366
My point is that you don't get to use Rust and just ignore all the footguns that comes with manually managing memory, it does nothing but get in the way when you step outside the bounds of what it deems safe. If you're doing things like language development then it offers next to nothing over C/C++ and doesn't save you any time or increase productivity so the statement Rust just saves time and effort is false. It can add to mental overhead in the worst cases because unsafe Rust doesn't take the condom off, it just pokes holes in it thus providing friction for no discernible benefit.

>>107861436
The problem is that 'm' is an unknown in this equation.

>>107861430
where do you coping cucks come from? trooncord? It's pretty obvious if you ship out code and get less turnbacks, it's better. period. They ship shit in Rust and get less security related turnbacks. there is no statistical trick here other than primordial truth. Rust won.

>>107861443
>rust
>footguns
you're confusing C with Rust anon.

>>107861452
It's a fallacy to say you found out the density when it's impossible to know the mass, yes.

>>107859092
obsolescence, it doesn't work on anything below windows 10 like most modern slopware coming out

>>107861453
>1000x reduction in memory safety vulnerability density compared to Android's C and C++ code
1000x is a made-up stat

>>107861443
>My point is that you don't get to use Rust and just ignore all the footguns that comes with manually managing memory,
You don't get to ignore them, Rust just won't let you fire many of them, without taking off the safety.
>it does nothing but get in the way when you step outside the bounds of what it deems safe
That's what a safety does.
>If you're doing things like language development then it offers next to nothing over C/C++
Fair enough. For certain subfields of language development, but I take your meaning.

>>107861523
no, it isn't. read the article retard.
> Our historical data for C and C++ shows a density of closer to 1,000 memory safety vulnerabilities per MLOC. Our Rust code is currently tracking at a density orders of magnitude lower: a more than 1000x reduction.
rust has 0.2 per MLOC, C, C++ has much more and if you round the rust case up to 1, it's an accurate statement.

>>107859199
>foot-shootings
head bobbings, saar!
But in all seriousness Rust is good for you.

Microjeet:
>one engineer, 1 million lines of code a month with ai
Googly-eyed jeet:
>1000x decrease in memory safety vulnerabilities we haven't found yet.

>>107861547
>it has to be heckin AI
not everyone is a neet who only worked on small shitty replaceable codebases.

>>107861557
This is just a complete nonsense statement. It has to make sense to be a sentence, nigger.

>>107860604
"It's big" is not fucking evidence, you stupid retard

>>107861572
your sentence is pure retardation and cope. Google utterly btfo you and you're bending over backwards to disprove it. just admit you lost lil bro. you're out of your depth.

>>107860604
You can't abstract away the complexity tax. You're just specializing the knowledge of how the language actually works behind all of the retard shit to some guy who gets paid more than you to figure out the ass-backwards way to do shit right in your gay language.

>>107861443
Sure, if you're developing some ultra niche stuff where you'd have to only deal with unsafe Rust then picking Rust might not be the best option. But that's not 99.9% of software development. What you're saying might be true but outside of those very niche use cases it's not at all relevant.

>>107861574
I never understood this cope either, Windows is fuckhuge, X.org is fuckhuge, Chrome/Firefox are FUCK HUGE, hell the Linux kernel is fuckhuge, yet people only scream about MUH BACKDOORS MUH SCOPE CREEP when people fucking talk about systemd. it's literally so fucking plainly retarded, yet people STILL do it.

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>>107859092
>>107859479
This. Globohomo wants to get rid of GPL so they can get their grubby hands on cuck-licensed software (Rust-trannies do it for free and push MIT or other cuck licenses at every opportunity)
The unnecessary rewrites for "safer code" are just an excuse to change the license

>>107861575
Google is run by the 14 eyes and will tell any lie to spread Rust if it will benefit American Imperialism. It has nothing to do with code quality.

>>107859092
Because it has more annoying fags than the usual language

>>107861634
I'd steer clear of the "just" language. They probably have other goals.

>>107860954
This. Trusting (((jewgle))) of all places is almost as bad as trusting that kike cocksucker running closed ai.

>>107859158
>>107859092
The only good argument for Rust that I've seen is
>yes, the competence crisis is real, devs are ass now, do you actually trust them with C/C++?
Fair enough, it's a language for retards, exactly what we need and deserve. I just wish it wasn't such a shitty, ugly language.

>>107860762
>reinventing the wheel was important part of research

>>107859092
it's practically unvettable, so any backdoor the glowniggers insert is unlikely to be found

>>107860386
the standard FOSS model is an open door for malicious actors to "contribute". and as demonstrated with heartbleed, even the most safety-critical software is insufficiently vetted.

>>107859158
android chokes and stutters and it's only getting worse with every edition. it's going to be dead soon.

>>107860582
so do they openly state that they're run by the cia or is the chernobyl-tier radiance just assumed to say enough?

>>107861634
BSD and Plan 9 people do that by writing in C. Rust actually is about safer code.

>>107861772
That's why they had operating systems like Genera and object-oriented and capability-based computers instead of cloning a bad OS from 1970. Why do you even use a computer when you can do the same thing by paying someone to use an abacus?
http://lispm.de/genera-concepts

>>107861803
Neither is GCC or LLVM. Not an argument.

>>107860964
>why?
Because it's slow and bloated. All the electron apps I use, use stupid amount of ram and often CPU.
If you want to use web utilities, just make a web app. Make it into a PWA if you want more native program feel. At least this way you will be able to share browser bloat across all the apps running instead of spawning dozen instances of the same for each electron app.

>show me a cross platform toolkit, that has all the retarded "accessibility" tooling required for meme laws that can make builds for every major OS with at least 1% of users.
Qt

>>107861118
>Then how is C++ the industry standard for 30 years now?
Maybe you have been living under the rock, but pretty much every IT corporation is using Rust right now.
Rust is the first alternative to C++ that actually brings enough new things to the table to justify taking a look at it. There is a reason why it landed in Linux, while C++ and its copycats never managed to do it.

>>107861186
>Clownflare never had outages with C++.
You must be at least 18 years old to post on 4chan.

>>107861240
You are missing the point of Rust and any static analysis in general.
The point is not to never use unsafe. The point is to write safe abstractions over unsafe code.
Every safe programming language is going to have it's runtime or stdlib written using semantics that are not available in that language. Hell, even C/C++ has parts of its stdlib and runtime(yes C has runtime) written in assembly because they do things that are not possible to express in C/C++.

>>107861707
>it's a language for retards
the opossite actually, this is why so few people understand it and it requires more brain power to write

>>107862059
>Qt
Unemployed detected. What happens on Qt, is you get stuck on a major release for years.
Either way you're probably talking about qml which is just a shittier js and webkit based webview.

Every Qt app I'm forced to use is worse than every GTK app I've used as well, ironically, even on Windows.

>>107861240
Who needs garbage collectors? what are you too Poor for 64GB of ram?

>>107861443
>it does nothing but get in the way when you step outside the bounds of what it deems safe.
This is no different from any other static analysis. That doesn't mean that static analysis does nothing. It is a very useful tool and every high level language does it. For example in C you can't just pass mismatched types to a non-variadic function, this is considered type unsafe and you need to explicitly cast it first.

>If you're doing things like language development then it offers next to nothing over C/C++
Utf-8 by default
Standardized build system
Dependency management
Borrow checking
Powerful macro system
Etc

>doesn't save you any time or increase productivity so the statement Rust just saves time and effort is false.
From my personal experience Rust made me more productive and saved me ton of time in comparison to C++. Even just having good build system saved me a lot of days of pointless work.

>It can add to mental overhead
This is true.

>>107861634
Vast majority of new projects are licensed under MIT. Rust doesn't stop you from using GPL. It just that no one wants to use a license that limits your freedom so much

>>107859092
>Why is globohomo pushing this
shilling peaked 3 years ago, hype is dead.

>>107861707
>it's a language for retards,
That's Go
Rust is notoriously difficult and filters people left and right

>>107861842
Can you read or do you need an e-celeb to make a 15min video for you about this question?

In 100 years from when all of us will be dead, C and C++ will still exist unlike rust

>>107862120
>Unemployed detected
I just don't make GUI programs. I work in webdev and embedded.
I never even used Qt. I just heard it has a lot of features.

>>107862168
>hype is dead.
There is 10x more downloads on crates.io than there was 3 years ago. 2x more creates too.

>>107862191
Why would that be a good thing?

>>107862193
>I just heard it has a lot of features
>I heard it so it must be TRUE!
Spoken like a true NPC.
I heard that you like to pleasure multiple cocks at the same time... I heard it, so it must be true!

>>107862166
>Vast majority of new projects are licensed under MIT
Only Rust-tranny/globohomo projects
>Rust doesn't stop you from using GPL
But Rust trannies sure as hell love to tell you GPL is bad actually and that you should use a cuck license instead
>It just that no one wants to use a license that limits your freedom so much
Case in point

Don't care, still using Rust. Wake me up when someone else makes an usable language

>>107862249
>Don't care, still a tranny.
FIFY

>>107862219
It's kind of ironic to call me NPC just to follow it with argument so tangent it seems its only role is to allow you to include your homoerotic fantasies in otherwise strictly technical conversation.
But I guess this is just how people like you argue. I'm straight and tech savvy so I will not engage beyond this point, thank you.

>>107862438
>But I guess this is just how super intelligent people like you rek chuds like me. I'm a flaming faggot and tech illiterate so I am too embarrassed engage beyond this point, thank you
FIFY. I know your tech illiterate ass is using an iPhone, which has horrible autocorrect, so with that said, you're welcome!

>>107859996
Imagine thinking taking pills and wearing thigh highs makes you a woman

>>107862512
>taking pills and wearing thigh highs
Literally every Rust user

>>107859092
>What's hidden in it
trannies

>>107859158
Also from Google's blog:
https://security.googleblog.com/2022/12/memory-safe-languages-in-android-13.html
>The number of vulnerabilities reported in the bulletin has stayed somewhat steady over the past 4 years at around 20 per month, even as the number of memory safety vulnerabilities has gone down significantly.

There are a lot of hidden sleight of hands that rhetoric around Rust tends to do. In the blog posted above for instance, it talks about how the extant Rust code only uses unsafe in two places. However, this does not account for the fact that Rust's adoption is currently very limited and done in places in which it's easy to switch over to it. As it moves to replace more and more C/C++ code, the ergonomic necessity of unsafe will grow. Both due to systemic complexity as these components begin interacting with each other, as well as the nature of the systems themselves.

Real world Rust code has memory vulnerabilities. Substantially less than C/C++, but this isn't a 1:1 correlation with reduction in exploitation. Software exploitation is satisficing, that is it's inherently about a minimum criteria. Scarcity of vulnerabilities doesn't actually translate to better outcomes past a certain point.

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>>107859092
>What's hidden in it
Job security.
No self-respecting programmer wants to maintain someone else's Rust code.

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>>107859816
>rewrote it in C++
How dumb are you?
GCC was not "rewrote". It's the same old C code but compiled with the C++ compiler.

>>107862714
C++ is not backwards compatible with C.

>>107862723
eh... I mean, you're reaching into ACKTUALLY territory here.

>>107859092
Most of rust developers are trannies.

Thus if more men become rust programmers, there will be more trannies.

>>107862730
trannies aren't most of anything, retard-kun.

>>107862723
Subsets of C++ are.

>>107862737
Except they make up the vast majority of rust developers and users

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>>107862723
>C++ is not backwards compatible with C.
You are clearly retarded.
99.99% of C can be compiled as C++.

>>107862753
no they don't.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vBofCW8j70A

where is the tranny? I'm most certainly not a tranny. you're a delusional retard.

>>107862753
They make up 5% of Rust programmers according to the survey data. This is probably a norm in all of programming.

so let me sum of this thread:
unsubstantiated claims of backdoors that somehow don't impact the equally complex C/C++ toolchains everyone actually uses.
trannies or something.
downplaying Google's own study.
rehashing the same bullshit about unsafe rust being harder, despite said google study contradicting that.

what else?

>>107861874
No, they had those because they came up with an idea for it and made it. Confusing the outcome with the method is a sign of low IQ

>>107862779
>not 100%
So you agree with him?

>>107862845
>"woke"
>filtered by the borrow checker
>doesn't understand the point of the unsafe keyword
>thinks that doubly linked list is not possible
>thinks that AI is competent at rust
>doesn't know that RAII has become dominant in modern cpp usage
>coping about the language dying

>>107862103
>The point is not to never use unsafe. The point is to write safe abstractions over unsafe code.
Im sorry but this is just wrong. the point is indeed to not use unsafe code as much as possible because ownership / borrow checker thing has nothing to do with abstractions inherently. you can create safe abstractions over unsafe code in any language.

>>107862845
forgot cuck license conversion (though it's not directly rust related but rust rewrites are a trojan horse for it)

>>107863111
true. it seems to be the normal trend across the FOSS ecosystem though.

Gonna drop a massive red pill.
Cniles are the real troons, why? Because all this name calling against rustfags is pure feminine behavior. It's like old hags doing all they can to undermine young women because they're jealous of their youth and beauty.

>>107863168
> I know you are but what am I?
Is school out, son?

>>107863090
Unsafe doesn't disable ownership / borrow checker. And yes, these are not abstractions, they are static analyzers. They are used to prove that eg your usage of smart pointers(abstractions) are sound.

>>107863168
It's just below average IQ behavior. All the smart cniles are already using Rust.

>>107863000
But now they are not allowed to make their ideas because UNIX is free, therefore making your own OS is "reinventing the wheel" or "boiling the ocean" (I've heard them say that too). The whole idea of university OS research basically disappeared.

>>107863186
you can use valgrind with C, there’s no reason to run the borrow checker and other reduplicated nonsense every single time on unchanged code.
Unless you’re selling hardware.

Some code, like the compiler itself, doesn’t need memory safety at all. When I tried Rust the first time, the compiler immediately dumped core.

Rust is a hobby/home grade thing at best.
Call us when there are ANSI/ISO standards, and quit pretending.

>>107863221
Valgrind can only detect things in runtime. For example it would never raise any issues in OpenSSL related to heartbleed unless you actually run it while performing the attack.

>Rust is a hobby/home grade thing at best.
It's used by pretty much every large corporation nowadays.

>Call us when there are ANSI/ISO standards, and quit pretending
Majority of most popular languages do not have ANSI/ISO standards.

>>107863300
> used by pretty much every large corporation nowadays.
You could say that about anything.
For example, if you raided the offices and drawers of big corporations, you will eventually find things like butt plugs.
Rust is like a butt plug. It doesn’t necessarily mean the company is “using” them to any significant degree, even if a few rogue employees post about it on social media, and how the butt plugs make them 1000% more productive.

I work at one of these large corporations (as many do) and we still use COBOL to run our financial systems. There was an attempt to replace it with a new system in the 90s using the fad language at the time—visual basic; we hired MIT grads and other riff-raff to work on it, but they didn’t know the difference between fixed point and floating point so it went on for years being unable to come up with the same balances when run in parallel, so eventually it was dropped and all those fucking insufferable idiots tried to get transferred to other departments.

>>107863300
> Valgrind can only detect things in runtime
Even if that were true, you’re falling into the magical thinking trap where “you don’t have to test your code with rust because compiler is magical”

Yes, you do have to test it, and yes, you’d be wise to look at the code coverage test.
But, you do you. I can’t tell you what to do once you think you’ve got a stolen fizz buzz solution c2rust’ed in your own safe space. It’s just my advice.

>>107863300
> Majority of most popular languages do not have
Fentanyl. Everyone is doing it! Hell, why stop there… the newer carfentanil is out! Get on that bandwagon asafp, as soon as you paid off the loan you took out for your yellow stanley cooler mug.

>>107863491
The whole point of borrow checker is to eliminate an entire class of bugs and reduce others. Nobody is claiming that the borrow checker eliminates all bugs. Either you are being intentionally disingenuous or you are a moron.

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>>107863549
I was talking about valgrind and c.
Why are you unnecessarily talking about rust and bringing attention to it and yourself?

Windows is written in C.
Minix on the intel processors is written in C.
Unix is written in C.
C was invented to create Unix.

Rust was “invented” to replace C++ because some retard’s elevator was broken and he “guessed” it was written in C++ (it wasn’t). Jesus fuck…

https://www.zdnet.com/article/rust-turns-10-how-a-broken-elevator-changed-software-forever/

Rust folks have tried to scrub this from the internet, but largely failed as evidenced here.

>>107863626
>C was invented to create Unix.
Unix was written in PDP-7 assembly, then rewritten in PDP-11 assembly, then some parts were rewritten in C. C wasn't an innovative or original idea either. There were other languages that did the same thing like PL/S, BCPL, and BLISS, and operating systems like Multics were written in a higher level language, PL/I aka PL/1, and the Burroughs mainframe OS was written in ALGOL.

>>107863626
moron it is

Rust is owned by Mozilla which is owned by Microsoft.
They will have total control over everything and can turn off support for Linux at anytime if they start threatening jewish profits..

C was invented by the soviets and distributed by its allies in the USA to weaken the country that's why it was free.
That's why comrade Torvald managed to take over the world with its literally who OS while the GNU/warriors were trying to salvage the whole thing by subverting the soviet ideology into a freedom oriented mindset.
Rust is an underground, communism-free, state of the art language with its freedom oriented design and holy goal, only the soviets would oppose that.

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Rust is better for vibe-coding, the compiler itself forces you to make better code, something that isn't so easy to do in C++, for example. You can easily do a "use after free" in C++ without any kind of warnings or errors from the compiler, LLMs will hardly be able to detect it. In Rust, this is almost impossible to happen unintentionally.
Since most software from now on will be written with AI, it's better to have a language that enforces better coding standards to avoid a bigger mayhem.
Be honest, would you prefer your Bluetooth driver (which can be the target of several memory attacks) to be vibe-coded in C++ or Rust? I would prefer it to be done in C++ by competent people, but since the market will prefer the cheaper option, they will hire some turd worlder vibe-coder to vibe-code the driver. Unfortunately, that's the world we live in.
So, in this scenario, I much prefer vibe-coded programs in Rust than in C++.

>>107859092
It's just good

I don't have any feelings about the rust lang one way or another but why does it seem like literally every rust user is a tranny? I literally got accused of being anti-LGBTQ and right wing in a completely non-political context for saying I prefer C++ over rust

>>107862723
C++ is more backward compatible with C than C is with pre K&R C

Who cares about this astroturfed shitlang?
I literally don't think about it at all and don't ever foresee needing to.

>>107859092
It's just a good language OP.
I don't get why people are so opposed to it to the point of gobbling up any and all negative press it gets and convincing themselves it's absolute shit.

>>107863878
>I don't get why people are so opposed to it
It's the weird cult stuff that the community has adopted. Without that, it would be a language with its own set of tradeoffs (more safety for more copies and fewer programming models) that could be discussed, but the cult stops sensible discussion (the types of bugs that rust prevents aren't the worst ones). After you've been round that loop a few times, you stop trying to be nice to them.

The worst kind of bug? Where you discover you've set a whole business strategy worth a billion or more on the basis of something outright wrong and then you and the board are SO BONED, possibly looking at hostile takeovers or lawsuits, and you can't do anything about it now and ITS ALL YOUR FAULT. Those bugs are the real ones to keep you awake at night.

>>107863420
>You could say that about anything.
You can't say that about D, nim, zig and every other C++ alternative. Rust is the very first one that actually managed to get a traction and got widespread adoption.

>>107863515
>Majority of most popular languages do not have Fentanyl.
True

>>107863491
>Even if that were true, you’re falling into the magical thinking trap where “you don’t have to test your code with rust because compiler is magical”
Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.
If you actually learned how does valgrind work and how is it different from static analysis you wouldn't be confused now. These are not very complex topics, just Google it. The main difference is that valgrind can only detect invalid behavior when it happens while static analysis requires you to prove the valid behavior for all possible situations. Both have their strengths, but unlike C, Rust can do both.

>>107863626
>C was invented to create Unix.
This is just factually incorrect.

>>107859092
It's gender spectrum compatible and doesn't suffer from ableist language in READMEs.

>>107861489
>doesn't work on anything below Win10
>works on everything down to Win95
https://github.com/rust9x/rust

Fuck off.

>>107861282
>There is nothing bureaucratic in C++
It's quite literally the epitome of the design-by-committee development model.

>>107861489
Anything below Windows 8 doesn't even have futex, fucktard. 7 is trash and missing a lot of basic shit Win8 and 10 has added. Stop using unsupported shit retard.

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>>107859092
It's a c++ alternative designed for Java/C# jeets who don't know what a pointer is.

>>107864580
mutexes are an antipattern

>>107863660
> Unix was written in PDP-7 assembly, then rewritten in PDP-11 assembly
No. Using mcilroy’s tmg, the language ‘B’ was ported to ‘B’ (from assembly) and the pdp-11 assembler was written in B along with dc in order to bootstrap the system and we were off to the races. The C compiler (or, really, what you’d call pre-k&r c) came soon after that.
As you probably know, the C compiler generated assembly that was compiled with as.

>>107859158
can someone tell a noob why google isn't using their own recently-developed memory-safe language for their os?

>>107864360
> C was not invented to create unix?
It was. There is no debate. Learn english semantics.
“Creation” is not a single moment in time.
> And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day.

If I had said “full K&R C was invented to create unix v1” or something, then yeah, that would be factually incorrect. But, as we see above, B came first. It would also be fine to say “B was invented to create Unix”
Are we even done “creating unix” now? I’m not sure, but I think it would be fair to say something you’d probably recognize as unix would be around v7.

Hope that helps.

>>107864850
Which one?
Dart?
Go?

Go is a hacked C compiler from Plan 9 with a massive (by 1970s standards) BASIC/Lisp/JavaJVM-like runtime (on my system it’s around 5 MB).

So basically the only languages that matter are C, Python, and Java

>>107864968
forgot dart existed desu

>>107860786
NTA but I believe the point here is that rewriting FOSS software into Rust allows big corpo make the new rewrite closed source. Rust enables a path of least resistance to achieve this goal.

>>107864935
"C was invented to create Unix" is as accurate as "Rust was invented to create Linux."

>>107861857
No, rustroonlang is about government control. With ISO standard languages already in place with trillions of lines of code basically running the world, they have little control at the "SHUT IT DOWN" level. With rustroonlang, they'll be able to arrange things as they (((see fit))) to. Simple as.

>>107865890
>No, C is about government control. With ISO standard languages already in place with trillions of lines of code basically running the world, they have little control at the "SHUT IT DOWN" level. With C, they'll be able to arrange things as they (((see fit))) to. Simple as.
C, the language of the Morris worm, was shilled to replace ISO and ANSI standard languages like Pascal, FORTRAN, COBOL, and BASIC. Then C got its own "standard" that actually mandated null-terminated strings and functions like gets. Rust is fixing some of the problems that C created.

>>107865802
Yeahbut
C existed over more than 99.99999% of unix’s life span.

Rust only existed on the last gasp… 0.000001% of the tail end of both Linux and Rust’s useful lifespan.

>>107865989
> actually mandated null-terminated strings
It was the unix syscalls that drove C to use null terminated strings. The C language was co-emergent with unix, which was initially written in assembly to bootstrap it (and until computers became powerful enough to run fluffy, high-level, bloated languages like “C” which had to have the c pre-processor, compiler, assembler, and linker all in separate programs and phases because it couldn’t fit all of them in memory at the same time)

Similarly, something like DOS used mov ah,9; int 21h, to print a “$” terminated string.
Interestingly, this is because CP/M also typically used “$” to terminate a string (and also used the same function number, 9, to do so!!!)

>>107866083
> couldn’t fit all of them in memory at the same time
Someone should try and get a rust compiler to run on real pdp-7 or a hardware/time/cycle accurate simulator and see how long it takes to compile itself.
I doubt it would ever run due to its size though, and it would probably take… what? A month to compile?

People are talking like rust is better without considering the realities of the constraints it was under.

It’s also sad that they are pitting Rust against C when rust was explicitly developed to replace C++

Even jwz rightly calls out C as basically a portable assembler. That’s a low bar.

Next you’re going to tell me it took a naval armada several months and 150 planes and helicopters full of navy seals just to capture a tiny, poor country’s third world dictator and his wife.

>>107865989
>Rust is fixing some of the problems that C created.
Such as? Like which OS has changed to favor the Rust way of doing things?

>>107859519
>only one compiler, the official one
Everything else you listed is a fair criticism but this is legitimately a good thing.

>>107866227
>Such as? Like which OS has changed to favor the Rust way of doing things?
By inventing 15 different string types to deal with C apis.

>>107863202
Yes, they are. You are not REinventing a wheel if you have a NEW idea youbwant to implement.

>add "baby duck" to filters
90% of c and cpp hate doesnt show anymore
is it some kind of tranny dogwhistle?

But what about Go?