Why stop retards from ruining their lives? Go ahead install those things on your roof, see what happens

>>108109610
solar is a delayed gratification / time preference / IQ test. most will fail.

Tldr, baseload generation and short term flexibility mixed with infrastructure priorities.

Renewable need smart grids and grid sized battery storage locally to fully transition towards mostly using renewable and that means replacing tons of old coal/gas infrastructure.

some of us in the eu can sustain ourselves with renewable and nuclear, but we got some gigantic niggers like poland and germany that refuse and keep on burning coal and then the eu forces us to sell our electricity to them so we also pay higher prices

>>108109610
Have you seen how long it is? Nobody even bothered to watch the whole damn thing

OP here, I forgot this whole site is just a collection of bots and gay ass US government pedo niggers sliding threads because they failed everything else in life. Just forget I said anything.

>>108109610
Because your attention whoring already got you far more attention than you deserve. Buy an ad or fuck off.

>>108109741
>US government pedo niggers
these people would agree with you tho, or are you still pretending like you're le underdogs

>>108109630
>grid sized battery storage
If you want the majority of your power to be produced by solar and wind those batteries needs to be able to last for weeks if you don't have a lot of hydro or live in California or the Sahara.

>>108109776
Don't be retarded, that's why you still have nuclear baseload and transmission from areas that still have sunlight/wind and are over producing.

>>108109791
Maybe feasible if you use as much nuclear as France does, but no one does except France and especially renewable fanatics are anti nuclear.
You obviously aren't but most are.
I really want the west to invest more in nuclear so we can finally have gen 4 reactors, super safe and the electricity will be very cheap if we build the supply chain and infrastructure for it.

>>10810963
German here. I'm sorry. We are cucked about this. I want a solar/wind + safe nuclear baseload future. I am even willing to never drive a fossil fuel car and charge every 200km.
But there's no option. Green Party wants Solar and wind but is retarded when it comes to nuclear, CDU/CSU want coal and are retarded when it comes to anything. Other Parties are irrelevant. There is no good option.

Here's the entire video in 3 seconds for you
>ORANGE MAN BAD!!!

Now go buy an ad

>>108109818
My state seems to being full steam ahead on wind, solar, and recently announced the intent to add 1800MW of SMR nuclear.

>>108109843
>SMR
A meme
At least it might lead to engineering achievements others can use in the future

>>108109843
>being
Be going

>>108109846
Whose?

My states has two SMR companies headquartered here, and our existing two nuclear reactors from the 1970s are owned by a company that is invested in the rolls royce SMR project.

They're all doing totally different SMR types.

>>108109866
>Whose?
All, until I see them produced at a reasonable price and achieving what's promised I'll assume they are all hype products for investors to throw money at.

>>108109884
I'm glad you're not in charge of funding these things lmao, we'd still be using the water wheel as our primary source of power if luddites like yourself were in charge. Sometimes shit doesn't pan out, that doesn't mean you hobble yourself by assuming they're ALL scams.

>>108109610
I wouldn’t even know about this faggot if faggots like you would stop advertising for him. He is an insufferable queer who deserves to be executed by anal impalement

>talks about a thing
>doesn't link to said thing
once again OP doesn't disappoint with his gay retardation

>>108109903
>not one company so far that hasn't been a scam
This time will be different! trust me bro!

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>>108109903
Boiling water reactors are still literally just upgraded water wheels and they are the pinnacle of energy production so far.

I would like to see SMRs become viable. I do know the USSR used radioisotopes thermoelectric generators successfully in remote areas. I think there is usefulness for SMRs even if they don’t produce the full amount of promised power.

>>108109944
Rolls royce is a scam?

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>gay windmills and solar panels
>gay nuclear nerd shit
Beautiful, Clean Coal is America's future.

>>108109951
>take taxpayer money
>don't deliver working product
yes.

>>108109970
New tech takes longer than expect doesn't = scam.


Do you fags not understand the concept of delayed gratification?

>>108109959
Coal always needs to be available as a backup. But coal ash actually releases more radiation into the local area than nuclear power. Its bizarre but there are a lot of radioactive isotopes trapped in coal. https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/coal-ash-is-more-radioactive-than-nuclear-waste/

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>>108109610

>>108109951
Just invest in green steel and green hydrogen, I'm sure it'll great.
Always invest in next big thing!

>>108109977
It obviously works, but it's guaranteed to be less effective than traditional reactors due to scaling laws. They are overpromising and almost no companies will reach markets, those that do will not be what's promised.

>>108109977
It’s not that, good friend. It’s just that we are still getting over the EV hangover. You see, once government subsidies stopped, everyone started losing money on EVs. Even Tesla is only profitable by selling carbon swaps. if it were truly viable then it wouldn’t need so much government subsidies.
Again, I want to see SMRs succeeding. But it is looking more and more like the same energy boondoggles as we’ve seen in the past. Milking government funding until that funding runs out. Solar mirror plants in the desert, clean coal gasification in Mississippi. I can make a long list but I don’t have the energy. There are a lot of green energy boondoggles shutting down now that they aren’t getting their Obama era subsidies.

>>108109945
even if we master nuclear fusion, it'll still be
>look inside
>boiling water makes thing spin

>>108110004
>>108110010
The biggest difference today is Ai datacenters. They need the power and will pay for on-site SMRs even if they aren't as efficient since they can be privately owned/operated and can presumably be built/certified in a handulful of years instead of 10-20.

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>>108110015
Yeah man it’s crazy how we are still so monke even in 2026

But water wheel works whether it is hydroelectric, geothermal, nuclear, whatever.

>>108110015
Actually not necessarily, there's been significant progress with supercritical CO2 replacing water in that role which can allow for both much smaller turbines and higher efficiency (as lots of energy is wasted on liquid > steam phase change).

So yeah, there a chance
>look inside
>boiling water
will no longer be a thing eventually

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>>108109610
Solar won. It's that simple. There's no argument to be made. All that shit you spewed is just nonsense FUD. That's why the people in charge are going all in on solar: because it's simply unequivocally technologically superior. There is no point in debating it on 4cuck with people peddling nonsense FUD. The people in charge already realized what's up: Solar is better and won. They're ultimaely in charge of what happens, and they're all in on solar, once again, to drive the point home, because it's superior on a meritocratic level.

>>108110056
We will see.
It will be nice for something to become a reality instead of did remaining investor/government enticing buzzwords for 10-15 years

>>108109610
>still can't cover even a quarter of its energy consumptio
this is actually false my eu country produces half overall with spikes like 70%+ of renewables

so I discard the rest of the post as false faggotry

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>>108110066
Here’s your FUD right here
We had a giant government subsidized solar farm get built locally. Someone forgot to check the weather. It hails here at least once every few years. They already replaced the entire farm once (at taxpayers expense) I don’t think anyone will support another tax payer funded replacement.
Plus the local Chinese assembly plant for US workers never materialized. All of the panels were shipped straight from China.

>>108109610
>Why is nobody making a response to the solar power video?
Why should they?

>>108110105
Whatever dude. Solar won and will continue to dominate. No squabbling on 4chan is going to change that.

>>108110066
why did people even expect them to die after 25 years? Were they supposed to suddenly turn into dust or something?

>>108110105
>one shit local project means they're all equally shit
Wow

You seem really intelligent.

>>108110117
This isn’t squabbling friend. This is you getting raped and gaped with superior arguments. The only loser here is you.

>>108110118
You must understand that the photovoltaic process causes the materials to decay, right? You didn’t honestly think that it was free energy that somehow nullified the laws of thermodynamics, did you?

Solar is low maintenance and doesn’t consume a resource that isn’t being consumed anyway (solar fusion). It just make sense.

The first world should be using solar as well as being non-retarded about nuclear energy. Need a slightly different solution for the third world (can’t be trusted with clearly products), but solar is still attractive there because it’s not something they can fuck up like the wells in Africa.

>>108110130
No the intelligence is that solar farms are vulnerable to Mother Nature. It’s not one shit project. No solar farm is invulnerable to hail, tornadoes, typhoons, etc. the replacement costs were not factored into anyone’s metrics for cost per kilowatt. Once factored, it is a reminder that solar is only viable in very limited circumstances.

my country has hella sun, but wind, for whatever reason nearly 4xs its production

>>108110156
*can’t be trusted with nuclear products

>>108110164
Lol no, MOST areas are not experiencing such extreme weather regularly.

I freely admit solar doesn't make sense everywhere, but you're being retarded trying to extrapolate an isolated local incident to global solar.

>>108110034
Full sized reactors are reliably built in 4-6 years in South Korea and China.

>>108110202
More like 6-7 years. 4 years is cope cherrypicking. Solar is much faster than that.

Problems with nuclear:

Nuclear is uneconomical
nuclear takes a gorillion years to build
nuclear waste problem has not been solved
in the time you build a nuclear plant you can install much more solar and wind
SMRs are meme vapourware
nuclear has the most catastrophic failure mode of any human technology (take a look at Chernobyl)
constant ongoing decomissioning/maintenance costs. cannot leave them unattended or you have nuclear meltdown catastrophe. meanwhile nothing happens with solar or wind

>>108110202
That's great, that's never happening in the US, at least not within the next 20 years, so let's focus on something we might ACTUALLY be able to do, which right now is SMRs of various sizes. Even the name SMR is a bit disingenuous, the Rolls Royce SMRs are targeting ~440MWe. X-energy SMRs are targeting just ~75MWe. They're both SMRs despite being wildly different in price/size/power generation. Some of the others are targeting just 10-20MW.

>>108110235
>cannot leave them unattended or you have nuclear meltdown catastrophe.
You haven't kept up on reactors in at least a decade huh?

Most new designs are walk away safe. They fail to a non-active state.

You're describing older designs.

>>108110277
yeah bro fukushima? That was 8 trillion years ago

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>>108110185
The only place that matters is America.
Extreme weather is common all over America.
I don’t care where you live and neither does anyone else.

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>>108110298
Fukushima wasn’t a fail-safe reactor. It needed power to SCRAM. The Japs should’ve made their sea wall 8 feet higher. The chief engineer who designed the plant told them so in the 1970s. TEPCO didn’t listen. Fukushima was inundated with seawater and the backup diesel generators were flooded and failed to provide the backup power needed to started up the SCRAM system that forces the reactor to shut down. Fail-safe systems overcome this flaw by not not requiring external power to SCRAM the control rods

>>108110340
Yeah the retardation in Fukushima was the backup generator being in a floodable basement on a fucking tusnami-exposed ocean-exposed coastline. I'm the resident anti nuclear shill in this thread but yeah that was certainly a design flaw. Now you can make an argument that you can't always trust people to make a foolproof design but that goes for anything, though certainly solar does not have the potential for this failure mode.

>>108110301
You're just vastly overblowing the issue.

Even in texas, where the insurance claims for solar panels damaged by hail is higher than ANYWHERE else in the US, is on track to become the US's largest solar producing state.

Turnes out at the grid level you just use weather monitoring and sun tracking technology, and when a storm is detected coming in you just tell the panels to orient themselves vertically to avoid full face blows from hail.

Manufacturers are also coming out with thicker front glass for areas that expect more hail than others, and industry testing is moving up from 1" hail to testing 2" simulated hail.

tldr; it's just not as big of an issue as you're making it out to be. This isn't even new, the industry has been working on this for years and the panels today are already quite robust and can stand up to decent sized hail.

>>108110372
>just keep buying more panels bro

You seem to really be invested in this flawed concept. Must be losing a lot of money since the gov subsidies ran out?

>>108110385
Lmao, even without ANY subsidies (and you people love to ignore that coal/gas also gets subsidized, via tax breaks and preferential accounting rules) solar is still cheaper. Only about 5% of the US is in what is classified as an "ultra high risk" area for solar. Everywhere else it's almost guaranteed that solar makes more sense over a decade+ compared to gas or coal.

https://youtu.be/svHeBLgpRQs

>>108109610
This is the video that ruined the channel for me. And the worst thing? I agree with a lot of it.
Solar is great for home and can be scaled up, wind is alright for niche cases, but this fucker has TDS up his ass and out of his mouth and is so god damn naive when it comes to politics is sickening.
Seriously, if you're a content creator, don't shoehorn politics where it doesn't belong. He had a great video and fucked up.

>>108110450
I'm glad he did it, more of those jobless fucks need to speak up about this shit.

You dumb faggots who want to pretend it's not happening DESERVE to have it shoved in your face by your favorite creators.

>>108110105
Pretty easy fix if you just put a net of see through material like fishing line over it.

>>108110458
Yes shoving your derangement in front of others is a good look. Really convincing too, def not a terminally obsessed loser

>>108110607
>Don't believe your lying eyes

I bet you still pretend alex pretti pulled his gun.

>>108109610
>billions and billions
Oil and gas cost trillions and trillions. Existing infrastructure costs astronomical amounts to replace, and current owners and operators have a vested interest in not having their still-profitable massively, massively expensive assets obsoleted overnight.
Billions is nothing.

Also batteries are still a big problem.

I can no longer tell anons from shill posts any more, SPECIALLY in this kind of thread

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>>108110678
yeah you can easily tell it's at the very least 50% bots
it makes me cringe to think i supported the orange pedo back in 2016, seeing shills here still sucking his cock is embarrassing
i've honestly lost faith in the whole system, burn this fucking country down

>>108110235
We could have had nuclear started 20 years ago and replacing most of coal by now if it weren't for people like you pushing to wait for solar to catch up which still doesn't handle baseload
>nuclear waste problem has not been solved
And somehow burning fossil fuels for decades in the meantime is a better option?
>Nuclear is uneconomical
Only because countries build it once then go back and change the design rather than build multiple of the same design. And coal subsidies
>SMRs are meme vapourware
This part is true though, it's politicians excuse to do nothing and kick the can down the road because of all the scaremongering

At least this thread has been generally more reasonable (aside from the two doomerfag complainers above)
We really do need an all-of-the-above solution to energy factoring in nuclear and renewables, but shit like "no CO2 by 2030!!!" is nonsensical and does no one any practical good. Coal + nuclear baseload should continue to be the standard for western countries, while we continue to improve battery chemistry and panel technology to make solar less fragile and more efficient to produce.
Which, improvements to solar, battery, and nuclear technologies will all assist with space exploration, which will make us even less dependent on extracting resources from Earth in the future.

>>108110077
>>108109610
96% of electricity generation here is CO2 neutral already. It's like 40% nuclear and then just renewables. Coal at 0.3%, gas at 1%.

Wind alone has gone from 170 GWh to 22 TWh in the last 20 years here. Making it produce already over 25% of all the electricity generated here. And new capacity is being built in the order of multiple TWh of actual generation output every single year. Combine with the nuclear and hydro capacity that's over 80% of our electricity generation. Add in biofuels and you're at 95%. It also happens that we have some of the cheapest electricity in EU.

The countries in EU that have not invested in renewables and nuclear are the ones that are struggling and paying out the ass for electricity. That's why they're shitting their pants over NordStream because they bet their entire energy infrastructure on cheap Russian gas and are now paying the price for it.

China is building more renewable and nuclear capacity than rest of the world combined. And by a huge fucking margin. But you can't build it overnight, which is why they still have to import oil and coal. And the reason they're building renewables and nuclear on such a massive fucking scale is because they want to be energy independent instead of needing to rely on imports.

>>108110747
it's kind of sick that the focus is once again on the pedos. nothing might come out of it, but the potential is yug, and probably the tip of the iceberg

>>108110774
smart anon with the facts, buying oil and gas from third parties is never the way

I can't believe we have an energy thread in /g/ I thought this board was only about AI and programming

>>108110774
>96% of electricity generation here is CO2 neutral alread
Only if you fudge the numbers and ignore the CO2 cost of the power plants, their maintenance and everything else that actually produces CO2.

It's like when the EU buys Chinese products produced without decent environmental laws with coal power generated electricity transported on ships burning raw heavy crude oil whenever they are on international waters and them claim they've reduced their CO2 footprint because it's not the EU which produces the ware.

>>108109610
If solar was the answer to anything, it would've solved everything. I heard talks of Elon Musk wanting to implement a solar energy grid in outer space, but until he succeeds in lowering the price of actually putting the panels in orbit, nothing will happen. There's also the problem of bringing the generated power from space to Earth, which some optimistic futurists think will be beamed with high-powered lasers or something. I think we've reached a point where nobody innovates anymore, and every "new" tech we see is actually a newer version of something that already exists. Truth is, solar is more idealism than anything, and we should all have gone nuclear. Governments and NGOs are a bunch of pussies though, and fear we'll have another Chernobyl—I think humanity has learned its lesson with Chernobyl, and, unless it happens in like North Korea, it's extremely difficult for something like that to happen in modern democracies. Too many prying eyes for someone to screw up as big as what happened in Chernobyl.

>>108110077
>produces half overall with spikes like 70%+ of renewables
very cool anon, now quadruple it to meet the datacenter and electric car demand

>>108109610
i didn't watch it. i appreciate alec's redditbrained way of doing things, but i don't need to listen to him rant and rave if i don't want to.

>>108110851
dw bout it bro ww3 will clean it all up

>>108110839
Based retard. The CO2 generated from building and maintaining power plants is virtually zero when compared per generated unit of energy from fossil fuel plants. Yes, it's not technically 0. But it doesn't matter in the real world.

The per capita emissions of China are much lower than US, and their emissions are going down now. So in fact it's much more environmentally friendly to buy shit made in China than shit made in the US. Their emissions aren't massively higher than the EU average even. Again, China is building more nuclear and renewable capacity than the rest of the world combined. While luddites in the west are still betting on imported oil&gas&coal or protecting the local jobs on that sector. Instead of trying to build new jobs in renewables. China isn't even doing this to be good and to save the earth. They're doing it to be energy independent and to solve local pollution problems in cities.

>>108110871
It's about an hour of regular solar ranting the final 20 minutes or so is him ranting about politics.

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>>108109610

Have you ever talked to an autistic person before? Once they've made up their mind, that's that. If they're leftie and autistic there are zero downsides to installing a depreciating asset onto your roof that inadvertently makes it harder for you to sell the home down the road. People like this guy have a reason that makes sense to them for doing the things they do.

>I mean, I don't have the numbers.

Numbers? Results? What for? I could show an autistic person the returns on my $15,000 - $20,000 over 20 years. They'll latch onto their narrative that the 15k-20k is nothing compared to the "incredible returns you get from the roof. Oh, and you save the environment!"

Just leave em be. Don't even bother. They're just looking to argue. Just pretend they're an Apple fan or something.

>>108110938
>The CO2 generated from building and maintaining power plants is virtually zero
Wow, that's crazy. So the EROI is in the hundreds or thousands for renewables?
Got a source for that?

>>108110851
It's actually good because it creates demand which ensures steady private investments in energy production.

>>108110962
I can find ~12g/kWh for wind including everything. For coal I found 700 - 1400 g/kWh depending on plant and coal type, gas 300 - 600 g/kWh, oil 700 - 1100 g/kWh. So yes, the CO2 from building windmills is negligible and completely irrelevant when compared to fossil fuels. The difference is multiple orders of magnitude where the emissions of building renewables would be a rounding error no one would notice in the fossil fuel emissions.

>>108111064
I asked for EROI.
If the EROI is 6 and it's built in a country that uses 40% coal and oil for electricity production then ignoring lubricant, cement, transport fuel and whatever else it becomes pretty clear the actual CO2 produced is significant.
Also you very much need to link the study because total CO2 studies are very often politically motivated.

>>108110947
fair enough, i rant about politics all day every day on 4chan too. i can't expect him not to care about the way the zionists are ruining this country, and i don't expect him to do it competently either. he's right that solar is the best kind of green fake energy.

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>>108110938
>They're doing it to be energy independent and to solve local pollution problems in cities.
Yeah one look at Chile Santiago and you realize gas cars are shit. It's in a valley so all the smog just sits there and accumulates. Their air literally becomes palpably clearer after it rains.

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>>108111148
theres a moment where implies anyone who brings up bird deaths is retarded
which is true

>>108111104
EROI doesn't matter as long as you're above a certain threshold. But even then wind reaches the same or even eclipses coal. Modern wind turbines are estimated to have a EROI of over 40 while coal has around 30.

And the wind CO2 emissions I quoted include all of what you mentioned. I'm not going to link you studies because you're not interested in reading them. Your position is that renewables are shit and you will not change your mind even if people present proof. You link a study that says the total CO2 production per kWh is significantly higher on wind than the value I said. A modern study on modern wind turbines, not some shit using ancients turbines with shit efficiency.

The reason to move away from fossil fuels is presented here >>108111158

>>108111176
what about old age or cancer?

>>108111205
>Your position is that renewables are shit and you will not change your mind even if people present proof
But I have changed my mind about them, I used to be in favor of renewables. They've done nothing but harm the grid of my country, made our grid from one of the most stable in the world to one barely working and prices fluctuate wildly with average prices rising the more renewables are built.
All hydro and nuclear power plants have to indirectly subsidize wind on windy days because their personell are there on standby and the nuclear power plants still have to run and the hydro plants often have to dump water, making it even worse. On windy days no one is making money because prices become negative in an effort to save the grid from collapsing.
Almost all wind farms in my country are losing money, and losing money quickly. Investors are losing their savings, the government sometimes bails them out.
Hydro is still making money but way less than before renewables. All big producers have switched to making money from fixed rate charges for bullshit because no one is really making money from producing electricity, so now investments have plummeted.
My country is Sweden.

By the way, the EROI numbers you mentioned certainly don't take into account when the electricity is produced and if the nuclear power plants have to continue running

>>108111314
And it's still a drop in the fucking ocean compared to other things that kill those same birds. If you actually cared about birds you'd be pushing on banning pet cats and hunting out all the wild ones.

>>108111314
for the USA in 2017 there was about 90,000 MW installed wind capacity
multiply that by 20 and you have more generation capacity than every source combined
Multiply bird deaths by 20 and its still second from last on the chart
tl;dr kill yourself retard

>>108111344
>>108111314
I think it would be between communication towers and electrical lines if 100% of American power was wind, of course you'd need to have about 8 times overproduction of wind if you wanted to actually use solely wind so that would put it way higher up.

>>108111336
Your country has some of the cheapest electricity in the world. The reason your grid is struggling is not because of renewables but your complete mishandling of grid upkeep and improvements to such a massive degree that you can't get the electricity from Northern Sweden to the south where most people live. Also the reason your energy prices have gone up is the Russia Ukraine war that stopped super cheap gas from Russia so it can't be used as a cheap reserve.

>>108109610
You have to be patient with her, the hormonal changes when you first start estradiol valerate injections can be pretty intense.

>>108109610
STOP SHILLING THIS EGOITISTICAL BORING GRIFTER AT ME IT'S NOT FUCKING TECH IT'S SOME IRRELEVENT CUNT ON YOUTUBE HAVING A NORMIE TIER VIDEO ESSAY ABOUT FUCK ALL

BUY A FUCKING AD

>>108111382
Thank you for telling me about my country. We used to have 0 gas turbines, so bord stream is not the reason, we used to have almost completely fossil free electricity production before renewables were pushed, nuclear and hydro was enough for pretty much everything. Now we burn oil every winter.

It doesn't matter if our electricity is cheap as you say, it's a lot more expensive than it was before renewable investments and they are the cause because of the price volatility they introduce. That very same price volatility has made industry flee and not want to invest. The harm is enormous.

>>108109610
>I mean, I don't have the numbers, but it's obvious this does not make sense in the big scheme of things.
hurr

>>108111336
Sounds like a Sweden skissue. I live in Quebec, we get 98% of our power from hydro. No problems. Cheapest electricity in North America. Actually there are some problems but it's not relevant to the renewable discussion. And I do think hydro is the best form of power with renewables in second place.

>>108111418
Guess what, your country doesn't exist in a fucking vacuum. Germany is struggling because there is no more gas, which means Denmark exports electricity to Germany, and then you export electricity from Southern Sweden to Denmark. And Finland stopped importing electricity from Russia, so you export electricity from Northern Sweden to Finland.

Combine that with your shit tier grid which can't transport electricity from Northern Sweden to the south and yeah your prices go up. But it's not because of renewables. Without the investment to renewables your energy prices would be even higher.

>>108111462
I think that anon is ok with hydro. It's wind they have a problem with

>>108111462
Yes, of course it's cheap if you have 98% of you electricity from hydro. They requires the correct geography and can only support so much electricity production.
That doesn't change that wind doesn't really add much production to the grid since there needs to be base load to cover when there's no wind and thewind causes wild price fluctuations so no one wants to invest in either the grid or in industry be auee neither will be profitable.
Let me repeat myself, almost no wind farms are unprofitable in Sweden, it only gets worse the more wind is added. We also don't have enough electricity during most of the winter, even though we are a net producer of electricity, wind barely adds to the grid, but it hurts it a lot.

>>108109610
>this video goes against my programming and made me very uncomfortable but I don't have any data to prove it wrong why has no right wing grifter proven it wrong for me so I can go back to my comfort zone? please do my work for me /g/ I don't want to be made to think

>>108111486
>Without the investment to renewables your energy prices would be even higher.
Without renewables there would be investments in electricity which actually had a chance to lower prices.

Even though we export incredible amount of wind they still lose money because when it's fucking windy in Sweden it tends to be windy in central Europe too.
I've already explained that wind barely helps the energy production needs, it only hurts the grid.

>>108111503
>>108111539
Investing on the grid is the responsibility of the state. Your state fucked up and doesn't have enough transfer capacity from where you produce power to where it's used. Stop blaming renewables for it. And no, there wouldn't be investment to other generation methods. Nuclear needs political capital and is way out of reach for most companies. Anything else beyond renewables is just not feasible in terms of cost.

>>108109610
>if true, why do countries still fight over oil
It still makes asfalt, plastics, just about every medicine we use, it's not just the energy part it's the petro chemicals part.

Then there simple inertia, why would people throw away perfect working cars and infrastructure?
Then there energy density you won't beat diesel for ships/trucks unless you go nuclear.
And while the battery technology is there today. When the solar boom started 15 years ago in Europe batteries where nowhere close to ready. It makes sense now but it didn't when it started. A lot of countries for periods of time make more then 100% of their energy needs via Solar+Wind. The issue is there no storage and the issue is thats in summer. You build solar to averages not peaks.

The EU has 406 GW of Solar Capacity, 2,697 TW of usage. The EU can at points make 15% of all it's electricity from Solar. But usually it's like 9~10% some 18% from Wind. Problem is these can flucate wildly and there no batter generation.
What carries the EU is Hydro 14% and Nuclear 23%.
You'll find this shocking but the EU only makes 36% of it's Electricity by burning fossils.

You could make the exact same argument hes making about Solar about Nuclear. 100% the same. The issue is nobody wants to be poor now so in the long run they're rich. Democracies don't work like that. What matters is the next 4~10 years at most. The only reason France got so deep into Nuclear because the entire population got scared shitless when Oil was actually cut off. You don't remember it because the US never really suffered from it a long time but in vast parts of Europe there was an actual oil shock Oil was so scarse that only half of the cars were allowed on roads per day. You license plate had legal times when it could drive So the 1st the 3rd the 5th of the month etc... Some had weeks on and off. There was an entire micro car boom because of this.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1973_oil_crisis#Impact_on_Western_Europe

>>108111567
Yes, the grid needs and upgrade but it's very disengeneous to claim that's the only or at least main problem.
Even if we cut off all other nations from our grid and had perfect a perfect grid with infinite lossless transfer capacity we would still not produce enough electricity most days during winter and quite often during the other seasons, we would however still technically be a net producer. That would not help us the days we wouldn't have any electricity and when brown outs would happen.
The problem with no new investments due to a lack of profitability would remain.
The problem of wind farms losing money would not only still be there, it would be worse.

>>108111207
Thats mostly what the cats get. Cats have a abysmal success rate of capturing healthy birds.

>>108109736
I watched the whole thing. He was based and correct. OP was snotty faced crying while writing his rambling retarded post.

>>108111680
>I don't have the data
>once you built solar and battery it produces forever, that's it, nothing more to think about
ok bro

>>108110235

>Nuclear is uneconomical
Absolute garbo opinion so I'm already discarding it.
>nuclear takes a gorillion years to build
in the US
>nuclear waste problem has not been solved
Doesn't keep up with the industry solved and 0 issues
>in the time you build a nuclear plant you can install much more solar and wind
You also need batteries for this to actually work like Nuclear energy
>SMRs are meme vapourware
Maybe
>nuclear has the most catastrophic failure mode of any human technology (take a look at Chernobyl)
Absolutely nothing happening there. And overblown joke. If it was so dangerous why did Russians invade through it to Ukraine. Same with Fukushima nad 3 mile island. Chernobyl is literally the absolute worst possible scenario imaginable and it was still a nothing burger.
>constant ongoing decomissioning/maintenance costs.
Maintenance cost are quite literally x1000 times less then Wind turbines per MW, this isn't a figuative haha it's LITERAL
>cannot leave them unattended or you have nuclear meltdown catastrophe.
Modern designs don't allow for this it's not the 1950s we know how shit works after 80 years of running them
>meanwhile nothing happens with solar or wind
Except you know the same shit you told us about nuclear, where to dispose of it when it's done, absurdly high wind turbine maintenance costs requiring armies of workers, all the decommissioning after their lifespan runs out, the dangers of lithium battery fires and so on...

>>108109791
>nuclear
how do we tell him

>>108111625
What are the alternative electricity generation methods companies would've invested in if wind wasn't available?

>>108109610
It's not useful for a grid, but it is wonderful for campers, emergencies, and such. Unfortunately, at least in the US, it isn't even useful for individual homes because it has been rendered into yet another grift. It takes almost as long as the panels last for them to break even.

>>108111723
Same shit except water movement.

>>108111723
Not decommissioning several nuclear reactors for a start and that would be enough because we produced all the electricity we needed before that, except during severe droughts.

>>108109610
solar does have some pretty good upsides, but he handwaves quite a bit of the downsides

>nobody's owned his '40 year lifetime' solar panels long enough to see how true the claim is
>doesnt cover how most panels are assembled in china and dumped across the world. going all-in on chinkshit enables genocide
>speaking of chinkshit, if you equip yourself on chinkshit batteries you're guaranteed to have a bad time
>kinda glosses over how your experience with solar is 100% going to depend on your local energy company. where im at the state allows them to buy my surplus energy for only pennies on the dollar of what i pay for electricity. it's not worth selling back
>and if he's going to make such an impassioned plea for solar, i find it quite strange he didn't prepare any recommendations for panels, or videos on how to install your own, or even ways to donate to solar farm startups

and if we're going to go into politics
>yeah, no shit, the people who live in coal mining communities are not going to give up their livelihoods for a handful of solar panel technician jobs. its not like youre gonna build new factories in these places to support the tens of thousands of people affected
>if democrats were serious about winning anything theyd give up their broadly unpopular positions on arms, illegal immigration, trans shit, etc. but they won't. they clearly WANT to lose

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>>108110066
Then why is this not reflected on a geopolitical level? Why are countries like Russia, UAE, Saudi Arabia, Qatar, et al. not bankrupt already? Why has China spent $300B to buy oil from abroad making itself heavily reliant on other superpowers? Why do all the armies of the world run on solar simplifying their logistics greatly? Why do ships not run on solar? They have plenty of room to fit enough panels. Why does any country anywhere even bother to maintain anything other than solar farms for energy production? Why is $7B of an incentive even needed when solar farms are basically free money?
Why are you adamant that a fat internet influencer is smarter than all the governments, armies and businesses in the world?

>>108110077
>uhm ackschually
Who the fuck cares, these are official EU numbers and if anything they're going to lie in the other direction and blow them up.

>>108110418
>tax breaks
This is still preferential treatment.

>>108110629
People who are in the oil business are in the business of making money. If there was a systematically better solution, they'd jump ship already. And again, that doesn't explain why the army and navies don't use it. They adopted every technology in history that gave them an edge.

>>108110774
>Combine with the nuclear and hydro capacity that's over 80% of our electricity generation
Why? The way that fat man explains it, nuclear isn't even needed. I sincerely don't trust any of these numbers because you just don't see european countries behaving like they solved their energy issues. Is Germany one of those shithole countries that haven't invested in renewables?

https://www.cleanenergywire.org/factsheets/germany-eu-remain-heavily-dependent-imported-fossil-fuels

And btw yes, chinks built a shitload of renewables, but they also produced a shitload of cars that then were promptly sent to rot in massive deponiums. They also aren't replacing their fossil fuels, pic related.

>>108111734
No, Sweden has pretty much capped hydro utilization. You can upgrade a few turbines to increase production a percentage or two and you can maybe build a few kW turbines here and there but certainly nothing major..

Uuuuoooooooooohhhhhh EROI !!!!

>>108111718
What do you want to tell me?

My state has 2 operating reactors that have produced ~600 terawatt-hours in their lifetime to date, and they recently announced a planned 20 year extension on both reactors. While also adding another ~190MW of capacity, giving (assuming the full 20 year life) another ~330 terrawatt-hours of power generation for my state.

>>108111772
You go right ahead and build your energy infrastructure ignoring EROI and see how stable your society becomes.

surely we'll have fusion be commercially viable before 2050?

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>>108111769
You missed my point.

>>108111744
>Not decommissioning several nuclear reactors
that's what happens when no one wants to invest in properly restoring old rusty reactors

nuclear simply has shit economics that's why barely anyone invested in it after the nuclear boom of the 50s

>>108111758
>People who are in the oil business are in the business of making money. If there was a systematically better solution, they'd jump ship already.
The problem is one of upfront cost and margins. When you have all your oil infrastructure already in use and you only pay operating costs and reap profits, why bother scrapping it all, throwing away its remaining useful operating life, and spending a ton of money on brand new infrastructure in the hopes of being able to make a similar amount of profit once all is said and done?
Besides, I was talking in general market terms, not in terms of individual big oil companies. And my main point was that "billions" is not a lot of money at the scale of national infrastructure.

>>108109610
>The EU built a shitload of wind and solar, billions upon billions were spent to ruin the landscapes of various countries and still can't cover even a quarter of its energy consumption with renewables
over half of germany's energy is renewables. why are you just blatantly lying like this?

>>108111799
>that's what happens when no one wants to invest in properly restoring old rusty reactors
The company who decommissioned the reactors, Vattenfall, is largely owned by the state and the social democrats and greens introduced new taxes to punish nuclear specifically to make it unprofitable and they also fired everyone from the board of Vattenfall who didn't want to de commission the plants
>nuclear simply has shit economics that's why barely anyone invested in it after the nuclear boom of the 50s
Sure, buddy. It's not the political climate.

>>108111697
He literally said the opposite in the video, but you're too retarded to watch anything that isn't forcefed to you in a 10 second TikTok.

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>>108111791
Even if we do. Let's say we do. They're going to take as much to build as a Nuclear plant say 5 years.
China is currently the fastest Nuclear builder in the world bar none, They started in 95. They really ramped it up in 2010. They've yet to reach Cumulative US.

Nuclear is only 5% of Chinese electricity. Wind is 10% Solar is about 10% Hydro is 15%
50% is Coal

So imagine how long it will take for a world to go Fusion + Solar/Wind

2100? 2150?

>>108111825
>They're going to take as much to build as a Nuclear plant say 5 years.
Maybe if it's laser or something similar that wins. If it's stellerator fusion reactors that wins then there's no way it'll take 5 years to build them, at least not for the first 50 years.

you know what's even better for the environment before going all-in on solar panels?
improve your house's damn efficiency. your local utility might have a free energy efficiency service they provide. otherwise, google home energy audits. these guys will come into your house and check
>do you have the proper amount of insulation in your attics and walls? you'll use so much LESS electricity/gas
>they'll whip out infrared imagers and look for drafts you can plug up
>they'll check the ages of your major energy-guzzling appliances and recommend newer models if needed
and while we're talking about energy hungry appliances
>if you can get away with it, consider hanging laundry to dry over using a dryer. those things are damn energy vampires

and we dont even have to stop there. how many miles per gallon does your car get? if all you do is commute between work and home, do you really need a bigass pickup truck that gets 12 mpg? did you know there are cars out there getting 45+ mpg? or motorcycles getting close to 100? and you can rent a truck for those few times you actually need to haul something heavy
internal combustion doesnt have to be the devil as long as you aren't retarded about it

i like his appeal to midwestern frugality, but he falls into the liberal pretentiousness trap that's gonna make normal people tune out his message

>>108111799
>nuclear simply has shit economics that's why barely anyone invested in it after the nuclear boom of the 50s

Why do you never answer when we tell you the opposite?

India and China are building like insane. India plans to have 100 GW operational by 2047. China will meanwhile have from 300 GW to 500 GW by that date. They want 25% of all power to come from Nuclear.

>>108111758
China are replacing their fossil fuels. Their CO2 emissions per capita have already peaked. They're still importing more oil simply because they can't magic enough renewable and nuclear from thin air and it takes time to build it. Also China has no oil domestically to meet demand. US is oil independent so comparing their imports makes no sense.

Why does China still buy oil to make them reliant on others? Because it allows them to meet the energy demand NOW. Their goal is to be energy independent and that should be the goal of every single independent nation. Ships and logistics run largely on oil because of legacy reasons. Except all the freight that's moving on electrified rail. Which is about the cheapest way to transport large quantities of cargo as long as you've got tracks.

When it comes to subsidies a lot of them are just straight up corruption. You lobby politicians enough and they'll give you subsidies. Fossil fuel industries also have shitloads of subsidies for them. It's all about who can sweet talk politicians into giving them the most tax money.

Navies have already adopted nuclear as fuel source. Why it's not everywhere is regulations and muh nuclear scare tactics by oil lobbies.

The fat man is just straight up wrong on nuclear. You almost always want some nuclear as baseload power generation. Germany is one of those shithole countries. The reason they're so keen on coal is to keep the poor Eastern Germany have even some jobs. And Russian gas is thanks to Eastern German politicians being eternally mind broken by the USSR and being the good little slave that does anything Moscow tells them to.

>>108111862
China invests even more heavily in renewables
Also both these countries are stockpiling nuclear weapons, and both their nuclear power efforts are of course heavily state-funded since again the economics are shit and private investors won't touch it without massive government support

>>108111799
And why is that? Surely it isn't because of political decisions and oil lobbies pushing nuclear scare tactics.

>>108109610
>The EU built a shitload of wind and solar, billions upon billions were spent to ruin the landscapes of various countries and still can't cover even a quarter of its energy consumption with renewables not even mentioning that a huge part of that comes from hydro power which is something we had for eons and things like biofuels.
Without batteries or yuge baseload power generation (nuclear) you can't run a grid 24/7 on solar and wind
Battery tech is still developing and the green movement shot itself in the foot by not embracing nuclear, and instead RESISTING it
Even with renewable electricity, oil is still needed to power cars, make plastics and tons of other products so maintaining some infrastructure for oil makes sense even for the most environmentally conscious countries for the forseeable future
Lastly, his argument is based on the current cost of panels, while panels have only been this cheap for a few years and they get cheaper all the time. It takes years for infrastructre projects to be planned and built so it will be a while before solar's usage catches up to solar's cost

>>108109610
>political part of it which is really obviously wrong
Nope. You're just a retarded Trumptard. Kill youself right now.

>>108111893
Nuclear is state funded because companies don't want to make 50 year investments when the political landscape can change every 2 - 6 years. And nuclear is entirely dependent on political decisions allowing them to operate.

Also even if nuclear didn't break even? Is it not beneficial for the state to be able to provide constant baseload to the grid from non polluting sources?

>>108111940
get ICEd loser

>>108111971
>moms basement tier post

>>108109624
How's your solar panel investment doing vs gold and the S&P?

>>108111907
>and oil lobbies pushing nuclear scare tactics.
lol oil profits from nuclear
ExxonMobil is one of the largest uranium mine owner in the world

>>108111893
Both of these countries are heavily pushing Thorium Reactors. Especially China.

>>108109610
>Why is nobody making a response to the solar power video?
The wonderful thing about YouTube is that this question is useless because you could always just make the video you wanna see and upload it yourself instead of waiting for someone else to do it for you. :^)

>>108110562
That cuts efficiency in half. Wind has the same problems with windmills that don't puree wildlife. 'renewables' are a fucking scam invented by oil companies. See his follow-up video about the a World of Energy sponsored by Exxon.

>>108111176
I mean I don't want more birds to die dude.

>>108109610
Not going to read your entire post.
That video, especially the second part was a giant temper tantrum.
Solar is fine but it likely won't be worth the cost.
Wind is fine but it will not be wroth the cost and just end up as e-waste.
Nuclear is where cheap power is but no one brings it up anymore because ancient designs on reactors that should have been decommissioned melted down. It's like someone driving a Baker Electric car and complaining it won't keep up with traffic.

>>108109610
>why do landline phones still exist if we have cell phone? checkmate atheists!

>>108111884
Yeah, but then China's oil imports should be steadily decreasing like Germany's.

IDK, it just doesn't compute. It took a few years from the invention of LLMs for the investors to jump in, buy up loads of fancy new hardware and set up enormous and complex datacenters to make them into insane machines that can code and do medical diagnostics. We can all see the fruits of that.
The renewables swindle has been going on for literal decades and a lot of shit was built, but the electricity prices aren't going down, oil is still being drilled, refined and burnt and all you get is lip service to renewables from the exactly same people that have been pushing for them for decades. There simply is nothing happening.

>>108111176
Damn kots.
And they cause a lot of CO2 because they're carnivores.

>>108111148
>>doesnt mention how windshit genocides birds
it's so funny watching rightoids suddenly care about the environment but only when it's green energy solutions

>>108110839
>ships burning raw heavy crude oil
Stop making shit up

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>>108112039
guess what else kills birds

>>108112196
brutal

>>108112196
Arguably getting killed by a windmill instantly ACKED is much preferable to this brutal death.

>>108111948
political landscape in China doesn't change every 2 - 6 years

>>108112114
But electricity prices are going down. Finland is building massive amounts of wind. And the price keeps going down year over year. Russia - Ukraine war raised the prices because no more imports from Russia. But as more renewable production comes online prices keep going down.

>>108109610
You could make solar if there was any silver left.

>>108112235
It doesn't, but China isn't a capitalistic economy in the first place, so using the fact that Chinese nuclear is largely state funded is a moot point.

>>108112196
>guess what else kills birds
most wildlife. they are a favored prey item.

>it's not immediately better, therefore it's bad
t. anons on the invention of the automobile

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>>108109610
You're very far from the target and trying to package solar/wind with progressive views is a their narrative not reality, you don't have to play by their rules.
Over 50% of daytime power consumption where I live is from solar, but obviously you're not going to power a whole country 24/7 with it.
Solar already makes sense on the scale of single buildings like factories and at market price without any subsidies, just from the electricity savings during working hours.
It's also the only practical way to have power off the grid, which is quite antithetical to the liberal urbanite lifestyle.

the absolute only possible reason for solar is not having to rely on the grid and generating all your own power
solar is terribly inefficient but it's the only way for regular people to generate their own power

>>108112253
>China isn't a capitalistic economy
Are you brain dead? Do you know how much of their economy is net exports? jfc

>>108112176
Rightoid also suddenly care about the poor Africans having to work in cobalt mines.
It's hilarious.

>>108112114
If a significant part of your country's energy doesn't come from renewables then there isn't much to benefit from. And dont forget crypocurrency and LLMs have been taking up a lot of energy just to run over the last decade

>>108112307
>how much of their economy is net exports?
About 3%

>>108110066
>panels from 25 years ago that cost a fortune and were actually made with the best quality materials last more than 25 years
>that totally means the ultra cheap chink shit being sold today will last more than 5 years if that

>>108112323
try again retard

https://oec.world/en/profile/country/chn

> $3.59T exports
> 3%
LOL get kek'd

>>108109610
>did post a link
kys nigger

>>108112307
What does being a net exporter have to do with being a capitalistic economy? The Chinese government has a huge part in their economy and every company in the country operates on the goodwill of the government.

>>108109610
Solar is good, I like solar.
Heat pumps are also good.
He's not wrong about solar.

But his TDS is unreal.
I don't understand these people at all and their obsession with Trump
Trump didn't invent the government
He didn't cause ANY of whatever he is complaining about

So we had solar everywhere then Trump came in and destroyed it all? No? Oh, nothing he is talking about was ever a thing, even when his precious dems controlled everything?

These people never take accountability or tell the truth

>>108112350
You could at least watch that part of the video instead of inventing some made up shit in your head about it.

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>>108109610
>Why is nobody making a response to the solar power video? I'm not even talking about the political part of it which is really obviously wrong and the lowest hanging fruit in the whole episode. This is /g/ so I am asking about the technical part of it.
/pol/ nobody complains about the political part because solar is the future.

>>108112346
> net exporter
you just said it dip shit. what do you think they are exporting in exchange for? bottle caps?

>>108112362
>because solar is the future.
solar cannot be the future without higher efficiencies. currently they require silver which is in short supply.

>>108112332
2.85%
https://en.macromicro.me/series/3768/cn-gdp-share-netexports

>>108112361
>You could at least watch that part of the video instead of inventing some made up shit in your head about it.
I did, did you? That entire last section was clearly about Trump

>>108112378
stop using chatgpt

>>108112389
I posted a source fucktard

The entire argument in favor of solar can be applied 1000x for nuclear. And the best part of nuclear is that it doesn't make you 100% dependent on other countries or exhausting all of earth lithium supplies just to store that overnight.

Every time I see someone shilling solar but not mentioning how nuclear is far better in every possible way I know I'm dealing with either CCP hire or a retard

>>108112378
let's do a little thought experiment. how much of the stuff on your desk was made in china? if you say 3% of it, i'll believe your number.

>>108112387
...anon now I know you didn't or if you did you're so retarded you couldn't hear anything beyond "trump".

He has well articulated arguments if you're willing to actually listen to the words being said instead of chimping out and turning it off the moment you hear your god emperor being "attacked".

>>108112393
> i PoStEd a SoUrCe FuCkTaRd
kek

>>108112396
>The entire argument in favor of solar can be applied 1000x for nuclear
this and it's actually more sustainable.

if you dont own a solar powered battery maintainer for your car i feel sorry for you

>>108112368
Money of course. But I ask again, what does exporting things matter when it comes to what sort of economical system the country is running? Fully communist countries still have money. They still export things for money. China isn't a fully communist planned economy. But it isn't a capitalistic market either.

>>108112402
This is what TDS does to people

>>108112417
it is capitalist

>>108112401
>nooooo your hard factual data backed up with a source is wrong because it hurt my feelings!
Rightoids are so fucking retarded.

What did your feel feels tell your Chinese net exports were?
Did daddy Trump tell you it's le evil high number and needs le hecking tariffs?

>>108112396
Nuclear is shit. I deboonked it here.
>>108110235
Liking nuclear is the peak basedjak stance. Unironically oil&gas is better than memeclear since at least it can't create a Chernobyl.

>>108112424
According to a source I found 48%. But you can believe whatever you want. They produce most of the worlds goods. Yet somehow only 3% exports. That makes total sense. Despite your source. You really do live in a fucking bubble don't you?

>DEEERRRRRPP

>>108112433
>can't create a Chernobyl.
most reactors created since the 70's can't melt down either. they deliberately fucked with the safeties and it predictably melted down. wtf is wrong with you people?

>>108112440
>According to a source I found 48%.
Care to show is that source?
No?
Don't think so.
Typical sub 60 IQ white trash MAGAtard.

>>108112419
What, listen to a logical argument without turning it off the first moment I hear trump?

>>108112447
>Typical sub 60 IQ white trash MAGAtard.
> i showed him a contrarian stat that flipped his whole world view upside down
> got im
> this means i'm right
kek

>>108109610
>Why is nobody making a response to the solar power video?
Why don't you make one?

solar panels expire
they also require burning coal to produce the heat nessasary to purify silicon from silica

>>108110951
dishwasher tech man specifically said he doesn't want solar panels on his roof even though he likes solar. Because it makes more sense to have it installed somewhere else at scale, and use the power distribution grid which already exists.

>>108112457
Still no source huh?
Monkey brain cannot Google?

>>108112471
deboonked
>>108110066

>>108112471
you don't get silicon from silica you retard

>>108112484
> i only know how to google things
> i get all of my information from one source that i trust implicitly and never question
you really are a fucking smooth brain. continue eating goy slop.

>>108112452
I said nothing positive about Trump at all, I just don't have TDS. I watched the video. Trump didn't cause whatever solar crisis is happening

>>108112500
Again, you didn't ACTUALLY watch the video if you think that's what he is arguing.

I really don't know what else to tell you.

If you watched it and you STILL think that's what he's arguing, you're just retarded and should be ignored outright.

>>108109610
Solar is completely dependent on subsidies. Even California doesn't want any more. SCE and PG&E won't pay you shit for generation because there's already too much and they make you go on a TOU to fuck you over.

>muh solar

Way too much at midday and completely insufficient the rest of the day. Only lasts 10 years then turns into toxic E waste.

>muh wind

Biggest government boondoggle since ethanol. Complete trash tier.

>muh nuclear

Expensive as fuck. Big generation but can potentially contaminate 1000s of miles of land and ocean if it melts down. Encourages NIMBYism and weapon proliferation. Spent fuel is a huge concern and expensive to dispose of. Old reactors are expensive to dispose of. Cannot ever be throttled or shut down depending on demand.

>muh battery

Expensive as fuck. Requires just as much subsidies as solar to be viable. Materials to make them require an army of niggers mining and the refining process negates any potential environmental benefits over gas.

>muh coal

Fucking meme. Its dead. Destroys the environment. Destroys the air quality. Zero advantages over any other generation technique.

>natural gas

Cheap. Abundant. Easy. Doesn't pollute much. Has multiple uses other than power generation, like heating and cooking. Basically a biproduct of oil production, which we will continue to need well into the future. Can be shut down or spooled up depending on demand.

I have a Tesla and solar and will probably get a battery, but not because they are the best. I buy these things because the government incentivizes me to buy them and fucks me over if I don't.

>>108109610
>the political part of it which is really obviously wrong
Do elaborate

the biggest problem solar faces is storage.

>>108112508
t. Vladimir

>>108112508
>Solar is completely dependent on subsidies.
As is the oil industry.
Nobody gets more subsidies than big oil.

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>>108112508
Gas is neurotoxic and explosive.

>>108112537
gas also works when its cold though

>>108112507
>Again, you didn't ACTUALLY watch the video if you think that's what he is arguing.
Yes, I did, you fucking retarded faggot.

He literally says that demoracts try to user in new energy technologies and the only reason the world isn't a solar utopia is republicans. Then he goes on a Trump rant and whines about ICE...which always existed, even under......democrats

So yes, I did watch the video, and no, I don't think the government fundamentally changes each time a red one is in there

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If solar is so useless then why are the chinks putting it everywhere?

>>108111859
>did you know there are cars out there getting 45+ mpg?
My Pirus gets ~60mpg
I think the worse it's been is 45mpg running the heater and going 100 down the interstates.

>>108112549
IN QUEBEC, we're fine with all hydroelectric. We've had some problems with outages, though it's not related to hydro in itself, but the rest of the network.

>>108109610
>if true, why do countries still fight over oil
They don't. Russia-Ukraine is not a fight over oil. Israel is not bombing five countries daily because of oil. Taiwan won't be heemed because of oil. Only the geriatric American rape empire is "fighting over oil" (or rather the ability to exercise power by controlling but NOT producing oil) because they cling to an imagined past that is long gone.
Also good job not even mentioning nuclear which of course can completely replace oil regardless of the issues you raised. Which is why dogs of America hate nuclear (Germany, Japan), unlike countries that will still exist in 50 years (China, France)

>>108112550
So again, his argument has NOTHING to do with Trump specifically, and he even says as much, so you're either retarded, or just a kneejerk reactionary retard seething about someone not liking "your" team.


And where exactly was he wrong? Under trump ICE is spending 10x more money to arrest and deport LESS people because he wants to hurt people in democrat states even though there are TONS of easily deportable illegals in southern states that COULD be deported for a fraction of the manpower/money.

But again, you don't CARE about the reality of trump/republicans/immigration enforcement; it's about hurting your enemies, in this case dark people and "woke" liberals.

>>108112611
Are you the technology connections guy?

What in the fuck are you talking about. People get deported all the time, that's always happened. How do you think they know where they are, by the way? It's because they get added to a list from the regular police as the regular police don't deport people. Then they go and pick them up.

You understand that deporting people here illegally is a good thing right? Also you have no idea on costs for any of this, and are being tricked by thinking that this is just focused in one state, it's happening everywhere.

>>108112611
Trump does have higher interior removals.
Turnarounds were previously counted as deportations.
ICE is in "blue" states/cities because local LEOs aren't cooperating. You dont need as many personnel in areas with cooperation with local authorities and there are plenty of deportations happening in "red" areas. You just dont hear about them because it actually goes smoothly.
If removing illegals "hurts" blue cities and states then that is there problem.

>>108112487
https://magazine.elkem.com/material-science-insights/from-quartz-to-silicon-to-silicones/

>>108109767
Deepstate, negro

>>108112659
>If removing illegals "hurts" blue cities and states then that is there problem.
It would hurt southern states more, they just aren't interested in doing so because it would "hurt" the states that vote for trump.

>>108112649
Hey, at least you dropped your fantasy cope about it being all about trump.

>>108112697
>Hey, at least you dropped your fantasy cope about it being all about trump.
Again, TDS. What in the fuck are you talking about. The dude is whining about Trump, like all people with TDS do, and is visibly angry about it. You are the one that made some head cannon about it/

>>108112697
>It would hurt southern states more
Top ICE detainees are in Florida, Texas, Georgia and Louisiana.
Again you just dont hear about it because these states cooperate with ICE.

>farm in town replaced a whole herd grazing field with solar panels
>electric bill went up $20 for everyone else
>beef also got way more expensive

>>108112731
You're the one boiling down his argument that goes FAR beyond trump to just "HE'S MAD AT TRUMP".

>>108112741
Sure, but look at the numbers statistically.

The most illegal immigrants are in republican states by a WIDE margin, so those states SHOULD have significantly more deportations, if you spent the time/money/man hours in those southern states instead of going around democrat states drumming up a couple hundred arrests per month compared to potentially thousands per week.

It's just a waste of time/money, if the goal is to ACTUALLY remove the most illegal immigrants, Trumps ICE is being almost the least effective they could be with the money/time they're spending to do it.

Because again, the goal isn't to deport, it's to terrorize Democrat states.

>>108110628
>alex pretti
They had to AI looksmax his face to make him more sympathetic. Sometimes the eyes fall for lies.

>>108112767
>You're the one boiling down his argument that goes FAR beyond trump to just "HE'S MAD AT TRUMP".
Sure thing buddy.

>>108112767
>Trumps ICE is being almost the least effective they could be with the money/time they're spending to do it.
Nah, they are extremely effective actually. More so than ever. Why don't you go call a black cop a nigger about it and show your true colors

>>108109633
The majority of German energy generation comes from renewables.

>>108112526
There are multiple sources of natural gas other than Russia despite what the media kikes would have you believe.

>>108112534
Oh really? How many billionaire solar Sheiks do you know?

>>108112537
Oh no some nigger got drunk and left the stove on. Better install solar LOL.

>>108112767
>so those states SHOULD have significantly more deportations
And that is what is happening and they are doing it with less people.
You just want illegals left alone in blue cities/states period. Any effort is "terrorizing"
Your not reasoning in good faith

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>>108112807
Just search gas explosion on Google there's tons of these and constantly new ones too.

>>108112810
but again, if you applied those same 1000+ agents deployed in Minneapolis to Florida/Texas/etc., you'd have FAR more deportations since southern state police DO cooperate with ICE.

It just comes down to “punishing” states for not cooperating.

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>>108112825
No, they have to have extra there as local authorities aren't cooperating and there are crazy people making their jobs more difficult

>>108112848
Yes, but you have to realize if they need to move MORE agents and MORE money to Minneapolis, that means LESS money is spent in cities/states where there are 10x as many illegals living there.

This isn't rocket science, if you're allocating those resources to an area that ICE themselves admit takes more time, and more money for EVERY SINGLE deportation, then if you sent those agents, and spent the time/money in states that DO cooperate with you AND have a lot more illegals present to begin with, you would logically HAVE to deport a much larger number of illegals than if you were to be in those democrat cities.

It's just basic math

all of these things are gay and retarded. Nuclear is objectively the best energy source

>>108112873
Your solution is to have no deportations from liberal areas.
Your solution is a child's solution.
It's not going to happen, they are not going to stop deporting illegals, thus there will be agents in that area, and since you make it harder, they need more of them

>>108112825
Ice doesn't need help in those areas, LEOs are cooperating.
This is a NATIONAL effort, not just what's easiest
More ICE agents in places like Minnesota is their problem because they are actively resisting efforts thus more personnel is required.

>>108112893
So you admit it IS about punishing liberal areas.

it's not like there is some hidden cache of 10s of millions of illegals in these cities.

The largest population of illegals is, and will always be in the southern states which are largely republican.

>>108112888
Nuclear is the soijak' surface level contrarian's (aka 4channer) reactionary choice. Solar is the bespoke analytical man's choice. When you analyze them on a technical level you realize nuclear is dogshit. In the abstract it can be cool, which is what fools some of the starry eyed, but in reality it turns out to be a wet fart.

>>108112900
So no illegals should be deported from those areas at all?

>>108112900
>So you admit it IS about punishing liberal areas
Can you go one single post without lying? Why are you like this.

It's not pushing it in one area, it's literally all of the areas. All of them. The entire country. They deport from Alaska and Idaho. Everywhere. Some areas just take more effort.

We will continue to deport them, thank you.

>>108112898
>they are actively resisting efforts thus more personnel is required
oops, you accidentally reversed cause and effect there, classic mistake. the correct order is: they are resisting because more personnel is sent there than required

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>>108112917
>>108112914
Well good luck guys, at your current rate it's gonna be a long fight.

>>108112927
If this is "terrorizing" blue cites then you dont want actual ICE

>>108109633
Easy there frenchie.

>>108112927
>only do what's right if it is easy
No

>>108112924
So where has it been said Minnesota LEOs have been cooperating since day one?

>>108109823
Afd

>>108112971
>>108112962
>The Wharton Budget Model estimates that a 10-year plan to remove all unauthorized immigrants would cost roughly $987 billion

I, for one, am shocked Republicans are funneling taxpayer dollars into their pockets.

>>108109741
I just like troll and yell NIGGER until I get banned.

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>>108112806
lmao no it doesn't

>>108113017
You haven't answered the question if illegals should be deported in Blue cites

>>108109610
>Why is nobody making a response to the solar power video?
I don't watch his trash content.

>>108109618
i literally sell electricity back to the city, i spend 0 on hydro and even profit

>>108109767
ah yes the government profiting off oil barons is going to side with solar, retard

>>108113032
Sure, when they commit violent crimes and are arrested, if they're here illegally they should be deported.

If they're simply being stopped for a broken taillight and they overstayed their visa? No I don't think they should be deported, they especially if they're already established here with a job/home/etc. It's far cheaper AND better for the economy both locally, and nationally, for them to be given a viable pathway to permanent legal residency.

Immigrants bring a massive amount of economic benefits, and if they're already living/working in the local area and providing to the local economy, deporting them for the simple act of being here illegally is objectively a dumb idea.

>>108112972
seems like cooperation is mixed, prisons cooperate, the twin cities have policies that make it harder to cooperate for public servants. in total, not great, not terrible. like other anons said, if the goal is to deport as many people as possible, resources are distributed very poorly. it's either incompetence or malice by the administration, the truth is probably somewhere in the middle

>>108112433
Oil&gas can't create Chernobyl. They WILL create smoggy cities and lung cancer.

>>108113058
>If they're simply being stopped for a broken taillight and they overstayed their visa? No I don't think they should be deported,
So if they have committed a crime and then it is found they have committed another crime also, your brilliant plan is just to do nothing.
Supposed economic benefits is a free pass to commit crimes? I don't understand your logic

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>>108111992

>only has enough money to do one of these

ngmi

>>108113127
Overstaying your visa is a civil infraction, not a criminal offense.

And the idea of immigration even having criminal penalties at ALL didn't exist in the US until 1929. Before that it was considered a clerical issue.

>>108113076
>>108113058
One of the main objectives was for violent offenders. If a non-violent offender happens to come around by chance, ICE has never said no because they are still illegal.
That's why ICE hangs around the jails, because people actually arrested are likely violent offenders.
If ICE hanging around blue city jails means deporting too many of the "good" illegal immigrants then perhaps your statutes for arrests needs rethinking.

>>108113152
>civil infraction, not a criminal offense.
You are confused, very confused
There's no visa involved here, they are just here illegally

You think they all have visas? where have you learned this, Reddit perhaps?

>>108113165
I never said they all had visa, I gave a single example of a hypothetical situation where I do not believe deportation makes sense.

If someone has been living here for years, has an established job, house, car, etc. It makes ZERO sense to rip them out of that life for the sole reason of them overstaying a visa.

If there are actual violent crimes being committed, yes, get them the fuck out of here, you'll have zero argument from me there. But do it legally. Prove they're committing the crime, you can't just claim they're violent criminals with zero proof.

The law requires nuance, or it'll just get used as a cludgel to attack your perceived enemies, and you better pray the day your enemies take control never comes.

The fact we have documented cases of not just a handful of american citizens and legally documented immigrants being arrested and in some cases, held for months or even deported illegally, means the current way this is being done is grossly flawed.

If it was economically viable, people would be doing it. It's literally that simple. Champagne socialists will continue to be confused by this.

>>108113161
ICE doesn't need to hang around jails. You're flagged illegal within the jail and transferred to ICE detention straight from it. This is preferable of course for most of them as it's basically a get out of jail free card, that unfortunately comes with a ticket to Juarez.

>>108113152
This dude thinks the 1% of immigrants who overstay their visa is the problem with illegal immigration o i am laffin

>>108113204
Being in any country illegally is a crime.
Go to Canada and just try to live there, watch what happens

They don't need to "prove" anything. Them being here illegally is the crime. They are removing them the legal and correct way.

Selling tacos doesn't mean you get to commit crimes

>>108113204
>if you're here illegally you shouldn't be deported based on this specific criteria
nah, you should be deported because you're here illegally. the conversation ends there. this is already one of the easier western countries to migrate to. we are not the third worlds daycare center, sorry (but not really sorry)

potentially unrelated to you, but why is this country's "heckin punk rock" leftist population both bootlicking statists and suckers of corpo dick at the exact same time? Curious.

>>108113165
getting a visa and then just not leaving has always been the easiest way to permanently immigrate to the US thoughbeit
and any actual attempt at keeping the country white has always been hamstrung by the fact that both parties support giving out visas to latinos ans jeets en masses because their cheap labor is "important to the economy"

Well my 2 cents will be burnt but the world is garbage and the reason why we still use crude oil products for public engergy generation is because some people have invested their existences on it and they have connections in the government that help them force us general humans to live under them. Cars don't count yet due to battery issues

>>108113028
The half pipe digger.

>>108109624
>But nuclear takes a long time to build, solar can be installed NOW
So which is it?

>>108113241
>why is this country's "heckin punk rock" leftist population both bootlicking statists and suckers of corpo dick at the exact same time
Literally, LITERALLY everything they tell you is projection. Typically a projection of their fetish (think about why cuck cuck cuck gets spammed so hard in certain boards here).

So the srgument against solar failed and it devolved into arguing about the last psrt of the video.
ICE really does need to be abolished.

>>108113266
> we still use crude oil products for public engergy generation is because some people have invested their existences on it
No, we use it because it's the only viable source. The entire global economy is built around it and until something as cheap and readily available comes around it will continue to dominate. It literally is not any more complicated than that.

>>108113241
i'm a firm believer that immigrants that don't contribute anything should go back to where they came from. when are planning to go back to /pol/?

>>108109945
It is due to thermodynamics and a very limited number of options on the menu. Water just happens to be a very good thermal medium that can also work as a moderator for neutrons.

>>108113387
That makes me question: How far are bioplastics right now? How viable are they and how well can they be scaled up? This is besides the other products from refining light/heavy oil, since they're mostly used for combustibles from what I know.

>>108109610
Being anti solar is fucking retarded d e s u
>I want to pay ze electricty company
>I want to lose power like my cuck neighbors
>I like paying more for less

Holy shit, I'm about to reach ROI on my panels on lightbulbs savings alone, I run my kitchen on the grid while the rest of the house is on solar and the dirty power from the meter burns the lights every 3 months more or less while the lights on the rest of the house have been going strong for 3 years now.

nobody tell this nigga what happened to spain and portugal a couple years ago because of solar KEK

>>108112196
Thats the result of an accident though. The better windmills work the more birds they kill.

>>108114371
nice straw man

I'm thinking about setting up a shed in the back with solar, makes a lot of sense since the most that would be powered is like a TV, some monitors, thunderbolt dock and whatever usb devices. Actually getting pretty excited to see how much I can get in there comfortably. Not sure about ac, but that can always be ran off the grind if need be.

>>108109610
>Why is Europe still fucked by Nordstream and only has fraction covered by renewables
Because they didn’t go hard on renewables? EU should have went harder on renewables and now we are paying for it with gas prices going up and electricity going up as well with the gas prices. If you build new power plant you would spend more on non-renewables then renewables. China right now is actually going hard on renewables unlike EU with 40% of all solar panels being deployed in China, and China finally going down in emissions. Why didn’t EU leaders do it before? Probably because they were too busy doing referendums, eating babies on Saint James and sucking Russian gassy cock before the invasion.

>>108114371
what is opportunity cost

>>108114797
Nah retard, we didn't go hard on nuclear that's why. Germany is the most retarded country in the EU, closing their own nuclear plants to fail pathetically with renewable sources. Imagine living in a country that has to beg their neighbors for electricity. Wouldn't be mine lol

>>108112396
>And the best part of nuclear is that it doesn't make you 100% dependent on other countries or exhausting all of earth lithium supplies just to store that overnight.
most countries dont have large supplies of uranium or plutonium tho

>>108114831
They are not mutually exclusive. If Germany didn’t close its nuclear power plants it could have had renewables replace gas plants and have no consequences of the Ukraine war. Also going all on nuclear could have had the potential problem similar to the natural gas, because most of EU Uranium comes from Africa and Kazakhstan, and guess where do Russians try to take control. Not saying nuclear is bad or that it isn’t good, just that it would be very similar to just making more renewables.

>>108110418
Oil and Gas isn't subsidized