1.4 GiB that is missing cannot be utilized at all no matter how badly it's needed.Less than 200 MiB is unavailable if i boot memtest86+ or windows 10I have seen people spread misinformation claiming that memory usage stats in linux isn't real allocation but it very much is and if you run out if it the system will halt so badly you can barely use it at all.
>>108637757how much ram were you supposed to have? 64 gb?cause you've counted the missing memory as "1.2" in your image filename as well as on the thread topic but as "1.4" elsewhere so I'm a little confused
>>108637786I have 64 GiB in total. If i boot memtest86+ i can utilize 63.8 GiBSo in total 1.4 GiB is unavailable in linux which is 1.2 GIB more than it should be.
>>108637757Are you using ram as cache for web browsers? anyway no idea. Something is clearly allocating that ram for hardware or program.
Let me guess you have integrated GPU in your CPU....if you have dedicated one, just disable the integrated in BIOSsimple as
>>108637757It's troonix. You're lucky it even boots without throwing fifteen kernel errors
>>108637757If you have an igpu it can reserve anywhere up to 2GB maybe more. Do dmesg | grep "Memory" and look for a line that says reserved to find out what's allocating it
>>108637867It doesn't show up in mate-system-monitor and isntead i simply says i only have 62.6 GiB of ram even though i paid for 64 GiB (it should be exactly 64 GiB physically). But the actual amount of ram that can actually be utilized (without resorting to a something like SWAP) is of course less than 62.6 GiB, Max is around 62300 MiB last time i checked (due to XFCE4, etc).
>>108637894I bought a CPU without one (13900KF). GPU: RTX 3090
>>108637903Seems like it's reserving a lot only to then not actually use it. [ 0.000000] DMI: Memory slots populated: 2/4[ 0.157135] Memory: 65373456K/66935632K available (20562K kernel code, 2951K rwdata, 16740K rodata, 4776K init, 4600K bss, 1517888K reserved, 0K cma-reserved)[ 0.157896] x86/mm: Memory block size: 2048MB
>>108637757is it a different unit? the missing amount is really close to some 1000 vs 1024 shit.
>>108638022this was my thought as well
if you guys didnt know OP is a mouthbreather who sources framechasers and random schizos
>>108638022No.
>>108638022No. First, that's for storage. Second, 64GB is about 59.6GiB, so that conversion wouldn't even account for this amount.My uneducated guess is this is likely memory held by the kernel for various tasks. Eg: your SSD doesn't have cache and is system memory mapped for its lookup.
Retard
>>108637757this is memory mapped space, you can sudo cat /proc/iomem to see how it's been carved out.hardware often needs to interface with the system through memory mappingsin my case, i have 256GiB physical but get 251.2GiB in userspace, approx 2~3GiB being PCI/MMIO, and 1~2GiB being ACPI/firmware/reserved>if you run out if it the system will halt so badly you can barely use it at allmake sure you have an oomkiller on!
>>108638342Why would these use up physical memory? The whole point of virtual memory, apart from separation, is to avoid these sorts of things.
>>108638399External devices can request ram instead of virtual memory.For instance smart access memory/rebar gives the gpu access to the entire ram pool instead of only chunks. NVME drives without cache will use your ram as cache and its up to the OS to decide how much. On Windows by default its 64mb, other Linux OS may differ.
tmpfs ramdisk for things like pid's and sockets
tech support thread
>>108637757https://kernel-internals.org/mm/memory-reservation/Note: your GPU RAM might be in the list belowKernel Memory Reservation MechanismsNot all physical RAM is yours to use — the kernel, firmware, and hardware carve out regions long before user space ever runsWhy reservations existPhysical memory is not a flat, uniformly available resource. By the time the kernel reaches start_kernel(), several parties have already laid claim to portions of the physical address space:Firmware tables — the BIOS, ACPI tables (RSDT, XSDT, DSDT), and SMBIOS data reside in RAM and must not be overwrittenKernel text and data — .text, .rodata, .data, .bss, and related sections occupy fixed physical addresses set by the bootloaderEFI runtime services — on UEFI systems, boot services memory and the EFI memory map itself need protectionEBDA and legacy BIOS region — the Extended BIOS Data Area and the top of the first megabyte are historically corrupt-proneDevice memory and memory-mapped I/O — firmware may describe ranges as E820_TYPE_RESERVED rather than RAMcrashkernel regions — a dedicated region held in reserve for the kdump capture kernelCMA pools — contiguous memory for DMA that doubles as ordinary movable memory until neededHardware quirks — some chipsets corrupt specific physical ranges (Sandy Bridge iGPU is a canonical x86 example)
At most, there are only 3 humans in this thread. Myself included. Every other post is literally an AI training module
>>108638551>Myself includedsounds like what an AI would say
>>108638505>https://kernel-internals.org/mm/memory-reservation/Doesn't answer why windows 10 makes less than 200 MiB unavailable and still works fine.
>>108638430Sure, but a gig and a half of this for commodity hardware?
>>108638623Prove to the court Windows does in fact not lay claim to those memory addresses and simply obscures the fact it is doing so from the user.Pro tip: you can't
>>108638623Windows is misleading you because it doesn't report its kernel memory in the "hardware reserved" section
>>108638210>>10863810864/1.024 == 62.5You are a faggot who can't do math
>>108638714It's off by that factor for each unit, retard. So congrats: you just calculated kilo-mebibytes.
>>108637757someone tell this absolute normie newfag the difference between counting bytes in 1024 and 1000 units?
>>108638636Windows 10 does still let you use most of your ram (like 63.2 GiB) by moving loads of stuff to virtual memory. Less than 200 MiB is reserved.
>>108638798I have 64 GiB of ram (68719476747 bytes). btw: 64 GB is 59.6 GiB not 62.6 GiB.
>>108638628unused ram is wasted ram. you want to do as little virtual swapping as possible to prevent hard faults.
>>108638846>unused ram is wasted ramAh yes, this explains perfectly why the kernel reserving a few gigs of space for a look up table makes sense. Thanks for your well thought out reply.
https://www.linuxatemyram.com/
>>108638846Ram that shows up as unused in mate system can still be used as cache which should improve performance.
>>108638869Not how the mate system monitor reports ram usage.
>>108638859as opposed to storing all that information in page and making your cpu do a ton of pointless interrupts
>>108638845no.You have about ~64000000000 RAMsince MB is kilo based.and in MiB it is ~62500 MiBwhich is more or less what your OP pic shows.
>>108638869Dipshit. The reserved memory wouldn't even show up there. It reports only usable memory. Read the fucking man page.>>108638888>in pageThe issue is why the kernel needs gigs worth of pages, not why it is reserved. Stop being obtuse.
>crying about RAM when you have 30+gigs available
>>108639033Yeah, exactly! You have 25+ available, what do you need 15+ for?
>>108639049>waaah I am "missing" a gig of RAM>I STILL have more free RAM than most people have total>I'm gonna cry about this
>>108639071>paying for RAM so you can watch the kernel play with itWhat did anon mean by this. Is this a form of cuckoldry?
>>108638604kek, I'll add you to the list of human folk
>>108639096What do you think a kernel does?
>>108639156Ah fair point. Inflation fetishists then?
>>108639165Windows/NT kernel "plays with RAM" as does the Darwin/XNU kernel on Mac, it's literally what the kernel does, interface with the hardware.
>>108639213It's supposed to make a useful system. Swallowing up your entire physical address space for record keeping isn't it. Sad I have to explain this to you, but you're that special kind of autistic retard who can't infer anything. I anxiously await your next low-int nitpick.
>>108638909Some people might think you are just trolling at this point. But you are probably that stupid for real. 62.6 GiB is more than 64 GiB retard.
>>108638210>>108638714>>108638764>>108638714NTA. But please learn how to use google. pic related. regarding the question of OP: Google MMIO. tl;dr the kernel might reserve a space of RAM for your GPU (Not your iGPU) so it can map the memory and make it easier to move the textures, assets, etc to and from VRAM.
>>108639236Nah "girl" I'll let you wallow in ignorance
Troll threadSageYour 200MiB is in my asshole and you can free it up by kissing my belly button from the insideNiggergo back to windows
>>108639358There's no need to get embarrassed now that I called you out on being functionally illiterate due to your genetic defect. Go ahead and say the line, autist.
>>108638810Works on my Linux machine
>>10863941732.7 GB is 30.45 GiB meaning that there is 1.55 GiB being reserved in your case.
>>108639449no? I bought two 16GB sticks and I have 32GB>redditspacing
>>108637757On my system Windows reports 15.2 GB in task manager as availableOn Linux it reports 14.9 GiB available in system-monitor and 15323752K/15986300K available in dmesg, and 15582212 in free15986300K is 15.2 GiB15582212, is 14.86 GiB, which rounds up to 14.9 GiBIn Windows 1KB = 1024 bytes, so I think Windows is just reporting your total memory as usable while Linux reports accurately.
>>108639381Back to Windows kiddo
>>108639465You paid for 32 GiB but in linux only 30.45 GiB is accessible.
gnome system monitor reports the ram usage in GB (not GiB) and unlike the mate system monitor it also reports how much is being utilized as cache.
>>108639512I paid for 16GB just like it's advertised
>>108639520You kinda got more than you paid for (it's technically 34.3597 GB = 32 GiB).
>>108639532All 32 GiB of ram is there. You just cannot access all of it due to linux being inefficient when handling it.
>>108639517Then change it to GB.
that's where the nsa put their spyware. it's got a large event cache.
GiB notation is so fucking gay
>>108639694Computers are binary.Base 10 is marketing.
>>108639694No it's superior and all alternatives are stupid.
>>108639737the unit inherently tells us the correct notation
anyway i missed it under all the "you're holding it wrong" kvetching, why is linux stealing op's ram?
>>108637930>>108639803Because it isn't.
>>108637902are these kernel errors in the room with us right now?
>>108638505>lincucks just accept this bs laying downthis is why i will always use windows
>>108639858The 63.83 GiB is only available if i boot memtest86+ (which isn't linux) or windows. If i boot linux there is only 62.6 GiB available to use.
>>108638859eviction exists and mappings will scale down with ram pressure. these things aren't static. unless you're nearly out of ram worrying about these numbers is retarded, and complaining without actual knowledge of how the kernel works even more so
>>108639941I have not seen it scale at all. The amount of usable ram after boot is capped to 62.6 even if there is a bad freeze due to running out of ram.
>>108639929Anon, nobody here knows shit. Use the slabtop command, which shows kernel memory. eg:sudo slabtop --human --sort=cThis place is a cesspool of phone ricers.
sudo slabtop --human --sort=c
>>108637757> 1.2 GiB of my ramThat's more than my old Linux Box with Debian Potatoe even has.Setting it up was so much work that I never felt the wish to upgrade.
>>108639976I am surprised i got even 1 useful reply here (which is still better than reddit). The main culpris is radix_tree_node which takes up 1238304
>>108639929Because you didn't buy 64 GiB of memory but 63.8 GiB.Windows and memtest report your TOTAL memory in GiB (1 GB = 1 GiB in those) as available.Linux is reporting 63.8 GiB, minus allocations for BIOS, kernel, and other shit, as available memory.
>>108639911accept? they immediately go full "it's not happening and it's good that it is"
In Windows I have 63.9GiB of RAM. Maybe you should just get a less wasteful OS.
>>108640108Windows does use a good amount of it by default though so you end up having to use the pagefile (which will wear down your SSD) to actually utilize more ram than what you can in linux.
>>108640106I had someone in reddit claim that it would be bad for stability to let you actually access all your ram and have system processes potentially be moved to a page file. But as far as i have seen the stability in windows 10 is fine even if you use like 63 GiB of ram. The only problem is the reduction of the SSD lifespan.
>>1086400341238304 what? It defaults to KiB. If so that's pretty fucking big for the radix tree. AFAIK, its only used for key-value lookups (think hashtable without the hashing). Not sure what module in the kernel is using so much but it feels wrong. For reference mine is around 140 MiB on 32 GiB.
>>108640151Yea there is obviously some pretty bad bloat somewhere.
>>108637757Windows does the same shit. It depends on how much you've set as a hardware reserve. Doesn't help windows and linux count space differently.
>>108640163Let me just say that's not typical. My workstation uses btrfs which by default uses a ton of kernel space memory for caching. My laptop is in the 200MiB range for the whole kernel. What distro is this? What filesystem are you using for your partitions?
>>108639975>radix_tree_node is the main cupritwell it looks like the right thing to tweak is vfs_cache_pressure, thenquestion is, what are you running where that extra 1.2gb out of 64gb will actually make a difference? you'll still be running oom and your system will continue to freeze anywaynow admit this thread was just bait
>>108640178Also, do you use virtual filesystems (VFS)? I don't, so maybe that's where it's coming from.
>>108640186He's probably generating slop. That will eat memory up like a motherfucker.
>>108640197the fuck you mean you don't use VFS
>>108640208Shit, my bad. I'm low on sleep. Meant virtual volumes, lol.
>>108637830>I have 64 GiB in total.no, you have 64 GB in total, GiB != GB
>>108640216Another Dunning-Kruger case.
>>108640493If everyone here is so dumb, why are you asking for tech support here?
>>108640714Most people are dumb but sometimes you do get something useful out of it.
>>108640768Read the sticky, go to >>>/wsr/ for your tech support threads
>>108640788It's more of a "linux is bad and people are trying to deny it" issue.
>>108640882Sounds like you don't need help then. You want people to go "Bill Gates-sama... I kneel" But I was curious if this is an issue, since I only have 14.8 GiB of RAM and figured it was because the used laptop had 2 shitty 8GiB sticks or somethiing. What distro are you using?
>>108641030The issue isn't your ram stick. It's a general bad problem with linux. I use Arch Linux (syslinux, lightdm, XFCE4).
>>108640714Why do YOU come here? Real question.
>>108641030We had a person earlier who could only utilize 30.45 GiB out of the 32 GiB they had paid for which is worse than our cases but even in your case it's still pretty bad since you really need all ram you paid for if you only have 16 GiB physical ram. The issue is almost certainly the linux kernel itself rather than anything else. It might be that this cannot be fixed without rewriting parts of the kernel itself (working for free so valve can benefit from it).
>>108639929memtest is in fact a linux colonel
>>108637757If you don't install proper drivers the system may reserve RAM for the system to deal with those components in a basic level. You probably got a bunch of missing drivers and that's what you got. Same shit happens on windows.
>>108641069Technology discussion not tech support, read the goddamned sticky
>>108640216least retarded /g/ poster
>>108641146I have tried various nvidia drivers. Doesn't affect how much ram i can utilize.
>>108637757you've got to pay the troll toll
linux is trashthere's no excuse for this
>>108641449It's sadly to be expected with these non-profit open source projects. Because microsoft is a private centrally controlled company with a lot of resources they are able to put effort and make it work fine even if you use say 63 GiB out of 64 GiB by simply having system processes move to the page file.Linux instead is fragmented where people are expected to work for free and there is no real coordination and people are convinved doing things in the old inefficient way is necessary and people who try to claim otherwise are shut down. You get the typical stupidity of crowds where instead of fixing real problems defenders of the dysfunctional status quo resort to misinformation and gaslighting.
>>108641147This isn't tech support though. It's unironically the start of a discussion.
>>108641691It's tech support, Linux ate my RAM, grade school shit
>>108641724You've never anything worth reading. I don't see why you're so upset.
>>10863793066935632K (KiB) is available to Linux, or 68,542,087,168 bytes. Like all OSes that run on x86-64, the default page size is 4096 bytes, which is a property of the hardware. So, you have 16,733,908 pages. Linux needs a 'struct page' and PTEs (page table entries) as well as some other metadata that comes out to about 92 bytes per page or 1,539,519,536 bytes, or about 1,503,437 KiB, which is about 1% less than the "1517888K" value in your dmesg output. In general, you should expect about 2% of your memory to be used in keeping track of your other memory, so this is about right. Any OS that needs to use the MMU to map pages needs this bookkeeping, it's just that Linux doesn't lie to you about it.
>>108641861>implying that the entries aren't sparse to combat this exact issue>implying that the number of entries has anything to do with the physical capacity, not the size of the virtual address spaceTry more like 0.2%
There are a lot of bad attempts to explain it but it is likely iGPU reservation.Even when you have a dGPU as well, it's possible to switch between integrated and dedicated while the system is running or run both at the same time, so unless you have actually disabled the iGPU in BIOS it may still reserve RAM to use for it.ZRAM is also worth checking.
>>108637757Yeah, well I slapped in 128gb into my rig running mint and it says I have 134gb, so ha, better luck next time, bucko.
>>108641925You have to reserve the space so you can run maxxed out. There is no such thing as sparse when under full memory pressure.
>>108642069I'm talking about the table entries, you absolute tard. The majority of virtual memory will be EMPTY for every fucking process.
>>108642090The reason the memory is reserved is so you can allocate them immediately upon a memory utilization spike. Hence, reserved for kernel use and not available for direct userspace use.
>>108642134You don't even know what I'm talking about. You don't even realize you don't know what I'm talking about.
>>108642149The memory overhead for bookkeeping when running maxxed out is accounted for up front at boot time. Hence, reserved.
>>108642158Gunmaxx your beta hole
>>108642178Ask google AI>linux kernel struct page overhead per 4096 byte page>pte overhead per 4096 byte page linux>what besides struct page and pte overhead uses reserved memory linuxThe rule of thumb is 2% when running maxxed out. You don't have to take my word for it, if you want see picrel gAyI
>>108642200You've already established you're retarded. You don't have to keep going
>>108641645let me guess, you disabled swap to improve performance?
>>108642209Lots of seething trannies today, I wonder why.
>>108642209>>108642249Ask stupid questions get answer you don't like...call them transgender?
>>108637757post the output of sudo dmesgpaste.debian.netyou won't though because for one thing you know what the problem is and are expecting a random internet user to use the process of divination to tell you what command to run to fix this problem instead of even trying to be facetious about it.
sudo dmesg
>>108642249Cope and rope, man(page)let.
Looks like OP has some experience coming up short where it matters most ;^)
>>108642283ywnbaw
>>108642304Typical tranny imitating roastie cope
>>108642358I'm a man and have no desire to be a woman. You must be projecting your fetishes onto me.
>>108642233I disabled SWAP to free up SSD space and improve the lifespan of the SSD.
>>10864195513900KF don't have a iGPU (pretty sure it's fused off so you cannot use it at all).
>>108642287Memory: 65373456K/66935632K available (20562K kernel code, 2951K rwdata, 16740K rodata, 4776K init, 4600K bss, 1517888K reserved, 0K cma-reserved)Don't know if it would be safe to post the full output and this is also not a tech support thread. From what i have read the amount of memory reserved by the kernel is normal given the amount of ram i have.
>>108642200Seems like the Struct Page is indeed the biggest problem and that windows doesn't have the same issue. The amount of gaslighting and misinformation i have gotten when i have asked about this problem indicates to me that this is a linux specific problem (windows does let me utilize up to 63.8 GiB after all). Seems like you can reduce it in linux but this is badly documented and may cause problems. https://blogs.oracle.com/linux/minimizing-struct-page-overhead
>>108637902I usually have only 3, lucky me
>>108643538Nah, Windows just considers the cost of their "struct page" to be part of the user's memory usage.
Has anyone actually managed to successfully reduce the amount of ram reserved by the kernel to less than 1% of your total ram?
>>108643658According to grok the windows equivalent takes wastes 25% less memory by default.
https://youtube.com/watch?v=2EFG3BO6oVY
>>108637757Doesn't happen on my 4GiB Debian+XFCE install, I get 4GiB on both Windows and Linux. Skill issue.>>108640216He does indeed have 64 GiB of ram retard. This is RAM, not a mechanical hard drive.>>108640714He is making a tech discussion thread, which is what the board is for, not a tech support thread.
>>108643727when i boot into windows it eats up 4gb of ram idling, even with no applications besides task manager running
>>108637757I seem to have the opposite problem...
>>108645754Flamewars != DiscussionThis website person hates Linux, cool, not a discussion.
>>108643727>according to LLM slopboth still need to be padded/aligned to 64b
>>108643389>1517888K reservedya. sounds like iGPU
>>10864580767.1 GB = 62.49 GiB
>>108645754This is not a tech discussion thread.This is a low effort shitposting bait thread.
>>108645754I meant 3.9 GiB on both, brainfart. But yes, still a giant skill issue. Inspect /proc/iomem and find out why. Maybe post it here.>>108645810He is discussing an actual topic on how linux apparently reserves more memory for kernelspace on his puter, which is a very valid discussion. Plus, he's definitely slightly smarter than the average /g/ poster, which is a welcome rarity given that defying all statistics, the average /g/ user manages to be significantly dumber than the average /g/ user somehow.
>>108645888you're right, I'm retarded.
>>108637757GiB is not the same as GB
>>108646181nowhere in OP was GiB confused with GB
>>108645838Wouldn't that show up under "cma-reserved" ?It would be pretty bad if linux reserved 1 GiB + for a non-existent iGPU.
>>108646002It's hard to find any good information on how to actually reduce the amount of ram reserved by the kernel. The biggest culprit seems to be the "Struct Page" which does grow linearly with the amount of ram you have (which is pretty bad in my case since i have 64 GiB of DDR5).
>>108646281Do you want the kernel to work? It needs RAM. THE MORE YOU HAVE THE MORE IT NEEDS.Bitches in 2038 will be like "I LOST 16GB OF RAM" nigga you have 1TB of RAM stop sweating the small stuff. Yes, 16GB is a lot right now, but in a future context where people have terabytes of RAM it will be insignificant.
>>108646254idk man. I'm trying to figure it out as well. but it may be a quirk with AMI BIOS, because I can't figure it out either. the iGPU doesn't show up either.
>>108646313I might try freeBSD later (if i get some more available disk-space) to see if it lets me use more ram. You could also try switching linux distro but i don't think it will help much.
>>108646308The funny part is that if Linux did userspace memory accounting in units of (page_size + overhead, e.g., 4096 + 92 == 4188) there'd be no "problem" because the moment a process used 1 byte of the page, they'd get charged for the full Hitler. But since Linux devs are more interested in "how many regular hw pages can I mmap and actually use" it makes more sense to account like Linux does.The problem is rolling up developer info to userfaggot GUI info because users are no longer predominantly actual devs.
>>108637757>Has 64GB of ram. Only uses half of it. Doesn't want his OS to reserve 1GB ram in case it needs itYou really think your games or whatever you are running is more important than the system that allows you to run said programs?
>>108646798That would just hide the inefficiency. According to unreliable sources the overhead from that was smaller in wndows.Perhaps i could find a way to do a proper test.
>>108647105You are literally retarded. This is why generations of people are blackpilled on teaching anyone anything; faggots like you are best off completely uninformed so at least you're not mostly uninformed, like you are now. But go get 'em faggot.
>>108639976Is this normal? I have 64GB RAM and a 4TB SSD.
>>108647105Linux and the NT kernel are both doing similar things by reserving ram for kernel needs. This is separate and different from hardware ram reservation. The only difference is that Linux is transparent in how it reports this information to you. You should be more upset at Microsoft for having misled you and wasting the past 24H of your time
>>108647156Your Radix_tree_node is smaller than mine for some reason.
