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>>18094638
I would select an appropriately discreet and open-minded king of medieval England or France (my ancestors) to contact with a most intriguing proposal. I would recount the founding of America in our timeline and the naval advancement of iberians that made it possible. That would get their attention. Then I give enough advancements to start an industrial revolution immediately: steel founding and firearm technology, electricity, modern biology. With my patron thus occupied, I set off in strict secrecy on a well-equipped and armed mission to the new world.

Once on American shores, I give diseases to the locals and subjugate them, but not as bad as the real colonists did. Generally speaking I use them and my select crew to create a master race that will rule the earth for 10,000 years. Europeans will try to invade America towards the end of my natural life, but I will have applied modern politics and economy to confront them with an enormous unified nation. Soon after my death, America will have technological parity.

>>18094682
>I would select an appropriately discreet and open-minded king of medieval England or France (my ancestors) to contact with a most intriguing proposal. I would recount the founding of America in our timeline and the naval advancement of iberians that made it possible. That would get their attention. Then I get arrested and sentenced to death for attempting to trick the king.
FTFY

>>18094707
You missed the first 10 words

>>18094717
Would any king of that time be open minded enough to believe something so unbelievable?
Even if you brought physical evidence, there's a significant chance that they'll think you're one of the things within their frame of reference that explain owning or doing something otherwise impossible, which are:
>Satan/witchcraft
>God (or some celestial being)
It's a massive gamble IMO.
I think a strategy that doesn't involve *any* disclosure of your origins eliminates this risk and gives you much better chances.

>>18094756
That part's easy. Once I have the era targeted, I'll just research a series of events to be unerringly correct about.

>>18094780
Yeah that's the one thing that makes you look the most like a witch. Even more than doing David Blaine tricks in front of them.

>>18094788
This isn't 3000 BC we're talking about. I will offer tangible benefit to serious men and be rewarded when my ideas are correct.

>>18094833
Right, I forgot we're talking about medieval England or France.

>>18094872
First of all, most kings weren't god botherers who kill anything unchurchly. Secondly, I could provide them with already-ancient evidence that the norsemen went there. Thirdly, people are executed when their predictions fail. I will be right consistently.

>>18094884
But this isn't really "anything unchurchly". It's a massive deal, and something - from their point of view - completely supernatural.
They could believe you and accept your explanation, but it's also possible that they'll think you're lying and that you're actually using witchcraft (or are Satan himself), or that you're God (which could be advantageous but would require a slight change of plans).
There's no way to ensure that they'll believe you, and for the one run you get, it seems like a massive risk to take that early.

>>18094902
Hardly supernatural. It's a time machine, and they can have mine -- I'm not going back any further. I place my trust in their ignorance of the overall scope, that they won't affect my timeline in any way by using it. That's also a fun idea, people from the wrong time inheriting a time machine.

The whole genre has a shared backwards (forwards?) compatibility where it's probable that the unexplained time travel technology, or magic in Merlin's case, is being passed down from time traveler to time traveler through their original sin, the act of altering time. As seen in the Guy Pearce film, the more you change history the more violent the correction is. So while Merlin is a traumatized character who can't die and feels that he can't change anything, he helps the world. Hero Sarah Connor escapes fate until the whole world is nothing but "kill connor".

>>18094942
I'm not sure they'll accept your explanation of what a machine is and what yours can do.
Remember that these people have no idea that electricity even exists. They barely have gear-based mechanisms, pullies, etc.

>>18094968
A time machine is a completely logical device that people have wanted since ancient times. You're the one who believes they're impossible, I could just tell those guys I'm Chinese and they have time machines in China.

>>18094975
From their point of view it wouldn't be a time "machine" (they don't have the same concept of machines as we do), but a sort of "time-travelling object" that achieves time-travel through magical or miraculous means.
The idea that you can build an object with material you find in nature, that can travel through time, and doesn't use magic, miracles, or anything of the sort, is completely foreign to them and you just can't possibly know that they'll believe you.
I don't know why you struggle to admit that it's possible that they won't believe you. The idea that they'll 100% believe you makes no logical sense and is entirely based on a lot of assumptions.

Anyway, I'm going to bed. Will reply yesterday. See ya.

>>18095014
I disagree, the "time machine" is a pre-modern concept of a machine. It's a singular device with extraordinary powers. The modern machine is all about replication and efficiency. To them, the boundary between clockwork and supernatural was less defined, as it was to early sci-fi authors who described this wondrous machine. People back then would've found nothing unusual in a demonstration of one-of-a-kind clockwork. When do we get to hear your strat?

>>18095014
Whether a specific administration would believe me can be ascertained ahead of time by studying their historical attitude toward the natural sciences.

*natural philosophy

BEFORE THE FINAL PAGE WAS STRUCK
I TORE OPEN A PORTAL IN TIME
AND FLUNG HIM INTO THE FUTURE
WHERE MY EVIL IS LAW

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NOW THE FOOL SEEKS TO RETURN TO THE PAST
AND UNDO THE FUTURE THAT IS APU

i would go back 20 years and be a billionaire since i know exactly how the stock market is going to go. Why the fuck would you want to go in the past farther then that, without modern medicine it fucking sucks.

>>18096050
billions of what? You chiseler. OP said world emperor, that's the exercise.

>>18095028
I don't think they would've seen it as another type of "clockwork". In their time they barely had basic mechanical/hydraulic/etc mechanisms that are easily understood by anyone. A time-travelling device would at best be comparable to things they've only fantasized about, and wouldn't be like anything they had ever actually seen.

>To them, the boundary between clockwork and supernatural was less defined
That's exactly my point. They wouldn't understand the idea of a device that does something like that in a natural way. To them it would be supernatural, and their view of the supernatural is based on a christian framework, so there's a good chance that they'd think you're either God or Satan (or someone working with either's power), as that would make FAR more sense to them.

>>18095031
>ascertained
That's a strong word, considering that we have no precedent of them seeing/experiencing something even close to this.
There's always a chance of them not believing you, just like with any big claim you make today.

>>18095028
>When do we get to hear your strat?
I would go to 17th century Italy and quickly become a wealthy merchant in Venice or maybe Florence.
I would infiltrate their high society as the financial genius that everyone wants to be in business with, and become a friend and close advisor of the Doge, earning him vast wealth and political success, and establishing myself as his most precious and valued advisor.
Once I have his full trust, I start working with all the best scholars and pretend to invent and discover with them everything I need to start revolutionizing everything I can (medically, agriculturally, industrially, culturally, etc), which, in short, would make it extremely easy to take control of, and unify, Italy, which would by that point be an unmatchable superpower thanks to our superior armaments and strategy (military and political).

I make sure that he fully understands that all this is thanks to my genius, and that the only way to preserve what he/we built is to leave me the reins, by letting me marry his daughter.
We then go on to conquer the rest of Europe with machine guns, tanks, airplanes, etc.
We then leverage the reputation we have gained, as well as the enormous army we have at our disposal, to (mostly) peacefully expand east and south, submitting everyone in our way and integrating them into our society.
I'd of course send ships to the Americas as well.

1/2

>>18095028
Eventually the entire world would be conquered, and I would start working on consolidating power by becoming the new emperor, having many children (all taught the knowledge I have) that I would then marry off to become the kings and queens of the most strategically important areas under my control, founding and financing institutions that provide value to the populations and seed knowledge and values for further development through worldwide scientific/artistic/etc communities.
I would then establish an extensive sterilization-based eugenics program to ensure that each new generation is at least a bit smarter and healthier than the previous.
I would preserve everyone's culture, and only govern through guidelines, similar to the European Union today, that give them great flexibility but force them to apply modern rights and standards of life, and prevent them from doing things like wage war against each other.

2/2

I think this strategy could work very well with minimal risk, as each step in the initial climb doesn't rely on huge risks, and is in fact pretty normal.
But I'll admit that there's a big uncertainty regarding the time scale of some of these steps. Particularly the initial step of becoming wealthy from essentially nothing (I guess I could "cheat" by bringing something valuable with me from the future), as well as developing an industry that can scale all of its components (from the mining of the materials to the delivery of the finished products) as rapidly and extensively as needed for this sort of conquest. I'm not sure I could do both quickly enough to leave me the necessary decades to do the actual conquering.

>>18096134
>>18096136
On second thought, Venice might not be the most optimal choice. I picked it initially because of its established trade networks (I could start by working under an established merchant and climb from there), but Florence could be a better option for that initial stage, since I would have easier access to patrons (such as the Medici family) that would help gathering the initial resources.
Another option could be Milan, for its advantages in agriculture and "industry", which are key for that first expansion and unification of Italy.
Genoa is also great for its maritime advantages, which are important when it comes to the European part of the expansion, but I fear that starting there would mean that gathering my first funds would imply having to sail on multiple long and dangerous trips, which would take too many precious years.

Of course there's always the possibility of starting in one place to gain some funds quickly, then moving elsewhere for the rest of the plan.
I'd have to look into the different options more closely before definitively choosing one.

>>18096132
Nah. It's crazy that your whole premise is people would reject reality right in front of their eyes, because it doesn't exist in OUR reality. Putting aside the fact that people believed in wondrous devices and time travel back then, they'd be complete fools to ignore what I can demonstrate to be reality. There's no basis to assume they would be except "time machines don't really exist" which is an absurd thing to say in this thread. Might as well say anyone in the past would just ignore you no matter what you do, because their worldview is already set.

>>18096132
that's just a quirk of spelling, "ascertained" doesn't mean "as certained" it's more like "evaluated"

>>18096538
>people would reject reality right in front of their eye
That's not at all what I'm saying.
You think I'm saying that they would go:
>you're lying, this isn't real
But what I'm saying is that they'd be like:
>this is real, but you're lying in your explanation of how it's able to do what it does. You say it's really advanced clockwork, but we know that clockwork can't do that; only God/Satan can, so you must be either one of them

>>18096549
Wut?
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/ascertain
>ascertain - verb
>ascertained; ascertaining; ascertains
>to find out or learn with certainty
>archaic : to make certain, exact, or precise

>>18096664
There's no functional difference because a person can't be 100% certain. In vernacular usage it's interchangeable with "assess" and "find out". For example, I can be as close to 100% certain as possible about an historical figure who's life is extensively documented hindsight, but you can still say "but maybe you didn't account for everything".

>>18096664
no, YOU know clockwork can't support time travel. Or you think you know that. Ancient people would have no such prejudice, The Time Machine is from the 19th century and it was considered sci-fi.

>>18096673
You're playing with semantics to avoid admitting that ascertain means essentially "to establish with great confidence".
My point is that you can't possibly be anywhere near as confident enough in your assessment of how a medieval person would react to seeing something so miracle-like, no matter what their philosophy is.

>>18096674
All "machinery" of that time (mechanical, hydraulic, etc) could be understood at a glance by a child.
>water goes here, which lowers this, which pulls on this rope, etc...
If you told them that you can time travel using a really advanced version of that, there is a chance that they'll say it's impossible (people react like that TODAY to technology they don't understand lmao).
There's also the possibility that they'll ask you for an explanation, and when you start talking about abstract concepts or invisible things (such as electromagnetism/electricity) they might think you're making it all up to cover for the real explanation (sorcery).

Again, there are, to this day, fundamentalist christians (as well as people from all over the world) who don't believe that modern technology is man-made, and that it can only be the work of Satan/aliens/etc.
The idea that you can be sure that a medieval person would believe you, when you can't do that today, is so preposterous, it's not even worth refuting.
I'm not going to continue arguing this with you (also because I bet you agree with me, and just don't want to admit it).

>>18096707
>"to establish with great confidence".
That's what I said and what I meant. You said it wasn't enough to be truly certain.
>All "machinery" of that time (mechanical, hydraulic, etc) could be understood at a glance by a child.
No it couldn't. Understanding of secular sciences was exceedingly rare compared to today. Not only that, you're still thinking in terms of modern machinery. The point of reference for a non-scientific thinker is not a cart performing workaday service, but a special device like Moses's staff or Solomon's worm. Clockwork toys and devices were mysterious and kept that way by their makers. You have an entirely modern take on the past.

>>18096814
>more of the same dumb misunderstandings
Kek.
All you had to do is say "yeah that's possible but I'd take the risk" and you'd have been correct and your ego would've stayed untouched, but you're too stupid to respond like a normal person so now you have to double down on this retardation lmao.
Fuck me for getting into an argument with a frogposter.

>>18096841
That's rich coming from le epic internet atheist complaining about fucking jesus camp and witch trials any time in history before 1950

>>18096846
Ok I see that you've been baiting the entire time.
You got me buddy.

>>18096851
Not an argument, concession accepted. I don't recall a single point in this thread where I've been wrong. That's not ego, it's a higher standard.

>>18096854
Sure buddy

>>18096863
You actually have no concept of the past at all. The scale and depth of intellect it took to create even basic sciences, the length of time, the losses and setbacks. Pythagoras and Archimedes weren't little kids. None of that stuff is logical to you either, you stand on the shoulders of giants, but you've been taught to identify with the secular scientific worldview as though it were a god. People didn't just act crazy before they had your beliefs, they were the same. When I say I can pick a compliant king, that means there's a wide range of human qualities from psychopath to intellectual disability and it's not a mystery where individuals rest on the spectrum. Just because they believed in God instead of Science, doesn't affect the outcome because 1: humanity is the same, with the same limited logic and reason, 2: the time machine is a "sufficiently advanced technology indistinguishable from magic" and 3: you're not accounting for the time machine changing perceptions of the world. I don't believe in time travel, but if you parked a time machine in my hallway I would significantly reposition my beliefs. Responsible adults have to respond to circumstances, not just stick heads in the sand. I could claim to be God, which should work better according to your argument, but it wouldn't be true and wouldn't stand up to scrutiny, whereas bringing a time machine and revealing the truth of various technologies would be the ideal proof.

>>18094682
>Generally speaking I use them and my select crew to create a master race that will rule the earth for 10,000 years. Europeans will try to invade America towards the end of my natural life
So basically just the exact same thing the conquistadors did?

>>18096910
We've already established that you're baiting by being retarded on purpose. I'm not going to read any of that.
This will be my last post in this exchange. Goodbye frogposter.

>>18096921
Did I make up the part where you start off on "fundamentalist christians in the modern day"? No. The witch hunt narrative is completely ridiculous, that's not pretending to be retarded.

>>18096920
no because they were looking for boomer rocks like the small minded imbeciles they were. I will go with the intention of creating a great world empire locally.

>>18096937
>boomer rocks
touch some grass jfc

>>18096974
Lighten up. It says "time machine" right there in OP

>>18096110
Literally in the OP
>If you don't want (or don't think you'd be able) to become the world emperor, what other position of power do you think you'd be able to gain?

>>18098235
Ok. I'm sorry.

>>18094638
I couldn't become emperor, but I could probably become rich. As an armchair local historian, this is a question I've thought about many times before. My research into local history has forced be to also research some regional history, which means pickup up on a ton of unrelated but important details.

Here's how I would do it...
> Destination: Detroit in January 1838
> to gain working cash, I would 'invent' the safety pin and the paper clip; both of which could be manufactured by the same subcontractor, both would generate income almost immediately.
> meanwhile, I can already locate, within about 100 yards on the 1827 map of Michigan, the exact locations to dig to reach a massive salt deposit, the first oil located in Michigan, and the greatest copper deposit in the state.

Then:
> I could invent oil refining enough to get a usable diesel
> Invent the internal combustion engine
> Invent the electric generator and motor
> Invent the airplane
> And the Telegraph

Since I arrived it 1838, I can also prepare/profit from the bank collapse which happens within the year.

>>18100004
>And the Telegraph
The newspaper?

>>18100047
You'd be amazed how much early history was determined by a lack of decent communications. For example:
> Michigan, 1841
> Speaker of the Michigan House announces his resignation
> To accept a position in the cabinet of President William Henry Harrison
> He doesn't know that as he is in the process of resigning, the president is on his death bed
> The news of the presidents death would take seven days to make it from Washington DC to Detroit Michigan

>>18100055
Just making a dumb joke about the T you capitalized
Sorry

>>18098710
You are forgiven my son

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>itt

>>18101850
the trick is knowing how.

>>18094638
I would bring 20 Zutts and take over the caliphate at it's peak.

>>18094638
yes easily but why would I want that position?

>>18102465
Based