When World War II began on 1 September 1939, Hermann Göring was reportedly furious with Joachim von Ribbentrop, Hitler’s Foreign Minister. Göring had long been wary of war with Britain and France; he preferred a negotiated settlement.According to several eyewitness accounts (including those by Paul Schmidt, the Foreign Office interpreter, and later memoirs from officials present), Göring phoned Ribbentrop in the Reich Chancellery as the crisis broke into all out war and furiously asked something along the lines of:> “Now what? You’ve got your fucking war! Do you still think England and France won’t act?”
Goring could turn on the charm when he needed to. Ribbentrop was an autistic fuck who was unlikeable even by Nazi standards
Funny how things work out.
>>18117236They didnt want war, but since it was September already they had to pick a best date - after negotiations failed then the plan had to be put into moption or they would nhavbe wait another 6 months - by which time Poland has either killed or kicked out all the germans in Danzig.So the Nazis had very few choices at the time,
>>18119429their choice was to get stomped and then hand over Gdańsk and many other lands to Poland
>>18117236>what is timmy gonna do
>>18119436
>>18119436Give ONE reason to do thatJust one
>>18119429>They didnt want warSo don't attack>but since it was September already they had to pick a best dateWhy did it HAVE to happen in September?>after negotiations failedWhat stops them from continue to negotiate?Negotiations often lasts for decades, and can be successful as time goes by and governments change.>the plan had to be put into motion or they would nhavbe wait another 6 monthsAgain, why the urgency to declare negotiations a failure and invade?>by which time Poland has either killed or kicked out all the germans in Danzig.They had not killed or displaced anyone in Danzig yet, so why do you declare this to happen within 6 months to be an unobjective truth?>So the Nazis had very few choices at the timeActually there was a number of options available if they truly did not want war. Would you like to hear them?
>>18117236Göring always struck me as the most pragmatic of the NS top brass leadership. He simply seemed uninterested in nazi-ideology and was more in touch with reality, though he basically enabled all of Hitlers crimes but it feels like he did it more to curry favor with Hitler and climb the hiarchy ladder, kinda like Krebs. He was cold and callous but not ideologically insane. His extreme aristocratic narcissism also led him to take on jobs he wasn't actually qualified for, and obsessing with being Hitlers Yes-Man which led him to make some comical promises he couldn't keep, especially as marshall of the airforce.Regardless, even as the war went on, he was more interested in collecting (looting) fine arts and wines for his private property and go on exotic hunts rather than jerking off to conquests and Aryan supremacy.
>>18119477>So don't attackCant leave Germans to more harm when the situation is getting worse and worse>Why did it HAVE to happen in September?Weather begins to get worse from that point, summer is long gone, autumn is about to finish.>What stops them from continue to negotiate?Negotiations often lasts for decades, and can be successful as time goes by and governments change.People are being killed and the Polish government ignores even the most reasonable possible offers. That's why.>Again, why the urgency to declare negotiations a failure and invade?Best possible offer is ignored, therefore negotiations have patently failed - problem?>They had not killed or displaced anyone in Danzig yet, so why do you declare this to happen within 6 months to be an unobjective truth?They had been increasingly belligerent without reason for years. 6 months is the time peroid before the weather is confirmed to be turning better again.>So the Nazis had very few choices at the time>Actually there was a number of options availabe. Would you like to hear them?As the resident big bad Nazi on /His/ representing the modern SS - ues I would love to hear them ; please fire away I will read and think with careful consideration.
>>18119429>by which time Poland has either killed or kicked out all the germans in Danzig.What makes you think that?
>>18119553Agitation was increasing year to year month to month.
>>18119429>by which time Poland has either killed or kicked out all the germans in DanzigLOL
>>18119558What are you trying to say anon?There was peace in this area?
>>18119461the less land krautggers have the better >>18119564it was before nazi thugs invaded this citydon't worry, the german problem in Gdańsk was solved
>>18119545>Cant leave Germans to more harmWhich Germans were being harmed? Those in Danzig? Not even Hitler recieved any reports that Danzig residents were being killed or forced away.>Weather begins to get worse from that point, summer is long gone, autumn is about to finish.Still doesn't explain why he had to attack in September, or even in 1939. What's the urgency exactly?>People are being killedLiterally no historian has found any evidence that ethnic Germans were being genocided in Poland.But you specifically said Danzig earlier, so I'm more interested in what sources says Germans in Danzig were being killed / Displaced, since not even German media said that about Danzig itself.But again, even ethnic Germans within all of Poland there is no evidence of any massacres before the invasion.>and the Polish government ignores even the most reasonable possible offers.Polish delegates actually arrived to the German foreign office the night before the attack to express desires to resume negotiations, but Ribbentrop dismissed them.>Best possible offer is ignored, therefore negotiations have patently failed - problem?The problem is that offers that has been rejected can be accepted over time, especially under a different government. We have endless examples of this happening because that's how normal states interact with each others, they don't just invade as soon as an offer has been rejected. There is no deadline on diplomacy unless time is a critical threat, but there was no urgency to warrant Germany to simply stop all diplomacy and resort to war.>They had been increasingly belligerent without reason for yearsSo had Germany. It was Germany who initiated the trade war in early 20s. It was Germany who voided the Non-aggression pact. Germany initiated hostile relations, and Germany could have done more to cool it down so negotiations can occur in a sober and calm premise.
>>18119545>As the resident big bad Nazi on /His/ representing the modern SS - ues I would love to hear them ; please fire away I will read and think with careful consideration.Hitler could have tried to press the issue through rejoining the League of Nations, at least try to make his case in front of an international forum. Hitler could have tried third party mediation instead of insisting on 1-to-1 strong-arming Poland. A neutral arbiter is an extremely successful method to resolve international conflicts.Germany could have proposed a more moderate and successive approach instead of absolute acquisition of Danzig, for example to start with setting up a joint economic and administrative office together with Poland to make transition gradual over time, for example they could have begun by forming a custom union etc.Germany could have offered concessions to Poland in exchange for Danzig, such as special trade rights or a resumed Non-aggression pact (the one Germany canceled), or maybe even territorial concessions in Silesia where there was a very large Polish population.The idea is to rebuild trust over time which will be a process, but trust had been eroded since the German-initiated trade war against Poland in the 1920s and when German troops entered Prague despite Hitler pledging his intentions were limited to Sudeten etc. It's perfectly understandable that the Poles were on their toes and mutual trust needed to be repaired. 1939 was a bad time to press the demand, and under threats of war.Halt propaganda campaign against Poland since German media (state controlled) were printing every single day about the castration of ethnic Germans.Germany could likewise have proposed a population swap like Greece and Turkey did in early 1920s to avoid conflict, since Germany had roughly as many Poles living in Germany, as Poland had Germans living in Poland. This was never even explored as an option, and neither was any kind of conference with mediators like Munich.
>>18119803This is all just on top of my head, and they are all examples of what >normal< states have done to resolve tangible diplomacy that lasted decades and often eventually resolved as governments changed.If Hitler truly only wanted peace it becomes extremely absurd that he was so quick to choose the war option when there is no urgency to do so, especially as soon as he's told no.The truth is that Hitler wanted war with Poland when they refused to submit as a junior partner to German ambitions. Danzig was the best argument for war and Hitler believed Britain and France wouldn't intervene.
